Thread 105837280

Post linux noob traps ITT

ricing should be 10000x bigger than anything else on that image.

>>105837280 (OP)
Setting up a dev environment only to spend the rest of your week fapping in the bathroom.

flatpack is actually great for running sketchy software on your machine.

You really should be getting comfortable with the command line and the gnu core utilities, pipes, etc. before anything.

>>105837426
I mean, it's the AI era.. you can just ask chatgpt to give you a simplified walkthrough for any action you'd like to take.. even if it's just installing a web browser. There's no reason for Linux to be intimidating or scary for the novice anymore..

Just remember to back up your shit

>>105837355
Ricing has been very popular on most desktop OSes for decades. It wasn't effectively killed on Mac until 10.7. It was very popular on Windows until 10, but still easily done until 11. If GNOME gets its way, you'll see ricing killed off on GTK-based DEs under Linux and BSD within 10 years, but Qt-based DEs and pretty much all WMs will be fine.

>>105837426
oh I am comfortable with pipes alright

>>105837280 (OP)
>Flatpak
It's fine... Only when packages are not in the official repository
I agree with the rest since there are better alternatives to them

>>105837441
>There's no reason for Linux to be intimidating or scary for the novice anymore.
The fact that people still don't do it proves that it was never about difficulty, it could be as simple as pressing a button and midwits still wouldn't do it because they feel comfortable in the cages big tech has constructed around them. They're like the elephant that is chained as a baby, and even as an adult who could easily break the chain, refuses to.

>>105839079
They are slowly introducing monetization to flathub, next you wont be able to install without account and later you will have to pay to update. OP is right, it's a trap.

anything that gnu hands have touched.

>>105839140
the freetard urge to slowly recreate macos but worse is amazing

>>105837441
true. if the ai boom hasn't happened by the time I've switched to loonix then I would've most likely fallen off a long time ago. manually scraping forums and cuckexchange to find a sliver of information on your specific issue is no fun

>>105839187
It's IBM and other corporations behind that.
Actual people with an interesting in contributing to free software don't make garbage like flatpak.

>>105837280 (OP)
arch

>>105839079
By that point forking is the way to go
I don't like IBM either but I like the concept of Flatpak
Emulators, GNOME shit and communication software like Signal or the different front-ends for discord to name a few
To be able to not have discord garbage in my core system while also having access to a somewhat recent version of an emulator is such a good thing

appimages is fundamentally better

>>105839303
Meant for >>105839140

>>105837280 (OP)
>Ubuntu
>Docker
>noob traps
Lmao. Aka. technologies that are productive, gets shit done and makes you money
But I know /g/ wouldn't know anything about that...

>>105839557
cont.
The real noob trap is listening to /g/ and become a tinker tranny that rices their Arch, Gentoo or whatever else crap, and doesn't actually do anything useful with their PC.

>>105837280 (OP)
I'm only using Virtualbox because my Multi-function printer Bother-7030R scanner doesn't work on Linux, but it works on Windows XP.
I don't see the point of using the more sophisticated VMWare or QEMU

>>105839557
nah ubuntu is literally a less functional debian. It has no reason to exist

>>105837674
>Qt-based DEs and pretty much all WMs will be fine.
Hahahaha, no. Qt skins (themes) can run any code on your machine. The markup language they're coded in (XML) allows them to execute any code on your system.
WM skins are mostly file, apart from those in WindowMaker and IceWM, which have the same issue as Qt skins.

>>105839732
delusional

>>105840367
>(XML) allows them to execute any code
fractal_wrongness.jpg

>>105839732
>2nd or 3rd most used distro in enterprise
>no reason to exists
lmao

>>105840367
A. You are objectively incorrect.
B. Your entire post is a non sequitur.

>>105837280 (OP)
Docker is fine but agreed with the rest.

>>105837280 (OP)
Virtualbox is almost oldfag software at this point. Been using it regularly since '08.

Docker is pretty nice to work with once you get it to respect your OS firewall rules.

Flatpak is shit compared to AppImage, but it's still useful.

Snap is redundant and has no good reason to exist.

Manjaro is meant for gnubes, so no argument there, but it is actually pretty comfy (and also has one of the whitest teams out there, https://manjaro.org/team).

Ubuntu was great until they adopted GNOME 3, and it has all been downhill from there. That being said, Ubuntu Server is megacomfy, especially with kernel livepatching via "pro" enabled. Manage a few servers that run it.

>>105837280 (OP)
Just wanted to post that Snap fucked me over because I used it to install a terminal emulator and shells it spawned didn't have enough permission to dynamically link through libld

>>105837280 (OP)
why does docker put the image on your system disk instead of in the folder of the cloned repo? My entire disk was filled with huge images and deleting them didn't free up the space for some reason. Eventually, I just got rid of the whole thing

>>105837280 (OP)
Wayland.

>>105844747
>i can't read basic documentation
kys retard

>>105844747
docker uses a system daemon, therefore the images are stored on system available for all users
rtfm

>>105841235
Who cares what retarded indians use?

Why is Docker here? Linux noobs don't even know what Docker or containers are.

>>105845224
because anon thinks that tinkering with hyprland is "advanced usage", and that docker is just something corporate drones use because they are dumb and retarded
aka. Dunning Kruger in full effect

>>105837280 (OP)
I'd trade this fucking Manjaro for Debian. I'm sick of the outdated package bullshit that made me think Linux is trash. Either your packages get bloated just to stay updated, or you have to compile everything yourself because the package maintainers are like lazy Discord mod archetypes

>>105837280 (OP)
It didn't used to be, but now it is

>>105846883
Once you've used linux for a few years and you mature past your distrohopping phrase, you will return to Debian

>>105839732
You're a tech Luddite kid

>>105837280 (OP)
Any 'gaming' distro

>>105846991
Nothing about ubuntu is advanced. Bundling a poorly written amazon app with debian is not advanced. Lobotomizing apt and half-replacing it with snap is a feature no one asked for that provides no value

>>105837280 (OP)
>Virtualbox
So what am i supposed to use?

>>105848075
>Le heckin Amazon
>Le heckin snaps
Get some new material already

>>105837280 (OP)
notice how flatpak shilling drastically decreased?
Simultaniously with Rust shilling.

>>105848197
Why dont you provide some examples of improvements ubuntu offers over debian? Since there are none

>>105840367
That is simply a lie.
Its astonishing how many """people""" are comfortably lying on /g/ nowadays.
Like what is even the purpose of this?
You lie, you know others know that you lie, you know that they will point out that you are lying.

>>105848225
>12 years of support for LTS releases
>Targeted by most 3rd party software, making it as frictionless as possible to get shit running (e.g. ROCm)
>Sane desktop defaults
>GUI apps for updating, configuring update policy etc
>Easy Nvidia driver installation
>Good theming / UX ootb
>Some good features implemented only in Ubuntu (e.g. triple buffering in Mutter before it was merged into GNOME main)
>Option for paid support
>Possible to have same OS for desktop, server, IoT etc
>Containerized applications are first class citizens

>>105848223
They are in process of commercializing flathub, it will take them some time but dont worry in some weeks you will see "random" posts about amazing flatpacks and relentless defense of new monetization features.

>>105837280 (OP)
>It was very popular on Windows until 10, but still easily done until 11
Bullshit, ricing was killed by UWP.

>>105849284
You could provide all of this without making major breaking changes to debian, and just releasing "ubuntu" as a pre-packaged GUI debian with a few included scripts such as setting up nvidia and/or ROCm

>>105849284
NTA but let's got through these one by one
>>12 years of support for LTS releases
yes, having paying costumers does help
>>Targeted by most 3rd party software, making it as frictionless as possible to get shit running (e.g. ROCm)
"ubuntu" packages are .deb files
>>Sane desktop defaults
wrong, it uses Gnome and its shitass file manager
>>GUI apps for updating, configuring update policy etc
as with literally every other distribution, nothing special
>>Easy Nvidia driver installation
source: your ass
>>Good theming / UX ootb
no, again, it uses gnu's object model environment desktop
>>Some good features implemented only in Ubuntu (e.g. triple buffering in Mutter before it was merged into GNOME main)
beta testing backported upstream; good job on learning how software development works
>>Option for paid support
yes, true
>>Possible to have same OS for desktop, server, IoT etc
same w every other distro
>>Containerized applications are first class citizens
thats not a good thing

>>105837355
wasn't until I setup i3+polybar that I started really like linux.
using prebuilt DEs always just feels like a windows knockoff and Gnome and KDE are similarly heavy on resources.

>>105846926
This
For every
>"omg I can't believe linux is so simple and easy, I'm never going back to windows!"
There are two
>"holy shit, linux is so ugly and outdated, and why does it have micro stutters in 2025? I'm done"

>>105837280 (OP)
> decide to try flatpak
> project has portable linux binary, so i know it should be around 300MB
> flathub ref file, turns it into 7 flatpaks
> size 3600MB
> drops the files in /var ~/var

>>105850618
Its amazing how we went from
>dynamic linking will save us all huge amounts of space and save devs the burden of managing all their own dependencies
to
>every app should bundle an entire OS because hello world has 10000 dependencies and they cant all possibly be an acceptable version

>>105837280 (OP)
>Virtualbox
>noob trap
You are retarded, your opinion is irrelevant just as your existence.

>>105850848
>drivers so bad they're out of tree still
ya, it's a noob trap.

>>105850668
overengineering and reinventing the wheel every X years is like religion for the fossfags.

>>105850618
>portable linux binary
how portable is portable?

>>105850848
java, guest image, drivers

>Ubuntu
>docker
>be me
>new machine in the lab
>it's going to be a third buildserver because of engineers hopping on the buildservers to bypass the pipeline and grab all threads constantly?
>okay.
>install ubuntu
>setup build env
>docker is part of it because vivado
>add to pipeline
>it just werks
>10 minutes later the first guy remoted into that machine to put his experimental build first
it just works. where is the problem? doxker even has a suprisingly low performance penalty - it's not like you cant just pay your way out of performance issues btw
the time docker saved sure pays for a few more threadrippers

>>105837280 (OP)
i am using ubuntu 24.04 right now, whats wrong with it?

>>105837371
>great for running sketchy software on your machine
just be mindful of flatseal and make sure you understand what you're giving access to.
for instance, if you have device=all, technically your whole /dev is available and you better hope nothing in the flatpak runs as root or you don't have some POSIX ACLs giving your UID access to things you don't want the flatpak to have.

>>105837280 (OP)
Everything about Linux.

>>105850456
The funny thing is that even Windows is less prebuilt than Linux. Linux devs are fucking obsessed with making everything retard-friendly for some reason.

>>105850939
it's ubuntu. you should be asking what's right with this. Fedora is the better distro not burdened by weird Canonical shitware like snaps or badly maintained and forwarded deb's
if it works for you, ok, but throughout my Linux journey, 99% of my Linux problems were directly related to Ubuntu.

Linux Server? oops you picked the wrong kernel package because Ubuntu has some autism about this.
GNOME desktop? oops, old stable, you have a bug that was fixed in the latest GNOME.
Weird GNOME plugins? ya, now you have some stupid dock that shows up on the lockscreen.
lately they've been pulling the: "Oy vey you need to register to get updates" even though they literally just take debian packages and patching and maybe rebuild them with their own CI at best.

>>105850983
also reminder every major enterprisey setting outside of M$ land (Azure too) uses Fedora or EL like distros for a reason:
AWS, Oracle, Redhat (duh).

>>105850863
>>105850899
It works, it's easy to set up (esp network stuff), easy to move machines between different PCs
Much better than KVM for disposable machines that you want to set fast, virt-manager is shit.

>>105850983
>not burdened by weird Canonical shitware like snaps or badly maintained and forwarded deb's
Fedora pushes Flatpaks just as hard, and they work like shit compared to snaps.
I feel like I am taking crazy pills seeing all this praise for Fedora and Flatpak. Snaps are so much better to use. I can drag and drop stuff without it failing silently. I can install cli tools. My binaries don't have to be run with
>flatpak run some.fucking.app
Snaps has channels, so you can choose which release to use, which is easy to do in the software store.

>>105850983
>>105851024
>>105850999
thank you, i am a linux noob, very informational

>>105850931
The problem is testing and debugging anything going wrong is going to be a nightmare. You will never know where your own product's errors end and docker's start. Doing any basic task is going to introduce downtime while you wait for X Y or Z docker command to complete for what should be happening instantaneously. You will end up spending more time learning about docker than on your own product.

>>105850999
>every major enterprisey setting outside of M$ land (Azure too) uses Fedora
??? he is not enterprise that wants the support for 10-15 years for his distro.
Similar argument can me made for Ubuntu being more popular for desktop since every corpo offers its shit for Ubuntu. Go to steam and download the installer, it gives you deb package despite steamos being arch based.

>>105851124
>The problem is testing and debugging anything going wrong is going to be a nightmare

>docker logs your-container
damn, that was really hard

>>105837280 (OP)
why is virtual box a noob trap?
Any noob can use it

>>105837280 (OP)
sandboxed apps are a noob trap, only because they will pick an app that's available but not all features work from the sandbox. that's all you actually said with your post. the rest of the image makes no sense you smooth brain

>>105837280 (OP)
all these retarded game launchers that make a new unique Wine prefix for each and every game you have.
>talk about at least 400MB for each game
>20 windows installed games on library? that's 8GB wasted at least
why?
having a single prefix works, just like having a single Windows 10 installation works.

I get that for some special cases where you want to modify a prefix so much that it will break everything else, ok you make a prefix there,
but for Every Single Game?

that's absolutely bloat + retarded

>>105851175
Thats cool for your toy project running in a single docker container locally. Not cool for massive bloated corporate docker compose spaghetti mess that spins up 15 containers on some random server cluster

>>105851258
In that case you have an observability stack that takes care of that part for you.
What even is this argument?
>docker is bad because too hard to learn
>also docker bad because getting logs from many containers is hard
Can you decide whether you are a complete noob or a working professional?
If the latter, you should have systems in place that gather logs from your applications and stores them in e.g. elasticsearch.

>>105851256
security.

>>105851283
Elasticsearch is possibly the slowest, most bloated, and incomprehensible piece of shit software ever developed. Its not at all surprising that you bounce from one pajeetware to the next

>>105851368
My company has used it for a long time. You don't get to pick your entire tech stack yourself. I don't even know much about it, but I know that our logs go there.
Point being: why are you complaining about logs being hard to get from docker containers if you have opinions about your logging infrastructure? Surely you would have logging covered, and you don't have anything to complain about then?

>>105851256
>all these retarded game launchers
you mean lutris? that's one thing.
>20 windows installed games on library? that's 8GB wasted at least
what's taking up the space? game installers don't usually install components to the system they just ship with tons of dlls in their root folder. so they aren't shared even on windows. if you're installing additional dependencies yourself that should generally not be nescessary anymore.

>>105851395
im complaining about actual retards like (you) that spend 10 hours doing a task that takes 15 minutes because the actual code they are working on is hidden behind 20 layers of abstraction which you admit to NOT EVEN UNDERSTANDING HOW IT WORKS >>I don't even know much about it, but I know that our logs go there.
You are a parasite building nothing but job security through abstraction hell

>>105851457
lutris, legendary, and some other one for gog that I had tried
they are all certified for noobs,

I just download and run my games manually
I have one 64bit prefix on `~/.wine` and that's it, all games work on there just fine.
win95 GDI, opengl, directx7, directx12, vulkan, everything,
if a game needs some DLL files I just put then in the game folder and do WINEDLLOVERRIDES manually on a script.

>>105839557
>>105839572
So much this. I was an arch thinkpad user for years. I switched to a MacBook and productivity increased significantly.