Thread 17846004

Why has there never been a communist revolution in America?

>>17846004 (OP)
Read Werner Sombart

America has no need to silence dissenters. It just gives them a megaphone and turns their protests into entertainment that can be later remixed and sold for profit

The only time working conditions in America have ever actually been bad enough to be on the brink of a workers revolt was during the Gilded Age and early 20th century, nowadays it's just a bunch of tankie retards schizoposting on social media about how they never touch grass

People like owning things and trading them when and how they want to.

any actual communist threats were beaten or imprisoned by the fbi or cia. the left are no longer a threat, at most they will advocate for social democracy of the bernie, aoc, zohran type. The left had no answers to the 2008 crash, there is no popular Maoism or Leninism. only, as i said, soc dems.

>>17846015
Pretty much

>>17846014
wrong, during the great depression the american bourgeoise were so scared of being double teamed by commies or fascists that they relented and let fdr win and let him implement all the socialist crap

>>17846015
but most people don't get to own anything substantial under capitalism and America's only getting worse in that regard

>>17846004 (OP)
Same reason there's never been a natsoc movement in the US. They love libertarian philosophy too much. They'll let you kill minorities and pay lip service to "the White race" but as soon as you try to implement any real economic or social policy they'll lynch you.

>>17846004 (OP)
America has never been as big of a shithole as pre-revolution China and Russia and likely never will be

>>17846028
The government taxing, regulating and lobbying for copyright infringes on the free market making it harder for small business to thrive. By voting for mixed economy modern parties who want a capitalist system merely keep leeching off it for government programs is creating the exact system which keeps the lower class from creating generational wealth

>>17846035
>and lobbying for copyright
Anon, do you have brain damage? Do you even know what copyright is?

>>17846040
Yeah it's what people use to kill competition for driving up profits i.e. medical patents that are one of the main reasons medicine is so expensive.

>>17846030
i personally feel like americans tend more towards anarchism, at the very least american anarchists have been historically way more active than commies. like uncle ted and sacco and vanzetti

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4xWbRBLj2I&pp=0gcJCdgAo7VqN5tD

>>17846042
???
Anon, patents aren't the same as a copyright, a copyright is automatically granted to any and all orignal works you create, I technically own the copyright to this very post, the degree to which a copyright claim can be defendable simply varies, but if you plan on making anything of value in your miserable life, you WANT to have copyright on it.

>>17846047
Aight, I defined it wrongly. Then I mean patent law. Creative works are different than direct resources, I get that.

dispersed, non-urban population + frontier as a release valve for landless underclass (it's free real estate) as opposed to europe where all available land was claimed centuries ago + individualist yeoman farmer/small business owner/suburban dwelling small time landlord culture

basically the size of the petite bourgeois is big enough and the proletariat is dispersed enough where any working class energy never really gathers into organized class politics. Of course the frontier is done and the petite bourgeois (aka "middle class" in burger parelnce) is shrinking as capital naturally accumulated upwards

>>17846063
>and the petite bourgeois (aka "middle class" in burger parelnce) is shrinking
Naw, only 0.17% of the population of the US is actually homeless (this is the same percentage as China by the way), it's like what >>17846031 said, America will simply never be as big of a shithole as pre-revolution Russia or China, pre-revolution Russia and China (especially China) were unique kinds of dystopian hellscapes

>>17846071
You don't have to be "homeless" you just have to not own the home you live in. Home ownership is the last vestige of wealth for the median American and the main contradiction of that arrangement is that the haves will use every NIMBY trick in the book to keep the have nots from lowing their property values through new development. This just leads to capital being sucked upwards and a growing renter wage slave class

leftoids no longer represent the working class, as the working class has been destroyed through immigration, automation, and outsourcing the factories to china. The leftoid himself is not a worker but a college student or trust funder.

the left have become an over educated elite class that scorns what is left of the working class, and embraces intersectional identity politics combined with social democracy that would alleviate the pain of being an over educated PMC who is no longer needed and works at starbucks to pay off their student loans


if you want the low down on the current situation look up the idea of the "Merchant right” and “Brahmin left

>>17846087
>wahhh the left doesn't hate brown people enough! send more stormtroopers to kidnap random mexicans!
Bring back closed shops and abolish right to work and they can't replace you with immigrants anymore. Sit down strikes would prevent offshoring.

>>17846097
see, you are Brahmin left, you scorn the working class, and offer them nothing, while uplifiting slave labour. this is why the left cant go beyond social democracy, this is why there will be no revolution

>>17846004 (OP)
Commies are just the useful idiots of capitalism and capitalists had no need for commies in the country they ruled with impunity.

>>17846004 (OP)
Amazon warehouses and Walmart pay their employees so poorly they advise them to apply for government assistance while the upper management and executives rake in huge salaries, fuck capitalism, it is time for a change

>>17846011
Good answer.
The worst thing you can do to a dissenter is to treat them like a clown or a cow

>>17846263
Let me guess, you support open borders and don't understand why the job market is so skewed in favor of employers.
Am I correct?

>>17846045
>i personally feel like americans tend more towards anarchism, at the very least american anarchists have been historically way more active than commies. like uncle ted and sacco and vanzetti
I think so. It ties in with the individualism. Even today, there are people who might call themselves communists but they really act like anarchists. Then there are other people who don't call themselves anarchists but act like the historical Sacco and Vancetti types. Like Luigi who shot the healthcare executive. People were making jokes about it, like a guy named Luigi just shot a corporate executive? What is this, 1912? An anarchist group attacked an ICE facility on the 4th of July and wounded a cop. It was like a dozen people and they fucked it up, but weirdly the news was downplayed and the cops were kind of hush-hush about it. Maybe freaked them out and they don't want to draw too much attention to it. I saw some conservatives online bring attention to it because it was the actual out-of-town antifa terror cell that Andy Ngo and those guys have been banging a drum about for years. That's the downside of anarchism, they tend to pop off and do stupid stuff like that.

A lot of our characters have an anarchistic spirit to them. Our most famous fantasy writer before George R.R. Martin was Robert E. Howard who was a highly individualist libertarian type more than anything.

>>17846018
This is the real answer. It's the reason the Frankfurt school was utilized in the states.

>>17846004 (OP)
He figured it out in the early 1800s.

In Europe, all the land was claimed by royal families going back thousands of years, all within confined countries. In America, the land was essentially all up for grabs by anyone, including the poor and illiterate.

>>17846335
>Even today, there are people who might call themselves communists but they really act like anarchists
The other way around as well, some self-proclaimed anarchists don't actually mind state power and political bullying so long as it's heavily left-wing in nature, Antifa for instance

>>17846004 (OP)
Developed/educated nations don't do communism.
Communism is a pipe dream for subsistence farmers.

Also if you look at American protests, you'll notice that a lot of people bring signs which they made themselves. I don't see that when seeing pics or clips of protests in Europe as much. Of course people do that too, but it's more common for people to be holding the same sign made by a union and handed out to their members. We do that too, but Americans love to bring their own signs even when part of a big crowd. Everyone is trying to individually influence the situation and express themselves even when they combine into a big group.
https://youtu.be/F7SNEdjftno

I could never handle being part of a monolithic group like this >>17846004 (OP) for very long. Something inside me would rebel against it. They're all flying the same red flag. But what if I want to bring a blue flag? I like the color blue. Why can't I bring a blue flag? You can't tell me not to bring a blue flag. What the fuck is their problem anyways!?!?!

>>17846263
>VIETNAM: In 2025, the average annual salary in Vietnam is approximately 207,600,000 VND, which is about $8,125.74 USD. The average monthly salary is around 14.9 million VND, or $600 USD. However, these figures can vary significantly based on factors like industry, experience, education, and location

Factory workers in Vietnam work on a zero-hour contract, which means they are sporadically hired and laid off indefinity until demand picks up enough to hire them. They work 6 hour weeks and make on average ~$8 a day. Also, workers in Vietnam cannot legally go on strike. They have to take their grievances to official state run union representatives that will organize a strike for them.

>>17846347
>>17846018
No, that's just retard cope

>>17846364
protest in America are really just a social event a lot of the times. Not to say that the people there dont believe in the cause, but its more like a fun thing to do for them more than anything else. A lot of the American lib-left is LARPing out the Civil Rights marches of the 1960s.

>>17846018
>muh CIA
John Brennan, the former head of the CIA, is an admitted communist. Like he told the the CIA officials he voted for the Communist Party when he first joined and thought they would reject him but they didnt. The CIA was created during WW2 specifically to oppose Nazi Germany and Fascist Italy and they worked with communist at home and abroad to achieve their goals.

The idea that communist never got a fair chance because the big evil CIA stopped them is the most retarded and gayest cope imaginable. Go back to lelddit you band dork faggot.

>>17846363
correct desu
contrary to communist theory desu

The only oppressed underclass that would've wanted it (blacks) were not capable of organizing it, partly by design, partly because they're blacks. You think it's a coincidence that the Civil Rights movement began during the Cold War, at a time when communist paranoia was highest in Washington DC? America's government was leaning hard on European imperial powers to divest their colonies and allow them to democratize before they were flipped in communist revolutions. And there was a similar attempt at home to keep a lid on America's own 5th column, the black population. Drip feed social change to deflate any revolutionary sentiments.

>>17846363
This too. Communism is for third world hicks and delusional western retards.
>Communism brought Shitfuckistan into the modern era! They went from a rotten monarchy to a semi developed nation back in 1957!
Thats wonderful, good for them.

>>17846401
>The only oppressed underclass that would've wanted it (blacks) were not capable of organizing it, partly by design, partly because they're blacks.
requesting that black chick from leftist twitter who said she tried reading Marx, didnt understand it, doesnt care to read through all that shit, and just wants white people to figure it out and to give her more money.

>>17846363
Which goes to show the theoretical basis as conceptualized by Marx is worthless. No country with a developed proletariat ever had a communist revolution.

>>17846004 (OP)
If communism is so good, why hasn't a single trial run ever been successful?

Labor is a market.

If communism provides a better life for workers, it should outcompete capitalism and eat up the supply of labor, even on a small local scale. But this has never happened. Why should communists be given more responsibility if they can't even handle a small collective better than capitalism can?

Answer please, without resorting to wild conspiracy theories.

Why would there be? less than 10 happned worldwide

>>17846435
Commies believe the French Revolution eqiivalent is a predetermined thing to happen in every nook and cranny of the planet

>>17846411
Lol. Pragmatism.

It's an economic demand though. NTA but I do think the blacks have, at times, put together a more radical politics. I mean radical as in a particular tradition distinct from the "progressive" one (which is more middle class and primarly about moral uplift). There is some overlap but they are actually different, and historically in American society the radical tradition has been associated with recent immigrants (at various times) and blacks who have their own communal solidarity to fall back on, and less inured to the force of authority. The "ideology" that manifests in the minds of people doesn't have to be Marxist to be radical, it could be some Hamas-like ideology. But there have been influences of socialism and third-world nationalism among American ghetto blacks:
https://youtu.be/mmo3HFa2vjg

In Russia, there were other revolutionary parties and groups for a long time before the Marxists showed up.

>>17846430
It was successful at industrialization but beyond that it didn't amount to much. The reason Marxists won where they did was because of a desperate need for industrial transformation in large, backwards countries (Russia, China) with feudal backgrounds in the political system, where capitalism wasn't working, and the Marxists were very pro-industrial. So you get an anti-feudal, anti-traditional, pro-industry, anti-capitalist revolution. The domestic capitalists in those places could be more like middlemen while the oil industry was controlled by foreigners (the Brits owned the oil industry in Russia), or the legation cities in China.

>>17846442
Also a bit of American communist history, look at the negro on the sign on the left at 1:18 in that Public Enemy video I linked.
https://youtu.be/6UsarGHjXhk

>>17846004 (OP)
Leftists are weak and cowardly. They were able to steal some countries by riding waves of dissent and then murdering and disarming everyone else. But because America is an actual, real country with great prosperity and where everyone is armed, no system of organized thief-tyranny can ever truly rise here. If they tried, we would simply drag left wing pigs out of their homes, and torture them to death.

What would they do, fight back? No I doubt it. Weaklings never fight back, they try to make others fight back for them. In America anyone who would do the fighting is already one of us. So, we will get to drag Left Wing Pigs out of their homes, and make them watch as we pour molten lead on their childrens' faces, and peel their womens' scalps off, and slide knives up under the jawbones of their daughters, and core their mandibles out like fish.

And then, oh yes, then we will get to torture them, then comes the justice they have long evaded! Imagine the glide of the dermitome down the good little leftist's good little left wing belly, how the fat would bubble up from the folds of his ill-cared for, hideous flesh, how he would scream and shriek and pound his little legs against the restraints as we peel him slowly, like a hand fruit!

Please please please launch your gay little revolution!

>>17846014
>The only time working conditions in America have ever actually been bad enough to be on the brink of a workers revolt was during the Gilded Age and early 20th century
*Laughs in Amazon Warehouse Diaper Porn Movie producer*

1.) The US, being a Christian nation founded on liberalism but before the advent of socialism is Utopian Socialist
2.) this means fundamentally the only thing the establishment cares about is assimilation and keeping the country together
3.) most exploited people were foreigners, even foreigners exploiting foreigners, creating a real disconnect between communist immigrants and natives
4.) not Catholic. Catholic countries are socially retarded and often make the situation worse
5.) a focus on using illegal labor means a focus on labor before it has any rights, you can't complain about working conditions if you're not employed
6.) empiricism, the US, being English, is empiricist and require evidence before they believe something
7.) not even talking about communist activity and just ignoring it
8.) the new left, created by Jews fleeing Soviet Russia, promote social democracy over social revolution in the US
9.) by the time communism resurged in the US it targeted blacks which being an untouchable class made people shrug their shoulders and go about their day

>>17846004 (OP)
These are disgusting vermin, i'ts better to turn them into fertilizer than allow them the right to existence

>>17846299
>"comrades we must plan the revolution, the evils of capitalism tha-"
>"dude, is that a phone?! in the room?!"

>>17846004 (OP)
Strong economy

>>17846636
oh forgot about this, communists only gained power in countries that lost wars

>>17846636
>>17846614
>"i have revised he pamphlets from yesterdays meeting, tomorrow we will rally at the glassworks, I am told- Max, are you paying attention?
>*max eating pretzels*
>"you guys wanna go to a baseball game later?"

>>17846647
>"comrade, we are not here to ingage with capitalist frivolities, the oppressed workers of this nation mus-"
>*victor walks in with a new radio*
>"guys, look what i bought, lets plug it in!"
I could make a skit out of this

>>17846169
Do you even know what a closed shop or a sit down strike are? Be honest. Explain to me in detail how giving ICE 75 billion dollars is doing more for working people than repealing the Taft-Hartley act would. Do you even know what that is?

>>17846807
Any government interference in the market should be repealed, you can have your sit down strike and closed shops and we would be free to scab and outcompete you.

>>17846817
Jesus fucking Christ you whine about immigrant labor and then say it's ok to scab as long as it's white people

The US didn't have a class system like Europe.

>>17846830
The post you responded to was my first one in this thread, not that other tradlarper that thinks whitey is the only one deserving of reciprocal freedom. Please excuse any confusion. Immigration laws are interference in the market as well.

>>17846004 (OP)
1. Larger, more spacious geography that makes organizing more difficult. Rural Americans have different concerns and experiences from urban Americans.

2. The average American sees themselves as self-made hustlers or farmers rather than members of a particular socioeconomic class

3. Communism is seen as too ideological and elitist. Americans generally favor pragmatic solutions to economic grievances under the framework of liberal democracy (such as the New Deal)

>>17846263
fix'd, I'd rather have amazon warehouses than gulags

>NOOO I NEED A NEW DINO HALLOWEEN COSTUME FOR MY FLUFFERINO DOGAROO
>I NEED MY HECKIN' AMAZON PRIME+√-1 > 9000 DELIVERIES
you do not, you could cut out eyes in a sock and your dumb fucking yapping chihuahuas wouldn't know the difference

the US like all New World cunts has if anything a racial rather than a birth-based caste system

>>17846848
now you see in Europe where your place of birth determines your social standing if you're a peasant you can be a millionaire and still a peasant. the lower classes were traditionally taught to obey and show reverence and respect to the ruling class at all times.

>>17847090
There was an almost darwinian selection process for who was desperate enough to come to the US. We got the crazy religious lunatics that will bisect you for Jesus and people that liked the French.

>>17846004 (OP)
A big one that I imagine hasn’t been mentioned yet is that communist revolutions were fomented by outside forces to destabilize enemies. Lenin sent to Russia from Germany and later during the 30s, Nazis funding Trotskyists. America simply wasn’t geopolitically relevant at that time to have others try and overthrow it.

>>17847145
ha ha no the KGB were funding all the 60s radical and antiwar movements everyone knows that

>>17847147
Well I was thinking more pre-45

>>17846263
>Amazon warehouses and Walmart pay their employees so poorly
They literally pay better than any other retail or warehouse jobs though. In my town the average starting hourly wage for a warehouse employee is currently $19.50/h due to inflation / cost of living increases. Amazon fulfillment center in my area start you at $23/h, AND offer you full time right off the bat instead of mandatory part time like virtually all other warehouse jobs.

I've heard Amazon works you really hard, but I wouldn't know cause I've never worked at one of their fulfillment centers. I dunno how bad it really is, or what the benefits are like. My warehouse may not pay as well, but the benefits are pretty good, and they're great about time off and scheduling, which is the main reason I stay on.

>>17846411
The lack of understanding has never stopped the negro from acting without a plan.

>>17846004 (OP)
commies are ultra-gay internationalists
most Americans are incredibly insular and think marxist international struggle is a bunch of bullshit

>>17846004 (OP)
Every person in that pic has an iPhone