Thread 24813382

Stop Procrastinating Edition

Previous: >>24804211

/wg/ AUTHORS & FLASH FICTION: https://pastebin.com/ruwQj7xQ
RESOURCES & RECOMMENDATIONS: https://pastebin.com/nFxdiQvC

Please limit excerpts to one post.
Give advice as much as you receive it to the best of your ability.
Follow prompts made below and discuss written works for practice; contribute and you shall receive.
If you have not performed a cursory proofread, do not expect to be treated kindly. Edit your work for spelling and grammar before posting.
Violent shills, AI jeets, relentless shill-spammers, and grounds keeping prose should be ignored and reported.

How fast do you guys type? I know it doesn't really matter for writing but I played this and I can only average around 55wpm

>>24813415
55 is okay. I usually top out at ike thirty-five.

Wrote this piece; what do you guys think?

>>24813415
According to a recent botnet sprint I did, about 20‐30. Maybe as median as 14. If I drink past my drinking tolerance it goes up a few dozen notches.

>>24813415
how fast is fast? i know i can type faster than anybody. so probably 100+?

>>24813509
This shit is ready to be published, bro. You need to pull the trigger and just do it. There is no more advice here that's going to help you.

trying out a new prose style. also edited quite heavily, trying to resolve issues from last thread. all feedback is welcome.

I kind of don't give a shit what /lit/ says anymore. I'm submitting pieces to journals instead of languishing over some chimerical slop designed to elicit the least amount of criticism on this fucking zoomer board. If your writing is just designed to not get torn apart, I can't see how it's doing anything worth thinking about.

>want to write
>wife keeps nagging me for sex
Fucking hell

anyone else not start writing because they think their grammar might be too shit?

>>24813850
No? But if you're having that doubt maybe this isn't the hobby for you no offence. Read more, and maybe write in your native language

>>24813509
Would you stop posting my story you piece of shit. Write your own.

>>24813382 (OP)
ZUTTING
this is the new current meme
gross but funny kek

>>24813509
Hot garbage

>>24813877
You had better publish it on kindle before he does. Because in his version Victoria gets blacked and jeeted all at once, maybe even chinked up her third hole. Guess which version is going to sell better, yours or his?

>>24813868
English is my native language but I have this doubt.

>>24813509
>talk
>talk
>talk
I hate women so much bros.

>>24813889
i dont get it

>>24813721
The prose is better, actually decent enough. Now it's just a matter of okay, what next? A bunch of morons doing drugs in a bathroom and one of them OD's isn't something that can't be in a story, but it's also not particularly interesting.
One suggestion:
Why does he mention Pulp Fiction, twice, if there's no acknowledgement or response at all?
First, I'd drop the "he thought of that scene" line entirely. The dialogue is plenty for the reference, and actually increases the "dumb guy panicking and saying stupid shit" theme more than if he thinks about it first.
Second, have some kind of response to it.
"I've never seen it."
Or
"What the fuck are you talking about, Dave?"
Or something. As ir right now, we just have a reference to a movie... and nothing. It just sits there, comparing itself to your scene with no context and no purpose to your scene. Either use it show the narrator is a dumbass or use it to contrast the events. Don't just remind us that Tarantino is really good, because Tarantino being good doesn't do anything for you.

>>24813721
please just indent the fucking paragraphs

>>24814001
Don't indent digital paragraphs, it looks like ass. That tiny bump in the wall of text doesn't help readability at all, but only makes it worse. Clear spaces between is much better, and both are not to be used at the same time.

>>24814036
Don't listen to this reddit spacing idiot. It only works on screens because nobody knew how to indent online so it's been defaulted to a space between paragraphs. But it doesn't read well in a book, it makes it feel like the indication that time passed far too much. And of course, redditors like this anon here can't read indents or regular books anymore because they trained their brain to only read reddit spacing

>>24814036
>both are not to be used at the same time.
Can't disagree with you there.

>>24814036
>>24814045
>Don't indent digital paragraphs
I am a jeet and cannot read

>>24813908
does she redeem herself and get bleached?

Where do you guys start your story from? Or maybe a better question would be, what is the backbone of your story? I've heard different people say it's best to start with the plot, or the theme of the story, or the characters, and I'm curious what the thoughts are here. I'm honestly starting to come around to the idea that the best way to have a story that really leaves a lasting impact on the reader is to start with an idea or theme, and build the rest of the story around it. Have a theme, and all of the characters should at least be tangentially related to it. If your theme is something really profound or interesting, and the cast of characters have a point to existing, the plot should come naturally

>>24814068
in medis res

Do you listen to music while you write?

>>24814134
Yea

>>24814134
I can't listen to music while doing anything focused, can't have people talking either. Absolutely zero tolerance. General background noise like a fan or just brown noise through my headphones to drown everything else out is beneficial. I wouldn't want music to influence my writing in some way that I'm not consciously aware of anyway.

>>24813601
I will send my manuscript to foids. We shall see if 4chan usage will fuck us in the ass.

>have LLM write descriptions
>focus on the fun stuff
Is it really that easy?

>textbooks blowing
what does this mean?

>>24814045
>can't read indents or regular books anymore because they trained their brain to only read reddit spacing
you just solved the illiteracy problem congratulations
>indents

do u guys study a lot of professionally written writing? Like, do you break down the scene structures, plot structure, the way paragraphs weave one into another, etc.? How extensively do you note your findings?

Just curious

https://egregoreandi.substack.com/p/circles-deeper
short story of mine, keen for any and all feedback.

>>24814134
jazz, ambient, anything instrumental works. but mainly the sounds of the city coming in through my window.
>>24814068
stop thinking about it so hard. think less, write more. the story'll work itself out if it's worthy of being written.
>>24813742
I like your attitude towards writing, but the poem doesn't do much for me.
>>24813721
stylistically decent, but I get the feeling you've watched more films than you have lived life and it shows in the text.

>>24814626
No.
My hot take is those technical skills should be learned solely entirely through subconscious exposure and not through analytical dissections (presuming you already have the foundational knowledge of it.) I've seen too many people hyper focus on pacing and structure to the point it sterilizes prose that was already excruciatingly flat. The more you read good writers, the more you begin to intuit the rhythm and from there you begin to let the prose guide it rather than force it the other way around.
The obvious exception is script writing. I'd even say its imperative to dissect them because the clinical nature is fundamental to their nature. No one enjoys reading scripts, they enjoy the possibility to tell a story with its skeleton of ideas.

>>24814641
i've done more drugs than i've watched films than i lived life, but you're onto something. i've literally attempted to account for it as happened, but reality's even dumber than fiction. no, sorry. i just didn't pay much attention, that night, i guess. glad you find the style ok tho

>>24814068
only one (1) thing: whatever the fuck helps anchor and motivate you to finish it
for me its usually a specific mental moment that captures both mood and by extension theme

>>24814659
I don' see how it would sterilize prose. Maybe if you're writing from a very detailed outline, sure, but if you separate out your study time from your writing time, say, morning and evening, there shouldn't be a problem. I would say close study of your favorite writers would fertilize your unsconscious more than simply reading for enjoyment

>>24814259
>foids
they are the last people who want to read about saints

>>24814695
It's more the fact that those who rigorously go through pieces tend to be amateurs and it ends up clogging their background faculties instead of greasing the gears. Even if they separate the time frames, they inevitably want to apply it. Trying to account for beats, ensuring they're keeping on pace, looking back at their outline all while trying to balance shit like passive voice such that nothing comes out natural is poorly stilted. And between the two, I think the average laymen confirms the former is much easier to intuit than the latter - the story slowed in the middle vs the alliteration really accelerated that sentence which made it yadda yadda.
I'll go further and say that even with second drafts, more often than not you're needing to decipher what your story is getting wrong less than mirroring what works in someone else's.
Of course there's some merit to it. But with the student works I've read and the fact that authors like Sanderson attest to it, I think it's better not approached in that fashion.

>>24814626
No. I just read and consume. This is why I recommend reading good literature is so important because it's a subconscious process. It's like the scene in one of the OG TMNT movies where splinter is a rat apeing his master doing kung fu moves. I simply soak and absorb the information that way.

>>24813509
i cant tell if this is wng or rr or shitposting or all the above

“Put your hee hee in my hoo ha,’ the woman said. Her tits were huge.
The man shredded his jeans with his bare hands. His erect penis throbbed in the air like a baby reaching for his mother’s breast. “Okay, bitch, it’s time for some thunder!”
And then they banged.

>>24814792
You're going to have to be a lot more descriptive if you want to write "romance".

>>24814750
>>24814751
what if all i care about is putting out popular genre fiction, and not literature?

>>24814792
I'm hard.

>>24814828
Still applies.

>>24813382 (OP)
>Stop Procrastinating Edition
But what if I'm using writing to procrastinate on other things?

What's the secret to writing good metaphors?

>>24814068
The characters are the backbone I use. I start by placing each character in a scene that lets them play out who they *are* in essence. This gives me a better idea of how they would likely react to different scenarios and to each other and I often figure out their motivations this way. Then once I have a good grasp of all the main cast, I start brainstorming different scenarios to throw them into to see what they would do. I'll often find I accidentally hit the same themes repeatedly simply because a character embodies that theme in a specific way so I end up with a thematic through line by accident.

>>24814856
His dick was a large tree trunk, as thick as a gnarly English Oak. The strength of his thrusts were the rough Atlantic seas. Her moans the wails of Grecian sirens.

>>24813721
This is really good. I have no notes.

>>24814761
you could state why you hate it. the rest of us love this story. its the best story right now. It has blacked, jeeted, chinked, saints, revenge, angry testable woman, correction rape, and something about jesus.

>>24814930
>the rest of us love this story
>its the best story right now

>>24815080
Join us on the right side of history.

>>24813415
If I am just getting words on the page? 60 I would guess. I have a 90-100 if just copying shit down. But when having to think, it slows a lot more. Then if writing creatively even more because I am thinking about everything.

>>24813415
70 wpm

>>24813945
English is not my native language but I have no doubts.

>>24813415
the higher the wpm the more you suck at writing

t. 120wpm

>>24813415
Between 95 and 100 if I'm copying.
Slows to an absolute crawl if I'm trying to really nail it.

hows ur guys writing going?

>>24815967
The writing is going well. The selling is going not so well.

>>24815967
Terribly. I’ve been revising the first book but it’s just turning into rewrites and each chapter is taking me a month for some reason I think I’ve burnt out. I finished writing book 2 earlier this year and that beast was over 100k words.

>>24813509
The line

Victoria's mother led a worry-free upbringing believing her daughter would have no trouble finding a husband

you can change husband to suitor and it would flow better. Tiny change to the prose.

>>24813509
The indenting changes after
>courtesy rather than sincerity.
Why is this?

>>24813382 (OP)
What're the rumors for your characters?

>>24816176
Bad crop.jpeg

>>24816187
thank you

>>24816179
1 hes gay
2 hes gay
3 hes gay
4 hes gay
5 shes gay
guess which one is the lie

>>24816179
1. he has a poor judgemnt of character
2. he's a bad shot
3. he's too trusting
4. he's always scheming for the moment to seize power for himself
5. he has plans within plans for when things go pretty south

Give me your thoughts

>>24816621
'its long chain creaking and rattling' -> 'its long chain creaked and rattled, until it fell short of touching the water's surface'. Rework all the present tenses a little more. Maybe it could be better to rework the monologue so he says it outward and make it more lively with him interacting with the others through dialogue. Maybe, just me. I try to rein in monologuing if I can help it if a character isn't alone, myself. I thought this was a nice piece overall.

>my favorite story is also the least popular
What explains this?

>>24816621
excellent. better than the shitty victoria story being shilled.

>>24816664
Bro... that's part of the Victoria cinematic universe.

>>24816685
meds

>>24813415
I can hold about 130 wpm for a few minutes. After that it drops to the 100-120 wpm range.
I can write about 35 wpm on my phone though.

I told someone at work I wrote a full novel (it came up) and they didn't even believe me. Feelsgoodman

Everyone fawning over this Victoria slop just excites me for when my book is published. Just you wait until this board's been exposed to my protag for a while. The memes will flow.

>>24816663
Taste

>>24814856
Just write bad metaphors and then make them good

>>24814626
Hell no, doing that shit will set you down the dark path to formulaic writing

If you don't like Victoria, you can't be a good person.

>>24813382 (OP)
>Filled with the sudden urge to write a story off the top of my head and fling it out there, raw and unvarnished, into the wilderness as a short serial
Dare I follow this edition's theme?

>>24816995
But your protag is Victoria

Wrote an article about Idubbbz, lolcows and dehumanization. Would like any feedback you have.

https://open.substack.com/pub/wallacemack/p/idubbbz-lolcows-and-the-death-of?utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web

>>24816995
It is literally the best thing I have read since Corndog Zen

>>24817143
I’ve been on the edge about reading Corndog zen. Is it worth it? I’m okay with it being unpolished but I want it to be entertaining

>>24817143
Hey that’s me

Who the fuck is Victoria she sounds like a slutty whore

>>24817123
I liked it. Thoughtful and touches on some important ideas, and I really liked your conclusion paragraph-takeaway. Maybe modern civilization needs to grind itself into a pulp. I personally think a last ditch effort to save things is in order, but thats not an endeavor for everyone, and is one that needs to be cognitive of the internet nonsense you detail.

If only *MY* Victoria was this well liked... read her slop bros....

>>24817162
i must have sold a thousand knock-off copies this summer it's that good

>>24817471
what do you mean? knock off copies?

>>24817393
We are reading your Victoria story though
>>24813509

>>24817604
that's not mine...

>>24817353
Thanks so much for reading and I appreciate the feedback.

>>24816995
nobody likes your victoria slop kys

I've spent more time reading about writing than actually writing. It's at the point where I'm reading scholarly papers on the effect of particular phonemes in poetry and prose.

Could someone fetch me up on the lore of Victoria posting?

>>24813415
just practice

I wish men read smutty fantasy, too. I really want to write a shamelessly fanservice-laden story in a pseudo-DnD-esque setting about adventurers fighting dragons and monsters, fucking tons of hot bitches, and getting lots of money in the process, but there's no audience for it, especially in any language that isn't English. Women mog us pretty hard in the self-insert fantasy department.

>>24818153
Have you heard of The Witcher?
But seriously, there is an audience for it, and is probably bigger than the female one. Problem is, men have much higher standards than women and won't read any slop just to get off. It needs to be good. Ironically, you find some of that in the realm of fanfiction.

>>24814792
It made me chuckle, so you did something right. I read the "hee hee" like the michael jackson "hee hee" in my mind and it made it even more hilarious.

>>24816179
That only works if in the story all the characters have been around for that long and even care enough to listen to rumors. A paladin in a quest wouldn't care about random gossip, for example.

>>24818153
>I really want to write a shamelessly fanservice-laden story in a pseudo-DnD-esque setting about adventurers fighting dragons and monsters, fucking tons of hot bitches, and getting lots of money in the process, but there's no audience for it

Are you fucking serious? Your super original idea is like 99% of fantasy genre as a whole and all online story sites. How could you be this clueless?

>>24817123
Incredibly superficial and say nothing about anything, especially if you know why Idubbbz and Chris Chan are lolcows in the first place. Maybe this is interesting for someone that has zero knowledge about what you are writing about and besides you personal anecdote, don't say anything that hasn't been told several times already by hundreds of other articles and video essays.

In a technical aspect is fine, I suppose.

>>24818231
PYW

>>24818239
What makes you say it’s superficial? I’ve followed the Idubbbzs downfall pretty closely and I watched most of the Chris Chan documentaries. I didn’t say it in the article because I didn’t really want to add fuel to the fire but I understand why Idubbbz gets jumped on these days and it’s because he stabbed everyone in the back and continues to double down on it. With Chris, it’s pretty clear to me that in the beginning he was 100% a victim and it was his parents fault that they kept making excuses for him and allowed him to continue using the internet in the ways he did. I’m not trying to remove agency from them or condone bad behavior. I’m just saying that the level of ridicule (with the exception of the barb stuff) is disproportionate compared to what they did considering they’re literally just people on a screen. I’m not saying no one has said what I’ve said before but I personally haven’t read it or I wouldn’t have wrote the essay.

I am now going to start a large editing session. I intent to do 4 solid hours of editing. I will take breaks to eat and rake/bag my lawn. I will provide updates. I will provide my favorite page of text. Please wish me well. Music for today is as follows.
>Ixion OST
>Prometheus OST
>Warhammer 40k Mechanicus OST
>Youtube AI Slop Scifi Grimdark background music

>>24818451
>no anime music
shitlist

>>24818153
>>24817118

Then I realized something was wrong.
The forest had gone quiet. Total silence.
No birds. No insects. Not even the whisper of leaves rustling in the wind. Just a heavy, unnatural stillness pressing against my ears. The kind of silence that feels sentient….watching.
I tried to call Artemis again, but my throat locked up. My voice refused to work. My hands were trembling, and I didn’t even notice until that moment.
“When did they start doing that?” I thought to myself, staring at my shaking and twitching fingers.
Something was out there. And it did not want me here.
I wanted to go back but not without the dog.
Then there was the smell. It was the worst thing I had ever smelled in my entire life. I remembered once when my dad went into our crawlspace to retrieve a skunk that had somehow managed to sneak inside. He’d gotten himself sprayed all over, and even that didn’t compare to how foul this was.
My parents were the no-nonsense type, neither of whom had any real spiritual or superstitious leanings. My dad was a meat-and-potatoes kind of guy who believed hard work paid off, while my mother was the most logically blunt and rational person you could ever meet.
Artemis ran back towards me the quickest I had ever seen her. She was terrified. I didn't know what exactly had spooked her, but she was whimpering, shaking, and trembling all over. I picked her up, holding her close to my body. I looked around before deciding that enough was enough and that it was time to go back to where the camp was located.
Then I spotted it concealing itself behind the trees, a massive, hulking black mass. At first I thought that it may have been a bear due to how dark and rugged the hair looked, but the more that I inspected, I could see from its features that it was no bear that I was dealing with.

How do I do on setting and atmosphere? I'm considering just focusing on the kid and his encounter with the Squatch but I'm also toying around having it shift to different time period in the kids life with all the stories taking place in the woods where he runs into the creature again.

Anyone here have experience sending their stuff to publishers/editors/agents? Im curious to know what file format is usually expected. I've been writing all my stuff in markdown files.

>>24818468
I don't watch cartoons

>>24818697
No but I plan on getting an agent for my next book

>>24814626
nah fuck that, people prefer reading retarded writing anyway.

>>24818550
Pretty good. Maybe a bit too disassociated though. The aside about his parents kind of draws the reader away from the immediacy of the scene.

How disorganized can a military be but still be effective what are some good historical references for unusual military structures

>>24818338
In the case of idubbbz, the dog piling exists because of the power imbalance between the viewer and the creator.
One bad behavior =/= one downvote/negative comment.
That, and idubbbz would and has advocated for this exact kind of social treatment for someone he doesn’t like. He’s simply being hoisted by his own petard. I see no way in which he doesn’t deserve this.
Chris Chan didn’t deserve what he got. They’re apples and oranges.

>>24818931
I see what you’re saying but I wasn’t really trying to carry water for Ian. Some of what happened to him is just perhaps but I used him more as an example of the kind of dehumanization that creates a lolcow. The people he conned and flipped on have a right to be angry but random viewers that just watched him on YouTube who started a-logging him? It seems disproportionate considering he is literally just some dude on YT.

Perhaps he wasn’t the best example but I don’t think it undoes the essay personally. Thanks for the feedback.

>>24818977
>It seems disproportionate considering he is literally just some dude on YT.
He would do the same to you if he saw you as an ideological enemy.
>Perhaps he wasn’t the best example but I don’t think it undoes the essay personally.
For me, as your audience, I felt it did. It probably sounds like I have an axe to grind with idubbbz, but I really don’t. I just don’t feel pity when a guy who runs over 10 people with a car is himself ran over by a car, if you’ll excuse the clunky metaphor.

>>24818997
Fair enough. Thanks for taking the time to read it. Something to chew on for sure

>>24818997
>writing general
>can't even come out with a good metaphor
Anon...

>>24819019
What would be a better metaphor for what I’m trying to convey?

>>24818890
Tough question to answer. The main reason any given army is more successful than any other usually comes down to superior organization, so it's hard to know what the line for "still effective" is. It also heavily depends on which era we're talking about.

>>24816621

I love this one. It's easily some of the best I've seen in a /wg/ in a long while.

>>24818882

I really should;ve organised better maybe have the line about the parents not believing what he saw be the last thing because he hasn't processed whether what he is seeing is natural or supernatural yet.

>>24818550
Maybe focus on showing instead of telling, cutting out fluff. Something more like this:

The forest had gone quiet.
No birds. No insects. Not even the whisper of leaves rustling in the wind.
I tried to call Artemis again, but my throat locked up. My hands were trembling.
“When did they start doing that?” I thought to myself, staring at my shaking and twitching fingers.
Something was out there. And it did not want me here.
I wanted to go back but not without the dog.
Then there was the smell, foul like the stench of a dead skunk.
Artemis ran back towards me the quickest I had ever seen her. She was whimpering, shaking, and trembling all over. I picked her up, holding her close to my body. I looked around decided that it was time to go back to the camp.
Then I spotted it concealing itself behind the trees, a massive, hulking black mass. At first I thought that it may have been a bear due to how dark and rugged the hair looked, but the more that I inspected, I could see from its features that it was no bear that I was dealing with.

Third version now. Heavily pruned. Interested in all thoughts and opinions.

>>24819160
I feel like it's getting worse

>>24816621
This is so good. It's comparable to actually traditionally published books. All the voices are unique, the setting is vivid and descriptive enough, you have good mastery of words that is complex, yet simple to access, Seriously one of the best excerpts posted here.

>>24819160
>me and Bill and Max stroll
>me and Bill stroll
>me stroll
Easy way to know when to use I and when to use me.

>>24818734
>warhammer
>prometheus
>don’t know what the other one is but it’s probably also gay
Nigga, you watch cartoons.

>>24817123
I actually think that people shitting on people like idubbbz, hasan piker, etc. is actually the birth of a new nuance. I’m not particularly optimistic, but at least people are turning against purveyors of the dominant narrative a little bit.

>>24819386
Why little man assume Grug not say me on purpose?

>>24818890
If a disorganized military is successful it is usually because the opposing military forces are even more disorganized. See: the first crusade. In the first place, the crusade's leadership was sort of vague because it was led by a committee of noblemen (most of them French) and the more influential of these men could simply do whatever they wanted if it came down to that. The crusaders frequently divided into smaller armies and pursued various other objectives as they arose. The first crusade was not a precise, deliberate march on Jerusalem but more of a wandering romp through the Levant that saw many other cities and castles besieged and taken, sometimes with Byzantine troops helping, sometimes in separate armies, or sometimes all together.

The main reason this worked out despite the lack of focus and clear leadership is because the Muslims were even worse organized and made no attempt to help one another. They were, in fact, more preoccupied with backstabbing one another than fighting the Christians, and the people in charge simply had no idea how to lead an army a lot of the time. The main result of this was that Muslim leadership didn't coordinate their defenses and frequently launched suicidal attacks against crusader armies as soon as they appeared in their lands, or as soon as they settled in for a siege, usually while hopelessly outnumbered.

Lack of coordination, lack of clear leadership, and lack of proper planning are usually fatal flaws for any military endeavor, so the only way an army rife with these traits could be very successful is if their opponents are even worse.

>>24817169
I don't believe you. Wallace Mack would never post here.

>>24819579
He could be here right now

>>24819764
>>24819579
Wait, Wallace Mack is the author of Victoria? He improved a lot.

Looking for feedback on my first real attempt at writing. This the opening of the first chapter. Any thoughts on the content and style? Did I lay out the hook well? Would you read more?

>>24819807
I read the first paragraph. You're on the right track, keep at it

>>24819807
>"So the water still runs, that'll be useful" he muttered
do people actually mutter things like this

>>24819764
And I'm Stephen King.

>>24813382 (OP)
>Stop Procrastinating
How?

I should stop writing fanfiction and try something of my own.

>>24819774
No they’re different

>>24819913
I've never tried writing fanfiction. How do you do it? It just feels hard when you don't know everything about a given universe and your autism doesn't let you get shit wrong.

>>24819956
nta, but if you're one of those autists, you just gotta learn everything about the universe. Helps if it's for something that doesn't have an absurd amount of """lore""" like Slop Wars.

>>24819956
It's not as hard as you think if you're a fan. Some of the rules might be a bit restrictive but the readers are really forgiving if you don't break some hard canon. Plus you can build on what's there too, add you own touch. People enjoy that too.

>>24819906
Why are you such an unrepentant pedo? Cocaine is not an excuse.

>>24819831
Thanks fren, will do. Can I ask why you stopped at the first paragraph?
>>24819832
Probably not. I've considered changing this line before but couldn't think of anything better at the time. I could take another stab at it.

Rhythm, just remembered this word existed. Any anons have any writings that have rhythm in it?

>>24820113
All of poetry?

>>24819956
Most fanfic is just about having characters fuck each other, anyway.

>>24820113
me :)

>>24819949
I'm honestly disappointed

>>24820113
yes the Victoria story has the word Rhythm.

>>24820113
nope lol

>>24819956
It's more important to write something people will enjoy reading than to get the facts right.

What do you guys think of this?

>>24820333
Just delete everything before "He leaned..." and you're good to go. Be careful about making everyhing "He did this, he did that" though. "he turned to face... he looked to... he looked to..." Search/highlight all your occurrences of "he" and you will see how ugly your text looks.

>>24820169
>Victoria
i want to fuck this bitch so bad already

>>24820355
>>24820169
You faggots are ruining the threads kill yourselves.

>>24820442
>faggots
>implying is not just a single schizo spamming

>>24820351
Not him, but pronoun repetition is nice. Not to say every sentence should just be, "he [verb]ed," but I'd rather see "he" used a lot than "[name]" or "the man" or something of that sort.

>>24819027
idubbz is like a spoiled banana cake used for his enemies, now re-used for an even worse banana bread - against himself

>>24820094
This makes no sense without context.

>>24820442
>Posts writing
>Encourages discussion of syntax and form
>Showcases proper dialogue tags
>Isn't fantasy slop with video game screens and logic
>Litfic with both personal and religious themes
>This story is ruining the thread
I don't understand.

>>24820562
THe issue is that he's filtering through the character. In order to describe the pool, "he looked to the pool" To describe the bar, "he looked to the bar" etc. This is writing 101 kind of stuff.

>>24821121
have you taken anybody's advice even?

Is there any popular modern writing advice that you personally despise and disagree with?

For me it’s “make your character relatable” and “don’t use fancy prose”. IMO, it feels like short-hand for “dumb the story down and make it a popcorn flick for people who are barely literate”.

>>24820351
>>24821242
This is fair advice. I hadn’t even realized how much I was doing it. I’ll take it to heart.

>>24816104
>>24821247
Of course. I took this guy's advice. It's a good change.

>>24821121
(You) are ruining the thread wanking about it, fuck off.

Have you ever thought about what more generally is the most effective way to get your writing in front of people?
>books
>nobody’s reading that shit, maybe 1-500 people under absolute ideal conditions
>audiobooks
>better odds, maybe 1-5K people if you find a good narrator and advertise it well
>TV/movies
>basically impossible to break into even if you dedicate your whole life to it; AI isn’t good enough to replace production teams yet; widest reach (millions) but not possible
>youtube/socials
>content mill hell; AI is good enough for the quality required for visuals, but good writing won’t do as well unless it’s comedy; similar reach to TV/movies though
>games
>in-between social media and movies in terms of solo difficulty, not impossible with preexisting computer skills; reach 10-100k
>manga/webnovels
>don’t know enough to speculate

>>24821380
Treating "show don't tell" as an axiomatic truth instead of advice for beginners who don't know how to describe a scene in detail is probably my biggest bugbear. I see "show don't tell" repeated like a catechism by people who should have long ago outgrown that advice. If you've been writing for years and still need the reminder to show not tell, it's maybe time to consider a different hobby or aspiration.

>>24821846
Show don't tell is usually bad advice anyway because it's just ported over from screenplay writing without actually considering the differences between a medium with moving pictures and one with only words on a page. Technically, all writing is 'telling.' The advice just becomes "tell well" which is as useless for advice as "git gud" is.

>substance use
>short, choppy sentences
>hardboiled slang
>swearing

>>24816621
Font used?

>>24821944
>technically all writing is telling
Not really. There’s a sharp line between “his eye twitched and his fists were clenched” vs. “he was angry,” or “he splashed water on his face and took two pills out of the bottle. He looked at himself blankly in the mirror for a while and then swallowed the pills and left” vs. “he was depressed.”
It’s not a matter of good or bad telling. It’s two completely different methods. Either your writing contains concrete images and sensations or it doesn’t.

>>24822039
I think some authors go too far into the "show" part of show-don't-tell. People *do* want to be told how to feel about a situation. They will never tell you that, but they constantly consume news media that does exactly that.

>>24821738
Nah. We haven't gotten to her getting blacked or jeeted yet.

>>24821944
all advice boils down to "git gud"
advice exists to try to bridge the gap between amateurism and the well-developed intuition of a professional
of course, following advice is not how well-developed intuitions are formed in the first place

>>24821380
"Just get to the point!" is the one that annoys me the most. It belies a relationship with art that I find ugly.

>>24822039
Show vs tell is about how directly you're communicating to the reader what you want them to know.
>Bob was depressed.
is telling (bad always)
>Bob felt his ass grow numb in his bus seat but couldn't be bothered to stand.
is showing, but
>Bob was angry, and then he felt nothing, and he wasn't really angry to begin with.
is also showing.
This is really what they mean by show vs tell.

>>24822311
>Bob was depressed.
>is telling (bad always)
I would disagree.
>Big long winded paragraph about how he caught his wife cheating on him with a smelly Jeet
>Bob was depressed.
>Big long winded paragraph about his internal struggles.
It acts as a very clear short transition between him catching his wife and his inner turmoil. But at the same time, quickens the pace so we can get his depression out of the way. We as readers don't need his sighs, his tears, his "I can't believe she cheated on me whining, he was depressed and we move onto how he'll get revenge

>>24821380
You don't understand the market or your audience. That's okay, most writers don't, if they were businessmen they'd probably be doing that instead. The successful ones do and are, though. If you want to be one of those, you're just not writing flowery language and page long descriptions of the temperature of the air in autumn. This isn't the 19th century, your audience aren't wealthy, aristocratic sophisticates (or people who think they are, anyway) with copious time driven by a need to feel superior to everyone else. Your audience are barely literate, 100 IQ, working class redditors and soccer mom's conditioned to television and movies as primary media for storytelling, and who want to relax and escape on their commute or at the end of their day. That's who matters, and if you're not writing for them, you can't expect to matter.
>But muh art
If you're really le artiste, then you can make something beautiful with the tools given to you for the people that are paying attention and their hard earned dollars for your work. It doesn't matter how great you are if nobody ever reads your book, you're still a fucking loser.
>but muh I don't care what people think, I don't want to sell books, I want to suffer
Okay, then don't whine about their advice and criticisms, it's not for you anyway. Enjoy your top ramen for the fourth time this week you fucking loser.

>>24822336
the basic fundamental amateurish mistake is leaving in sentences that read like the author reminding themselves what the story is about. That's always a mistake.

The best writing is clear and concise, with strong, but brief, descriptions. You can be a good writer and have more flowery prose, but you are using an inferior style.

>>24822375
Sad. Read more books. Styles come and go. Beautiful sentences are worth celebrating in all their forms.

>>24822393
I almost always prefer the sleek lines of modern styles.

opinions on this opening (rough draft)

I watched the shadow crawl across the sand. The black shade tethered to the Pillar of Creation always circling. That stretch of night, a constant reminder that darkness is bound to all things. The shadow was weak right now, barely a line, but by the end of the day it would consume everything.
My focus on the central totem was disturbed as an elderly man in painted skins and bones moved to the front of the crowd. Leaning against his staff, he looked to the top of the Pillar of Creation, where the Orb of Life burned fierce in the heavens. He held his hand up to allow the night to cover his face.
To others darkness was not all bad, sometimes the light was too magnificent. The old man was using the shadow to his advantage now. The other grown ones had already been doing it before he arrived. Their eyes could not take it
I did not use the shadows, the light was never too magnificent for me. The darkness scared me, and I could not be free of it. But, I would be free… soon enough. I was chosen. Only little ones could be chosen.
The elder looked down at the grey sands by the pillar. It was the only area where the grass did not grow. He looked at me and beckoned. Surrounded by the grown ones, their shadows covered me.
I was bound to the Pillar of Creation and I knew that I was being freed. I was having my shadow severed. The grown ones rubbed my skin with fine oils that smelled like flowers. Their faces were hard and downcast. Why? I was being freed from the darkness.
The old man began to speak and the grown ones backed away. He struck his hand together and light rained down on me. I was drowned in light.

>>24822415
It's pretty rough. I'm having trouble even following what's going on. It seems cool, but I don't know what it is.

>>24822503
It’s a primitive ritual child sacrifice from the point of view of the child. It’s a sort of reincarnation story but not like an Isekai web novel.

>>24822365
There’s such a thing as a balance. You can do lush prose without sacrificing market appeal. You also seem to forget that alot of classic literature was originally written for plebs. Dickens was literally serialised and popular with the working class. Only some were written for the aristocracy.

Asking everyone to write like Hemingway is the death of art. People should develop their own styles.

>>24822414
like I said: read more books

>>24822415
Amateurish, in the way that you just need to write and read more.
>I watched the shadow crawl across the sand.
"I watched" is weak google "filtering phrases"
>The black shade tethered to the Pillar of Creation always circling.
sentence fragment
>That stretch of night, a constant reminder that darkness is bound to all things.
another sentence fragment
I don't think these are artistic sentence fragments. I think you are omitting the word "was" because you have (correctly) identified that it's repetitive. The real solution is to add actual variation and focus the sentence around the central thing being conveyed.
Sincerely, I recommend spending a week or two going through a grammar book. If you want to write like this, you need to really understand the parts of speech and the different ways you can arrange them.

>>24822648
Any good recommendations for grammar books. I want to convey it as thought. Not all thoughts are complete sentences. Probably need to format it differently or rewrite like you say

>>24822520
>the point of view of the child.
it does not sound like the voice of a child at all

>>24822589
>Asking everyone to write like Hemingway is the death of art
I wouldn't dream of it, I know you can't write subtext.

>>24822703
He is special

I wrote the opening to a story I am working on. What's the proper procedure for sharing it? Pastebin says I'm now allowed to past my bit. It's only about 500 words

>>24822729
screenshot it

it's almost november, when i can try extra hard to still not write

>>24822415
i'd start post-reincarnation, or something.

chapter premises i got down today:
>group of friends at cafe discuss the beastiality epidemic
>asking various people what it means to be an adult
>receiving messages from acquaintance of their ai written stories from single paragraph prompts
>hobby into hustle culture
>earnest relationship with traumatized college whore
>gay man has sudden reoccuring vivid dreams of having intimate sex with women
>improvement theory and measuring/quantifying success

looking forward to fleshing these out in the future

Do you prefer to write your stories with a pre-planned structure or do you simply write from an autistic idea without a set direction?

>>24822659
Trying to navigate writing scattered and fragmented thoughts while also keeping things sensible for the reader is very tough sometimes. I disagree with the other anon, though. I don't think grammar is the root issue here. It might be part of the issue but "read a grammar book" won't solve the problem.

There's just too much 'jargon' for a casual reader. If you think about it, almost every important noun you used was something the child is familiar with, but the reader isn't. By the time we hit the middle of the section, we're just totally lost and it's hard to care what's happening because we have no possible way of knowing. I reread it more carefully and now I can see, oh yeah, it is obviously a sacrifice, but I completely missed that the first time through because by the time we hit that point, I was already kind of checked out. And it's only a few sentences. I shouldn't be filtered this quickly.

A reader has a limited amount of patience for deciphering things, especially early in a story, before they get really invested. I'm still not even sure what the various "shadows" are, because sometimes it seems like just shadows but other times it seems it means something else. But these shadows are such a big part of the scene that I kind of feel like I need to understand them.

The scene is good. The imagery is good. The idea of having the child describing things with a child's eyes is good. But you have to somehow try to keep the mysterious feeling while also allowing the reader to "get it." I'm not sure how to do that, but I think you're close. A little more work and it's good.

>>24822753
Why not just use a non-cucked pastebin clone like cryptpad?

Here is my second story ever I am working on. Judge me.

>>24823080
honestly nigga this shit stink of ai and even if it aint it's soulless and vain and you should just keep writing. posting ur second story ever aint worth jack shit. post your 100th story. post your 500th story. admitting to it being your second story ain't what u think it is homie. do U feel compelled by this? could you read it 10 times in a row? something aint right about this.

>>24823112
What language is this?

>>24823046
i rely on structure, formula and tropes. and i show (not tell)

non-cucked pastebin clone cryptpad link
https://cryptpad.fr/pad/#/2/pad/view/Vp+DuRIjZCYRO1rUWz-h-ml+D0JcwUICd3RUUU+IGSU/

>>24823080
Very well written. I hate it though. She should just push him off the roof and the world would be a better place. I wouldn't read it, unless I thought this ended up in revenge of some kind.

Unless the guy is the MC. Then I'd consider reading.

>>24823128
Zoomie-negro speak

>>24823046
>do you simply write from an autistic idea without a set direction?
I start with this until I get a feel for the characters and world and then I go back and make plans editing what has already been written as needed.

>>24822520
Not him but the only thing I misunderstood was the sacrifice part. I read it as a coming of age ceremony of some kind. Like I thought all the adults went through this and they had stern faces cause they new it was painful or something. You might want to do something to emphasize that this ritual is not performed often to better clue in the reader. Otherwise, I liked it. I don't get the other guy's autism about the sentence fragments. It's just a stylistic choice.

>>24823071
Thanks for the feed back
Orb of Life is the Sun
The pillar of creation is a dense totem being used as a sundial and burning stake
I true to use context clues to help but I guess it was not the best
>>24823454
Thanks I’ll have take a step back and try to examine it as someone with zero context

>>24823454
I will say I was not necessarily trying to avoid confusion. I wanted to subvert the expectations and mislead the audience a bit

>>24813382 (OP)

https://iannewman.blogspot.com/2025/10/meet-ethan.html

Mostly an inside joke between a few friends of mine that I've been writing on lunch break, but looking to get opinions positive or negative.

Working on the second part now

>>24822415
You could turn this into a poem and then edit it to be more concise. It would be a good exercise.

>>24823080
I greatly dislike this. It reminds me that women gravitate towards high functioning psychopaths. Make the man into a hot chick and it'll instantly be better.

>>24823080
Part of the right is cut off, but there's still a margin. How did this happen?

>>24818089
>serbia

I made this question a few days ago but forgot to check the replies: do you receive any feedback on your query rejections?
I got over 40 rejections and what the agents usually say is "this isn't right for me", and rarely "this sounds interesting, but I'll pass".
Feedback from an agent (not just a beta reader) would be invaluable to me, but I'm afraid I'd sound amateurish to ask for it in my query letter (as if already expecting a rejection).

>>24823535
>the Orb of Life is the sun
Then just call it the sun nigga, ffs

>>24814626
As an artist (painter) I’m surprised at your replies. To be a good artist that stuff is essential.

>>24822659
this is a good one

>>24824496
Agents aren't editors, they don't give feedback. They read your cover, maybe a handful of pages and tell you to fuck off.

>>24824556
if you've been reading & writing it shouldn't surprise...
the attitude here is poor, but writing really is more about reading and intuition. it's not as easy to analyze, the skill differences are harder to identify, and whatever you do learn is often not easily applicable-- writing has always been less formalized compared to painting.
and there's the matter of expression.

How is it?

>>24825005
Damn, I want a burger now.

>>24825005
uhh pacing

>>24824556
>>24824707
What a bunch of bullshit. Literary composition can and should be deliberately studied just like it is in every other form of art. Of course nobody here studies the masters. And of course every piece of writing posted here is a steaming pile of shit. Honestly, why the fuck am I on 4chan instead of studying the masters myself? Fuck this. I’m never going on this site again.

Trying to cook up some zombie kino. I'm worried this is dragging too much before getting to any actual dialogue. Basically...what would you cut out here or rework?

>>24825005
>Dong pushed a finger into his bun.

>>24825091
>Squirrely preferred synth music personally.
The "personally" feels kinda akward, don't you think? (In fact it might actually be ungrammatical—usually it's when someone refers to themselves when they say "personally", and usually with a comma before it). Same with the next line, wouldn't "Something more aggressive and robotic would have made more sense [...]". I don't see the point of the italicised "that" in this either unless there's further context related to music but it doesn't seem that way.

I think you need to do some cutting. A lot of these sentences longer than they need to be or have things in them that just make them akward. Otherwise seems fine. Take this line:
>"making dreams come true for the superfans wanting in—for a price".
The "for a price" after the em dashes doesn't add anything, we already know he's a scalper and apparently a scoundrel, it's just shoving it down our throats and driving the constrast past its breaking point. If anything it takes away. As the next sentence is "Boy, was there plenty". If you insist on including the former you'll have to put it in brackets or change the "was there plenty". It turns a really good line into something bloated. Sorry if that sounds harsh

There are probably more edits that can be found but I think you get the idea. There's a good body but with a bit too much fat. I think you should work on how you view your sentences for editing.

I like the premise though, love "what if zombies just kinda existed" settings. I wouldn't worry too much about how long till dialogue thing though. My suggestion? Put "so damn inquisitive" (with or without the "so") in inverted commas, the "damn" already frames it as something personal but put it in quotation marks and you already begin to paint how people talk to Squirrelly and other zombies—it's like a hint dialogue, or something, without a real speaker, as to not break the flow. I get this line already hints at this is something said to him or about zombies but I think it focuses the intention.

>>24825163
>It turns a really good line into something bloated. Sorry if that sounds harsh
Nope, that's exactly what I need to hear.
>My suggestion? Put "so damn inquisitive" (with or without the "so") in inverted commas
I like this idea very much. I'll work that in as I go back to trim the fat. Thank you, I'll watch my sentence lengths and redundancies.

>>24814626
poetry and short stories

>>24825055
the alternative is you PYW and are humbled into oblivion

>>24814626
I did this recently with Game of Thrones. It was fun coming at it from a certain lens, studying how George introduced characters and concepts and what points in the story. Was actually quite the nurtured read.

Wake up, go to work, go to the gym, get ready and go on a date. Kiss or fuck the girl, it doesn't matter. Get back home and schedule another date the next day with one of today's matches or a girl I've been talking to. Can't forget to reply to the 10 girls I've been texting every day. Fuck, one of them sent me an audio or video, God damned waste of time. Get 5 hours of sleep, I just wasted 2h past midnight sexting and trading nudes with some whore. Still have to jerk off in the morning. Can't forget to renew my subscription for Tinder Platinum, this way I get at least 10 matches a day, more options for when I want to fuck someone spontaneously. I hate women. All they want is my body. They'll fuck and ghost. Fuck em, I don't wanna date the whores anyway. The girls I do wanna date don't wanna date me either. They say everything is good but something is missing. Something is always missing. I'm tired. But I'm so lonely. My self worth is based around the number of women I conquer. But all I want is one. One pretty one though, the ugly and fat ones fall in love too easily. I've broken too many of their hearts. Doesn't matter, though, they wouldn't love the real me. They just love the persona I put out there. Nobody can stand me at my worst, might as well not show it. I'm so tired. I don't wanna deal with women and people anymore. But I can't stop. I love the thrill of it. But I'm so tired. Too many dates, too many things to remember, too many people to talk to, too much sex to have, too much money to spend, too many needs to fulfill. I don't want to feel anything anymore.

What would you say is the best book on grammar? The wiki doesn't mention any

>>24826081
Yes it does, Garner's Modern English Usage

>>24825091
Reminds me of Gaslight District

Do you guys ever feel like you genuinely have something down there inside you that needs to be turned into a story and you have bits of it but you're unable to give shape to the whole and it starts feeling painful and contrived to attempt to do so and you worry whether you should abandon the project altogether?

>>24826476
Pro tip:

Start with the ending and work your way backwards. That’s how I plan my stories.

>>24822374
It's not because that's entertaining and long-ass paragraphs of mope are not. Listen, it's called storyTELLING, not storySHOWING. Repeat after me: Tell, don't show.

>stumbled and fell flat on my face attempting a serial with minimal planning or direction
>suddenly get inspired to add flashbacks in later chapters to earlier chapters with content I should've had in there from the start
>promise myself I'll rewrite the entire thing to be less patchwork when I'm finished

Am I a genius or what?

>>24826476
>Do you guys ever feel like you genuinely have something down there inside you that needs to be turned into a story
my advice: stop focusing on yourself and look outwards. writing is about training yourself to take an interest in things. ignore those deep and obscure things inside you and trust that they'll continue to inform your writing whether you're conscious of it or not.

>>24826970
i like this advice because it sounds reasonable and validates my inability to really grasp my inner auteur, or something. if that sounded sarcastic it wasn't meant to

>>24826945
sure. does making these scenes into flashbacks (in the meantime) somehow help?

>>24827057
>serial
Yes. You want to keep moving forward no matter what, I actually cut the part in my post where I explained that stopping would kill my minimal momentum.

>>24825967
>>24824925

>>24827061
ah, makes sense. i suppose i have some apprehension about the context of a flashback affecting this process.
you could use something like scrivener to manager chapters and scenes. but it would take some getting used to, and i suppose i wouldn't risk your momentum

>>24827071
>you could use something like scrivener
But doctor...

>>24820100
>why you stopped at the first paragraph
You're not there yet

I farded today and thought I sharted my pants
but when I went to the toilet to wipe my bumhole, the toilet paper was clean
who was shart?

New to /wg/, and to writing original content in general. What's this place's stance on reading/critiquing longer samples of a story? Are tips on a little block of text the best I should expect here? Because I don't feel like that shows how well or poorly I can structure a story, utilize foreshadowing, make hooks, etc. etc.
I don't really have an interest in monetizing what I write, it's purely a passion project, but nobody I know seems to really give a shit about literature, and I'm looking for something a little more in-depth.

>>24820711
It's a passage from his novel "It".

>>24821742
Uncle Ted had some ideas, but it requires dedication.

>>24823046
It's whatever works for you.

are we showing?

>>24827621
after telling

>>24813382 (OP)
what my type is and I made a joke that I'm into girls with connected earlobes and made it out like it was my fetish. Or I make jokes about things like how I'm into armpit hair but lip hair and leg hair is disgusting. Or that black nail polish makes me obediant. in general I make it out like im attracted to the most random nonsensical things.

She ends up laughing especially at the whole armpit hair one . What does this mean? Does it make me look creepy or more fun? If it matters she seems to be creeped out by a bunch of people for things I don't understand or seem innocuous/innocent. Could she be telling others and her friends that I'm creepy.

If it matters she has those connected earlobes lmao. And she has told me her friends like me from the stories she tells them about work.

I hired a writer

>She decided both their maunderings came from age and wondered if all men fancied inane contemplations serving no purpose other than indulge in perceived self-importance


Is this sentence too purple?

>>24827716
they're just going to use AI and charge you for it

>>24827735
Maybe, but it's mostly ungrammatical.
>She decided both their maunderings came from age and wondered if all men fancied inane contemplations serving no purpose other than to indulge in perceived self-importance.
or
>She decided both their maunderings came from age and wondered if all men fancied inane contemplations serving no purpose other than indulgence in perceived self-importance.

>>24827735
>Deciding that both of their ramblings resulted from age, she wondered if all men fancied inane contemplation—purposeless outside gratification of self-importance.
Don't fear punctuation.

>>24827653
Someone got lost on their way to the Write Your Thoughts thread

>>24821742
>dude big numbers lmao
ngmi

Does anyone else use AI to help edit? It does great catching awkward phrases

>>24826525
You're not a pro

>>24827857
Pretty sure even just doing that will bar you from most publishers

With Nano gone will any of you bother to write next month

Wordcount limits don't scare me.
Wordcount maximums keep me up all night.

>>24827939
But a maximum is just another kind of limit.

>>24827917
Oh shit they closed down?
Thank goodness I don't have to split my attention anymore, I kept failing them.

Shit general for talentless, stupid, ugly faggots

>>24827949
Hey!
I not stupid!

>>24827949
Oh well you’re a jerk!

>>24827949
I am not ugly

>>24825055
Unlike in painting, excessively analytical people who obsess about technical details rarely produce good, enjoyable writing. If you perfectly recreate a scene from life in a painting, tree by tree, every blade of grass and bird, you're a master. But if you autistically list everything in front of you in text, you're a freak.

Writing is less cinematography and more a craft of blindness, using language, sound, and rhythm to convey immaterial experiences, which the reader translates as a receiver. A major share of this process is built on personal feeling and intuition, which are effectively killed by religious reliance on theory.

Of course, you should read a lot, take inspiration and learn, and maintain linguistic correctness, but there's something of a middle ground to seek in this. Trying to dissect old classics to pieces and quantifying every passage won't serve you well, because those masters deliberately break away from theory and crash conventions, guided by their intuition. Your most important assets are vocabulary, ear for language, and self-awareness, and those are what you should cultivate, instead of "on what line does Shakespeare apply le call to action" as an embarrassing number of retards out there do.

>>24826476
I have this feeling all the time. It's like I have puzzle pieces, but I can't figure out how to put them together.

It's not only writing that gives me this feeling though. Math, video games, and programming give me that feeling quite often as well.

Programming taught me how to solve this problem: take a step back and finish the puzzle the easiest (to you) way you can. It's fine even if the result is ugly or contrived because you can always change it later. Your first time writing it out lets you put the situation into a better perspective, and might help you come up with a better solution.

You should use a minimal amount of prose to describe the scene. Instead of painting a vivid picture using words you should use a minimal amount of prose to set the scene. A lot of it should be left up to the reader's imagination.

Treat it like an indie game dev builds a tavern scene. You start with a static background image, add in some background music. Then layer it with the noise of people chatting and laughter. Maybe add some animated candle or fire place flames. In the foreground you have static character images that will iterate between a few expressions depending on the dialogue. This is a minimalist way of conveying the scene and it's perfectly adequate for a game. You should strive to do that with prose.

Why a minimal amount of prose rather than a vivid picture with lots of detail? Because the latter is boring. Giving the reader a skeleton of the scene and letting them fill in the blanks allows your story to move on. A detailed scene description should be left for situations where the reader's expectations would be mistaken, eg instead of a tavern full of drunks and merrymaking there's a table that's sober and quiet.

What do you guys think of this? I've come to this conclusion because I've read far too much prose that made me think "can we move on already?" This is especially true with older novels.

>>24828046
>Writing is less cinematography and more a craft of blindness
what

>>24824556
Writing isn't like the other arts. The only fundamentals we have are vocab, spelling, and grammar. There aren't any essential techniques like perspective or shading to learn. Sure, there's plenty of people willing to sell you writing techniques they package as "essential," but those are just snake oil salesmen. Good for a laugh, but if you start following that stuff like it's gospel you'll make the dullest, generic, derivative, most forumalic crap ever shat out.

>>24825055
Your masters are the steaming piles of shit

>>24828111
This is one of those posts where I can't tell if anon is being coy or genuinely dumb, impressive either way

less ≠ more
more = more
more more more
MORE MORE MORE

>>24828111
It depends on your audience, but I generally do what you say. I find that putting in one solid detail is enough to keep the rhythm. So if you just mentioned the heartiness of the fireplace, that should imply people chatting and laughing, the food and drink, the music, etc.

>>24813721
Partly why I don't litter my writing with em dashes is because it's so easy to do so.

>>24828111
I think this is all very sound advice. Even if it's not eternal dogmatic truth, it will lead to better writing than trying to force prose into a sort of VR experience that invites readers into your beautiful mind palace. Amateur writing always feels like a desperate attempt to communicate 'the movie in your head', instead of focusing on the words on the page. But!
>I've read far too much prose that made me think "can we move on already?" This is especially true with older novels.
I think older novels are the exception to what you're saying (as long as you can project yourself into the context of the people who originally read them). The literary theorist Frederic Jameson talks about a Balzac story that begins with a lengthy, detailed description of a nice house - no characters, no plot, just house facts. He makes the point that, today, a similar description would usually be given only through a character's eyes, as a description of what the house means to them emotionally, what memories it recalls. But in the early 19thC when Balzac was writing (says Jameson), because society was more coherent and communal, and people's experiences and desires more similar, it was as if that description already *was* being filtered through a character's eyes - the eyes of the collective consciousness of French middle-class society. They were all on the same page, and when Balzac fantasises about a neat garden or a cosy kitchen or whatever, his readers would have shared in the fantasy, felt the words evoke the same desires, and recalled the same struggles for prosperity in the recent past of their society. Whereas today, if a /wg/ anon gives us lengthy paragraphs of scene description, the raindrops dripping from the trees etc., it feels as remote from us as if they were describing the different varieties of half-elf in their private worldbuilding project.

>>24828112
You're telling stories to someone who can't see what you see, trying to convey what you experience through multiple senses solely by language.

Is there any reason not to name your chapters?
The pros from the top of my head:
>Makes it easier to remember what happens in each chapter
>Gives them more flavor and personality
>Makes the reader more excited to read more
And for the cons:
>Might spoil something
>Coming up with names is kinda hard (but not really)

>>24824556
visual art involves technical skills you have to consciously figure out and develop, whereas writing is speech encoded into symbols, and speech is learned intuitively through exposure. when you read a lot your brain can't help but absorb and imitate literary language. more conscious "study" of "technique" is optional and even damaging if not paired with that fluency.

>>24824508
You know what… not a bad call

I'm trying to write something absurd (actual absurd, not philosophical absurd), but it's so tricky to make no sense without, well, making no sense. Surrealism is pretty tricky, eh?

>>24828367
>Is there any reason not to name your chapters?
The reason is that no one really does it these days (at least in the books I read), so it will look like a quaint affectation.

>>24828367
I named my chapters when I serialized them online. That's a little more attention-getting than bare numbers.

>Just started writing
>Learn about EM dashes
>"Yo, this is cool and useful"
>Post my story snippet (1000 words) for a beta reader.
>This looks AI, only AI uses so many EM dashes, I'll have to decline.
Okay.

>>24829147
Employ the British en-dash – do what the Penguin Classics do.

>>24828111
I have a well paying job with not that many bills because I'm a man child. I stack paper and write for myself and let my mom read my stories. I'll make it as purpose as my girlfriend's boyfriends' tip.

>>24828111
I have a well paying job with not that many bills because I'm a man child. I stack paper and write for myself and let my mom read my stories. I'll make it as purple as my girlfriend's boyfriends' tip.

>>24829149
what's the numpad imput for that?

>>24813382 (OP)
If only you knew how bad things really are.

>>24825392
>>24828121
Alright. One of you give me a prompt and I’ll write a short story. But I’ll need a few days.

>>24829204
Well it’s a writing general so maybe you should write about how bad things are. But show, don’t tell.

>>24822036
Centaur MT Std

>>24819832
actual video game dialog, incredible stuff

thought about this premise for a novel?

>set in an unnamed fictional whaling town to the far north of the world
>MC is unnamed and a complete stranger to the town
>has no friends, far away from his home
>the story begins with him learning the news of the death of his father, the only person that linked him to his past in any way
>he becomes even more withdrawn and isolated, as that whaling town is a melting pot of various peoples and cultures - mostly men - who do not speak the same language other than a bastard primitive pidgin

>the only solace and comfort in his cold and incosolable life is the finding of either a woman (cliché but familiar) or an animal he rescues during a whaling expedition (unorthodox but hard to pull off)

what do you think?

>>24829696
>the only solace and comfort in his cold and incosolable life is the finding of either a woman (cliché but familiar) or an animal he rescues during a whaling expedition (unorthodox but hard to pull off)
Neither. Fuck your "muh finding consolation in love" slop. Why don't you write something artistic with the premise.

>>24829696
>what do you think?
didn't read, would you read it yourself? post the first chapter so I can.

>>24829696
Your conflict and entire story is that he's an incel. That's not a good premise.

>>24829753
It's supposed to be a ruined man at the edge of the world clinging to nothing but the survival to endure and survive. It's based on many real life encounters I had with southeast asians and Pacific Islanders who'd find themselves months or years away at work while working Maritime; with some of them having no one home left waiting for them

>>24829696
Your conflict and entire story is that he's an incel. That's a good premise.

>>24829870
>>24829870
>>24829870

What is the takeaway if one of these AI generators says it thinks parts of my writing were AI (they weren't)?

>>24827944
A much harder one.

holy shit my habits are horrible these chapters are dogwater I'm killing my readers by forcing them to look at unfinished drafts I'm pumping out when I see that my work gets a single view before I've properly rewritten it I feel like killing myself die die die but not before putting out the next chapter wahoo

It's hard to write when I'm in a self loathing spiral, and then the failure to get anything done just adds to my dissatisfaction