Thread 64070179

Were they required to be jump-qualified like their parachutist counterparts? I'm assuming that they still had to be a cut above regular infantry and receive special training on loading and unloading gliders, but they also trained in parachuting as a redundancy (i.e. a case where you might have enough planes, but not enough gliders and can press the glider troops into the role)?

Also post glider troops I guess.

>>64070179 (OP)
No idea about glider troops but I know that rapid response troops that are meant to be transported by helicpoters (is there a specific name for them?) recieve basic parachuting training. So my guess would be glider troops did so as well.

>>64070179 (OP)
Is it just hindsight or am I wrong to think that gliders were the fucking dumbest idea ever, surely a normal paratroop drop would just be safer than a semi controlled crash?

>>64070384
>Can theoretically wack gliders directly onto an LZ with a whole unit intact unlike scattering a gorillion paratroopers over a wide area.
>Can have gliders able to carry vehicles and support weapons
That's the theory, in practice gliders are scarily jank.

>>64070179 (OP)
The first glider troops in the US were line infantry units that were involuntarily converted to glider formations. Until Operation Varsity, they still wore infantry uniforms and weren't allowed to get airborne pay.
Conversely, glider pilots were taken from the bottom percent of OTS classes and from other flying schools that had washouts. They could only be Warrant Officers and their standards were largely dropped to get enough bodies for the program, they could wear glasses iirc.

>>64070384
Parachute drops were pretty much always chaotic shitshows, with troops dropped miles off target, wandering around lost, missing their weapons and ammo containers etc. It took ages for them to form up and move to their target. Glider-borne troops landed concentrated and with heavy weapons. when it went well it was perfect (see Pegasus Bridge) but when it went wrong it was horrendous, with entire platoons dead or having their legs torn off by landing on obstacles.

>>64070179 (OP)
>I'm assuming that they still had to be a cut above regular infantry
Parachutists aren't even "a cut above regular infantry." They're literally just regular infantry that jump out of planes. The prestige is 100% related to the absolute shitshow that airborne ops always are and the recognition that jumping from a plane into said inevitable shitshow is a raw deal. For that you get a special hat and jump pay.

>>64070179 (OP)
I miss gliders. So much potentials.

>>64070810
Nah it's because the press love the idea of shock troops to the degree that they will lie and claim parachutists arrived in key areas before the infantry. It's become the new game of Guards vs Line infantry.

>>64070572
Hijacking the thread real quick to talk about glider pilots because I think their story needs to be more widely known.
After combat landings and assuming they survived the crash, glider pilots had no real job to do so many just wandered around the countryside until they got bored. In Normandy, glider pilots were notorious for ninja looting all the cool shit off of battlefields and taking all the gifts from liberated civilians while the combat troops were still fighting (see pic related, an SVT-40 and Kar98k leaning against the boat in the foreground) causing the pilots to be reorganized into a rifle company with combat objectives after the Normandy landings. They would be tasked to pull flank security and hold key terrain, which were easy jobs that reflected on their lack of actual combat training.
During Operation Varsity, one of these pilot companies accidentally saved the day when their supposed easy objective turned out to be right in the middle of the Germans' escape route retreating from the British landing on the Rhine beachhead. The pilots were attacked by armor and heavy weapons and were on the verge of being overrun when a bazooka was found, and after figuring out how to charge the rocket, a pilot shot it at a nearby panzer, which panicked and drove into a flak gun that was being set up. The attack was broken up shortly after with their heavy weapons being destroyed and the other Varsity landing troops were free to move on their objectives.
https://www.airandspaceforces.com/article/valor-operation-varsity/

>>64070179 (OP)
What's the thing circled in yellow?

>>64070949
Thanks for the effortpost anon. That's good shit

>>64070384
It was an attempt at doing what helicopters can do.

>>64071609
Looks like one of those single-shot flamethrowers.

>>64070949
neat
>The retreating tank ran over one of its flak guns
good reminder that goofy darkly comic shit has always happened in war, it just didn't get recorded in HD and put online

>>64072299
Doesn't remind me of any model I know.

>>64072524
Wait, found it.
https://www.marketgardenmilitaria.com/product/us-ww2-airborne-pathfinder-m-227-signal-lamp/

>>64072875
Neat.

>>64070949
> when a bazooka was found, and after figuring out how to charge the rocket, a pilot shot it at a nearby panzer, which panicked and drove into a flak gun that was being set up.
you just made that up
in the OG text it doesn't really say this
chances are they were equipped with Bazookas as one doesn't just "find and figure out how to use a bazooka" in the middle of combat
also it just says that the retreating tank drover over the flak gun and another flak gun was captured by US infantry, doesn't say anything about "while setting up"

>>64070572
Weren't they looked down on and denied their parachute wings until one general took a ride in a glider and decided to give them the wings anyway because anyone insane enough to climb into a glider would be insane enough to jump out of a plane

>>64070572
>The first glider troops in the US were line infantry units that were involuntarily converted to glider formations. Until Operation Varsity, they still wore infantry uniforms and weren't allowed to get airborne pay.

W-WHAT?

>>64070572
>Conversely, glider pilots were taken from the bottom percent of OTS classes and from other flying schools that had washouts.

That sounds retarded

>>64076158

it is

>>64076158
>>64078540
its not

glider pilots don't need to be top tier
and it keeps the class motivated to do well

>>64076158
They were not expected to have high survival rates and would naturally fly very few missions. Their tasks were simple and dangerous .

Wasting intelligence on cannon fodder is poor use of assets.
That's why the AAF got higher intelligence recruits than infantry. Flying repeated missions was extremely demanding, with the 8th AF losing more airmen than the USMC lost total casualties in the entire war.

They might have been more satisfied as glider pilots than as navigators or bombardiers under the feet of the pilots they wanted to be.

>>64078553

Yeah but barely controlled landings are not something you want a total landings novice doing

>>64079673
You don't understand the mindset of how disposable infantry are considered versus how valuable a pilot is. Glider pilots need to make ONE combat landing for an entire operation or campaign whereas plane pilots need to land their plane how ever often they sortie.

In the military some people are just considered more disposable than others and glider pilots were that. It makes perfect sense.

>>64070810
The prestige is due to them being volunteers and had extra rigorous training on par with commandos and rangers in WWII. They're also very agressive and tenacious, so they get used as "fire brigades" to plug holes in attack and defence when they're not air dropped. This also adds to the prestige.

>>64079673
isn't learning to fly and land a glider literally the first thing military pilots (even today) learn?

>>64070810
t. Leg

>>64070572
>stuffing literal conscripts into rickety gliders

VDV moment

>>64079761

Landing a glider on a concrete runway with a training pilot ready to take the wheel in case you fuck it up =/= landing a glider in potentially rough terrain at night under fire

>>64085800
> with a training pilot ready to take the wheel in case you fuck it up
yea... about that

>>64085800
Whats the backpack the one standing in the middle has got on?

>>64086616
Its a backpack, loaded up with things and nick nacks too. Anything you might need, its got inside for you.

>>64082579
up until D-Day, literally every single glider assault with the exception of Eben Emael had ended in disaster. Nobody in the US military actually wanted glider troops, but it was the only way to drop division sized formations and equipment in a hurry.
The biggest problem was with the gliders themselves. Since training glider troops was firmly at the bottom of the Army's to-do list, the Waco corporation was able to get away with subcontracting and outsourcing most components of the gliders, all with no oversight from the government. The build quality of the airframes were atrocious to cut costs, as well as the thought that QC didn't matter since the gliders were supposed to crash land anyways, lead to massive losses in training. The Army didn't really care because they had heard the stories of The Hague and Crete, and thought that gliders crashing and the occupants dying horribly was just something that happened.
I forget the source, but I read somewhere that glider pilots suffered the second highest percentage of casualties by MOS in the entire military, behind submarine crews.

>>64070179 (OP)
be British glider pilot, 1944
name’s probably Nigel or Alistair
told you’re landing in occupied France in a coffin with wings
aka the Airspeed Horsa
made of plywood and raw British optimism
mission: land next to a bridge and take it before the Jerries know what hit ‘em
“quiet” insertion lol
training: crash into things until you’re good at it
take off night of June 5
get to Normandy
visibility: basically zero
glider release at 6,000 feet
pilot: “I’ve got this, lads”
slams down like a meteor in a wheat field
skids through barbed wire, a pond, and possibly a goose
final glider stops 47 feet from the bridge
Germans: "Was war das?!"
you and the lads burst out yelling “FOR KING AND COUNTRY” and "HOLD MY TEA"
enemy is so confused and sleepy they barely resist
within 10 minutes you take Pegasus Bridge
commander says the actual phrase “Ham and jam” on the radio
that was the code for success
Ham. And. Jam.
reinforcements show up later like “yo what happened”
you already secured the bridge, killed some Nazis, and brewed tea
mission is considered one of the most successful airborne ops ever
no engines
no backup
just wood, balls, and British spite
mfw the glider didn’t even have brakes
mfw you just slammed that bastard into France and won

>>64073113
no, they had glider wings (the predecessor to modern Air Assault wings—almost exactly the same design in fact). later in the war glider infantry were often cross-trained as paratroopers. one of the division commanders (can’t remember which) insisted that all his glider guys be dual-qualified.

>>64073086
If you read it in the context of "the guy with the bazooka in the nearest platoon got killed early, and it took a while til anyone found his body and figured out how to fire the thing" then it makes a lot more sense

There were nationwide glider enthusiast clubs in Germany and the Soviet Union to train pilot candidates in peacetime.
However, training them to fly heavy gliders loaded with troops and equipment would be costly and difficult.

>>64086616
it's just a regular m36 musette bag.

>>64079760

>had extra rigorous training on par with commandos and rangers in WWI

Paratroopers didn't have anywhere close to the level of training that the commando units undertook. They got told they were special, because the Army needed volunteers for a highly dangerous job.

This might be a stupid question, but did C-47s towing gliders also carry a full stick of paratroopers (who could presumably jump after the glider was released) or did they fly empty to save on weight?

>>64070384
You can have your transports tow gliders for double the guys per drop
Gliders are cheap and easy to build and dont need engines so you can get extra airborne manpower even at max plane production

>>64078604
>most intelligent branch of the US military lost more men than the dumbest (and gayest) branch

>>64070384
There are pros and cons. You can land a lot more heavy weapons and ammo to support your infantry, even light vehicles. Everyone lands in the same spot, so they're more organized and ready to fight quicker.

You can also land more of everything, you don't need transport planes fit for paradrops, any old bomber can drag along a cheap glider behind.

The downside was of course that they were insanely dangerous, almost a 50/50 shot at either great success or complete disaster. A crashed glider will take out an entire platoon as KIA/WIA

>>64070949
>The pilots were attacked by armor and heavy weapons and were on the verge of being overrun when a bazooka was found, and after figuring out how to charge the rocket, a pilot shot it at a nearby panzer, which panicked and drove into a flak gun that was being set up
This is some Men of War shit

>>64082579
>muh conscripts whining
Wait till you realize all major factions in WWII used mostly conscript troops and that the concept of a majority volunteer military is for most purposes and in practice a creation of the very late 20th century, pretty much only after the Vietnam War era.

>>64089065
The US Army paratroopers in WWII had training comparable to LRRP units in the early Cold War. In fact, WWII paratrooper training inspired the training given by Recondo schools in the 1960s, this was in large part from Westmoreland's experience since he was a paratrooper in WWII. They would also be issued specialized and unique gear and weapons.

>>64073686
>government finds a new way to shit on the people fight for it
At this point I'm surprised that you're surprised.

>>64070384
VDV gliders when

>>64090779

Yeah but using conscripts as paratroopers (who have demanding physical and psychological requirements on account of being more prone to serious injury and death just from parachute mishaps) is something that basically no one but the Russians do.

>>64090792

Westmoreland only became a paratrooper in 1946, he would have served with a lot of WWII vets though.

>>64086796

Imagine how differently shitshows like Market Garden would have gone if Howard Hughes' autism had paid off and strategic airlifters had been developed just a few years earlier.

>>64093252
not a lot different

>>64090809
fun fact the belgians did use conscripts in their para formations. grated they asked for volunteers after basic when they couldn't get enough professionals to sign up
there's a decent chance one of the guys in your pic is a conscript.

>>64093287

Having a conscript who wants to actually see some action/extra pay volunteer to attend jump school =/= forcing conscripts to attend jump school under threat of court martial

>>64093297
that's true but I don't know how the VDV does it's recruiting.
I know about conscripts being given the choice between "peeling potatoes in Germany for a year and a half or getting their jump badge" because one of my high-school PE teachers loved to regale us with his stories while he made us run laps until we collapsed l.

>>64093297
Also operation dragon rouge et noir are way under appreciated considering how successful they where.

>>64093473
>I don't know how the VDV does it's recruiting.

There are videos of Russian jumpmasters quite literally dragging screaming trainees to the door of the plane and physically throwing them out. Keep in mind that in the final test of jump school in the United States Army, if you show any degree of hesitation on the aircraft, you automatically fail and you're out of the airborne for good. Attempting to compel a trainee to jump from the aircraft against their will would almost certainly result in the instructor being court-martialed or at the very least removed from their position.


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7264049/Russian-paratrooper-screams-hysterically-tossed-plane.html?ito=social-twitter_mailonline

>>64094973
>training for war
vs
>training for the appearance of being able to war

>>64087144
That was Swing and the 11th Airborne.

>>64094973
>mfw the female cadet shows more balls than мишa when jumping
>theyre gonna fuck him till he melt that poor boy

>>64070838
helicopters stole the show and do it better

>>64090797
>oh no its unethical we employ our troops a certain way because we're putting them in a situation they don't want to be in

>>64096052
lacking in range.

>>64085800
Hi, my name is William C. Lee, and I’m an alcoholic.

I drank because I was obsessed with dropping soldiers out of the sky—literally tossing them into the unknown and hoping for the best. I convinced the Army that the future of warfare was flying men into enemy territory strapped to wooden gliders or jumping with parachutes. Sounds heroic, right? It wasn’t. It was terrifying—and a complete mess.

I ignored the reality that gliders crash. A lot. Planes get lost. Troops land scattered across fields, forests, or sometimes, cows’ backsides. People died because I was chasing this crazy idea, and when things went sideways, I blamed weather, equipment, anything but myself.

The bottle was my refuge when I couldn’t drown the sound of broken men, shattered plans, and failed missions. I told myself it was progress, but it felt more like throwing lives into chaos for the sake of innovation.

Now I’m here, admitting I pushed too hard, drank too much, and cost more than I can count. Flying infantry wasn’t just a gamble—it was my addiction.

Thanks for listening.

>>64096171
yeah

I still can't get over how good the fallshirmjeager were

>detach 10km from target
>target has no idea what's coming
>get to pick where you land
>based on Intel radioed an hour before you deploy
>crash into a heap of junk on the ground
>That's fine, because you're in a glider going 8km an hour
>have all your weapons and ammo in the right place
>have enough men to form a company within a 300m area
Sounds pretty good to me desu.
Compared to jumping, praying your chute deploys, getting scattered by the wind over 10 square miles with the enemy hunting you down on the ground and having no idea where you are, being armed with only minimal ammo, and possibly being bashed into a wall, tree, fence or being stuck in a tree.

>>64090809
Glider pilots weren't paratroopers, which is the whole point of that post.

>>64093473
All branches of the USSR/Russian military are mass conscript based from the enlisted to even many of the officers.

>>64097761
So good their first major drops ended in near annihilation and they spent the last half of WWII as depleted light infantry

>>64097761
>got suppressed and pinned by like a dozen Norwegian palace guards and let the King of Norway slip away right past them
>got an entire company and squadron of Ju-52s shot down when the targeted drop zone happened to also be a Norwegian army regimental command post
>got skullfucked so hard at the Hague that the regimental surgeon had to take command because literally every single officer had been killed
>got stabbed to death by angry Greek peasants because they jumped into battle unarmed
Ironically, the combat efficacy of the fallschrimjager improved once they were forced to accept conscripts and were relegated to being heavy infantry

>>64097761
You know they are good based on how they make a certain subset of people seethe.

>>64096360

kek

>>64090779
Canada was the only nation in WWII to have an all-volunteer army iirc. The government was trying to avoid a massive political crisis with the frogs who hated conscription which happened in WWI.

>>64097761
they were literally so bad at being paratroopers that they stopped being deployed in that role after Crete
they didn't even land with any weapons besides their sidearm. most of them got killed while searching for the gun pod that had their rifles and mgs

>>64102738
Jesus Christ really? I knew Crete was a mess never heard they didn't get their rifles when they dropped and had to scurry and find them. Krautism strikes again

>>64086537
That's a primary glider and they get launched from the top of a hill by people pulling a bungee cord and running. They're easy to fly and consequences for not figuring out how to fly by yourself in a few seconds are as minimal as possible.

>>64102738
Does anyone know when carrying your ruck and dropping it tethered before you land became standard? Did the us drop with their shit in WW2 but land with it on them?

>>64102761
The olive trees and shrubbery in Crete caused their parachutes to get tangled up easily on landing, made even worse by the fact that kraut parachutes were dogshit and didn't have quick release buckles so the fallschrimjager that got stuck were essentially paralyzed unless they got cut down or could reach their backup knife.

>>64102902

I've been to Crete and holy fuck what were they thinking dropping paratroopers there

>trees everywhere
>hills everywhere
>bushes everywhere
>rocks everywhere

You're basically guaranteed to land on something that's gonna hurt you.

>>64070179 (OP)
>Were they required to be jump-qualified like their parachutist counterparts?

No and they didn't receive extra pay either, even though gliders were probably _more_ dangerous parachuting.

Also, that thing circled in yellow is a big flashlight used by pathfinders to guide aircraft for glider/para drops.

>>64105295
>being forced to use an M1903

grim

>>64105181
>Jump out of Ju-52 that's taking AA fire
>Try to avoid snagging self in tree
>Fail because German rigging doesn't let you steer
>"Scheiße"
>Now dangling and trying to get your convoluted knife out to cut yourself loose
>A bunch of pissed off Greek farmers approach
>Drop your knife
>Draw your pistol because it's all you have
>Drop that too
>They beat you like a pinata

>>64094973
Well for us airborne you have to do 5 jumps on the last week, 2 day and 2 night jumps maybe a mas-tac

>>64102890
Idk when the "hook pile tape lowering line on the left side" came around but i just like saying it

1,900+ logged skydives plus several years when I was one of the kewl kidz and didn't log unless it was something weird like eating breakfast atop the gas envelope of a hot air balloon.

Incredibly vapid stupid fux can survive parachute jumps. Especially military rounds, my ellipticals will not land me survivably unless I actively fly them in and swoop land.

The only hard part of para trooping is the military stuff. Basic parachuting is easy after your initial jump. I give these guys their due as soldiers.

>>64109281
>mas-tac

Mass tactical jump?

>>64070179 (OP)
Lmao at that clown on the right

>>64070949

These guys look like they've had a rough time.

>>64114429
Christ, look at the size of those aircraft.

>>64115575
surviving getting smooshed has that effect on you.

>>64097781
>implying
In practice none of these are true and almost all historical glider landings prove that, lol. Arguably the only successful post-Eben Emael Glider operation, where the cargo wasn't just equipment for airdropped paratroopers, was the Pegasus Bridge and there a lot of their success came from the surprise and the decent training of bong glider pilots.

>>64116061
The bongs and Germans were the only ones who actually took glider ops seriously and instituted real air assault training. The Ox and Bucks who landed at Pegasus Bridge were also former line infantry that got voluntold to be converted to glider troops, but the bongs had the good foresight to swag all their glider troops out with paratrooper equipment and training. Their pilots had dedicated training as well and were expected to form up and fight with the infantry, but the RAF in general had a much more martial mindset after Churchill reformed their ground combat training after Crete.

>>64115748

Globemasters can carry an entire company in a single airlift

>>64102890
>Did the us drop with their shit in WW2 but land with it on them


all their shit was attached to them in some way, ruck straps where flipped over their shoulders and it was carried dangling underneath their reserve chute, weapon was put in a bag and attached to them with the chute strap or clipped on to their webbing depending on the weapon. later on they just ditched the weapon bag all together and just strapped the weapon into the chute strap like with the Garand with no bag.

>>64118818

Couldn't you strap smaller weapons like the M1A1 Carbine to your leg?

>>64119484
you would think so but you don't really see it attached there. it was usually worn in the bag attached to the web belt or folded up tucked into the chute strap. you don't really see anything but a knife or hawkins mine attached to the leg now that i think of it.

>>64119833

It was fairly common for paratroopers to strap knives around their boots

>>64105295
>Also, that thing circled in yellow is a big flashlight used by pathfinders to guide aircraft for glider/para drops.
Neat

>>64115952

true

>>64114461
that "clown" would beat you up, steal your money and car, seduce your girl and wake up to your mom making him breakfast

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jake_McNiece
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filthy_Thirteen

>>64070810
> For that you get a special hat and jump pay.
a special hat and jump pay=elite, since you get the craziest motherfuckers trying to join for the hat and pay

>>64105295

Is that camo painted on?

>>64095017
thanks anon

>>64124869
Spray paint yeah.

>>64114429
Ya, so basically for training to minimize injuries and deaths you have 2 go arounds to get everyone in the DZ, its to minimize the amount of people in the air at once which really helps to lower shit going wrong, just from personal experience each time someone landed on my chute and they had to ride down with me and trying not to eun into someone is a pain.

>>64118293
The c17 is so much more spacious it was really nice the one time i got to jump it compared to the c130

>>64070949
That explains why this guy was laying on his ass when the squad rolled up lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1xtiuqWFCc

>>64124080
Still a clown lmao

>>64102761
Yeah, it wasn't an ideal arrangement that's for sure.

>>64107257
It was 1943 before they introduce a muzzle device the Garand that would let it fire rifle grenades, so before that one guy in every 12-man rifle squad was issued an M1903 with an M1 grenade launcher attachment.

>>64127323
>before they introduced a muzzle device for the Garand
Ftfm.
I should go to bed.

>>64070810
They aren't anymore but in ww2 they absolutely were. These days infantry self select for motivation and the average national guard infantryman is equipped nearly as well as the 82nd. In ww2 this wasn't the case.

I was going through my grandfather's stuff after he died and his unit during korea was a south Dakota guard unit that was increased in size several times over with draftees. Their ship was leaving in 90 days and the draftees were reporting as civilians, with the unit responsible for basic training. I suspect that technical roles were trained elsewhere but the infantry were the units responsibility.

Compared to that the paratroopers were very elite.

>>64124080

oof

>>64109281

Do they you do one jump per day/night?

>>64118293

gobble gobble

>>64102738
> they were literally so bad at being paratroopers that they stopped being deployed in that role after Crete

>>64102902
> kraut parachutes were dogshit and didn't have quick release buckles so the fallschrimjager that got stuck were essentially paralyzed unless they got cut down


> The RZ-20, a specific model, was a notable advancement, differentiating itself with four quick-release harness ports, allowing for faster exit from the harness upon landing
> The RZ 20 parachute, used by German paratroopers (Fallschirmjäger) in World War II, was first used operationally in early 1941

>>64127673
>I was going through my grandfather's stuff after he died and his unit during korea was a south Dakota guard unit that was increased in size several times over with draftees. Their ship was leaving in 90 days and the draftees were reporting as civilians, with the unit responsible for basic training. I suspect that technical roles were trained elsewhere but the infantry were the units responsibility.
yeah in korea days the reserves pretty much had a one time 90 day summer camp basic training and then when they were activated the only infantry related training they got was on the boat to Korea. Where the Army units were almost treasonously underequipped and armed

The German RZ parachutes were deliberately optimized for very quick inflation.
The harness was attached only at the back, forcing the jumper into a head-first dive when exiting. This made the body a “stabilizer” and helped the canopy inflate cleanly with less oscillation.
All of this meant the chute could be safely deployed from 200–400 ft - much lower than Allied chutes, which usually required 600–800 ft minimum.
The suspension design (shorter lines, rear-only attachment) also produced less “parachute lift.”

The goal was tactical:
>Get the paratrooper on the ground faster.
>Reduce drift from wind.
> Minimize the time they could be shot at in the air.

Although parachute drops at low altitudes were possible, this forced transport planes to fly at low altitudes, which likely increased the number of planes being shot down in heavily defended battlefields like Crete.
This altitude made it difficult for AA guns to aim, but made AA fire from small-caliber weapons effective.

>>64070384
I miss AC2 when you could glide around

>>64134913

Isn't this photo doctored (specifically the plane being on fire)?

>>64134913
the planes are going to get shot at either way
might as well reduce the time the paratroopers are exposed

>>64134110
>very quick inflation

>>64105295
>pineapple grenade
>is painted yellow

>>64107257
Yeah they should have used the superior M1903 USMC instead.

>>64136813
the only problem is that now your strategic airlifters are vulnerable to being shot down by small arms fire.
In Norway, eight Ju-52s were shot down by fucking Madsen guns after the Fallschrimjager tried to zerg rush a Norwegian regiment. This failed because the field identified as the drop zone was actually being used as a Norwegian regimental command post.

>>64140060
>eight Ju-52s were shot down by fucking Madsen guns

Fucking how

>>64090803
Gliders are beyond russian technology...

They do have a fuck ton of An-2s though..

>>64070384
You're wrong. A really good glider pilot could land his glider within a hundred yards of where you wanted infantry. The british did this at Pegasus bridge, dropping gliderloads of troops on top of the bridges to capture them before the Germans could blow them up, even though they were literally wired ready to go already. Nowadays paratroopers with modern chutes can land on a plastic plate, but back then paratroopers were extremely scattershot in deployment.
The real puzzling thing is that the british spent months hand picking glider pilots and soldiers for this D-Day action and then months training them on specially constructed scale models of the bridges and then apparently forgot all of that before Market-Garden.

>>64071928
In some ways they're actually even better than helicopters for point actions like this because they're nearly completely silent, you won't hear a glider till it lands.

>>64070211
Atleast in the United States, rapid response unit deployed by helicopters is the Air Cavalry, or just Cavalry since the combat horse Cavalry are disbanded

>>64134920
Rise of the Ronin (2024) also has a glider and really feels like AC2/3. Give it a shot.

>>64070949
best post on /k/ in years

>>64140060
a plane is vulnurable to small arms up to about 2,500 feet
what you gonna do, Have paratroopers be in the air for 2+ minutes? If there's a machine gun that can shoot at planes it also can shoot at paratroopers

also I doesn't say that all 8 Ju-52s lost were shot down by small arms, "Kampene i Norge 1940" which is quoted on wikipedia mentions that the cause of loss for two of the Ju-52s is unknown and that it is assumed that they crashed and sank, for the rest of the 6 it doesn't explicitly say it either

>>64141230
>>64141489
https://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Dombås
correction: they were shot down by Browning M1917s, which is only slightly less humiliating imo.
Wikipedia uses the same source of Kampenie i Norge for the casualties and claims that only eight out of fifteen aircraft returned to base. Seven got shot down and one made a controlled landing in Sweden. I don't know who's right, maybe a Norwegian anon can chime in.

>>64141681
> wikipedia uses the same source
never trust wikipedia
have seen stuff like this so many times, just because they claim it's based on said source doesn't mean it actually is

don't even know where they get the "Browning M1917" from - searching for it in the book that is cited yields 0 results and the page that is cited doesn't mention any specific machine gun type either

>>64073086
>>64087180
not the previous guy but you did straight up make that up.
it doesnt say anything about the bazooka and then
>light Officers Chester Deshurley and Albert Hurley held their positions, firing their machine guns until the tank came within fifteen yards of them, as did Flight Officer Robert Campbell, armed with a tommy gun. At that point, Flight Officer Elbert Jella severely damaged the tank with his bazooka.

Why did you make shit up you think this is plebbit ?

>>64141681

At least M1917s are belt-fed.

>>64073686
Medics didn't get combat pay because they weren't combatants, so it makes sense for glider guys to get fucked over too.

>>64096317

kek

>>64093252
One of the most plausible what-ifs, we came so very close to the formula. Built this, realized much like the German Me 321>323 development cycle it would be even more useful under it's own power, plus unlike them we could afford the spare engines. Then we won and the entire R&D pipeline short of jet turbines got put on hold for decades, leading to these crazy glimpses of 1960-80s ideas and hardware circa 1944-45 - airlifters, flying wings, drones, F&F guided missiles.