Thread 106584210

Coping faggots always use the exact same word "powerful" when describing LibreOffice. But that's a complete fucking lie. You know what _would_ be powerful? Being able to make a fucking bibliography in whatever format you want. Being able to have in-text citations (again, in whatever format you want) and have them automatically update upon modifying the bibliography entries would also be powerful. Being able to scroll with a touch screen would be powerful. Actual Wayland support would be powerful. Having some proper theming support so it doesn't have to look like Office 95 would, again, be powerful. Correct header/footer spacing would be powerful, but this is unfortunately STILL an issue. And of course, any sort of collaboration would be powerful.

And despite it all, LibreOffice is sadly the best FOSS office suite, because OnlyOffice is a fucking Chromium webapp and the devs have admitted they will never solve the slow document loading and saving:
https://community.onlyoffice.com/t/loading-any-file-takes-a-rather-long-time/4205/2
https://community.onlyoffice.com/t/desktop-editor-how-to-load-new-documents-faster/1289/3
>Sorry, there’s no way to change this behaviour. Our goal is continuous improvement of Desktop Editors, however, this delay in opening the file is a part of the way how it works.
kek

>>106584210 (OP)
Isn't this software open source? You could make all those changes instead of complaining that someone else hasn't done it

>>106584293
OP already made a pull request to remove CoC and got banned

>>106584210 (OP)
What about Calligra

>>106584532
Retarded UI, even worse formatting issues, and doesn't have any functionality at all. Genuinely worse than Wordpad.

>>106584210 (OP)
>Being able to scroll with a touch screen would be powerful.
midwit normgroid detected, opinion discarded.

>>106584210 (OP)
How much did you pay for Libre Office?

>>106584812
The same price I paid for Microsoft Office, $0

>>106584629
>have laptop with touch screen
>use it
Problem?

>>106585001
use case for not using keybinds?someone so concerned with efficiency just casually removes their hands from the touch typing position?

>>106585042
Because I don't care

>>106584293
This is why people hate FOSS.
>oh you think your car is shit? why don't you just make your own car?
Fuck you and fuck people like you you goddamned cunt.

>>106585065
It's so sad too when so many great software is FOSS yet a simple fucking text editor can't work properly.

>>106585065
>This is why people hate FOSS.
That and their flagship product gimp.

>>106585084
GIMP is only hated by baby ducks. That said, if Krita works better for Photoshop users then it should probably be recommended more often.

>>106585094
>GIMP is only hated by baby ducks
Kek do you wanna bet on that?

>>106585065
>get free car
>proceeds to sperg and file complaints to the manufacturer that you don't like it

>>106584812
>How much did you pay for Libre Office?
$0.00 and it's worth every penny.

>>106585094
Any editor other than GIMP works better for just about any user.

>>106585118
There is a point where something is worth less than nothing, where you have to put in more effort to use something than it'd take to earn the money for the paid option.
In that sense LibreOffice is worth less than nothing. At least a pen and paper doesn't have GC stutters.

>>106584210 (OP)
Ok and you're comparing to what? Microsoft Office? Because neither is that good. They're a do it all but all poorly office suits.

>>106585082
Honestly it isn't too bad until you have to interface with M$ users and Redmond's xml fuckery. I'll take Writer over Word any day of the week BUT office drone software is not an island.


>>106585118
>>proceeds to sperg and file complaints to the manufacturer that you don't like it
That was OP, not me. But why offer the canned impotent response of, "Just build it yourself". Some people want to just have a tool that works, they don't want to make a tool or deal with tools like yourself.

>>106585157
MS Office has proper formatting + Office 2007 was a lot prettier than LibreOffice

>>106585094
>GIMP is only hated by baby ducks.
GIMP can't into CMYK

>>106585148
sounds like you cry a lot for something you dont have to use if you dont want to
>This car I willingly chose and got for free has negative value
Dont use it
>They should pay me to use it
Literally just dont use it

>>106585065
its not like those dudes are getting paid to do this

>>106585190
Are you this particular thread's low-quality FOSS apologist?

>>106585148
>At least a pen and paper doesn't have GC stutters.
CALC is a four letter word.

>>106585173
You can change the look and feel if libre office to look like Microsoft office and I don't know what you mean by proper formating but you can also set formating for the entire document and it will update automatically in libre office. I don't think you're aware of the actual problems of these office suits. The biggest problem is neither is very precise. Latex, markdown, asciidoc and friends do a much better job than word tools in having consistent formatting and there are dedicated spreadsheet tools that do a better job than either libreoffice or Microsoft office. Most of the time you don't even want a spreadsheet, you want a database.

>>106585201
They do https://www.libreoffice.org/donate/

>>106585148
Well that's your perfect valid, personal experience with it, and you are encourage to use a tool that better fulfills yours needs
frankly I don't like libreoffice either, I'm thankful for not having to deal with it, and even though an office suite is not part of my work, I can also see how bad it is. but yelling at volunteers is quite pointless if you're not willing to spend the effort

>>106585220
>I don't know what you mean by proper formating
LibreOffice doesn't know how big a header and footer should be. When I load an MS Word document in Writer, text that SHOULD fit within Page 1 now put on the start of Page 2 because the header and footer are suddenly too fucking fat on LibreOffice.

>>106585253
Lol you can't even format your own comments and you're expecting libreoffice to do a good job? Anyway yeah you can do that, you just didn't find out how. You can even set dark mode if you want. It doesn't look very good though.

>>106585279
You're mixing Microsoft file format with Libreoffice and you're expecting consistent formating? Libreoffice format of ODT not DOCX. You're not going to get it and you've found out one problem with these tools, exactly what I was talking about, they're not precise enough. Neither Microsoft or Libreoffice have precise formating and you'll never get it. Use latex if you want that, or markdown if you don't need much features, or asciidoc for an in-between.

>>106585220
>You can change the look and feel if libre office to look like Microsoft office.
No you can't, because you can't change the colour (or set gradients) of every little thing, and you can't even set a custom image as the background; they only let you use their shitty predefined bitmaps as backgrounds. I'd love to use an Office 2007 background on LibreOffice, but there's no file dialog to choose your own file.
>>106585281
>and you're expecting libreoffice to do a good job?
Yes.
>Anyway yeah you can do that
No you can't; otherwise, the Office 2003 theme you can install from within LibreOffice would have all the gradients from Office 2003.

>>106585065
If you miss a feature you could put a bounty on it. Or just straight up pay someone to program it and put in a pull request. But somehow people who use FOSS also believe everything should be gratis, including other people's labor.

>>106585315
>You're mixing Microsoft file format with Libreoffice and you're expecting consistent formating? Libreoffice format of ODT not DOCX
Works with Google Docs and OnlyOffice.
>Libreoffice format of ODT not DOCX
Dude, the problem isn't the filetype. Opening both file formats in both office suites will produce the same errors, because LibreOffice's own internal logic has an unorthodox way of interpreting the dimensions of headers and footers. This can be instantaneously proven by opening a blank document in LibreOffice and filling the header. Why is the header so fucking big? Why?
>Neither Microsoft or Libreoffice have precise formating
I don't care about defining the millimetre bullshit myself; LibreOffice should fix its header logic.

>>106585383
>Why is the header so fucking big? Why?
Moreover, why is the header text all the way down there? Don't you agree it should be raised a little more, as well as greyed out?

>>106585332
You're talking about menu backgrounds right? That's a GTK problem. Notice libreoffice looks similar to other GTK applications. It's using GTK3 in fact and whatever theme you have will also be in libreoffice. You can put a gradient in GTK3 theme. Also you're not using the menu you want. There's an option to copy modern Microsoft style menu.

>>106585065
Stop whining and buy an MS Office key or usb to MS365. You get what you pay for.

>>106585383
Because you are using the default header settings. You can change that if you want. It has to do with file format because there are options in ODT that don't exist in DOCx and vice-versa. DOCx is more ambiguous btw.

Sounds to me like this is a lack of skill problem. Yes libreoffice could be more user friendly but I don't think Microsoft office is very user-friendly either.

>>106585414
Anon, it has nothing to do with GTK, and everything to do with the fact you only get a predetermined list of background images to choose from in a drop-down menu. Where is my option to pick MY OWN image? I'd like to use the Office 2007 application background but can't. Furthermore, I'm running LibreOffice through Qt, so this is all irrelevant.
>modern Microsoft style menu
I'm not talking about Ribbon, mate.

>>106585450
>Because you are using the default header settings
NOOOOO, you are not fucking understanding it mate! The so-called "Page Style" is baked into the fucking file and preserved in the file even when saving between different office suites. This is all to say that the "default header settings" cease to be relevant the moment I open an existing file.

The issue that LibreOffice's internal maths has NO FUCKING CLUE how to interpret these values. New document, existing document, it makes no difference; they're equally FUCKED.

Do you know what happens if you open a Word document in LibreOffice, notice that the headers are fucked, and then manually change the headers WITHIN LibreOffice? Your document is going to be completely FUCKED when you load it again in Microsoft Office, because now the headers have been overcorrected in the opposite direction.
>there are options in ODT that don't exist in DOCx
What the fuck are you talking about? You can resize headers in Microsoft Office.

Want a refund?

>>106585001
>he put his greasy fried chicken finger all over his screen
U nasty nigga

If you're running Office 2007 or newer, you're cucked and an inch away from no longer being white.

>>106585253
>cant even quote
cringe

>>106584210 (OP)
ITT, Midwit cannot figure out basic formatting or the difference of file types.

Literally the type of idiots Microsoft advertises to, just pay the stupid people tax already. The only smart people using Microsoft are getting it for free from work.

>>106585065
>>106584830
Its damned near impossible to make money off of software that isn't a video game. People will just pirate anything you make. Making any kind of anti-piracy system just seems exhausting and I'm really not in the mood to listen to mindless platitudes about muh freedumbs. You guys build huge networks of websites to hoard information and that's fine. I support data hoarding but I also support paying working people.

Little software development shops don't have disposable income like Metallica does. We can't sue every stay at home mom that takes our work without giving anything in exchange. Adobe realizes this and now all of their software is in the cloud. This is the way that companies have decided to protect their software. They will not allow you to run their software locally. Its impossible to fight the guys that steal software so we have to be like a CVS in a shitty neighborhood where even the baby formula and tampons are locked up.

I support free and open source software but developers need to eat. No one can implement anything anywhere without paying the electricity bill.

I would start a business and quit my job IN A HEARTBEAT if people were willing to pay for Linux support. I could definitely see myself as creating something like Canonical but on a much smaller scale. The only people that pay for support are businesses so all the solutions are tailored to enterprise.

Software developers like me are tired of working for corporations. Many of us would be happy to start small businesses and one of the biggest markets are small office, home office, and regular desktop users.

Even if I could only charge $10 per month people would compare it to their Netflix subscription and say that it isn't worth the money.

So do it yourself.

I use only office because I can't be bothered to fuck with the formatting bullshit that takes place

>>106586664
if you use ODF, there's no formatting bullshit. granted, if you interact with files from other people, you're gonna have that problem anyway (since nobody uses ODF). i think the best solution is to use MS Office for maximum compatibility with OOXML, but use ODF wherever possible, so you get maximum compatibility with every office suite.

>>106584210 (OP)
Just get the Microsoft 365 subscription with a gb of cloud drive, and never deal with poor fag options again.

>>106586654
>I support free and open source software but developers need to eat. No one can implement anything anywhere without paying the electricity bill
this is not a problem of free software but of modern soceity and its endless greed. feel free to call me a commie but agriculture has been solved for over 10 thousand years there is absolutely no reason anyone should have to work for food. and free software is proof that people will work without global finance prodding cattle into the pen.

>>106586877
I hear you, dude. I love thinking about alternatives and different economic models but this is THE NOW.

And right now we all have bills to pay. Its not at some imagined point in the future. Its RIGHT NOW.

You can blame it on society or whatever else you want, that is beside the point. If we don't get paid, we won't work.

At least come up with an alternative currency so we can at last buy groceries, I mean damn. Give us something. We're not slaves. I can't eat platitudes about the economic system. What do I have to do to get freetards to understand? Do I need to become a hobo with a "will code for food" sign?


>free software is proof that people will work without global finance prodding cattle into the pen.
People will work on free software because their other needs are met. People will work on ANYTHING if it means that they get to eat. Those who are able to work but unwilling will not eat is not a bad rule. Money implements that rule. The people working on free software are either paid to work on free software by the companies that employ them or they are a project that corporations deem important enough to give sizeable donations to. Either way, money makes it happen.

I understand exactly what you're saying but right now I don't have a way to get the resources I need to live without money. Not to mention that if you want free software to remain free, there have to be more people working on it. What happens if Linus Torvalds is compromised and starts to put backdoors in software because the state forced him to?

Then you would want a fork and I'm not saying that it wouldn't happen. I'm saying that it would happen a lot more quickly and smoothly with more people ABLE to participate in the effort.

I wish software developers would unionize but the pajeets fucked things up for Americans.

Pages is better in any possible way

>>106584210 (OP)
>Being able to make a fucking bibliography in whatever format you want. Being able to have in-text citations (again, in whatever format you want) and have them automatically update upon modifying the bibliography entries would also be powerful. Being able to scroll with a touch screen would be powerful
does ms office have these features? Sounds to me you need to use some kind of markdown/latex editor instead. The only thing I hate is slow spreadsheet and the shitty presentation app.

>>106587263
>Write very basic text editor in C
>Common Lisp plugin system.
>Implement all the core functionality in CLISP.
>Let people use the editor for free.
>Let them make extensions for free.
>Charge for support and custom-made extensions.

And no one will pay because muh freedumbs. I can guarantee that the text editor will not steal or catalogue any of your shit. No one will pay for it.

So open source becomes corpo source.

>>106587263
>does ms office have these features?
Yes MS Office has had proper bibliographies for as long as I can remember

>>106586580
>difference of file types
LibreOffice fags ALWAYS say this as a defence, when it is completely irrelevant (>>106585556)

>>106586793
>if you use ODF, there's no formatting bullshit
It has nothing to do with the file type and everything to do with LibreOffice's internal maths: >>106585400 >>106585556

>>106588120
>poor + low IQ
didn't read.

>>106588302
Wat.

>>106585065
>Hotrodders that made their cars better is why people hate Hot rods and muscle cars
Have you accepted the fact you're probably just retarded?

>>106586654
I didn't pirate MS Office, though. I got a student licence when I was in high school and have been using it since.

>>106584373
the devs already removed their CoCs

>>106588388
Hotrodders tune their car for a specific purpose. FOSStards tune their software to chug and crash. Believe it or not but some people just want something that works out of the box without dealing with scraped knuckles or insufferable cunts.

>>106589531
I thought Dr. Shekelbergstein did that for them.

>>106584210 (OP)
>https://community.onlyoffice.com/t/desktop-editor-how-to-load-new-documents-faster/1289/3
Is that a fucking tim buckley avatar? what the actual fuck

>>106589670
KEK

>>106584210 (OP)
> https://community.onlyoffice.com/t/desktop-editor-how-to-load-new-documents-faster/1289/3
>> Is there a way I can get the new document loaded in a snap without waiting for 1-2seconds.
its like a solid 3mins for me for a small spreadsheet. Meanwhile gnumeric opens it instantly but then messes with the encoding and shit. I wish gnumeric wasn't such a pain in the ass to build otherwise I could just fix that.

>>106584210 (OP)
Didn't read. If you don't like it, don't use it. Imagine letting some random office suite take up so much mental space in your head.

>>106591265
>If you don't like it, don't use it
The problem is that on Linux, you HAVE to use it. It remains the best Office suite on Linux despite it all.

>>106591306
Nope, that's not what it means. There are plenty of other word processors and things that you can use.

Install gnumeric

>>106591319
OnlyOffice is unusable due to being JavaScript crap, WPS Office is unusable due to being CCP malware, and Softmaker's stuff manages to not even be as good as LibreOffice which is sad

>>106591334
Your childish reasons for not using alternatives are irrelevant to their functionality. Additionally, these are not the only alternative office suites.

>>106591342
>irrelevant to their functionality
How is OnlyOffice being slow irrelevant to its functionality? How is Softmaker Office lacking LibreOffice's features irrelevant to its functionality?

>>106591346
You didn't mention any of those previously. I'm not going to continue this discussion since you're not arguing in good faith and you just want to complain.

>>106591359
>You didn't mention any of those previously
"JavaScript crap" was specifically mentioned in my reply to you, as well as elaborated upon in the OP (you did read the OP before replying to it, right?).
"Softmaker's stuff manages to not even be as good as LibreOffice which is sad" is also self-explanatory. Don't you dare accuse me of not arguing in good faith.

>>106586521
Sounds like an American issue.

this was the peak unless you need cloud and collaborative features

Yeah LibreOffice sucks ass. Good thing office suites are for the goyest of goyim, pure golem software. Actual humans with souls use LaTeX or markdown.
>b-but muh wagie job
Shut up golem, go back to making spreadsheets and playing excel-like games (e.g. civilization) in your free time while chad fucks your wife like you never could

>>106585148
>There is a point where something is worth less than nothing,
Troonix users wont get this. See also wine and protroon.

>>106592009
Proton is great though

>>106585556
>>106588132
>Do you know what happens if you open a Word document in LibreOffice, notice that the headers are fucked, and then manually change the headers WITHIN LibreOffice? Your document is going to be completely FUCKED when you load it again in Microsoft Office, because now the headers have been overcorrected in the opposite direction.
If by "Word document" you mean a .docx file, then that's not what I'm talking about at all. I'm talking about creating an .odt file with Word, then editing it with Writer. Or creating an .odt file with Writer and then editing it with Word. Have you actually tried that? In my experience the formatting stays consistent.

>>106585383
>This can be instantaneously proven by opening a blank document in LibreOffice and filling the header. Why is the header so fucking big? Why?
That's not proof of anything except Writer and Word having different defaults for margins. Again, try creating new sample ODT files, then see if the margins change when you open them in the other program.

>>106594067
>Have you actually tried that?
Yes.
>different defaults for margins
I'm telling you, it's strictly, 100%, exclusively and only a problem with how LibreOffice INTERPRETS the dimensions of headers/footers.

New document, existing document, docx, odt, it makes no difference; they're equally FUCKED.

>>106594082
Can't believe you actually made me download Libreoffice onto my Windows machine to test this. The only difference that I can see in my anecdotal example that I just whipped up, is that the footer in writer is aligned to the top, instead of middle like everything else. But that does not affect the rest of the page formatting in any way. I even edited the document several times with different program each time, nothing changed. So far, either I've been lucky enough to not hit the issue you're describing either now or back when I was studying, or you're actually talking about issues relating to rendering and editing DOCX files in different office suites (which I'm well aware of) and you're just not realising it.

>>106585065
>comparing physical manufacturing with some lines of code
LMAO

>>106594448
Same document. MS Office on top and LibreOffice on bottom.

>>106595062
clearly a different font being rendered. i think there's an option to embed the font into the document. you could try and figure out why it's not loading or you can also pick a font that's available in both instances.

>>106595134
It's Aptos in both

>>106595279
my brother in Christ
have a look at the Q and the J and tell me that's the same font.
fonts generally don't get embedded into documents, so if they're not available on the target system for whatever reason, a "similar" font gets rendered instead. as for why it's not available, i don't know, but this has nothing to do with cross-compatibility between editors, because the same thing will happen on the same editor just on a different system.

>>106595323
Says Aptos on both programs. But setting it to Arial does fix it. Maybe LO doesn't know how to deal with Microsoft fonts?

>>106595341
For the record I've installed Aptos straight from Microsoft's website