Thread 18105503

He was not a violent and cynical man like FDR

he ordered the deaths of millions of Jews, Slavs, and gypsies and ordered his soldiers to starve the entire city of Leningrad to death and not accept surrender and pretended to be a Christian while privately resenting Christianity

how was he not violent and cynical?

>>18105507
You are proving my point; those decisions were made by the retard and incompetent, often corrupt officers of Wehrmacht and SS

But the most important part of your post is that the killing of jews even at conservative statistics are 400k. Even one of the most famous orthodox rabbi of Jerusalem admitted way less than 1 million jews were killed. And they deserved it

>>18105507
>his soldiers to starve the entire city of Leningrad
You are confused. It was the battle of Moscow
The general was Franz Halder

ww2 won by usa = pic

>>18105507
No such order was ever found and jews and slavs died by their own hand or war factors, which hitler didnt start, the UK and France did.

There is no argument against this so the thread is over.

>>18105543
>the UK and France did.
This is the most important part of 20th century
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peace_efforts_during_World_War_II

>>18105520
No, I'm talking about Leningrad. But they had the same mass starvation planned for Moscow, which are confirmed in the Goebbels diaries. The starvation of Leningrad was a direct order from Hitler and it's corroborated by multiple sources including Alfred Jodl. The orders were also to shoot people who tried to flee and epidemics of disease were expected.

>Der Führer hat erneut entschieden, daß eine Kapitulation von Leningrad oder später von Moskau nicht anzunehmen ist, auch wenn sie von der Gegenseite angeboten würde.

>Die moralische Berechtigung zu dieser Maßnahme liegt vor aller Welt klar. Ebenso wie in Kiew durch Sprengungen mit Zeitzündern die schwersten Gefahren für die Truppen-entstanden sind, muß damit in Moskau und Leningrad in noch stärkerem Maße gerechnet werden. Daß Leningrad unterminiert sei und bis zum letzten Mann verteidigt würde, hat der sowjetrussische Rundfunk selbst bekannt gegeben.

>Schwere Seuchengefahren sind zu erwarten.

>Kein deutscher Soldat hat daher diese Städte zu betreten. Wer die Stadt gegen unsere Linien verlassen will, ist durch Feuer zurückzuweisen. Kleinere, nicht gesperrte Lücken, die ein Herausströmen der Bevölkerung nach Innerrußland ermöglichen, sind daher nur zu begrüßen. Auch für alle übrigen Städte gilt, daß sie vor der Einnahme durch Artilleriefeuer und Luftangriffe zu zermürben sind und ihre Bevölkerung zur flucht zu veranlassen ist.

>Das Leben deutscher Soldaten für die Errettung russischer Städte vor einer Feuersgefahr einzusetzen oder deren Bevölkerung auf Kosten der deutschen Heimat zu ernähren, ist nicht zu verantworten.

>Das Chaos in Rußland wird um so größer, unsere Verwaltung und Ausnützung der besetzten Ostgebiete um so leichter werden, je mehr die Bevölkerung der sowjetrussischen Städte nach dem Innern Rußlands flüchtet.

>Dieser Wille des Führers muß sämtlichen Kommandeuren zur Kenntnis gebracht werden.
-Alfred Jodl

>>18105567
>The orders were also to shoot people who tried to flee and epidemics of disease were expected.
The attack was a failure. There was no hope for resecue. I'm not sure, I'm 100% confident if Jodl thought the soldiers could have survived he would have disobeyed the so called orders. Unfortunately they would go back, retreat and die of hunger and cold

Now I remember watching a russian documentary by RT, which is unfortunately offline like 99% of their content, where they said that after the mistakes were made aka failure to the 4 fronts to unite in 1 and attack as a whole unit, there was nothing they could do other than perish

Rutracker may have this doc, without subs.

>>18105597
We're talking about Hitler and his intentions. Hitler wanted Leningrad and Moscow depopulated by a siege and planned famine and not accepting surrender of the civilian population. Those orders came from Hitler. His Leningrad starvation order is corroborated by OKW documents, the Goebbels diaries, and other sources. Hitler and Himmler were obsessed with starving Leningrad and then destroying it, while the commanders of Army Group North wanted to actually capture the city. This proves Hitler ordered violent mass war crimes against civilians even if it wouldn't benefit or would even be counterproductive to Germany's war aims, for the explicit purposes of genocide.

Hitler was evil and vile.

>>18105512
>And they deserved it

>>18105609
noooooo it was churchill who forced him to starve leningrad also consider trannies

>>18105609
Hitler would accept the surrender of these cities as he did with town after town and city after city. Leningrad etc were no different. They were conducting close routes as part of the battle. There was no plan for mass deaths as that would be counter productive.

>>18105609
>is Leningrad starvation order is corroborated by OKW documents,
even if that were 100% true, at that point the battle was lost you retard. What could he do? Send drones with food and medicine?

>>18105609
If you really want to talk about evil mistake or evil intention, Hitler greatest mistake was spending a lot of money on Warsaw after he bombed it, he wanted to build a city there asap, like he knew he was going to die soon because of his daily routine of "vitamins", he wanted to build a whole city for 1 million germans
Still most people who died in Warsaw were the same type of jews you see today celebrating the death of 1 year old kids in Palestine

Back to the topic, why dont you quote generals of the german army admitting making mistakes?
Or should I do it for you?

I suspect some people here dont have access to the entire journals, sources and other documents

They have PARTIAL access, that is, the only parts that are good for the narrative of Hitler was 100% to blame for WW2.

But when you go to these archives which are online and or free in pdf form, the history is totally different. The same sources they use to justify Hitler "100% guilty and evil" would prove without a question that the german generals disobeyed orders daily, didnt care to study the tactics and refused help from the SS.

Those generals had more wealth than Hitler, they didnt pay tax while the top of SS hierarchy had 70% income tax. The generals were treated like modern day celebrities aka above the law.

Should i start by talking about a general responsible for the Barbarossa who few weeks prior was found having sex with a minor, not declaring he build a nose big fuck house without declaring to the state and couldnt explain how could he afford having gold bars which were supposed to be in the state bank in his safe?

Shall we continue?

>>18105649
>>18105644
>>18105629
This thread was made by a Nazi about Hitler's morality. Not about military tactics and generals. And I've proven Hitler was an immoral genocidal monster. You're just trying to distract everyone here with random shit. Begone.

>>18105619
I have proven you wrong with an official document about the starvation order from Jodl himself. Maybe you need to actually read it >>18105567

>Der Führer hat erneut entschieden, daß eine Kapitulation von Leningrad oder später von Moskau nicht anzunehmen ist, auch wenn sie von der Gegenseite angeboten würde.
>The Führer has once again decided that surrender by Leningrad or later by Moscow is unacceptable, even if offered by the opposing side.

Surrender was not to be accepted. The city was to be sieged, starved to kill everyone in it, and then destroyed. That was all on the order of Adolf Hitler. The relaying of Hitler's order "Die Zukunft der Stadt Petersburg" (the Future of St. Petersburg) says the same. Do not accept surrender. Hitler was quoted in July of 1941 that he wanted Leningrad razed to the ground. I have many more documents but you are a Nazi who will deny it all, in spite of all the evidence presented. You couldn't even read what I posted here already.

>>18105659
>Kein deutscher Soldat hat daher diese Städte zu betreten. Wer die Stadt gegen unsere Linien verlassen will, ist durch Feuer zurückzuweisen. Kleinere, nicht gesperrte Lücken, die ein Herausströmen der Bevölkerung nach Innerrußland ermöglichen, sind daher nur zu begrüßen. Auch für alle übrigen Städte gilt, daß sie vor der Einnahme durch Artilleriefeuer und Luftangriffe zu zermürben sind und ihre Bevölkerung zur flucht zu veranlassen ist.

"The same applies to all other cities: they must be worn down by artillery fire and air raids before being captured, and their populations must be forced to flee."

So they literally are not trying to kill the population

btfod by your own quote.

This is the cope some holohoaxers try when they cant show a holocaust.

Online twitter guy Matthew Cockerill aka History Speaks tried this "muh leningrad" line. Then went toe to toe with a real Nazi and stfu since.

>>18105677
last real nazis bleed like dogs while watching their wives and sister having fun with red army soldiers

>>18105697
Like the poster above said, the Sovs raped German grandmothers and children. People who couldnt run. The best of Germany carried on and germans remain genetically stable until Merkels millions

>>18105507
can we see this order?

>>18105705
Good. Nazis deserved a hell of a lot worse for what they did in the East.

>>18105707
No one is surprised to see that those who hate Nazis also approve of child rape

>>18105716
Are you really going to act like the Nazis didn't force Polish and Russian teen girls into sexual slavery and set the well known pedophile rapist Dirlewanger and his brigade onto Warsaw to commit atrocities on civilians including child rape?

>>18105719
>baseless cope
germans were/ are known for high standards.

>>18105733
Dirlewanger was convicted by a Nazi court of child rape. He was known as a pedophile rapist by the Nazis themselves and they sent him out with his brigade to butcher Warsaw. Those are facts.

>>18105733
the rape of polish and soviet slave girls was such a big problem that germans had to bulid special centres dedicated solely for murdering the newborns from those rapes
read about Ausländerkinder-Pflegestätte

>>18105512
>But the most important part of your post is that the killing of jews even at conservative statistics are 400k

Not by any real historians

>>18105742
>convicted by a Nazi court
Self owned

>butcher Warsaw
What right do partisans have in war? Why were they butchering German troops?

>>18105745
>holocaust adjacent propaganda.

Germans killed babies
What babies
T..they just did mkay?!!

>>18105751
Any historian not doing the deepest research isnt a real historian on the holocaust.
Only revisionists do the deepest research. No others anywhere.

>>18105757
>Self owned
No, you self owned. He was known by the Nazis themselves and convicted as a pedophile rapist. They then set him free and gave him a brigade to commit brutal atrocities on civilians.

>>18105764
did these "civilians" have bombs and guns?

>>18105764

What exactly was his conviction and sentence?

What could poissibly be wrong with killing the evil Polish Partisans? What right did they have to shoot at the Whermact?

Go ahead explain it

>>18105507
>muh 6 gorillion

>>18105503 (OP)
>He was not a violent and cynical man like FDR
That's why he lost. Why start a war if you don't have the grit?
>>18105512
>>18105528
>>18105617
>>18105677
/pol/tranny meltdown

>>18105909
He was convicted and sentenced in September 1934 by the Heilbronn court to 2 years in prison for raping a 13 year old girl and for molesting other underage girls. The SS judge Georg Konrad Morgen also had issues with him due to his atrocities on the Eastern front and tried to raise concern about it but his higher-up friends in the Nazi state kept intervening bailing him out. He was a known pedophile to the Nazi court system and by the Nazis themselves but was allowed to keep slaughtering and raping civilians. Are you denying he was convicted of rape of underage girls?

>>18105954
OD consistently fought for his innocence throughout those years from conviction stating that he thought she was 17.

>Konrad Morgen

The same SS judge that convicted and executed an SS officer for the murder of two jews in his camp - thereby debunking the holocaust.

LMAO thanks for bringing that up.

>>18105512
He did order Paris destroyed including all its architecture in revenge against the French when his forces were being driven out. The only reason he wasn’t able to add that atrocity to his long list of batshit insane barbarism was the general in charge of the city just didn’t fulfill the order. Dietrich von Choltitz is still at times referred to as the savior of Paris.

>>18105993
Hitler was a huge architecture fan so no.

>>18105998
We literally have the order. Fan or not he was very petty and vindictive.

>>18105507
>average reply to this post

FDR and Churchillwere Anglican while Hitler was a Romecuck so FDR and Churchill had God on their side. Stalin also was likely Anglican.

>>18106082
>seething
>>18106049
may I see this order?
>no

>>18106214
>the order
Sure. He ordered everything including monuments rigged with explosives. They had to be demined after the city was liberated.
http://www.choltitz.de/bilderseiten/redentexte/truemmerfeldbefehl.htm