Thread 213736599

What language(s) are you learning?

>Share language learning experiences!
>Ask questions about your target language!
>Help people who want to learn a new language!
>Participate in translation challenges or make your own!
>Make frens!

Read the wiki:
https://4chanint.miraheze.org/wiki/The_Official_/int/_How_to_Learn_A_Foreign_Language_Guide_Wiki

Useful links:
>Free language‐learning book archive:
https://mega.nz/folder/INlRkAQC#CthKI9-_kmDNyrOx12Ojbw
>Books on linguistics and language courses:
https://mega.nz/#F!Ad8DkLoI!jj_mdUDX_ay-8D9l3-DbnQ
>Assorted language resources and some nice visual guides:
https://pastebin.com/ACEmVqua (embed) (embed) (embed) (embed) (embed) (embed) (embed)
>Torrents with more resources than you’ll ever need for 30 plus languages:
https://archive(dot)ph/x0dFH
>Russianon’s list of comprehensible input resources:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1wXd0V32TjCFsr1-F_en_lA4MI-i7JtyYf26cWLtPRec
>Massive collection of textbooks on various languages, sorted by family
https://theswissbay.ch/pdf/Books/Linguistics/
>/lang/ inpoot torrents
https://rentry.org/inpoot
>Refold Anki decks
https://rentry.org/refold

Welcome to my thread !!!

What languages are you guys trying to learn ?

I kind of need a native to learn with me

>>213736806
French, Italian, Esperanto, and German. Focusing on French rn

>>213738113
All at the same time, though ?
I want to learn DE and RU (good luck lol) and Italian at one point (kinda forced to). I’m A1 German, can’t advance as I want to find work before paying for a teacher etc. learning by myself is already a pain. Probably one lang at a time , although hard for me to decide which one to start with -

>>213738312
Not at once. I've studied them all at various times and brush up on them when focusing on one or two.

>>213738312
Imo German has the most quality resources on the internet. Both legal and illegal.

>>213736806
Been making more confident strides with russian, still cant talk to a russian that i don't know without spilling my spaghetti everywhere but i understand more than i did a year ago.
I've been leaning towards trying to boot up my french again since I want to read BD but that shits hard. My grip on that is about as solid as a wet fish. I have a way more solid grip on russian...
My gaelic has been rotting for 3 years lmao

>>213739148
BD ?

>>213739317
Bande Dessinée, french comics like Asterix, Tintin and Lucky luke (I have one of each three for inpoot)

>>213736599 (OP)
Learning Spanish even though it's not very useful to me. I just like the language and I like the music, not the pop stuff so much but the music with guitars and accordians and they have some great singers. I'm about A2, trying to get to B level.

>>213739148
How many years did it take for you to be able to “talk” in RU ? Understanding it I assume is prob easier

>>213739866
a very slow progress of two years, because im most confident when im fucking with people who dont know russian (my classmates), i also have a russian gf which is another outpoot opportunity. Been learning for probably three and a half years. (on and off for four).
I don't push my boundaries hard in language learning, just slowly get accustomed to new shit.

>>213738944
Illegal…. Wdym ? :/
And yes it’s prob the best lang for English resources which is good

>>213740214
4 years off and on , I see. Not really sure what resources I need but I will look into Anki decks (hope they will work with me, wish me luck)

How do you resist the tempation to branch out?

I've been learning chinese for over half a year now and currently at that point where progress seems to stall, where you don't have enough vocab to understand most texts but also don't feel the reward of learning new words/characters the way you did when you first started out

A voice in my head tempts me to start another language on the side but I know it's probably not a good idea

>>213742040
I feel you / I would personally talk to a teacher or something online, ask for advice

>>213742040
>A voice in my head tempts me to start another language on the side but I know it's probably not a good idea
Unless you find actual use for the language in your life, this voice will only get louder.
>t. Language gigadabbler

>>213740724
As in pirated books, torrents, etc. On top of free quality resources like DW and a bunch of other websites.
I still haven't seen anything like it for other languages. Perhaps Japanese? Kinda.

>>213742040
Take a class unironically. Especially the ones in China or Taiwan.

>>213742887
Yeah… I don’t pirate things, kind of scared to do this type of thing unless someone knows how to do this etc. I don’t judge me, I’m not a dude and 0 tech connoisseur.
But yeah DE is great for accessible info, that’s one thing I like

>>213736599 (OP)
>Adult learning Edition
is this necessary? you think there are a lot of children learning languages on /int/?

>>213743715
I agree it may be a bit dumb, however : as an adult, your brain doesn’t not retain language learning as well as when you’re a child. Therefore, sharing tips is useful - we all learn differently and less fast as when we’re young

Question :

For those of you who try to learn a very lowkey language such as Welsh, Breton or other NA native languages… what’s your aspirations and how difficult has it been, knowing they have so few resources ? Thanks

>>213745561
Normally its them learning it because le based white race shit. Muh cultural heritage.
Frankly as a Welshman I think the language should just die.

>>213741167
I never fucking ankigoon. Do inpoot with letting the words sink into your brain. I always try to learn words either in context or "im literally about to use them" moments.
I personally just got burnt out when i tried anki.

>>213745726
> Frankly as a Welshman I think the language should just die.
Hey, be gentle on urself. Sorry but I can’t stand the sound of welsh, idk what it is about it…

>>213745913
Hmm… I see. Let me know if there’s any books or resources you can share with me, that’d be great : thanks

>>213747055
https://en.openrussian.org/
^ this is a very good online dictionary i use regularly if i want to just look something up.
I personally worked through the penguin russian course, but that book is very dry at times, work through it if you dare. It does have the stress marked though, so if you can read something out loud, DO SO.
Another book that has stress markings, that i have read from cover to cover is the Short Stories in Russian by Olly Richards. by this point i was semi comfortable with reading cyrillic at length without getting a headache.

Nothing beats just exploring, finding what works for you and keeping on doing it, but if you find yourself burnt out by doing anki, dont act surprised.

I was thinking of taking up Spanish and looking at the "Russianon's list." Why is Spanish crossed off the list, along with the Dreaming Spanish channel and the other first four links? Are we not allowed to learn Spanish anymore? Or is the owner of that document just crossing off things as he goes through them? I was hoping to learn Spanish, but I guess I'm just not allowed.

>>213748355
Nice ty - I know maybe 80/85% of the script, I remember learning it very quickly when I was 22 or something (ы, Щ, Ш are difficult to understand, again I am at a level A0).
Having a tutor is probably the best thing, I’m just broke at the moment for now. 4 years looks like not a lot for this particular language too, again, I’ll focus on the basics and see how it goes/how I learn

>>213748355
There’s a book “Golosa” that used to be free and downloadable. It’s 80 $, I’m going to see if I can find a more accessible version. Idk maybe you’ve heard about it too

Bumping the good thread. Also... *thinks of on-topic question* what's your favorite language?

>>213752509
DE or RU for me… although , I do like Italian too

>>213742040
You need to set an objective for yourself
For example 'I will read a short story entirely in Chinese' or more likely 'I will finish one story in a graded reader' or maybe an entire graded reader
If you don't do that you're doomed

>>213752509
Old Norse
It ought to be Japanese but I hate Japanese

>>213755283
There must be so little resources, no ?

Japanese doesn’t do anything for me either… One of the most challeging langs to learn with mandarin and Arabic

How difficult are Estonian or Finnish compared to Russian ?

I will get good at korean. I will move to korea. I will eat 떡볶이. I will marry a QT korean. I will be happy

So I did start Dreaming Spanish today, despite the fact that it was crossed off. I was curious about the pronunciation. I know just a little bit of Spanish spelling, but they pronounce cabesa like cavesa, something that sounds like "boy" but I'm assuming is probably spelled voy, and yo is pronounced djyo. I also noticed one speaker with a kind of lisp. Any ideas about whether it's any particular accent or how to know where the different speakers are from?

do you guys use ChatGPT to learn? is it any efficient?
I was wondering if with enough dedication I could get my spanish to a functional level in a few months

>>213758308
it's useful for specific tasks (morphological breakdowns, answering straightforward questions) but it's questionable as a general language learning tool

>>213758308
I heard it makes mistake in German, wouldn’t trust it - heard a lot of ads about Pingo AI. Never used it though

Is it true indonesian is very easy to learn?

i have been learning Portuguese so i can have sex with white braslian women

>>213758831
Bengali is easier.

>>213760738
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/36250487/brit-tourist-drugged-robbed-ipanema/

Good luck

>>213760962
>drug and rob me
>take all the nothing i have
they better touch my weenie at least

Whenever i grammar check my sentences on chatgpt this is what pisses me off the most than no you're completely wrong or something like that answer.

I love every part of learning russian even the cancer parts like verb aspects/verbs of motion.
What I cant stand is reading it, feel like plucking my eyes out having to read through a picket fence of square letters with no legibility.

>>213742887
Do you know a good German private tracker?

>>213758308
I don't know if chatGPT is the same as google translate, but I do use GoogTrans a lot, and it is very efficient. you need to understand what you are saying and check your grammar rules against the robot speak anon. I am improving 500% faster than I ever did when I learned English.

>>213761249
to me it's like reading all caps lock. sometimes I will get lost in Russian rap lyrics.
Doing Nastya's 2nd year of Russian for beginners. She is making me write down a dictionary. I should be able to recognize 10,000 words in frequency order if I finish all her videos.
that should help me not get lost in reading Russian rap. understanding them putting it all together and making sense of cases meaning is another story. I feel old, I want to start Mandarin Chinese

>>213758256
voy means going. in imperative? I think it means I am going (to). va a means is going to.

it all depends on the context and translation. I remember I wanted to teach this general something, but I don't remember. you can talk to me in Spanish until I remember and it comes up.

>>213758256
that's what you get for listening to an Argentinian.
they add a SH sounds to words and letters that do not need it in any way. it is a mental retardation and nigger speak, unnecessary ebonics and in no way an "accent"

Ich will eine deutsche Freundin haben
Ich will eine deutsche Freundin haben
Ich will eine deutsche Freundin haben
Ich will eine deutsche Freundin haben
Ich will eine deutsche Freundin haben
Ich will eine deutsche Freundin haben

>>213742040
I hear the same thing too, but I know its dabbling.
I also know I'm not getting any younger. English took me forever to learn so if you're smart enough and your memory is strong doing several languages after a certain point is not a bad idea.
you just need to get the basics out of the way and start consuming media.

If my mother tongue is Spanish and I speak English. German is another English, its Russian that's tough as fuck to learn. I can juggle both just fine. I'm at that point I can begin Chinese basics and either portuguese or French are romance languages to brush up my Spanish.

Easy. more spanish more English vocabulary. that's Portuguese French and German. the only hard ones are Russian and Mandarin.

THEN I can begin ONE of ancient Greek, Japanese, Arabic, or Cantonese when I'm an old man out of curiosity. but I won't need it. I would much rather get far in math and physics.

>>213739866
I don't want to discourage you or anything but in my case I've been at it for 2 years now with notebooks and only because I have Russian with Nastya on YouTube.

I am barely going to fill notebooks of Russian with Max and Easy Russian and other YouTubers like I do now with German. the most time and effort I have put in my life is in Russian. I am taking a break right now.

>>213761947
Я хoчy имeть pyccкyю дeвyшкy.

>>213747055
As an alternative to Anki, simply buying a physical frequency dictionary like the Routledge ones and reading it before watching/reading input might help.

I am considering returning to Italian, learning Spanish (not because of the number of native speakers, as I am not planning to go to South America anytime soon, I just like Spain and the Hispanidad), and German. I am giving up Japanese for next year, I think. With German, I could decide not to start learning it until I plan to go to Germany, but emigration aside, it's a cool language, and the grammatical cases are awesome, so I'm not sure if such a decision makes sense.
I still like Japanese, but it works the opposite way for me than it does for weebs: the more selective I am and the less anime I watch, and the more I read about, idk, the history of Japanese automotive for example, the more I like the language (although this season isn't a good example because a lot of cool stuff came out). And I love their unique writing system.
>>213742040
Master-dabbler here. I don't remember anything from languages I studied anymore. Especially when it comes to speaking (I can understand Romance languages passively on easy levels, more or less). It's magical how the ability to communicate evaporates. So beware of it.
But I can't help it, when I stopped having anyone to talk to, I lost almost all interest in the language except for listening to songs, sometimes watching dubbed movies and TV series etc. And we're talking about “easy” languages here, where initial progress is relatively quick due to easy pronunciation, familiar vocabulary or general presence in the culture.
You need to find Chinese-speaking friends ASAP. Or other people learning the language, some community.

>>213761947
Das glaube ich nicht.

>>213763548
A lot of people triumph in racist ass Latin America as actors and musicians.
have your kids here, America and Europe are too gay. i'm on pol all day to know that they are hopeless cases.

>>213758256
Terrible bait. Do better.

>>213763548
>I am considering
You need to stop doing that and make a commitment bro

>>213736599 (OP)
I have decided to learn Japanese. 1000 years in the anki mines for me. See you on other side.

>>213736599 (OP)
Forgot to link previously thread

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"माँ" is less formal than "माता", I believe
"माता"(mātā)is a more appropriated term to address the immaculated virgen mary, I heard from a priest once that assossiating mary to be my mother was plausible since john 19:27 address that mary should be counsidered the mother of us born from the original sin(by the son it self).

>>213742040
You have to get your enjoyment from content in the language. If you aren't getting a feeling of accomplishment anymore from studying but you're still studying, it's just going to feel like a chore without any reward. And the reason you're tempted to start a new language is because you miss the feeling of quick easy progress in the beginning. But the result will be the same, until you've dabbled in 17 languages and got nowhere.
You have to start consuming content that you're interested in, do it for the sake of the content and not just to learn the language, and forget about that feeling of accomplishment from making progress because that's gone forever.
I can tell that my French comprehension is way better than it was a year ago, but it doesn't feel good in the same way that it did when I was a beginner because the progress is not fast enough to activate the happy neuron.

Greetings /lang/.
It's time for me to add to the annoying posts that ask for help with deciding between languages.
Next month, I have to enroll for mandatory military service that will last 9-12 months. I'll try to use my free time there for some language learning and I'm between improving my French and starting Spanish
>French
>Have already made a lot of progress, even if it has stalled the past few months
>Could be the boost I need to enter into solid B2 territory or even break into C1
>Lost motivation recently because I won't need the language in the near future, but if I ever do, I can freshen it up some months beforehnd

>Spanish
>Always wanted to learn it
>Easy phonology for a native Greek speaker, meaning I can focus on learning from texts (easier to do when my free time there could get interrupted at any moment) and try the Kato Lomb method
>Harder to start a new language when I'm done with the military and have to get a job
>But starting a third foreign language when my second is shakey could be the beginning of becoming a dabbler with 5 A1 languages.

I'm heavily leaning into Spanish, but any opinions are welcome

>>213736806
portuguese, japanese

>>213736806
Chinese and German

>>213736806
Too many.

>>213766190
Just study French again and grind French literature, audio and videos
Don't bother with Spanish, it'll be a complete waste of time when you've already gotten so far with French but not far enough

>>213766731
Btw once you get to the stage of inputting with Spanish you'll likely run into the exact same problems that you did with French only you have an additional language you feel you ought to make time to study due to sunk cost which will just make you more stressed and hate the language learning process

>>213764509
>i'm on pol all day
Grim
>>213766190
Spanish only if you really plan to reach at least level B2. If not, then choose French. >>213736806
English, Italian, German, Japanese, Spanish. Focusing on fucking around rn

>>213766190
>Could be the boost I need to enter into solid B2 territory or even break into C1
Great reason to keep going
>Lost motivation recently because I won't need the language in the near future
Greek and English are all you need anyway so drop this line of reasoning completely
>Easy phonology for a native Greek speaker, meaning I can focus on learning from texts
Not a big deal, French pronunciation isn't some deep mystery and you can easily learn all the rules needed to pronounce 99% of words. And the phonology isn't a big deal.
>Harder to start a new language when I'm done with the military and have to get a job
This is going to be a problem for you no matter what you decide

French

Hi all, trying to learn French rn, and I have a problem with pronunciating R so I pronounce it like spanish R. Should I worry about it? Will french frown upon me if I talk like that?

>>213767474
Try pronouncing it like a spanish J it's closer.

>>213765817
I know, but I want them all. Now I'm even considering returning to French. Maybe I'll sign up for a language class because self-study is not for me.
>>213767474
You can always larp as Cajun person

>>213767369
I've learned the rules for french phonology and I agree that it's not a deep mystery. Learning the IPA symbols used for french helped me immensely. But it's still unnatural to me when I speak. I don't mean the accent, I mean not being used to making these sounds on the fly.
>>213767474
Look into the IPA for french and for your native language. Which is the closest sound your native language has? How do you modify it to sounds like the french R?
For example, Greek has /ɣ/, which is like it but not pronounced that far back in the mouth. So when I try to pronounce the french R, I try to do a more throaty /ɣ/.

>>213767704
>>213767708
>>213767768
I managed to pronounce it like uvular fricative but it's just very hard to do it constantly so I decided maybe I can just switch to historical pronunciation of an R (alveolar trill) and it won't make much difference for French speaking people.

>>213767857
Idk about uvular and all that names, but it's similar R as in German and it's not always so guttural and rough, sometimes it's somewhere between R and, idk, H

>>213767768
>But it's still unnatural to me when I speak. I don't mean the accent, I mean not being used to making these sounds on the fly.
... So do the work
>>213767708
>I know, but I want them all
There are millions of beauty women I'd love to fuck yet I never chose to become a rapist. Commit to a language.

>>213761780
Wait… where did u find this Nastya ? Italki ? If she gives u homework, then, I wonder if you’re learning via a platform ?

I’m looking at teachers for RU, there’s so many and don’t know which one to chose from. I want to start from level A0 (I know the alphabet but will pretend I don’t). To me this language seems like a pain but I am motivated. I might abandon at one point but I want to try it out…

>>213761903
>>213761869
I looked some more at their video catalog, and it implies that the woman I listened to most so far (Shelcin) is from Colombia. Knowing that, I also noticed it appears they have the country of the speaker(s) tagged under the video. For example, this one has the tags Colombia and Spain. The man has a pronounced retracted s (sounds like "sh") and also uses a "th" sound in place of "s" in many places ("thiente"), which I guess is how Spaniards really talk.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQ76zWZSmbg

>>213764758
I'm not trolling. I have some prior exposure to Spanish spelling, but I haven't listened closely to Hispanics/Spaniards talking before.

>>213758256
In Spanish, b and v are pronounced exactly the same way. At the beginning of an utterance, or after an n or an m, it sounds like b as in boy, in English. In the middle of two vowel sounds, it sounds like IPA [β], which is kind of like a "v" sound, except a "v" involves the upper lip and the lower teeth, whereas [β] involves only the upper lip and the lower lip.
In Spanish from Spain, z and the soft c sound like a "th" sound. In Latin America, they're just the same as the "s".
> yo is pronounced djyo
This is also common among all Spanish speakers. Their "y" sounds sound almost like a soft j sound. It's written as [ʝ] in IPA.

>>213770382
>all Spanish speakers
except for Argentinians and people in that area, who pronounce them as "sh" sounds.

>>213736599 (OP)
Is there a refold 1k russian deck?

>>213770382
That explains what I'm hearing. Thanks for breaking it down.

>>213761947
du
du hast
du hast mich

>>213742040
I don't really think there's anything wrong with branching out when you feel burnout, but I don't think this should really even be a consideration until you're able to consume at least some media in the language. I burned out on French and as a consequence I started doing Spanish, which in turn actually reinvigorated me to keep doing French and push myself more by reading more books, watching movies and television/YouTube videos, etc. Just remember that you could potentially be doubling (or even tripling) the time you'll take to learn both languages unless you do it right and are able to enjoy media in your original TL.

What's your approach to reading (or consuming any content) in your TL when the text in question is on the more difficult size.
I got myself a cute children's book, but despite expectations it has lots of words I don't understand and can't infer from context most of the time, so I'm just stuck there reaching for my translator app every sentence and it's hard to get into the flow of reading.
I'm considering maybe reading through the text twice, using a translator on the first round and then seeing if I remembered all the words the second time through. Maybe even make that thrice and read the first time without the translation just seeing how much can understand
>>213736806
Currently on Ukrainian. Finnish, Belarusian and Polish are all on the list but I'm not sure which of those I want to go for first. Polish would make sense since Belarusian is very close to Ukrainian to the point where I can already understand a lot of it and I don't want to confuse the two in my head.
>>213738312
>Probably one lang at a time
For me the biggest pain is when to "allow" myself to move to the next language. I've no clue what I want to consider as "good enough" and I don't want to jump from language to language every time I reach a plateau

>>213773781
Currently on Ukrainian. Finnish, Belarusian and Polish are all on the list but I'm not sure which of those I want to go for first. Polish would make sense since Belarusian is very close to > >Ukrainian to the point where I can already understand a lot of it and I don't want to confuse the two in my head.
Good luck !! Motivation, motivation

>>213773781
I use tools like Language Reactor to do lookups and translation fast. Repetition is key but it depends a lot on your frustration tolerance. The more unknowns, the bigger your cognitive load and at some point it's more effective to just drop it and go for something easier. Children's books can be deceptively difficult, they have simpler themes but don't restrict themselves to a particular vocab size. Graded readers are much better for learners, usually labeled as A1/A2/B1/B2 or beginner/intermediate/advanced, so you can control the expected difficulty and climb it like a ladder.

>>213761947
Same dude

>>213774336
>Children's books can be deceptively difficult
Yep. Especially since while I'd consider myself to be quite decent in my TL conversationally the book just uses a different kind of language and has lots of words that I never encountered in day to day speaking to people.
For example "walking on tiptoes" is an expression I've just never heard or needed before

>>213736806
latin atm (then spanish)

>>213773781
I learn Japanese and when I don't understand I just power through instead of using a dictionary, it's too tiresome otherwise. After I finish this book I'll find something that has furigana to make the reading more comfortable.

Did Poleaf get his Pole-gf yet?

I lied. Ever since I left this place I haven't touched any language.

I am thinking of focusing on one definite foreign language and give it an honest go.

Should I even bother? Or should I just move on at this point?

the tamil word for flower is literally "poo"

>>213777549
Why did you lie?

>>213777645
>Why did you lie?
I don't know. I think it's because I had no "excuse" to post so I thought I could reinsert myself back here by acting like I started learning a new language. But I realized that it's only a matter of time before you catch up to my lie.
I feel bored and have recently been wasting at least 4 hours a day doing nothing but scrolling. What if I just studied one interesting language for one hour a day for a while and see if it sticks?

>>213777549
>Should I even bother? Or should I just move on at this point?
Move on, like I did. The eternal dabbler lifestyle is never sustainable, even if you're a NEET. Focus on more useful skills like programming or lifting.
But maybe I'll just learn a tiny bit of Georgian while I'm here

>>213777800
What if I sign up for this and just dabble for a bit and try to build consistency? Maybe it will work, no?

>>213761155
If you were royalty or nobility, this behavior would be normal
But to us normal people, it feels dirty when people are overly polite to us.

>>213777800
>or lifting.
One of the reasons I went into languages was to have something to listen to while Iifting/gym. Kill two birds and all that.

>>213761155
Sounding idiomatic is just as important as being grammatically correct though
>>213777645
He made up a story about his aunt being crazy for a long time before dying tragically, just for our attention.

>>213778185
I was just bored and wanted to spice things up. As cliche as it sounds, sorry.

I fucking hate [v] like what the fuck
just say b lmao
also [z] is just a joke, you wont make me believe in its existence
>noo it's completely different from s
prrofs?

When I talk (in English, my native language) sometimes the word order gets jumbled. Yesterday I said "You already showed us to them" when I meant to say "You already showed them to us." Another time, I meant to say "What song is this playing?" and meant to say "What is this song playing?" (although both technically make sense). I noticed immediately thereafter that I said the wrong thing, but I still said it. Is this the kind of thing that only happens in your native language? Do you guys do similar things in your native language?
>>213775900
If you hear/read it enough times eventually you'll get the drift of it anyway so that's still fine, and it doesn't take you out of the immersion. I do the same thing unless I keep hearing the same unknown word or phrase over and over again.

>>213767474
Dalida did that and nobody cared
but she was a star, so who nows

>>213777972
Listen to Motörhead, prime British music.

>>213778470
>Another time, I meant to say "What song is this playing?" and meant to say "What is this song playing?"
Vice versa I meant

>>213778558
not interested in music tbqh

>>213778910
How can you lift heavy without heavy music?

>>213736599 (OP)
someone can help me how can i improve in french
i want to know the language so when a french speaking person ( in great part here from africa ) asks if i speak his language,i would simply refuse , even if i know exactly how to speak

btw thanks all portugal frens for creating good house designs, i like them a lot :D

>>213779338
Listen to the sentence "do you speak french" in french 5-10 a day and after a week you'll never forget.

>>213777833
>My German Shill program is TOTALLY different from everyone else's

Does anyone else learn languages purely to read in them?
I know two languages in addition to my native where I am pretty proficient across the board, but in addition to these I know quite a few where I am only able to read stuff. If I tried to pronounce anything in them I would sound like a retard, but it is very easy to get to a good enough level to enjoy complex material if you stop caring about potentially interacting with people or non-written media.

>>213778316
English and French have a voiced/unvoiced distinction for every plosive and fricative but no other consonant except for two which are arguably neither plosives nor fricatives. It feels weird to me that Spanish doesn't have z or v or ð or ɸ but there you go.
>>213767474
Its okay, just tell everyone that you learnt from a southerner

>>213782430
>except for two which are arguably neither plosives nor fricatives
I mean there are two without a distinction when you could argue (although I would disagree) that they are fricatives.

>>213782053
yes, that is mostly what motivates me. I am too asocial and introverted, I just want to read in different languages

What languages would use this type of R sound (idk the term in linguistics or what it is) ? Ty
https://voca.ro/1fLr4aAGT2pl

>>213782053
I learned English only to be able to read in it. And when i got decent results i was able to read any book or text that i want read to, but how retarded i was, it would be better if i practiced output too.
Now im stuck and have to learn English gramma from scratch.. It's really not enough to only read in your target language, it sucks
And i suck too, kms

>>213782852
Just sounds like you're gargling?

>>213782852
Where did you find it

>>213777549
Jordanon, choose a language for me, please: German, Japanese, Italian or Spanish

>>213783398
Gargling : sound produced from the throat. I guess we could say that (R). Maybe it’s a stressed R

What’s the easiest (lol) Slavic language to learn ?
czech, Ukrainian are the hardest ones for pronunciation, maybe Russian too

>>213782852
Erhotic...

>>213785848
Thanks : so, “Rhotic” R

>>213785828
Bulgarian

>>213782852
Xir voice is so beautiful...

>>213786793
Well then, I will look into this, thanks for sharing. Not that it’s popular but I’m curious now

>>213786950
“Vielen dank”

>>213785828
Why do you want the easiest? Learn the sexiest (it's czech)

>>213788088
That’s going to be a big challenge, especially with the Ř and also the grammar cases. I’ll try to find a good tutor maybe and see if there’s a good introduction. They do have good media/movies though, that’s true

>>213785828
Bulgarian is supposed to have the easiest grammar. interestingly it's also closest to Old Church Slavonic, the first written Slavic language.
I've also heard Slovak is relatively easy for whatever reason. but Russian or Polish might still be smoother for the amount of material available

does anyone here use Learn With Texts or any of the other free lingq knockoffs? I just restarted using an installation I did years ago again for German. I think it is pretty well suited for when you have issues finding comprehensible input because you can look up definitions just by clicking on the word, which speeds things up. I will say it can be a little annoying for german because it obviously doesn't recognize verbs that have a separable prefix and each form of a verb will show up as a new word even if you'e encountered it before (eg gehe gehst geht will each show up as new words even though they are forms of the same verb).

>>213788739
I'd just use yomitan, ankiconnect and the yomitan pdf reader if I were you

>>213788712
Thanks

最近ほとんど日本語を使っていない
新年の頃から勉強もしてない
日本に行く機会が失われちゃったからなにか新しい言語を学びたいと思ってる
でも本当に日本語を勉強する旅に後悔がない
本当に日本から色々なこと気づきました
次は中国語にしようと思っています
我真的能学会中文吗

>>213789004
お前の日本語はまだ不自然だから次の言語に移るのは早いよ

>>213789386
次の言語に移るのは俺様の興味次第だ
日本語マスターになろうなんてそんなくだらないこと一度思ってない
どうせアメリカに住んでるし本当にこの言語を使う機会がない
もう理由がない
N2を合格したからもう十分だ

>>213788739
1. Comprehensible input is a meme.
2. Grind German’s irregular verbs and its conjugations. It’s a short list.

>>213790112
Dumb shitskin opinion. It's easy to learn the Germanic irregular verbs solely through exposure. Most of us did this when we were learning English.

>>213790112
"comprehensible input" just means reading/listening. the meme is when people say you have to 100% avoid grammar/vocab study outside of reading, and 100% avoid explanations in your own language. basically it's an overcorrection to people inefficiently grinding thousands of vocab and memorizing grammar paradigms before even reading

If you HAD to learn either French or German, which would it be and why?

>>213790504
><…. Both are hardcore, French is easier. German maybe is more useful (population) ?

>>213790112
I have found it very difficult to learn german verbs out of context. years ago I used to make word lists, essentially a manual version of spaced repetition (the gold list if anyone is familiar with uncle davey from youtube). there are just so many vaguely similar looking and sounding german conceptual verbs and a ton with the separable prefix, that I would have a hard time recognizing the verbs I had learned when I found them in a text. for nouns the word list worked really well for me.

>>213790112
Comprehensible input is absolutely not a meme. If you listen to hours of your target language at your own level or slightly above, everything sticks so much better and it'll feel rewarding going from very low level speech to grasping some dialogue from TV shows and so on.
Same with reading, I just tend to neglect it probably more than I should.

Comprehensible input works, the problem is it takes about 3x-5x as many hours to learn via CI.
Do you want to do 600 hours of grammar study and vocab flashcards? Or 2000 hours of watching blogs in your target language?

>>213736806
Deutsch und Französisch, aber mein Niveau beim Letzteren ist ehrlich gesagt unterirdisch im Vergleich zum Ersten. Kann mich kaum auf Französisch ausdrücken.

>>213790977
You won't ever be fluent unless you supplement those 600 hours of formal study with comprehensible input, because that is what makes your conscious knowledge about the language automatic.

>>213769928

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c8UhYxmWd_k&list=PLb5nZiuzvKAEl-RxINSf-dhn71sPaKIk-&index=101

you should be able to find the learn Ru. 366 days, 5,000 ru phrases 1 year, and 10,000 Ru words frequency order playlists on her channel.

Do 2 years of that. She will bring you up to speed on all the basics. if you need more, search her and other channels.

>>213790977
2000 hours. it honestly never ends, if you think your botched up "C1" is good enough for a job you are in for a rude awakening. grammar is not a math equation, you honestly do memorize all of the meme idioms and expressions if you want to be good at it.

>>213791109
Ty, might be looking at a one on one lesson but it’s a good resource, Ty

>>213790315
>Most of us did this when we were learning English.
As kids.

CI is a meme, you will only be able to understand input, do not produce output. If you don't speak, you don't speak.
>>213790910
How many languages did you learn by it? I guess, input only works when you're a child.

>>213791302
Passive study is like gathering tools for an imaginary toolbox; active study is like actually learning to use those tools. This is why early output is useless.
Besides, isn't it funny how the people who are attacking CI are both Asiatic subhumans?

I'm an eternal dabbler, I'm worse than jordanon

>>213791455
the key is to stay focused on one TL, but dabble in everything else along the way

>>213791523
I will never be fluent in my TL(s)

>do flashcards and grammar exercises
>reinforce what I learned via input
It just werks

>>213790395
But the post you're responding too was about setting up a software program to help him read texts in his TL. Isn't that purpose in line with the part you said is not a meme ("reading")? If so, what prompted your meme comment.

>>213791302
I don't ever see a practical need to "output" in my target language, so just being able to understand input would be fine by me. But the ideais not that you never output or don't need to output, but that with sufficient input, you will be ready to produce output in the TL--simple at first--without having to laboriously contrive it. It's not that you should never speak, but it's pointless to speak before a certain point in the language acquisition journey.

>>213791782
>he doesn't know about the learned knowledge-acquired knowledge distinction
>he doesn't know that learned knowledge never directly becomes acquired knowledge
>i heard he's not even going to prom

>>213791302
I actually feel my French output has gotten better by simply hammering input. I used to do output exercises early on but I don't feel as though they helped me at all. Spent like a year learning French that way and I didn't even feel comfortable asking basic questions by the end of it. I started doing Spanish a bit on the side as well and I already feel like I can use the language more effectively than I could use French in the same amount of time spent studying.

>>213745561
Welsh has the most actual good resources because it has the most actively native speakers. I can highly recommend it. It’s fun. It’s also way less retarded and ideological than Irish. I learned a little because I made welsh friends studying abroad.

Say Something in Welsh is literally just pimsleur made for welsh by a govt contract due to the absence of a pimsleur course or something similar.

There’s a BBC Cymru, speakers online, lots of books, etc.

>>213790977
>Comprehensible input works, the problem is it takes about 3x-5x as many hours to learn via CI.
I've made more progress with a few months of input than I have with years of more traditional French study. I think most can agree CI stuff sometimes gets a little cultish and at times even a little absurd but I really don't think there's any more efficient and effective way to learn a language than by focusing on CI. I think the two biggest problems CI has come from the lack of CI resources for some languages and the fact that some people seem to not really branch out from CI content to explore regular media in their TL.

>>213783123
What if you do not want to interact with people of that language? Take French for example. Good books, but horrible people.

>>213788739
No, I just raw dog PDFs or epubs in my TL. Looking things up is gay.

>>213791455
Same :'(

>>213736806
German. I'm really thinking of quitting. Not because of German itself, despite being difficult I really like the language and the Germans I've met IRL have all been very friendly. However, because of language learning as a whole. Not living somewhere that your target language is widely spoke robs you of the best language learning method which is total immersion and robs you of the best reason to learn which is you don't have a choice. We get a lot of Germans here, the tourists all speak English and the migrants all learn Spanish. And what I've realized is that this is going to be an issue for most languages. Even if you go live in a country that has your target language as the official one (a headache in and of itself specially if you don't want to be a fucking wageslave) they'll just switch to English. Wtf is the point. Seriously.

>>213791162
>grammar is not a math equation
I'm not the guy you're responding to and I think that debating language learning techniques is kinda gay but I still want to be contrarian about this point: the more you practice maths the more automatic it becomes and the less this makes sense

gigachad behavior

>>213782430
Spanish does have z and ð (as allophones. See: isla, dedo). It also has v in some dialects, but it's mostly people who are overcorrecting their speech.
>>213782053
Despite having watched thousands of hours of shows or videos in English I still have a pretty noticeable accent. I don't really care about it, I have never used it outside of classes, save for a couple interactions with foreigners whose native language wasn't English.

>>213793976
That's exactly my worry about learning Japanese or Brazilian Portuguese (Portugal is relatively close to Poland, but it's not a place I'd like to emigrate to, and they speak English really well, better than Germans). The only comfort is that Japanese and Brazilians don't speak English very well

>>213793976
>they'll just switch to English.
I'm sure people are willing to have conversations in their native language instead of having them in English. Even if everyone spoke English, not everyone is going to be able to talk about any topic in English.

>>213763548
>It's magical how the ability to communicate evaporates. So beware of it.
I can still read Borges after 3 years of not practicing Spanish but I can barely hold a conversation

>>213782430
English /f, θ, s/ were originally in variation with [v, ð, z]
these only became separate phonemes from French/Greek/Latin influence and some grammatical changes -> which is reflected in the fact that /z/ and /ð/ are still mostly written with s and th
/f/ and /v/ distinction derives from old French, so it was much earlier and thus is reflected in writing
/ʒ/ is also mostly French-derived

I think I'll remove Italian from my list. A nation of music, and at the top 10 of the charts is an Italian song in the Reggaeton style with French title, followed by some Puerto Rican song, then something Latin again, then Italian Reggaeton again, a Manu Chao cover, some Italian pop finally, Italian take on favelados music, shitty Italian trap, basic millennial pop from 2000s, some tolerable rap...
Grim
>>213795569
Yep. Same with English. I understand scientific papers, but I struggle to express myself

>>213790977
>Do you want to do 600 hours of grammar study and vocab flashcards? Or 2000 hours of watching blogs in your target language?
Or you can just do 50 hours of grammar study and vocab together with your 2000 hours of native content?

>>213789004
>我真的能学会中文吗
うん
日本語から中国語に移るのは結構簡単だな、英語知ってる奴がフランス語学ぶのと大体同じ難易度なんじゃないかな
とはいえ日本語と中国語のコンテンツの格が全く違うからモチベーション方面では苦労するかもな

>>213791380
>Besides, isn't it funny how the people who are attacking CI are both Asiatic subhumans?
You're right, im subhuman, kms

Russian is an extremely based language. It pretty much mogs everything besides English and Mandarin.
Inb4: trannies seethe

Russian is the grammar of Latin, the script of Greek, the attitude of French, and the vibe of Icelandic. Cool as fuck I daresay.

>>213795840
>I think
Stop! Commit to a language!