Thread 106186552

>OH MY HECKIN KEANU CHUNGUS IT IS LIKE LE WRITING LE POETRY
>EXECUTION SPEED? CODE MAINTAINABILITY? PORTABILITY? EXPLICIT CONTROL FLOW?
>NO THOSE THINGS ARE EVIL WHITE MAN SCIENCE WE NEED MORE HECKIN ARTISTS THAT FAILED MATH IN PROGRAMMING
How did this shit ever gain the foothold it did?

>>106186552 (OP)
>I can't get hard unless it's statically typed with GoF on an IDE!

>>106186552 (OP)
Your entire point has been made irrelevant by AI and vibe coding. No one cares about prog language quirks anymore.

>metasploit
>obsolete webdev shit
who else uses this lang?
python won
rip perl

>>106186566
Ruby is more OOP than Java and gets design patterned to death you absolute dumbfuck nocoder

>>106186614
>python won
But at what cost?

>>106186614
Jekyll
Mac OS Homebrew
Puppet

Airbnb
Github
Salesforce

Still plenty of use out there.

>but muh it doesn't scale

shut the fuck up

>>106186659
Python and Ruby fulfill basically the same purpose but Python understands that it is ultimately an engineer tool, and that giving programmers 804829 ways to do the same thing leads to horrendous code quality and with it degrading product quality. Zen of Python >>>>>>>>>> Perl/Ruby hippie nonsense.

>>106186679
Hugo >>>>> Jekyll
Any Linux or BSD package manager >>>>> Mac OS Homebrew
Ansible >>>>> Puppet and Chef
As for the others, corposlop can be built in anything and succeed with another VCs throwing money at it. Shit people build things entirely in JS now, doesn’t make it a good idea.

>>106186697
>Golang

Only agreed on Ansible being top, because it's true. Wrong on all other accounts.

>>106186659
rip perl golf wizards
now pythonjeets
things just get gayer with time

>>106186682
>but Python understands that it is ultimately an engineer tool, and that giving programmers 804829 ways to do the same thing leads to horrendous code quality
Are we talking about the same language? Businesses that have been using python for years currently have half their string interpolation done with fstrings; the other half is done with .format (which only happened because someone made the junior replace all instances of interpolation done with + around python 3.4)
Of course there's an obligatory directory where every script continues to use the old % syntax (which runs in a venv with ancient vendored crypto because building python's crypto library depends on a working rust, lmao).
There's also a single file in production, but not in git, written by an Indian contractor who really liked Template.substitute.
Unless you're writing R6RS, linters are the only way you're going to get 10 people to write code the same way. And that's without asking "who cares?". The current trend is to write shit Python, see if anyone buys your shit service, then rewrite everything in Go/Typescript/Rust (chosen entirely on what articles were at the top of hackernews over the last 30 days).

>>106186552 (OP)
>How did this shit ever gain the foothold it did?
How old are you?

Ruby exploded during the peak Java EE OOP delusion, when the Gang of Four was absolute gospel and every Serious Enterprise Java jeet thought preprocessing templated XML was a good way to configure applications. This is when UML was a serious topic, people still used inheritance, etc. etc.

Suddenly RoR pops out of nowhere and teams of like three hipster millennials and one Gen X boomer are bringing shit to market faster than entire fucking multi-billion dollar corpos.

It gained foothold because it was BETTER you fucking zoomer. This is pre-Java 8, pre-generics Java, XML soup Enterprise JavaAbstractFactoryBean era.

You can shit on Rails, Ruby now, in 2025, but web dev was fucking horrendous back then. Also, Python didn't do shit, it was Node, the propaganda behind Node ("it's web scale!"), middle management's desire to subvert the labor market and put JS on the backend to make developers more interchangable, and a general shift to the microservice meme that killed Rails.

Anyone feel like LISP was the old testament and Raku/do is an attempt at a new testament but it just turned into a tower of Babel cause I feel like that, as someone who used to really like Perl and perl and even contributed to Rakudo but now can't be bothered to code anything at all anymore because it's all already there even if it's wasteful with regards compute and comprehension and documentation and so on. Maybe we should be using LLMs to write documentation instead of code? Or maybe that's just another way to make it all more stupid again, who can tell at this point.

>>106186552 (OP)
I 'member back when it was still on top. it was like this mass hysteria, and off-the-scale shilling. now barely anyone talks about it. I am pretty sure rust will face similar fate.

I used to be into ruby, then I embraced the simplicity of go

>>106186682
>. Zen of Python >>>>>>>>>> Perl/Ruby hippie nonsense.
It's true. This is also why Python beats all homoiconic languages like LISP and Prolog.

my business runs on rails

>>106186552 (OP)
Calm your tits.

>>106186552 (OP)
It's comfy. I liked it. I'm sad it's gone. It's not good for any massive project, or any personal project I was interested in, but I had a Rails job back in 2014 and it was a pretty cozy job. It's a comfy language for wagie-cagie-ing shit.

>>106186552 (OP)
Ruby has a fun syntax. It's a cool scripting tool, like Lua. For actual coding and webdev? Oh boy

>>106188134
But muh Paul Graham

>>106189715
When Paul Graham wrote his essay, he was talking specifically about startups with programmers that actually gave a shit about their output. Nowadays every business has some south-asian-written "code" that everyone else has to deal with, and they sure as hell can't be trusted with homoiconicity or language flexibility. If you think of the main outsource languages, they usually have guarantees to reduce the shit code automatically: Python *tries* to have one way to do anything (they've gotten looser on this and have suffered for it), Java *forces* you to at least think about how you are catching all exceptions. I think Rust will be a good contender for jeetsourcing because if the code compiles at all then a lot of things must have been checked by the jeetcoder to make it work.

>>106190421
A stirring analysis. What would you consider to be harder-to-jeetsource languages?

>>106186552 (OP)
their community kidnapped web-application jobs with rails.
Then they started building whole companies based on the rails doctrine https://rubyonrails.org/doctrine.
But when times changed, and startups demanded for scalability, innovation and software outside B2B shit is when ruby started losing popularity and CTOs got more aware that was a meme-language infiltrated.
As a warning, that next language is Elixir, even if elixir is a good niche language for some concurrent tasks. These retards are trying to force it everywhere.

>>106191240
BEAM makes sense for an api gateway though. I wish Erlang had gotten the mindshare instead of elixir, but the underlying platform is a substantially better fit for a web server than Ruby, Python etc.

>>106186652
>Ruby is more OOP than Java and gets design patterned to death you absolute dumbfuck nocoder

"Some may say Ruby is a bad rip-off of Lisp or Smalltalk, and I admit that. " -- Matz

>>106187708
>How old are you?
>Ruby exploded during the peak Java EE OOP delusion, when the Gang of Four was absolute gospel and every Serious Enterprise Java jeet thought preprocessing templated XML was a good way to configure applications. This is when UML was a serious topic, people still used inheritance, etc. etc.
>Suddenly RoR pops out of nowhere and teams of like three hipster millennials and one Gen X boomer are bringing shit to market faster than entire fucking multi-billion dollar corpos.
>It gained foothold because it was BETTER you fucking zoomer. This is pre-Java 8, pre-generics Java, XML soup Enterprise JavaAbstractFactoryBean era.
>You can shit on Rails, Ruby now, in 2025, but web dev was fucking horrendous back then. Also, Python didn't do shit, it was Node, the propaganda behind Node ("it's web scale!"), middle management's desire to subvert the labor market and put JS on the backend to make developers more interchangable, and a general shift to the microservice meme that killed Rails.

Based. This is all true,

but Ruby is still a very inferior product compared to the OG stuff (Smalltalk)

>>106188134
>It's true. This is also why Python beats all homoiconic languages like LISP and Prolog.

Ah, found the guy who only knows Python.

If you had any relevant experience with Lisp you would write "Lisp", "Common Lisp", but not "LISP". Gotcha!

>>106186552 (OP)
perlmonks was a bit hard to understand in the early 00s. then ruby comes along and is a more lightweight and powerful seeming scripting lang that could yield and had good oop.

the landscape was different then, and ruby was fresh.

>>106191931
What do you think smalltalk is?

>>106187719
sell me on Raku. I know Clojure/Common Lisp and have written my own Forths/Lisps.

>>106186552 (OP)
I know nothing about Ruby, but you described Perl perfectly.

>>106192808
Ruby is heavily inspired by Perl, makes sense.

>>106193034
Ruby is more inspired by Lisp/Smalltalk than anything.

>>106193066
I agree, but Perl woild be the next biggest influence. Ruby inherits most of its under-the-good text processing straight from perl

>>106187708
>pre-generics Java
So modern java?

>>106186652
Ironic shitposting is still shitposting newfag-kun.

>>106193034
Perl might just be the most Reddit language in existence.

>>106186614
>rip perl
I actually quite like perl, it's good for simple stuff.

>>106192126
Like perl but slower and your old perl scripts wont work.
Bruce Grey is a great wizard tho.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSP_GgcHQ0Q

>>106191955
I don't bother writing much lisp because I already know prolog. Since every sufficiently complex lisp program has a bug-ridden and half-baked implementation of prolog, I thought I'd just cut out the middle man.

>>106190758
>A stirring analysis. What would you consider to be harder-to-jeetsource languages?
Any language that is flexible is terrible to outsource because jeets will find ways to fuck it up. So homoiconic languages (lisp, prolog, and to an extent R) are right out, but also languages that have multiple ways to do things like C++ and Perl. C no way because that gives too much power to the jeet to blow everything up.
Ironically, Javascript is *terrible* as a language for outsourcing, since its weak typing system creates tons of implicit type casts that are difficult to debug after the fact. However, since it's the highest demand language a lot of businesses will try to outsource it anyway. They can *kinda* get away with this on the frontend since it's easier to identify when something is wrong on the frontend. But this is more a half-exception. Still, if you're going to jeetsource frontend work then it should really be through a declarative framework or typescript-enforced.

Basically:
rigidity and static analysis -> good for jeetsourcing
flexibility, power, and trust -> bad for jeetsourcing

>EXECUTION SPEED?
Languages have tradeoffs. Not everything will be fast. Ruby focuses on rapid prototyping capabilities, and programmer satisfaction (which is important in preventing burnout). If you want a language that has most of the benefits of Ruby, but runs faster, the Crystal programming language may be more for you.
>CODE MAINTAINABILITY?
Ruby isn't difficult to maintain.
>PORTABILITY?
It runs wherever the interpreter runs. And it's not difficult to port the interpreter. It is possible to use platform-specific features, but those aren't something most people are going to reach for. You aren't going to run into portability issues unless you need something on a specific platform to begin with.
>EXPLICIT CONTROL FLOW?
We have if, while, for, and all your other friends. We even have goto if you compile the interpreter with OPT_SUPPORT_JOKE set to 1. What's the problem?

>>106195678
>If you want a language that has most of the benefits of Ruby, but runs faster, the Crystal programming language may be more for you.
or you could just use Common Lisp with SBCL.

>>106186682
python won because it was more accessible to normalniggers thougbeit, the trick was to make whitespace matter so that the code had to look more orderly to work, without also including any sort of visible syntax that scares them off.

>>106195841
>the trick was to make whitespace matter so that the code had to look more orderly to work
Yes this is a killer feature of Python's that I wish all languages would adopt.

>>106196610
it's very good training wheels, but you could achieve the same with an IDE/Editor bitching whenever your code looks like whatever it's been told is considered ugly. Ultimately it is not worth being stuck with every other way that python is retarded.

>>106186590
AI can't write Rust or C++. Digusting axe wound trannies and cnile boomer old men won.

>>106196610
>completely fucks with REPL friendliness
you understand that autoformatters exist, right?

>>106186682
>but Python understands that it is ultimately an engineer tool, and that giving programmers 804829 ways to do the same thing leads to horrendous

Thank, you have just confirmed you are not an engineer.

>>106192047
>What do you think smalltalk is?

What do you mean?

>>106195762
>or you could just use Common Lisp with SBCL.

Based.

>>106193066
>Ruby is more inspired by Lisp/Smalltalk than anything.

Without any of the things that make Lisp or Smalltalk great.

>>106192126
>I know Clojure/Common Lisp

Then you don't need stinkin' Raku. Keep being awesome.

>>106186652
>and gets design patterned to death

You will be dissapointed when you grow and find out that this is a BAD thing, not a good thing.

>>106186552 (OP)
Ruby is Python for people who think they're too clever for Python, but never are, which means they aren't clever enough to realize when they should be doing something else.

>>106197056
No shit sherlock, context clues aren’t your strong suit are they?

Don't most people using this run the JVM implementation now? It was like 10 times faster and actually multithreaded last time i checked.

>>106196900
It blew my mind that a language lauded for its supposed gain in development time (still?) provides a REPL completely inept at dealing with indentation levels. Testing functions or specific block of instructions in the REPL is hell, and the module system doesn't even provide a way to do that easily (importlib.reload is a hack)

>>106195841
>the trick was to make whitespace matter so that the code had to look more orderly to work
if that's what you honestly believe, you're a retard.
if you honestly believe that, you're a retard. it won because it's dynamic, strongly typed, a good stdlib, and "the zen of python" is a good philosophy. simplicity is king
>>106197020
I am. confirmed you're a faggot

>>106198082
based. this

>>106186552 (OP)
Who are you quoting?

I like Ruby because it was made in Japan and that makes it superior to other things

>>106195678
>>PORTABILITY?
>It runs wherever the interpreter runs. And it's not difficult to port the interpreter. It is possible to use platform-specific features, but those aren't something most people are going to reach for. You aren't going to run into portability issues unless you need something on a specific platform to begin with.
this is basically a non-issue now with containers

>>106186552 (OP)
The reason UN bans landmines is because of ruby https://jpcamara.com/2025/08/02/the-o-in-ruby-regex.html

>>106196774
>AI can't write Rust
?
It can.

>>106186552 (OP)
I like the logo

>>106198154
>>106198154
>>Thank, you have just confirmed you are not an engineer.
>I am. confirmed you're a faggot
>it won because it's dynamic, strongly typed, a good stdlib, and "the zen of python" is a good philosophy. simplicity is king

lol "engineer"

more like a script kiddie

and lol at python "being strongly typed". See the attached pic? Now "engineer" tell us how where the "strong typing" went. I think it went up your ass.

>>106198082
>Ruby is Python for people who think they're too clever for Python, but never are, which means they aren't clever enough to realize when they should be doing something else.

+100

This defines the average Ruby user perfectly.

RUBY RUBY RUBY RUBY
DO YOU DO YOU DO YOU DO YOU

>>106201576
Gen alpha, doesn't even know what script language is..