Great visual and musical style but damn this has to be bar none the worst writing across any TMNT media.

Nickelodeon just can't figure out how to make the Turtles appeal to kids again.

>>149228392 (OP)
Self-aware writing is lame enough most of the time, but using it for constant exposition and dumbed down storytelling is even worse. It's basically catering to dumb people by letting them pretend they're actually sophisticated and media-savvy.

I wouldn't call the writing worse than Rise though, they're pretty much on par.

>>149228407
Draw them looking cool, make them do cool things, put cool toys out there for them to buy. It's not hard. It's just that Nickelodeon doesn't hire people who understand what young children (especially boys) think is cool.

>>149228500
Having them act like actual teenagers is a nice idea in itself, since it's literally in the title but it was generally disregarded as a characterization factor in the source material, and the earlier adaptations mostly used a cringy marketing department idea of how teenagers acted.

Making April also a teenager since the Nick era rather than a cool adult friend was a mistake though (not to mention making her a misshapen potato mutant in MM). Hot adult April was a no-brainer point of appeal in the original

>>149228392 (OP)
>visual style
The combo of extremely ugly, lumpy characters combined with a noisy sketchy style didn't really add anything besides trying to make it stand out next to spider-verse.
>musical style
All of the tracks that weren't licensed music were completely forgettable. Yes, I know Trent Reznor worked on it. None of it is bad, it's just forgettable. "Can I kick it" and "Ante Up" aren't good enough tracks for me to pretend like the movie was better because of them.

>>149229270
I think one of the things I like about the visual style is how it's not intended to be as sleek and broadly appealing as Spider-Verse. It's messier and clumsier, but in an attractive sort of way (though I agree it has to click for you: it doesn't for me 100% when it comes to some of the character designs but still I like it a lot, specially the "drawn" lighting)

Also I thought the main theme (or at least the one they use for the title and then reuse in the end) is simple but very nice; reminds me of the classic NES game's intro music:
https://youtu.be/BWG05SbeUQo

>>149228392 (OP)
You're full of shit and you know. Claiming this has the worst writing in TMNT when IDW exists is pure lunacy.

>>149229920
There's elements of the art style that do work. Tales of the TMNT does a good job of giving us the best version of what this artstyle could look like, specifically because it dials down the ugly and uses the sketchy/messy linework for emphasis and flare. Otherwise, most people were impressed by Mutant Mayhem because they'd never seen a movie with that style. It was new, but not necessarily good.

>>149228392 (OP)
>Great visual style
HELL no!!!!

Still haven't seen the film.

>>149230450
To be fair, I've only been exposed to the original E&L comics and the animated adaptations. Example?

>>149230508
So iconic and relatable

>>149230508
I can't believe they turned April into Mr. Hankey.

>>149230454
But everybody had seen Spider-Verse at that point, normies included. And if you don't mean NPR 3D in general but specifically the doodly approach of Mutant Mayhem, what previous example prevented the unimpressed people from appreciating it?

>>149228392 (OP)
>>149230508
How come the 80s cartoon still mogs the other versions despite people online such as this board shitting on it constantly?
>Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (1987 TV series): 10 seasons 193 episodes.
>Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (2003 TV series): 7 seasons 155 episodes.
>Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (2012 TV series): 5 seasons 124 episodes.
>Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles (2018 TV series): 2 seasons 39 episodes.
Black April shills keep on LOSING, 90% of the merch is just 80s cartoon April, videogames too

>>149230508
We can look forward to bald triple-amputee April for the next TMNT iteration

>>149228392 (OP)
And it shows in the box office. This movie had a terrible box office. Being better than Transformers One is not saying much. And I suspect the sequel is going to fail even worse because of diminishing returns. This movie is like the opposite of Bad Guys in that it had a fairly weak box office but Bad Guys 2 has actual hype going for it. I'll be surprised if Bad Guys 2 fails worse than Wild Robot.

And Mutant Mayhem 2 will be the end of Seth Rogen's handling of Ninja Turtles. Another strike against the franchise because Nickelodeon were a horrible owner for Ninja Turtles. The only thing they did right was Shredder's Revenge.

>>149230572
That's a big butt

>>149228392 (OP)
I never liked any of the intentionally ugly, grossout stuff. It's annoying.

>>149230508
It's kind of annoying how any Hollywood artist definition of
>grounded in reality, real person
just translated to
>I made them an ugly fat loser weirdo

This is how they see non rich LA elite Hollywood types, everyone else in the world is an ugly fat loser weirdo to them and that is what they consider to be "Relatable" to the common dregs of society.

>>149230450
You could have gone with Archie or The Next Mutation, instead. Mutant Mayhem does have fucking terrible writing though. Learning ninjitsu from youtube because Splinter is afraid of humans. The high school focus. April's whole arc. The endless "milking" joke. The entire pointless addition of "Cynthia Utrom" It's dogshit writing top to bottom.

>>149228407
To boys you mean. Girls have never given a damn about TMNT. And the problem with all western companies is....

They are all inherently anti male ESPECIALLY animation companies.

So they both will not make what boys like and separately are not allowed to make what boys would like. TMNT is a franchise about action and fighting against all types of villains but we can't have violence because that would not be family friendly because western animation HAS to be infantile. This is why anime kicks so much ass and destroyed western cartoons. And hot women? That's illegal. Enjoy April always being ugly.

And then you have the ideologues and their agendas now April is race swapped to black and Bishop got a sex change. And Casey himself got a sex chance. It's all so disgusting. The entire Western Entertainment Industry is excrement.

>>149230794
I assumed the Cynthia Ultrom bit was simply sequel seeding?

>>149230541
IDW TMNT comics are infamous because the general formula of those comics is that....

The turtles are pacifists but most of their villains are psychos.

Even formerly comedic idiot villains like Bebop and Rocksteady have killed innocent victims and the turtles refuse to kill these villains making them greatly incompetent. The turtles are enablers of criminals and the only time villains die in IDW is when the villains accidentally kill themselves with their own weapons or a side character randomly shows up to kill a villain for the turtles. It's such an anti climax that this is routinely how the conflicts end in this comic. Surprised IDW lasted as long as it has.

>>149230757
This. It's why I always hated cartoons like Ren and Stimpy, its simply outright ugly and gross. To a lesser degree hated Angry Beavers and CatDog for being visually gross.

>>149228392 (OP)
>Mutant Mayhem April is unappealing and barely looks like April O’Neil
>Tales of the TMNT April looks better, but still not close to April O’Neil

>>149230571
Spider-verse uses multiple artstyles and animation techniques for all its different characters. It both communicates that they're from different realities and that they are also different genres. It fits with the idea of crossing over multiple different Spider-man characters. There is distinct artistic intention there.

Mutant Mayhem is sketchy and messy, because that's a style the Spider-verse movies didn't do and also because they initially over-focused on the high schooler angle where the turtles were going to start the movie in high school and Baxter Stockman was going to be their teacher who later became Superfly. So it's even less of a thematic story-artstyle connection and more of a leftover decision from an earlier draft of the movie that they probably couldn't change their minds on, since the final cut of the movie was rushed through production after years of redrafts and do-overs.

>>149232486
Damn Spiderverse was so influential that it even influenced stuff it didnt do

>>149232970
Yes? Are you trying to be flippant?

>>149230788
They're not wrong

>>149228500
Little kids don't play with toys anymore, grandpa.

>>149230840
She was going to be a bigger villain originally, but they apparently cut most of her story when they chopped Baxter Stockman's presence in the plot down to 1 minute of intro scene.

>>149228392 (OP)
>Great visual
It looked like puke and it moved like ass. It's the same overly colorful retard crap that faggots lost their shit over spider verse for even thought it was poorly animated

>>149233419
Picture "lmao" but in colorful scribbly letters

>>149230541
It's really difficult to put into words just how awful IDW TMNT is. There's just so many issues with it and I'll almost certainly be understating them with just a brief summary.

>extreme reliance on nostalgia to the point where it suffocates the entire comic
>plots are circular horseshit where nothing really gets done. The turtles are constantly fighting apocalyptic events only for the next event to roll around immediately afterwards, and any positive change the turtles make is always undone.
>nearly every character arc in this comic either gets derailed or totally undone at any given time. Casey and April get it the absolute worst, because there was a clear direction for both of these characrers and it feels like the writers took them in the total opposite direction out of spite. This has resulted in both of these characters hitting dead ends in their development, and both slowly get written out instead of the writers fixing their mistake
>the OCs are hit and miss, and by that I mean at best they're kinda cool, and at worst they're Ken Penders-tier.
>the pacing is repetitive as all hell. The comic has this weird gimmick where conversations never really end properly, they just sort of trail off while the last sentence is used to transition to the next scene. It's a common thing on modern comics, but holy FUCK does IDW take it to obnoxious levels. Literally every other page has this, once you notice it, it makes the book feel even worse than it already is.

I can go on, I really can, but I feel like I made my point here. TL:DR: OP is an idiot that hasn't experienced truly bad works.

>>149228392 (OP)
nah, that award goes to Rise of the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles

>>149233356
If they didn't, you wouldn't get anymore Ninja Turtles anything.

>>149228392 (OP)
Not sure what's going on, but for some reason, despite the crap designs, I want to hang out with and fuck Leatherhead, and comfort...then fuck Wingnut.

>>149228392 (OP)
can i

kick it?

>>149228392 (OP)
https://www.instagram.com/p/Cw27960xRbi/
Concept art for Shredder

>>149230508
making april black is one thing but why also make her ugly (twice)?

>>149233419
Some of the coolest action sequences in any TMNT media ever, and you have the gall to react this way? I hope this take on the Turtles stays with us for a looooong time then, just to spite people like you.

Could they stop make Donnie skinny and wearing glasses? He never was a wuss who can’t fight. He had received the same training as the other three. Technical skill make him stronger than his brothers.

>>149239272
>Some of the coolest action sequences in any TMNT media ever
Lmao fuck off. There's a single good sequence and it's the crime fighting montage. The fight scenes otherwise are nothing special. Even the imagi movie had better choreography and that shit is 20 years old. Even the animated series for MM has better action.

>>149234656
>extreme reliance on nostalgia to the point where it suffocates the entire comic
>plots are circular horseshit where nothing really gets done. The turtles are constantly fighting apocalyptic events only for the next event to roll around immediately afterwards, and any positive change the turtles make is always undone.

To be fair this is fucking every /co/ and /co/ adjacent property that isn't toddler or tumblr slop these days.

Nobody wants to have Spider-man stop a bank robbery, he HAS to be grappling with a villain either revealing he cucked Uncle Ben or being secretly Gigasatan devourer of hope who changes everything. The Power Rangers can't just form the megazord and defeat a monster of the week to do foundational character building and define the status quo, it HAS to be a "Remember Green with Evil and how serious it was even adults thought it was big boy TV! I wanna do that too!". For the longest time the The Transformers couldn't have the autobots just team up with some plucky humans to stop Megatron's energy harvesting scheme it has to be a life and death battle and the humans have to hate and fear them. Batman can't just fucking stop the Joker from building Whoopie Bombs and stuffing them into places for people to trip over. Sonic can't just fucking eat a chili dog and blow up some robots. The X-Men can't just fight a fucking Demon Bear.

Every single fucking one of these ends up being invested with faggots desperately regurgitating a blend of their hyperobsession with the "most important" arcs or episodes and their own desperate need for validation and to try and become "the guy", their perception of the Great Writer who was Important just like Kirby or Stan or whoever and Leave their Mark without realizing that the constant lack of foundational work like MotW issues/episodes and the like means there's no status quo other than vague corrupted nostalgia and their own constant oneupmanship means nothing they do sticks or fucking matters.

>>149239601
Worst part is that IDW TMNT's original ideas are actually good enough on their own that it could have been one of the best TMNT comics ever made, on top of the longest running, if that retarded old faggot Tom Waltz didn't insist on derailing his own story to his own take on a nostalgic character or event, only way more exaggerated and bigger and more complicated and also involving at least a dozen other "iconic" deep cut references.

>>149234656
I remember this OOC shit. I thought Raph would take the time to talk to him, encourage him, and share their troubles, instead of just getting mad at Casey for saying some toxic trash. Not to mention when Raph actually try his best to help mutant town, all he got was more indifference and complaints from others, even Leo don't want to listen to Raph's difficulties.

>>149239169
Hate to burst your bubble anon but the reason they turned her black is the exact same reason they turned her ugly. Maybe if we lived in a different universe where Idpol was suffused into all our entertainment it could happen but it cant. The only option is to make an entirely new character who is a black woman and hot.

>>149239272
>Some of the coolest action sequences in any TMNT media ever, and you have the gall to react this way?

I have eyes yes, and you think THIS garbage is what constitutes good action you're an honest to god retard.

>>149234656
I actually like Casey and Jennika's relationship, until Tom Waltz turned Jennika into mutant turtle, and Campbell ruined Casey for make Jennika fall in love with a pig.

>plots are circular horseshit where nothing really gets done. The turtles are constantly fighting apocalyptic events only for the next event to roll around immediately afterwards, and any positive change the turtles make is always undone.
All of these misery lit does not help any The Turtles character development. They're even worse than some modern manga protagonist like Deku and Yuji.

>>149239764
I think it's not just that they couldn't stick to their original ideas. They may just hype these good ideas, and then stop developing them, causing these ideas to become superficial.

We know IDW Turtles' previous life came from feudal japan, but for some reason, Splinter remember his was Hamato Yoshi, but he fucking forgot his sons original japanese names.... Even Tang Shen's ghost can't remember her son's names. Splinter only remember their kimono color so he slap their favorite colors on their mask. I don't understand why they didn't want to give the turtles japanese name. This should be an important connection between the turtles and their previous lives.

>>149240589
rude

I actually love how this movie looks in motion, like a kids crude notebook sketches come to life.
But yeah the writing is nothing special.

I loved this movie and I thought it was the best western animated film in a while when I saw it in theaters and I don't get why people hated it. Kicked modern Disney/Pixar and Illumination's ass at least. Cool animation and a sweet story. I liked how happy the ending was. So many animated films lately have been downers.

>>149239601
I don't like the writers force the turtles to think it's their duty to save the city or even the world, they're not fucking caped heroes.

>>149241703
>>149241807
Have you actually watched it again since it was in theaters? Because a lot of it looks rough and once you look past the scribbly noise, the few action sequences aren't really that great, unless you really like screaming and flailing.

>>149228392 (OP)
>zoomer Turtles

>>149241703
I wish I'd gone to see this in cinema

>>149234656
How was your impression of IDW when it first started?
I recall being on /co/ when early IDW Turtles (like it hadn't yet hit Issue 50 and was still in that evil Leonardo arc) and it was being highly praised between it and all the side comics

It's strange to say, but this is probably the first TMNT iteration I enjoyed since the nick purchase. I love the 1990 movie and 2k3, like some 87, Like Mirage(even the parts people skip like the guest issues, some of the guest issues and Tales Vol 2 are some of my favorite turtle media ever) 2012 just felt obnoxious to me, and while I can appreciate Rise's animation it just didn't work for me. I did like the Jhonen Vasquez short though, I thought that would've been a good style for a new show.
I also liked the gross designs, it reminds me of the early Playmates toys. April looked pretty awful, but I'm ok with it being a world where all the humans look like wonky weirdoes. Reminds me of some 90's claymation too

>>149239462
And Splinter put them through the same physical training regimen so they're all jacked.

>>149228407
And this "we want to be accepted by everyone" shit in the latest iteration REEKS of trying to be an expy for the lgbt. They always have to hitch their shit to other group's wagons, and make all media their soapbox.

>>149238361
Yes you can!
I got funk, you got soul
We got everybody
I got a gift, gonna stick it in the goal
It's time to move your body!

>>149241543
let's try with a little more frames to even the playing field

>>149244680
>>149239462
This is why Laird was adamant about them keeping the same body types

>>149228392 (OP)
The worst part of this was ironically when it was trying to be a TMNT product
I don't want to hear a single person bitch about they Bay turtles origins, and the sewer book, when this one they learned perfect martial arts from fucking Youtube compilations

Also the finale is just a worse version of the "You mess with New York" scenes from Spider-Man 1 and 2

>>149243335
Teenage mutants.

>>149245214
of the Ninja profession

>>149239169
She was cute in Rise, you're just a fag.

>>149241543
When does it get good?

>>149244663
The grossout designs are the worst part. TMNT is not a booger and toilet humor series.

>>149246056
They LITERALLY live in the sewers

>>149239601
You're not wrong, but IDW TMNT really does take it to an absolute cartoonish degree. Like, 90 percent of this comic is recycled from other parts of the TMNT franchise, and more often than not it feels like the writers want to slam action figures together rather than tell any sort of coherent storyline. The nostalgia bits always take priority over genuinely interesting developments, so you end up with scenarios where the comic can have crucial bits of worldbuilding that the Turtles established nuked to oblivion, solely to hype up two nostalgic villains fighting each other.

Also the comic lacks ANY kind of restraint, and it really shows by the time City of War rolls around. By then there are so many plot points and subplots and characters and references all going on at once that it will drive you insane trying to keep track of it all. Like, pic related was all that was happening in a SINGLE arc. The book just becomes increasingly bloated each arc for the sake of shoehorning in characters for the sake of nostalgia, and it collapses in on itself after a while.

>>149240839
My main issue with Casey and Jennika was that I couldn't shake this nagging feeling that the writers broke Casey and April up for the sake of setting up this relationship. In that context it was a severe downgrade that didn't help Casey in the slightest. It didn't even last all that long, so even the writers realized it was a mistake.

Plus Jennika herself had some severe issues, because the book never really answered the question of "what makes her so special compared to literally any other Foot Soldier?". I maintain that there was a massive missed opportunity for using Jennika as a sort of bridge to show what the average Foot Soldier gets up to in their daily lives. It would've been far more interesting over what they actually did with her.

>>149244635
>How was your impression of IDW when it first started?
I only really got into it during the last storytime, and I actually really liked it at the start, which is part of why I have such a burning hatred for it now. If it was bad from the jump, I could've bailed early on without wasting so much time. But it was really fun for the first 50 issues, even if it was flawed on a fundamental level. After the point the flaws start catching up and it slowly becomes unreadable. But then every once in a while they throw out a genuinely good comic, so you have just enough hope to cling onto that the comic might go back to getting good again, while on the whole it NEVER does.

It's like being trapped in an abusive relationship in comic form. I quit after Armageddon Game and never looked back. I found the 80s Turtles comics and they're so much better, it's like night and day. They promise nothing but a casual fun time like the early mainline IDW issues, and I'll gladly take that.

>>149228392 (OP)
Haven't seen Mutant Mayhem yet but there's no way it can be worse than Rise, right?

>>149246056
>TMNT is not a booger and toilet humor series.
It's in the DNA of the series, even if it's rarely revisited these days. I like how in some ways the movie feels like the product of someone who played with the old toys.

>>149247752
Rise has anime-like action. Rise is just good kiddy fun you can use as a stepping stone into TMNT 87 or the Mirage books.

>>149247799
>It's in the DNA of the series
It's a thing playmates stapled onto the series and forced the cartoon to integrate, because they made the toys first and added them to the cartoon after.

>>149247860
>Rise is just good kiddy fun
It really isn't. It may have been one of the most annoying things to sit down and watch. The dialogue was just pure insufferable garbage and they didn't even have the decency to limit it to Mikey but instead made it so every character sucked. If was ridiculous.

>>149247688
I've said it before, but the problems were there from the start, but because you know there's 149 more issue and all the side comics to go through, it's easier to tell yourself that the assorted stupid decisions from the jump are fine, because the story picks up and moves past it after a few issues. But then new problems start, and the clusterfucked plot starts getting worse. By the time you hit issue 50, you've got an unfortunately average TMNT story. Some good. Some bad. Could have been better. And then it goes for another 100 fucking issues and just gets worse, plagued by poor writer and editiorial decisions the entire fucking way down.

>>149246056
You're joking, right?

>>149248141
Yes because Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles was always supposed to be clean and sharp like a Japanese knife


You coomers would love a TMNT Anime with a bland cute eyes art style and pedophile fan service

>>149247752
It's worse than Rise because Nick and Seth Rogen are pushing MM's characterizations, designs, and writing style as THE iteration of the Turtles. Rise just came and went and can be easily ignored.

>>149248863
>>149248982
Are you two being retarded on purpose?

>>149246056
eeeeeeeeeh, yeah it is.

>>149249133
By sheer number of episodes, comics, and movies where that is not the case: You are objectively wrong. Stinkbug and other gross-out characters are outliers, not a core element of TMNT.

>>149247208
They hype up so much stuff but eventually they never once really develop a decent storyline and just rushed it to the end and then hype up the next one.

>I maintain that there was a massive missed opportunity for using Jennika as a sort of bridge to show what the average Foot Soldier gets up to in their daily lives. It would've been far more interesting over what they actually did with her.
I think she should have a storyline to reflect on the fact that she once killed some innocent people as a Foot assassin. I remember she did kill a professor who found the scroll of Foot Clan secret history. How she will make amend if she met these victim families and friends. What if they want revenge?

If there is any new plot that can replace the plot of her become a mutant turtle and also end her story, it should be that she returns to prison to face her crime again, but at least thanks to her training in the Foot Clan, she will not be bullied in prison, and Splinter's teachings have also taught her to be patient with some prisoners and try to enlighten them. Maybe in the end she would be respected by most people in prison.

>>149249309
>objectively

Shut up nerd

>>149248141
The designs for most of those figures were provide by Mirage, anon. Playmates gave them commission for providing figure designs and Laird and Eastman arranged for Mirage artists to handle as much as they could to get them extra pay. Laird even did concept art for the early figures.
Some of the unused designs were REALLY out there,too.

>>149248141
>>149249483
Hell this is why Steven Murphy and Ryan Brown were trying to do the Mutanimals spinoff- most of them were things they created for the Playmates toyline

>>149228392 (OP)
Do we owe them an apology?

>>149249483
>>149249538
If Eastman and Laird wanted the series to be all fart and boogers, they would have done exactly that. What you're arguing and showing doesn't show that TMNT was ever intended to be a toilet humor story.

>>149249647
No

>>149249647
Why do all Ben Schwartz characters act the same and wear blue?

>>149249647
They actually got a best story and a decent ending in 40th Anniversary Comics.

>>149228392 (OP)
cool turts

>>149249647
I don't. Been a fan since the theme song first surfaced.

>>149248171
The writers have a weird moral code where they want the turtles to be merciful but, they have to fight the most psychotic versions of the villains. They also don't allow the turtles grow strong enough to defeat the major villain. In the entire story, we only see that the turtles' pacifism does them no good and only brings them more trouble.

>>149238543
Huh, interesting. It's like an exaggeration of the TMNT II costume. Though there's a sort of asymmetry here that feels...YA-esque? Like, the style feels like something you'd see in a preteen graphic novel.

>>149249748
Typecasting. He simply can't escape it

>>149253005
I like they let Roger Craig Smith voice Raph in TMNT: Splintered Fate.

>>149247688
Even casuals lost interest with TLR sequel after Tom Waltz and Kevin Eastman killed Mikey. Why do they think it would be hyped up to rush kill off old character and replace them with new ones?

bump

>>149230508
Iconic and relatable
>>149230572
Based

>>149230788
>This is how they see non rich LA elite Hollywood types, everyone else in the world is an ugly fat loser weirdo
they must lurk on /co/ a lot

>>149252112
It's just Tom Waltz. He's a fucking idiot who tries too hard to mash together too many philosophies because he really, really wants to tell redemption stories, while also retelling exaggerated versions of existing stories, while simultaneously being gritty and serious, but also kid-friendly and PG.

Shredder torments the turtles over lifetimes, and it's a grievous, traumatic experience that fractures their whole family that they haven't recovered from years on. He even gets redeemed and treated like he wasn't ever truly that bad... And then there's Bishop, who does the same shit to the turtles, including turning their friend like a weapon to use against them (same shit Shredder did with Leo), but he's doing it in the name of protecting the planet from hostile aliens and mutants (both of which exist and proceed to cause many, many huge threats to the Earth), but when he gets stomped to death, not a single person cares. He doesn't even go to the afterlife or given a second thought.

That's Tom Waltz in a nutshell.

>>149254231
Again?