Thread 33498583

How do you meaningfully counter someone who uses the expression "to gaslight" every time you say something they don't like?
>be me
>break up with a girl of 7y
>start dating a religious low maintance girl
>based political views, doesn't go out, doesn't drink
>but every we don't agree on something in our "relationship"
>"anon stop gaslighting me"
>"anon this is pure gaslighting"
I usually just change the subject and suck it up(never apologized though), because everthing I say after that, she just doubles down on me "gaslighting" her and she gets into this wird confrontational bitch mode.

>>33498583 (OP)
>wird
Weird*

>>33498583 (OP)
>>33498895
Rape her

>>33498583 (OP)
I don't know. But make sure you never actually mention what you are disagreeing about. Keep looking for ways to one-up your girlfriend and "win" the discussion without even trying to understand her POV.

>>33498583 (OP)
I would ask what gaslighting means since I'm not sure what it does

>>33498948
>I would ask what gaslighting means since I'm not sure what it does
In its original sense it means trying to make someone think they're going mad. More generally it means not merely lying but trying to make someone doubt their own perception or memory.

Nowadays people like OP's friend sometimes use it even more loosely just as a synonym for lying, which is unfortunate, as it's a lot more serious than that.

>>33498583 (OP)
It's the latest meme word women have come up with to "win" arguments when they have nothing logical left to argue with.

I used to argue with my ex about the definition of gaslighting, explain to her how we were just having a disagreement and it isn't gaslighting, etc. etc. As time went on and I got more experience, I started just telling her to shut the fuck up. That worked better than anything.

>>33498583 (OP)
sounds like she's trying to get the upper hand by confusing you.
totally 10000% unequivocally this comes from her parents / siblings and the environment she grew up in. she's just being herself, this is how she's learnt to deal with any sorta conflict.
this is the "Shut off" button for you, and for anyone giving her issues in her personal life.

you're in for a rough ride buddy, sounds extremely immature and deeply rooted to me. people who have this sort of conditioning take years of self-discovery, reflection, and actively changing their actions to get over this type of shit. sure you can try to help her to get over it, but It's going to be extremely difficult because

repeat after me :

changing another person is nearly impossible and extremely taxing and will never meet the standard that you desire

but yeah I'd keep fucking her I'm extremely lonely I'd keep her around until I find a better one

>>33498583 (OP)
Stop talking and when she ask why say:
>I'm trying to not gaslight you

If she uses that every disagreement, she's actually gaslighting you.

Zoomers overuse words until they mean nothing.

>>33498583 (OP)
Sounds like she's gaslighting you.

>>33498583 (OP)
>start dating a religious low maintance girl. based political views, doesn't go out, doesn't drink
>but every we don't agree on something in our "relationship" "anon stop gaslighting me"

honestly anon sounds similar to the girl im dating now. she is in her 30s, low body count, consevative poltically, doesnt drink, is very modest and proper.
but we've had a lot of fights that have stemmed from her insecurities. and I found myself the same position as you often. lots of times where she would say things to me that would conflicting and then tell me i just dont understand her. when i end the argument to avoid more conflict, she will do a 180 and tell me im bad for ending the argument and i should be willing to work it out.

>>33498583 (OP)
stop gaslighting your girlfriend, she has the Lord on her side

>>33498583 (OP)
Toxic word that didnt even exist 10 years ago outside of serios psychology circles with doctorates.
Id watch the Kanye West south park with them and if they didnt change run for the hills. It's honestly a word that screams Im a fucking loser by anyone who uses it.

>>33499673
>Toxic word that didnt even exist 10 years ago
That's half the language on the internet these days, including "toxic"

>>33499691
>New words
Yes
>Loaded mentally ill terms
No
Id also throw narcissist on the pile. Ive never met a happy person who causually throws that term out.
Also toxic is old as fuck. Everyone from the 80s feared quicksand and toxic waste.

>>33499709
Don't forget alien abductions.

>>33498948
Like this anon(>>33499162)
said, it's like an extreme form of psychological manipulation where someone tries to make another person doubt their own sanity, perception of reality, or memories.
>Your friends are bad influences,
>You don't need to see your family.
>you didn't saw me kissing another person, it was all in your head
>the underwear you found in my car was yours, are you too stupid to recognize them

>>33499636
>sounds extremely immature and deeply rooted to me. people who have this sort of conditioning take years of self-discovery, reflection, and actively changing their actions to get over this type of shit
This is so true. I know her light usage of this expression doesn't seem like a deal breaker, but I think it actually is:
>imagine being married or having a kid.
>"anonette I don't agree with how you raise our child"
>"stop gaslighting me, this argument is over!"
>"anonette, our bedrom has gotten cold"
>"stop gaslighting me, this is not true, this argument is over!

>but yeah I'd keep fucking her I'm extremely lonely I'd keep her around until I find a better one
Me too man, but we haven't has sex yet only a car blowie.

>>33499641
This is the best advice, gonna use this when I see her tomorrow, kek. Tnx anon.

>>33500158
>>33499641
>Why did you stop?
>I'm not trying to gaslight you
>Ah so you admit you WERE trying to!

>>33500160
This is also a big possibility, yes.
>you're now gaslighting me with not actively trying to gaslight me
You really can't win with female psychology-

>>33499653
We're both 30+.Scary, I know.

>>33499655
This was my first thougth. Either she is playing 4D chess or she is dumb.

>>33499656
>but we've had a lot of fights that have stemmed from her insecurities
>lots of times where she would say things to me that would conflicting and then tell me i just dont understand her.
>when i end the argument to avoid more conflict, she will do a 180 and tell me im bad for ending the argument and i should be willing to work it out.
Are we dating same girl, kek? It's exactly the same with my situation.
Did you find any working solutions yet?

>>33500173
its a lose lose, for OP, look up the concept of the double bind, basically a situation you may find yourself in often with this girl, and learn about it

>>33500183
>Did you find any working solutions yet?
i have not. i have been in therapy, I have taken notes, kept a journal, and have trying to understand where I keep going wrong, its been taxing mentally on me and I am very worn down. Early on I used to stand up for myself, and now I often say whatever is needed to prevent the argument from continuing.

If it helps here's here reasoning why acts like this

>anon you seem like you dont care about me, I told you i want to be kissed and hugged all the time and you barely do it
>anon i do thinks for you all the time and you never tell me thank you, you never tell me how lucky and happy you are to be with me and all that I do for you
>anon somes you retreat in your head and dont want to talk to me for a while and it makes me feel like crap, dont you understand what youre doing to me?

>>33500185
>double bind
This is very true and also very interesting, great stuff anon
>therefore, when a woman uses a Double Bind, the man is not usually motivated to withdraw, instead, he often becomes motivated to investeven more energy into the relationship
So true.
>Failure to undertsand and prperly handle double bind manipulation can have and extremely-destructive effection male self-esteem.
I find myself feeling more and more depressive when hanging with he. Like she's constantly judging and criticizing me and actually think to myself stuff like "Am I really such a bad person/such a piece of shit."
I felt the same way with some evil teachers in elementary school.

>>33500217
How long are you two together?
You seem like a bigger man than me, investing so much energy into your relationship where she is the larger problem by far.
> its been taxing mentally on me and I am very worn down
I get you, I feel like she's constantly judging and criticizing me and I actually think to myself stuff like "Am I really such a bad person/such a piece of shit."
Whydon't you leave her if she is acting issuch a way towards you?

>>33500153
yeah man. I'm glad you agree, or sad that you agree haha because it means you also think Its true.
It would be hell on earth to have an adult, in an adult's body, who you do adult things with, just have an "off switch" that allows them to live however they want. It's impossible. It's an impossible to deal with person

so yeah man, like I said enjoy your blowie, enjoy whatever she gives you, but she sounds like a person not ready for a relationship and honestly I'm in the mindset that major changes rarely happen on an already adult person, so I believe she'll just be fucked like this forever and nothing will ever prompt her to change. plenty of fucked up people out there. but yeah man don't take it from her, if it gets too much you'll have to let her go, as hard as It'll be. Because the alternative is suffering

>>33500329
>Whydon't you leave her if she is acting issuch a way towards you?
Shes very wealthy and wants to be a mom. On paper she could provide a single-income family household and a house and a yard and the kind of life I and her grew up in, back in the 90s. She makes more money than me and has no reservations about sharing it with me once we are marred. No prenup, just her money is my money. she is able to stop working for 2+ years with all her savings.
Again on paper it should be a no brainer, which is why my logical brain says dont leave this relationship. But my feelings are lining up

Everytime it gets close to that point of leaving, the fear sets in. I start thinking:

>Did I cause this? Am I just an unhappy person who cant make a good thing happen?
>Remember all the nice things shes offereing you if you just accept it
>What will she tell everyone? (We have the same sets of friends, and i worry she may tell my issues to them)
>Is this the last time I will ever meet someone? Did I not try hard enough
>Where will I meet someone now?

I dont enjoy sex anymore, so I dont get physical pleasure of it either. I dated a girl for almost 3 years before that, and ended up single for over 2 years after. Failed dates, pursuits that went nowhere. I'm 34. Time marches on.

>>33500377
>I'm in the mindset that major changes rarely happen on an already adult person, so I believe she'll just be fucked like this forever and nothing will ever prompt her to change. plenty of fucked up people out there.
I really think you're on to something. I'm in my 30s and I'm slowly realizing that veryfew people want or are willing to change for the better. It's like most people are looking for a partner whowill tolerate their negative behavioural traits(modern newspeak term is "accepting your partner they way they are") while I think that your partner should bring the best out of you and make you grow as a person.
>like I said enjoy your blowie, enjoy whatever she gives you
Not gonna yap off, but we agreed on last Friday that she would come over my place tomorrow. I called her on Monday to confirm this and she sounded very excited. I took PTO for tomorrow, bought some nice food to make lunch and dinner, the whole nine yards. She called me this morning and when asked her when I can expect her, she said she is not ready yet.
I mean okay, she doesn't owe me anything and I literally said no problem whatsoever, I just feela little let down because I planned everything and then she started being very angry and accusing me of gaslighting her.

We are still meeting outside tomorrow, but I know there is going to be this weird unspoken tention from her as in me being a bad person.

I think I must let her go.

>>33500381
I completely get what you see in her on paper as you've said but I honestly think that you're trying to live up to some fantasy idea of a great life with her while you realize that the reality is totally different and that the idea of a perfect life with her is slowly fading away by each month you spend with her and take her mental abuse on the expense of your mental wellbeing

>Did I cause this? Am I just an unhappy person who cant make a good thing happen?
No. It takes two to tangoand you seem to be investing a lot of energy to better yourself with therapy, notes and journaling.
>Remember all the nice things shes offereing you if you just accept it
But at what price? Are youwilling to pay the high "bitch" tax for the rest of your life?
>What will she tell everyone? (We have the same sets of friends, and i worry she may tell my issues to them)
I agree on this, but you know, pulling off a bandage always hurts.
>Is this the last time I will ever meet someone? Did I not try hard enough
Sure that is a realistic fear but I'm sure that you will absolutely meet someone. I was with my ex for 7y had a nasty breakup and I've been on dates with 3 girls after a year of licking my wounds.
>Where will I meet someone now?
This is a compley question depending on your lifestyle but life always found a way.
>I dont enjoy sex anymore, so I dont get physical pleasure of it either
You don't actually like her or even detest her for treating you in such a way, so you don't ejoy the sex anymore.
>Failed dates, pursuits that went nowhere. I'm 34. Time marches on.
I have a similar historyand I'm 33. Haven't you realized yet that life is like 85% of daily hardship and failure. But we get up and fight on.

>>33500481
>tention
tension*

>>33500481
Sucks that she cancelled.
I think you know your situation best, anon.
You can try to communicate with her about this, but if again she shows that she's mentally fucked and can't communicate properly - then you'd be best to let her go now, before you get involved deeper and it hurts even more. Best of luck to you brother

>>33502530
Thank you brother.