Thread 18103422

I am an actual Independent Baptist. The "Enjoy Hell" poster is either a complete heretic or a total larp. Also Steven Anderson is a heretic cult leader. These extremists do not represent us.

I actually grew up going to an Independent Baptist church and our pastors are nothing like that. Yes we have our distinctives about the King James Version and we do not consider ourselves Protestant (and yes some people in our churches do believe the trail of blood theory put forward by James Milton Carroll but this isn't synonymous with Baptist successionism and not everyone thinks this exactly).

There is quite a bit of variation among us about many things like some pastors teach Lordship salvation while others believe in Free Grace and apparently some even have Calvinistic affinities (though this is a small minority). No we don't think you HAVE to be an Independent Baptist to be saved and there are plenty of other denominations which have saved Christians. Although at least in my church we won't accept baptisms done by non-Independent Baptist churches and if you want to join the church then you either need to be baptized or, if you're coming from another church, there will be a vote.

But anyway we affirm all the central tenets of Baptist Christianity like we believe in the Trinity, we believe in the incarnation and that Jesus is fully human and fully God, and we believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, we believe in the substitutionary atonement and the resurrection and ascension of Jesus, we believe in a twofold ministry of bishop (pastor) and deacon, we believe baptism is only for adults by full immersion, we believe in a young earth, we believe salvation is by faith alone totally apart from works, we believe once saved always saved, we believe scripture alone, we believe that Satan is a literal entity in opposition to God, and we affirm the autonomy of the local church, and many other basic Christian and/or basic Baptist beliefs.

Enjoy Heaven

>>18103422 (OP)
>I am an actual Independent Baptist.
So am I.
>The "Enjoy Hell" poster is either a complete heretic or a total larp.
No, you are simply retarded.
>Also Steven Anderson is a heretic cult leader.
On what ground is he a heretic? Name the doctrine.

>>18103422 (OP)
>some pastors teach Lordship salvation
Which means they are Hellbound false prophets with whom we should have ZERO fellowship.

>>18103422 (OP)
>But anyway we affirm all the central tenets of Baptist Christianity like we believe in the Trinity, we believe in the incarnation and that Jesus is fully human and fully God, and we believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, we believe in the substitutionary atonement and the resurrection and ascension of Jesus, we believe in a twofold ministry of bishop (pastor) and deacon, we believe baptism is only for adults by full immersion, we believe in a young earth, we believe salvation is by faith alone totally apart from works, we believe once saved always saved, we believe scripture alone, we believe that Satan is a literal entity in opposition to God, and we affirm the autonomy of the local church, and many other basic Christian and/or basic Baptist beliefs.
All good except for "adult baptism". Baptism as a child is legitimate if the child has been saved.

>>18103428
He literally teaches that gay people cannot be saved when the Bible teaches differently. He also teaches that the Trinity is made up of three distinct spirit bodies which is antithetical to the doctrine.

>>18103437
>He literally teaches that gay people cannot be saved when the Bible teaches differently.
The Bible teaches exactly that in Romans 1. Care to offer a chapter and verse from the King James which contradicts this doctrine?
>three distinct spirit bodies
He teaches they have their own bodies, which is Biblical. Do you think they all share the same Jesus body? Probably not, since you snuck the word "spirit" in there to make it seem like some esoteric doctrine. How about you don't attack a man of God who is doing great works for the Lord?

>>18103444
>The Bible teaches exactly that in Romans 1. Care to offer a chapter and verse from the King James which contradicts this doctrine?
1 Corinthians 6:9-11. If you actually read Romans 1 in context Paul is speaking about the punishment that God imposed upon some of the gentile nations because of their idolatry, it's not a blanket condemnation of people who are gay as Paul gives a list of sins which include homosexuality in the passage above and mentions that "such were some of you". Anderson actually telling gay people to kill themselves is morally reprehensible! You should be ashamed of yourself. His antisemitism is also morally reprehensible.
>He teaches they have their own bodies, which is Biblical. Do you think they all share the same Jesus body? Probably not, since you snuck the word "spirit" in there to make it seem like some esoteric doctrine. How about you don't attack a man of God who is doing great works for the Lord?
I'm not going to argue with you about your cult leader. The Bible teaches that God is a spirit (John 4:24), not three spirit bodies with distinct minds and wills. That's plain polytheism. The persons of the Godhead are distinct persons yes, but they are one being. Whatever Anderson preaches it is not that formulation, it is closer to tritheism. We believe in the classical formulation of the Trinity as taught by historic Baptists and as taught by the Bible. https://faithsaves.net/trinity/

>>18103466
>1 Corinthians 6:9-11
Telling that you didn't include the text. Allow me:
[9] Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
[10] Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
[11] And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
I don't see anything about faggot sodomites in here. Ready to admit you are lying, or are you going to double down?
>His antisemitism is also morally reprehensible.
Ah, so you are LARPing.
>I'm not going to argue with you about your cult leader.
Right, you are going to burn down a strawman that you created. How boring.

>>18103498
>All alcoholics are damned
Why doesn't this get more discussion? Should we ban alcohol?

>>18103510
>Why doesn't this get more discussion?
All sinners are damned unless they believe in Jesus. Alcohol isn't special on that wise.
>Should we ban alcohol?
No, because the law of Moses doesn't proscribe it. But you shouldn't drink it.

>Enjoy-Hell-Guy was Pastor Anderson all along
KINO if true

>>18103566
>Enjoy-Hell-Guy was Pastor Anderson all along
No, I'm not. Pastor Anderson is a much greater man than I, that's a ridiculous comparison

>>18103570
I just wanted an excuse to draw attention to the fact he looks identical to Emperor Probus.

>>18103574
Okay. Have you noticed Vespasian looks like LBJ?

Congregationalism was the closest thing to a perfect denomination. Baptists made one issue far more important than other ones causing unnecessary division but you're still true Christians.

>this is untrue

>meanwhile your entire theology and religion

>>18103422 (OP)
You're a Baptist and you're worried about heresy, why? You literally don't believe in denominations or binding doctrine, so how can you enforce the bounds of what is and isn't heresy?

Also once saved always saved is retarded. You mean once you're "born again" you can go rape a child and you're still saved? How do you know that someone has "been saved"?

>>18103835
>You mean once you're "born again" you can go rape a child and you're still saved? How do you know that someone has "been saved"?
No one who is born again rapes children. Pedophilia is an "unnatural lust" which is a key feature of reprobates. Reprobates being those people who hate God and will never believe on Jesus Christ.

>>18103837
Okay, so how do you determine who is "born again"? I don't see why someone who loves and believes in Jesus Christ is immune from doing horrible things. A lover of Jesus could still murder someone in a fit of rage. We still have free will and sin even after we get the Holy Spirit.

The once saved only saved BS is weird. Y'all also arbitrarily gatekeep the label. If someone does something horrible you just say they were never "born again" in the first place

>>18103422 (OP)
I am unironically descended from many of the martyrs of the trail of blood. Like actually traceable including a few major early modern figures. Family was traditionally baptist. We all took the Anglican pill and never looked back.

>>18103851
Murder is a natural sin. Being a serial killer is not.
Natural sin = sin deriving from good and natural things. I.e. lust for another man's wife is evil and wicked, but it is a natural sin, emerging from the desire to have sex and REPRODUCE.
Being a homosexual is an unnatural sin. There is no natural urge to have sex with a dead end. The same applies to bestiality and pedophilia.
In particular, the Bible says these unnatural affections are the particular token of reprobation. God turns off their natural senses and allows them to debase themselves more than any natural sinner.
I mention serial killers because reprobates are also mentioned as being "full of murder."
Murdering someone in a fit of rage is a natural sin. Deriving pleasure from torturing innocents to death is not. There is no natural urge implanted within you by God to love inflicting pain for the sake of it. Out of spite? Maybe. But any examination of actual serial killers reveals they don't even do it out of spite.

>>18103859
Being a Baptist is a natural sin and it should be legal to murder Baptists.

>>18103863
You cannot kill me in a way that matters.

>>18103870
I believe the burning Baptists is good. Because they likely repent while being burned.

>>18103872
>repentance isn't a work all of the sudden
so if you burn someone at the stake it's possible they can be saved by faith alone?

>>18103859
And where is this distinction between a "natural sin" and an "unnatural sin" in the Bible? Since y'all are sola scriptura? Show me the verses

>>18103863
> it should be legal to murder Baptists.
It was legal for a long time and it probably will be again when the Catholic Reaction turns the EU into a revived roman empire

>>18103498
>I don't see anything about faggot sodomites in here. Ready to admit you are lying, or are you going to double down?
>"nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind"
The word "arsenokoite" in the Greek is translated by the KJV as "abusers of themselves with mankind". The word arsenokoite basically means a homosexual man. You're ignorant of Greek. But it's obvious you're a troll. You're really bad at it too since literally everyone on this board knows you're not a real IFB.

>>18103422 (OP)
The Young Earth creationism part hit me like a truck lmao. I was not expecting that.
And Apparently it is a normal, common belief among many american denominations of Christianity. Huh. I did not know that.

Apparently Seventh Day Adventism does, how strange.

>>18104031
Maybe that's why that country is so fucked up.

>>18103428
>>18103422 (OP)

Kek the enjoy hell guy is funny but sad. he reminds me of a wwe caricature.

>the flames just got HOTTER
>ENJOY HELL
>TICK TOCK

Bro is all about buzzwords and zero substance in his line of reasoning. You will never actually hear him teach or attempt to teach, its all judgement casting. We should just pray for him.

>>18104036
Best case is hes actually just a well-elaborating shitposter with too much time on his hands
If worst case however...it's really not funny, it's organizational trauma speaking through him.
Those flames just got colder :). Enjoy repentance.

>>18104031
>And Apparently it is a normal, common belief among many american denominations of Christianity.
And Eastern Orthodoxy.

>>18103428
Steven Anderson's son is a tranny reprobate. His other son doesn't believe Jesus is divine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sEItfNotsSE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeUabqeZaLs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KL1_KUE-TI0

>>18103422 (OP)
Are you the Ready to Harvest guy?

>>18103835
>You literally don't believe in denominations or binding doctrine, so how can you enforce the bounds of what is and isn't heresy?
I'm not OP, but the Bible absolutely contains binding doctrine. It's not us that enforces it, God does and will enforce it however.

>Also once saved always saved is retarded.
It's the core of the Gospel.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life."
(John 5:24)

"Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?"
(John 11:25-26)

>>18103851
>Okay, so how do you determine who is "born again"?
The only person who can know certainly that an individual is saved is that same individual. The rest can only be based on seeing their works since only God knows what they truly believe and think. That's how I can know I am saved based purely on what the Bible says about believers. But I can't necessary believe third party claims of belief from other people, though I can give people the benefit of the doubt until they demonstrate otherwise.

>Y'all also arbitrarily gatekeep the label. If someone does something horrible you just say they were never "born again" in the first place
See 1 John 2:19.

"They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would no doubt have continued with us: but they went out, that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us."
(1 John 2:19)

That's what the Bible says, and it's consistent with everything explained above.

>>18103965
>The word arsenokoite basically means a homosexual man.
It really doesn't. There are words that would imply sodomy, but Paul chose deliberately to use a different word here. This term in 1 Corinthians 6:9 and 1 Timothy 1:10 applies to prostitutes, as they are those who abuse themselves with mankind.

Also, see what Paul said to the Corinthians over in 1 Corinthians 10:18, as well as what it says in Hebrews 4:15.

>>18104177
>1 Corinthians 10:18
My mistake here, meant to write 1 Corinthians 10:13.

>>18104134
I really doubt the Orthodox Church is Young Earth Creationist in the strict sense. Rather than just nomal creationist like all Christians implicitly are.

>>18104368
YEC is not just believing in Creation. It's bundled up with a lot of pseudo science to prop up a very specific set of bible readings because they also believe the bible cannot ever be wrong.

Orthodoxy doesn't have to do any of this because they don't worship the book.

>>18103884
I am protestant and believe in burning Baptists. The translators of the King James, and Calvin himself, all participated in the execution by burning of various Baptists.

>>18104139
How does this make him a heretic?

>>18104597
>conflating Baptists and Anabaptists
Not the same. The only similarity they share is that they both reject infant baptism.

>>18103965
>The word "arsenokoite" in the Greek is translated by the KJV as "abusers of themselves with mankind".
1. I don't care what the original Greek says, I don't speak Greek and neither do you.
2. The King James is a perfect translation, and it doesn't say sodomite, it says abusers of themselves with mankind.
3. I take this to mean women who sleep with lots of men. The fact that you read gay sex into that speaks volumes about your own perversions.
4. I am not a troll, your pattern recognition is just profoundly crippled. Perhaps you are projecting?
>>18104031
Have fun burning.
>>18104036
>Bro is all about buzzwords and zero substance in his line of reasoning. You will never actually hear him teach or attempt to teach, its all judgement casting.
No, you are simply ignorant. The archive is full of substantive points that I've made. I simply don't always feel like it, and the trash on this board certainly doesn't deserve it.
>We should just pray for him.
No thanks.
>>18104139
>tranny reprobate
That is not in evidence. He dressed in drag to stick it to his dad, but he never came out with a pronouncement of being a proud faggot or a woman. You are a liar.
>>18104610
>How does this make him a heretic?
Indeed. The sins of one's sons are not imparted onto the father. Remember, the "person" you are talking to is low IQ to begin with, and its hatred of Anderson is further retarding its judgement.

>>18104031
Why is that so surprising? When taking the Bible at face value, it absolutely argues for a young Earth. I am not arguing against the proven scientific validity of evolution and the age of the Earth being billions of years old, but one has to really stretch the Bible to get it to agree with that. It wasn't even two-hundred years ago when a young Earth was soundly debunked from a scientific standpoint, so it's quite jarring to have to completely change one's view on the creation of the Earth.

>>18104669
>1. I don't care what the original Greek says, I don't speak Greek and neither do you.
Ok then I guess you shouldn't watch Steven Anderson's videos where he teaches Koine Greek to read the Bible.
>2. The King James is a perfect translation, and it doesn't say sodomite, it says abusers of themselves with mankind.
And abusers of themselves with mankind means sodomite.
>I take this to mean women who sleep with lots of men.
Well you're simply wrong. You're trying to one up by taking one of the most radical views of the KJV, you seem to be implying you think either the KJV is itself inspired, or even more extreme that it's a new revelation. Very few KJV-Onlyists are that extreme and even Anderson isn't this extreme. An actual KJV-Onlyist takes the Greek text of the original Bible very seriously except for the extreme fringe which I doubt would be on 4chan. Pic rel can be found on a real IFB website.
>I am not a troll, your pattern recognition is just profoundly crippled. Perhaps you are projecting?
You are an atheist and you don't believe in God. You are a troll. I told you that I was going to point this out in every thread I encounter you in. Assuming you're even one person because literally everyone on this board knows how the "Enjoy Hell" poster writes and could easily imitate the writing style.

>>18104678
You're retarded. Bye!

>>18104681
You're an atheist and you don't believe in God.

>>18104682
Ahhhhh

>>18104683
You're an atheist and you don't believe in God.

>>18104656
I see no difference Zionist scum

>>18103570
>legit thinking pastor anderson is great
this here is the sole reason why everyone on this board should completely disregard whatever you have to say

>>18104683
>(((Saturn-day)))
Enjoy hell rabbi.

>>18104784
>>18104776
*yawn*

>>18104675
>When taking the Bible at face value, it absolutely argues for a young Earth.
Depends on how you define it. If you think there was an arbitrary amount of time between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2, you can be a biblical literalist and yet have some disagreements with the modern world-view of flood geology. What's being presented as your only choice for cosmology is a false dichotomy.

>>18105218
>If you think there was an arbitrary amount of time between Genesis 1:1 and Genesis 1:2, you can be a biblical literalist and yet have some disagreements with the modern world-view of flood geology. What's being presented as your only choice for cosmology is a false dichotomy.
No, you are simply a liar. There is zero reason to believe that. Why not also allow for arbitrary amounts of time between Jesus being nailed to the cross and dying? I recommend you burn your Scofield "Bible" and get a King James without commentary. Better yet, get saved.

>>18104675
Because I don't think about Christianity or the bible much.
Only a very specific set of readings constrain you into a young earth, btw. Literalist, fundamentalist readings.
Augustine was railing against taking Genesis at face value (as in, a literalist reading of creation happening in six literal days) hundreds of years before even the east-west Schism.

>>18105551
What does Scofield have to do with his viewpoint lol?

>>18105730
Scofield was a proponent of "gap theory".

>>18103422 (OP)
What makes one particular 17th century English translation of the Bible special?

>>18105859
It was the best translation of the Bible ever made. 50 (white, anglo) scholars all well-versed in the entire corpus of classical literature worked for 7 years, building on previous English translations.
No other translation can boast of such a professional, unbiased (different teams had to check each other's work) process.

>>18105551
>Why not also allow for arbitrary amounts of time between Jesus being nailed to the cross and dying?
This is a disingenuous question, because we know exactly the amount of time when all of that took place, it was all on the same day. Those events were all on the same day.

>There is zero reason to believe that.
I happen to believe in every prophecy of the Bible, including Isaiah 45:18.

"For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else."

So if God did not create it without form and void, as it says in Genesis 1:2, then it became that way only after some judgement that occurred. This is also in line with what it says in Revelation 21:5. According to the Bible, everything that God creates is perfect. It doesn't start out being "without form and void." It could become that way and lose its perfection (similar to how the Fall of mankind happened) because of a rebellion and judgement, causing it to be flooded with water (and for that, see 2 Peter 3:6-7, Genesis 9:11). The Bible isn't wrong, the only thing wrong here is your preconceptions, which are misconceptions, anon. I'm only saying this because other people might be interested to know the reasons why and this is a good opportunity to explain it. You have already shown yourself to be disingenuous, so I do not expect any kind of a serious reply.

>>18105859
Have you tried reading it?

>>18105878
>This is a disingenuous question, because we know exactly the amount of time when all of that took place, it was all on the same day. Those events were all on the same day.
And we know that God created the heavens and Earth in 6 days. Ready to admit you are lying?

>>18105889
>And we know that God created the heavens and Earth in 6 days.
That's true, the six days of creation started in Genesis 1:2. It would be a literal six days because of Exodus 20:11, etc.

>>18105892
You're retarded.

>>18105903
Why is it that the origin of flood geology (as espoused by influential 20th century writers such as Henry Morris) based on books formerly written by George M. Price and Ellen G. White, who were both associated with Seventh Day Adventism? Some real questions to ask yourself. I wouldn't want to be following their theology or cosmology.

On a related note, why did Ben Stein feature in the 2008 movie "Expelled"? Hmm... Why is a self-identified Jew, who denies being Christian, prominently advocating for flood geology-style creationism as the only alternative to atheistic materialist worldviews like "evolution"? That always struck me as odd. What could be the strategy there. Anyways, thanks for letting me use your posts as a springboard to post more information.

>>18105930
See >>18105903

>>18105930
flood geology is bogus but so is gap theory.
apparent age is where it's at.

>>18105940
Apparent age as an idea is compatible with anything, anon.

KJV believers are in for a rude awakening in hell.

>>18105949
Tick tock.

>>18105953
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legacy_Standard_Bible

This is the most accurate bible in existence. Enjoy hell.

>>18103428
>On what ground is he a heretic? Name the doctrine.
Off the top of my head
-Literally teaches the bible is God
-Teaches Christ burned in hell
-Teaches sodomites cannot be saved, even if they repent and believe (so abstaining from sodomy is a good work which you must perform to be saved)
-Teaches you can be impenitent, and even openly unbelieving, and be saved as long as you paid lip service to Jesus at some point