Why did they make kira such a bitch?

He always was

>>23357797 (OP)
He's a cuckold.

>>23357797 (OP)
This was his actual characterization before Destiny turned him into a boring nothing

This was for husbandofags.
>Kira is literally perfect and he would STILL strive to give you more!

>>23357993
if someone came to kill them while they were sleeping they would make at least 1 mistake

I can't take seed seriously with those character designs.

>>23357993
What happened to these kids? They're not in the movie.
Did Lacus get bored of them and sent them back to the orphanage?

>>23357797 (OP)
Wait, this is from Freedom?

>>23358154
yes

>Kira is infallible
>people bitch about him

>Kira is fallible
>people bitch about him
Confusing

>>23358260
>Kira is annoying and sounds like a cat in heat when he's upset.
>Oh now their trying to pretend he's actually cool as a cucumber in Destiny despite having Shinn level breakdowns in the previous show.
>Oh, now he's back to being annoying.

Really not hard to track.

>>23357797 (OP)
He literally had sex on the beach at the end of the movie like a super chad

Lacus being the one wearing the pants was already implied, this movie spent a good amount of time hammering that idea by showing it in practice.

>>23357797 (OP)
Freedom is non-canon trash.
Kira is one of the biggest chads in the franchise as well as being the best pilot and having the best GF.
>>23357993
>he's still coping with his headcanon after all these years
>>23358020
Wrong.
>>23358260
>>23358283
>got filtered by CHADira

>>23358301
>Wrong.
Wrong.

>>23358301
>Literally filtered by a great movie with a great ending
>Telling other people they are filtered
Anon, YOU are the non-canon trash.

>>23358301

The Mighty Strike Freedom is still a dogass mobile suit that's basically the Strike Freedom with a Jet Scrander.

>>23358312
Funny thing is I think he actually likes Freedom despite other Kira and Lacusfags hating it.

>>23358260
>>23358283
/m/ is retarded and the idea that a character might act differently in differing circumstances is INSANE to them. Look at the thousand threads of “why did Char go CRAZY in CCA when he was so nice in Zeta??”

>>23358362
I wasn't saying I couldn't believe the reasons for Kira's changes in characterization.
My point was that I found the character to be a nuisance every step of the way, regardless of the changes.

>>23358323
After building the actual kits it feels like such a downgrade, plamo wise. Four wing frames each storing two dragoons separated by their own colored plastic that can detach as a gimmick, to just.. three flat wing pieces on each side. Color only really broken up by weak thin stickers.
I guess the sword is supposed to do a lot of carrying, when it comes to appeal.

>>23358312
>Literally filtered by a great movie with a great ending
Has the exact same flawless victory ending that Destiny does.
Eat shit.

>>23358321
Stronger than turn a

>>23358577
How reductive and idiotic

>>23358577
What do you mean flawless
Kira got his ass kicked as any main character would have since Orphee threw everything at him and didn't give him even a second to breath. He wanted Kira dead that badly

>>23358577
Strike Freedom got beat up, it was not a flawless victory

>>23357797 (OP)
Why does seed have such an ugly character aesthetic, god damn.

>>23358708
Not that guy but literally everything went according to the good guys' plan and villains aren't allowed to get anything right, they get baited into not shooting Orb, Lacus gets broken out easily, everyone wins their respective fights etc. The only good guys to die are the two no name dudes who were the notBlack Tri-stars.
I agree that Kira, mercifully, wasn't wanked nearly as much as he could've been but, in exchange, the final version of Freedom is stupidly overpowered.

>>23358126
Presumably they still live with Malchio, but Kira and Lacus didn't live with him anymore since they had to live in Plant for Compass work.

wtf Durandal you're such a dick

>>23358819
SF IJ and Akatsuki actually took damage this time.

>>23358819
Again, not a flawless victory so...........
....

>>23358577
Only shinnGOD had a flawless victory, the SF got banged up a ton.

>>23358863
not as bad as Tallia
>Hey Rey come join our suicide pact
>Btw tell that bitch Murrue to take care of my son lol

Kira is prone drone btw

>>23358864
You need to think of mecha as characters, because that's how they are animated. It's not the same that Freedom is a complete wreck at the end of SEED and Justice was blown up as to what happens in the movie:

>SF
Token damage to the chest. Loses weapons that aren't even suited to Kira's combat style and gets a massive upgrade.

>IJ
Loses a single leg. That's it.

>Akatsuki
Did its mission and made it back alive. Body is fully intact after tanking a Requiem shot.

>>23357797 (OP)
>DURRRRRR DURRRRR DURRRRR
Fucking stop it, Hirai. You are only making your own characters look utterly retarded.

>>23357993
Taking care of orphans > Sex

>>23359442
>Loses weapons that aren't even suited to Kira's combat style
>DRAGOONS, rifles, railguns and a chest cannon are somehow not suited to Kira's fighting style
>Akatsuki did its mission and made it back alive
And it was still basically out of commission after doing so.

>>23357797 (OP)
Kira is exhausted, since even SEED. He's tired and broken. Even in GSD, he's not sure if they're really doing the right thing, and by Freedom, his doubts are overwhelming him. He feels constant guilt over stopping Durandal, wondering if he was right, as the battles (as he predicted) just keep happening with no end in sight. He feels like he's let everybody down, and tries to shoulder most of Compass's burdens himself. Orphee literally cuts deep into all of Kira's insecurities in one exchange.
>"You're not good enough for her."
>"You defeated Chairman Durandal and took away order, peace, and a society free of conflict from the people. And yet all you create is destruction, hatred, and death. Isn't that right?"
>"I can create the world she desires. You can't. You can't do anything but fight."

>>23359442
>>SF
>Token damage to the chest.
The chest cannon was destroyed.

>Loses weapons that aren't even suited to Kira's combat style
???
Kira loves beam weapons.
>>IJ
>Loses a single leg. That's it.
It was an arm. Not leg.

>>Akatsuki
>Did its mission and made it back alive. Body is fully intact after tanking a Requiem shot.
True. But this whole scene was BS. At least scorch and burn Akatsuki black or something. For crying out loud it's a city destroying beam. Not some ordinary beam rifle.

>>23359442
>It's not the same that Freedom is a complete wreck at the end of SEED and Justice was blown up as to what happens in the movie:
The circumstances aren't the same, as they weren't in Destiny either.
In SEED, the Three Ships Alliance is fighting on its own. They're literally just three ships and their mobile suits.
In Destiny and Freedom, they're backed by entire fleets, and the nations behind them. They aren't inserting themselves into the middle of a genocidal war, they're fighting a much more mundane space battle.

>>23359442
>>23359557
Akatsuki's shield took the brunt of the blast, and was unusable and physically falling apart afterwards. The parts of the Akatsuki that weren't covered by the shield were straight up glowing with heat and the cockpit had alarms going off. Firing the Zeus Silhouette nearly totally drained the Akatsuki's battery.
All of this combined meant that it needed to get the hell out of there immediately. But I don't even see why it was brought up given that it had a specific mission, did it, and wasn't a major combatant otherwise.

>>23359557
>The chest cannon was destroyed.
He barely used that thing.

>True. But this whole scene was BS. At least scorch and burn Akatsuki black or something. For crying out loud it's a city destroying beam. Not some ordinary beam rifle.
Complain to Fukuda. He's the one that outright refuses to put his pet characters in any real danger.

>>23359592
>He barely used that thing.
Could you shift those goalposts any faster? Spineless
>Complain to Fukuda. He's the one that outright refuses to put his pet characters in any real danger.
The only one pissing and shitting themselves over the guy not needlessly killing characters off is you though

>>23359594
>The only one pissing and shitting themselves over the guy not needlessly killing characters off is you though
We've been through this debate before. It's not a thing about killing characters, but actually feel like they are in some kind of actual danger. They brush the Black Knights off too easily. The Millennium didn't even take a scratch.

By the way...
>needlessly
That's debatable.

>>23359614
>actually feel like they are in some kind of actual danger. They brush the Black Knights off too easily. The Millennium didn't even take a scratch.
The Archangel which survived two wars is destroyed. Almost every MS Compass has gets destroyed. Later, with some actual planning and a lot of risky maneuvers and unexpected help, they're able to win.
>That's debatable.
The characters dying or losing their machines for good wouldn't do anything to push the narrative forward, you just want it to happen because you're depraved. It isn't enough for Akatsuki to need to retreat ASAP due to damage, you aren't satisfied unless it's a smoldering wreck. It isn't enough for Strike Freedom to be torn up and lose nearly everything it has and even run out of energy, you need to see it actually blow up.

>>23359589
>The parts of the Akatsuki that weren't covered by the shield were straight up glowing with heat
Destiny did more damage when Shinn sliced an arm off it.

>Akatsuki's shield took the brunt of the blast
>and the cockpit had alarms going off
You think this somehow makes it "okay"? Requiem destroyed multiple PLANTs, a number of fleets and a city on Earth from a beam that had to be reflected from the moon.
But no, "some alarms were going off in the cockpit, so it was damaged"! Fuck right off with that nonsense. It's bullshit no matter how you slice it.

As a reference, this is the scale of destruction Requiem is capable of inflicting.

>>23359632
>You think this somehow makes it "okay"?
What is this inane schizo babble? "Okay"? Are you passing moral judgment on it? It's a work of fiction you clown.

Requiem is just a high powered beam cannon. Its beam is able to be reflected, as is evident from the basic functionality of the relay stations. Akatsuki is an MS where its only claim to fame is its ability to deflect beam weapons. Its ability to deflect Requiem, while taking heavy damage and being taken out of action as a consequence, is by no means some random ass-pull.

>>23359629
>and a lot of risky maneuvers and unexpected help,
"Unexpected" from whom? Everyone was on the same boat.

>or losing their machines for good wouldn't do anything to push the narrative forward, you just want it to happen because you're depraved
Destroying the old machines does push the narrative forward. It symbolizes progress, conflict, a break with the past. As an example, it's the reason why the Pursuit Special is blown apart in the first two minutes of Fury Road.

>It isn't enough for Akatsuki to need to retreat ASAP due to damage
See >>23359629 and shut the fuck up. It's the epitome of bullshit that Akatsuki can tank, of all things, a Requiem shot.

Should Mu have died a second time getting blasted by Requiem?

>>23359651
>Destroying the old machines does push the narrative forward. It symbolizes progress, conflict, a break with the past
After a certain point, you just have to wonder if this has whole thing has just been bait.

>>23359647
>Are you passing moral judgment on it?
Not moral, narrative. Because this is bullshit done for the sake of it, plain and simple.

>just a high powered beam cannon
>JUST
Anon, Requiem is capable of obliterating a city completely off the map. Not even the Destroy firing multiple cannons of different calibers was capable of that degree of destruction. It is several orders of magnitude beyond even the most powerful ship-mounted cannons.

>Its beam is able to be reflected, as is evident from the basic functionality of the relay stations.
Yes, relay stations the width of O'Neill cylinders using Mirage Colloid. Not exactly the same as your average rifle shot.

>while taking heavy damage
What "heavy damage"? Just some of alarms going off in the cockpit, while still being able to fly away? At least they could've have its armor fully burnt off, because even the shield kept its gold coating after the blast.

>>23359660
it's a valid reason because why the fuck else would they wreck the freedom just before having strike freedom debut?

they don't want to pass down freedom to a secondary character or taint it otherwise, so into the trash it goes to make room for the new one

>>23359647
>Requiem is just a high powered beam cannon.
And tank cannons are just big guns, but it'd be pretty silly for someone to shrug off getting hit by one with a couple broken bones because they were wearing kevlar, even if that works on smaller scale equivalents.

>>23359651
>"Unexpected" from whom?
The Alliance fleet and Orb's own space fleet joining the battle, and ZAFT loyalists stopping the coup faction. Compass went in for a stealth mission, then got massively backed up by basically every existing faction. If it was just Kira, Athrun, Shinn, Luna, and Hilda vs all of Foundation's forces and the ZAFT coup fleet, they may have gotten totally annihilated.

>Destroying the old machines does push the narrative forward. It symbolizes progress, conflict, a break with the past.
Which isn't the story of SEED Freedom at all. It's a more introspective story about accepting your own faults, and trusting and relying on others. Older machines overcome the newer models precisely because of this.

>It's the epitome of bullshit that Akatsuki can tank, of all things, a Requiem shot.
It could handle a blast from a positron cannon, but the big beam cannon is what stretches your suspension of disbelief? Get real.

>>23359699
>Older machines overcome the newer models precisely because of this.
it also helps that they just got better weapons than the enemies, period

If you guys can't see the difference between Kira laughing off everything Rey ever does to him and destroying with him stock footage, vs SF getting almost all it's weapons and most of it's backpack destroyed and overheated and about to get pasted until Athrun saves the day I don't know what to tell you

>>23359684
>Not moral, narrative. Because this is bullshit done for the sake of it, plain and simple.
It's a hype moment that gives the Akatsuki, which is basically obsolete due to Foundation's new armor, something to do that only it, among all the protagonist suits, can do.

>Anon, Requiem is capable of obliterating a city completely off the map. Not even the Destroy firing multiple cannons of different calibers was capable of that degree of destruction. It is several orders of magnitude beyond even the most powerful ship-mounted cannons.
>Yes, relay stations the width of O'Neill cylinders using Mirage Colloid. Not exactly the same as your average rifle shot.
Not one word of this countered what I said at all. It's a beam cannon. That fired on a mobile suit that explicitly no-sells beams.

>What "heavy damage"?
Everything outlined in >>23359589
>even the shield kept its gold coating after the blast.
The shield was physically falling apart and we see pieces of it melting off.

>>23359690
The Freedom was destroyed for a completely different narrative reason - to clearly denote when Durandal is officially the villain of the show.
If you were right and it was to get rid of the old to make way for the new, they wouldn't have just kept calling the Strike Freedom "the Freedom" for the rest of the show. That's the exact opposite.

>>23359693
Nonsense analogy. Kevlar doesn't outright negate bullets. Better analogy would be Superman tanking handgun bullets vs tank shells.

>>23359690
Anon, what is your point anymore? Do you even know? Because it sounds like you're just spouting out whatever you can to justify not liking Freedom at this point.
>>23359714
> The Freedom was destroyed for a completely different narrative reason - to clearly denote when Durandal is officially the villain of the show
I'd add that it was the show's way of telling Kira/co that they couldn't just keep running their operation off of prayers and vibes alone anymore. They needed to do at least some planning and get their shit together if they wanted to get anything done.

>>23359711
To be fair, given that Kira fought a nearly identical machine in a worse version of his current one, why should he even struggle?

>>23359699
Not just your faults, but your losses as well. Looking towards the future is great, but you'll never really go where you need to without accepting the past as well. Acknowledging that pain and learning from it is the ignition point for wisdom. Hence details like Stella protecting Shinn, Compass using Nicol's tactics to get the drop on Foundation, Athrun turning the words Cagali said to him at the end of SEED into strength to survive. I said this before, but I haven't properly found the words to explain it so I keep trying. Sorry for the nuisance.
>>23359711
It's just the one guy.

>>23358577
>GSD flawless victory
>but only if you count Kira and his 7 closest friends and not the hundreds of ZAFT, ORB, and EA troops that joined that and died on the Messiah assault
>don’t count the literally army that was decimated to get him there
>flawless

>>23359747
You're good anon, and I agree with all of that.

>>23357797 (OP)
With Hiraiface everyone looks like a bitch.

>>23359751
>GSD flawless victory
>but only if you count the characters you're supposed to root for and not random mooks
Umm... yes...?

>>23359735
This is true. Kira was never gonna have trouble against Rey no matter what. He already defeated a superior and more experienced version of the same guy when he'd never fought Dragoons before and didn't have any of his own. He already knew exactly what to do and had more options.

>>23359714
>If you were right and it was to get rid of the old to make way for the new, they wouldn't have just kept calling the Strike Freedom "the Freedom" for the rest of the show. That's the exact opposite.

They call every version of it just "Freedom", even in the movie as it's basically Kira's second identity at this point. That being said they clearly wanted the original gone so Kira could have an upgrade and might as well destroy it since it would otherwise never be used again.

>>23358577
I love how “flawless victory” is only ever cited as an issue with SEED Destiny and now Freedom, when it’s not only standard for Gundam, but the majority of media - film, TV, games.

>>23358126
>>23358856
It's for the best since I'm sure Lacus wouldn't want smelly orphan stink when her and Kira breed and create the ultimate messiah child that will guide humanity beyond the earthsphere.

>>23360881
Don't remind them that Unicorn ends the same way. Even with them TANKING a fucking Colony Laser.

>>23360881
>flawless victory
>standard for Gundam
0079 - gundam and white base get shot down
Zeta - 80% of good guys die or get brain scrambled
ZZ - Purus die
CCA - most of the good guys die, including Amuro
Victory - lol lmao
Wing - gundams get destroyed
SEED - Flay, Mwu and a bunch of other people die, Freedom and Justice get rekt
00 - Lockon dies, Tieria "dies"
IBO - lol lmao
GCucks - villain gets away with everything

Such standard

>>23360974
No good guys die in the final battle in 0079, ZZ, F91, 0083, 08th MS Team, G, Wing, X, or 00
Get real

>>23360995
Not flawless victories.
Get real.

>>23361004
Yeah they were. And you’d especially shit yourself if you ever watched anything other than Gundam. Return of the Jedi would give you a heart attack.

>>23361015
>le my nerd shit is better than YOUR nerd shit

>>23360974
If 00, Wing, and ZZ are the caliber of "sacrifice" we're running on, then you literally have no point. Puru 1 dies way before the final battle and 2's mortal wounds are delivered before the final battle with Haman. She's a "loss" for the final battle by technicality.

>>23360974
the good guys had a flawless victory in IBO tho

>>23360881
>I love how “flawless victory” is only ever cited as an issue with SEED Destiny
It's an issue in SEED Destiny because you spend half the series with Rey and Shinn in the protagonist roles (I mean Rey isn't a protagonist but he's like an Emma Sheen level ally in early Destiny) so the fact that they just get WASHED by Kira and Athrun is much more jarring
At least the special edition/remaster for Destiny made it more clear that Shinn only got asswhooped so hard because of a literal mental breakdown

>>23358126
Lacus ate them. And not just sexually.

>>23360995
Birgit got gaypwned by Bugs and the Federation fleet that was sent as reinforcements was wiped out, so there were really only 2 people that could fight the Rafflesia at that point.

Also Kou got KEK'd by Nina, which I'd say is frankly worse than death when the bitch comes back all smiles like she didn't just shoot at him.

>>23360995
They fail to prevent the colony drop in 0083 and only avoid court marshal because the whole gundam project ends up getting scrubbed. That's not mentioning failing to stop the nuking of konpeito too. Kou basically achieves nothing all show long.

>>23361398
>>23361407
Also, Nina got off scott free.

>>23359247
>Mfw the kid was such an afterthought Arthur wound up having to take him in instead

>>23361407
Kou actually got court martialed for stealing the GP-03 and was sent to prison, but he was released later after Gundam Project was wiped from existence.

>>23361015
Return of the Jedi? The one where Luke is getting electrocuted to death until Vader saves him?
Totally the same as Athrun dabbing on Shinn in 5 seconds.

>>23361111
I do not subscribe to your definition that if no one dies it's automatically a 'flawless victory'.
In the first place, the main issue with SeedD isn't even the fact that no one dies, it's how easily they win. I don't think anywhere near as many people would complain if the fights were somewhat close.
Judau literally could not beat Haman on his own and needed other newtypes protecting him. How is that a flawless win?

>>23358301
>One of the best selling movies in the entire Gundam franchise is non canon
Why would you want your series to sink back purgatory like this?

>>23360963
Yeah and that was just one of many things that made Unicorn a crappy Gundam series.

>>23360974
>Doesn’t include G-Witch where all the villains are either powerless or forced to make amends for their mistakes whilst none of the good guys get killed in the final fight

>>23361908
That wasn't my definition in the first place. My point was that
>>23360974 defeats its own argument by making the mark for acceptable loss so low. If shit like Puru's death and "The Gundams got destroyed (after the fact)" are all it apparently takes, how does SEED Destiny not reach that low standard? You could just as well say that Terminal lost Meer (someone Lacus feels a lot of guilt for) and Kira and Lacus had to give up their comfy life on the beach even after the battle.

>>23361937
I wrote that right before going to sleep so I concede I might have forgot something.
With Wing I was thinking of Endless Waltz where Wing Zero gets destroyed as part of the finale.
And with Puru I admit that I don't remember ZZ that well, I remember she died in the second to last episode and I assumed it was part of the same operation. But yeah, Judau needing help is a better argument, now that I checked he doesn't even win against Haman, they disable each other and she commits sudoku.

>>23359442
It's very weird how SEED operates on the idea that "Beams are beams" despite some being regular plasma, some being microwaves, and some being FUCKING ANTIMATTER (Well, the positron part at least) Why exactly is Akatsuki resistant to all three different types but weak to bullets and bashing?

>>23365095
no seriously, there isn't an explanation

>>23365095
When was Akatsuki hit with any sort of microwave beam?

>>23365144
It wasn't.
SEED haters are retarded.

>>23357993
Instead of Mighty Strike Freedom, Freedom should have ended with these kids in a 5 seat combiners blasting Orphee into pieces

>>23358301
>Freedom is non-canon
>he's still coping with his headcanon

lmao you really fucking hate that Kuckira is canon (real)

>>23361908
Reminded me of Revenge of the Sith honestly, where Anakin and Obiwan have their battle and just kind of back and forth ineffectively for a while until Anakin/Shinn does something stupid and gets immediately wrecked.

>>23359557
>The chest cannon was destroyed.
Yeah but now he's got a ZZ forehead gun.

>>23365252
Pretty sure it's intentional. Isn't Fukuda like a big Star Wars fan? Even pulling a Greedo on Nicol.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhpmGzNK0aI

>>23365171
>>23365144
I guess I mixed up what Requiem actually was. It's apparently unspecified I was just mentally comparing the CYCLOPS and GENESIS like haze of energy around it to mean it was Microwaves or Gamma Rays for sure.

I guess because it can't fire with the Positron reflectors up it's either Positrons or protons.

>>23365241
Only you believe its real.

>>23365252
Not exactly. Athrun was trying to talk no jutsu Shinn the whole time but he failed. Shinn went full schizo and was about kill Luna, only then Ahtrun goes Seed mode and dismembers Destiny in seconds.
Basically Shinn lost the moment Athrun got serious.
Though to be fair, one can argue Shinn wasn't performing at his best due to losing his goddamn mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tz4fGkD2b-s

>>23365538
>its

>>23357993
She was saving herself for marriage!
Kira's dick doesn't work!
Kira is attracted to Lacus on the spiritual level only (he lusts after Assram)!

>>23359657
Yes. His presence ruins other characters (who accept this 'But Muh Amnesia!!' genocider with open arms).

>>23359557
>>23359592
Fukuda wanted to one-up Mwu blocking a Lohengrin with the Strike

>>23365828
He combined Mu's most ludicrous feats (tanking a giant beam and reflecting beams back at enemies) into a single moment

>>23365660
If Athrun had given him this speech during the betrayal sequence instead of that retarded "Rey and Durandal's words sound good but will eventually kill the world" maybe he would've actually convinced Shinn

>>23365660
I swear so much of the dialogue is the characters being way too preachy and trying too hard to sound smart and profound.

>>23365313
It really is just a giant beam.

>>23366068
>Shinn is wavering, not really sure on what's right or wrong
>he begs tearfully for Athrun to come back, to not betray them
>all Athrun has to say is "Shinn, the chairman has been using a fake Lacus, and Meyrin can confirm that his agents are after me. Why don't we go land somewhere and talk this out? Nobody has to die today."
>instead Athrun says some total bullshit

>>23366126
Does Athrun ever acknowledge that he played a part in Shinn's downfall? I feel like even the show doesn't seem to think so.

>>23366136
I doubt it. He expresses sympathy for Shinn, especially in The Edge, but doesn't blame himself for the state Shinn ended up in. And given they still don't get along as of Freedom...

>>23366126
>instead Athrun says some total bullshit
It's more fun that way.

>>23365660
>when Shinn fires six beam rifle shots at a stationary Athrun and misses with five of them
Holy shit
I always thought "he was losing his mind and that's why he lost" was some sort of cope

>>23366194
Funny thing is I think is I think in the Edge manga Shinn actually damages him.

>>23366190
>[...] And now you're trying to kill off the future as well?!
>I know! I know this much! That's why the world has to change! That's why Orb needs to be wiped out!
He's fighting for a world he doesn't even want and trying desperately to convince himself that it's right.
Kino

>>23366136
No it's mostly portrayed that there was just nothing Athrun could have done to make Shinn listen.

>>23360881
No. It's specifically a GSD "thing." GSD's ending fucked up the Gundam audience so much that, when the finale for Gundam 00 was getting commercials, people actually thought it was a "plot twist" that 00 Raiser was seen actually taking damage in the final battle. Before the whole episode even aired.

>>23366194
Pretty sure that along with the "That's why the world has to change! That's why Orb needs to be wiped out" were new to the remaster/special edition. In the original he just goes straight into the "Dakedo...DAKEDO" ill fated palm charge.
I guess Fukuda didn't think it was obvious enough that Shinn was conflicted through the entire final battle

>>23366217
Rey was working overtime to groom him into becoming Durandal's Vader in the final few episodes, even though it's clear Shinn doesn't really 'get it'. He even makes sure that he barely gets to talk to Lunamaria because he knows she'll cause him to waver.

>>23366296
Getting shot down and left without a machine to pilot was the point at which Shinn lost pretty much any respect for him, at least as a mentor figure. And this was the same battle where the first of the stolen machines got shot down, which cemented the perception of Shinn as an ace from the rest of the ship's crew.

>>23357803
Pretty much this.

>>23365265
>Yeah but now he's got a ZZ forehead gun.
Yeah but it doesn't work without the second nuclear reactor in the Proud Defender pack powering the forehead gun.

>>23365828
>>23359592
>>23365839
Fukuda said he had trouble deciding whether he should make the movie with a more serious tone (like the od Season 1 of Seed), or make it with more of a party atmosphere to appeal to Seed fans who supported him throughout the years. To give more fan service and good moments to characters. He decided that if this was his final Seed project, then he wanted to go out with a more festive tone with no regrets. It's why Mu blocking Requiem is treated as more of a joke meme than anything serious, and why the end of Seed Freedom is just a bunch of characters getting their moment to shine while dunking on the Black Knights.

What Fukuda didn't expect was that Seed Freedom would be the biggest selling Gundam movie of all time, and breaking all records. Far surpassing Hathaway in ticket sales and gunpla sales.

Because of that success, Fukuda was allowed to remaster the movie for Bluray release. He redid over 600 scenes in the movie to improve animation. And his Seed Freedom Prequel movie was approved called "Seed Freedom Zero" (if I recall the name correctly".

>>23366575
Rey grooming Shinn into the ultimate attack dog and Shinn's decaying mental stability is probably the only thing that the tail end of Seed Destiny did well. But it feels so unsatisfying because it just results in such a laughably one sided beatdown from a character who had been useless most of the series.

>>23360995
>flawless v
>X

>>23361015
Famously obscure and unwatched media, Star Wars

>>23368919
You think we might see more SEED stuff with or without him?

>>23369382
For all of Seed's faults, Fukuda is still the best in the modern era of Gundam Directors. Seed is far surpasses nonsense like Gquuuuuux (how tf do you even say that) or GWitch or Requiem for Vengeance.
Seed may be flawed but at least it's entertaining and interesting. So yes I hope Fukuda stays and makes more Seed.

>>23369501
Agreed. Gquux was bizzarre. Requiem had crap writing. And GWitch isn't even Gundam. It's just school duels using mobile suits with added drama. Like a serious version of gunpla fighters to appeal to women.

>>23360995
Gundam machines are the good guys

>>23369501
I randomly started rewatching Seed Destiny since it just popped up in my youtube recs.
I'm up to episode 8 or 9 and it's honestly pretty good so far. I like how it takes advatage of being a 50 episode show, it takes it's time, the fights are a little too long but nothing feels like filler. Shinn is actually likeable and him shitting on Cagalli was perfectly justifiable, they also did a good job justifying Athrun's decision to go back to Zaft.
I remember it goes to shit around the time Kira comes back but it's honestly better than I remembered, so far.

>>23360974
>villain gets away with everything
You're not supposed to view Challia, Lalah and Shuji as bad guys.

>>23372094
The first 10 to 20 ish episodes are pretty solid.

But the main writer only planned for a short series. She also got sick later on, had some issues, and handed in scripts late which affected the animation team. So Seed Destiny suffers from pacing and animation problems later on.

Personally, I like to pretend the first 10 to 20 episode of Seed Destiny is it's own series.

And the other stuff (like when Kira Returns with a mobile suit) is it's own seperate series.

>>23372111
I view Nyaan as a bad guy

>>23358708
If you think about it Orphee's an even bigger bitch for needing to use an upgraded knockoff of the Strike Freedom built to counter the SF's beam arsenal, a co-pilot to control his Dragoons and drones, and his buddy in a discount Justice just to fight Kira, and Kira was still able to barely survive all that bullshit.

>>23361015
>>23369366
I mean Star Wars is the Gundam of the West. Down to when the original writer/director left, it went to shit.

>>23372111
Challia is Zeon so he's a bad guy. They still genocided half the human race.