Thread 17924963

Happy birthday to the greatest military leader of all time

>>17924963 (OP)
Its not May 1st

>>17924963 (OP)
Interesting, how did it all turn out?

>>17924963 (OP)
>born of the Feast of the Assumption of Blessed Virgin Mary
What did God mean by this?

>>17924986
>heh, and how did the napoleonic wars turn out?
Europe was completely transformed, history became divided into before and after the Napoleonic Wars (and the events that lead to them) while Napoleon himself was cemented as one of the "Greatest Men of All Time."

All this is irrefutable; it is not opinion, just fact. Whether you like or hate him, the lasting legacy he had is undeniable. No Prussian, British, Austrian, or other commander in the conflict comes even close to the level of lasting fame Napoleon had.

Genuinely the only people who seethe about Napoleon are buttblasted britons who hate him having a generally positive reputation or other LARPing internet monarchists who hate him because of video games.

It took SIX coalitions to win, remember. Seven to win entirely.

>>17924986
His system became the standard for Europe while every other faggot that came after him only buried their legacy even further.

>>17925019
>t. copium

Reminder.

>>17924990
Assumption of what!? How many fucking feast days does this bitch need to have? Goddamn.

>>17924963 (OP)
GOD BLESS FRANCE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nKy5pX4VLk

>>17925429
He is.. with millions of africans

>>17925439
No, I meant REAL France

>>17924963 (OP)
Napoleon would get his manlet ass kicked if he tried to invade America btw.

>>17925447
Dumb statement. This is on a list of things that was not possible when Napoleon was alive - also, he had no real interest in colonialism. He saw it ahead of time as not only egregiously immoral but also a big waste of time and money 90% of the time.

Assuming the First French Empire had no continental enemies to worry about if they were able to cross the Atlantic and invade or had a reason to, you're completely wrong. 1812 was a stalemate for both sides; the US Army was not capable of fighting the French Imperial Army in open field. If any American general faced Napoleon in open field at that time not only would there not be the requisite forces to face them in the open ala Borodino or something like that, if they tried they'd be absolutely destroyed. It'd be Bladensburg Races except it'd be the Bladensburg Slaughter.

The United States would put up a fight for sure and the guerilla aspect would be very interesting. I predict what would happen if such a situation as I've described occurred, Napoleon would eventually be faced with such intense irregular opposition it would make him miss the Peninsular War. They'd probably be able to take most of the major cities and hold the ports, but once he tried crossing into the Western Territories it'd be a nightmare of whispering trees and stolen scalps.

>>17925447
Mmm, lets see what happened when a European country tried to attack your country: 1812
Oh....
Now lets see what happened when a european country invade my dear Mexico:
1829 - Spain is defeated.
1861- France is defeated.

>>17925477
>1812
1812 ended in a stalemate technically speaking

>>17925477
1846 - USA (decisive victory)

>>17925019
>lasting legacy
Napoleons only lasting legacy is being worshipped by history autists who stroke it to lopsided battle boxes. His empire crumbled to nothing, his family line dwindled, and whatever political ideals he might have fought for at some point, he abandoned himself in favour of naked authoritarianism.

>>17925019
>Genuinely the only people who seethe about Napoleon are buttblasted britons who hate him having a generally positive reputation
but you didnt even say whether the Napoleonic Code did good for humanity or not. You just said
>Napoleon conquered everything like Genghis Khan
>he had fanboys

but what were the actual positive effects of the code and legacy that makes britbong hatred irrational?

>>17924970
Does the entire way of waging war and the entire military era bear this guy name ? What military innovation did he provide ?
Even out of spite, you should have at least named Nelson instead : whom, indeed, revolutioned naval warfare

>>17925554
His lasting legacy is the death of absolute monarchy and the birth of worldwide nationalism movement. The entire Europe is based on Napoleon giving people representatives, constitutions, unified code of law, central administration...
Even the balkanics nationalism started because Croatia (former french province under Napoleon) started exporting the idea.

>>17925554
Nigger most of what we define as a "modern state" was invented and/or spread around Europe by him, like the metric system or the civil code.
He even wrote shortlt before dying that these are his true legacy and not all his incredible military victories (= main reason hes workshipped by autistic military historians) that were made void by Waterloo

>>17925026
>n-no! not true!
>>17925554
Did you not read the post? I literally said that whether you agree/disagree or like/dislike him, his legacy is the "greatest" in the sense that he is better known and more revered than any other individual figure from the time. Yes, he is also despised-but the vast majority see him as "cool french war guy."
>>17925572
I deliberately didn't say if I thought it was good or not. The point of the post is to say at the end of the day, he's the most famous and that a majority who know of him either think he was cool or love him.

When I say most who revile him are assblasted bongs, it's because for many continental Euro nations it's more the revolution itself than Napoleon that people take issue with.

>>17925447
Half your country is only in your country because he sold to the US, you tard

>>17926737
>sold
Bargained off land he couldn't control for a little bit of money to prevent America taking it by force.

>>17925626
Napoleon? Lost.
Robert E Lee? Lost
Adolf Hitler? Lost
Why do you worship losers?

Unironically would like to see anons actually discuss or debate whether Napoleon was
>good/bad overall
>competent/retarded overall

but it seems to always devolve into shitposting

>>17924970
literally only reason anyone knows him is because he was one of the people who finally managed to defeat napoleon in a massive combined effort, kekked

I would unironically say more brits know nappy than welly

>>17924963 (OP)
>Decisive French victory
And now Paris is an African city but an Italian man who could barely speak chimped out 200 years ago so we won ou quelque chose

>>17926750
Who could barely speak French

>>17926740
>>17926746

>>17926655
Yes and it fucking sucks

>>17924963 (OP)
I really appreciate him unlike Hitler.

>>17926752
But that doesn't make sense to me.

Like I said, I wish I could see people actually lay out their views about him, backed by some sort of research. Not just
>well in the end he lost, so, bad and stupid!
Welly lost at Tordesillas, does that mean his entire career up to that point was worthless? Genuinely yet to see an actual cohesive argument for/against him, instead it's just e-peen measuring

>>17926655
>representatives, constitutions, unified code of law, central administration...
All of these things existed in europe before napoleone started installing his family members as tinpot monarchies all over europe

>>17926837
loser

>>17924963 (OP)
that's not Julius caesar

>>17927409
id say caesar was a better PR guy and not as good of a commander
i wonder if nappy could have held spain if he punished the looters sufficiently and avoided the anti christ propaganda

>>17926881
Look how politically backward Spain was before getting Joseph as a king. And even thought he was heavily rejected by riots and guerilla, many reform were kept after the war as basis for the new spanish state. Naple had no constitution before getting Murat as a king. Meanwhile, Netherland, Switzerland and northern Italy became republics. Slavery and feodalism was abolished in Malta. And it's juste few exemple, the list is long. How many european states use Napoleon's code as the basis for their civil laws ?
To prove it, he multiple revolutions that sparked accross Europe during the XIXth up until WW1 all claimed a french legacy they tasted under Nalopeon's rule but was repressed when his system collapsed. New regimes had to de facto accept many changes that occured

>>17928432
>Look how politically backward Spain was before getting Joseph as a king
How so because they didn't allow any jews in?

>>17928432
The Netherlands, and Switzerland already were a republic before Napoleon and the French. Italy also had its own republics like Venice, which Bonaparte gave to the Austrians
He also installed his brother as king of Holland, thereby making the Netherlands a monarchy for the first time since 1588.

>>17928432
Only thing he did was to emancipate jews across europe and spread the pooitical sickness produced by the french mind.

On land perhaps, but was who ruled the waves.

>>17925019
>>17925025
nigga
that's like saying that Hitler won WW II because the British emprie no longer exists and countries now use Postalcode

>>17928933
It's was liberal constitutionnal monarchy. And the french were kind of hypocrits : local governments served their interests. They wrotes constitutions themself, local population suffered military requisitions, conscription, often pillage...
But they also experienced a lot of modern reforms once the french gone they were willing to keep, minus the foreign occupation

>>17924963 (OP)
>greatest military leader of all time
You spelled Khalid ibn Walid wrong

Friendly, threadly reminder that Corsica was ANGLO within Napoleon's lifetime.
Napoleon Bonaparte was, therefore, an ENGLISHMAN.

>>17929144
>Corsica was french when he was birth and until he left for France
So long, retarded bongman

>>17929031
No, it isn't. We aren't saying he won, we're saying that in the end his legacy outstrips those who defeated him. None of the commanders or rulers who beat Napoleon are as well known as he is, nor did any of them have a larger individual impact.

The Hitler comparison makes almost no sense, because it'd be as though Napoleon was permanently defeated following his first major conflict; he wasn't. The Napoleonic Wars lasted 12 and a half years, and for most of that time were marked by French victories-many of which Napoleon personally secured for himself.

Whether you think he was great or terrible, or whether you believe he *deserves* that legacy or not, that's the way it is. Only a literal retard would deny it.

>>17924963 (OP)
We don't even know when the greatest military leader was born because the Uriankhai did not keep written records back in 1175 AD.

>>17929031
>that's like saying that Hitler won WW II because the British emprie no longer exists
Yea…

>>17926743
Nap threads always devolve into sports-tier side-choosing or all-or-nothing trash takes.
>he won lots of wars so he is the greatest
>he lost in the end so he is a loser
I too wish we could have more objective discussions where we talk about his strengths
>great commander in his youth
>napoleonic code
As well as his weaknesses
>peninsula and russia fuckups
>growing megalomania towards the end and becoming the very thing he was against in his early days, both politically and militarily
Most of all I’d like more discussion on just how cool the era was. What’s your favorite battle bros? Mine is Wagram.

>>17929725
>Great commander in is youth
He still rocked in the end. Tactically, his best campaign were the campaign were the first italian campaign and the campaign of France, during the 6th coalition. But his ennemy stepped up on the between and only grew stronger while France only went weaker with the loss od experienced veterans during each campaign

>>17929725
I, too love Wagram but also the Essling part of the campaign. It feels like the culminating point, while also the moment it started to go down.
Eylau is kino (my ancestor lost both is legs here) but it's a pointless battle and I like it less.

>>17929774
The whole Lobau Island arc with Aspern-Essling and Wagram is prime historical kino.
>The Austrians sending burning debris (even an entire mill) down the river to destroy the bridges
>The Lannes/Bessieres rivalry with Massena trying to calm them down
>the tragedy of Aspern-Essling and Lannes’ death
>the massing on the island and subsequent blitz crossing under a torrential rain and thunderstorm
>the long battle of Wagram with brush fires raging all around
I was flabbergasted most of the time reading about it. It always gets overshadowed in Napoleonic discussions too, which is tragic. Everyone wants to talk about muh Waterloo.

>>17929878
>It always gets overshadowed in Napoleonic discussions too, which is tragic. Everyone wants to talk about muh Waterloo.
I think Wagram do not stand up on is own on one specific point : Austerlitz is the great tactical move, Jena-Auerstadt the crushing victory, Eylau and Borodino are the bloodbath, Waterloo the final battle...
Wagram is a gigantic battle, but a huge face to face. A bloodbath, but still a decisive victory. A decisive victory, but not a crushing one and not the final one. The highest point of the empire, but France won no campaign afterward.
Leipzig probably suffer the same way.

>>17930100
Yes, it’s true. Same goes for Friedland too. And I suppose Marengo is too early Napoleon for most people.

>>17926750
tzd

>>17930117
Marengo is kinda embarassing as Napoleon was practically defeated and the battle was won by Desaix in some sort of reversed Waterloo. But Napoleon proved tenacity and the campaign itself is fabulous
Friedland is obviously a great victory, but almost too easy and it come after Eylau.
Ulm is gorgeous : an entire army forced to redition by manoeuver alone, a real sized check-mate. It's like that Zun-Tsu quote that said greatest victories are achieved without blood spilling.

>Be ruler of 1000 year old empire
>Hear Napoleon is coming
>Be so scared shitless that instead of even trying to fight, you send out a letter saying you ended the empire and are running away to just rule over Austria

The Holy Roman Empire deserved a better end than what this pussy provided.

>>17924963 (OP)
>200 years later
>still conquering the minds of men, in awe of his unmatched tactical supremacy
>still making the weak cry out his name in jealousy
Vive le Petit Caporal

Soon...

>>17924963 (OP)
>The Greatest
Enter.

He was onion-pilled so I respect him
https://youtu.be/YE70jrhOrjk
>"Very good, there is nothing better than an onion for marching on the road to glory."