Thread 17932077

Black anon here. Something I'll never understand is the gatekeeping of the term "native American". In the functional and objective sense I am native to America. My families ethnogenesis happened in the Americas prior to the founding of modern nation states including the US. I have no ties to any other nation, yet if I state the fact that I'm native to America it's treated as a conspiracy theory.

What is the reason or purpose for this quirk of American social labeling?

native american was another nonsense civil rights thing like blacks thinking they have culture

>>17932077 (OP)
We used to call them Indians but that posed a problem because they aren't from India. It's an imperfect system but you get an idea of what it was brought in to replace.

>>17932077 (OP)
>melting pot mistake

The term used for a european or african descent person born in the americas was "creole"
As the other anon said, they used to call native american indians, this because when columbous started his trip he was intended to go to the oriental indias (not the actual place of india, but the whole sudeast asia)

>>17932546
>started his trip he was intended to go to the oriental indias (not the actual place of india, but the whole sudeast asia)

This doesn't appear to be true. Columbus was a skilled navigator with a relative idea of the earth's size. He did not pack nearly enough supplies for a trip across both the Atlantic and Pacific.

At that time, 1492, there were rumors of the Americas obtained from the moors via reconquista. During that era the story of "atlantis" was not seen as a myth.

>>17932563
Was tenochtitlan the true atlantis?

>>17932077 (OP)
It's marketing, essentially. First Nations, Natives, Indigenous, it's just marketing to win sympathy and support considering our society is built on ethnic groups competing for influence and resources.

You're right, we're all native. How could we not be? How long must we live in an area before we are native to it?

>>17932563
Also. Europeans of that era had exposure to people from the Indian subcontinent and Asia, even if limited, so they would have had a vague idea of what to expect.

The folks living in the Caribbean at the time would have obviously not been the people of Hindustan to Colombus.

>>17932593
I liked your previous argument better
but just because columbus knew the approximate distance he had to go, doesn't mean he understood America was disconnected from India. They had reports of the width of the atlantic but no idea about the size of the american continent or the pacific. The size of the earth, to whatever degree they knew it, was just a number.

>>17932593
>Europeans of that era had exposure to people from the Indian subcontinent and Asia
Extremely limited. They knew of some basics, but very few people had actually seen a South or East Asian in their life, much less a Southeast Asian from the East Indies who were basically a side note in Marco Polo's writings.

It's a term reserved for indigenous tribes, mostly due to politics.

>>17932563
>with a relative idea of the earth's size
Columbus based his entire voyage off of his incorrect calculations that the planet is smaller than it actually is. You're right that he hadn't planned to sail across the entirety of the Atlantic and the Pacific. It so happened that America is where he thought Asia was going to be.

>>17932077 (OP)
In the United States, "Native American" did indeed originally refer to people born in the country. Pic related is a flag used by the Native American Party / American Party / Know Nothings. A political group popular in the mid-19th century who opposed further immigration from Europe.

>>17932868
This map shows he's clearly familiar with Asia. No way he confused caribs for Japanese.

>>17932958
I mean, both east asians and native americans are mongoloid races

>>17932958
And he would have expected to see Chinese before he saw "Indians".

That gradeschool lie doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

He was basically treasure hunting from information he got from his moorish contacts and was able to sell the idea to wealthy Europeans.

>>17932960
You think he believed Japanese people and Asians at large were stone age people? He was far too educated for that.

>>17932965
Europeans for the most part knew literally nothing about Japan beyond its name and the fact it existed until they actually physically started exploring insular Asia. So yeah he could very well think a place inhabited by stone age tribes was Japan

>>17932958
>>17932563
>>17932593

I wrote a larger post, but this Anon beat me to it: >>17932868 Columbus thought the planet was smaller. He explicitly *didn't* have an idea of the width of our world and that was why nobody wanted to fund his expedition; they thought he would waste a bunch of money dying in the Atlantic ocean.

>>17932958
>>17932961
>>17932960

He didn't know where the fuck he was. Columbus had never actually been to East or Southeast Asia before.
Columbus used the term "West Indies" because he thought he had succeeded and landed somewhere in East Indies, which is what they called Southeast Asia at the time.

>>17932986
>Columbus used the term "West Indies" because he thought he had succeeded and landed somewhere in East Indies, which is what they called Southeast Asia at the time.
Actually he just called it India extra Gangem, i.e. Southeast Asia - or just the Indies. He thought he had hit what we would call Indonesia and that China was just a short boat ride away.

>>17932986
>He didn't know where the fuck he was. Columbus had never actually been to East or Southeast Asia before.

According to this map he should have thought he hit the Japanese archipelago not india.

Also. He didn't have to have gone to Asia to be somewhat educated on it. Who attempts to go to a far away place and not research what to expect?

Asians introduced Europeans to gunpowder and hand cannons so there was substantial trade relations. Europeans were just tired of being taxed by Muslims for Asian goods.

He had no kind of Asian or Hindu translator on his crew.

>>17932077 (OP)
>yet if I state the fact that I'm native to America it's treated as a conspiracy theory.
This is because there's some retarded niggers who think they wuz injunz n shiet

>>17932077 (OP)
Based, I had a revelation on DXM one time that black Americans (i.e American Descendants of Slavery) have a stronger claim to being real Americans than Ellis Islandites like me. About the term? Like >>17932891 said, it was a popular anti-immigrant/pro-protestant reactionary movement in the mid 19th century. Gangs Of New York is a great film about them

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z4_4p15iGlU

basically since your lineage came here on a boat and didnt practice cannbialism you are not native american, and they took it away from you because they know it irks you

>>17933059
the ancestors african americans were cannibals doe, cannibalism is still a thing in africa

>>17933070
Nobody mentioned Africans.

>>17933000
They traded and had regular contact with near easterners, who were the middle men through which east asian innovations arrived in Europe. There were no chinese merchants traveling all the way to Italy to sell gunpowder to europeans. Only a couple european expeditions ever went all the way to the far east, and none before the age of exploration went to Japan.
>He had no kind of Asian or Hindu translator on his crew.
That's not how that worked. Europeans did not have Japanese or hindi speakers just lying around in Europe waiting to teach traders & explorers the languages of far away lands. To communicate with locals european explorers used familiar lingua francae when possible and just fucking kidnapped locals and turned them into translators by forcibly teaching them their languages when not.

>>17932077 (OP)
Native American is a racial term denoting the people who originally inhabited the Americas before white people took over bringing boatloads of black slaves with them. They also didn't used to be called that but it's not PC to call them Indians or Injuns or red man anymore