>>105654816 (OP)
>China will overproduce energy
>No one talks about its storing capacities
>It will need to sell cheaply to nations around the gobi desert
1000IQ play from nations like Kazakhstan

>>105655171
>>No one talks about its storing capacities
Yeah the nation that produces the biggest amount of batteries by far will definitely have trouble storing all that energy

>>105655171
If you extend the net east - west you can use the timezones to smooth out the duck curve.

>>105654816 (OP)
>stop burning fossil fuels
>cut down all trees which absorb sun heat and convert to wood and replace with solar cells which convert it to electricity which is burned as heat
>both average energy consumption per person and global population increase one hundred fold
gee i wonder why global warming isn't going away

>>105654816 (OP)
and yet china also has a ton of nuclear and is planing nuclear energy in fucking space
weird that
almost like solar or wind are not suitable for a giant ass industrial country such as china

>>105654816 (OP)
Solar + batteries
>buuuh i dont wannaaaa
Too bad. It's the future.

Investors and builders need to maximize their profits. Up front costs for the production is offset by the projected units of energy produced to sell over time. Natural gas is the king for this equation but in due time that is likely to change, maybe in the next decade or two decades. There's a real engineering video about this topic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UC_BCz0pzMw

>>105655171
If only they had the knowledge and/or industrial power to invent and fabricate some way of storing all that daytime energy....

>kicked out by trump
>immediately goes back to dicksucking china
nerdass simpass glazing ass fuck nigga

>>105654816 (OP)
considering nobody wants to make solar outside of china, and nobody also wants to have their power generation capabilities beholden to china, I imagine the only real answer is nuclear and everyone else is either shills or terminally retarded about geopolitics

>>105655964
It's a thinly veiled demand for more government subsidies for his batteries and solar panels.

>>105654879
What

>>105655171
>No one talks about its storing capacities
They make batteries...

>>105655964
True. We need to ban solar panel and nuclear power. Since China is doing it, it must be bad.

Tranny brain at work

>>105655186
>Battery storage for the grid is feasible.
Tell me other good fairytales.

>>105655186
>>105655935
>>105656147
>It's just like building small batteries
Oh, I thought there was a reason for pretty much 80% of research efforts being focused on the storing of the generated energy. I bet there's a good reason no one is reporting on how much of that energy they can actually use and transport out of the literal desert they are generating it in.

>>105656158
yes yes ching chong sucka da china dikku

>>105656160
>>105656170
>it's impossible to store and transport large amounts of energy
>i-it just is ok

>>105655171
pump hydroelectric storage
it's that shrimple

>>105656248
>>it's impossible to store and transport large amounts of energy
It's impossible to store and transport over vast distances without losing a lot of the energy you generated. If this wasn't the case, feel free to explain why so much research money is going in that direction instead of improving the generation processes or some company poaching all researchers to massively reduce their production costs.

>>105656269
In a desert.

>>105656363
1-2% efficiency loss over 1000 km for China's new grid system. Its absolutely negligible. You dumb cunts need to neck yourself with you tranny fluids.

>>105656455
I'm a white man, born with a dick and I won't chop it off but I won't glaze asian autocracies because unlike you I don't hate my homecountry. Also the losses are higher anyway. Even if they were that low, that'd still only be usable for Beijing but not the massive southern economic centers. Dedicating an entire desert for one city is absurd. Just help people get solar on their own roofs and reduce the amount of electricity they need to use.

>>105656491
Denial wont help you face reality.

>>105655171
Kazakhstan, I kneel.

>>105654816 (OP)
Energy isn't produced

>>105654816 (OP)
We'll probably get Republicans who see big money in data centers lobbying for "Small Nuclear" or Fusion along the lines of OKLO in Texas.

Democrats will want to advance science too so will probably bring back nuclear plants with the new technology akin to what Iran does by building plants underneath the ground.

Solar was never popular here because we spread the rumor that they destroyed the environment anyway and were inefficient. China didn't give a good damn about environment and they can't even see sometimes but they got paid off proving we were pussies and should have just wrecked the environment.

By the way China sells solar panels and they have already changed the game for a lot of people. You can now buy a 3000 dollar plot of land and power your little camp with just solar and get Starlink cheapest way to live. Gen X Boomers are waking up to this and that land will be worth 20K in a few years.

>>105654816 (OP)
Nuclear + renewables w/ storage solutions.

Should be obvious.

>>105654816 (OP)
Thorium

>>105656590
But BUT EROEI

>>105656612
you cant obviously ignore economic forces

>>105656491
>>105656363
>>105656170
These posts are a nice example of why the West is fucked. "White men" like this guy, who haven't actually produced anything themselves and have just spent the last couple generations riding on the achievements of the visionary inventors of the mid-20th century, have developed this absurdly overblown ego as a result of the cultural echo chamber they live in.

The achievements of other nations, even ones that are their direct competitors, will never give them the wake up call they need because they're incredibly good at sticking their heads in the sand any time they see a suggestion that other nations might be poised to usurp them. Dismissing China in particular seems especially stupid considering the absurd growth China has undergone during the past couple decades.

Will they ever wake up? No, they'll just pretend that it's all fake until it becomes impossible to deny and by then it will be too late.

>>105656760
This is exactly why tech companies keep hiring pajeets, because Indian academics do learn something that isn't pure masturbation
Way easier to deal with a retard that is at least trying, than convincing someone who's stuck in a analysis paralysis to do something

>>105655171
There is no such thing as overproducing electricity. All electricity is made to demand.

so uhh about that air quality in china
surely the numbers are real right?

>>105654816 (OP)
>a country that has to import fossil fuels from the west (+satellites) and has a massive electronics/minerals industry is leveraging said industries to insulate itself in the long-run from foreign coercion and instability
Great strategic planning. The West could do the same if the bean counters didn't cry communism at the mere thought of state investment/industrial policy.

>>105657828
>so uhh about that air quality in china
China has shit air quality because they actually have heavy industry in their country.

>>105654816 (OP)
MUH

>>105656160
We're doing it in some parts of Australia, actually. Capacity is ramping up constantly since we've been investing in large battery banks and infrastructure, it goes hand in hand with our drive for more renewables. It's not a cheap investment, granted, but if a shitter country like us can do it, surely the US could too.

>>105656363
>It's impossible to store and transport over vast distances without losing a lot of the energy you generated
Transporting large amounts of energy is a solved problem since the 19th century. Just add more voltage. More voltage can carry more energy with less losses to heat on thinner (i.e. cheaper) wires, which is why transmission lines that bring energy from a 20th century factory to your house use super high voltage on hundreds of thousands of volts whereas your house outlets are at 220V (or 110V if you live in a third world country)
DC very high voltage is more efficient because AC suffers losses from impendance and the skin effect, but converting voltages is brain-dead easy with AC (just add a bunch of copper one side and less copper on the other side lmao), converting voltage with DC requires specialized power electronics that didn't exist 120 years ago with the AC/DC wars but they exist now and are already widely used.
>If this wasn't the case, feel free to explain why so much research money is going in that direction
??? source? Maybe they are designing some more efficient very high power DC converter I dunno

>>105658370
Asking Americans to not rape the environment is like asking Indians to not defecate in public. Sometimes they pretend to be willing to change, but at the end of the day it's just their culture.

>>105655407
They can plan on doing both

>>105659715
>wahh da environment
Holy shit you are mentally ill.

I thought solar gets exponentially more powerful and cheaper over time, like chips do

Isn't it inevitable that we mostly switch to solar?

I always found wind to be a mafia style scam to grab government subsidies, it does nothing.

>>105656760
>direct competitors
this is politician talk. complete nonsense. if you have such a big problem with China then go start a war with them and kill them all.
the west stopped hiring white men and filled every role with soul devoured, permanently childless sex in the city women, and niggers, now you whine that white men aren't all nikola tesla, and no one is 'involved'. your actual enemy is Larry Fink, retard.

>>105660566
I don't recall ever saying that I had a problem with China.
>politician talk
World economies under capitalism are a zero sum game. Any country that is not 100% self-contained and self-sufficient is engaged in direct competition with other countries. They compete to buy resources, they compete to sell resources, they compete to buy and sell services, they compete to structure world politics in a way that benefits them most, etc.

America produces a lot of passenger planes. If the American aerodynamics industry declines (which it's doing as we speak) to the point that China is able to produce better and cheaper planes, then countries will stop buying planes from America and start buying them from China. That's a direct loss for every American who benefitted from that industry.

>the west stopped hiring white men
The problems I describe have been ongoing for the past 50 years at least. It's not a recent phenomenon and it predates your retarded zoomer culture war brainworms. This problem is not only something that can't be stopped with the sort of retarded shit you're doing here but is in fact made worse by it to such an undeniable extent that I find it hard to believe it's not intentional.

Countries in decline need to be brutally honest about their decline and take drastic steps to reverse it. The best way to make while men apathetic and complacent is to tell them that it's not because they aren't making an effort, but because it's hopeless for them to even try because there's a global jewish conspiracy designed to keep them down. It's the same reason American blacks have been stuck in the same rut for so long: rather than focusing on how they can improve their lot, they've been tricked into focusing on getting upset over the groups "oppressing" them.

You are falling into that exact same trap.

>>105654816 (OP)
downloadmoreenergy.com

>>105658028
is that Benny Hill?

>>105655171
>No one talks about its storing capacities
Sure they do, but no one likes the answer.

Hydrogen is a giant clusterfuck, everything else is worse.

>>105656797
Someone who tries is better than someone who have resigned. Whether resignation is due to personal reasons, white guilt, white superiority, white shame, laziness, boredom, etc. Doesn't matter. If someone has resigned mentally, you cannot get them up physically.

>>105656760
>White men
>4chan/g
Bro I have news to you

>>105661246
>brown trying to point out other browns
a tale as old as time

get your english teacher to explain to you the difference in meaning between
>White men
and
>>105656760
>"White men"

>>105656760
Except that I'm not saying it's fake. It's just not smart building a large solar farm in a desert where nothing happens while they have no proper way of storing it. Get solar panels on buildings that regularly get used (private homes, government buildings, corporate buildings etc) and generate energy close to the user. That's the way you can actually use the energy well. That's the one thing solar can provide which no other source for electric generation can and instead we're glazing some country for generating power in a desert and being forced to sell to other countries or just lose most of it during the storing and transportation.

>>105661049
bring in a billion more niggers and pajeets instead of hiring white guys to engineer planes, that'll fix it.

>>105654816 (OP)
Who says? Let me guess, China is reporting it and people are dumb enough to believe it without concrete evidence.

Chinese FUD spammers never lie about their capabilities. First they fixed RAM prices, then they saved the GPU market, onward with CPUs, now they are doing Solar!

>>105656590
Neither party wants to do shit.
Repubs aren't going to want to hurt electric company profits and demoshits want us to deindustrialize anyway.

Right now there's an internal conflict in the Republican party because oil and gas are still major donors but there are red states with significant renewable industries like Texas and NC.

>>105661659
Eh.
They are both protecting their profits in the end.
Fossil or renewable, neither are going to build out more than absolutely necessary to keep energy prices at a baseline rather than driving them down.

>>105661569
>now they are doing Solar!
China actually produces there.
There is a reason the Biden admin enacted tariffs on Chinese renewables.

Officials in China state China is doing well.
>we numa 1
Like they've been doing for 30 years. More at 11.

>>105661759
Agreed, I was thinking more about their cultural habit of hamstringing renewables in the legislature. There's lots of debate about whether they should keep doing that on the state and federal level.

>>105658370
Our electricity is now California-tier prices and getting more expensive every year. Prices are going up at the end of the month.

>>105654816 (OP)
>nucular energy
fucking amerimutts

>>105659753
Yes. It costs less than $0.10 per watt currently. Solar panels are more efficient, cheaper, and durable every year.

>>105662713
wut he mean by this

>>105655712
>nuclear
>economics
Economics doesn't come into it and the fact that some people don't realise this terrifies me.
Storage of nuclear still hasn't been solved. It is going to destroy this planet.

>>105655171
>>105656573
HI FIVE-A~. VERY NICE~.

>>105664267
I like how oil lobbies will try to suggest that the pollution caused by manufacturing these things are nearly as bad as the pollution caused by oil exploitation for energy.
They're dreaming. Oil has caused so much cancer near my area alone it's a repugnant thing to suggest that it's worse than solar.

>>105666086
youre a schizo

>nameplate capacity of 9001GW
>it's actually 0 GW during peak hours
Solar is a scam.
>>105664267
Now do the same chart for batteries.

>>105666286
Here are your battery prices saar.

>>105666419
>tfw bought LIT

>>105666454
Time to invest is SOD!

>>105655186
Li-ion batterys are absolutely shiet for grid level storage, you would liltterally be better off pumping water up a hill.

>>105655339
I thought China has one timezone because autism

>>105666268
I'm a schizo?
You don't even want to talk about nuclear waste and the detriment to our environment with it. This shit WILL destroy us all if it gets any more out of control. It's already fucking up groundwater supplies where I live. We don't even use nuclear power and it's doing that (took storage for a price).

>>105666513
Australia unironically considered doing this. There are several dams that are salty already and you have an entire ocean there.

So did Trump fuck up NOAAs weather forecasting ability on purpose to promote oil and nuclear?

>>105666605
LOL

>>105666605
>We don't even use nuclear power and it's doing that (took storage for a price).
Sounds like your shithole country IS the solution to the problem.

>>105666605
Did the barrels leak?

>>105654816 (OP)
Hydrothermal depolymerization, nuclear, and tidal generators.

what is this fucking thread lmao

>>105655171
>Electricity
>Overproduced
No such thing on a sufficiently networked national power

>>105654816 (OP)
>china: "yeah, we're 100% solar with superior chinese technology!"
>reality: the solar panels are cardboard and the nuclear reactors are dumping radioactive sludge into the drinking water reservoirs

>>105655171
they have like 5× the us’ population, they’re probably underproducing if anything

>>105666496
these people started their histogram at $0.65bil and extrapolated it from two years
alright

>>105654816 (OP)
china is going to sell cheap energy to the world and further undercut onshore industry lol

>>105666496
i made $100 yesterday and $150 today, by this time next week i'll be making $500 a day!

>>105654816 (OP)
Has anythig this guy predicted in relation to technology come true, ever?

>>105654816 (OP)
>How to Produce More Energy?
Easy. Just install a second sun.

>Source: fart huffing wumao fantasies
Wowie zowie, thank you daddy Musky-wusky UwU

>>105668811
based

>>105654816 (OP)
>retards are still arguing about energy production
the current problem is not production, but STORAGE, you fucking RETARDS.
only muricans are retarded enough to keep using oil when you can get 200W of electricity per m2 for 5-6 hours a day with cheap solar panels.

>>105668250
Then they'll lose power in storage and transportation.

>>105668615
But it's le biggest solar farm. The problem is more about it being in an inhospitable desert that only has buildings for said generator. There's nothing with noteworthy power draw.

i just bought a solar power battery tender for my car and it really works.

>>105661759
The energy industry needs to grow 2X. The solar is growing the fastest in Texas. So are battery storage. When bills come out to punish solar or wind, it becomes hard to sell. Especially since the states produce local jobs. Ideological push can only go so far

>>105656363
>In a desert.
put the pools indoors so the evaporated water condenses and falls back in

>>105656158
>>105656455
>nobody:
>poltard: TRANNIES

>>105673564
It's not really about ideology at this point.
I'm extremely bearish on the US's ability to really do anything related to infrastructure.
Squabbles about renewable or fossil fuels are just kinda that.

Energy production will grow but only what's necessary to sustain the status quo. I'm not confident anyone will take advantage of what solar can do to really reindustrialize.

>>105675275
That won't change that the power is generated in the middle of nowhere

>>105666419
>cost expressed per watt
>cost expressed per kw hour
I see what you did there but most of /g/ won't.

lol

>>105658370
Okay where does these materials cone from?
How are these batteries made?
What happens with the batteries that need to be replaced?

How hard can you load the batteries?

Battery technology to the electricity grid is retarded to it's core and we will only see the problem when you retards have already installed it.

Potential mass is the only good way to store energy.
Moment is good to stabilize the grid frequency.

>>105679262
yea last i checked batteries still require rare materials (relatively speaking), are hardly recyclable, and don't even last very long. i think we're a bit premature trying to go all in on current battery technologies. time will tell of course, but i reckon in 50 years or less we'll be looking back wondering wtf were we thinking. i realise current technology is all we have, but idk, we don't need more false starts like hydrogen which just grind everything to a crawl overall

>>105679314
and don't get me wrong, hydrogen is nice on paper, it's just that the current means of producing enough of it don't make sense, at least as long as collection>consumption efficiency is still a concern. like yea solar > electricity > electrolysis > hydrogen fuel cell in electric car is really green. but electrolysis is way less efficient than using chemical batteries, as bad as they are for the environment. we'd need to greatly reduce our energy consumption
really, i do think that should be a goal, but we're not even close to that as a species

>>105656363
>It's impossible to store and transport over vast distances without losing a lot of the energy you generated
HVDC

>>105654816 (OP)
Solar
Sun is free :^)p2t8t

>>105677218
W is power transfer.
Wh is amount of energy.

>y-yeah well they can't store all that excess energy! It's impossible for battery technology to advance anymore!

The cope train has moved on to the next station, I see. (Final stop: Chinese World Hegemony)

>>105679343
>electrolysis is way less efficient
Hydrogen is produced by refining from natural gas not by electrolysis, that's why big oil loves it so much.

>man with solar company says world must buy more solar

>>105656590
>>105656651
natural gas is better than solar. look up the allam cycle

>>105656760
why do all the countries have to become less white the whole time we try your ideas though

>>105654879
I immediately know an Indian wrote this

>>105659715
?

>>105661049
>The problems I describe have been ongoing for the past 50 years at least. It's not a recent phenomenon and it predates your retarded zoomer culture war brainworms.
affirmative action was just found to be a decades long unconstitutional anti white policy, so you are hoist on your own petard there

>>105655171
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_pumped-storage_hydroelectric_power_stations

>>105666605
water is 1 to 1 just as effective as lead shielding when it comes to radiation
if you drop all of the worlds fissile material into the mariana trench, how much radiation would reach the surface of the ocean?

>>105675437
if you use the word tard in the derogatory you are also from /pol/ just sayin

>>105654816 (OP)
Stop using so much energy
https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/
>>105655935
>>105656147
>>105656269
Batteries are bloat
https://solar.lowtechmagazine.com/2023/08/direct-solar-power-off-grid-without-batteries/

>>105656491
>my homecountry
What homecountry? The US Empire has explicit directives to ensure there is no homecountry for you.

This is almost a decade old, so the percentages of parts able to be recycled is even higher now.

>>105680475
was going to make joke about degrowthers and someone actually posts it unironically, insane

>>105680764
Not even degrowthers.
Just eco death cult horseshit
Degrowthers advocate that less population means advancement in standards of living as more of everything is generally available.

>>105680367
The difference is that radioactive particles can diffuse through water but not through lead you fucking donut

>>105680475
the use of thermal energy storage for cooking is so obvious that it's practically embarrassing we don't do this more often
we're literally not even trying

>>105680526
>semiconductor material reprocessing
yeah no thats not happening, unless "reprocessing as landfill" counts

Love how solar panels being recyclable is somehow a open and shut win for retards. Recycling paper is bad for the environment where do retards get off thinking that recycling panels is a win without cost. Solar farms are gay. Supplemental use is okay. Nukes will always be king.

>>105655386
>he believes the climate bullshit
how many boosters are you on?

>>105655597
now to drink your onions milk, grab your booster, get into your wage cage, acquire your axe wound, and go sleep in the pod

>>105666086
are you one of those boomers who still believe in muh nuclear bad fearmongering?
I thought you died out

>>105666605
>nuclear waste
are you actually retarded?
literally just bury it or turn it into nuclear weapon
it's not some kind of magic goop that turn entire region into wasteland

>>105656760
Ironically this sort of sneering contempt for outsiders is what got imperial China fucked over in the first place. They paid no mind to European innovations until it was too late, and then they got whacked with the century of humiliation.
Nothing new under the sun.

>>105666605
all of the USA nuclear waste from the start of their nuclear efforts (including medical, research, power, and military) takes up about 1,500 shipping containers. lol. cargo ships hold like 20,000 containers. majority of the weight is concrete too and its mostly water.
nuclear waste is fuck all.

>>105682843
Thing in, people fall into a fit of rage when they see a sea of solar panels.

Imagine the energy you could harvest were it possible to harvest the desperate lust for attention twitter screencap posters have.

>>105682843
>just build a solar park the size of germany bro
>oh and also just build and maintain it in what is literally the most inhospitable place on earth

>>105682129
The usual retard response to this is that it's an extremely idealized view of the problem and that a disaster is inevitable. These people don't understand how much worse oil and coal are for human health, even in the short term.
People don't actually care how safe nuclear power is, they care how "scary" it is.

>>105654816 (OP)
More energy to be used on fucking WHAT?

>>105654816 (OP)
Isn't china's pupulation like 8x that of the us? They obviously produce more electricity.

>>105685388
Uh... no. Why the fuck would you say something this retarded when you can easily look it up?

Molten salt towers are pretty cool, too.

This tower can supply enough electricity for 400,000 people.

>>105664267
what is this stupid idiot scale for babies

>>105680321
of course

>>105685449
I like them too, but aren't they horribly inefficient? even compared to photovoltaic.

>>105677203
transmit the power over a wire to a storage facility near an urban area, then dispense it a much shorter distance as demand dictates.

>>105654816 (OP)
Jews make a lot of money out of coal. Never going to happen.

Cool, so what are they going to do with all those solar panels once they start reaching the end of lifespan in 10-15 years?

>>105654816 (OP)
If we're low on energy then why do my lights always work?

>>105685554
until they don't.

>>105685554
Don't you know global warming will deplete the sun in 20 years? We need to allow muslim in Europe to curb climate change.

Solar is for domestic use only were failure of the grid is acceptable. Anyone shilling for solar powering the world is lying.
Also imagine depending on China's mood for energy.
Nuclear or miraculous break thought in energy production is the only way foward. Laggers will pay premium for the megawatt.
>But Nuclear is dangerous!
Yes it is, if niggers work on it that is.

>>105666605
>Native American
My sympathies bud. You got done dirty. That said, as long as we follow safe protocols nuclear waste is a non-issue.

>>105654816 (OP)
Let china do it. The more they use it, the more they will depend on it.
The more reliable an energy source is, the more influential people will, "for some reason", fight against it or, at the very least, ignore it in favor of others. This is why solar is liked while nuclear "must be stopped".
People should focus on nuclear energy and its efficient use to become truly independent.

imo energy discussion is pointless online since everywhere has different landscapes (literally) making different sorts of power more efficient. and politicians should stay far away from energy companies because 90% of politicians barely understand how to operate their dvd player, let alone anything about power generation/transmission.
>muh nukular
>muh wind's
>muh sunlar
it feels like every time an area adopts one of these they pick the exact wrong one for the area. it's almost like a conspiracy to spend all this money and then go "See! See! It doesn't work, we HAVE to use Solid Coal!!"

also we need to kill all the nimby retards who chimp out whenever anyone wants to put a solar panel/windmill/rtg/micro-dam anywhere because it "spoils the view". no joke where i live wind power is literally illegal even on private property to set up yourself because it supposedly damages property values to have to look at windmills. giant black concrete slabs for passive solar are fine though, and they're talking about bringing back uranium mining. but a 30kw windmill for just my ranch, oh jeez, can't do that

>>105656760
>until it becomes impossible to deny
bro americans still literally think canadians live in igloos and mexicans live in adobe huts.

>>105666086
>Storage of nuclear still hasn't been solved.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4aUODXeAM-k

>>105661155
hydrogen is a meme BUT i liked seeing a few years back how HHO/brown gas/whatever was considered for use on work sites. straight up just converting ethanol engines to run on literal elemental hydrogen, the idea being that it's easier to generate on-site or at least nearby in remote areas rather than trucking fossil fuels around or dealing with less reliable electric vehicles. (obvs this is for like remote areas and shit way up north, a construction site in town can just plug in an air compressor to the power box they install first and hit the gas station two blocks away as needed)

why does everyone sleep on hydro? i get that the US has a lot of deserts/plains but wherever there's a river why not dam that shit? it's not like the US has tons of river based shipping anymore and even on the great lakes just like dig a side channel bro

same for tidal on the rather massive coasts available to the US

>>105664267
what a bizarre arrangement for the axes/scale. but i know why they did it
americans will look at this and see "LINE GO DOWN, AIEEEE WTF I HATE SOLAR NOW"

>>105686719
hydro is mid because it implies you're going to bury some good ass nature under a thousand feet of water.
If you actually need the water then sure that might be a reason, but more often than not you just colossally fuck up the local ecosystem and install a permanent sediment trap
Any expensive public works project also struggles to get funding.
>bros do you want [thing]
>hell yeah we do
>ok lets raise taxes so we can get [thing]
>nooooo dont tax me aiieeeeee

>>105686837
there is nature under and around the water though. and if you're willing to build a giant molten salt tower surrounded by mirrors or cover thousands of acres in wind turbines, clearly you don't give a fuck about birds anyway.

>bros do you want [thing]
>hell yeah we do
>ok lets raise taxes so we can get [thing]
>nooooo dont tax me aiieeeeee
fair point but it applies to literally everything. even if you just want to expand the local coal plant this will happen

>>105686877
who told you I was willing to do any of that gay shit?
Put the sun into a fucking bottle. Or at least heat up some water.

>>105686837
but yeah this is the best example of people saying "no" to a dam
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sa-gWLjKSwg

>>105686886
"hire"(enslave) HR roasties to pull a giant cable to cock a massive spring piston that will take water and compress it at high speed and use the heat from the adiabatic compression turning the water into plasma to heat up exotic toxic refrigerants to drive closed loop turbines

You know how you know solar is a scam, that it is fucking garbage? Because zero, I mean no fucking company in the US puts solar on their buildings. None of them. You would think with all the polo shirt wearing Mormon sales faggots going door to door scamming people with getting panels on their homes that McDonalds or warehouses would be putting panels on their buildings to lower cost. Why not? Wouldn't a Business make a green investment like that? Their are plenty of tax benefits, especially in gay states.
>but but, mr Americafat, solar is actually good, and the oil lobby is the reason greedy companies that care about their bottom line don't use panels.
Lets use the example again.
>no no, we are having a power outage, time to.......
turn on a fucking generator. No one is taking about battery backups or solar for servers hospitals or data centers because they need RELIABLE POWER that WORKS. Not fairy tale government subsidized garbage.

>>105687387
they don't? it's really common in australia. a notable example is how in bunnings (hardware store) they typically even have a monitor inside which shows how much power their solar panels are producing to show it off

>>105687452
here in canada it's not quite like that but tons of large buildings have solar on the roof. though it is absolutely more to get rebates on power than to operate in emergency and everywhere has stood-off diesel gennies

>>105687482
no i don't think they're using them with batteries as backup power, though i wouldn't know if any did or not. a generator makes more sense in most cases i'd say. power cuts aren't common enough to justify buying and maintaining large battery banks
thinking about it though, in australia we get plenty of sun year-round, while you guys get snow and shit, so perhaps solar makes less sense to you

>>105687452
I know Australia is a desert hellhole that is run by faggot liberals who subsidize solar panels with tax breaks. But I have never seen solar panels on commercial buildings in TX, New Mexico or Arizona. Once again, no hospital on this fucking planet has a
>"green backup solution of solar and giant batteries."
And why would they? ICE and traditional power generation is always superior because you have complete control and the system is cheaper then batteries, smaller and more energy dense then batteries, can be refueled cheaply. Solar is not reliable at all.

Everyone I know who has solar panels on their houses hate them, they got scammed into them by some polo wearing Mormon guy who "we will charge you your power bill to pay off the panels for the next 15yrs." Retards fall for it, realize its a scam and after 15 yrs their panels are already shitting out on them. Solar has its purpose, but much like the landfills of windmill blades, people don't see the true cost of these things.

>>105687521
>>"green backup solution of solar and giant batteries."
no one frames solar like this except for retarded preppers afraid of a wrench. solar is and always has been for normal municipal power generation backed up by diesel gens for individual buildings in emergencies and coal/gas/nuclear/etc for export energy

>>105687452
The schizo is wrong. US companies don't put solar panels on their buildings because their main concerns are getting the buildings up and open as fast and cheaply as possible. For the minority of buildings that are actually built to last (or at least aren't disposable Walmart slopshacks), solar panels are in fact becoming increasingly popular.

As a rule, do not ever discuss energy issues with mutts. They literally worship fossil fuels.

>>105687542
The memes are so funny with you faggots. Panels literally only last 15 to 20 yrs, they lose a shit load of efficiency over time and will need replaced. Here is the real question? Without government subsidies, can a commercial building owner afford to put panels on a building? The answer is always no because they barely pay for themselves. Any home owner understands this concept. solar panels on your home cost allot of money and at the end of the day, barely pay for themselves.

Don't worry though. I might be a dumb fuck Ameriamutt, but you know how are dumber? Europoors who we cut off from Russia, now they can't get cheap practical energy and compete in the global market. Oh you think Germany will fix their energy issue with manufacturing with fucking solar? BAHAHAHA. Please. Childless faggots like yourself don't understand the zero some game of solar. It is made to make you feel good. and Elon Musk owns a solar company. Stop listening to Billionaires dumb fuck.

>>105654816 (OP)
>solar panels
what is EROEI?

americans really be out here throwing a shitfit because the ghouls that rule them invest in useful tech once in a while

>>105687860
I am literally being genocided.

>Ameriamutt
>how are dumber
>zero some game

>>105654816 (OP)
Large scale refrigerant cycle. Like the size of a fucking mountain, plugged into the deep Earth or a volcano. You could run a fucking shit ton of turbines with it.
Have a system to store the liquid in reserve in cells to respond to demand as necessary.

>>105687612
So long as they do pay for themselves isn’t that good?

>>105686837
*Laughs in Chinese*

>>105680333
Isn't this the shift from moving production from america to china?

>>105688008
what does that sound like

>>105654816 (OP)
Let's see China do it without over 190 countries throwing them free stuff.

>>105685471
>I like them too, but aren't they horribly inefficient? even compared to photovoltaic.
Uneconomically.

>>105686719
>no riverboat shipping
when all the Indians get sent back... all those shitty trucking jobs they've been terrorizing the interstates with vanishing... Proud Mary will roll again.

>>105655186
idiot

>>105686877
>muh taxes
Taxes are already sufficient to pay for these projects. There's no need to raise them. Just stop spending them on garbage that's irrelevant or giving 500%+ markup on projects and labor because the government's buddy was hired to do it.

>>105687542
>america DUMB america BAD america STUPID america MUTT
>no I don't have any proof of my claims, sh-shut up

>>105690457
there is literally not enough of any single currency in the world to cover the debt of the countries that use it

>>105690493
Good thing we can make more currency at will.

>>105685498
They explode after 1 day of use right in your face and you can post about it

>>105687612
Don’t worry, the Germans are burning coal again

>>105690493
>he thinks the debt is real

>>105691105
I wanted to argue against this but I remembered I haven't gotten any news in years

>>105656582
Yes, technically energy only ever changes forms, but would you say a forge doesn't produce steel because it's just another form of carbon?

>>105691552
>would you say a forge doesn't produce steel because it's just another form of carbon

>>105691442
It is for the tax payers

>>105691642
yeah, it needs to have carbon or its just iron dicknuts

>>105691442
If debt isn't real, then why does the US pay all its debt (at least the interest on its debt).

In fact, the US pays 15% of ALL its revenue on financing debt. By 2040, the US will spend 30% of its GDP on just paying off the interest on its debt, if the rate of debt stays the same.

Recently the US just hit $37 trillion in national debt. Those are some juicy interests.

>>105680882
hmm you almost had me but then i remembered there arent any currents in the mariana trench and all the most dangerous radioactive materials are heavy metals and will never float up to harm anyone
i stand by my original assessment, you could drop every single gram of radioactive material we have ever obtained, into the ocean, and all humans would be completely protected

>>105682843
we would need even less energy if we just compressed all humans into a cube

>>105691442
print your 1 trillion dollar zimbabwe dollars to solve world hunger

>>105694052
>Just massively change the environment, I don't see any direct effects for humans!
>t. Mao

This might actually be the single most retarded thread on /g/ I have seen in years which really is a sad, pathetic achievement.

>>105659745
dont shit where you eat

>>105694674
I know this is a US website, but not everyone here is American. Just reminding people that commie retards exist is not a magic win button in arguments elsewhere, except maybe in India.

the answer is solar+storage with some amount of baseload nuclear/hydro/geo and gas peaker
its really shrimple as that until(if) fusion. the boomers that larp about muh coal are complete retards, even if you ignore carbon ask them how much they'd like to live next to a coal plant it's years off your life

>>105690487
It's an open secret in the US that a lot of commercial buildings are basically disposable: https://actionlab.strongtowns.org/hc/en-us/articles/360053128692-Big-Box-Stores-Core-Insights
This is mainly about big box stores, but they're just one well-known example. Obviously you'd have to be a retard to buy solar panels rated for 30 years and put them on a building that will be crumbling in a decade.

>>105694674
Every fucking country does it.

Otherwise Netherlands would be flooded entirely. Even in the US you have megacities like New York where it's a concrete jungle. Might as well genocide every single human so every part of earth returns back to nature.

>>105666620
Lots of places DO already do it. It's called pumped storage hydroelectricity.
Switzerland for example has 32% of it's electrical generating capacity as PSH.

>>105688954
hhhhh

>>105696073
>It's just about communism bros
>Don't look up what happened after he ordered all those sparrows killed
>It definitely doesn't have effects today

>>105656269
>sun comes out
>steals your water

Yeah because they use African slave labor in the cobalt mines.
White people have morality.

>>105698707
lol

based

It's the future.

>>105687387
You are simply wrong. Texas took the lead from California in solar installations in 2024 because it's no longer about eco faggotry it makes economic sense. You would be right a decade ago. The future is now old man.

>>105704248
NTA but showing gains is not the same thing as generated power, which I feel is more interesting. I still agree with you that it's a finacial decision or in some cases even arises from a fear of losing sovereignty