Thread 7632270

Main issue: construction does not work for most styles of anime heads. Eye, nose, cheek placement and shape all change depending on the angle. There are dozens of examples I could provide for an OP image but I'm just going to pick this one at random. It's very well established in any style of cartooning that facial features will morph and change depending on perspective, emotion, etc.

What I want to know is: HOW do you learn the "nuances" of a particular style when there is NO guide? How are you supposed to learn what changes any why?

I want to establish a few things:

>Yes I have practiced loomis and most other sources of construction. They work perfectly fine for realism, I have no issue. They simply do not translate to 2D.
>I realize there are images out there showing “anime construction” but they are flimsy at best and just as inconsistent. They also use styles almost no artist or studio uses
>Reverse engineering a style via self studies, grinding, etc will only get you so far as if you are below int, you don’t know what the fuck you’re doing as most 3d fundies will not apply to the anime head

I know there are at least a few people here who I have seen with adept skills at this type of anime style. My question is how did you learn? It simply does not make sense that you would study vilpoo for 3 months suddenly understand that the cheek is enlarged and protruded from a worm’s eye 3/4 view, or whatever.

Inb4
>just draw
>needs loomis
>drawabox
>reddit spacing
>etc

Holy mathoid brain. Just draw it bro. You learn it by doing. Are you looking for some secret formula? Too bad, it doesn't exist.

>>7632272
Bait response. Cartooning is very mathed out, read any Disney book. Or read the Tom and Jerry one. Things are done exactly for a reason, not for no reason. Also
>just draw
You literally did not read the thread. Don't respond, leave.

>>7632273
You're deluded if you think people learned to cartoon by reading endless books. Learn to feel it out. Whatever you're looking for doesn't exist.

If drawing is this unintuitive for you, I'm willing to say you're straight up ngmi. Sorry.

>>7632275
>feel the form bro
You haven't read any cartooning books because you are factually wrong. Things are done FOR A REASON. Not a bunch of stoners feeling forms. If you ask Bruce Timm why something looks a certain way he tells you exactly his reasoning. He doesn't say "idk man lol it just looks good for some reason".
>>7632280
There are 4 types of people in /ic/. People sharing their work, people looking to improve their work, people helping others improve with information, and lonely, pathetic faggots who aren't doing any of that shit. You and the other guy have said literally nothing of value. You can shitpost here all you want I will literally never take you seriously or consider what you have to say if it's just shitposting. You're just wasting your own time.

Why would I tell you? I'd rather retain every discovery I've made up to this point and sell a course down the line with my findings. I do feel your frustration and know exactly what you're going through, though. It doesn't help when nearly all tutorial online draw by intuition and leave out crucial details.

But I'm sorry, money is on the table for me.

>>7632282
I'm loving the copy paste troll responses buddy. Keep em coming. Im gonna leave for a few hours, I look forward to the neuroplasticity one, oh and the you either get it or you don't one.

>>7632284
Excuse me, that is an organic, real response from me. But I am the inventor of the neuroplasticity meme believe it or not haha. Yeah I've been around...anyway, see ya.

>>7632281
Can you seethe any harder, permabeg retard?

>>7632270 (OP)
You use simplified construction that is universal, than express your style with proportions, lines or whatever. The hard part that you looking for is breaking rules. sometimes you draw things that are not correct but its actually make drawing more apealing. Examples like eyes on different angle that they should be or mouth being way to far away from nose are just the tip of the iceberg. This thing is not universal so you will not find the anserw. Just drawing a lot until it clicks or copy someone process one to one is only way to draw a true anime head and not some 3d object.

>>7632302
pya (post your anime)

>>7632307
kys (kill yourself)

>>7632270 (OP)
How to Understand Anime Art (and Reasons Why You Won't): How to Draw Anime

Just use references for the style you are trying to emulate, and make notes on the style so you can study it. Compare it to what you've already learned and how it differs.

>>7632270 (OP)
just copy the anime heads you like, filled an entire page with them, it worked for me, you'll get an understanding of how the OC artist MIGHT have drawn the anime. this is the next best thing if there's no guide

>>7632270 (OP)
As you figured, the head models don't map to a strictly 3D model. That's why it's not going to make sense when you try to apply rigorous 3D construction logic to it. Basically the head and face is drawn in the most appealing way (to the artist) for direction it's viewed at. For example, you'll start to see things like people drawing the ears closer to the face on a 3/4ths view, which helps keep the face from looking too wide, particularly in the absence of more 3D looking lighting. The way you learn the "nuance" is by seeing how other people do it and figure out their "rules" for every view. There are not many of them, and you could mostly split up the problem into front, 3/4s, side, back, and combine it with above, below, and leveled. Any in-between angle could be realized as a mix of the prior set (interpolating). I think what would help you with models is looking at settei, which animators use to stay on-model and determine how the character looks from the common angles.
Some strike witches settei: https://www.moehui.com/206718.html
Repository of other settei: https://setteidreams.net/settei
Pic: Cardcaptor Sakura settei

>>7632342
post your work. stop with this meme.

>>7632340
>>7632342
Please pyw, anon. Not trolling. Sincerely.

>>7632420
what meme?

>>7632425
>still no work

yeah I can dismiss you

>>7632273
retard post. art is not math, thats how you end up a shit artist. every single ngmi thinks like you yet you keep falling for it. every single good artist is like, nope, i just put it where i felt like

>>7632420
ngmi

https://coloso.global/en/products/illustrator-hide2-us
There's a Coloso course that's coming out in english in a month. Might just be what you need OP, since you can't seem to figure it out yourself through free resources. Has all the credentials: Japanese animator, well-known and very methodical instructor, 31 chapters of deep diving just the head and the face. Open your wallet.

>>7632426
What meme though? Are you seriously calling copying a meme?

>>7632270 (OP)
you are not wrong in that, anime is 2D shapes, it does not make real 3D sense, like, if you look at 3D anime models, they break if you look at them at the wrong angle.

the fundamental assumptions of western realism/comics does not apply to anime, but they still preach the values like they do.

>>7632463

I'm seriously saying you still have no work. Don't reply to me again without work.

>>7632471
What? Whatever, stay retarded, helpless retard.

>>7632463
it's a super common bait on this board to say anime heads cannot be understood as 3d or that other forms of head drawing knowledge don't apply, etc. So everyone is going to assume your thread is bait.

>>7632462
I honestly didn't expect he's a pro. I thought he's just a hobbyist or a youtube grifter.

>>7632474
Don't worry about me.

>>7632462
buy an ad

>>7632484
I sent the course as a joke because who would pay that much for something that's already available for free, but he really is an industry pro and his youtube channel has been a boon to anime artists though you have to do some digging and apply self-learning. His courses are probably the only thing that's worth paying for in that overpriced business of a site but that's if you need to be taught how to do it step-by-step.
>>7632495
His stuff is completely free on youtube, get a clue. And so are many other books and courses already on this board.

>>7632420
>>7632423
https://pixiv.net/u/5818586
In case you can't see anything:
https://litter.catbox.moe/eyozuel982h4uizc.png
Btw, to clarify, I'm not saying you can't use 3D ideas at all, just that you have to fudge it and break it to have it look better from different views.

>>7632504
Holy btfo. How will that begtard respond?

>>7632504
Am I talking to 2 different people? No way one of you is Cro.

>>7632511
I only posted twice:
>>7632342
>>7632504

>>7632514
Well that confirms that other pinhead from the other thread is here doing his same shit again. He's so easy to spot.

>>7632530
>He's so easy to spot.
Wasn’t this whole exchange about how he is hard to identify? >>7632511 literally says he didn’t know he was talking to different people.

>>7632530
What other thread?

>>7632504
there's no way cro is on /ic/

>>7632270 (OP)
can't you just copy that picture you posted? what the fuck??

>>7632546
Talentlets can't learn from copying. They need books, guides and exhaustive demonstration of construction.

>>7632548
might as well use AI at that point. you have no respect for yourself if you think copying is a good way to learn

>>7632557
Lmao. You need to be such a talentless retard to say such a stupid thing.

>>7632536

Even if I say it he'll just deflect. It's the same long running game they play.

>>7632560
meds?

>>7632557
What’s a good way to learn, anon?

I still don't understand this myslef. Maybe it helps you though. Also, someone posted some study around here showing some 3 eye measurement from the eye itself to the chin, thats been bugging me a bit too. Anyway, good luck

>>7632575
Where is this from?

>>7632270 (OP)
Draw what you want to draw. If it's that anime head, copy it.
But don't just copy the 2D lines, feel the form, try to understand why things are simplified the way they are.
Draw an anime head and change things up. What will it look like if you elongate the chin? Make it shorter? Place the eyes higher or lower, change the size? How about drawing it in rough shapes vs more details vs goofy-looking blending?
If you just draw, these are things you might just do intuitively for the heck of it and because anime faces are fun.
I personally like a silly ratio of too big hair with very low huge eyes, very short, round-ish chin and a wiide face because I think it's cute. Even the fat sticking out to the side, it just looks so goofy.
Copy different styles or whatever you like, experiment with your own ideas and draw from your head before comparing your results to your ideal and see what's different.
When I tried to draw bara faces, I did notice that I placed the eyes too low, that I made the chins too short and narrow, that I somehow made the faces too narrow in the wrong places and that a really short hairstyle revealed that I messed up the headshape.
You want to draw this kid's anime face, right?
Look at it and then sketch it without tracing it, then place it on top to look for things you've missed. Then try again. It might be slow for you or maybe you'll get the hang of the style quickly. Depends on how much and in what way you've been drawing ig. But I'm sure you'll make it work somehow.
The easiest way to improve is probably to just have someone tutor you, but with how many resources there are out there, you won't need it, especially when there are so many resources out there.
You can also get feedback here.
You could post your work and attempts. Maybe that'll make it easier to understand what you're struggling with.
I think Vlippu and Loomis are neat resources though, even if they don't go into stylistic deformity nor current manga style conventions.

>>7632577
No idea, found it in my folders yesterday while tagging files.

>>7632585
You could also follow step by step anime head drawing guides. There are a lot of those and the results all look a little different, but I still think they make for good reference points if you're struggling.

>>7632270 (OP)
it's a little thing I like to call advanced symbol drawing

>>7632270 (OP)
>>7632575
>>7632612
I'd say that stylistic choices are just about drawing whatever looks cute to you at a given angle, not about absolute consistency.
A lot of cartoon characters have their crazy hair flip to the other side every time they turn their head. It's about drawing what you want things to look like, not drawing what things actually look like, even if you'll benefit from using that as a starting point or at least exploring realism along the way.

>>7632619
NOOOOOOOO SHUT UP ART IS SCIENCE YOU NEED TO MASTER INSEMINAL TERMIOTICS BEFORE YOU ARE ALLOWED TO DRAW ANIME

>>7632621
Yes, you should draw photorealistic corpses before even considering drawing anime.

Step 1: learn loomis method with human ref.
Step 2: Apply that method with anime style like this vid: https://youtu.be/56Cyamovg-I
Step 3. Repeat step 1 every time you fail with the step 2.

>>7632612
This is so stupid. The point of drawing the mouth on the side of the face in 2D is to make lip flaps easier. But this is needlessly complicated to do in 3D compared to natural mouth movement. I can understand the appeal of cel-shading, but 3D trying to look 2D is just silly. It's like adding artifacts from cameras into CGI renders like lens flare because "that's what it looks like".

>>7632612
>2 different medium
I dont get it

>>7632732
anime uses a lot of SFX and 3DCG these days
right is the 3d viewport to get the result on the left

>>7632585
>feel the form
Again this bullshit. Talentless ngmis cant feel the form, or imagine the form or some other bullshit for talented anons.
This is why they try to make up insane rules and graphics that dont make any sense. They dont have any talent for art.

>>7632842
I don't believe for a second the author actually used vilppu to learn. All artists, even pros, are all cunts unintentionally or otherwise.

you bakas. you have to draw an Anime character more sugoily , like this.

>>7632845
ahead of her time

>>7632844
Most artists are very talented and they learn intuitively just by the mere act of doing.
This is why when they try to teach they come up with the most insane and random bullshit like "Feel the form" because they cant explain something they never had explained to them. They just learnt as they went.

You have talentless hacks like Proko on the other side who can only copy and barely at that and anyone who looks at his program realizes it is nothing but cope because he cant draw naturally.

>>7632684
how

>>7632504
>posting someone else's Pixiv

>>7632842
>>7632844
>>7632848
I noticed people are really mean on /ic/ these days. What happened?

>>7632860
it's summer
kids are mean

>>7632860
Arrogance of talented artists thinking anyone can get as good as them just as easily makes me throw a tantrum.

>>7632270 (OP)
Problem #1: To get a true comparison you need a 3d model thats not in orthographic view. Basically you need to ensure perspective is turned on. No, it is not on by default in 3d software.

Problem #2: anime/manga uses forced perspective, just like 3d animators use even if they aren't imitating 2d, and perspective tricks are for live action movie shots as well. Is it accurate? No. Does it look good or more dramatic? Yes. That's all that matters.

>>7632504
>I'm not saying you can't use 3D ideas
Of course, you aren't. You fucking trace 3D models lmao.
Also
>pedophile
Die in a fucking fire, seriously.

>>7632270 (OP)
you got 90% of the work done already

>>7632660
>I--I'm cute??

>>7632270 (OP)
take a tip from the pros

>>7632270 (OP)
It's a visual language. Just like with spoken languages it has intrinsic rules that don't make much sense and you have to learn them by memory.
Why does the end of the word Kansas get pronounced differently than the ending of the word Arkansas? It's a similar concept.

Appeal and style can't be taught in a similar fashion as fundamentals. It just doesn't work like that. The more a representation of reality is broken down into symbols (abstraction of reality), the more of these rules you need to learn by hearth.

Western art tends to be more realistic, so you can stick to the classic fundamentals of drawing more. This is why Loomis doesn't apply to anime AS MUCH as it does to western "style".

>>7632927
>Appeal and style can't be taught in a similar fashion as fundamentals

the problem is japs pretend anime-style is some kind of artform when they are clearly slapping cartoon faces on constructed bodies. they know what sells, its like drawing a =3 face on The Birth of Venus, sure you can do that to get weirdos to buy your comics but dont act like its some high art or something

>>7632939
What has any of this to do with learning art/stylization?
You are speaking like a completely irrational person.

>>7632939
Show me how you do this?

>when they are clearly slapping cartoon faces on constructed bodies

>>7632951
You draw a less stylized (less symbol drawn) body, that more accurately follows perspective rules. When it comes to the features of the face you need to learn a different set of rules, that don't conform to perspective fundamentals anymore. That's where you start breaking the rules.
You need to learn by observing already established anime art (copying) or by trial and error.
They are 2 different skillsets.
Putting an anime face on a "regular" head shouldn't be an issue if you already understand the fundamentals of anatomy and perspective.

>>7632342
I think this is great advice, I don't know why other anons are calling it a meme. Maybe it's articulated in a complicated way, but if you think about it, it's just about checking out the conventions of how different artists create appealing different angles with their stylisation and why comparing things to 3D like OP did may not work as well when it comes to breaking down a style.
I don't think applying some 3D construction is a bad idea, but if you do it too rigidly and inflexibly, it'll stifle your output. (If your drawings are exactly like a 3D model all the time, you might as well use 3D models. Likely won't look as good, especially the face.)

>>7632962
>You draw a less stylized (less symbol drawn) body
Stylisation isn't what people mean when they say symbol drawing.
Symbol drawing is when you try to copy an image and find yourself drawing symbols of what you see instead of actually drawing what you see.
Sure, simplification and stylisation may mean that you're (intentionally) abstracting real things into symbols so to say, so I guess you're technically not wrong. But I think it's better to call it a simplification, exaggeration, deformation or simply stylized because symbol drawing usually refers to picrel.
But this is just my take on the semantics, I don't disagree with what you're saying at all.
>2 different skillsets
Indeed.

>>7632504
I regret having been logged in when opening that pixiv link.
Geez, warn people with a little "I DRAW LOLI HENTAI HERE IS MY LOLI HENTAI PAGE" information before you post that. Absolute eye-cancer, although possibly less visually offensive to channers than my yaoi scat art. But I'd warn people man.

>>7632977
Symbol drawing is a kind of stylization. It's simplification of reality. You can symbol draw with intent or symbol draw because you lack the skill to draw more realistically/correctly.
Symbol drawing isn't intrinsically wrong.

>>7632987
Yeah, I know. I just meant that people on ic usually say stylisation to refer to that because symbol drawing is usually said as a specific kind of critique.
Also, symbol drawing with intent is great, but if you're doing it unintentionally, especially when you're trying to copy something, whether that's realism or anime, you'll probably not quite get the result you want.

>>7632997
...Which is what you also kinda said. Sorry, I'm kinda out of it, I probably shouldn't talk on the internet today lol.

>>7632420
What a fucking retard lol.
People should stop replying to this dogshit thread with any seriousness at all

>>7632997
Haha, nah, you are totally fine. We both just completed each other's thoughts on symbol drawing. I don't disagree with you in the slightest.

>>7632981
Thank god I decided to just open the embed instead. I fear i'd be put on some watchlist if I opened that link.

>>7632999
I don't care if it was Cro who said that. I bow to no one.

>>7633066
Clear example of one's ego stiffling his progress.
You should always listen to your superiors.
An open mind is the way to self-improvement.

>>7632914
y-yes

>>7632270 (OP)
Cartooning uses both construction and abstractions. It doesn’t readily translate to 3D. The abstract shapes are like lesrning calligraphy of a new language.

>>7632575
>>7632577
>>7632595
That's from Teal Guy/Simon.

OP here, a big thank you to all the anons who took the time to give real answers. For the record my last post itt was >>7632284. All these faggots trolling the people trying to help are not me. Just ignore them, they are fucking losers with zero intelligence.
>>7632302
Yes I know there is no universal solution to every style, but I was hoping for a strategy to solve for individual cases. But it looks like the answer is just more studying unfortunately.
>>7632342
Thank you I appreciate it. I do have every strike witches art media available as you have figured out I am a huge fan of Kazuhiro Takamura's art, especially his more recent style. I've been practicing awhile and just got frustrated trying to find a technique specific to him that will help me emulate his style. It's hard, because he isn't very popular so there is almost no information by him aside from little tidbits he writes on his "settei" as you said.
>>7632462
I appreciate this but I am a brokie and can't afford that. But to be honest I have seen many hide channel videos and I just don't find him particularly useful.
>>7632468
I can't remember which book it was but it was an old western cartooning/animation book and it helped me immensely. Even though it was mostly drawing tom and jerry type shit I learned a lot about the thought process behind breaking formula.
>>7632503
>>7632505
kek I have seen these multiple times. I come from /3/ so I'm well aware of these sly techniques.
>>7632340
I've done this for a few weeks, I guess I just haven't put in enough hours... about how long did it take you to start feeling good, like you were on the right track?

>>7633211
>missed the real redpill answer
(￣ω￣;)

>>7633211
>about how long did it take you to start feeling good
not him but unironically ~800-1000 hours in total of general anime art skill.

>>7633197
It makes me suicidal knowing I will never be even a hundredth as good as him.

>>7633262
try harder

>>7633266
A penguin may break his bones flapping harder than a dove and he still wont fly.

>>7633291
You're not a fucking penguin, dumbass. Stop making excuses for your mediocrity.

>>7632856
Like this
>>7632927
>This is why Loomis doesn't apply to anime AS MUCH as it does to western "style".
Depends on your willpower (and autism)

>>7633262
I've never really said this but the fact that he followed me back on twitter feels like a small pat on the back I still think about. He follows a thousand other artists though, I think he just likes art/animation a lot and that's pretty cool.

>>7633211
>I've done this for a few weeks, I guess I just haven't put in enough hours... about how long did it take you to start feeling good, like you were on the right track?
Probably also helps not to just mindlessly fill canvases with animu heads but to analyze the shapes and look for the patterns.
Do it as you draw, but also do it while simply observing, like when you see art on social media, or when you watch anime and read manga.

The great thing is that the vast majority of anime art styles use the same basic exaggerations for their art, just expressed slightly differently, which is why it doesn't matter that much which artists you study.

I remember Naoki Saito talking about these exaggerations in a video, like how the eye that's facing away should be slightly pushed further away, when looking at the face at an angle, which creates a more appealing look; or how the ears on anime girls are always a bit lower to create a less pronounced jawline, creating a cuter appearance. You will notice that the majority of these stylization rules will not be applied to the same degree when drawing males, which is honestly hilarious to me but makes total sense if you think about it.

Maybe skimming through Naoki Saito's videos could help you: https://www.youtube.com/@saitonaoki2

It's all about these tiny details. Keep looking, studying, and comparing, and these tiny details will become obvious to you.

>>7633315
No. I am PERMABEG

>>7633258
>missed the real redpill answer
>(￣ω￣;)
Sorry which was it? When I got back there were almost 100 replies and I only had time to read a few.
>1000 hours
That seems like a lot, I don't mean until you felt good at it, I mean until you felt like you were "on the right track".
>>7633447
Hey thanks again. I've actually grinded that image a few dozen times. Sometimes I find it so difficult some times to extract knowledge from something I'm not good at or don't know a lot about. But, instead of getting frustrated I will keep what you said in mind and be strategic rather than mindlessly pumping out copies. Thanks again
>>7633262
Don't get me wrong here, he's very very good, but he's not Michelangelo or something. I don't see how you could literally never be as good as he is now.
>>7632338
I do this, the gains are sporadic though. There are times I discover something and feel great about practicing it, then there are times where I feel like I don't know what the fuck I'm doing. I guess I am just at that point right now.
>>7632575
I haven't seen that image before... that's an interesting approach to the eyes. Anime eyes are the absolute hardest for me because I feel like I have absolutely no idea where to put them and what the "form" is. With loomis I feel like I know exactly what to do most of the time, whether I execute it well or not. Even looking at that image of yours I feel like it goes from "draw the head with this mask thing" then "draw the rest of the fucking face". With anime eyes I feel like I'm just symbol drawing.
>>7632860
Bro it's all of 4chan since around 2015 and the massive influx of election tourists. They spread across the boards like a plague and took root. Not to say that before then we didn't all greet each other as faggot, just that it was more for the lolz. Nowadays you can feel the lonely, visceral hate of some neets here.

I just tell them to fuck off.

contd
>>7632585
I hear you and I have done this but I will keep at it. I feel like I don't have much more to say to this than I've already said but thank you for your detailed response

>>7633727
I have no clue why that uploaded sideways sorry

>>7633447
Where is the picture from?

>>7632273
And even those fundamentals are fudged a lot in the real world of drawing cartoons. Did you know that even Mickey Mouse, a very basic ball head character which at first glance appears to be a constructoid's wetdream, doesn't actually adhere to proper 3D construction? His ears are placed in a way that just looks good from the particular viewing angle, and do not acrually adhere to a 3D reality.

>>7633739
And here would be a more realistically constructed Mickey... which is entirely wrong and would cause the art director to demand immediate redraw if you handed in illustrations or animations looking like this. You could argue that the director is wrong because construction says it should look this way, and get yourself fired from the project.

And some other western cartoon model sheets get far more "just do what looks good, and don't do this or that because it's wrong even if it seems right" than anime. You basically just have to be so comfortable with drawing from a combination of natural skill (the large part of it) and mileage that you can pick up new rules on the fly and make changes based on what looks good while adhering to the rules of the character design and/or style.
Even for realistic observational art, you might be drawing something right in front of you and see that two things make an unpleasant tangent. You can merely stick to drawing what you see, or improve the depth and appeal of the drawing by pushing the forms to have more of an overlap. You could even be drawing a figure from life, see a value shape that's almost there but not quite, and either stick to the harsh rules of lighting and anatomy that you see in front of you, or say fuck it, this shadow shape would look better if I fudged it a bit here, and probably wind up with something that looks better even if it is "wrong."
And that's what has been done in lots of anime styles. Maybe things were started with construction, but for tons of designs, things were pushed and pulled, fudged and smudged, to wind up with something that's wrong by construction standards, but right in the sense that more people want to look at the finished result than had construction been strictly followed.

>>7633724
the one with a pic by Takamura. (search the thing in it)
>I mean until you felt like you were "on the right track".
depends on what you mean by right track. not being weighed down by jewish education and having correct pointers I was fortunate enough to have from the start. but to fully apply things and internalize them takes a lot of time. even if you go hard for 200 hours at faces and nothing else, it's still not going to produce a fully refined result in your own drawings.

>>7633734
NTA but it's a production sketch for Hill Climb Girl, a short animation for the Japan Anima(tor) Expo.

>>7633778
>the one with a pic by Takamura
Oh that one. Yeah I searched that and nothing with that title came up. Is it a book, video?

>>7633834
youtube
wow, they really are filtering it. it was google-able not long ago. now they're shilling oridays.

>>7633834
>>7633838
Link?

>>7633838
buy an ad howard

>>7633739
post funny style abstractions that somehow make sense and are good
for me it's pacman eyes

>>7632342
this nigga howard really do be postin in ic

>>7632479
They apply in moderate terms. People trying to directly map anime features to the Loomis head typically wind up disappointed with the results. You also need to develop a sense of what looks good and what looks bad, and wind up with an end result which looks good. If you are just drawing for yourself you can do whatever you want, but if you're trying to make art with broader appeal, you study what popular artists do and apply it to what you're doing. The fact that a lot of anime head styles have a mouth which is cheated to the side when open in profile view should be proof alone that rote adherence to Loomis construction methods isn't always going to be enough to capture perfect anime heads. I think the fact that a lot of anime styles are more human-ish than a lot of western cartoons causes people to forget that anime styles can just as easily call for form breaks and stylistic choices which clash with the "right" way of drawing a human head in 3D space. Or sometimes they don't and will basically be drawn as though you sculpted an anime heads and are rotating it in a 3D space.
Late learners get too caught up in the right way to draw things or trying to find the perfect formula that will give them a perfect result every time. That doesn't mean not to learn how to draw proper 3D heads or study Loomis, just don't have a meltdown when it doesn't seem to apply to what you're trying to copy or if just drawing anime features on a Loomis construction doesn't give you results which look like the work of your favorite mangaka.

>>7632585
bros...that vulva is looking a little too puffy..

>>7633838
I watched 15 minutes of it... anon that video was terrible. I hope you were trolling. Holy fuck that was a waste of time.

it wasn't that hard to me, but i hope you find your path anon-kun.
if this help you feel better, i suck at 3/4
i recommend you grab a head and put the eyes a little more inside to the head

>>7634111
OH SWEET JESUS

ENTER

>>7633211
>it looks like the answer is unfortunately more studying
No shit? The fuck do you mean “unfortunately”

>>7634111
>i suck at 3/4
You suck, period.

it's all about skull bones

>>7634224
>it's about anatomy and perpspective
>where perspective doesn't follow perspective rules to the letter and insterad it relies on appeal and style
gg

>>7632338
Speaking of references. I'm looking for someone who draws a lot of chibi art.

>>7634233
https://www.zerochan.net/kotokoto+kottan

>>7634227
you keep saying this but you 1) won't explain how. It's cool you posted your work (allegedly) but if all you're saying is "it's bent" and won't explain, giving everyone the run around you're just as much of a dick as any troll, pro or not.

>>7632281
lol, lmao even

>>7632504
This nigga just slaps the same face on every character

>>7634134
i wonder what is katy coope doing now

>>7634282
>http://ktcoope.com/makes

damn she's like a female Zun almost

>>7632302
>>7632619
Good takes.

>>7634278
seething jealous /beg/ rage

>>7634271
nta It's already been explained. You need to figure out the rule breaking for yourself because each anime artist does it differently. You do this by studying their work and figuring it out yourself. If you feel like you don't know what the fuck you're supposed to figure out, honestly read something like Preston Blair.

Also its not like you throw fundies out the window. 99% of professional japanese anime artists can do your standard nude realism. Because it teaches you basic shit like form and construction. You can still start an anime head with the cranial mass, etc. But if you're looking at a guide that tells you to start with a circle and divide it into thirds etc, you can be sure they don't know what the fuck they're talking about.

>>7634509
It's cool anon, I'm figuring it out. I know that blair book wouldn't help me.

>>7634271
It was already explained several times by different anons.

Here are some examples where pure perspective and accurate anatomy simply don't work.
>>7633739
>>7633745
>>7632927
>>7632612
And there are more.

I'm not saying you shouldn't learn perspective and anatomy. They help you tremendously when it comes to breaking down the rules and applying stylization to your art. Western cartoons and anime bend the established rules.
I personally say appealing stylization is when mistakes look good.

>>7634509
Wtf, anon. Are you me?

>>7634032
She's probably on TRT to build her body. Pretty cool of the artist to consider this detail desu.

>>7634617
Look, and I get you don’t wanna help and call me a retard or whatever, but a damn mickey mouse book and looking at a quirky “haha 3D doesn’t map to 2D” webm isn’t gonna get me any closer to having work that looks as good as the Cro guy that posted earlier (allegedly). He won’t share what he’s doing correctly to achieve that look. Me reading a blair book from 50 years ago isn’t going to get me any closer. I’m running around in circles with half backed responses and I’m tired of pretending it’s helpful to be kind and humble.

But I’m good. I’ll figure it out.

>>7634628
No, it's not that I don't want to help you. The issue is that there is not a guaranteed formula to tackle stylization and/or appeal.
I can only repeat what I said in this thread already. Look at artistst you like and try to copy their habits/style. Try to memorize what they do when they draw the faces you like so much. Where they put the mouths in different povs and perspectives, where they put the eyes, how they draw the nose from different angles, etc.
I personally don't like this approach, because I think trying and failing at it on my own is the only way in order for me to develop a style that is not just a copy of somebody else's. I personally spent years "just drawing" in order to find out which mistakes I made in the end looked good. With trial and error I realized which stylistic choices I should drop and which ones I should keep.
I honestly don't know if this is the best or quickest method, but it's the method that worked for me. I'm still experimenting whenever I draw, so I'm still developing a style I could really call consistent.
Pic attached is a drawing of mine that showcases something I like in terms of style. Just so you can get a better idea of how I draw.

You can post your art and I can give you my personal opinion on what things you should change. Heck, I can even do a redline.
But the underlying issue is that that's just gonna be my personal opinion, because I have my own personal sensibilities and sense of appeal.
You might want a completely different result.
Does any of this make sense to you?

>>7634628
>>7634542
Dude no offense but you sound very retarded. Unironically ngmi as you are too narrow minded and lack creative intuition

>>7634628
The reason you are so confused is you keep thinking there is some 123 exact step by step guide or course out there that will teach you a magical universal way to draw anime. There isn't, you learn by practice and study. And yes, if you weren't so dense a 50 year old book WOULD help you. They were good enough for Yoh Yoshinari but apparently fat loser faggot anon is too good for mickey mouse.

>>7634628
Some skills that go into drawing are knowledge-based, and some are intuition-based. This one is pure intuition. Nobody will explain to you the theory of how to stylize the anime head because it isn't grounded in theory.

>>7634628
you're responding to multiple people. teal line guy/simon who made >>7633197 and >>7632575 is also a huge purveyor of you need to know fundies as well as style to draw anime. you can't just do one or the other, you need to do both. sure you could still learn the anime style without studying fundies, but you're not going to draw like your idol unless you do both. i don't think you need that blair book but you do need fundies books + copying anime art you like. that's it.

>>7634657
What are fundies?
Not trolling. Just permabeg and retarded.
If I can put a box in 3d space and make a shitty asaro head out of it is it proper fundies?

>>7632270 (OP)
It's hard to say desu i would say just copy the Japanese artists and anime and learn from it. If there are any secrets i doubt they will tell you any.

>>7634628
>I’ll figure it out.
Maybe if you become more based in your views, right now there's no chance.

>>7635390
"Fundies": is short for fundamentals. As a noun, it essentially means core principles, or the most basic concepts that are used in all art. For example, perspective is a fundie. It is a blanket term for the way a subject's form is distorted based on viewing angle, distance etc.

The reason you learn these things is not only for implimenting them but also for knowing how to aesthetically "break" them. Learning your fundies is important because each will make you a better artist. Some weebs on /ic/ hate it because it's time not spent drawing waifus. But it's kind of like how doing a chest press at the gym also works your biceps and triceps even though it is primarily a chest exercise.

>>7634657
>teal line guy/simon
Why can the guy not draw authentic anime? any reason for that?

>>7635781
he's not trying to

>>7635792
Why should we care what he says in that case?

>>7635793
Why should anyone care about your notion that there's a thing called authentic anime?

>>7635793
Same fundies still apply.

>>7635781
Because he likes all animation, both western cartoons and anime. So his preferred style is a mix of both. But you can't deny the fundamental skill underneath where he could replicate it if he really wanted to. It's a choice more than an inability.

>>7635809
The guy literally can't. It's not a choice.

>style is a mix of both
Nothing anime about these >>7632575 drawings.

>>7635858
That's just your /beg/tard judgement. Doing proper anime isn't hard. It's up to you to ignore his advice and stay /beg/

>>7635858
nah, he can draw anime. just check his socials. and plenty of popular japanese artists endorse him. unlike the begscribbler 2013 artist alley tier fauxnime shill who keeps posting his how to draw anime youtube video here

>>7635858
It must suck so hard to be you anon

>>7635862
>Doing proper anime isn't hard.
Why can he (nor you, nor 98.9% of /ic/) not do it then? Why can nobody here help the OP then? Or show their works that are proper anime.

>>7635864
Link? I'd be happy for it to be true.

tacit knowledge

>>7635858
You're actually insane, like, clinically. This is what true mastery of fundamentals looks like. You can literally draw anything in any way you like. But honestly the biggest thing is enjoying lots of mediums and being constantly inspired by them. Do you even like drawing with such a narrow-minded definition of styles that were inspired by each other?

>>7635870
However, doing proper anime is not hard or some secret magic, but I'll give you one thing, most people here that are actually trying to draw anime are beginners. Even if you look at /alt/, most artists are not trying to do anime.

>>7635885
>yoshinari
That's a Japanese artist that can draw proper anime. Why do westoids think they can bring up someone else's mastery to cover for their lack of it?

>>7635892
>doing proper anime is not hard
How do you know? Can (You) do it?

>>7635680
I’m busy getting the answers as we speak. I will no longer be fooled with the run around.

>>7635896
>That's a Japanese artist that can draw proper anime.
You say that like there aren't seething begtards earlier in the thread screeching REAL MANGAKA ONLY DRAW ANIME THEY DON'T DO GAY ASS FUNDIES OR WESTERN SHIT

>>7635907
We can only hope.

>>7635914
Stop coping and dodging the questions.

>>7635896
If you're too braindead to realize that the reason why he draws so good anime or otherwise is because he studied a lot either way then you're really a lost cause. Do you want Timbougami and lots of other non-japanese illustrators today that draw in the style to personally write you a reply recounting each step they took to get to where they are? Why would they waste their time answering you just because you have such a broken perception of art? Just fucking study art.

>>7635907
Oh fuck guys he found the secrets, which mangaka told him?! Fuck this guy is going to get good WAY too fast and he isn't even Japanese! The decades long secrets have been spilled...

>>7635921
>Why can he (nor you, nor 98.9% of /ic/) not do it then?
>You see, this Japanese artist can do it!
Cope. Sneed.

>>7635923
nta but this is actually great advice and I'm screencapping this for myself

>>7635923
Don't respond, it's just howard seething that he can only draw fauxnime scribbles.

>>7635923
So all we needed was just fundies and 3D? As /ic/ taught all along? /ic/ won... It's so over for animecels...

>>7635925
It's an unwritten rule that Japanese artists literally take a vow of silence on not spreading their secrets when they get to a certain level of skill. There's just this realization that happens in their mind of "I won't speak of this openly no matter what". I'm not even joking by the way.

>>7635945
Yes and Japanese people are also very humble! And they bow to each other to say hello and eat everything with chopsticks... did you know in Japan it is rude to tip? It's also rude to eat while walking down the street.

>>7635945
>Y-yoshinari-san... you m-must never tell another riving soul... that moving the distant eye inwards at a three quarter angle creates a cuter more pleasing face... doing so would ruin your career, all of us... ruined....

>>7635931
I can't discern 'gabe' from 'howie', admittedly i've only been lurking here for free resources the last few years. I think 2020? But fair enough.
>>7635930
I usually have this similar advice up whenever I feel inadequate looking at other artists. The difference is that I admire their skill, discipline and work ethic rather than get caught up in whatever style they draw in. Japanese this, westoid that. It's hard enough to learn how to just draw well, some people here choose to add this stupid complication to it? It's madness.

>>7635955
Hmm I'll save your image but the advice is a little aggressive for my taste

>>7635950
This. Certain social norms stuff is understood intuitively by them. Only in the modern west do we think it should be the norm to share everything and not keep secrets.
>>7635954
You jest, but it's literally how they think. Sure, the proverbial Overton window will shift slightly because of online courses and youtube, but there are topics you are allowed to discuss and limits you are not allowed to go beyond.

>>7635923
Practice fundies, draw, repeat. There is nothing special to muh animays like the weebs like to think. It's simplified reality with its own forms of exaggerating for viewer appeal often dictated by corpos lol.

>>7635955
This. I laugh when people say they can spot foreigners drawing anime. Like, n*gga, they outsource to Vietnam and Korea. Anime is now more Korean than Japanese. Zero difference, it's all a form of cartooning you do after learning the fundies. You cannot tell the difference between a Korean style and a Japanese style.

>>7635925
You joke but you’re cooked, Cro. I’m coming for your ranks.

>>7635972
Cro and teal be quakin'

They taught you /ic/, but you refused to listen.

>>7632270 (OP)
You can't stylize in an appealing way without learning the fundamentals. Learn the rules, then break them.

>>7635896
>How do you know? Can (You) do it?
Yes. What's your excuse now?

>>7636023
you have regressed

>>7636030
My penis hasn't

>>7636030
I love you too

>>7636040
I love you more

>>7636051
I missed you, but let's ERP in another thread.

>>7636023
>simple ass doodle
that's nothing to be proud of, retard.
>>7636051
>>7636055
disgusting. you are fat, bearded, hairy men picturing each other as little girls and getting aroused to the thought of it. pigs. that's why you suck at art. plato would say you are bronze souled men

>>7636069
You don't draw and you are trans

>>7636069
feel free to redline it, I thought that was what we were doing today. It's really early on the sketch so I don't mind changing things around, actually that was the whole point on posting it

>>7636094
baylego...

>>7635858
It's just a matter of using a more pronounced lineweight vs thinner uniform lines we usually see in anime (because it's easier/less time consuming when used in animation).

>>7636075
i do, actually. but aren't moepigs such as yourself closer to transhood than normal people because of their deification of femininity to the point of loathing one's own male traits?
>>7636094
uhh. ok, sorry for insulting your art, its not like im some art god, either. a fellow struggler in the journey to artistic mastery is to be respected. i just dislike howard, is all

>>7636108
No? This drawing has more pronounced lineweight than teal's drawing.

>>7636109
>Gets asked for redline
>Immediately backs off
lmao do begtards really?

>>7635928
>>Why can he (nor you, nor 98.9% of /ic/) not do it then?
Why aren't you listening to the 1.1%?

>>7636123
There are none in this thread

>>7636023
The progress is based. It's hard to believe the last 3 posts on twitter and >>7633197 are by the same person.
I kneel.

>>7636127
baylego >>> teal
it's confirmed

>>7636109
>>7636118
Not much male traits on display here. He should watch more anime and learn from it.

>>7636115
And because of that it doesn't look any more """"authentic""" anime than Teal's stuff.
What you want is not anime stylization, you want A PARTICULAR anime stylization.

Also, please, post your work. I really want to see if you show any competency whatsoever.

>>7636135
>And because of that it doesn't look any more """"authentic""" anime than Teal's stuff.
Holy low cognitive resolution.

>>7636125
Then why do you keep asking?
Isn't it clear that skilled artists that can see through your narrowminded BS from a mile away won't be willing to help somebody that is clearly a lost cause?

>>7636139
You are crazy.
You are a waste of time.
FACTS

>>7636139
Why did you dodge the PYW request, schizo?
Is it because you are indeed a schizo?

>>7636147
I feel sorry for you, so I'll give you a tip. "Genuine" anime style looks like it does because of the shape language, not the lineweight.

>>7636108
>>7636135
Sometimes I lament the delusions overtaking /ic/, but then I indulge in my darker side and cackle, for it means there is simply less competition for me.

>>7636154
Anime uses uniform lightweights, giving it that distinctly anime look. Varied line weight gives it a more fundies-informed appearance, thus throwing the viewer back to comics with heavy use of realism.

>>7636151
@ibaylego

>>7636144
The bigger issue is when those giving advice are a lost cause, like most of the self-appointed teachers of /ic/ are.

>>7636162
Did you forget manga and regular illustrations exist too? When people say anime style they don't literally mean the look of an anime genga.

>>7636171
I was just making things up to sound like a typical /ic/ pseud.

>>7636178
You got me

>>7636051
On second thought I remembered you post AI slop so I don't like you.

>>7636115
Look at that subtle variation in line-weight. The tasteful thickness of it.

>>7636163
>@ibaylego
Do you draw anything that is not copies of other authors?
Maybe I'm wrong, but this is exactly what your art looks like. Is anything you posted on your twitter drawn from imagination?

>>7636188

>second thought
Have a third, forth, and 5th thought.

>>7636191
This kind of thinking is exactly why westoids can't draw anime.

>>7636196
Hmm, I still don't like you.

>>7636166
That's not the bigger issue. Especially not if poeple can back their claims with artworks, like several of them did in this thread.
The problem OP has is that he doesn't understand that stylization and appeal follow very similar "rules" no matter what style we're talking about.
This deluded brainlet thinks there's some inherent secret to drawing anime, while anyone with an ounce of brain knows that's not the case.

>>7636201
six, seventh, and eighth?!?

>>7636198
So I was right? Nothing of yours is drawn without copying other stuff to the letter? Like, absolutely nothing?
If that's the case then you can't draw anime either. You copy anime.
If I give you a piece of paper and ask you to draw an anime head, what's gonna happen? Can you at least recall stuff from memory (which is what internalizing a style means)?

>>7636206
On ninth thought, maybe if somehow he redeemed himself spectacularly.

>>7636203
>similar rules
>no secret
Then why do cartoons lack the appeal of anime? It's physically painful to look at contemporary 'toons for anyone with a proper grounding in anime culture.

>>7636211
>Then why do cartoons lack the appeal of anime?
This is what's wrong with your narrowmindedness. They don't LACK the anime appeal, they have a DIFFERENT appeal.
Appeal isn't quantifiable. This is why stylization isn't an exact science like perspective or anatomy are.

>>7636198
>why westoids can't draw anime.
This. And the problem goes so deep you could about it for hours upon hours. Truly a pitiful state of being.

>>7636208
It's all from imagination.

>>7636218
Then you are good. Are you OP?
What you draw doesn't look like something somebody that doesn't understand anime stylization would create.
WTF is wrong with you?

>>7632270 (OP)
>What I want to know is: HOW do you learn the "nuances" of a particular style when there is NO guide? How are you supposed to learn what changes any why?
There should be character sheets for the character in your image. Simply looking through and drawing through that style sheet should give you a solid idea of the "nuances".

>>7636215
>Appeal isn't quantifiable.
It is in terms of hitting a certain very definite quality barrier. They are not on the same level qualitatively. Some people can just filter it out and not feel pain by temporarily lowering their standards. I feel physical distress if I have to look at a contemporary 'toon for too long, even if it's 3D.

>>7636217
>This. And the problem goes so deep you could about it for hours upon hours. Truly a pitiful state of being.
Have you ever considered the fact that people prefer to have (or try to have) their own style?
I understand there's beginners that want to mimic anime to the letter, but their issue is not that they aren't following some magic rule, their issue is that they are beginners.

>>7636227
>I feel physical distress if I have to look at a contemporary 'toon for too long, even if it's 3D.
That's a you problem, not a general art world problem.
Also, cherry picking shitty western art by authors that have a clear lack of art fundamentals knowledge isn't a good argument.
Teal's stuff that was posted in this thread is on a completely different level, compared to what you posted here.

>>7636234
>have) their own style
Like absolutely every top Japanese artist does while still belonging to a homogenous culture? What westoid culture forces is not having your own style but having forced diversity. Those who know, know.

>>7636238
>no true western artist fallacy
You know it's what the culture forces everyone into. You are allowed to (in rare cases) to make something not cause instant physical distress in the viewer, but don't get too out of control and make something on the level of anime.

>>7636222
There's a schizo running around who keeps blogdropping him everytime any drawing gets praise to try and give him a bad reputation. The actual owner of that handle is a pretty chill guy.

>>7636239
Again, a you problem.
Why is wanting to have a recognizable style a bad thing exactly?
I'll give you an example.

This >>7636218 looks like generic anime drawing #36786237768236. I could never tell who the author is. That's why I thought your stuff was a copy of already existing art.

This >>7636023 has a stronger author's note, althought it's still derivative. Somebody with this kind of art could never be recognized out of the tons of other artists that draw exactly like this, unless there was a signature underneath it.

>>7635885 >>7633197 >>7632575 >>7632585 >>7632342
These are what an author's note looks like.

>>7636261
Pyw.

>>7636259
I see. So this thread is just a schizo wasting people's time. I should know better at this point.

>>7636261
post your work

>>7636266
blog?

I haven’t been part of the thread at all, sorry
I do have some thoughts on OP’s questions. I'll drop by later tonight.

>>7636269
@ibaylego on x.com

>>7636271
you're no fun

>>7636269
I don't draw regular run of the mill anime. If you want anime, I'm not who you want to follow.

And it's definitely not this
>>7636272
>@ibaylego

>>7636266
baylego has a more recognizable style than yours

>>7636280
You lack the skill and knowledge to draw anime.

>>7636281
yeah but he posted work
where your work?

>>7636282
post your work

>>7636282
>>7636281
Nah. I posted this in order to show something that comes closest to what I'd call generic anime. My faces are more recognizable than cookie cutter anime.
I know you are just a psycho trying to stirr shit, so tough luck.

>>7636282
I'm not even trying. I draw faux anime, leaning more towards western stuff.
I just happen to know the difference betwen fundamentals, appeal and style.

>>7636281
I don't, chill. BBCChan has a lot more style than me, still, I never cared about style I just draw what I'm into at the time, my style comes from my errors and my taste, I never made an intentional effort into refining it

>>7636281
Nah. I posted this in order to show something that comes closest to what I'd call generic anime. My faces are more recognizable than cookie cutter anime.

>>7636282
I'm not even trying. I draw faux anime, leaning more towards western stuff.
I just happen to know the difference betwen fundamentals, appeal and style.

I know you are just a psycho trying to stirr shit, so tough luck.

BBCChan >>> Baylego
it's been confirmed

>>7636288
I'm seriously glad you ain't that moron. If you seriously aren't trying to copy anime, then I was completely wrong and. My bad.
I guess you just have a very strong visual library or something.

>>7636294
I'll go over the thread later, but yeah, It comes from consuming stuff and talking to friends, it's osmosis

>>7636266
for someone calling someone else generic this is really generic

>>7636405
true. if he wasn't such a notorious shitposter here I would have thought it was legoman or some other generic western artist.

>>7636405
>>7636423

>>7636290
>I posted this in order to show something that comes closest to what I'd call generic anime.

>>7636520
that's his default style though, and if he's calling that generic anime he has severe cognitive resolution problems.

>>7636522
PYW
Oh wait, you can only post other people's blogs, since mr cognitive resolution is just full of shit.

>>7636530
Be honest and clarify this for me. Are you really calling your stuff close to "generic anime"?

>>7636536
Be honest and PYW.

>>7636536
Saying this is the closest I can get to drawing generic anime, doesn't mean my stuff is close to generic anime, even though it appears other people in here are saying exactly that (it's probably the shitposter that pretends to be baylego, so whatever).
I don't think I'm good at drawing "authenitc" anime, cause I never really practiced it. 99% of the time I experiment and do things on my own.

>>7636545
>posts other people's blogs
>somehow others are assholes
your cognitive dissonance is astounding

>>7636593
it's about the ego

>>7636648
I agree. But it's your ego, not mine. I'm putting money where my mouth is by posting my art (mind, only to show my level of expertise to people that don't know if they can trust randoms on the internet). Meanwhile what are you doing? Hiding behind anonimity and being a raging shitposter that pretends to be somebody else?

>>7636660
I know I'm not a saint either but you lack some self awareness

I can't even tell what the fuck is going on ITT anymore. So many accusations of people being twitter artists, pretending to be them, pretending to be but secretly being others, you guys are legitimately mentally ill.

>>7636672
What the hell are you talking about? Am I claiming to be some art beacon of truth? I'm just posting my opinions, like everyone else.
Why the fuck are you obsessing over me, while there's other people in this thread saying the same shit I do?
Stop being vague and explain your accusations.

>>7636675
Yes, case in point is this homosexual >>7636697 trying to win 4chan arguments because of his fragile ego

>>7636779
>anon says people that pretend to be others are mentally ill
>is so assblasted by bbc to point at the guy that isn't pretending
at least try to make sense kek

would the best way to learn anime faces fast be spending an entire month doing artist studies?

>>7637594
>month

>>7637594
yeah one month should do the trick go for it anon

>>7637602
There is above 700 hours in a month.
100 hours is enough to get better than 95% of all people and 700 99%.

>>7637638
Yeah but learning isn't just some easy, steady linear line with no bumpy hicks in the way. Especially if you're not getting consistent feedback on your work from a pro.

>>7637638
Retard, nobody is going to consistently draw for 9 hours a day. And if they are, they are in the 1% and shouldn't be worrying about time-factor if they are drawing that fucking much.

>>7637594
Anyone who asks these stupid "can I get good at x in y amount of days" is ngmi period end of discussion.

>>7637638
>100 hours is enough
>700 hours is enough
If your standards are tumblr tier low kek. That's barely getting out of beginner territory.

>>7637657
He's not wrong about the 100 hours part, but he is in for a reality check if he thinks he can just download info by the hour.

>>7637662
Simply being better than webtroons isn't an achievement. For proper anime it's prebeg territory still.

>>7634265
Much appreciated man!

>>7636266
Based

>>7636953
You just can't help yourself you little baby

>>7632270 (OP)
Drawing realism makes you better at drawing anime

there has to be some hidden factor because even when a japanese person who has never drawn something tries to draw anime, you can still tell they were japanese.

>>7637991
pyr.
pya.

>>7637994
It's called being surrounded by anime all your life. It's also the reason western zoomers can draw anime much better than the older generation.

>>7638001
Are you assuming the generation before zoomers weren't surrounded by anime? Dude, it was caked into their childhood. Japan dominated the TVs.

>>7638019
"surrounded" also to what degree? You think Japan is Akihabara everywhere they go or something?

>>7638019
No, millennials only like anime ironically and think it's cringy. The average millennial only knows sailor moon and pokemon. In 2011 it was extremely rare for a westerner to nail the anime style well. Just look at DA artworks from that era.

>>7638025
Yeah, Pokemon is a staple to that generation. We got Horizons just this year...you think a 12 year old today knows about Ash and his long journey?

>>7638031
>you think a 12 year old today knows about Ash and his long journey?
Gen alpha? No way. They wouldn't know and their brain is too rotten to give a crap about it.

>>7638035
Exactly. Do you know how much pokemon was in your face back then? It was everywhere. We were probably just as surrounded with pokemon as Japan was.

>>7638036
Yeah, until elementary school ended and it wasn't cool to like pokemon anymore.

>>7638039
Elementary > cool
Middle > uncool
>high school & college > cool

>>7638040
>high school & college > cool
Being with a group of nerds doesn't meant you were cool. Also millennial pokemon fans don't really watch other anime.

>>7638045
>Being with a group of nerds doesn't meant you were cool
Uhm well when I mean by cool I mean even if you played it you weren't stigmatized and like I grew up in a neighborhood where a lot of kids my age at the time played the game on the DS. Lots of fun times with the underground game modes.

I drew pokemon pictures for my younger brother's classmates when I was in high school and they loves it. They'd pay me in quarters just for a picture. It's just "uncool" because well you're in a new environment at that age and think you're all mature and shit.
>Also millennial pokemon fans don't really watch other anime.

That's wrong.

>>7638054
>kids my age at the time played the game on the DS
Stopped reading there. You're not a millennial. You were an early zoomer at most. Stop pretending you were one.

>>7638064
I'm born in 1993. My first handheld was a green gameboy color with Pokemon Crystal

>>7638067
And also I had a handmedown NES growing up from my step brothers so I had technically had with the older millennials had

>>7637959
he posted his work and he most certainly swipes the floor with you. you are just making a fool of yourself.

Can someone teach me how to draw cute anime heads? All I do is disgusting ugly trash.

>>7632273
>Cartooning is very mathed out, read any Disney book. Or read the Tom and Jerry one
bitch

>>7638257
seems like you know how already

>>7638020
>Be me
>4 months in a backwater prefecture of japan
>theres a convenience store every 10 minutes of walking, they all sell manga magazines
>in town, theres an animate, 2 book-off
>the buses and trams have prefectural mascots printed on them
> enter a shop, their radio plays an anisong after every 2 or 3 regular tracks
>check out your uni's club activities: theres manga research club and a digital arts circle
>join both, discover there's themed cafe's even in this backwater area of the country
>go to a family restaurant to eat
>they're doing a collab with an anime or gacha game


No, it's totally not all around those Japanese kids growing up.

>>7639356
No i dont. I dont have fundies and my drawings ar ugly.

>>7639515
pyw

>>7639500
>Japan is literally "what if anime was a place"
Based.

>>7639516
Just imagine the worst chris-chan dogshit. I am worse.

>>7638121
Imagine caring about your image on an anonymous chinese basket weaving forum, created for the sole purpose of shitposting
That guy's work isn't all that great either if you want to know the truth, it's not bad but nothing to write home about. Not to mention it's coomer shit.

>try puts his eyebrows halfway up the face
>when I try that my heads look weird and bloated
wtffff

>>7639993
you mean in general or in copies of this specific image?
draw with the hair too, bald heads can be confusing if you aren't used to the style because they dont contain the full info of the style.

>>7639500

I type in "anime shop" into google and find dozens of geek toy shops stuffed with figurines and cards. There's even a whole Pokemon store dedicated to just that near me.
>the buses and trams have prefectural mascots printed on them
And so are thousands of people putting anime stickers on their cars.
>go to a family restaurant to eat
pic related

just stop being a cringe weeb

>>7640027
>>theres a convenience store every 10 minutes of walking, they all sell manga magazines
Publix and Walmart still sells these on the racks

>>7640027
>having west palpable anime only, lucky if it isn't defiled by troonslators
>vs directly being plugged into the culture and living on the same land as Japanese creators
kek

>>7640032

>turn TV on (yes, that black rectangle in your living room)
>you get several anime stations dedicated to only just anime running 24/7/365 (assuming you're not poor)
>several subscription based services that show anime
>apps like crunchyroll not even allowed in Japan
>be Japan
>you need to wait until 1AM to get ecchi show then record it on your DVR
>fined if you pirate the latest episode of Precure

keep being a weeb

>>7640037
>anime culture is just torrenting muh anime on crunchyroll
westoid EOP cope.

>>7640040

You retarded weeb. Make your own sanctuary environment at home. Anime does not need to be everywhere at all times in America. If it was I'd just pick up fishing and hunting. It's already everywhere as is if you look just a little bit more.

>>7640042
you are an ironic EOP weeb.
the internet gives you the ability to be plugged in but still not to the same level as someone in Japan.

>Anime does not need to be everywhere at all times in America.
and that's a good thing.

>>7640045
>the internet gives you the ability to be plugged in but still not to the same level as someone in Japan.

nah. we are more plugged into anime than the japanese. keep being a weeb, retard.

>>7640049
>redditors watching dub slop and relying on troonslators to tell them what to think are more plugged in than the native population
we're reaching levels of EOP cope previously considered impossible.

>>7640051

anime tv stations are all raw. you'd know this if you actually engage with the medium instead of trolling taiwanese sub reddit forums.

>>7640066
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M_yZ0VTH7rM

>>7640066
the west doesn't watch raw anime. western discourse around anime is dominated by troonslators and fundamentally anti-anime influencers

>if you actually engage with the medium
you can engage in a lot of the culture but you are hard locked from certain things if you aren't physically in Japan, even more so when you are an EOP like 99% of the west. the level of cope you need to deny this is astounding, I wonder why this is such an important part of your worldview.

>>7640069
>you can engage in a lot of the culture but you are hard locked from certain things if you aren't physically in Japan
such as?
>western discourse around anime is dominated by troonslators

There's only so many ways you can translate "naka dashite ii?", faggot.

>>7640197
my man you just outed yourself as a tertiary EOP tourist.

>>7640208
this is time square, NYC

>>7640211
>库洛游戏
stop being a self-hating EOP anti Japan tourist if you have any self-respect.

>>7640223
You keep digging yourself in a hole, weeb. The Japanese themselves love the game.

>>7640030
You do realize that outdated anime news type of magazine isn't what I was referring to, yeah?

>>7640338
Mangadex, old man. We used to use Mangafox back in the day if you want to be anal about it but now we all have high speed alien boxes in our pockets to view manga anywhere, anytime, any mom's place.

>>7640341
Plus we used to have Shounen Jump magazine in America. I am unsure if they still do that present day or if you have to order it through Viz media.

>>7640211
New York is hardly representative for most western cities, but you go ahead and keep making these terrible comparisons

>>7640342
They discontinued it over 10 years ago. It's all digital nowadays.

>>7640341
Reading shitty scans is still a different reading experience from paper manga. Have you ever tried reading manga in 2-page mode on mangadex? 90%+ of the titles kn there have everything in the wrong order. You cannot view most of these as intended. Nevermind low quality scans for many and the inconsistent translations

>>7640354
>...Anonymous
>07/10/25(Thu)18:17:40 No.7640354
>>>7640342 #
>They discontinued it over 10 years ago. It's all digital nowadays
To my knowledge, that is

>>7640343
lmao so is akiba? you thought that was a win?

>>7640354
Does Japan have an official site that preserves all their manga? No, they do not. They themselves do not care. Foreigners however go through great lengths to preserve and translate what would be considered lost media. Both the east and the west still fail to upload manga, books, etc that are out of publishing. This has nothing to do with “I know Japanese and you don’t” as your argument—it’s an embarrassment that the country that pumps the stuff out fails to save their own media for years to come and has to rely on the so called EOPs you keep bashing on.

>>7640389
Westoids just love hoarding/pirating stuff while calling it preservation for some reason. Japanese people prefer to respect the author wishes.

>>7640393

In what world does an author not want their story to live on for years? Bad take. I think you lost this one, sir. Maybe next thread.

>>7640395
There are artists would rather have their old work not spread, and there are some that do. I've seen various artists release doujinshi out of print for free, but most do not even when they perfectly could. It's a different culture. Americans wouldn't understand.

>>7640400
>It's a different culture
Nah. They're just stuck in 2005. If they could they would, but they prefer to remain behind than embrace fully online, global distribution and cultural preservation. So the west does it for them.

>>7640411
Westoid entitlement in a nutshell

>>7640018
Nah, his top-left image. I tried to recreate it and it looked weird as fuck

>>7640383
Except the area described here >>7639500 isnt Akihabara or any big city someone who isnt from Japan would know. It's just a city in a peripheral region of Japan. Which was the point

>>7640389
You're conflating me with someone else, dipshit

>>7640871

You want me to go down to my local grocery down the street and take a video of some anime magazine on the shelf, nimrod? Didn’t we have the Yaosobi Oshi no Ko song playing on the radio legit a few years ago when it got popular? Anime is big now—globally. Especially in America. I’ve given so many examples and I could sit here and give more but you’ll just dismiss it because you want to be combative for no good reason.
>>7640877
You’re the same retard.

>>7640227
>>7640227
Argument should have ended here when the /jp/ lang troll got bodied at his own game.

>>7640888
No, retard. You brought up "so called EOP's you keep bashing on" I didnt even use that term.

>>7639843
pyw and show how relevant your opinion is compared to his

I know you won't

>>7634647
based

>>7635955
WHAT does he mean just draw?
LITERALLY JUST DARW?
BUT WHAT ABOUT STUDYING THEORY?
WTF DO YOU MEAN JUST DRAW? STOP BEING VAGUE NIGGA

>>7632273
>>7634628
Is this howie's new form? I am kinda amazing he keeps coming up with new material after so many years