Thread 17953330

so now that the dust has settled,
how could they have won?

>>17953330 (OP)
Absolutely never declare war on the USA and mass-produce Panzer 4 tanks instead of unreliable Tigers and Panthers.

>>17953330 (OP)
When tf did italy ever have crete?

>don't declare war on the USA
AND
>pressure the USSR into joining the Axis
OR
>actually use international formations and recruit much more heavily among Slavic peoples
unfortunately the krauts were too obsessed with lebensraum to seize the opportunity presented by organisations like the RONA etc, by forging a friendship with the Russians in the middle of a massive war and playing a part in the creation of a new Russian constitution they could have ensured a world hegemony for themselves.

>>17953330 (OP)
My take is simpler, all they need was a much heavier investment in interceptors/air superiority.

They didn't start losing until the strategic bombing destroyed most of Europe already. Hitler naively thought that Churchill would honour the international law agreed with Roosevelt to consider the bombing of unfortified cities far from tge front a war crime. As soon as the first bombs fell on the Ruhr it was going to be nearly impossible to catch up.

The second option was using the vast stocks of Sarin they had, which in total was a far more powerful WMD than nukes would be until the 1950s. They could've easily wiped out London with V2s or entire Russian army groups with this. Again an honour thing the German leadership didn't want to use.

Declaring war on the US was obviously another idiotic move (they knew it was, but wanted to honour their alliance with Japan which is naive considering Japan never properly invaded East USSR to tie down divisions there like they promised).

>>17953330 (OP)
reduce Germany's maximalist aims and settle down for smaller territorial gains

>>17953646
I mean they literally just wanted West Prussia back though.

The peace proposals sent to Churchill proves that.

>>17953330 (OP)
By 1942 they had already lost.

Best way to win:
1. Somehow capture the BEF at Dunkirk and hope it will be enough to tilt the British to begin negotiations.
2. Somehow learn to coexist with the USSR.
3. Somehow hope that FDR dies sooner than he did.
4. Somehow persuade Italy not to join the war so the conflict remains localized.
5. Somehow don't be ideologically crazed nazies.

>>17953330 (OP)
>how could they have won?
By using white identity instead of Aryan identity to define their in group, and asserting that white identity defines who is "israel".

>>17953717
>I mean they literally just wanted West Prussia back though.
That wasn't even the offer before the fall of France. Let alone after.

>>17953771
>Muh fake pan-Europe christoid identity
Go back to r/The_Donald

>>17953779
It is the correct answer to the question and what will happen eventually.

>>17953330 (OP)
1: Replace the entirety of the Nazi leadership with sane, non drug addicted/drunkard, politicians
>Pro: Much less retardation and ego-bullshittery
>Con: They probably wouldn't start WWII, and it still wouldn't have been enough to win if they did.
2: Stay in the negotiations for a Moscow-Berlin Axis, rather than storming out in a hissy fit because Stalin is being a retarded little egotist (he's fucking Stalin, what were you expecting from him?)
>Pros: It would make Berlin feel secure until the 'sudden but inevitable betrayal' moment in the relationship
>Cons: Stalin was not going to accept any position in an alliance but 'Lord God Almighty', this just gives the Red Army time to recover from the purges and start their own offensive west.
3: Stop the annexations after Sudetenland
>Pros: Britain (and even France) were desperate to preserve the peace and the Munich Conference was their final hail mary in that regard. They'd probably accept the Nazi state if it wasn't trying to start a fight with them.
>Cons: Nazi economics are beyond retarded and non-functional, they were incapable of operating long term unless they had other nations treasuries to loot. This plan just ensures a complete financial collapse (worse than the Weimar Republic) when the party can't find a way to defer payment of the MEFO bills/Germans stop accepting the deferment of payment of the MEFO bills.

>tl;dr - Sorry bro, don't work, unless you feel like giving them actual magic or making every other human on earth a 10IQ vegetable

>>17953770
>Somehow learn to coexist with the USSR.
If Operation Pike happened

>>17953924
Nazis can financially turn cryptocurrency

>>17953969
Dude, Nazi economic theory makes NFTs look like a reliable and productive investment, as well as a fantastic store of wealth.

>>17953774
Yeah it was, Germany offered to fully lift the occupation of France more than once.

You will understand WW2 better when you accept that Churchill never gave a fuck about 1939 Polish borders or even the reparations. He was willing to destroy the British Empire and all of Europe simply because he wanted to destroy Germany and thought there was nothing more important than keeping Wilhelm from having ships and stopping GDP lines.

Just look at any of the peace offers. If you still believed the retarded "at least we aren't German" cope you'll cry when you realize that was never, ever even on the table.

>>17954153
Based Churchill spawning the 100 year old seethe of krautoids

>>17953330 (OP)
Do not delay the Assault Rifle or the Panther.
>wtf why couldnt other people just magically get their late game techs sooner
Because the Germans built the assault rifle and the Panther by 1942, they didnt mass produce them because Hitler wanted semi-automatic rifles like the G43 and the Army wanted Stug assault guns and Panzer IIIs.
They should have scrapped their nuclear research dept and put all of these scientists onto their guided missile programs. It wasnt a long jump from Ruhrstahl to guided missiles to guided strategic missiles.
>America would nuke them
With what? America cant get bombers over Europe if the atlantic coast is covered with SAM sites. The Germans created the first SAM batteries prior to the war's end. if they concentrated their genius on aerial defense youd see something like Ukraine where air power is non-existent due to the strength of surface based interceptor missiles.
>>17953336
>>17953436
The United States was already at war with them.
USSR joining the Axis is a good answer.
A lot of tankies cope about it but Stalin liked Hitler and National Socialism prior to the war and thought it would be better to share the world with Nazis than see it fall to capitalists.

>>17953774
Germany offered peace on day fucking two when Danzig and only Danzig was in German hands.
How do they get more minimalist than one (1) city on the border of East Prussia?

>>17954173
We arent German, we just dont like that this silly war against Germany laid the groundwork for White genocide.
It gave credibility to all the wrong people.

>>17954153
>lol Hitlers peace proposal in 1940 was only to get west Prussia
Ok so who do I trust?
Historians who study ww2 for a living, or some random autistic neet on 4chan?

Hmm. I'm gonna go with historians. Kindly shut the fuck up with your opinions.

>>17954153
>Churchill, churchill, churchill, churchill
even as a corpse he's still pounding your little Germaboo bussy

>>17954200
get into your local nazi militia so we can rape and murder you for the second time

>>17953330 (OP)
Play the long game instead of trying to rush Europe. Slowly abuse Britain's unwillingness to enter a war instead of gambling everything on the basis that they won't, and continue to slowly grow. Basically, avoid a second world war.

>>17953330 (OP)
the best way to win was to not have one to begin with

>>17953330 (OP)
Country with insane genocidal racist ideology lead by a delusional meth fueled headcase could've never won because the world would've ganged up on them as a matter of survival

>>17953330 (OP)
Why does the retard who made this map think that the Germans occupied Bulgaria or Romania?

>>17954382
while at the time that map is depecting they were relatively independent, later on Germany eventually did occupy both states when they caught wind they were planning on dropping out of the war

Saying the Axis could have won is like saying the Panthers will win a Super Bowl.

>>17953330 (OP)
Basically by not being Nazis. Tap into anti-Bolshevik feelings in the USSR, build up a far stronger network of volunteers, informants, anti-partisans and labourers, and use them and the Finns to squeeze Leningrad and free up that part of the front. Create puppet nation-states as you go with some concessions for Germany.

>>17954382
The map legend would very clearly be:
Red: Germany and its claimed occupation zones
Orange: Actual useful Axis allies (Finland Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary etc.) plus temporary occupation.
Green: Less than useful Axis allies.

>>17954499
I mean they literally did all that though.

Germany had the most foreign volunteers out of every side of the war, more than even Britain.

>>17954193
I like this except losing the nuclear program wouldn't be enough. They'd have to foresee the defeat of the luftwaffe and shift to asymmetric warfare, specialized squadrons and focus on rocketry instead of planes -- like the soviets later did.

>>17954193
The real problem is shifting to a defensive strategy with no way out. SAM batteries would get zerg and strafed by fighters. Many tech advancements would fall into allied hands or be developed in response.

My answer would be to play the initial Barbarossa hand better. The encirclements at smolensk and elsewhere were such a delirious moment of victory that it made rationality impossible, but that's the moment when Hitler held the most cards. At Dunkirk he decided to consolidate his position instead of pressing the war against England, there should've been a plan C to the Barbarossa operation that involved consolidation instead of total commitment. Hitler had millions of Soviet soldiers and millions of square miles of Soviet territory as bargaining chips, a few weeks earlier they thought they were getting Poland and now they're defending Moscow. Hitler could've swallowed his pride, taken a look at the numbers, and made a deal that heavily favored Germany. I bet Stalin would've driven his own tank factories to the border in return for some land and some men back. Meanwhile, Germany has the opportunity to close off Murmansk by land and stop lend-lease. With the eastern front temporarily pacified, they could actually address the England situation.

>>17954210
>>17954200
Does he know?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UgIpen4cIvY

>>17954208
>bussy
Read that again.

>>17954754
>SAM batteries would get zerg and strafed by fighters.
Explain this to me like I am a 55 year old Raytheon engineer.

>>17954210
>we
We? You didnt fight in WWII, your spiritual predecessors were getting the shit kicked out them with the blacks lmfao.

>>17953429
They got the east side as a consolation prize

>>17954516
>Germany did not being Nazis

Don't declare war against America and don't invade the ussr. They would dominate Europe outside of great Britain and the ussr. What's wrong with that?

>>17953468
>They didn't start losing until the strategic bombing destroyed most of Europe already.
strategic bombing never destroyed europe, and they were losing because the red army was kicking their teeth in across the eastern front
this is pure atlanticist cope

>>17953717
>>17953774
>>17954197
germany just wanted the sudentenland
germany just wanted austria
germany just wanted the rest of czechia
germany just wanted danzig
germany just wanted the rest of prussia (<---- You are here)
germany just wanted the posen
germany just wanted the rest of pre ww1 poland
germany just wanted ...

you get the idea. well you specifically don't because you're a retarded /pol/tranny neonazi. but anyone with a brain can see that germany "just" wanting land meant nothing since they'd "just" want some more land 4 months later

>>17954996
mmm we're talking about unguided missiles aimed visually. Maybe a primitive 1940s "radar" later, but in either case they would only be useful against bombers.

>>17955135
Germany DIDNT want "the rest of Czechia".
It fell into their lap in a stroke of luck.
Germany DID stop at Danzig offering peace. It was declined.
>Germany would just keep taking things
America stopped, France stopped, Poland stopped, Russia stopped, why is Germany the outlier?
right because you need a cassus belli for a war that never should have happened.
>neonazi pol
cope
You hate the Nazis because they would throw your troon ass into a camp.

>>17953330 (OP)
>Stop after annexing Sudetenland
>Bait Soviet Union into invading Poland first then demand western powers help Germany guarantee Polish independence from Soviet invasion

>>17955153
>Russia stopped
Mein fuhrer..

>>17954754
In hindsight the Germans mid-Barbarossa would've been seen as an unstoppable force. They could impose almost any condition on the Soviets because the threat of a new German assault would've been more intimidating than what they actually did.

>>17953771
trvke

more meth

>>17955153
>IGermany DIDNT want "the rest of Czechia". It fell into their lap in a stroke of luck.
haha what the fuck, this is some new level of mental gymnastic

>>17955153
They would throw your ass into a camp because you're a neet, people who deemed "anti-social" were removed from society.

>>17955135
YWNBAW

>>17956399
Forgot included Mexico and Argentina

>>17953330 (OP)
They couldn't have won because the US would make nukes no matter what