/adv/ I've found myself in a bad spot. I just turned 30. I haven't girlfriend of about 9 months now, and it's gone well but lately I've felt distant, like I'm not sure if she's the one. She's kind, and caring, and we get along, but something feels missing, I don't feel a deeper connection to her. At times the relationship feels more like a father-daughter dynamic of me constantly teaching, guiding, correcting, and her just following along. I don't often feel like I have an equal partnership that I can rely on, admire, learn from, etc, just a nice comfortable person to spend time with.

As it's gone on and I realize where I'm at in life, I feel like it's supposed to be more, and I'm struggling with the idea of commiting further.

At the same time, I know how rare a good and loving partner is, maybe I should just settle and try to be happy knowing I have someone who loves me.

What do? Am I going to regret staying with her, or am I going to regret leaving her more? I really don't know and I'm feeling pretty numb to it all

>>33228308 (OP)
I've had a girlfriend*

>>33228308 (OP)
>have an equal partnership that I can rely on, admire, learn from
this does not exist irl
be happy with what you have

>>33228336
Every guy I know who is married now feels like their wife is their equal partner, who they rely on, trust, and deeply feel connected to and in love with. I know that's just maybe my circle, but I don't feel any of that.

I fear that settling for comfort and her being honest, loyal, etc albeit a good idea for the future, will end up with me feeling like I never really had love

>>33228308 (OP)
>I'm struggling with the idea of committing further.
then don't, this type of woman probably won't pressure you to get married anyway. be wary of ideas that could be coming from her family though

>like I have an equal partnership
be careful what you wish for. I've spent 80% of my adult life involved with such women and it invariably ends up clashing over 1 subject or another. nowadays I prefer more submissive/obedient ones. I guess the grass is always greener anyhow

>>33228308 (OP)
Try speaking with ambiguous nuances. Women love that.

>>33228357
>their wife is their equal partner, who they rely on, trust, and deeply feel connected to and in love with
is that what they say or does it genuinely seem that way?
in my circle, every guy who is in a relationship is fucking miserable and would die for a woman like you're describing, myself included

>>33228393
She wouldn't get it. She would just laugh or agree blankly. She never has any input or original thought she just, exists beside me. I don't even mind a little push back now and then I just feel like I want to be with an intelligent, curious, interesting woman with ideas and thoughts of her own and share them with me and enjoy the deeper things in life together, and she's just not really capable of that. Yeah she'd make a comfy, dutiful wife, but never a best friend. And that kind of sucks if I have to spend 90% of my time for the next 60 years with her.

>>33228369
Yeah there's no pressure it's just I know she's expecting it and if I do cut it off I know it would be better for her to do it sooner than later.
And I guess you have a fair point. I really just don't have a good baseline..I've dated miserable, selfish, difficult women in the past, and this is the first one who isn't like that, but frankly she's boring, simple, and we don't "click". I question if I'm in love basically all the time, but to be fair I'm not certain I've ever been with someone I love so how would I even know what it is when I have it?

>>33228308 (OP)
Not sure how to help, but I feel you. All I can say is don't be pressure by the 30 thing it's just a number

>>33228456
I'm trying not to. I just kind of figured I'd have it figured out by now but I just can't get the dating thing right. I just want to feel satisfied and certain and then I'm happy to commit and settle down, but every girl is either insane or mid, and everyone around me is genuinely happy with who they have but I can't seem to find that

>>33228308 (OP)
From what I'm gathering in the thread.. are you even sure you like her? What reason do you have for being with her at this point and what do you think is missing?

>>33228308 (OP)
It seems pretty clear that she is not what you want. If you leave her there is no guarantee that you will find what you want. But if you don't try, you're going to spend the rest of your life wishing you had.

>>33228759
I do like her. She's pleasant, and checks all the bare minimum boxes for a good wife and mother. I enjoy time with her for the most part. I just don't really feel strongly connected, and I don't really admire, or desire her all that much. I got into this relationship thinking that just having a stable kind person was enough, and now am realizing that maybe there's more to being fulfilled in a relationship.

>>33228813
However to your point, I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater. You're absolutely right there is no guarantee I'll find anything better. Hence the dilemma. Is it worth it to be, amiss and a bit disappointed for life because I never really fell in love and found my soulmate, but still have the care, safety, stability and love of sn adequate partner?

Or am I better off risking dying alone or ending up with someone worse, for the chance of that actual fulfillment. I'm not sure myself, and don't want to make a mistake

>>33228308 (OP)
You have to trust your gut feeling, the simple fact you felt the need to make this thread is not a good sign. She sounds like the kind of woman who is an empty shell that you’ll try to fill for your whole life, while never getting anything out of it. And let me guess, her mother is a real piece of work. I think you already know what you want to do

>>33229024
How the hell could you figure out her mom w as s a mess?

>>33228308 (OP)
Sounds pretty chill desu

Could you mix it up somehow? What's missing exactly? You haven't specified. Csm you not admire her kindness and generosity?

>>33228308 (OP)
It's not gonna get better. If you can stomach her,and if she's happy with you, keep her
If you leave her you'll be mopping around for the better part of an year and she'll find a new man in 2 months

>>33231528
It's hard to describe but, she just doesn't get me, and I don't think she can. She's not rock for brain dumb or anything, she just doesn't have any education, she doesn't have strong opinions, any original ideas, nothing really interesting or worthwhile comes out of her mouth for conversation. Every time we talk it's about us, the relationship,or small talk. That's it. When things don't go her way she just breaks down and gives up, or relies on me to fix it. She has no real indepence, or ambition, or ability. It feels like she's an NPC, And sometimes I just kind of wish we could have meaningful, or funny, or interesting conversations with her having actual input. She just agrees to anything I say, or asks me what it means because she doesn't know or understand. She brings nothing to the table financially, at all, and likely never will and I've realized recently in my own financial troubles that it's just all on me forever.

I guess that's just the core of it. It's on me. Every conversation topic is on me. Every ounce of entertainment is on me. What we do in our free time is on me. Our lifestyle and stability is on me. I think about having kids? That'll probably be all me too, and additionally probably having to baby her as well.

She's kind and caring and supports me, she'll never betray me or hurt me. But she brings little more than that to the relationship and I just feel like it's supposed to be more. I wish she would just talk to me about something she cares about, or surprise me with some knowledge on something we're discussing, make a plan or surprise of her own volition, have some ambition, do something other than: watch tiktoks, and like me. It's just unfulfilling, but yes it is stable and functional and better than being with someone destructive or alone

>>33232340
I feel really bad demeaning her like this but I just don't know what else to say. Tl;Dr, we just aren't on the same level, and it shows. Yes she's a supportive loving partner, but she's not a reliable,intellectual, independent adult and it feels like while I'm safe and secure, I am just bored, unchallenged, frustrated, and feel like I could have more

But I don't act on it because I don't want grass is greener or unrealistic expectations to fuck over my life. If I could get a lobotomy and just not care and be at peace with it I would

Look, just leave already.

You’ll then find out quickly just how green, or dry, the grass is on the other side.

Good luck.

>>33232520
I appreciate the decisiveness, thanks anon. I guess what I'm really looking for advice on if I want to be decisive is simply:

To those of you with long term relationships, successful marriages, what was more important in the long run:

Feeling in love, connected, intrigued and engaged and passionate about your partner and your life together?

Or having someone stable, easygoing, secure, loyal, kind and serving?

If both are required then yeah I gotta reroll

>>33232567
I’ve been in long term relationships and was offered marriage twice. The only thing I have to tell you, despite what advice I can give you, the only way for you to truly understand yourself and what you want, is to DO WHAT YOU WANT TO DO, and then dealing with the benefits or consequences of those actions.

Want to leave stability and comfort? Fine, but you might get greeted by absolute chaos and it might make things worser than before. Or, who knows?

Besides give you platitudes on what might happen, I wish someone had told me this instead. People seem to hold a candle for their first love many years later.

We can’t answer it for you. Find out on your own. And I’m telling you this, because I was in your shoes once. You WILL find out.

>>33228308 (OP)
>believes in equality unironically
kys faggot

>>33228405
>.I've dated miserable, selfish, difficult women in the past, and this is the first one who isn't like that, but frankly she's boring, simple, and we don't "click"
That is the same problem I deal with. We are broken beyond repair, man. We need a long timeout from women to heal ourselves. You must talk openly with her about it. You would be surprised at her response. Older men say such a girl is a treasure, on the other hand you cannot grow with a girl who doesn't give you pushback and cannot read the room. The duality of man. The broken women at least forced you to become better or overcome them. The lack of challenge stifles us, and does not elevate us.

>>33231383
Overly controlling and criticizing mothers do that to their children, especially daughters.

>>33232340
>>33232377
I understand

Talk to her about it. Tell her you're unfulfilled and you'd like a little more from her. You want to know what gets he going, what she's passionate about and you want to do new and fun things together.

See what happens. Might be that she's just not for you, and that's fine. But talk to her first.

>>33231383
How do I know? It's difficult to explain. The whole situation you've been describing is textbook mother complex + anima-projection, see picrel. It might not make much sense to you but if you're interested you should try reading Jung. or you can try asking chatgpt i guess
>>33233134
This anon knows what's up
>>33233169
this is retared and futile

>>33228308 (OP)
>At times the relationship feels more like a father-daughter dynamic of me constantly teaching, guiding, correcting, and her just following along.

When it is said that men should be the leader, it wasn't just a hypermasculine grunting from macho men lol. It's because this is exactly what women want. That dynamic is what happens when a man and woman synchronize, she always defers to the submissive follower role, because she wants to. You are the man and lead. This isn't father/daughter shit, this is just man & woman being man and woman.

>I don't often feel like I have an equal partnership that I can rely on, admire, learn from, etc, just a nice comfortable person to spend time with

You are asking for a partner to be your parent, to guide and mentor you like a father.

>I don't think she's the one
'the one' doesn't exist. There is no such thing, not on the way 'the one' mindset tells it.

Is there someone you will grow old and die with? Yes. Is it fate that hands it to you? No. You decide who the one is. You do that from a place of rational choice, not whimsical or fleeting feelings. That means if you try to use your feelings to determine who the one is, you either never find it or you throw them away.

You should stick with her

>>33232581
Yeah that's fair I guess I just need to figure out what I want. I do want the stability, just a little more than that would make it worthwhile.

>>33233114
I mean not really I don't expect her to be as smart or funny or be some mega talented success, but I mean, fuckin something beyond being nice and pretty would be cool.

>>33233133
I've tried feebishly once or twice, telling her I'd like to have more interesting conversations and deep talks, trying to introduce her to new activities and things, and really coax her to share herself more with me, but it falls flat. I try to kinda force interesting conversation like today I brought up about how I am worried my job (I work in defense) might be impacted by the Iran situation and I expected at least a "how so?" Or a "what's going on in Iran?" Or something but expectedly I got "oh sorry to hear that. I just got to work, love you!" And I even further prodded and said something like "yeah it's a crazy situation rn" hoping again to spark some interesting Convo and hear her opinions or at the least see some curiosity, but nope her reply was "hmm well I hope everything is okay for you, I miss you!" And then derailed into something about what she had for lunch, so I gave up. Maybe I should've just straight up said "hey aren't you curious about what's going on the world?" But eh

>>33233169
Yeah I'm trying to get more time with her, were going on a trip this weekend for my birthday so hoping that time is spent talking and doing fun things. I feel like there's more I want to learn about her but every time I prod Its just kinda revealed, that either she's hiding from me, or she really just is simple.

>>33233134
>>33233206
I'm familiar with Jung, it's interesting. A lot of those qualities line up. Yes she seems beholden to her mother and her mother's approval and her mother is certainly controlling and critical, but she does seem to want to escape her mother and actively repels herself from her.

>>33233305
I get your point but it means a lot more to establish they dynamic to lead a competent and fulfilled woman than just a default option husk. At the end of the day I have to spend my life with her, I have to be stuck in a room with her for hours on end for the rest of my life..shouldn't I get some kind of stimulation, enjoyment, depth, contentment from it? Yes you're right rationally shes a good option for my life, but I guess that means I'm just supposed to be dead inside forever and shuffle along feeling nothing?

Not saying it's that bad now but that's what I'm fearing it getting to at the current trajectory

>>33233321
>I have to be stuck in a room with her for hours on end for the rest of my life..shouldn't I get some kind of stimulation, enjoyment, depth, contentment from it?

You should get and expect comfort, peace, security, loyalty. That's what relationships are for. For stimulation, depth, enjoyment or contentment, that's your job to give to yourself, boss.

That means seeking it from life in things that aren't to do with love or sex. Hobbies, goals, adventures, skills, that sort of thing. You're in charge of delivering that to yourself.

>>33233325
Ironic that I've completely fucked myself then if that's true. I've settled on everything in my life, my career, my education, the things I do for fun because building stability and success in order to achieve and maintain a wife and family was always the end goal, and the aim of my ambition. If that part of my life is just a matter of settling too then I will have never truly gotten or achieved anything of meaning

>>33233309
>I've tried feebishly once or twice, telling her I'd like to have more interesting conversations and deep talks, trying to introduce her to new activities and things, and really coax her to share herself more with me, but it falls flat.
I meant first talking about how your mind is fucked from the previous girls you dated before her. Besides that, are you sure you are the same class? Sure, we pretend we are all equal, but that is bullshit and you know it. I don't mean income class, but a different class of people. She sounds like a typical 3rd estate/peasant girl, not to be derogatory, she will be useful in practical matters, but everything else no. I had the same experience with a Colombian girl, sweet and submissive as you can wish, but the conversations were dull and beyond boring. Is you girl a different race?

>>33233309
>I'm familiar with Jung, it's interesting. A lot of those qualities line up.
That's what she is going to be for the rest of her life. The good obedient girl, afraid to fall out of favor with figures she sees above herself. A good trait in itself, but that is to an extreme. My last girlfriend was like this. She was intelligent and had her own will somewhat, but she was overly dependent on her mother so she was also infantile and self-centered. Her family life was oppressive and restrictive like a prison. Unfortunately you cannot change that in her.

>>33233344
No we're not in the same class, and that feeling does bother me. I love her for her heart, and I appreciate all she does for me and if I could just not care I'd be set and treated like a king forever ,but it's so boring and uncomfortable being on such unequal footing. She is mixed, mother is japanese father is British, I'm American. She is a high school grad hotel concierge I am a Masters holding geopolitics/history buff working with a major intelligence agency, pursuing my doctorate soon. I for fun learn languages, have my pilots license, play golf, cook, travel, and play Vidya. She draws and likes horses. The horse thing is cool tho we've bonded over that a bit.

I almost feel as if, she is a perfect WIFE candidate, I can see her and I 20 years from now with kids and a home and a ranch slowly enjoying life and being at ease.

But right now while I'm seeking adventure, and trying to explore the world and life and have someone to do that with, to take on the world and make way for myself, she just isn't much help and she just doesn't keep up.

It's very strange, I've never been in a situation like this

>>33233332
>Ironic that I've completely fucked myself then if that's true. I've settled on everything in my life, my career, my education, the things I do for fun because building stability and success in order to achieve and maintain a wife and family was always the end goal.

Nah. Your obstacle isn't that you've fucked your life up. The dilemma is you're not seeing the forest for the trees. That's just a perspective issue, and a common one at that, especially when you're still 18 - 30, though around the thirties is the moment where you encounter the dead end. By dead end, I mean you will grasp for meaning and come up short. Kinda like what you're doing now; you got the girl, got the career, the education, the hobbies, everything and you expected life to go to the [end credits], fade to black, a big 'hurrah' and you finally achieve 24/7 satisfaction or something.

Nope. Life goes on brotha. Life still demands you push forward. In fact it expects double of you when you become a husband & dad. Life goes 200% from there.

And that sounds miserable and all. But that is exactly where you can derived the satisfaction from. You have what it takes already. The career and the woman. Your problem is you just see life as a linear track, that your career was to reach the end point of marriage and family. Not quite. You connect the two, make it an interlocking circuit; you work your career for your family. And you have family to motivate your career or passion or skill. The two fuel each other.

What comes out of that is unknown. That's for you to find out. You won't know what it is, and you're not supposed to. This means you got a whole new life you've yet to begin. So no, your life isn't fucked. Far from it.

>>33233366
>But right now while I'm seeking adventure, and trying to explore the world and life and have someone to do that with, to take on the world and make way for myself

>Have someone to do that with
>Take on the world and make way for myself

Nta but notice how those two are a contradiction. The former isn't doing it yourself.

Anon, are you just complaining for having a good partner? So far I've read from the thread, it looks like you are in some early mid-age crisis. Be a man, like, for real. Appreciate that woman, because when you manage to "seek adventure", you'll wish to have a woman like her at your side, instead of a harlot

>>33233412
Well thank you for that perspective. I do appreciate it.

>>33233432
Howso? I want a woman that encourages, emboldens, and provides assistance to the life im trying to make for myself (and by extension the life im trying to make for us) and also someone to handle the difficult times with and the good times with, knowing they'll be reliable, helpful, comforting and exciting to go through it with
And I'm not convinced I have someone like that. I'm planning on doing my doctorate soon, when I do, if I need to take time off work, I don't have someone I can rely on to cover the bases financially, because she just has zero career prospects. It's all on me. Somehow I have to do even more for the life I want, still providing for her, with no real help.

I want to travel while we're still dating and in the early marriage if we do get married. She'd like to but she probably can't. She has no money, and her job and mother are very restrictive with her time. It's been pulling teeth just to try to get 5 days off for her in December to take her to a friend's wedding. That doesn't make her any less loving, comforting, or secure of a partner, but it does make her kinda a burden.

>>33233468
No I'm trying not to complain it's just hard to express everything I've been holding in without doing so. Yeah she's a good partner. Fits all the bare minimum requirements for a life long loyal, caring, serving wife. And that's it. Isn't it supposed to be more? Arebt you supposed to feel a deeper more personal and meaningful connection to your partner? Aren't they supposed to surprise you with their talents or wit or be able to help you handle the load when things get bad? Maybe I'm just chasing fantasy and I'm open to being told that. But I just thought this was supposed to be more, that I was supposed to be content, and not constantly be pestered with the thoughts of "is this it?" And "you know you could do better" when I'm with her.

>>33233366
>No we're not in the same class, and that feeling does bother me.
That will not change. I say one thing worse than race mixing is class mixing. I am the product of that and the marriage of my parents is a very unhappy and sinister one. Your girlfriend is good on a practical and material way, but is void of anything that elevates the spirits. I was in the same boat as you one year ago, even though my ex was very intelligent, she didn't communicate well and our conversations were the same as yours, about us and other people, nothing else for 95 % of the time which let my brain rot.

As painful as it was for me, and especially for her, I broke up with her. My life has been improving drastically since then, I haven't dated other girls because I got rusty and also because I wasn't over her until recently. I still think of her everyday, but I know no future is possible.

She was also mixed, in her case half white and half Latina. She had strangely Asian characteristics and traits about her.

About the adventure part: if you mean whoremongering and travel then that is futile.

Some men are built different. Usually the more intellectual and merchant type settles between 35-50 years of age, not sooner.

>>33233486
>Well thank you for that perspective. I do appreciate it.
No problem. Just be sure to look through that perspective and practice it every now and then. You can keep the perspective you already got, just keep that other one in your pocket bro.

>Howso? I want a woman that encourages, emboldens, and provides assistance to the life im trying to make for myself.

I pointed out the contradiction between wanting to take on the world and make way for yourself, on one hand, yet wanting someone else to do it with you on the other.

I should have elaborated more - I was at the waiting room for a dentist appointment so I couldn't finish my point lol - the point wasn’t to put you in a ‘gotcha’ moment. Just to call attention to the all-or-nothing/black-or-white paradigm. You want both at once. Thats good by the way, that’s exactly what you should aim for.

You can do both. But we do have to be realistic:

You want a woman who encourages and emboldens and provides assistance to your goals. What you are asking for isn’t something you can realsitically get from a woman. Not just your woman btw, any woman. And I know I may come off as generalising here, but hear me out:

Women dont know how to properly encourage men. They can soothe them, comfort them, but if you ask them to validate your struggle and guide or encourage, they’ll always come up short. Only men can do this for you, and should’ve been/should be from your father. Or at least a strong male role model, or role models of competent male peers. Ones who encourage you and embolden you.

If you seek this in women, you’ll always find yourself wanting. And from the sound of things the woman you got seems like a keeper. She is patient with your vulnerability of lacking encouragement and resolve.

Other women might chew you up and spit you out for that, for not being ‘man enough’ to handle your own shit like a stoic one-man army, shitting on your manhood for it.

>>33233669
>cont
What I’m saying is, in life, everyone wants to cover all their bases. But everyone, or most people — myself included — will have at least 1 (one) void. A part of ourselves that is missing, or underdeveloped. The worst mistake we can make is to then use or try to expect another person to fill this for you. Best case scenario is, they cannot but still love you in a way you aren't appreciative for. Worst case scenario, they DO fill the void, but not to fulfill it; but to drill and eviscerate and bore a deeper void in you, by being the embodiment of what pained you before.

Example: lets say you are a guy with standard father issues (which is common today, 81% of all men struggle to have a strong relationship to a male role model). You get a chick who fills that void, seems like a go-getter chick, boisterous, robust. What that chick does is she will drag you and coldly judge you and emasculate you for failing.

This commonly happens if you are a guy who lacked a male role model. You seek a female who has those almost ‘fatherly’ qualities you wish you had. But the twist is all you attracted was the same poor or dysfunctional connection you had with dad or whichever male figure failed you, only with tits.

So, the solution isn't to seek encouragement from women, or romantically. Seek it from other men, through brotherhood or from a role model.

>>33233669
>>33233702
Thanks anon. I guess I just have to find a way to find passion and purpose outside of love, I just never really have had that.

It is weird tho that you conflate some of my issues with lack of s father figure. I read through no more Mr. nice guy, as I've been a people pleaser and wanted to get over that, and a lot of the issues I resonated with are indicative of men with poor father figures or lack of one

But it's weird cuz I have a great relationship with my dad? Who is a great guy. Psychology is a trip especially when you're your own subject.

I made this thread with the hope of some advice that could be help me to make this relationship still work rather than just giving up on it, albeit being open to advice to do so if it seemed best. I'm not sure I'm any closer on feeling different towards her, but I understand what you're saying about life and the important things to consider. Thanks bro

>>33233669
>>33233702
Lastly, in case it wasnt obvious:

Do BOTH. Keep the comfortable and peaceful and loving girlfriend. But also seek to broaden your connection with other male peers and aspire to male role models. Have the home in the lovely girl, but have the adventure as a man in pushing your comfort zones and having a tribe of guys, ideally wise men or strong men, to give you insight, encouragement, and guidance.

Have the best of both worlds bro. You do not need to sacrifice one to gain the other. This is why I genuinely think throwing away the relationship would be a genuine mistake and an act of self-sabotage. Because even if you do, you will repeat the same cycle with a new girl.

If your girl has 80% of what you need, but lacks the 20% you passionately want, thats normal. No girl is perfect.

If you trade her for a girl who has that 20%, watch the hell out. Because you’ll get that girl, but you will find she only has 20%, and no 80%. Meaning you just threw away a keeper for someone lesser.

>>33233721
>Thanks anon. I guess I just have to find a way to find passion and purpose outside of love, I just never really have had that.

Same. I was a codependent myself, so I know the whole song and dance lol. Codependent = expecting a relationship to complete you, Life doesn't work like that. I thought it did too.

>It is weird tho that you conflate some of my issues with lack of s father figure. I read through no more Mr. nice guy, as I've been a people pleaser and wanted to get over that, and a lot of the issues I resonated with are indicative of men with poor father figures or lack of one

>But it’s weird cuz I have a great relationship with my dad?
So do I. My Dad wasn’t terribly abusive to me. Nit of a temper yeah, but isnt a bad guy. Just like yours presumably aint a bad guy either. Poor father/son connection =/= father is bad guy.

It simply means the fatherhood role wasn’t carried out. Example: my dad, decent as he is, did not teach me anything. No skills, no DIY, no repairing, no fishing, no hunting, no building. In fact each time I tried to help him as he worked on something at home, he’d scold me for it. Never helped me ingratiate myself with being a man.

Which meant, while he was sympathetic to problems I had in life, he had zero problem-solving to lend me. No encouragement to punch a bully in the face, no masculine gestures to point to solutions or much of a guiding force to keep my mind and heart in the game. He was just ‘dad’, but not a father. You get me?

Either way, those things you can still learn and enjoy. It just requires not seeking the relationship to bring you that type of fulfilment, but you can get it through other guys or yourself if you wanna dare yourself to push your limits. (ideally both).

Good luck and thanks for hearing me out

>>33233309
>she does seem to want to escape her mother and actively repels herself from her.
This type of girl is only truly loyal to her mother. She needs someone (you) so she can escape her but it is hubris, because everything she does is unconsciously about her mother. You meanwhile are merely her vehicle to do so, you can never compete with her mother in her psyche. That’s how deep she is wounded by her. So you’ll always come second at best, she is her god, wether she wants it or not. But it always takes two to tango. When you encountered her you projected your wishes of an ideal woman upon her and because she’s so empty there was nothing to hinder those projections. Now that you’ve been living with her for a while the illusion you put yourself under has been broken, and obviously you’re extremely disappointed. Your almost ideal woman turned out to be a bloodless doll who just doesn’t seem to have any life-force, so of course you’re annoyed. You are bargaining and rationalising very hard to “save” the relationship, but at best you’ll be able to address the symptoms, never the cause. There are lots of anons in the thread who are telling you to let it be, because she isn’t so bad after all right? Wrong. You will be miserable, because you’re both living a big lie and she isn’t truly invested in the relationship. So again, always trust your gut, learn to identify your own rationalisations or it will fester for the rest of your life. Lastly I don’t believe people like this can be good mothers, superficially they may appear to be but your children will pay the price of your unresolved issues

>>33235449
>>33233309
I forgot to add that you very likely have some issues yourself (I believe someone already mentioned this). you also describe your exes as horrible etc. Fucked up people are attracted to each other like flies to shit, so it isn’t even her fault. Codependence, like that other anon said. I have a friend who had a very similar relationship as you for almost 10 years. He grew increasingly frustrated with her over the years, but breaking it up became more and more difficult because she’d be reduced to a sobbing mess. Finally and luckily for him there came a situation where she had to choose essentially between her mother or him. She threw him under the bus and came back crying afterwards because he was seethingly mad about it, and that’s how he escaped.

>>33233769
Yeah that tracks. I love my dad and he was always very kind, moral, loving and taught me about integrity and faith but he wasn't a typical "masculine" figure, didn't teach me about any "man" stuff because he didn't even really know how do to any of it himself.

>>33235449
>>33235523
I do have issues with like self esteem and confidence but I've generally been a good partner and friend and think myself s good person who otherwise has his shit together despite that. When I say my exes were bad I mean like, people who were extremely childish and selfish and fucked up. I've had exes cheat, verbally and emotionally abuse me, one tried to kill herself to extort me I mean it goes on, and any girl I ever met who really seemed special, put together, independent, smart, confident and I really felt something for off the bat ended up rejecting me.

Then I found my girl now, and it seemed really good at the get go because she wasn't any of those negative qualities of exes, but she also didn't have that spark of those girls who got away. She was just, good and present, and I figured I would grow with her and build love and that connection with time. And it's not like our relationship is bad it's just kind of one sided and unfulfilling.

The problem I have is I keep commiting to people who seem like good eggs, even if they're not the whole package because I'm tired and frustrated with dating and feel like I'm running out of time..I'm 30 now, I expected this to be all done and taken care of by 25 if not by now. My parents are hitting their 70s and I'm so deathly scared that they'll never get to know my children and that relationship between my future children and my grandparents is extremely important to me, but feels like it's slipping away unless I just get over my shit and deal with it. I really don't know what to do but she is a good baseline, I feel, and if I could just spark some passion and connection with her I wouldn't have made this thread

>>33233114
fuck you for mocking our dreams, women don't have to be like this

>>33235883
You seem like a good dude anon, I mean that and I wish you the best.
>My parents are hitting their 70s and I'm so deathly scared that they'll never get to know my children and that relationship between my future children and my grandparents is extremely important to me, but feels like it's slipping away unless I just get over my shit and deal with it.
This is such a strange thing to say, why do you care so much about that? Some simple math tells me your mom had you at almost 40 (!). So you can hardly be blamed for waiting a little longer yourself. I also wonder why you find the relationship between potential children with your parents so important. I mean, I get it, I loved my grandpa, but why do you feel like you owe it to them? Have they even told you they want grandchildren or do you just want to please them? They themselves would be the only ones to blame. Let’s say your gf turns out to be infertile, what would you do then? You need to prioritise your own wants and needs over those of others, it sounds like you desperately feel the need to please your mother, since you describe your father as kind of weak. Once again, you clearly feel you are going in the wrong direction, but rationalise and explain it away with all sorts of reasons. You want to change your gf into someone with a different personality, but how would that even be possible? You are bargaining to save your relationship because you are already slowly detaching from it

>>33236150
Yeah my parents were 37 and 39 when they had me so ALMOST 70 now.

It's not an expectation of theirs or a personal obligation to them on my end, I would like them to enjoy having grandchildren but I know that I have to make my own way. However, my relationship with my grandparents was extremely important to me, especially when I got older and could have deeper conversations and meaningful experiences with them. So I always wanted my children to be able to have the same experience with my parents. Feeling like that's falling out of reach is something I have to going to live with, but it is hard and it has created a general sense of pressure and time to just get married and get started.

Sometimes I feel like I've had to meet someone like her that has everything necessary for a good relationship. But maybe not everything I want and a partner because I just don't deserve to have more than that. It's a big, better safe than sorry kind of thing, and as much as I would like to hold out for that perfect match, I don't want to be chasing Disney dreams and lose out on something real if I have it. And I don't really trust my own emotions or thoughts enough to make the call on what I really want or what's really good for me so I tend to ask others, hence this thread

>>33235449
>>33235523
This anon gets it. Not putting a woman on a pedestal, seeing the misery for what it is, making OP accountable. It is not an early mid life crisis as the other anon claims, you are just not fully integrated in your manhood. Once that happens you would dump her naturally and avoid women as such, as well as the broken ones.

>>33236212
Let me guess, you are also an only child? You LOVE to talk about yourself and your perceived issues. This thread is done and gone. Deep down you know what is right and try to avoid the simple and clear-cut solution.

>>33233486
>I want a woman that...
Find male friends for people that test you, OP. Proper peers. Women are not men and men are not women, the two are not made for the same things. Men are meant to challenge other Men, you should be thankful that your woman is happy to be a woman.

>>33237340
What do you mean by integrated with my manhood?

>>33237369
No I have a younger sister. I'm just really extroverted and don't have a problem opening up. The way I see it the more I say about myself the higher the chances an anon might catch something about me that leads to new insights. Might as well continue getting advice while people are still actively replying to the thread

>>33237420
I have male friends they just.arent all that challenging they're all pretty laid back guys doing their own things. And they're all either long married or incels lol

>>33237612
>What do you mean by integrated with my manhood?
You explicitly want an "equal partner" which is contrary to nature. In a sense you want a woman to be fully dependent on you but also, in case of your death, have her take care of herself. You also mentioned somewhere that your father was not a masculine role model (same case for me) so you seem to have a more twisted understanding of what constitudes a man/manhood.

>>33237612
>I'm just really extroverted and don't have a problem opening up.
Good you didn't take my devil's advocate to heart. Still, there is only so much analysis that can be done by online strangers. You got more than enough input, though two-sided. Many advocate to break up, they are not as elaborate as those who advocate for staying with her and work on yourself, though there is a reason these anons are more numerous.

Do as thou must.

>>33233206
Very interesting. Thanks for a good post

>>33228308 (OP)
Nigga, men are supposed to be basically fathers to women. Women are lifelong children. If you want a partner to challenge, teach, and lead you then become a faggot

>>33228308 (OP)
>At times the relationship feels more like a father-daughter dynamic of me constantly teaching, guiding, correcting, and her just following along.
several anons would kill for this you ungrateful nigger

>equal partnership that I can rely on, admire, learn from
those are unicorns, they exist but finding one is not easy

>>33228308 (OP)
>no one in the thread has brought up the fact that OP is dating a child
Really?

>SHE WAS 17 YEARS, 11 MONTHS, 3 WEEKS, 6 DAYS, 23 HOURS, 59 MINUTES, 59 SECONDS OLD YOU SICK FUCK

>>33239580
> I just turned 30. I haven't girlfriend of about 9 months now
OP is literally dating a 9 month old female

>>33239590

>>33239590

Anon, I am in an extremely similar situation (even down to the working in defense part).

My girlfriend and I come from very obviously different classes, and also has a controlling and critical mother.
She is educated, however, and does have her own job making slightly above the average salary.

She is a very negative and pessimistic person who frequently gives up on things and dislikes learning new things, and she drains my energy with that negativity. Her emotional intelligence and communication skills are close to zero.
But, she is kind toward me, does help a lot with common tasks that keep the house running (cooking, grocery shopping, dishes, etc.), and is extremely loyal.

I, too, can't help but feel that there is more. According to my own hierarchy of needs, I would much rather help cook and take on other tasks if it meant that I got someone who is emotionally intelligent, feminine, creative, and importantly, has a positive outlook on life and likes learning new things.
She loves cars and Instagram. That's about it.

This is the exact quote that made me reply, for how crazily similar it resonated with my own situation:
>I try to kinda force interesting conversation like today I brought up about how I am worried my job (I work in defense) might be impacted by the Iran situation and I expected at least a "how so?" Or a "what's going on in Iran?" Or something but expectedly I got "oh sorry to hear that. I just got to work, love you!" And I even further prodded and said something like "yeah it's a crazy situation rn" hoping again to spark some interesting Convo and hear her opinions or at the least see some curiosity, but nope her reply was "hmm well I hope everything is okay for you, I miss you!" And then derailed into something about what she had for lunch, so I gave up.

Just want to let you know there are others in the same boat, also thinking about moving on, but very hesitant to give up something stable, as well as the only relationship I've ever had.

>>33243447
>Just want to let you know there are others in the same boat, also thinking about moving on, but very hesitant to give up something stable, as well as the only relationship I've ever had.
I am one of the anons who had the same kind of girlfriend, with the difference she was religious but quite vain about looks, but she has basically no online presence. Down to the negativity and lack of talking things about, even most of our interests overlapped, so I broke up with her. She was emotionally draining, each day, each week, each month until I could not take it anymore. No social skills, I had to spell everything out for her which made me go nuclear. She was inept at learning, she could only listen to me like a soldier, but not internalize subtle cues and new characteristical patterns. I broke up with her and haven't felt that free since I cut contact with my parents.

My mother is similar but worse, so she reminded of my mother a lot, albeit with a masochistic and not a sadistic character.

So, yes, break up. This cannot be fixed. You cannot fix her.

>>33228308 (OP)
I've been where you're at, OP, and yeah it's a hard thing to deal with.

Do you enjoy being around her or does it feel like a chore?
Do you feel like an asshole quite frequently for not reciprocating her energy?

Tread carefully, OP. Even if they're all smiles about it, the nicest girls do take notice when you withdraw and are heavily effected by it. If you feel like it's worth working out your differences you should make the effort sooner rather than later. Otherwise just call it quits, because she will make that decision for you and you will be completely blind sided by it.

The important point here is that this kind of limbo does not last forever, you may realise just how much you cherish this person, and by then you may have already lost them

>30

It's over dude.

>>33228308 (OP)
I was in a very similar position anon. I started thinking of the future and marriage, and every time I thought about us getting married I just couldn't see it. That's when I realized I was wasting her time, so I broke it off with her.

I'd always been uninterested in having kids, but then I met a woman at work who changed my mind. She's super responsible, motivated, and smart - then, on top of that she's cute and fit.

I felt an overwhelming desire for her and found myself even fantasizing about having kids with her and raising them together. That's when I realized I wasn't against having kids, I was just against having kids with my exes.

Now, whenever I meet someone I ask myself, do I see myself having kids with this person? Would she be a good mother to my children, caring for them and teaching them and serving as a good role model?

If the answer is no, I stop immediately. It's saved me a lot of heartache, not just now but hopefully in the future too.