Thread 149445675

>>149445675 (OP)
It just shows us no one really reads comic books. Injustice is so popular since it had marketing with a video game thats it. It does not help everyone must be scared as shit to even attempt to adapt Kingdom Come with ANY art style becasue you just cant

>>149445725
I realize I've gotten old in that I never realized KC has apparently become overshadowed by a shitty western fighting game. I know comics are niche but KC always felt like something even casuals knew, like DKR

>>149445675 (OP)
Kingdom Come was carried by the art, but despite everything it's better than Injustice.

There had to be a saner way to handle both stories.

>>149445867
>>149445976
I just notice whenever people complain about Injustice forcing a bunch of evil super man stories and mentioning Kingdom Come always has people getting shocked everytime.

>>149445675 (OP)
The Green Lantern character design in this one is so insanely cool.

>>149445675 (OP)
Only read it because of plastic man

I think what stands out as the defining scene in KC for me is the moment when Magog kills Joker. You expect for it to be some serious "he went to far moment" instead everyone cheers and outs Superman. Magog is the new hero the 90s needed hes cool, and epic and kills the bad guy woooo!!!

>>149446083
Literally me.

>>149446204
>They chose a hero who would kill over a hero who wouldn't
>Now they're dead
It's that edge of profound and ridiculous that I want from my conic books

>>149446204
This moment is so profound becasue it could still happen today and everyone in the comic and the viewers around it would cheer for it.

>>149445675 (OP)
It's still terrible and carried only by the (stiff) art
>Cable is . . . LE BAD!
>"pastor" who believes the bible is all just a feel-good metaphor
>Billy and J'onn got raped for no reason
>heckin biblical references!
>bloodthirsty Diana
>every boomer fucks off and is surprised that the kids that they taught nothing to turned out fucked up

>>149446603
Fag

>>149446603
The art may be stuff, but Alex Ross painted it when he was barely 25, which is impressive. Maybe not so much in the age of digital painting where some asian teenager can do highly rendered paintings in a few hours, but for only the second really big project he had, there's such a leap even from Marvels.

>>149445683
>>149446603
It's still Waid's best comic to date.

>>149446062
Evil superman wasn't even the problem with Injustice. That was how everyone except Green Arrow and Harley Quinn left their identities at the door.

>>149446230
>me at 2am in front of my computer screen pondering which of my hundreds of steam games I should play
>I wait still

>>149445675 (OP)
This comic is proof Mark Waid was always a deranged boomer.

>>149445675 (OP)
Kingdom Come is dogshit.

>>149447786
>>149447800
Kingdom Come is solid. And one of the best alternate future comics.

>>149446713
I agree. I wonder how big Alex Ross imfluence was.

>>149446603
What you describe is just being more than just panels but having a meaning or deeper intentions. It is more like Homers ailias or Platons Atlantis.

>>149446685
I dont think that it is that stiff. But more cinematic and like old paintings.

>>149446083
How is Alan Scott looking like he did the 40s in modern comics if he has this sick armor to wear

>>149447908
>I wonder how big Alex Ross imfluence was.
a good deal. Alex Ross had the seeds for Kingdom Come as early as the 80's when he was a kid. It's why Flash and GL take after the golden age versions, or why Dick is Red Robin long after nightwing is established; originally Ross was thinking of this as an Earth 2 story. I'm sure Waid input a lot too, but a lot of the ideas are steered by Ross.
The art book Mythology goes into it and has some early notes, but they're kind of hard to read(including a bizarre idea for a movie Ross wrote as a teenager about a teenager getting reborn as a baby with knowledge of the future and becoming a messiah with the movie ending in the whole world singing a classic rock song)

>>149447873
There's a page in this comic where a character wearing an American flag murders a boat full of refugees wearing turbans, and the American flag wearing hero is very obviously the bad guy.
And this was in the 90s. Before 9/11, before the UK Migrant Crisis, before Donald Trump.

>>149445675 (OP)
Yeah, Kingdom Come was only kinda dogshit.
The whole message is wonky, really "new bad, old new", the younger characters have basically no agency of their own.

>>149445675 (OP)
Yeah, Kingdom Come was only somewhat dogshit.
The whole message is wonky, very "new bad, old good", the younger characters have basically no agency of their own.

>>149448058
It suffers from the same problem that Superman Vs The Elite has. That the 'dark edgy' new Superheroes are pretty much all strawmen with no redeeming qualities. The story doesn't allow them to have any valid points, or even make their case about why killing is necessary sometimes. It just smears them as bad and their way of being a superhero as bad without trying to be even handed.

>>149445867
Nah. Nobody read kingdom come because it doesn't look like regular comics and doesn't have Baby Sneed or Big Chungus in it. Its like how people will read garbage marvel comics but will never pick up Marvels.

>>149447908
Capeshit is not comparable to Classical works

>>149448244
The Iliad is a somewhat straightforward action story to be honest.

>>149445675 (OP)
this was utter dogshit though, retard.

>>149448021
Because it was always a thing. And in the 90s you had Iraq, Afghanistan and Yugoslavia war. So you had some sort of war refugees that was present to use in Kingdom Come.

>>149445675 (OP)
>reject modernity embrace tradition the comic book

>>149447971
Interesting. But it shows with Kingdom Come that Alex Ross needs a “veteran“ writer as a correcting editor.

>>149446603
>le
>heckin
Look I know you’re being ironic but you still sound like a massive faggot

>>149448244
They are. Not all and everything. Just like not every classical work is good or great. Many are forgotten.
But to go back to my statement, i meant that more in a sense of how and what is used and assembled.

>>149445675 (OP)
I like it, but I feel like a lot of anons here are blinded by it.
They seem to refuse to see that this Superman isn't morally ambiguous or that he can fail like any human, but rather see him as a perfect god.
I think thats incorrect

>>149446781
The issue with Injustice was that Superman was right to kill the Joker and the writers made him evil to say ' See? This is why heroes should never ever kill.'
>>149446204
Magog didn't go too far by killing the Joker, it was mostly everything he did after killing Joker that went too far.

This is probably an unpopular opinion, but KC's whole '90s antiheroes are bad' premise limited the story. That being said, it wouldn't be KC if things played out differently.

I liked the Laibach guy.

>>149446781
The problem with Injustice is whenever the it's not being hilariously retarded and having fun with it
Reading it with /co/ was super fun
>>149450004
Yeah show me anyone who'd fault someone for murdering a mass murderer who also just drugged you into killing your wife and unborn child

>>149445675 (OP)
/co/ is pushing the revisionist narrative that "Kingdom Come was never good" just because Waid has been garbage for the last 15 years, as if that somehow makes his older work any less good.

>>149445683
That review is utter dogshit.

>>149450004
>>149446603
And here come the morons who think it's about "90s antiheroes".

>>149450845
>And here come the morons who think it's about "90s antiheroes".
If it isn't, then what does Kingdom Come have to say about anything?

>>149450004
I wouldnt say the anti-hero is limiting. It still feels not dated.

Injustice honestly makes me sad. What we had was a perfect opportunity to be an entry for a lot of people into DC comics. But instead of given us something that showcased and shared the characters as they are instead what we got was Edgy Bad Universe Number 578. It's such a wasted chance all because Nether Realm had to do this rote bullshit.

>>149450845
Kingdom Come is okay, but his Flash run is overrated mediocrity.

>>149445675 (OP)
You know I was just thinking earlier today that if Injustice did a rough adaptation of this or something instead, it would've been way fucking better.

Damn I need to reread this shit, it's been years.

>>149450004
What I think I like the most about Magog is that unlike say Manchester Black or any other variant of the pro killing heroes he was probably the one most disgusted by how things went.

https://bleedingcool.com/comics/lets-all-read-alan-moores-proposal-for-dc-event-comic-twilight-of-the-superheroes/

Thoughts on Alan Moore's proposed Twilight of the Superheroes event that never happened? Yeah, yeah, I know

>bleeding cool

But just ignore that.

>>149451255
Nah, we should've just had gotten a good DC fighting game that captured the feel of the comics like the MvC series. Something like DC vs. Capcom or DC vs. SNK would've been way better.

>>149451198
It isn't "saying" anything about anything. It's just a superhero story. You're overthinking it.

>>149451259
His Flash run is fucking great and the high points of it are still the peak of the character.

>>149451359
I wish people would stop comparing these. Twilight of the Superheroes was basically just a superhero version of Game of Thrones. They're nothing alike.

>>149451382
The biggest problem with Injustice is that NRS made it. NRS was always going to make it because WB owns both NRS and DC. NRS can't balance for shit and they can't animate for shit. Their chosen art styles also really don't work well for a superhero fighting game where going for realistic rendering kind of undercuts the fantastical hyper fighting aspects of the genre.

>>149451359
I always thought it'd be a disappointment a draft like these always are easier than actually writing and penning the story plus art. I think it's cool though
>>149451302
You'd think Magog would have more going on he appears in like what five pages?

>>149451382
That was pretty much my point. Yes.

>>149451468
The only ones who really care about "balance" are the handful of arcade gamer tourney fags. And MvC2 is quite famously busted to shit. I do agree that I don't think their art style was the best choice but I don't think it had to be. Like we could have probably gotten something with the Alex Ross realistic aesthetic and that would have been cool.

>>149451451
They rightfully get compared because they're both alternate bad futures of the DC universe, and KC actually had some stuff that was originally going to be in Twilight, like the Superman/WW pairing.

>>149451491
>I always thought it'd be a disappointment a draft like these always are easier than actually writing and penning the story plus art. I think it's cool though
The draft does make it seem like an incredible story. That said, Idk if I would've liked to have seen it actually get made, as it would've led to more darker and edgier DC stuff and we already got way too much of that as it is.

>>149451558
>They rightfully get compared
No they don't and you know it. Stop trying to make Alan Moore the protagonist of comics.
>they're both alternate bad futures of the DC universe, and KC actually had some stuff that was originally going to be in Twilight, like the Superman/WW pairing
These don't constitute real similarities. Again, stop making Alan Moore into the center of the universe of the comics industry.

>>149451468
>The biggest problem with Injustice is that NRS made it. NRS was always going to make it because WB owns both NRS and DC. NRS can't balance for shit and they can't animate for shit. Their chosen art styles also really don't work well for a superhero fighting game where going for realistic rendering kind of undercuts the fantastical hyper fighting aspects of the genre.
I don't disagree in the slightest. I think WB should just be comfortable with giving the DC license out to another dev and letting NRS make a horror fighting game or something.

>>149451521
There's balance at a high level and then there's balance at a low level, and NRS sucks at both. NRS loves a particularly obnoxious form of zoner and includes retard-tier broken shit in a lot of their games. The bigger problem either way is their animation team, which sucks giga dongs. Marvel 2 is a legacy game (and has a gigantic roster) so it gets a pass, and a lot of the more busted stuff took a while to figure out. Games that come out as busted as MvC2 nowadays, like DNF Duel and now Nen Impact, rightfully crash and burn.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RkapfBYIfc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTeFLQlS6EI

>>149451451
>Twilight of the Superheroes was basically just a superhero version of Game of Thrones
BAT PUSSY, PAUL, BAT PUSSY

Personally I always felt the chain of logic from "Magog is willing to kill the Joker" to "It's his fault Parasite ripped open Captain Atom" was extremely weak. I get what they were going for, but the specifics just feel too contrived to be a convincing moral argument. Especially when it's an accident that could have easily happened when Superman was in charge.

>>149451987
I don't think they're making a "moral argument". The new breed of superheroes were reckless and needed to be put in check and the JLA were the ones to do it. You're overthinking it.

>>149450665
why does diana look like that lmao

>>149446083
Didn't this dude just fight gangsters and fuck bitches? Why's he on the lookout for Ayy lmaos?

>>149450665
>read injustice
>someone gets hit or is crying out in grief or whatever
>NNNARGGHH!
Every time. Every character it's NNNNAAARGHHH. Never AIEEE or EEK or OOF or even ARGH, always NAAARGH

>>149451451
>a superhero version of Game of Thrones
It even had incest.

>>149451389
>His Flash run is fucking great
It really isn't.
>the high points of it are still the peak of the character.
That doesn't mean anything. It's still mediocre.

>>149445725
>It does not help everyone must be scared as shit to even attempt to adapt Kingdom Come with ANY art style becasue you just cant
If it was up to Ross he'd just have it be in the DCAU style. Ross has a few cartoon style pitches no one ever buys cause they only want to pay him to draw realistically.

>>149453178
you have shit taste

>>149445675 (OP)
I never really liked this one outside of the art. I don't get why the actual story gets put on a pedestal. At least Injustice had the excuse of being a flimsy justification for a DC fighting game to happen.

>>149453084
It's oddly hype and fun a good chunk of the time
>Lobo's Ring Cock
>Detective Chimp
>Plasticman Annual
>Kal El Welcome to the Sinestro Corp
It's more fun than it has a right to be considering how dumb it is and how it has to bend over backwards to get to the first game. Ditto for Year 6 orwhatever for the second game

>>149453345
No.

>>149451596
I haven't even read that much Alan Moore stuff outside of his DC output.

>>149451596
It's not that anon's fault. DC made Superman, Batman, Kirby, Moore, Miller, and Crisis the chief defining characteristics of DC. Marvel kept the naming convention of Earth-616 for the mainstream universe after Moore's run on Captain Britain.

>>149445675 (OP)
The only thing about Kingdom Come that wasn't utter dogshit was Alex Ross' artwork.

>>149455328
this is selective confirmation bias

>>149455385
Those are pretty big things.

>>149446713
You could probably find 10 better stories in his Flash run alone.

>>149455414
Not likely.

>>149453239
Damn, if they did a DCAU style Kingdom Come in the original BTAS style that'd be the tits.

What killed more people: Batman letting the Joker live every year, or Magog killing Joker?

>>149445675 (OP)
What's /co/'s consensus on Justice?
Whenever I remember it the spread page of them in robot suit turns my stomach but the Wondy/Cheetah fight turns me on.

>>149455583
I started it twice but never got far.

Who the FUCK is Magog?

>>149456492
This nerd.

>>149456492
He's a god from another universe who gives his juice to some twat called lance who also calls himself magog

>>149445675 (OP)
Kys Linkara, you just like it because Starfire fucked anyone but Beast Boy. More like kingdom cum.

>>149455583
It's a fun book. Not as good as KC and since there's so many characters, a lot of them end up flanderized but a book every Justice League fan should read anyway. Even if it's more of a homage to the Super friends.

>>149450845
>That review is utter dogshit.
Because the magazine this was published wants to be intellectual and contrarian.

>>149451302
I agree with that. He is a better or tragic anti-hero. Thats another point of how good KC is. The characters dont feel one dimensional.
>>149451491
>in like what five pages?
And still better written than your aberage modern character.

>>149446204
Magog is based as fuck. He's exactly the kind of character comic books need right now. Enough of this faggotry of goodie two shoes heroes who refuse to kill mass murderers because they are le heckin victims of the systems.

>>149449750
I don't know about that. I find the actual writing (and not just the ideas, but that too) of Earth X far, far superior to Kingdom Comd.

>>149451255
>What we had was a perfect opportunity to be an entry for a lot of people into DC comics
People liked Injustice because it was edgy. The general audience only likes DC when it's edgy. Specially overseas. Looks how Superman is doing in the rest of the world. In Germany it's making less money than Morbius. If Injustice had been anything but pure edge it would have only gotten mild interest and would be forgotten by now.

>>149455490
Batman, but with Magog the number of killers remained the same.

>>149456809
I hated Earth X. /co/ hypes it up so much, yet it's not only boring but also just stupid.

>>149456809
What i see as a problem with Alex Ross is that his stories tend to split into too many storylines (could also be companies asking for additionals one-shots and mini-series) and the end kinda fizzles out.
Thats something i dont see with Kingdom Come. The story is much tighter or focused. And the end is rewarding, feels concluded and give some shine on the characters with a feel for “to be continued…“ or “they lived happily…..“

>>149456877
Boring? I thought it is tense like a “who dunit“ or a western with showdowns.

>>149450665
>Yeah show me anyone who'd fault someone for murdering a mass murderer
Clark would. It's just not in his nature to fatality someone. But even in a fit of rage, he wouldn't have done all the stupid shit he did afterwards in that comic.

>>149451468
Don't forget
a
block
button
lmao