Thread 150080843

Why is he the only hero who can go full camp and full edge without it being cringeworthy

>>150080843 (OP)
Bump

>>150081498
Pump and Dump just like what the Arkham guards did to Arthur Fleck ROFL

>>150080843 (OP)
I don't know, but that's why he's the best character to ever exist.

>>150081730
agreed

>>150080843 (OP)
>full camp
Batman & Robin
>full edge
ASBaR
>without it being cringeworthy
kek

>>150080843 (OP)
>without it being cringeworthy

Lots of non-Batman source material to pull from. You can do Sherlock Holmes stuff, gritty street level crime, and Dick Tracy silliness because all of those properties and ideas existed before Batman, and he slots neatly into any of them.

>>150080843 (OP)
Because he's versatile. His origins, aesthetics and "powers" allow him to be inserted into literally any kind of genre and story. You can put him in any period, any place, literally anything and anywhere, and he just works. You can make a silent screwball comedy set in France with Batman. You can make a completely straight supernatural horror with Batman. You can make him an Ancient Greek or some Egyptian Prince and it works. You can put him in the far future and it works. You can make him Iron Man or Sherlock Holmes with a bat on top and it works.

Batman works on a level very few other characters work. Superman doesn't. Spider-Man kinda does, but not really. Iron Man so-so, only if you tie him to the concept of tech. But even then, even if you can find ways to shoehorn other characters in other genres, it's not natural. You can write one or two horror stories with Spider-Man. You can put Iron Man in a Fantasy setting. But they're one-offs. Experiments for people who already know who those characters are. You can't say
>I'm making a whole new AU where Batman's a wacky Silver Age mentalist with low-tier telepathy and he travels through time solving Scooby Doo mysteries
With Batman it works. With Superman it doesn't. Batman just has the perfect equilibrium to allow him to be inserted into literally anything. Seriously, think of any story, and you can put Batman in it, whereas with 99% of other characters it's just not possible.

>>150080843 (OP)
Batman has always been cringe though

>>150080843 (OP)
because he did both these things before you were born, and so to you, it is the natural way of things.

>>150082936
Saying something is cringe is actually cringe, I can't wait for this fucking stupid trend to be over.

>>150082923
>Because he's versatile
He's a bottom.

>>150080843 (OP)
He isn't.

>>150084253
A guy hung like this is a strict bottom?

>>150080843 (OP)
Did you miss the whole BatKek era?
It was full of edge and cringe and everyone hated it.

You guys remember that Dobson comic where he depicts 2 dudes going to see bvs and one of them is all excited and the other one is confused, and Dobson tells Hollywood to "mind the gap"?

What did he mean by that? Minding the gap means to look out for something, usually an obstacle. How is every single person whose mindset is in between these two extremes a danger to DC?

>>150080843 (OP)
I think he the only one that can embody his different eras well

>>150080843 (OP)
The fundamentals of the character are just strong enough that everything works as long as you stick to them enough. It helps that he attracts so many good writers.

>>150082923
>Batman works on a level very few other characters work. Superman doesn't.
I’m not sure he has quite the same versatility but Superman works in a lot of angles. Strong guy does what’s right works nearly everywhere.

>>150085546
He clearly doesn't have the same versatility. You just narrowed his character down to a single element

>>150085579
Yeah, that’s what they do with Batman. Brooding detective fights for justice.

>>150086036
Now you are just being intentionally reductive to defend your nuthugging of Superman

>>150086113
My man, what do you want me to tell you? That reducing a character down to its basic elements doesn’t allow you to place them in unfamiliar settings? I’m not gonna sit there and lie to make you feel better.

>>150085479
>he attracts so many good writers.

>>150086438
I don't need you to lie or even respond. You don't understand the assignment. This isn't about reducing a character down. It's about a character having multiple aspects that are amenable to different types of stories. Superman doesn't work in half the the stuff Batman works in. It's not about "setting"; it's about genres. Superman only works in a couple while Batman works in all of them.

>>150086710
Yes.

>>150086751
Name the specific genres Batman works in that Superman doesn’t.

>>150082988
This is the only real answer

>>150080843 (OP)
Batman is the masturbator hero. It is why he is so endearing to so many fans, because they're masturbators too. No matter what you put their masturbator hero through, they stick by him because they like to be represented as heroes. It's also why people lash out against Superman, he's breeder coded.

>>150086829
Noir detective. Batman doesn't seem out of place looking for DNA evidence in a sex dungeon but that's a case Superman would leave to the police.

>>150082923
>blah blah

Batmans a Mary sue who's human qualities make him shine in outlandish situations where he becomes the perfect man to achieve goals that allow us to enjoy his achievements though pure wish fufillment and pure human skill. Plus he looks cooler and radiates superiority over others even gods despite being a mortal with no super powers, that's the hook, we humans want to end up better than the gods who look down on us.

>>150081730
>best character to ever exist
Some of you guys don't read beyond comics and it shows.

>>150086710
A ton of writers and artists have at some point worked on Batman.

>>150090317
>A ton of writers and artists have at some point worked on Batman.
but not a ton of good ones

>>150090397
>but not a ton of good ones
The best ones have, faggot.

>>150086756
Is that why his main book has been so shit for so long?

>>150086751
>Superman doesn't work in half the the stuff Batman works in. It's not about "setting"; it's about genres. Superman only works in a couple while Batman works in all of them.
People don't seem to believe or understand when I say this, but Superman started out as, and works best as a subversion of the pulp action hero Batman is based on. That's why most Superman stories don't work. People either want or expect a Batman story starring Superman, and if you do that then it's stupid, but if you don't write that then the audience just ends up confused because it's what they expected.

Superman could have as much flexibility, but writers barely even know how to write a good Superman comic as is.

>>150090440
The best =/ many and artist =/ writers. It's also not an achievement from the character when DC is basically comissioning artists to work on their OCs. Or when you have been existing for 80+years on life-support and the overwhelming majority of your output is bad or mediocre.

>>150091156
>Superman could have as much flexibility, but writers barely even know how to write a good Superman comic as is.
Alright dipshit, give me a genuine horror story set in France of the 1600s and keep Superman's core characteristics intact.

>>150080843 (OP)
Zorro can also do this. And Zorro inspired Batman.

>>150091450
I didn't say you could do all the same things that you could do with Batman, I just said he'd have just as much flexibility.

I also don't know a damn thing about France in the 1600s.

The amount of butthurt Batman threads generate is enough to power a house at a minimum.

>>150091422
Saying Batman has been on life support is funny considering hes probably the reason a lot of other characters get to have their own books.
>overwhelming majority of your output is bad or mediocre
Subjective. And name a character with a comparable volume of media that isn't bad or mediocre.

>>150091467
>I didn't say you could do all the same things that you could do with Batman, I just said he'd have just as much flexibility.
One cancels the other, moron. The argument is that Batman can be thrown into virtually anything and anywhere and still work. Superman can't, and if you cannot prove otherwise, then no, he doesn't "have as much flexibility". Learn to read.

>>150091530
Superman, Batman, Spider-Man, they can all work about as well. Superman had a cameo in I Love Lucy and fought Muhammad Ali. While other characters and actors had cameos in Batman ever since the 1966 series, even him crossing over with Scooby Doo multiple times, it's become common to see Batman inserted into basically anything and everything. It's not because he's a more flexible character, he's just had a much longer track record of being DCs crossover guy since The Brave and The Bold pretty much became just a way to use Batman's popularity to try to boost the sales of their other characters.

Superman can do it too, he's just not as popular anymore, so he doesn't get the chance.

>>150091668
...You legitimately do not understand the argument, do you? Why are Superfags always retarded?

>>150091686
You are being disingenuous.

>>150091709
No you moronic cunt, you are literally unable to comprehend the entire point of this discussion. I know Superfags are retarded, but this is a new low.
>heh, Imma post a smug heckin SuperCHAD image
Christ...

>>150091756
I don't think you understood my argument at all, simply because you don't want to.

>>150080843 (OP)
For me it's pic rel

>>150091834
I understood it just fine, moron. Your point is that Superman is recognisable and has inherent flexibility due to the nature of his creation. But that's not true as Superman requires so many things to be recognisably Superman that he is barred from naturally being woven into tons upon tons of stories and genres. Whether you can write a one-off comedic or western or horror story about Superman is besides the point. The core argument is that Batman can naturally be woven into any story, in any time and place, and work with very few changes to his person. Batman is flexible and versatile, Superman is even more rigid than most capecharacters.

>>150080843 (OP)
first adam west
second, the keaton movie. both are fairly modern portrayals that the fans loved.
third, the comic itself reinvented its tone from dark pulp hero to goofy silver age guy. they were both popular at the right times
batman can now do both

>>150091885
I'm going to dumb it down for you in a way you'll find hard to deliberately misinterpret: It has nothing to do with Batman as a character, it's all about what you've been exposed to. Batman in a bunch of random different settings and time periods is more normal to you because DC just keeps doing it with Batman, not because he's actually better suited to it.

>>150091925
>this faggot things it's about consumption and not the core malleability of the character
Dipshit, if Batman wasn't malleable, he wouldn't have been spread across all genres. The inherent traits that are needed to make Batman "Batman" are strong yet few, which means that he can recognisably be "Batman" while being molded to fit any kind of requirement for any kind of story. Superman needs specific parameters to work and therefore is unable to deviate from that which he is. How can you not understand this entirely simple point, when you yourself even failed to answer the simple test I gave you? Christ.

>>150091954
It's all in the popularity of the character.

>>150091979
You're legitimately retarded and you do not even have the decency to concede. I'm not wasting any more time on your nonsense.

>>150091991
>You're legitimately retarded and you do not even have the decency to concede
Now you're projecting.

>>150091481
> hes probably the reason
And? Batman is not less hard carried by brand recognition and nostalgia because other characters/brands in their shared universe are more on life support than him.
> it's subjective
> name me one counter example of when the same business model don't produce shit in masse
Way to shoot yourself into the foot here. Not sure what name dropping more contenders in the "kept afloat and relevant thanks to big companies that are too big to fail" category would do or prove for you either.

>>150092149
Shit argument when Batman consistently tops charts across all media and sells more merch. Its like saying the mens football team is being carried by the owners or needs the same push as the womens team. The mens team is the reason the company is still afloat and able to afford the womens team. Batman is bigger than DC.

The fact that DC can use Batman in so many (good or bad) adaptations is testament to the fact that there is demand for the character. Its another discussion entirely that asswipe writers/artists/editors cant write or draw to save their lives, and thats not something specific to the character. No other character has the same sorta demand and still have shit adaptations regardless.

>>150092537
Reminder that the last movie outing of Batman didn't even outsell Girlboss Black Panther.
And he certainly didn't save the Flash movie.
Sure, he's a best-selling comic in the fading comic industry, big fucking deal.

>>150092633
Did better compared to how much it actually cost to make it. Plus you're comparing it to the collective hype of MCU + le blackpower we waz kangs + Badwick Choseman's death.

Flash and the whole DCEU was ass. Batman was added to try and hype up MoS's sequel and save a sinking ship. He was the best part if it anyway.

Come back to me when you've got a consistently best selling comic, video game, movies and merch from some other character. Otherwise shut the fuck up about Batman being as ass as anyone else. No other character has a peak as high either.

>>150091668
>Superman can do it too, he's just not as popular anymore, so he doesn't get the chance.

Nah Superman as a character has to be treated as a near Christ like god amongst men and a patron saint of fatherly empathy, so inserting him being a regular and neutral tone settings like horror or pure action fantasy would be walking on eggshells when you have heroes/characters that would be less ideal or flawed into consideration. It would be like if he was in a xmen crossover, how are you gonna make him a natural fit for the morally gray and near villainous people like Wolverine or Cable

>>150091686
Because Superman has to be the bestest ever because that’s what they were told growing up and they refuse to have it any other way, they want to believe Superman can do anything Batman can do because he’s astroturfed as the face of the brand and leader of the justice league even though Batman cucked him ages ago

You can make a James Gunn Superman film starring Batman but you can NEVER EVER make a Matt Reeves Batman starring Superman- the character is too boring and illogical for that ever work, Superman is a relic of the past who lives on because he has the root word of superhero in his name

there are basically two ways you can do batman, dark and edgy detective, or camp comedy. cause at the end of the day he is a dude in a bat coustume.

I feel like sonic the hedgehog is similar. you can have saturday morning comedy sanic, or sonic underground dystopia were robotnik is evil incarnate sanic

>>150092537
>Batman is bigger than DC
That's brand recognition for you. You're once again not contradictiong anything you're arguing with. Grasping at straws and achieving silly comparaisons doesn't change the fact that Batman or any other could never afford to wallow in so much mediocrity if he wasn't backed up by a system that can support what all that fanfare cost. Your boyfriend is a high maintenance bitch and a testament that if you keep something alive by injecting money into it for long enough you'll will eventually gain some brand recognition.
>there is demand for the character.
Who is that argument for? Corpos, bootlickers or bots? People are not actively asking for more Batman or cape movies. At best they're asking to see big budget spectacle if the ticket can easily cost 15 bucks now, but they're not the one who decid what is getting made. The people are not in control kek.

>>150080843 (OP)
>without it being cringeworthy

Cope harder

>>150094600
>Batman or any other could never afford
Thats where you're wrong. Batman has survived because hes adaptable and beloved. Sure, if he wasn't owned by a company and was open to use, he might've had less media, but he would've been picked up as is or adapted into a new character by someone smart enough to recognise the potential. Chalking off his acceptance as mere brand recognition is stupid when characters like Superman, WW etc. are just as recognizable but lack acceptance or are hardly memorable enough to justify movies/games or other media.

>Who is that argument for?
People responsible for publishing media doing market research? You think corpos make blind decisions on who to push or publish? Sure, trying to make bank by just his popularity and poor planning has led to more mediocre shit (DCEU), not to mention the saturation of capeshit thanks to Marvel. But you're being naive if you think market research isn't pointing to Batman being profitable.

>>150080843 (OP)
What are some of his good camp comics?

>>150096801
*crickets*