Thread 149653691

Was it really that bad?

>>149653691 (OP)
Censorship is bad, yes, christcuck faggot tourist. Now kill yourself

>>149653691 (OP)
Batman became really boring in the silver age because of it.

>>149653738
You okay man?

>>149653691 (OP)
Nope. We wouldn't have Adam West Batman today without it.

>>149653691 (OP)
Yes.
It almost totally destroyed EC Comics.
>>149653788
But at what price?

>>149653691 (OP)
Yes. It ruined comics as a medium in the US and lead to the dominance of capeshit

>>149655826
That's certainly the narrative but I'd like to conduct some independent research to see if that's actually true.

>>149655826
superheroes?

>>149653691 (OP)
It was worse.

>>149655840
There a reason no one makes capeshit anywhere but the US.

>>149655856
Yeah they say that in comics documentaries a lot but I'd like to see the raw sales figures.

>>149653691 (OP)
Some ust want is back to stop the gays, that is so stupid

>>149655856
BNHA is technically cape THOUGH

>>149653788
Adam West's Batman came from Playboy parties making fun of the 40's serials. The CCA didn't really have much to do with it, they would've made a jokey Batman series regardless because the producers went to those parties.

>>149655826
>>149655840
>>149655856
>>149655907
The idea that it directly lead to the dominance of capeshit is bullshit because Dell comics were still dominating into the early 60s, and Mervel wouldn't take over the market until a series of distribution issues plagued Dell.
Dell was largely known for IP comics based off cartoons, westerns, and other genres that weren't superheroes.
What the CCA did was corner EC comics out of the market and largely affected Crime and Horror, but Horror would come back, arguably more graphically, in magazine formats in 20 years by the 70s.

>>149656289
Dell collapsed after the CCA was formed, Wertham's group had a hate bone for Dell and pressured WB and the other licensees to cancel their relationship with Dell, by the early 60's Western took all their IP and created Gold Key and Dell began experimenting with alternative formats to get away from CCA scrutiny

>>149653691 (OP)
No it wasn't. CCA existed in the 80s golden age and did nothing to curb the artist expression going on in that time.
>>149653738
Eat shit porn tranny

>>149653691 (OP)
It was bad for the same reason the MPAA is bad, it acts like a third party regulatory group but was just run by the big publishers so that only their product gets an audience. The CCA was run by the big publishers and colluded with the distributors for them to not distribute non-CCA books. And funnily enough the downfall of the CCA came when the big publishers lost control of it, when the Spider-Man anti-drug PSA issue commissioned by the US government was printed without the CCA stamp was the beginning of the end

As a number of digital stores are now finding out the hard way, you can't just stock material not meant for children alongside material that is and expect to get away with it.
>>149654597
Those guys were going to get it one way or another. If not the regulators, the government or stores just outright refusing to stock those comics anymore. It took about a decade for Warren to start magazines like Creepy, Eerie, and Vampirella, life finds a way.
>>149655840
It's not. Look up what actual books Marvel and DC were publishing from 1954 through the 70s. War, westerns, romance, adventure. Capes dominated because those were the books that sold the most. You can start here to see what the numbers were https://rsmwriter.blogspot.com/2023/01/comics-sales-1969-1970.html

>>149653691 (OP)
Yes.

>>149653691 (OP)
It was bad, though it's often wrongly said to be bad for superhero comics.

There's nothing the Code prevented that superhero comics need to do, and after the Code was revised in 1970 or so, it was probably more permissive than the actual publishers (hence, Jim Shooter decided to ban the use of mild profanity like "Hell" and "Damn" but the Code had allowed those for years already).

It's a bit like the Hollywood Production Code. Most of the rules (crime must always be punished, ditto sex out of wedlock) weren't a problem for the type of escapist family-friendly movies that Hollywood primarily made. They were a terrible drag on any movie that tried to be realistic, because the Code forced films to lie about what the world is like.

Same with comics. Superheroes are frankly escapist entertainment for children, evil would always get punished with or without the Code. But you can't make "serious" or even semi-realistic comics that way.

>>149653691 (OP)
In a way it was a good thing because it prevented the government itself from regulating the medium.
Instead this self-censorship meant that once the medium was in a place where it could safely uncensor itself, it could.

The main terrible thing about the CCA was how it fucked up telling basic stories about crime or romance by prohibiting any negative depictions of marriage or the justice system, and any positive depictions of divorce or criminals.
It really hit Batman hard, it's no surprise that the silver age was the worst-performing era for the Dark Knight.

It also was abused by DC to eliminate their competition and the entire medium of horror comic books

>>149655826
That wasn't the CCA.
During the height of the CCA romance comic books and westerns were still often far better sellers than most superheroes.
The CCA did kill off horror comics, and neutered the more risky romance books.
But the domination of cape shit seems to have been a natural phenomena done by the comic book reading public of the US

>>149655856
Japan makes more capeshit than the US.

>>149653691 (OP)
No most of the all time greats from Marvel were made under its watch.
Once done the tryhard "muh gritty" edgelord era of comics began. And only a few good works resulted from that.

>>149653691 (OP)
>>149653761
>>149655840
>blatant astroturf is blatant

>>149659303
The dominance of cape shit is equal to the dominance of shonen manga in Japan. Both of them are aimed for young male audiences and both genres created the most influential comics.
Ex: dragon ball and cape shit.

>>149657382
>Those guys were going to get it one way or another.
It didn't have to be that way.
Before Dr.Wertham showed up on the scene, the original Batman comics were dark and edgy, and then, all of a sudden, no more talk about Batman's r Robin's origins. (Both saw their parents get killed)

Good point about Carlton Comic, though.
I was always surprised that I could buy Vampirella at the age of twelve, and not get carded for it.

It did have one inadvertent positive benefit. When Marv Wolfman wrote a story for the DC anthology series The House of Secrets, the issue's framing device had the host, Abel, comment that he heard it from a "wandering Wolfman". The Code mistook this for a mention of a werewolf and flagged it. When the editorial staff told them that the story was written by someone actually named Wolfman, the code allowed it on the condition that he be clearly credited as the writer. Other DC writers complained about Wolfman giving them special consideration, so to placate them, the management decided to properly credit all writers going forward.

>>149660098
>Before Dr.Wertham showed up on the scene, the original Batman comics were dark and edgy
Batman was edgy for a few years at best. A lot of golden age Batman comics weren't. Goofy stuff with Dick Sprang's giant props and wacky gadgets. In the 50s, most superhero comics were completely safe. Wertham's objections to Batman was that he thought Bruce and Dick living together was gay, that Superman was some sort of Nazi thing because he was ignorant about his creators, and that Wonder Woman was an attempt to psy-op men into getting into BDSM-switch relationships with women (this was his stopped clock moment, this was in fact Marston's agenda).
The comics that got stamped out by the CCA were the edgy horror and crime comics, EC Comics and its knock-offs. Even Marvel got in on it with Menace. I find this scene funny and entertaining, but nothing like this would ever be shown in a movie or a television show at the time because kids could see it, so why would it be allowed in a comic? People just weren't paying attention. Well, it go their attention, there were Senate hearings and everything, and they put a stop to it.

>>149660519
Batman was edgy for about 11 months, that's when Robin was introduced, once National realized kids were reading comics, the Joker and Catwoman were created a few weeks later and then they stopped killing Batman's villains at the end of each story so the rogues could return in future stories, parent groups cry about comics happened after WW2, there was a toothless version of the CCA in 1947 but the senate hearings and parent hysteria didn't reach their boiling point until 1954 with the publication of Seduction of the Innocent

>>149660847
He was still off-and-on edgy for a bit afterwards. In Batman #1 Joker is a serial killer. At the end of his second story he accidentally stabs himself to death, but they thought he was too good a concept to be a one-off villain so they rewrote the dialogue to say he was going to live through it.

>>149660937
Also in Batman # 1, Bats gun downed Hugo Strange's henchmen and hung one of the Monster Men with a noose from the Batcoptor which parents complained about, so after that issue, the editor, Whitney Ellsworth decreed to Bob Kane (with Bill Finger) Batman could never use guns and heroes couldn't kill villains no matter what line wide for National Comics, by Batman #4 the No Kill Rule was established in the story

Didn't read the thread but let me guess
>I need censorship because the people that actually make comics keep saying things I don't like

>>149661532
That, but also some fun comic book industry history discussion. How censorship molded the industry we see today.

>>149659355
You're an ass fucking fag.

Go fuck a man's ass and get shit stuck in your peehole you ass faggot

>>149653691 (OP)
For horror, yes big time. However...
It did have the effect of making comic books focus more on characters/superheroes which helped that genre because they couldn't rely on shock anymore to sell.
They also forced Dick Grayson out of Bruce Wayne's bed which was a good thing.

>>149653691 (OP)
yes but it wasn't an official government mandate, it was a compromise but still resulted in a defacto censorship that crippled creativity and it has effected the industry in more ways than just censoring stuff in the 60s

still better than having to show your id for every time you buy something with "adult" content
but worse than the ESRB system for games

>>149653691 (OP)
Well, considering it killed off a lot genres like horror and Sci-fi. The only genres that survived were kiddie and superhero comics,. I suppose it was a disaster.

>>149663726
>The only genres that survived were kiddie and superhero comics,.
This didn't happen until many years after the CCA went into effect.

>>149653691 (OP)
Define bad, OP senpai?

>>149664350
It was fairly instant CCA was formed in '54 EC comics who did all the horror and sci fi stuff was out of the comic business by '55. Dell who did the Western and Pulp books were pushed out of the traditional comics market by '61
At the same time but unrelated Faucett Comics who also did westerns was in a 12 year legal case with DC over plagiarism claims that Captain Marvel was a rip off of Superman, they eventually won but the legal fees wiped the company out.
Romance, Western and War comics were solid sellers until the early 70's when Charlton finally went out of business and later the DC implosion killed everything but the superhero line.

>>149659313
That's utter bullshit.

>>149653691 (OP)
yes, retard

>>149653691 (OP)
No idea, but I wish comics were better.

>>149668436
This, but with animation too, dawg.

>>149653691 (OP)
as a creator, i'd hate it

porn addicts are genuine scum. you can be a porn addict, but don’t push that shit onto other people. it’s turning you into literal cattle that are easily manipulated, chasing a carrot on a stick. sheep in a herd

>>149659313
I've seen more capeshit from Korea than Japan.

>>149653691 (OP)
Are they still here?