Thread 150915540

How did this go from being a genuine horror show to being proto-Chowder?

>>150915540 (OP)
Season one stinks except for the musical ep, they were right to make the changes they did.

>>150915540 (OP)
The Jashin-Chan effect

>>150915540 (OP)
New writers. CH Greenblatt joined halfway through and his humor was very different. He also created Fred Fredburger.

>>150915565
Wrong

>>150915540 (OP)
first season of billy and mandy has shit art style.

>>150915540 (OP)
>genuine horror show
Ok, I like this show, but let's not kid ourselves here.

>>150915576
Based

>>150915605
Retarded opinion

>>150915606
Grim and Evil frequently went into full-blown Courage territory
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rSrRsfHPpk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tZ0P4ArZ7GI

>>150915565
Tickle me Mandy and Dream a Little Dream were great episodes. As well as Nigel and Hoss Delgado’s introduction episodes.

>>150915660
The "season 2-3" design was in season 1.

>>150915685
Nope, season 1 was Grim and Evil when they had Evil Con Carne, season 1 of Billy & Mandy is technically season 2, they produced new episodes and used the Grim & Evil segments as the middle one

>>150915579
Ironically, season 3-4 still had a pretty dark sense of humor at times

>>150915579
>Fred Fredburger.

Cartoon Network really loved him putting that in all the bumpers.

>>150915685
>>150915730
NTA, but I will make it more clear. Any episode that is 7-minutes long is from Grim & Evil, so every episode that aired from 2001-2003. Jacked Up Halloween was the very last episode of Grim & Evil, and 2004 was when Billy & Mandy became an 11-minute show and officially its own show.

Blame US scheduling for this, many international channels still kept it G&E and had the Evil Con Carne segments intact. Like the Brown Evil 2-parter has a Con Carne segment as the middle segment.

>>150915540 (OP)
>>150915606
The entire show wasn't just horror-focused but it did have some actual horror elements and even episodes early on. It was kind of a blend of horror and comedy, but that got dropped pretty fast in season 2 and became more "comedy featuring horror characters".

>>150915733
2004-2005 was like a hybrid of Grim and Evil-era and Fred Fredburger-era.

>>150915605
I vastly prefer those over the later seasons. The designs got more crude and ugly later on. Billy and Mandy themselves looked out of place.

>>150915752
>>150916231
The funniest thing about this episode to me was learning that the crew intentionally was drawing her skirt shorter as the episode went on. If you go back and watch it with that in mind you can actually notice it gradually getting shorter. Well that and I guess the whole blatant porn shot joke they did with Billy riding her. What a time to be alive.

Even the early promo art oozed with SOUL!

>>150915540 (OP)
watch bunnicula

Did anyone ever notice how the intro still featured characters that only appeared in the first 2 seasons and never again? I doubt anyone rememberrs the Scotsman.

There was also those tiny imps that followed Grim around that got phased out quickly.

>>150916267
>the crew intentionally was drawing her skirt shorter as the episode went on
They confirmed that?

>>150915660
Based

>>150916568
A long time ago yeah, I think it might have even been Atoms himself.

>>150916466
The inclusion of Malaria front and center always made me wonder if they didn't intend for her to have a bigger role at first.

>>150916741
This kind of humor is exactly what I'm talking about. I don't necessarily have a problem with gross-out humor, but Billy and Mandy wasn't good at it. Billy and Mandy WAS good at horror but they completely abandoned that aspect of the show.

>>150915540 (OP)
Honestly the last season was pretty boring, I remember stuff like the christmas special with vampire santa barely getting chuckles out of me or that special with the spider queen. Not saying that the show was bad but that I'm glad they pulled the plug when they did since it had run its course.

>>150915758
Don't forget Cheese from Foster's.

I always have a hard time picking a favorite episode, I'm stuck between here thar be dwarves and the secret snake society.

>>150917392
The last season is pretty universally considered the weakest, it felt like the show was running on fumes.

>>150917510
Yeah I'm sincerely glad Underfist wasn't greenlit as a show.

>>150915660
You can feel the hotness fading away

>>150915605
I genuinely think season one looks better. I still like the later seasons too though.

>>150916047
more like jacked off halloween right fellas

>>150917410
cheese and fred fredburger are the best characters ever

>>150915540 (OP)
>genuine horror
It was a children’s comedy with horror elements.

>>150918986
Read >>150915671

It was just as much of a horror show as Courage, people like you just forgot that because the show completely changed its style and became Family Guy for babies.

>>150919072
>Family Guy for babies
Even that's generous. It was more like an even more babyish version of Season 7 Spongebob. It's like the writing staff decided to binge watch Nick Jr. and forgot that Billy and Mandy was supposed to be a gothic horror show.

>>150915540 (OP)
Billy wasn’t that much different. Mandy was the one who got flanderized worse.
G&E Mandy
>cynical and mean but had moments where she cared for Billy
>has moments of weaknesses, like having a crush on the new kid
>was not constantly grumpy
B&M Mandy
>much more cynical and cruel only moment of caring for her friends is the tv movie
>ultimate evil in Endsville, has the entire town under her control
>literally can not do any emotion other than a scowl or else the universe will unravel

>>150919520
To be fair, according to Maxwell Atoms Mandy was never meant to smile and her smiles in the early episodes were animation mistakes. He based Mandy off of himself because he was autistic and didn't smile as a kid.

>still no r34 about the 3 head monster in complete and utter chaos.
why live

>>150916621
Did Malaria ever appear again after Grim in Love?

>>150915540 (OP)
>Eats Ass

>>150920924
>Eats Brains

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hp-NRJ4JFdE&list=RDhp-NRJ4JFdE&start_radio=1

>>150915540 (OP)
>genuine horror show
It was never a genuine horror show.

>>150919072
And when exactly did that happen?

>>150921001
>6 season show peaks at Episode 8
I'm not even saying the show got bad or anything after this point, it's just funny that such an experimental episode, and one that's generally one of the best regarded, was so early into the show's run. It'd be like if Band Geeks was a season 1 episode of Spongebob, or if Duck Amuck was like the third Daffy Duck short.

It doesn't matter when you think Billy and Mandy jump the shark, I think we can all at least agree that none of the Harry Potter parody episodes are worth watching and it's really weird that they kept milking the idea despite how mediocre it was.

>>150915540 (OP)
I liked it.

>>150915660
>The absolute madlads even went so far as to draw her cum gutters in some episodes
Atoms and his team were based.

It's so weird growing up never knowing this as Grim & Evil but knowing all the segments under Billy & Mandy

>>150921239
Not him, but this did genuinely scare me as a kid, that Billy closeup.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5iwWGEKEn30

>>150915540 (OP)
Hateful Fart Cartoon

>>150921128
Yes it was, this thread contains multiple examples showcasing early B&M's horror scenes, you just didn't bother reading the thread before posting in it.

I miss when Nergal was the primary antagonist. It feels later on they used him less and turned him into a complete buffoon, with Boogey Man replacing him as Grim's rival.

>>150915660
Based

>>150916584
Cute

>>150919780
Just as a background character a few times.

Y'all wanna see Dracula dance?

>>150923136
I like that Cow one, it looks so dumb

>>150923127
God the Honky line was a perfect brick joke

>>150915660
Id fuck and impregnate all versions

I hope to fuck a woman like her one day

>>150915660
I really fucking liked her Valley Girl voice, Valley Girl voice makes me diamonds.

Harold used to be a somewhat reasonable parent while Gladys was the insane, paranoid one. Then they made him into a generic retarded dad.

Why?

>>150924261
LOL TARD DADDy UNNY LMAO!!!!!!!!!
Same reason why Mandy stopped being an actual kid with other feelings.

>>150915540 (OP)
It became funnier afterwards though. The Fred Flintstone episode is one of the funniest episodes and that was 2006.

>>150923396
Which line?

>>150915565
Filtered

>>150923086
In what sense was Nergal *ever* qualified to be *The Grim Reaper's* rival?
He's just a lonely worm thing that lives underground.
He can electrocute people with his tentacles.
That's literally all he has.
He's totally irrelevant.

The fucking himbo monster hunter is more of a rival to Grim than Nergal is.

>>150926233
Nergal and Eris were the two main villains before they introduced the Boogeyman.

Gonna post some early concept and production material.

>"A doodle from my freshman year of college sketchbook."
Cod Commando was the first Grim & Evil-verse character Atoms created.

I'm convinced that all the people saying "BILLY AND MANDY WAS NEVER A HORROR SHOW" are zoomers who don't remember Grim & Evil
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r9Ya-2ZBXkk

Notice the Dexter doodle

Grim's eloganted skull shape was based on the face of I.R. Baboon of I Am Weasel fame, which Atoms previously worked on. Start from his nostrills, which are Grim's eyes and downwards.

>>150915540 (OP)
>genuine horror show
It was never good and it was never a horror show. That's why.

>>150915540 (OP)
>to being proto-Chowder?
I'm going to give a super hot take here but most of the only Billy and Mandy episodes worth watching were the ones done by CH Greenblatt.
>Keeper of the Reaper
>Secret Snake Club
>Any Dracula Episode
>Here Thar Be Dwarves
>Attack of the Clowns
>Duck!
>My Fair Mandy
>Herbicidal Maniac
There's seriously way too many of the actual memorable episodes that he was responsible for. The rest of Billy and Mandy ranges from being pretty good to just okay.
There's way too much Billy and Mandy that's just fucking boring, especially in Season 2. And Evil Con Carne is mostly a slog as well, if I'm being honest.

>>150926888
Okay zoomer

>>150926888
Stfu homo

>>150926897
This show was off the air before most zoomers were old enough to form memories.

>>150926909
Early zoomers watched it you retard

>>150926915
He said "most" and the oldest zoomers would have been kindergartners when it came out

Okay no more, too many shitposters and schizos keep posting inbetween, ruining the flow.

>>150926925
Billy in pajamas is cute.

>>150926915
>>150926909
Most zoomers don't remember the grim and evil seasons when it was actual horror. They only remember the comedy seasons

The last consistently good year for B&M was 2005, Wishbones and the Cthulhu episodes were kino and had the dark Grim and Evil feeling in them. 2006-2007 was when it started feeling like a Nick Jr. show. The Boogey movie was good though.

>>150927530
I honestly keep forgetting about the Yeti episode from the last season, definitely one of the more forgettable episodes of the show.

>>150927610
At least it's about Grim trying to kill someone.

>>150927628
I'm surprised they let them make that episode that late in the show. It feels like the CN executives were trying to make Grim just a generic skeleton instead of the literal Grim Reaper by that point.

>>150926890
I like the gothic atmosphere the Grim and Evil episodes had. The show never recaptured that atmosphere afterwards.

>>150923022
It's horror comedy at most

>>150927496
why do people act like reruns don't exist

>>150928776
Grim and Evil was horror, 2004-2005 B&M was horror comedy, 2006-2007 B&M was comedy.

Nobody ever mentions how S1 had the best title card music.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vu69Tm6t1aw

>>150929073
I like the later title card music too. It didn't always fit though because like I said several times, the show became way too lighthearted later on.

>>150915540 (OP)
Both sucks

>>150915540 (OP)
>>150915565
oddly similar to simpsons
season 1 was objectively meh
season 2-3 was the patrician's choice
season 4+ were excellent but believed by normies as the pinnacle of the series

>>150926730
I thought that was Billy
>captcha: DGMAX

>>150916584
shes so fucking sexy despite their attempt to give her an ugly expression. skirt covering literally nothing.

>>150929073
Season 1 had a synth score

>>150930506
That was in 95
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5TiAKlwIr6w

Grim didn't exist at this point. According to Atoms in a Reddit AMA, he got the idea of adding a supernatural being after working on Cow & Chicken which had the Devil (Red Guy) in the cast.

>>150930605
thats fucking crazy how long they were developing this idea man

>>150930605
I think I'm just thinking of the name then, he mentioned somewhere that "Billy" had always been in the back of his mind. I think that was what he called spit wads or something like that

>>150930632
Billy and Mandy could have been a 90s cartoon.

>>150926903
Gtfo normie

>>150930938
Those are some serious hips. They put Shakira to shame.

The earlier seasons were more mean-spirited to Grim, though. Every early-seasons ep ended with him losing.

>>150926751
Anon some of the first few episodes include "Grim gets pranked into thinking it's Opposite Day" and "Grim wears a suit filled with ground beef to pass as human". Like yeah the show wasn't afraid to go for dark/gross jokes or even straight horror scenes, but it's disingenuous to pretend that was the show's primary focus. It was always comedy first.

>>150932765
It was both but in the Grim and Evil days there were plenty of scenes that were only horror with no comedy. It was much more like Courage whereas in the later seasons it was more like Fanboy and Chum Chum.

>>150926942
Most be really cool to be apart of HB's legacy even if it was just for the pilot

>>150927530
>2006-2007 was when it started feeling like a Nick Jr. show.
Fear and Loathign in Endsville is a really good episode thoughbeit.
>LIKE AN ANGRY WOMAN

>>150932783
>plenty of scenes
That's hyperbole. You'd get maybe one spooky or atmospheric scene every four or five episodes.

>>150932783
The creator of Fanboy and Chum Chum did actually work on thr show.

>>150932030
I think it's more that she doesn't have ribs.

>>150932823
There were entire episodes that were spooky, like the one with Betty White. That felt like a Courage episode. Also, Nergal Jr.'s debut was basically a PG version of The Thing.

>>150932824
>it's true
Interesting how he worked on the good episodes though. Maybe he got fired and saw the bad episodes afterwards and thought that was how cartoons are supposed to be.

>>150916741
>>150923207

>>150915540 (OP)
I liked mindy https://youtu.be/R-FBTOGrfZM?si=k-WKPiOVxmB7oIEq&t=337

>>150933371
Can you please stop posting this shit, this is exactly what ruined the show's reputation and ended up getting it canceled.

I never really liked the episodes where Grim was just a punching bag

>>150919573
>Was
He stopped taking Tylenol?

>>150915660
Eris smacks different when you realize she's voiced by Hayley Smith.

>>150933914
Hayley Smith with a British accent.

>>150926916
What happened to the pets anyway?

>>150915660
cute bitch

>>150915540 (OP)
>being proto-Chowder
That's a good thing.

>>150933982
Mr Snuggles showed up in season 1 and randomly once in the last season too
They stopped using Saliva after season 1
Milkshakes is the only consistent pet through the series

neat article. This is why Grim & Evil split up.

>>150915660
Her tooth gap makes my willy ache.

>>150915540 (OP)
I don't know why Billy and Mandy isn't as well-remembered as Chowder. IMO it's the better show.

YOU'VE MESSED WITH THE NATURAL ORDAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

>>150927667
That's what the Indian dub did.

>>150915540 (OP)
Because despite the showing having one of the best concepts ever that you can do anything with, the writers where total hacks who could only think of toilet humor to entertain kids.

How did Maxwell Atoms come up with women so perfect over and over?

>>150936131
Dora looking ass haircut and eyes.

>>150936131
phwoar i need to beat my tiny white mean to some christmas cake office lady porn NOW

>>150936131
Needs to be FAT!

>>150936164
draw this dora dude

>>150936170
loving the navel

>>150928710
Sovl
Soul
Soulless

>>150936178
She truly has a sexo design.

>>150936131
I wish Gladys and Claire got more art, I always prefered them over the teacher.

>>150922948
what made it hateful?

>>150936428
Eris needs more fat fetish weight gain art since shes alway so skinny.

>>150936643
Well you're in luck, she has a bunch of those.

>>150936677
thats not much

>>150915540 (OP)
I still love the show to be honest.

>>150936135
That's actually the joke.

>>150926905
Why is Mandy so fucking sex here?

>>150936677
PERFECT CHONKY ERIS
BUILT FOR NON-PENETRATIVE FAT SEX.

Would Underfist made a good series?

>>150936164
Awesome! Did you draw this?

>>150940103
It probably would have been a good mini-series but those weren't really a thing when it was going to be made.

>>150940103
Yes, but they should have put Eris in as well.

More concept art to keep discussion alive.

Early versions of Eris, Harold, and an unused character "Yog" who evolved into The Boogey Man.

Early versions of Nergal, Mindy, Pud'n and Mandy's parents.

Atoms had a different show idea that got rejected before Billy & Mandy. Professor Death Ray Eyes would later appear (in a different form) on Evil Con Carne.

>>150942709
To be honest, I feel like this earlier Mandy design fit better than the final one.

>>150936164
I love your work, their really amazing. Would you care to redraw this in your own style?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3pSa2D61egE

Billy and mandy between its seasons correlate between Powerhouse CN, CN City/Yes era CN.
At a time when CN appealed to everyone and didn't start pandering to kids and treat its audiences as if their brain dead morons.

>>150926864
>>150915579
nepotism

>>150923136
Big headed Grim

>>150942740
>>150942767
Funny how they couldn't settle on a design for Eris even back then

>>150935648
Dexter's Lab isn't much older than Billy and Mandy and it had middle segments. Same with Johnny Bravo and Cow & Chicken.

somebody make an archive of all the Billy and Mandy production art.
because the creator is struggling financially so bad that he has to sell them off to sustain his living

Billy & Mandy has three eras. 2001-2003 (Grim and Evil era), 2004-2005 (the good post-G&E seasons) and 2006-2007 (proto-Fanboy and Chum Chum)

>>150933515
So many jokes packed in but none of them are funny, no wonder I didn't like this show as a kid

>>150915540 (OP)
Are we having Chowder for breakfast?

>>150938588
What the fuck is wrong with you

>>150946826
People like you.

>>150946173
i will rape michael ouweleen's face in hell for destroying this man's career then making rebecca sugar a thing

>>150942726
>British accent
Is it me, or he sounded Jamaican?

>>150947296
They changed it to JAmaican because Gregg Eagles' doing a Jamaican accent was funnier, I think.

>>150947296
Greg Eagles was the reason he sounded Jamaican.

>>150915540 (OP)
>Genuine horror show

???? You cant be serious.

>>150947503
Read the damn thread, there are several examples posted that show B&M started off with lots of moments and even entire episodes where there would be no comedy and only spookiness.

ITT: zoomers trying to gaslight people into thinking Billy and Mandy was always a baby show full of poop jokes when it used to have moments like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r6vPYUo94Gw

I stopped watching about '05, I actually remember really enjoying what I saw. Were the later seasons really that bad? How was the movie?
Have a song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ZdcwG03yHM

>>150936164
Don't know if you are him, but I hope that you're around.

>>150947523
>entire episodes where there would be no comedy and only spookiness.
this never happened even once.

>>150942553
It is really odd how Underfist was gonna handle her.

>>150916466
I do remember the Scotsman, and I do wonder what happened to him. Feel like they got rid of him because he was too similar to Haggis MacHaggis from Ren and Stimpy.

>>150915540 (OP)
Tbh I like both the early and later seasons.

>>150926730
I'm surprised Atoms didn't bring these characters to main show like he did with Skar. Like Ghastly could have been the school's chemistry teacher, Hector could have been the mail man and Cod Commando could have been Billy's new pet fish

>>150942779
>Mindy wearing the same outfit
Honestly, would have been funny. Especially if the colours were going to be inverse.

>>150919520
This is what happened to Wednesday in the new Netflix show too

>>150915540 (OP)
It was such a popular show it seemed like they wanted to keep it in line with the network identity as long as possible but became increasingly difficult.

>>150945477
Stfu

>>150926864
Oh that's crazy

>>150945477
That's not nepotism that's what a healthy network looked like: staff graduating from shows to branch out and even make their own. Not really the case anymore, though.

>>150951645
Basically this. Atoms had to work himself up, he started out as a prop designer, but did a good enough job to be promoted writer and storyboard artist. CN executives did have a keen eye on him, hence he was able to pitch his own ideas.

>>150951291
Yes...