Thread 64116197

Thoughts on Self-Defense Insurance and is it worth it?
I currently have USCCA but having been hearing a lot of bad stuff about them and watched some of their videos "addressing" those concerns which only further confirmed them. Now I'm considering either LawShield (since you don't have to pay back any fees if you take a plea etc.) or just getting a Lawyer on a Retainer.

>>64116197 (OP)
I wouldn't bother, seems like they're about as good as relying on a public defender but you have to pay

If you find yourself in a situation where you need to take out your iron might has well aim all rounds to the head and save yourself a long time wasting trial.
Just say he was big and threatning and you reacted on instincts and that was to mag dump his ugly face.
No need for insurance after that.

>>64116197 (OP)
>self-defense insurance
It's called having a lawyer.

And yes if the parents take you to trial the Nigger teen not being able to emotionaly manipulate the jury, there is no reason to suffer such shit just for human deciency.
Aim all rounds to be lethal than provide useless CPR and say you tried to save him afterward.

>>64116221
>And yes if the parents take you to trial the Nigger teen not being able to emotionaly manipulate the jury,
Can you type this again with proper spelling and grammar? I have no idea what you're trying to say.

>>64116197 (OP)
If you're worried about getting into a self defense shooting that's legally ambiguous enough to get you charged and go to trial then you need to spend your money taking classes and hitting the range.
CCW insurance is 100% a scam.

>>64116222
Some nigger decides to jump.
You shoot him and he becomes a disabled nigger.
Parents sue you and now you have to oay him for the rest of his life wageslaving while he neets.

>>64116226
Why are you incapable of typing in complete sentences? Brain damage?

>>64116197 (OP)
Whatever you do do NOT listen to the tards on /k/ who say not to get it, because they're either memeing or really that stupid. If you don't have a Lawyer you will go to Prison and thats time you will have to do anon: HARD TIME

>>64116242
Why did you capitalize "lawyer" and "prison"? Are you German? Why does everyone on this board type like a retard? Lead poisoning from shooting in unventilated indoor ranges?

>>64116247
>doesn't know about proper grammar
Everything is going to be alright anon, everything is going to be alright anon. I said that everything is going to be alright.

that fag from tfb is going to show up and shill for insurance itt and no its not weird that a super successful attorney has time goon on 4chan all day

>>64116257
tbf?

>determine you might need to use a gun to defend yourself
>ignore the realities of our fucked legal system and greedy victimhood culture

If you believe you'll use your firearm, then you need some kind of legal protection.

>>64116266
>>64116257
*tbf
Lmfao, excuse my autism.

>>64116255
The words "lawyer" and "prison" are not proper nouns. I don't know how they do it in your native language, but in English only proper nouns, the first word in a sentence, and the pronoun "I" are capitalized in a normal sentence. Headlines / titles have their own rules, as well as initialisms. What we do not do in English is capitalize for emphasis.

>>64116247
A solid 90% of posters on /k/ are yuros and/or have never shot a gun before. Even less would stand to know how American self-defense laws actually work.

The 2nd Amendment is dead if you risk prison time for lawfully defending yourself

>>64116197 (OP)
I have USLS. Had to use it once, but that was literally because I wanted a lawyer to look into a bad traffic stop I had in Wyoming. Their attorney couldn't help me, but I got pointed in the right direction. For self defense stuff, I haven't ever had the chance or need to use them.

>>64116333
trips of truth

>>64116214
>>64116221
Just do what guy in webm related did and leave the scene immediately without identifying yourself. Let your lawyer handle everything. It's the police's job to investigate the homicide. If they question why you fled the scene, just say you were highly stressed and panicked after you protected yourself from a deadly theat.
>>64116225
I guess you were living under a rock during the whole Kyle Rittenhouse thing.

>>64116394
Once again, I'm begging you people to read a fucking book and learn how the law works. What did Kyle Rittenhouse do to get charged?

>>64116336
The thing is that a court has to decide if it's lawful, and 99.99% of people are unfit to represent themselves in a court of law.

>>64116544
He shot three pedos in a clear-cut case of self-defense that was all caught on camera. He was charged with two counts of homicide, one count of attempted homicide, and two counts of reckless endangerment because the jewdicial system wanted to make an example out of him just like they did to Derek Chauvin. District attorneys are political hacks who know a grand jury could indict a ham sandwich.

>>64116604
Okay we're getting there. Where did he shoot the three pedos?

>>64116639
One of them in the arm and the other two in the torso, if I recall correctly.

>>64116197 (OP)
Any and all CC insurances are a scam. You can't insure illegal activity. Anyone telling you anything different is either a scammer, Jewish, or a scamming Jewish insurance agent.
>https://youtu.be/Fx5wLx63Bvc?si=kDJurupttjkTqeTS

>>64116197 (OP)
It's a scam.
USCCA is the biggest scam of them all. I think CCW Safe is the least scammy out of all of them but do your research. Don't give USCCA a fucking dime of your money

>>64116197 (OP)
They take all your money and when you need them they try to prove you're a criminal so they don't have to help you.

>>64116197 (OP)
What are they going to do that a shitty no-name lawyer on retainer wont do, other than deny you service to pocket your insurance payments without having to pay out?

>>64116242
Self defense insurance is a lawyer

>>64116301
That's not true. Communism is lenin/marx shit and communism is the dipshit irl version.

>>64116679
Can't tell if trolling or just retarded. Of course you can't insure against intentional criminal acts, but you can insure against civil liability and the cost of criminal defense. I have no idea if any particular CC insurance policy is a scam, but the idea in principle is entirely valid.

>>64116755
Self defense insurance is so you can pay for a lawyer, you imbecile. Unless you're quite wealthy, you won't be paying for a criminal defense out of pocket, and most public defenders are only marginally better than no lawyer at all.

>>64116773
Well then how do you think it works? Look at this mysterious hole you've described, as if the idea of financing is just dreams and stories. Do you not regularly work with a lawyer?

>>64116773
Marginally is the understatement of the year. Even the guy who barely passed the bar is miles ahead of almost all defendants

>>64116763
>>64116773
ok now what do you do when you're stuck with a charge you could beat BUT the CC Insurance decides you're guilty (cheaper)?

>>64116787
Are you retarded?

>>64116795
No, because they absolutely do it all the time.

>>64116763
>>64116773
nta but if youre being charged its because you are suspected of committing a crime which allows the insurance company to deny your claim if they wish, which is what happened to the guy in sc. its entirely up to them and whatever arcane formula they use to determine whether they want to pay out or not. its not a sure thing that they will actually pay out anything

>>64116807
see? Totally not a scam, it's just you fucking you.

>>64116394
This guy did nothing wrong. Protected the people. Which is what conceal is for.

>>64116221
In a civilized society we wouldn't have to shoot to kill.
>You committed a crime and got shot? Be glad you lived.
Unfortunately we live in an occupied state that hyperfocuses on made up racial divides that were invented and emphasized by the same group of hyper-rich people that own the media, control political discourse, and donate billions to political campaigns. The only people not getting fucked are the ones in charge.

>>64116786
The issue is not knowledge, it's time. If you hire a lawyer, you get 100% of the time you're paying for. If you get assigned a public defender, you're one of several clients that lawyer is handling concurrently and you get however much time is available depending on the other cases and the lawyer's assessment of your importance versus the other defendants. I'm not arguing you should represent yourself, I'm arguing you should hire your own attorney rather than use a public defender if at all possible.

>>64116807
Nothing is a sure thing. Welcome to life. So what's your plan? If you have half a million dollars sitting around to self-insure, then good for you. But if not, what's worse - take a chance that the insurance company might decide you're guilty and refuse to pay, in which case you have to fall back to the public defender, or take a chance on the public defender to begin with? If you're so broke that the insurance premium is a major obstacle, then go for the latter. But if you actually have something to lose?

>>64116257
Just in case anyone believes USLS is bullshit, picrel is the most, uh, unusual case I ever handled for a USLS member (for free, or for $11/month or however you want to look at it). Details redacted although the case is public record. One more time - I had to defend this guy because USLS called this self-defense.
It's too bad that other companies are scams because USLS genuinely is not.

>>64116760
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proper_noun

>>64116782
You think that somebody is going to give you a loan to pay for a criminal defense if the circumstances are dodgy enough that insurance wouldn't cover it? Sure.

And there's a reason people have insurance for things instead of just taking out loans every time there's an unplanned major expense.

>>64116763
https://youtu.be/ED7xenrKnqc?si=RZVCiP_95b2p4ced
Have fun getting fucked by both your CC insurance and your local prosecutors.

>>64117014
>Half a million
If this from a movie or something? Real ones don't cost this much

>>64116394
He was completely justified in doing that though

>>64117058
Depends on the case and the lawyers. A simple case in a non-hostile jurisdiction would be much cheaper. But that's not what the insurance is for. A complex case with attorneys that specialize in self defense cases with multiple expert witnesses will cost a fortune. Rittenhouse's defense cost $2 million.

>>64117049
>?si=RZVCiP_95b2p4ced
thank you glownigger-kun

>>64116839
He didn't get charged btw
>>64116553
Actually cops decide that. First and foremost when they arrive at the scene.

>>64117023
kek you should make a video about the legalities of paintball guns

>>64117105
No problem, sweetcheeks.

>>64117014
>i cant afford not to pay for a scam
this seems like the sort of reasoning somebody who gets involved in a questionable self defense shooting would use desu. if you think $25/month is gonna save you from the local maoist DA looking to crush your nuts, i say go for it.

>>64116197 (OP)
There is a company called "Attorneys on Retainer," They are not an insurance company but rather a co-op where you and every other member share the cost of an attorney on retainer. It's better because they can't deny you legal help the way insurance companies can. It's ~$35 per month which is expensive but will definitely cover you, plus it's cheaper than actually getting an attorney on retainer and paying for it yourself. Armed Citizens Legal Defense Network (ACLDN) is a more affordable co-op, but I don't know much about it.

>>64116226
His parents can still sue you in civil court if the criminal dies. You'll need a lawyer anyway.

>>64116394
TEXAS JUSTICE = GIGA BASED.

>>64117167
Let me guess, you also don't have health insurance because there's no guarantee they won't find some excuse to deny coverage if you get cancer.

>>64118277
NTA. Most health insurance companies tend to have better rates of coverage; self-defense insurance companies tend to let BCBS and United look good.

>>64117116
>Actually cops decide that. First and foremost when they arrive at the scene.
Cops are not prosecutors

>>64116197 (OP)
if you can afford it, just find a reputable defense attorney and get them on retainer. And they'll be there for other crap too besides just you murdering people

>>64116197 (OP)
>or just getting a Lawyer on a Retainer.


Just do this

>>64117023
I dont understand this email or your post.
are you trying to say that USLS got this guy off? or defended him successfully?
what was the outcome of this case.
I have been a member of USLS for like 10 years. Signed up at a firearms event in Washington State that had like half a dozen USLS reps giving out free shit. Seemed like a good idea when I was 25 years old, I'm 35 now and have never needed it so I've questioned cancelling it.

>>64118630
A police report is the first thing a prosecutor looks at when deciding to file charges. Your ability to confidently illustrate the fear for your life and sequence of events that led to the lawful self defense shooting to the responding officers will be the difference in you going home for the night or getting detained.
See: the Arizona 10mm guy that everybody likes to use as a source in these threads. Dude had a lawful shooting, but got got because he kept changing his story and leaving details out. The cops thought he was the aggressor because he was nervous and acting like an idiot so they charged him.
Things like forensic evidence that could exonerate you aren't immediately available, so cops at the scene rely on your own testimony and witnesses to make a determination. That's why knowledge of the law, your duties, equipment, and capabilities are so important in order to demonstrate that you acted within the law.

>>64116197 (OP)
I saw all the bad press with USCCA and some of the concerns with Law Sheild and AOR. Went with Right to Bear because they had a local rep at the lgs.

>>64119767
The point is that they covered this as self-defense, which is, frankly, incredible. The chief complaint about these services is denial of coverage to members.
Relatedly, people think AoR is something it's not. They originally denied misdemeanor cases and revised their policy. If you called them with a case about someone stealing your car, they'd probably deny that claim because it isn't self-defense. That's understandable, but the point is that they have a definition of what they do and do not cover, just like every other company out their. They have cleverly re-framed their program as "attorney on retainer" when it's really insurance, but now they can say "insurance company bad, attorney on retainer good" and people believe it because everyone hates insurance companies.

>>64119767
>I have been a member of USLS for like 10 years. Signed up at a firearms event in Washington State that had like half a dozen USLS reps giving out free shit. Seemed like a good idea when I was 25 years old, I'm 35 now and have never needed it so I've questioned cancelling it.

I remember my first serious felony case for USLS and the guy saying "man, I almost cancelled because I thought I'd never need it."
It's the same thing when people win a raffle, just the shitty version. "I never thought I'd actually win." It's improbable which is why it's cheap, and it's cheap because it's improbable. Increase the risk, increase the premium.

>>64119910
This is why you don't talk to the cops period, and just lawyer up immediately. Talking to the cops can never help you. The best thing to do is just stonewall them and let your lawyer take care of everything, since he knows all the rules and is an officer of the court. Its your defense attorney's job to protect you, and you can't get in trouble for going to one for help.

>>64117116
It went before a grand jury, and the grand jury chose not to charge him.
https://texapedia.info/grand-jury/

>>64119770
>t.Cuck

>>64119962
>>64120303
>Relatedly, people think AoR is something it's not.
Bruh I was thinking about switching to AOR...It's so over man.

>>64116197 (OP)
Its probably not. Only reason I went with it is i had a massive discount through my work. I won't be renewing it for another year though. If you live in a really bad area maybe? But then you're better off just saving that money to get a down payment or for rent somewhere else