Thread 149665341

What's the hardest part about drawing comics for you? For me, it's perspective.

>>149665341 (OP)
>is thread will be about ai in 10 sec

Staying motivated to make it when it's not your livelihood

>>149665341 (OP)
A total lack of creativity and artistic ability

Knowing how to make a comic

>>149665341 (OP)
Resisting the urge to draw porn of my characters. Nasty, gross, gooner shit.

>>149665586
Make something fun and generic like it was designed for machine cloning or advanced fabrication techniques

>>149665791
Post your goon

>>149665628
Pretty learnable these days. The trouble is finding energy and motivation.

Keeping the different body parts in proportion to each other.
I’m working up to perspective.

>>149665837
Move the part you want to draw manually until you feel comfortable trying to shift vantage points

>>149665341 (OP)
Serious answer? Redraws. Nothing cripples creativity, confidence and momentum like having to redraw a whole page (or more).

>>149666034
Fantastic way to get experience tho.

>>149665341 (OP)
That, but to be more verbose yet vague at the same time it's imagining a significant scene in my head, finding error however large or insignificant in what's on paper, anatomy, detail, shading, line weight, etc. and immediately spending the rest of my day looking for distractions from the sinking thoughts of futility and disappointment from knowing however many more cases of this there may be panel for panel, page for page, ones I'll have to erase or edit repeatedly or extensively to fix or worse that will be unsalvageable and I'll have to start all over for...until I chance upon the drawing a few days or weeks later and having forgotten all my obsessions realize it's not that bad, trying again, then the cycle repeats itself.

That, the psychology of perfectionism but inability to be perfect.

>>149665341 (OP)
For me it's the focus. You have to give every panel your everything if it's gonna look acceptable. If you half ass even one aspect of the art, it's gonna bring down the quality of everything. Then there's the writing, but that's a whole different beast.

>>149665553
>>149665818
Motivation is a meme. You need discipline. You need to start and not stop.

>>149665341 (OP)
My art is okay, but color is unbelievably time consuming.
>>149666622
Absolutely and you need to plan things well in advance so it doesn't all fall apart and leave you completely burned out. I failed to do this and although I'm back at it, I was so depressed by the dumpster fire I made for myself that I froze up for awhile.

>>149665341 (OP)
backgrounds and furniture

>>149666742
>My art is okay, but color is unbelievably time consuming.
Did you go into a lot of detail rendering? I'm hopeless at that.

>>149666793
I work a lot with color tones and I'm obsessed with how light hits the form. It's maddening but I cannot seem to stop myself.
Originally, I designed my system around a simple two tone scheme based on the way they colored the batman animated show. now I usually work with between three and five tones, but sometimes more.
I'm probably articulating that poorly and come off like a pretentious douchebag as a result.

>>149665341 (OP)
Backgrounds, FUCK backgrounds. I think it's one of the biggest reasons I can never get into making comics proper because I can't put down the setting I have in my head with how difficult it is. Don't even get me started on characters sitting on chairs, holding objects etc...

>>149666877
No no, that's fine. You're earnestly expressing yourself, that's not pretentious in my book. Could you post your work, I want to see what you're talking about.

>>149665341 (OP)
That's literally the most important part and the thing you need to master first.

>>149666985
What's important in the art is that it tells your story. It goes like this, for me.
1. If it reads well, it communicates the story.
2. Interesting style, I like art that makes a strong statement
3. The lowest priority is technical skill. It's very important of course, but it's lesser than the other two things.

>>149666234
Not really, other than preparing you to expect to redraw shit again. Experience is something gained with time not specific events.

>>149666877
>I'm obsessed with how light hits the form
There’s your problem. Don’t do this with color do this with inking. Even if it’s washes.

>>149666927
To be fair outside of an establishing shot at the front end of a sequence you don’t need them.

>>149666941
I'll go with these since they're relatively new
A simple two tone
>>149667074
I'm obsessed with that too.

>>149667141
A simple three tone, maybe four depending how you count it.

>>149667083
I've seen this phrase eight times in the past hour. Fair makes it sound like you have tons of practice and you post here for others to meet you at your level of talent. Getting lazy is fine, you don't need to justify or qualify it.

>guy pointing up
>guy looking up
>group throwing their heads back
Well fuck basic page layout principles, amirite?

>>149665341 (OP)
Consistency, design wise.

>>149667344
That's not being lazy, it's being efficient.

>>149667141
That's really cool, reminds me of Head Loper

>>149667537
Great human advice, good luck with the "inventing hiberstasis" research

>>149666742
>My art is okay, but color is unbelievably time consuming.
Absolutely same. I feel like colour even bumps my art up a notch in quality, but it takes longer than penciling and inking- which I do traditionally- and I don't enjoy it nearly as much becauseI'm usually doing it digitally

>>149667697
I'm gonna start filtering your trip now

>>149665341 (OP)
>What's the hardest part about drawing comics for you?

Not deviating from my main(actually productive) non-erotic comics into my black projects(goon comics) and thus not progressing further. Its very similar to just doing sidequests forever and not progressing the main story of a game. I dont feel they are a total waste of time because Im still drawing daily, just not drawing the right thing.

On that subject, how thinly spread are you because of these black projects? You know which ones Im talking about, those ones that will never see the light of day and that your family will inevitably find once you are dead.

>>149665341 (OP)
Perspecrive for me too.

>>149665341 (OP)
I suppose I'd say planning. Knowing when and what to show where is a lot more complicated. Not to say drawing is easy but if you can draw you can draw. Planning this shit out and figuring out all the working parts takes a lot of foresight.

>>149665341 (OP)
Im still a newbie, but I’d say composition and perspective + knowing where to put your text

>>149665341 (OP)
Where’s even a good place to post your comics?

>>149665341 (OP)
/co/ draws comics? I thought they just gooned to off model fanart

>>149668044
>but I’d say composition and perspective + knowing where to put your text
Just use modern comics as a reference for what not to do and you'll be golden. Frankly, I'd be shocked if your average artist knows what the 180 degree rule is or letterer knows what eyelines are.

>>149665341 (OP)
perspective is tedious but not hard
good composition is hard

I can't figure out what to do with background scenery.
Like say I need to do a typical city background. I don't know anything about buildings or the stuff on them so when I pull up a reference photo or two I would just literally copy them and then feel like a fraud.
Or same with interior scenes. Okay I need a fully furnished living room ... so like a couch and ... a tv? Alright but what type of couch? What model tv? Does this make sense?
I have a autistic burden that makes me worry too much about that shit and I don't know how to get around it or improve.

>>149665341 (OP)
getting the time to do them

Do you prefer to draw comics on paper or on digital?

>>149668282
>so when I pull up a reference photo or two I would just literally copy them and then feel like a fraud.
Wat? That's literally what you're supposed to do? I can't speak for western comics, but larger manga teams have literally had the less busy team members physically fucking pound pavement to get reference photos for background artists to trace. I'm sure plenty also look up photos online. Using real world locations helps with perspective and (if they're all from the same area) architectural cohesion and ensures you'll have minor details right like random objects about a scene.

If you feel that bad about using other people's work, pound pavement yourself.

>>149668444
Paper, it just feels nicer. Also, nice trips,

>>149665553
>>149666622

It really isn't a pleasant experience spending hours and hours drawing and coloring something. And then the people of Deviantart or Pixiv just don't care and you get zero comments. It's a real motivation killer.

>>149668282
Improvement is a process. Your skill slots are gonna be mismatched. If you want to level up in BGs focus on them for a while. Do a mini or something. Come up with decent answers to your questions. If you don’t want to focus on BGs, accept that your backgrounds will have the same weaknesses until you do and don’t get stuck there if it isn’t your priority.

>>149668553
People are fickle and unreliable. You should only draw for yourself.

Perspective is also not a strong suit of mine, when in doubt I open up Blender and block out a scene in 3D to use as a reference, that helps a lot

For me the hardest part that I don't have a workaround like that for is getting to the part where I actually draw it. I'm not much of a writer, it's not something I'm good at, it's not something I particularly enjoy doing, but I would have to write a comic before I can draw one,

It also doesn't help that I'd rather shit broken glass than pass the writing duty to someone else because pretty much everyone I know who likes writing and is any good at it is basically the opposite of me in terms of creative sensibility, which doesn't sound like it should be a bad thing, if anything that should be a good thing, right? Diversity of thought? But every time I try to do a brainstorming session all I end up being given are ideas that seem deliberately devised in the interest of making whatever I'm working on the exact polar opposite of what it's supposed to be. I have one friend in particular who I swear if Jim Davis was working with he'd try to turn Garfield into Breaking Bad or some shit. I love this guy as a friend, cannot fucking work with him.

I would give just about anything to rewire my brain to make stories come to me as easily as the visuals that go in those stories, or if that can be done to just know where to start

>>149665553
No fucking kidding. If there ain't money, sex, or at least compliments in it, doing art can be tough.

>>149668553
>really isn't a pleasant experience spending hours and hours drawing and coloring something.
I don't know, personally I really like finally being able to shade and ink my drawing to a point that I like it

>>149668282
I recommend reading pic related >>149668282

>>149665586
Hey I'm creative! I'm just not artistic

>>149666622
Discipline is a meme. If you ain't getting paid to do something, chances are good you aren't going to do it.

>>149668282
me too, i always feel like i need to get references for EVERYTHING before i start because otherwise what i draw looks boring

For me, completing a panel. There are reasons why the comic companies hired a several-man team to do a comic. Penciller, inker, colourist, typsetter/letterer, editor, and sometimes writer as a separate credit. I just can't do all of it, and I have a draining day job in a totally different field.

>>149665341 (OP)
I love comics they're fun, nice thread

>>149665341 (OP)
For me, it's the fact that I can't fuckin' draw.

>>149665341 (OP)
faceblindness

>>149666034
draw each panel on a separate piece of paper and then splice them together after the fact.

>>149665341 (OP)

having to erase things

>>149669531
>draw each panel on a separate piece of paper and then splice them together after the fact.
this is the best advice
I did this for a 6 page concept comic a couple years back
best personal project I completed in less than a week from square 1
that includes story, character design, and page layout
but I recommend doing thumbnails along with it and a mock page to space out your paneling for flow

>>149665341 (OP)
STARTING.

>>149669531
Way ahead of you, I draw each character separately and composit them into panels.

>>149667697
>>149667344
Full on schizo

>>149666742
Agreed. I hate coloring. I just want to draw more things.

Main difficulty for me, besides coloring, is just how low-energy I am. I want to draw so much, but I get wiped out pretty easily and spend most of my time lying down with Game Grumps playing in the background, trying to recover.

>>149667847
Also same. I really want to work on my passion project, a comic called Sordid Matters, but my 18+ material is what makes money, so I spend all my time doing that instead.

>>149669531
>>149669787
>>149671248
this is an awful idea, you're basically losing the composition of the entire page. It will feel disconnected unless you're really good.

References
>>149665791
Yeah I have to make sure my subconscious isn't smuggling in any of my fetishes.

>>149672266
Holy shit, is this yours!? It looks super nice. The details in the backgrounds are gorgeous and the character artwork and action is great too

>>149665341 (OP)
lines, perspective, coloring, paneling, writing, shading, picking up a pen because i don't actually like drawing.

i like to think i have a funny bone in my body tho

>>149669253
Eh. These days I find even getting paid doesn't get me motivated. Would I like more money? Sure, who wouldn't? But I don't really need it so it makes it hard to care.

>>149672294
I compartmentalize pretty easily, my settings are very divorced from the proper tone for my fetishes

>>149665341 (OP)
Paneling, actually. I can draw the images separately easy enough but figuring out an interesting way to organize the panels, that leaves as much space for the characters, dialogue and backgrounds while also leading the reader's eyes around the page is really difficult for me. Not enough people talk about how important good paneling is on a comic. It can basically make or break readability.
Backgrounds are a pretty big weakness of mine too but this is a specific issue I have with making comics in general.

>>149672713
>an adult drew this
anon, I know they say to never give up on your dreams, but jesus

>>149673076
>your dreams
nah.
i legit don't give a hoot about drawing good, i just whip out paint for making thread-specific OC if i think i got a funny joke going.

i do appreciate the technical side of things tho, i just have no idea how to even apply them to shit out an even passable doodle

>>149669184
Compliments are actually the option here since the rest are tied up in toxic assets at the moment

>>149669308
Actually this is a really relevant point; when someone can actually do the whole production process themselves, we should honestly consider them a genius.

>>149672949
You paneling is actually really solid and clear anon, at least on this page. This is pretty helpful too
https://salgoodsam.com/mc/flow-the-eyelines/

>>149665341 (OP)
Actually making characters. I have story ideas and such, and a good enough eye to not just have two people talking and them actually utilizing the enviroment.
But if I were to make a cast, they'd all just be generic and look like background characters. Also consistency of characters but I'm improving in that.

>>149672657
Yes, thank you. I drew it so many years ago, I really want to complete this some day.

>>149673568
Meh. You get used to do it eventually.

>>149673916
>I really want to complete this some day.

i hope you get the chance to too, it's looks great

i like the details on the trees and plants and the clothing folds and character expressions and proportions

also, i see you, creepy thing in the background in front of the tree in the first panel!

>>149665341 (OP)
keeping quality consistent. my effort is consistent but spread across multiple panels/etc just makes me draw worse and worse. i dont have the patience to do much

>>149665341 (OP)
Hands
Foots from behind
Backgrounds

>>149673729
Thanks. I'm mostly just struggling with it on the comic I'm currently drawing right now.

>>149672272
Isn't that was thumbnails are for? You work out the initial composition with the thumbnail, and then draw the separate panels.

>>149672272
There’s a tool you use to avoid this called a layout

>>149665341 (OP)
Proportions in general are a nightmare for me. It's hard to really pin down just how to make bodies look right. The "7 heads" method only really goes so far, especially in more complex poses.

Good thread, it's nice to see people share some tips. One issue for me is writing dialogue. I can imagine it in my head perfectly fine but when it comes to physically writing it down it feels embarrassing for some reason. I can't help but cringe and it stops me dead in my tracks among other things, I have no idea why this happens.

The trick to learning perspective is to know more people, yuk yuk yuk.
My fucking ADD, ADHD or some shit makes it hard to focus without getting distracted
It's fine now when I'm just doing this shit for fun but if I ever seriously considered doing this that's going to be an issue

>>149665341 (OP)
Paneling hard filters me. How the fuck do you people make the boxes perfect? No, digital shape tools are not an answer.

>>149678448
Do you say the dialogue aloud before committing?

>>149678607
Ruler on the tablet, works for quite a bit of people.
>>149678799
NTA, but another big problem with dialog is that all the characters can sound the same, observation of others usually help. Even here (I notice one guy always using "waiting for the other shoe to drop" when he needs an idiom)

>>149678916
I do kind of struggle with samevoice. I just invented that term btw.

>>149665553
Same, the inertia and trajectory i had before moving out and having to work full time killed my ability to see my own projects to fruition. if my younger self could see the current me he'd probably be disgusted that I kowtow to non-creatives. I used to have all these big ideas about money being meaningless and that if I continued to doodle, draw, and make animations my dreams would come true. Dreams are figments, you're looking at the goal before you've even laid the foundation. that's when your entire family bursts into your room tells you you're 18 and if you're not pursuing a degree it's time to move out. They were right for the most part.

>>149673729
>https://salgoodsam.com/mc/flow-the-eyelines/
I came here to post this.

Anyone making comics should read this shit. Pisses me off every time I see professionals fuck this shit up.

>>149665341 (OP)
backgrounds

>>149680147
Backgrounds are a pain, but grinding and improoooving them has been one of the more rewarding endeavors for me

Please, if you haven't, you need to read Mcloud's comic about making comics, it has so many tips and tricks, it's super-helpful, regardless of how good your art is

>>149682362
this is a good comic. but to me it's more of a good comic than a guide to draw comics.

>>149665341 (OP)
Finding the right pencil can be difficult...

>>149684602
anon is down to his last PENCIL
he has no more PENCILS in reserve

>>149666622
Discipline is nice but it's not going to pay for the bills that keep the fridge cold, computer on or buy food. I do agree that having discipline with art is good, but it's unrealistic for most people to always dedicate free time to an often unrewarding hobby.
All of the full time comic artists I've talked to and know have a spouse that's working a job that can afford to pay most of (if not all) of the rent/utilities/other costs. A lot of living arrangements like this have the artist making supplemental income by either art, a part time job or a combination of the two.
Or they have rich parents that they float off. Lucky them!
That being said, I wish all comic artists a very merry fulfillment from making your comics. :)

>>149685133
When art is the only major commitment or responsibility in your life it’s easy to believe you have more discipline than anyone whose less fun discipline kept you fed.

>>149668450
>larger manga teams have literally had the less busy team members physically fucking pound pavement to get reference photos for background artists to trace
deets? I wanna hear about this

Designing an interesting layout that keeps people reading, everything else can be made easier with a tool of a reference, the actual art of comics comes in the form of the whole pages

>>149665341 (OP)
wanting to draw the same thing

>>149685760
>>149668450
nta, but it's just what it sounds like. Part of making comics is having lots of reference on hand to pull up when needed and not just relying off imagination.
This was also common in American comics when there was enough pay to float assistants. It used to be called "morgue files" or "swap files". A lot of artists came up through working as assistants for another artist and helping them with these files; for example Howard Chaykin with Gil Kane, or Larry Hama with Wally Wood

>>149665341 (OP)
>What's the hardest part about drawing comics for you?
for me there's not a particularly hard part really. the hard part is the real life crap that gets in the way of comic making.

>>149668282
IMO: Treat the world as its own character and approach it like character design.

For a concrete example, here's a great little 5 minute video about film makers choosing the perfect chair:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfGKNJ4mldE

My own prompts that may let you switch perspective:
- the shape of a character (square and stout, tall and lanky...) can convey their personality. The style of architecture can similarly communicate the personality of the people who inhabit it, or at least the people that originally built it.
- fashion tells you about how the character chooses to communicate their image to the world (flashy, drab, worn-out...). Interior design can similarly reflect the personality of its inhabitants.
- similar to how characters can be framed in different ways (low angle = intimidating), you can also frame buildings differently
- you can also build contrast between characters and their environment, such as a high-maintenance looking person having a home you'd expect from a slob.

>>149686447
>This was also common in American comics when there was enough pay to float assistants. It used to be called "morgue files" or "swap files".
>this sounds interesting
>search "morgue files comic" to see if there's any examples or webpages
>its all horror slop because a stupid fucking webseries has the same name

>>149665341 (OP)
scenery or the world around them
the characters are fine and the way they interact is ok but everything sround them is hard for me to do becayse they look unnatural

>>149665553
Honestly, part of me doesn't even want my art/comics to be my livelihood.

Does it mean ill create smaller and shorter projects with almost nobody seeing them. Sure, but honestly ill rather that then having my work take over me and make he feel only hatred for a howdy that I used to love. Plus I've always loved smaller projects from others as well

I don't totally get why people think you either have to only do art if you can make a business out of it or not at all

>>149687140
>feel only hatred for a howdy that I used to love

>>149687780
Hobby*
Sorry my inner Texan came out for a moment there

>>149685760
>deets? I wanna hear about this
Once a story outline's in place for where scenes are gonna happen, they'd send out someone like the letterer, inker, or, if the team has one, a background artist, to get photos of locations that match those in the story at various positions an angles. It wouldn't be odd for them to hop a train to a small town just for shots that match that setting. The pictures get turned into reference photos if not outright traced and saved for future use.

It's like how comic companies will use internal pose books, but less lazy.

>>149687140
>>149687780
>for a howdy that I used to love

>>149687956
>>149685760
>>149686919
https://www.scribd.com/document/290841089/Not-Turning-Japanese-by-Colleen-Doran?v=0.116
This is a really good one that I believe another anon showed me that went into the production process differences between Comics and Manga, at least back then. And if I remember correctly, it talks about references and using them.

>>149688880
holy cope

>>149668426
Yeah, this. One third of my time is spent asleep, the second third is for work, and the final third is a balancing act between family/friends/housekeeping/interests/anything else that pops up. It's hard to find the time for comics.
I guess I could skip out on some sleep to make more time. But then I'd be tired and miserable. Or I could leave my job and focus on art as a career. But that would be a huge gamble with no guarantee of sustainable income.

>>149688880
>TEZUKA AND HIS 10 ASSISTANTS ARE THE ONES THAT PRODUCE 500 PAGES A MONTH
>500÷11= 45,4.
>Average American artist output is 30 pages.
There's some truth to this document, but there's lots of cope too.
The main reason why japanese artists are superior is the work ethic. This work ethic also causes most of them to suffer health issues later in life.

>>149689168
Tezuka's style is also much simpler than where US comics started heading since the 50s. That's another factor.

>>149688880
>the average cartoonist in Japan has about five assistants
The average cartoonist in Japan wishes. Average is 3. 5 is just at larger mags. And there are absolutely one man bands on the low end like that nutbag Junji Ito.

Also western comic makers absolutely use shit like stock resources and have dedicated teams. What the fuck is this nonsense? Japan might have more stock resources because western comics suck ass and Japan might not credit assistants because the manga industry sucks ass, but these aren't major fucking differences. Also everyone in Japan knows the assistants do most of the fucking work.

It is true that the standard teams for manga and western comics are different at least. Comics need colorists, use cover artists for some insane reason, usually the writer and penciller are separate positions unlike in Japan where the reverse is true, and positions like editors are less likely to step in to help with earlier production steps.

This shit reads like a ton of cope.

>>149688880
>>149689551
Also one thing this copefest alluded to that's sorta true is nowadays larger manga teams might have on hand someone specialized in CAD to do shit like buildings/vehicles/weapons. That's a recent change in the last couple decades and was controversial when it started.

Also, something this shit doesn't make clear is manga teams give people primary responsibilities, not sole responsibilities. If you finish one part of your work, you help out with the other shit to get shit done in time. It's always all hands on deck. Not sure western comics do that shit.

But literally nothing stops western comics from doing the more efficient shit manga does.

>>149689551
>Also western comic makers absolutely use shit like stock resources and have dedicated teams
I wouldn't call having separate inkers/colorists the same as having a team where they can handle elements like the backgrounds for the lead artist.

>>149689551
>Writer and penciller are separate positions
that's why comics are losing.
Japan allows the artist to have an unified message in his work, while in America the text and images compete against each other for attention and space.
It took AGES before hero comics stopped describing everything that was appearing in the panels.
How can any sane person see this and say "this is the superior medium". Tezuka in his first manga already knew this was dumb.
Even in mangas that the writer and artist are separate positions the text doesn't compete with the panels
I've: first of North star

>>149689704
>But literally nothing stops western comics from doing the more efficient shit manga does.
What stops them is pay. American comics did have assistants in the past, these days the role of inker is increasingly reduced in favor of having the lineart artist handle the "inks"(which is often just the same because it's digital these days)
American pay doesn't sustain a team the same crew the way Japanese pay does. It's not even a matter of the amount per se, as much as what it can net you.
>. If you finish one part of your work, you help out with the other shit to get shit done in time. It's always all hands on deck. Not sure western comics do that shit.
Sort of. If you're a letterer/inker/colorist and you manage to finish early, you generally want to take on another job, because it's more pay, and those jobs don't pay well generally.

>>149689799
I fucking hate ESL posters.

>>149689799
Robin sticking out his ass for no reason in that last panel

>>149689722
>I wouldn't call having separate inkers/colorists the same as having a team where they can handle elements like the backgrounds for the lead artist.
Comics DO have a member of the team that handles a duty expected to be handled by the lead artist in most manga.

WRITER

>>149689806
American comics do still have positions roughly equivalent to assistants in theory. There isn't something magically different between a manga inker/letterer and a comics inker/letterer. Maybe manga assistants are more versatile, but that's a fault of the comics industry not trying to foster talent. Manga assistants are also functionally apprentices, there to learn the basics of manga production generally as well as the art style of their boss. Long term apprentices can even be expected to act as the primary artist temporarily if shit hits the fan like a health emergency. There's also oddball duties like assisting with research for the writing portion of manga. They have a hand in everything.

>>149665341 (OP)
>perspective
It can be quite tricky. Here, this tutorial is one I saved during DeviantArt's heyday, back when you had these tutorial strips floating around all over the place, I pray it'll be of use to you brother

>>149688880
>>149689168
None of that is taking into account Tezuka was also producing a substantial amount of animation frames for Mushi Pro. Even by Japanese standards, Tezuka was an anomaly and shouldn't be considered the norm. Dude was the workhorse to end all workhorses.

>>149665628
You draw little boxes and put the characters in them with speech bubbles.

>>149689722
Comic companies could maybe afford more production staff if there weren't fucking 4 editors on every fucking book doing a notoriously ass job.

>>149690827
>here isn't something magically different between a manga inker/letterer and a comics inker/letterer.
The main thing is that a manga assistant isn't just doing the inking, they're often also handling the background in the first place, or doing other characters in the background. so the identity of who drew the page becomes muddled by having multiple hands on it, even if it's all done with the lead artist's approval and supervision.
One big factor for why a lot of artists avoid this, besides the budget for the initial payment, is that a big factor for comic artists is resale value. An artist wants as little others on the page as possible because it's /their/ art they're selling, not a bunch of other artists. . It's been a big point of debate between inkers and pencillers as to who owns original pages when returned by the publisher, to the point where it's become common for inkers to work on a copy of the pencils instead of the originals(and why a lot of artists choose to still have final pencils traditionally at all)
When Jim Lee sells a page, it's his, and maybe some goes to Scott Williams. He doesn't have to worry if the Beast was laid out or penciled by someone else and he needs to pay them too.

>>149691880
So what you're saying is comic production is shit because the team producing the comic works for the publisher and not the project lead?

>>149692218
No, the case was the same when Jim Lee ( and others) were both leads and publishers. They wanted to handle all the pencilling themselves and only have specific inkers.

>>149692362
>They wanted to handle all the pencilling themselves and only have specific inkers
Deliberate inefficiencies aren't really an inherent quality of an industry even if they are widespread. That's just people choosing to structure their workflow in a way that less work gets turned in.

Yeah, no shit, the more creators micromanage quality control, the less shit gets done.

>>149692571
Less work gets turned in, but they own more of the work that's made.
It's not just the industry, but the fact that the market here desires original art in a way that the Japanese market doesn't.

I DESPISE the technical shit involved with comics, especially all the crap with printing. There's so much to keep track of like CMYK for colors, measurements, margins, etc that my brain blurs everything together and gives up when I try to read about it and apply it.
If whatever I make may be doomed to never be put to paper properly, but allows me to actually focus on drawing and not making it a chore, then that's a sacrifice I'm willing to make.

>>149692606
>the market here desires original art
The state of the industry and the existence of cover artists would suggest otherwise.

Also, let's be real here, a lot of artists working for the Big 2 are bad on both a technical and aesthetic level.

>>149665341 (OP)
My dialogue is stupid and childish. I always end up cringing at it a few days later.

>>149694348
Even professional writers struggle with dialogue. Look at how uneven the dialogue is in movies, TV, and novels. It's just really hard. You're trying to capture the thoughts of someone who is not you, an inherently difficult task. The only thing you can do is just spend a lot of time trying to get it as good as possible, even if that means dozens of revisions.

>>149689799
Tezuka was an outlier. His energetic and easy to read approach to paneling gave him an edge over everyone else, so everyone started copying him.

>>149690861
Thank you for this.

>>149689799
>Even in mangas that the writer and artist are separate positions the text doesn't compete with the panels
In those cases it's usually a collaborative process to create manga. It's not just a writer turning in a script to an artist. That's where you run head first into issues.

>>149665341 (OP)
making inking that doesn't look like dogshit

>>149693561
Baby steps, anon.

>>149665341 (OP)
proportions are the one thing that keep me from animating
drawing still images is fine but doing that over the course of a ton of drawings and keeping it consistent is hard
i struggle with keeping volume consistent for the same reason

>>149694028
JRJR's art may not be great, but the original pages are probably still selling for thousands.

>>149668044
>knowing where to put your text
cheat code: take a bit of time to place a rough version of your text first over the very rough pages, then start tightening the roughs around the text. in the end when you do the final text you could change things a bit, you'll have automatically given space for your text because it was already there and you drew around it

>>149665341 (OP)
My work is so bad not even the rippers rip any of my stuff despite hosted on the same Amazon server sins 2019.

>>149696008
Why is your work on an Amazon server?

>>149696527
>thread about how to draw comics
>people discus how comics are made

Have not a single one of you ever read this guy's books?

>>149697119
I can't read

>>149697119
A long time ago. I've forgotten all his points.

>>149665341 (OP)
TOO many to list.

>>149693561
USA: America has weird paper sizes I can't be bothered to remember them.
REST OF THE WORLD: Make sure your page is 1.5x taller than it is wide and stay inside this. Resolution doesn't matter as it can be adjusted with relative ease. Forget spreads unless you know exactly what you're doing.
Baby step: Separate colors from linework.
Baby step 2: Drawing in the margins, spreads and shit, when you know what you're doing.

>>149699913
>American Paper size
11x17 inch paper
1" in from the sides/ 1.5" in from the bottom and top.
That's how I learned it anyway, but looking around the internet, I see all kinds of crazy shit.
so I guess I'm wrong.

>>149665341 (OP)
my two problems in drawings are details and dynamic movement.
Details are self explanatory, but with dynamic movement I mean still drawings that you can feel the movement of it. For some reason I am simply unable to do so. I have tons of references of artist that I perceive as being able to do so,but when I try to copy it, even when just copying their original artwork, I am never able to make it look like they do.

>>149700083
Make a quick sketch as you'd normally draw a character.
Look at the individual parts of the character and try to double the motion.
E.g. your character leans 30 degrees forwards as he's running, make him lean 60 degrees forwards as he's running fast as fuck. Look at arms and legs and try to "double" the intensity of whatever goes on.

You don't have to the initial sketch for practice, just take any picture, drawing or photo, and try to turn the knobs up.

>>149700175
thanks for the advice, though I feel like I would always tell myself "but that's not how [this or that] works"

>>149696629
You cant mention manga ever our you literally hate the west