this was a good movie. I finally watched it and was not let down, but I wish it had maybe an extra 20 minutes of denouement instead of just ending after the big battle. it's too hot for me to type more so I won't.

>>23381224 (OP)
adding a few things to put more meat on the thread
>I like Agnes and wish she got a happy ending
>can Lacus do the OP thing accords can do too?
>where is this thing about Athrun liking Kira's mom coming from? It wasn't even in the movie unless I missed it
>I miss the OG English voice for Kira, I think it was Richard Cox?

Honestly thinking back, there could have been a lot more unique interactions between characters that were unheard of.
>Shinn and Lacus never talked
>Mu and Shinn never talked (about Stella)
>Luna and Kira never talked
>Meyrin and Lacus never talked

Yeah it’s good.

>>23381238
>can Lacus do the OP thing accords can do too?
Yes.
>I miss the OG English voice for Kira, I think it was Richard Cox?
Matt Hill. I can’t watch the new dub no matter how I try. The pronunciations are all fucked up, dialogue is fucked up, audio levels are fucked up.

Why didn't Shura and Orphee try to Yami ni Ochiru Kira during the final battle?

>>23381238
>>I like Agnes and wish she got a happy ending
She's alive. Which is more than what could be said for other characters who shared her voice actress in SEED.

>>23381609
Only Griffin can do that

>>23381658
Damn the Accords are fucking frauds.
My GOATs would never.

>>23381573
just aint the same without that Ob

>>23381573
Lacoos killed me
>>23381468
movie felt a bit rushed and you can see they kind of wanted to give everyone at least a frame or thing to do... if only the art of the OVA wasn't completely dead, it could have been a 3 hour thing even.
>>23381619
doesn't she land on the moon? that's good luck since Shinn and Luna had that happen to them... kinda good luck anyway?
>>23381697
the accords are kinda like innovades I guess... which isn't the worst concept to recycle. and it was super cool when Shinn's mind just went blank and there was nothing they could do.

Shinn should've fought Shura to get the rematch from the sword duel earlier. Also I kinda wish Orphee and Ingrid didn't die

>>23382474
Yes. Like I said, she lived until the end. Which means a lot considering every other character voiced by Houko Kuwashima in the CE ended up dying. (Via Hibiki, Natarle, Flay, Stella) Agnes broke the curse.
>>23382491
How would Shura have reacted to naked ghost Stella?

>>23381224 (OP)
I loved it. Every character that appears in the film gets at least one little moment to shine (even though I don't know why Andy isn't in the film). I never cared about Shinn but I think he was utilized perfectly in the movie, really contrasts with Kira how he's still a little immature and hot-headed. Everything involving Kira, Athrun and Lacus was great and THAT one Athrun moment was super cool. Already one of my favorite Gundam movies.

Does any other protagonist love their Gundam as much as Shinn?

>>23382549
>even though I don't know why Andy isn't in the film
Proof enough that "people" that like the CE are retards that don't pay attention and only get distracted by flashy imagery.

>>23382622
And he was the captain of the Eternal too during the final battle, wasn't he?

>>23382622
Oh, my bad, only watched it once. That scene goes by really quick and I was paying attention to the Bucues there. So he technically IS in the movie, but he doesn't do anything and was included only as a quick cameo, same with Sai.

>>23382647
What? No. The Eternal effectively only shows up once.

>>23381224 (OP)
>this was a good movie. I finally watched it and was not let down, but I wish it had maybe an extra 20 minutes of denouement instead of just ending after the big battle. it's too hot for me to type more so I won't.


Why didn't you watch the Directors Cut Extended Remastered Edition?

It didn't have enough Murrue fan service.

>>23382856
She's never had a shower scene in anything.

What do you think of the character/MS rankings from shortly after the movie released?

>>23382996
People just love Kira, he's basically Gundam Jesus

>>23382996
I will never understand the Yzak love
This nigga was a war criminal

>>23381224 (OP)
my favorite scene was when athrun was beating the fuck out of kira

>Flawless victory again
Garbage.

You think Femto Armor will catch on as a trend in mobile suit development following Freedom?

>>23383011
Japs like angry femboys, I guess?

>>23383011
He had some character development and guilt from it then took out 2 Druggies with the least powerful of the Gundams.

>>23383044
That's what friends are for.

>>23383098
It’s possible Compass might be able to reverse engineer and use it on new ace machines. I don’t think they’d shy away from using enemy tech, that’s hardly a thing in CE.

Didn't think I'd come across this.

>>23382996
Still surprised Cagalli ranked so high while Lacus is only number 5.

>>23384770
Reminder that Athrun made Shura, an Accord genetic supremacist, view the mental equivalent of a racemixing sex tape.

>>23384758
How the heck can they talk about Gundam Seed for 90 minutes? Is he just rambling nonsense?

>>23384865
It's a she, actually. As for the length, I have no clue. I listened for about 20 minutes, but things felt mostly like preamble. Stuff was said, but not much was done then to expand why said things were either good or bad.

>>23383049
Shinn is the FLAWLESS VICTORY boy this time though, SF almost gets blown up and IJ takes damage and loses parts.

>>23384879
It's bait, anon.

>>23384881
Oh no, I acted on IMPULSE....

>>23384873
>It's a she
I don't buy it.

I never understood this frame. Why are Mayu and Stellar appearing with the Impulse? Because he associates the Impulse with him being weak?

>>23384889
>I don't buy it
I mean, you can look into it yourself.

>>23384894
I think it's because Luna just got in his flight path. That said, you might be onto something with that.

>>23384894
Well, let's get autistic here.

Shinn is already massively stressed. He's fighting for a world he doesn't believe in. He's fighting to create a world without war, by first exterminating Orb. Athrun tells him he's full of it and asks if that really is the kind of world he wants. Now Shinn's in the cockpit hyperventilating and thinking on all that he's lost.
>Mayu's phone message, her running and smiling
>Stella dying in his arms in Berlin
>himself crying over his family as Freedom is fighting in Orb
>him lying Stella to rest in a lake
>him bringing down the Freedom, but only temporarily
He charges at Athrun. Suddenly a white mobile suit swoops in to block him from Athrun. Shinn doesn't really see the Impulse, he sees Mayu and Stella, two people he's lost. And he sees the mobile suit he associates with losing them - the Freedom. He doesn't slow down his attack, he intensifies it, while screaming his head off
> やめろぉぉー!! / Make it stop!! / No more!!

TL;DR
He's in his own head. He doesn't register the Impulse, he sees it as the Freedom. It's the Freedom that he associates with him being weak.

>>23382996
Best girl Lunamaria not even on it...

>>23382996
These were only the interim results. Here are the final results.
https://www.gundam-seed.net/special/gp2024/

>Character
1. Cagalli
2. Kira
3. Lacus
4. Athrun
5. Shinn
6. Yzak
7. Arnold
8. Dearka
9. Lunamaria
10. Stella

>>23384972
You're in luck!

>>23384986
>MS/MA
1. Freedom
2. Mighty Strike Freedom
3. Destiny Spec II
4. Z'Gok
5. Strike Rouge
6. Strike Freedom
7. Akatsuki
8. Infinite Justice
9. Rising Freedom
10. Infinite Justice Spec II

(I was hoping the Strike would do better, but it got 11th)

>>23382996
I don't get the Cagalli meme, she barely did shit in the movie.

>>23384986
This is cute art of Kira with his love interests

>>23385000
Is it really fair to divide Z'Gok and Infinite Justice Spec II into seperate categories? They are the same suit. Z'gok is just the outer armor of Justice Spec II. Not a full suit. They put the two votes of IJ and Zgok together.

>tfw still haven't watched the movie yet because I haven't steeled myself to suffer through all of Destiny despite at least three attempts

>>23385005
She was mostly support but had vital roles. She sent Athrun to the Foundation because shit was suspicious and already had evac plans ready, which is why everything went so quickly in the film. She had the Impulse, Destiny and Strike Freedom repaired, clearly why Athrun has the Infinite Justice too, and loaned Mu the Akatsuki again. Her remote system is why Athrun beat Shura but she was also controlling the IJ when Athrun was in the SF. https://x.com/fukuda320/status/1799118247402619018

>>23381224 (OP)
this movie is the definition of turn your brain off and have fun, both for good and bad

>>23381224 (OP)
It was a good ending to the SEED storyline

>>23383157
he acknowledges his war crime once without even directly saying he killed innocent civilians in the process because the writers clearly couldnt handle trying to properly redeem him

>>23385000
I cant believe they like the Freedom that much it looks like shit compared to Strike

>>23385567
Strike has the ugliest SEED backpack

>>23382532
They missed the opportunity to give TM Revolution a character in Freedom and have him survive the movie

>>23385000
>>23385567
>>23385567
>>23385582
>Aile strike no where near top 10
THE FUCK

>>23385567
Maybe they like it because of Kira.

>>23385755
The Aile Strike isn’t separate from the Strike, which got 11th

>>23385772
Makes me wonder what they think of the Freedom's interventions in Destiny, or Angel Down.

>>23384972
>Lunamaria
>best girl
She is very cute, yes, but let's be honest here, she's barely a character and can't hold a candle to Lacus and Cagalli. In my opinion there's nothing wrong with "cute for the sake of cuteness" in anime, but Lunamaria is 100% pure waifubait, I'm sorry Anon.

>>23385787
It’s not a monolith, there are plenty who still think Kira was in the wrong and deserved to be shot down.

That said, the main fan sentiment seems to be that Kira wasn’t in the wrong for trying to reduce the number of deaths. I’ve seen some say that the only one in the wrong there was Athrun.

>>23381224 (OP)
not a fan of MSF making a beeline for the nearest beach so Kira and Lacus can immediately strip off their clothes and fuck?

>>23385845
>Lacus
>character
If you mean Deus ex Machina, sure.
There's nothing to her but always being right and having asspulls to save every situation.
Cagali is a character though yes.

Ingrid > Lacus
Orphee won he just didn't realize it

>>23385943
>There's nothing to her but always being right
Literally the first half of Freedom is her fucking up because she's being hasty trying to put BC to bed. Even in Destiny, you could make the argument that her passivity was what let things get so bad in the first place.

>>23386083
So it took until the latest movie to give her a flaw?
And SEED and Destiny she's perfect?

>>23386270
She was Morosawa's self insert so...

>>23383098
I feel like everyone higher up will want to bury the fuck out of it because of how badly it can emasculate the average force. Compass's aces don't really need it and the enemy having it just makes it hard for them to do their interventions, especially one Kira is attempting as it really messes up his beam spam disable tactics.

The main people who would want it are people like Blue Cosmos to make their huge WMD mobiles even harder to stop.

>>23386270
Did you just stop reading halfway through my post?

>>23386291
No, that’s who Cagalli was
Morosawa said that she found Lacus to be an unreasonable woman for supporting her man going out and risking his life rather than asking him to stay behind

Just as I suspected before this was properly announced, the EarthAlliance was complete irrelevant to the point where they have been reduced to a faction of faceless mooks.

>>23386381
The Eurasian Federation is in total shambles, the Atlantic Federation is perfectly fine, maybe even better than ever
I wouldn’t be shocked if we see a new Alliance between the AF and Orb in a future work

>>23386347
No but you said arguable in Destiny and Destiny does not make that argument, that's you being charitable.

>>23386402
NTA
Doesn’t it? Doesn’t she regret that her absence from politics led to Meer being used and then dying?

>>23386410
And Meer is one of the reasons she decides to take an active role in the worldstage following Durandal's defeat as well despite not wanting to.

>>23384758
Anyone watch this shit?

>>23385948
>Orphee won
The cuck girlfriend Olympics?

>>23386880
The KWAB villain of the CE Olympics.

>>23386370
So, the reason Cagalli was going through so much shit in Destiny was because Murosawa hated herself?

>>23390440
He's got some competition.

is it just me or does Kira go from being mature in SEED to exceedingly stoic in Destiny to just utterly immature in Freedom?

https://youtu.be/I2P7ZhrcjGs?t=167
>athrun saves kira's worthless faggot ass in the movie with his z'gok
>twice
>zeus destiny is mighty freedom's assist
athrunsisters... I can't take the humiliation any longer...

>>23390597
Kira as a character died the moment Aegis exploded in his face. The corpse was repurposed for a wish fulfilment power fantasy mary sue moralfag self insert for Fukuda.

In Destiny they at first wanted to dig up the rotting corpse one last time and use it properly this time around - as a Sacrificial Lion and Passing the Torch. But they got cold feet the moment Impulse shoved his sword in his face. The stinky bloated corpse was then re-repurposed for even more schizophrenic mary sue wank that could only be excused as a brain cancer dying wish.

And in the movie they inadvertently became semi-conscious of this and parodied the character with a hilariously retarded melodramatic otome NTR plot point which culminates in him crashing out, getting mauled by Athrun and then totaling both Freedoms in the movie. Which was the most appropriate thing they could've done, second only to finally putting him down.

tl;dr don't think about these characters too much. They're not written as humanlike characters. They're entertaining clowns. Same goes for action scenes and world building consistency in CE.

>>23390617
but what if we didn't know how fast it accelerates? how much grip would that require?

>>23385845
>she's barely a character and can't hold a candle to Lacus and Cagalli
Neither Lacus nor Cagalli are characters what the fuck.
Lacus is only interesting if you take the schizo cope theory that she's an evil mastermind. Otherwise she's a disgusting Mary Sue that makes no fucking sense in-universe. She has no motivations for anything yet she has the resources to shit out nuclear powered Gundams in months.
And Cagalli is an even bigger crying joke with Destiny completely shitting on what little character she garnered in SEED. Didn't even let the bitch keep her dad's Akatsuki lmao.

At least Luna has the endearing retard couple thing going on with Shinn and actually pilots a Gundam. Impulse now being a proper complement unit for Destiny, capable of matching any of Destiny's needed roles with silhouettes and Destiny now being capable of recharging Impulse with deuterion beam upgrade.

>>23390617
>>23390683
Literally too retarded for a teen's show.

>>23384894
Luna is in the Impulse.

>>23390607
Destiny Spec II isn't even playable yet...Shinn bros...
Neither is Orphee or Shura though I guess

>>23390597
I thought that his characterization in Freedom made way more sense than whatever we saw in Destiny

>>23390768
Yeah but why are Stella and Mayu there as ghosts?

>>23390774
Not really. Destiny Kira is the best version of him.
Freedom Kira is just bad, non-canon fanfiction.

>>23390617
But Athrun is his self insert

>>23390568
Their relationship issues at least were based on their irl issues

>>23390798
No one wants to self insert as Assram the loser.

>>23390777
Because Shinn was falling apart almost as hard as the whole show at that point.

>>23390761
Retards take it seriously. Even Fukuda told you to turn your brain off.

>>23390807
That just makes the fact that you're still too retarded for it worse.

>>23390617
>>23390683
SEED haters are retarded, as always

>>23390818
>t. The Raped

>>23390820
I love it THOUGH.

>>23390826
>I love it, that’s why I post random untrue shit about it lmao!
Ok

>>23390834
It's all true, sorry.

The movie is quite kind to Shin. He single-handedly takes out a couple of opponents alone.

>>23390838
>none of the characters are characters!
>Kira was meant to die, the new characters were just meant to kill all the old ones!
>Lacus is an evil mastermind who churns out nuclear Gundams!
SEED haters are retarded.

>>23390847
Yeah, all true. And that's fine.

>>23390848
That’s all complete bullshit though
You not understanding characters doesn’t mean they aren’t characters
Shinn was intended to be replaced as MC from the very start
Lacus doesn’t run Terminal

Put your phone down and pay attention when you watch something, ffs

>>23390844
Freedom was kinder to Shinn than Destiny was.

>>23390858
Well yeah, Destiny is about Shinn being manipulated and used by the people he trusts most

>>23390858

>>23391019
Based

>>23390683
>least retarded destiny fan

>>23391216
Don't you dare lump him in with other Destiny fans. He's in a league of his own.

>>23391241
Look, I don't hate Destiny. But it's definitely a downgrade from Seed. Sick mobile suits though.

>>23390683
Even in EXVS, I liked how Gunner Zaku compliments Destiny so well, just by virtue of the cost and roles.

>>23391274
That's not saying much, even people who love Destiny can generally agree

>>23391325
Just saying. I'm a Gundam fan? Absolutely. I'm a Gundam Seed fan? Sure. I'm a Gundam Seed Destiny fan? I don't know if I'd use that word.

Kira and Lacus are villains.

>>23391019
>>23391128
Canon thanks to drama CD. He still hates Athrun (warranted) but he ended up liking Kira.

>>23391342
True GSD fans accept its retardation as a complete package. Shit and all.
Schizos try to gaslight themselves with extra material and cope theories.

>>23391683
Kira is an allegory for Jesus, he can't be a bad guy

>>23391719
>He still hates Athrun (warranted)
How is it warranted?

>>23391274
Not to start an autistic slap fight, but the one that I think is better honestly just depends on mood.

>>23391852
Probably because Assram is a schizophrenic retard.

I binged the whole series in a few days, nothing will outass the Kira teleport. As for the movie, the weird mind control thing just reeked of poor plotting so the movie turned out rather mediocre for me. Freedom does look sick though.

>>23391922
>Kira teleport
What

>>23391942
The one they made an entire manga tie-in to explain the asspull.

>>23391886
Fair. Destiny has more of that "2000s angsty teenager" flavor to it, which is not objectively bad, and I do admit sometimes I'm in the mood for it.

>>23391942
Kira loses to Asrun when the latter explodes his mobile suit at him, Kira presumed dead. Actually Kira is alive and safe back in one of the plants.

>>23392354
the orphanage guy just had a rocket ready to launch at any time or something, idk I didn't read the manga

>>23392354
>Kira loses to Asrun
Didn't happen. Kira won the fight and Assrun had to resort to blowing himself up.

>>23392375
>kira won the fight
>by getting caught in aegis' MA grip
You see, Assram, I won because dying unlocks my Super Jesus Christ 2 zenkai boost.

>>23392346
Y2K angsty teen edge is unironic kino and I'm tired of pretending that it isn't. I never grew out of it. Instead I became immune to shame and cringe.

I pity you if you've never blasted Linkin Park while playing Rengou VS Zaft 2, enacting your favorite AMV moments.

>>23392442
Aegis was completely out of power
Athrun’s only recourse was blowing up Aegis
It STILL didn’t kill Kira or destroy the Strike, at least nowhere near as bad as the Aegis got it

Athrun lost

>>23392491
I'm guessing you feel the same way about Freedom vs. Impulse. Shinn lost because Kira didn't die even if he destroyed the Freedom.

>>23392491
>It STILL didn’t kill Kira
Ok I guess nobody wins anything in this universe because all 3 of these motherfuckers keep surviving despite getting their suits blown up.

>>23392511
Mu is the biggest winner since he keeps surviving getting blasted by big ass beams.

>>23392479
Shinn is more fun to watch in combat than the other two, especially during the middle parts of Destiny where he feels more like a Musou character than a Gundam pilot.

>>23392519
>Mu is the biggest winner since he keeps surviving getting blasted by Murrue's big ass titties.

>>23385582
Sword Strike is sex.

>>23392523
Very true. I fell in love with him thanks to his Impulse stunts but I also loved him in Destiny. He pilots like a suicidal maniac. Completely unhinged.

>>23392538
>He pilots like a suicidal maniac. Completely unhinged.
But doesn't the show treat that as a bad thing?

>>23392509
Correct.

>>23392543
Then that means Kira lost the Savior fight since Athrun didn't die either.

>>23391911
Mainly in Destiny. At least in Freedom he knows what he wants and that's to impregnate his best friend's twin sister.

>>23392519
>>23392525
He was always my favorite.
>aryan chad
>no bullshit coordinator magical powers
>genes so strong his dad was cloned multiple times
>fights mobile suits using shitty mobile armors no problem
>bangs the big titty captain
>loved by all his crewmates
>mentor figure to the protagonist of the series
>sacrifices himself to save his friends
>comes back to life to bang the captain some more
He's beyond based.

>>23392509
No, Freedom vs Impulse was a win because Shinn was able to actually shoot down the Freedom, it was irreparable
Angel Down itself was a loss

>>23392511
The point was that Athrun lost his suit and didn’t damage the Strike beyond repair in turn, it can’t be anything but a loss

>>23392545
No, Savior was completely irreparable

>>23392442
>>23392491

It was a draw, as both would have died without a third party rescuing them.

>>23392692
I know that. It's just that one particular anon once claimed only battles where Kira wins matter to him, and he called Shinn a "cheater" for his fight against Freedom.

>>23392711
Yeah, a draw works, it’s just definitely not an Athrun victory I’d say

>>23392541
Seed Destiny treats it as a bad thing because he's not regulating his emotions properly.
Seed Freedom inadvertently treats it as a good thing because Shinn is now on Team Kira and someone has to handle the extra BKs.

When Z'gok did it's cast off my brain heard the musical sting and for a moment I thought Ibwas going to hear the Ultraman Mebius themesong.

>>23392788
If SEED Freedom winds up treating it as a good thing, wouldn't it be because he's finally in a good headspace mentally? Also, I thought his fighting style changed somewhat in the movie.

>>23392541
Partially. The main crux of his criticism from the cast was not just about him being reckless but him being reckless and zealous for the wrong cause. In the finale he loses his faith (heh) in the whole plan and just runs on fumes - leading him to almost dying. I remember one anon describing Shinn as a shounen protagonist that lost his will and motivation, meaning he can't bullshit his way to victory anymore.

In the movie he's at first strategically mellowed out by Kira putting him in support and civilian escort roles. Then when they unleash him on goober knights he's much more clearheaded. In Destiny he tanked Destroy's beam head on because he was an insane berserker but in the movie you see him methodically disarming the knights with hit and run tactics before committing to full on attack.

By far the most entertaining character in CE.

I just really like this episode.

>>23392870
What a bullshit webm video. There absolutely no way a beam shield should be able to block that. Especially since we saw beam shields break from much weaker attacks in the Seed Freedom movie.

Destroy Gundam deserved better than that.

>>23392987
>Destroy Gundam deserved better than-ACK!

When is that prequel about the Strike Freedom theft by The Foundation is suppose to release?

>>23393035
In 20 years based on precedent.

>>23392987
Some extra material mentioned how that was a dumb thing to do and that Destiny got drained/damaged with that lunatic move.

>>23392897
Man, those two Legend's blade dragoons were scary. He oneshots not just a Zamza-Zah but a freaking Destroy too.
Pity he didn't use them against SF.

>>23392870
How can an anti ship sword penetrate phase shift armor?

>>23392711
Athrun needed a bus ride home.
Kira needed the writer to change his mind, an asspull manga copout and a hospital visit.

Athrun won. Kamikazeing your mobile suit is an entirely tournament legal move.

>>23393319
>coping

>>23392711
>It was a draw, as both would have died without a third party rescuing them.

No. Several problems with your statement.

1. Athrun could have survived. He was not as badly injured as Kira, and had military survival training.

2. Kira took an explosion to the face and was on the verge of death. He definitely was going to die without outside help.

3. Athrun won the overall battle. But lost the mobile suit duel.

Athrun wanted to kill Kira. He didn't necessarily care about winning the mobile suit duel as long as he killed Kira in the end. If blowing up Aegis gets Athrun the victory, then Athrun will do it.

When asked by fans, Director Fukuda said that among the 3 pilots (Kira, Shinn, and Athrun), Athrun is the strongest pilot. Fukuda explained that Athrun is a trained soldier, has a killer instinct (goes for the kill) that Kira lacks, and does whatever it takes to win. Athrun is extremely crafty.

That's why Athrun beat Shura in the Seed Movie. Shura thought they were having some "honorable duel" with rules. Meanwhile Athrun was thinking of whatever method he could use to kill Shura. Even if it means using outside help like Cagalli remote control. Then Athrun goes straight for the cockpit with his beam saber. No mercy.

Meanwhile Kira fought Shura twice and lost miserably both times. Then Kira spared Orphee and didn't strike the cockpit directly.

>>23393333
If the goal of the overall battle was to kill Kira, how would this count as a battle win?

>>23393326
Coped so hard they wrote an entire manga bullshit to cover their rewrite tracks.

>>23393372
>If the goal of the overall battle was to kill Kira, how would this count as a battle win?
Because without outside help that came later, it would be a battle win. Kira dies. Then Athrun eventually gets up and walks away.

Who could have anticipated that Lacus would somehow teleport to Earth and save Kira? She has magical powers.

>>23393394
The same could be said for Athrun's win against Shura. Even then, isn't the only reason that Athrun survived owed to the fact that Cagali picked him up over anyone else that doesn't any ties to him?
Also, it was Reverend Malchio who picked Kira up after the battle and brought him to the PLANTs.

>>23392870
Eyo ain't that the same guy in the jobber squad with stella? Didnt he get chopped in half?

>>23393467
>The same could be said for Athrun's win against Shura.

Athrun did the same thing against Shura. Athrun focused less on winning the mobile suit duel in an "honorable way" like Shura wanted, and focused more on killing Shura by any means necessary.

Athrun doesn't pilot mobile suits for dueling. He pilots to *kill*. For Athrun, a mobile suit is just a tool to accomplish that goal.

If Cagalli wasn't available, then Athrun would have done some other cheeky strategy. Like switching to an AI controlled backpack (since Shura can't mind read AI) movement. Or using Mirage Colloid cloak in some surprising way to kill Shura. Since the Accords can't seem to detect humans under Mirage Colloid cloak.

I'm confident Athrun would have come up with something to kill Shura if Cagalli wasn't available to help him. He's always thinking about ways to kill his enemies. He thinks like a soldier according to Fukuda. So Athrun probably had several ideas in mind.

>Even then, isn't the only reason that Athrun survived owed to the fact that Cagali picked him up
I'm not sure Athrun needed her help to survive. He was unconscious. Not dead. Cagalli just happened to find him. Remember that Athrun has received special forces training and survival training.

>>23393469
Yeah, Sting. He survived because Chaos got split at the torso instead of the cockpit, much like how Immortal Justice was cut in half with Shinn bailing out of it midair. There's a split second scene where Sting is being rescued in a boat by soldiers.

I always thought his death was tragic, precisely because nobody mourned for him and he didn't even get to finish his last sentence. At that point Shinn knew Extended are tortured so him dispatching him uneventfully and mercilessly was grim. Then again he probably didn't even know he was in that Destroy.

Surviving all this only to get repurposed and stuffed into a coffin that is the Destroy Gundam is just sad.

>>23393333
>Shura thought they were having some "honorable duel" with rules.
Says the guy using mindreading to win. Unless he's one of those types that thinks a fight is only fair when he's winning.

>>23393500
If Seed Destiny was a better written series, Sting probably could have been a great character. Imagine starting out with your brother, sister, and your father figure Neo. Thinking you are the future and being so happy. Then gradually losing each of them one by one. Each loss making you more resentful and bitter. Gradually it's just you and Neo. Then finally being the last one standing. So you swear revenge and get into Destroy Gundam to take how everyone who has wronged you and hour family. Sting could have been such a great character if this series had better writers.

>>23393203
At max output, the beam covers the tip too

>>23393539
This whole series couldve been better if they didn't throw a dozen characters in the later half the series. Sting and his group besides stella got thrown under the bus HARD. They way how they were written was like the writers rushing to get rid of dead weight.

>>23392795
I mean Infinite Justice 2 did Gaia's Photon Edge against Shura

>>23390574
Imagine if Kira said three days and three nights with Lacus to Orphee instead of saying he has Lacus's love.

>>23382613
There's Setsuna, but he's a cheating manwhore.

>>23393500
>He survived because Chaos got split at the torso instead of the cockpit
> Shows a whole ass suit blowing up after being sliced.

Gundam Seed pilots make suicide bombers look like chumps bro. Out here brushing off explosions like they're bruises.

>>23393333
>2. Kira took an explosion to the face and was on the verge of death. He definitely was going to die without outside help.
Athrun was out of his MS right before it exploded, Kira was still in an MS with phase shift and a safety shutter. Athrun was definitely in the worse position, especially as he had to be picked up by Orb while the Archangel would have gotten to Kira if Lowe hadn't.
>3. Athrun won the overall battle. But lost the mobile suit duel.
Athrun had two other Gundams backing him up and was up against a Strike that only had a beam saber and shield, and still had to settle for a draw - if you can call it that, because ZAFT lost Aegis, and the Buster and Dearka were captured by the EA.
>When asked by fans, Director Fukuda said that among the 3 pilots (Kira, Shinn, and Athrun), Athrun is the strongest pilot. Fukuda explained that Athrun is a trained soldier, has a killer instinct (goes for the kill) that Kira lacks, and does whatever it takes to win. Athrun is extremely crafty.
It can go either way. He also says that if the three fought in the same mobile suits, Kira would win, and he had Durandal boast that nobody could match Kira in a mobile suit battle and Athrun didn't disagree, but then he has Shura in the movie boasting that Athrun is the strongest pilot.
>Meanwhile Kira fought Shura twice and lost miserably both times.
Kira survived about 20 minutes against the Black Knights' ambush, and did as well as anybody could against Orphee, Shura, and three Ziggurats hitting him at once from every angle. Athrun faced Shura alone. It's not really comparable.

>>23393533
Shura does seem to be the kind of person who prefers a fair fight. Against Rising Freedom, he made a point to join it on the ground to fight after it was unable to fly, and he only uses his machine's needle launching shit when it's clear he's already won. His mindreading is just a natural ability of his, it's no more cheating than Athrun going into SEED mode.

>>23392538
>>23392870
>>23393005
Very weird. Kira does the same melee move Shinn does. Freedom pulls out its beam saber and Kira goes in for a close range attack. But Destroy Gundam raises its arm, and blocks with a beam shield. Then smacks Freedom Gundam away. Makes Freedom's melee attack look so pathetic. So why the heck wasn't this used against Destiny Gundam? We know it's sword can't break beam shields. Yet all the Destroy Gundams stood there like idiots during the Battle of Heaven's Base.

>>23382491
I wanna see how Athrun would deal with the Black Knights by himself or with Hilda.

>>23393574
>We know it's sword can't break beam shields.
That only happened afterwards though.

The giant anti-ship sword being unable to break beam shields just makes it completely useless as a melee weapon compared to a standard beam saber. I guess you can the SF/IJ just have stronger shields than the Destroy's.

>>23393203

>>23393539
What you describe is basically what happens, only they keep blanking his memories and reconditioning him again and again to the point where the guy who looks up to Neo, spends time with Auel, and worries about Stella, is reduced to an insane, raving lunatic, not much better than the old biological CPUs.

>>23393574
Only Stella knew how to pilot this piece of shit. Either that or her prototype Destroy was feature complete and the latter batches got pushed into service before being properly assembled.

>>23393581
>The giant anti-ship sword being unable to break beam shields just makes it completely useless as a melee weapon compared to a standard beam saber.

No it doesn't. Where does this idea that anti-ship swords must more powerful than standard beam sabers come from? Sword Strike Gundam could not cut through Aegis Gundams shield. Sword Strike also could not cut through Calamity Gundam's shield. Anti-ship swords give you extended RANGE. Not more power.

>>23393586
Diff anon here.

I totally forgot Destroy has g-panzer like Forbidden Gundam.

Now that I think about it that makes more annoyed.

Seed Freedom made Destroy super weak.

>>23393599
>Seed Freedom made Destroy super weak
At least it took couple of hits from RF/IJ tag team.

Look at this chump getting range melee'd by Lazer Barrel THROUGH his shield https://youtu.be/gyUQna_zMcU?t=62

>>23393591
They're also useful underwater (with beam turned off), which is how Strike used it.

>>23393591
>No it doesn't. Where does this idea that anti-ship swords must more powerful than standard beam sabers come from?

Because otherwise it's just more expensive for barely any benefit (greater weight, which results in less effective swordsmanship, can be broken, with the only advantage being some minimal extra range for the two handed version).

>>23393641
Also, note it's basically how all games balance it, because if it doesn't have extra power compared to a beam saber, it's just trash that no one in their right mind would use.

Not trying to say game balance is accurate to the series, but in this case without that it is something useless that shouldn't exist unless you're focused on underwater equipment.

>>23393591
>Anti-ship swords give you extended RANGE
That's fucking stupid. Just make a longer beam saber. We know the technology exists since Destiny's boomerangs have extendable length and the meteor can either have beam sabers or use the sabers as beam cannons.. The whole point is that the extra weight of the ASS gives it more power or at least it's supposed to. When Shinn's fighting fodder the sword works right but when he's fighting Kira and Athrun it's shit. There's no point in having a physical sword with a beam edge is the physical part only provides length.

>>23393591
From them being more powerful than standard beam sabers. That's why Arondight can cleave straight through a Destroy Gundam or Zamza-Zah. That's why it was only ever physically stopped by Kira doing an insane maneuver using two beam shields and his MS's phase-shifted hands, or Athrun's shield that combined an anti-beam shield with an actual beam shield.
>Sword Strike
Used a laser-edged anti-ship sword instead of the beam-edged Arondight that Destiny would later have, and only came up short against some of the best MS that existed. We also see it cleave straight through Strike Dagger defenses anyways.

>>23393647
>>23393641
>Because otherwise it's just more expensive for barely any benefit

It never was about benefits. The Sword Strike was designed to fight inside Colonies, Cities, and/or areas with large populations and buildings or debris. This was to minimize collateral damage from heavy beam weapons. So the focus was on close combat and mobility.

>>23393647
I loved Destiny and it's super long range in Gundam Musou 2. Really handy for that type of game.

Also on a somewhat related note, Another Century's Episode R (shit as that game is) is the only game that has Destiny use his boomerangs as beam sabers like he used them against Athrun.

>>23393686
Headcanon.

>>23393696
Read databooks. Oh wait you can't read. I forgot.

What's the point of anti-ship swords? They look cool. That's literally it. STOP using your brain.

>>23393704
>They look cool.
I think that's a perfect description for just about everything related to the Cosmic Era.

>>23393652
>There's no point in having a physical sword
>Length doesn't matter.
Screw off with that nonsense.

>>23393696
Have you forgotten when Kira used Sword Strike? Inside a Colony twice and inside a military base.

>>23393697
Okay. Looked through Great Mechanics 14, MS Bible 06, Dengeki Data Collection 17, Mobile Suit Textbook CE 70-75, didn't find it.

>>23393712
Genuinely what are you talking about?

>>23393333
>Athrun could have survived. He was not as badly injured as Kira, and had military survival training.

Athrun was unconscious with the tide coming in and didn't wake up until hours later when Orb had given him medical treatment. If Cagalli's group hadn't found him he'd have died.

>>23393708
I didn't say that length doesn't matter. I said if all the physical blade was for was length, then a longer beam saber would do the same thing. You don't need a physical blade if all it adds is length.

>>23393736
Glad I did look at these. Here's a page from SEED OFFICIAL FILE Mecha Hen volume 1 that explicitly says it's intended to be used to charge into enemy fleets and MS. Does say it was chosen at Heliopolis and Artemis to reduce collateral damage - but nothing about it being 'designed' for that.

>>23393333
>this cope again
No one listens to Fukuda. Everyone knows and accepts Kira is the strongest pilot of the three and has the best feats.
Anyways, Kira has never lost a battle. The only MC to do so.

>>23393781
>Everyone knows and accepts Kira is the strongest pilot of the three and has the best feats.
Correct.
>The production staff also regard him as the strongest pilot in the world of SEED , and Sunrise's setting production department has stated that "If Kira, Athrun, and Shin were to fight in the same mobile suit, Kira would be the strongest," and in a conversation with the author of the spin-off, Morita Shigeru, who is in charge of the script and settings, said, "There can be no pilot stronger than Kira (in the world of SEED)."
>In "Neumann's Logbook," a bonus novel for "FREEDOM" written by Goto Rio, Kira is said to be the strongest pilot in the world, and he seems to have a high reputation.

>Anyways, Kira has never lost a battle.
Uhhh you lost me. Shinn did legitimately defeat him during Angel Down, even if it was helped by a myriad of external factors.

>>23393781

Kira is an overrated pilot. His embarrassing performance in Strike Rouge is all you need to see. It's somehow even worse with the Ootori reanimation.
Both Freedom and Strike Freedom do all the work for you. Multi lock-on full burst beamspam is literally a button press. Kira never does anything other than look cool as the target acquired animation reflects on his helmet.

Athrun performing the exact same movements with Strike Freedom in the movie proves this. The same DRAGOON deployment followed by railgun shot that Kira does.

>>23393820
We already went over this last thread. The Strike Rouge went up against mass produced grunts that were only slightly inferior to Freedom or Justice and the only damage it suffered was losing an arm from blocking a blast that blew through its shield, even though he was still fighting to disable instead of kill.

>Athrun performing the exact same movements with Strike Freedom in the movie proves this.
He does not. His piloting style is completely different to where it was that instead of the mindreading that clued Shura in that it was Athrun. His movements were stilted, as was his control of the Dragoons.

I probably like SEED more than anyone on /m/. I live breath and sleep SEED, yet I hate that movie. Why is this.

>>23393896
You took it seriously.

Can someone explain to me exactly what the fuck the "Destiny Plan" was? The Chairman wanted to remove desire from human emotions? Sounds a little silly innit

>>23393901
The fan service in the movie made a mockery of series. I like fan service as much as the next guy, but it felt beneath them to do something like that.

>>23393896
Probably because nothing in it actually matters. Literally nothing has changed and you might as well just not bother after watching Destiny.
The absolute gall that they want to do a fucking midquel of all things...

>>23393896
Why exactly did you hate it?
>>23393907
What do you mean by fan service in this case?

>>23393914
Fan service means lewd stuff. I thought that was universally known.

>>23393912
I think the new Seed movie will bomb. This movie was successful since people missed Seed, but after watching the movie they now got their Seed fix.

>>23393912
>...
gb2leddit

I want a 3rd season but preferably one that focuses on new characters.
1st season of SEED = 0079
2nd season of SEED = Zeta
3rd season of SEED = ZZ

>>23393902
Durandal's version = they run a detailed analysis of your genes and determine exactly what position you should hold in life, and you hold that position whether you like it or not.
>The Chairman wanted to remove desire from human emotions?
He viewed aspirations as the source of human conflict, and the Destiny Plan would address them by locking you in your place, in theory. You won't ever stress out about losing your job or trying to get a promotion because you're genetically destined to be middle management.

>>23393912
We get it, you don't like SEED

>>23393927
Not likely

>>23393918
>Fan service means lewd stuff
It could also mean pleasing fans just for the sake of it, like for example referencing something that fans know without any actual justification for it. The expression is not exclusive to TnA.

>>23393907
>The fan service in the movie made a mockery of series
Out of all Gundams you say this about the one that's exclusively made out of fanservice kek

>>23393914
>Why exactly did you hate it?
The lewd fanserivce is beneath them. SEED is serious business to me. Also, don't like how they made everyone except Kira job to the villains (some of which have 0 combat experience). Shinn is a seasoned veteran yet looked hopeless at times. It's as if this movie took every jesus stereotype about Kira and made it into reality. Where he's jesus and everyone is damsels in distress.
>>23393944
>Not likely
This movie made me realize I'm just tired of the main characters. I've rewatched SEED too many times, I knew what the characters were going to say to each other before they said it. Most of them have already been through one or more character arcs, it's time for fresh blood. If we get a 3rd season I want new characters and only a small amount of cameos from the old characters. Another issue is, it's hard to imagine them ever losing, they collectively have years worth of battle experience so any new villain they struggle against ruins my suspension of disblief. You have no business being able to fight on par with these seasoned veterans.

>>23393963
>Also, don't like how they made everyone except Kira job to the villains (some of which have 0 combat experience).
You literally didn't watch the movie.

>>23393927
>I think the new Seed movie will bomb.
I don't think SEED anything is capable of bombing anymore. SEED is huge in Japan and it's now in that goldilocks zone of nostalgia. I'm not saying it's gonna get milked UC style but it has the potential to restart the frenzy it once had. Did you see the Japanese hype and percentage of players for the Steam port of that one Destiny vita game? It's pretty telling https://gamalytic.com/game/1857740
You NEVER see those Japanese numbers on any other game.

Also there's a big controversial elephant in the room when it comes to SEED. China. Their middle class now has money to spend on shit like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fr4IAtgKyJM and they ALL love SEED. Try navigating through GSD tag on pixiv or artstation. Quite literally all CGI artwork is made by Chinese artists and freelancers.

>>23393969
It would be very funny if SEED Freedom Zero was able to outdo Hathaway 2. At that point, just put UC on ice and go all in on CE.

>>23393969
Is Gquuuuuuuux or Witch doing good?

>>23393969
SEED is pretty much the persona 3 of gundam. It saved the franchise and everyone and there mother knows about this show. It's almost impossible for anything in that part of the franchise to fail.

>>23393983
At least previous Gundam are popular while most people don't give a fuck about the first two Persona games compared to the later ones.

>>23393969
Seed seems to be following in the trajectory of the Matrix movies. Where they created an amazing 1st release, but it has gotten progressively worse with each new release.
>>23393976
>SEED Freedom Zero
>A prequel to a movie.
This is really-really dumb and shouldn't be encouraged by fans especially if you liked the movie. They didn't expect the Freedom movie to be that successful so now they're rushing to milk it. Whatever they make won't come from the heart, it will be made for profit. Instead you should want them to take their time on it and let a new story happen naturally. Masterpieces are born, not created.

What is a plot for a 3rd season of Seed?

>>23393996
Like if anons here were to come up with one?

>>23393998
yes

>>23393963
>Shinn is a seasoned veteran yet looked hopeless at times
He's literally the only one that performed flawlessly.

IJ loses an arm and needs his wife to remote control his suit to trick the opponent into a surprise head beam meme attack.
SF just gets mutilated in a humiliation ritual. Its wings clipped, its railguns castrated, its torso cannon slashed, even his DRAGOONS get shot down.
Destiny though? Shinn's edgelord PTSD is so strong it counter brain rapes the Black Knights and he slaughters them with Shadow Clone Jutsu. Even saves his girlfriend mid battle to redeem him almost palming her in series finale. If you like Shinn you have NOTHING to complain about in this movie lol

>jesus stereotype about Kira and made it into reality. Where he's jesus and everyone is damsels in distress.
Kira gets to be a damsel in distress in this movie TWICE. Athrun saves his ass TWO TIMES. IN THE EXACT SAME MANNER. FROM THE SAME ENEMY. USING THE SAME ATTACK. Anon is right, you didn't even watch this shit. You somehow got every complaint inverted.

>>23393966
>>23394000
It's bait, you morons.

>>23393991
It took 20 years to shit this out nigga I am NOT waiting another decade. Gimme the slop. Give me that greasy fast feast for pigs. I want more Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice. Let these battery boys shine.

>>23393991
reddit post

>>23393999
Well, I think I'd set it some years after Freedom. Make it about the Eurasian Federation falling apart and giving way for a new major power to emerge, and then that new power entering into conflict with the Alliance (who will be the protagonists) - Compass is still around and bails the MC out, but they're stretched too thin to stop wider conflicts from breaking out.

>>23394024
CE desperately needs Earth alliance characters. Preferably naturals too.

>>23393963
>The lewd fanserivce is beneath them
If you're talking about Lacus' pilot suit, I'll just remind you that this is not the first time she wears a sexy outfit and she has shown cleavage before.

>>23393966
>>23394000
>>23394012
>it's bait, you morons
You're the moron. One of the subplots of the movie is Kira putting the weight of the world on his shoulders and trying to fight solo since everyone is too weak to help him
https://youtu.be/XFyW6Ho4HX4?t=64

Fuck all of you for wasting 10 minutes of my day tracking down this clip. It's you guys who haven't watched the fucking movie. And again I will repeat myself, it's shit like this that made me not like the movie because it's treating Shinn and Athrun like scrubs. They are seasoned war veterans and should be treated as such.

>>23393996
>Kira & Lacus offspring
>Athrun & Cagalli offspring
>Mu & Murrue offspring (this will be the Char clone character)
>Shinn & Luna offspring
>+new characters
It would literally print money.

>>23394039
He says that mid-meltdown and it's both immediately pointed out to be untrue and demonstrated to be untrue
You have lost

>>23394024
>>23394040
I'm so sick of the main characters and their overpowered Gundams. Why not make it about Naturals piloting normal mobiles suits and relying on skill and hardwork. An MS 08th Team style Gundam set in the CE setting.

>>23394047
>untrue and demonstrated to be untrue
Shinn gets beaten up while trying to break up the fight. They turned him into a comedy relief character. It's fucking disgraceful what they did to him. Did his voice actor fuck the director's daughter or something.

>>23394049
Because of SEED's popular because of the characters. People love Kira and Lacus. Even Destiny seemed to suffer as most people mainly watched the show just to see the old cast.

>>23394052
Shinn solos the entire Black Knight Squad later without getting hit once
Enough with these psychotic delusions of yours

>>23394039
Dude, Kira was crashing out in that scene because he thought he got cuckolded in the worst way imaginable. Not only is he having a breakdown but he's also getting beat up by Athrun for crying and making a scene. You're not supposed to agree with him there because nobody else does either. How in the fuck did you interpret that scene to be about him being Jesus? He literally got mauled for being so wrong lmao. It was cathartic. Some SRWZ-tier therapeutic shit.

>>23394052
The entire scene is comedic. That's where they tell Shinn (and the audience) that they're resolving the situation in their own way and not to interfere with their autism.

>>23394049
they tried that with stargazer and people still hated it, you're asking them to make the team characters EVEN WEAKER and people will start to love it?

>>23394049
I remember one anon describing how Gundam SEED is about Coordinators the same way X-men is about mutants. Take it or leave it.

But yes, I agree with you. CE is big and varied enough to have other stories in it, like UC. I'd love to see more grunts and their stories. Focusing on Kira and friends exclusively will make the setting feel small but moving on from them risks alienating the gigantic install base. So it's a tricky situation.

Ideally they'd find the way to introduce more characters and conflicts while relegating the main cast as important but supporting characters. Or they could just milk them until they're dry, that's the safest and most financially optimal decision. SEED Freedom is set only 1 year after Destiny. These guys are still young. Shinn and Luna are still underage kids lmao

>>23394069
Eh? Isn't Stargazer almost unanimously loved?

I've been shilling SEED on /a/ for years. It's my favorite Gundam but I hate this movie. Mind you, I hadn't seen SEED in like 10 years so don't really remember the organizations/history when I watched it.

>Villains
They reminded me of the filler villains you would see in those shitty DBZ movies. They just don't feel like they actually existed in the world prior to the movie, maybe the sequel movie will do a better job of making them feel real. What were they doing the entire time while the world was at war? How are they fighting on par with the protagonist if they never fought in a real war? Where did they magically get the tech/resources to build powerful mobile suits under the watch of the Earth/Zaft/Orb? An easy solution for all of this would just make them ex-Zaft or ex-Orb militia or some shit and have them steal some Gundams at the start of the movie.

>Mind control
This was an awful concept. Them mind controlling characters and making Kira think he was getting cucked just felt like cheap/lazy storytelling. Mind control has never worked in storytelling and is just an asspull plotdevice since it gives the writer godlike powers to create whatever melodrama they want. Instead they should have written an actual romantic rivalry preferably not with Kira-Lacus because their relationship was too established for us to believe there could be any conflict.

>Shinn
They continued the trend of ruining his character. He became a comedy relief character.

>Fanservice
Said this earlier, I'm a straight male and like lewd shit, but it's beneath Gundam Seed.

>Protagonist
I'm sick of these guys. They are fully realized characters. We know what they'll say and do in each situation. They also have too much plot armor/experience so it ruins my suspension of disbelief when they fight noobs.

>Final battle
It looked like they flirted with the super robot genre. This fight did not look like Gundam Seed and instead looked like a cheesy video game final boss battle from a JRPG.

>>23394079
>Eh? Isn't Stargazer almost unanimously loved?
It's basically forgotten by the larger fanbase, even among the seed fans. like, seed fans will harp on fukada apparently ignoring or rejecting astray, but nobody asks for a stargazer continuation or even what fukada thinks about it

>>23394084
>They continued the trend of ruining his character. He became a comedy relief character.
Oh go fuck yourself with this bait already.

>>23394086
Who gives a fuck about Fukuda's opinion on Stargazer? It was good because he wasn't involved.

>>23394090
Who gives a fuck about Stargazer in the first place?

>>23394093
Me nigga.

>>23394094
Well, that's nice then. What did you like about it?

>>23394097
Somber tone and the most beautiful track in the entire franchise https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PjSImUBIxXE

>>23394057
>>23394047
>>23394058
>>23394088
Literally 2 minutes into the movie Kira is telling Shinn to go guard a government building and stay out of the combat zone. Shinn has been demoted from protagonist to a grunt that Kira doesn't fully trust. This would be like us watching 50 episodes of Kamille being the protagonist in Zeta, then in ZZ Gundam we see Amuro telling him "sorry kid you're not competent enough so sit back and let the adults handle this". If they disrespected Kamille like that Zeta fans would be seething, so why aren't SEED Destiny fans seething.

>>23394079
>Eh? Isn't Stargazer almost unanimously loved?
You'd be surprised. Japan really does not care for it at all.

>>23394086
Astray itself has become very controversial too. Again, in Japan.
I think western fans cling to both moreso out of contrarianism than for their inherent qualities, honestly.

>>23394088
Seconding this.

>>23394104
Thirding >>23394088
No point arguing about the movie with somebody who hasn't seen it

>>23394104
Didn't read your shit of a post. But thanks for posting that sexy Justice. What an elegant face.

>>23394104
I thought that was because Kira was suffering from a savior complex where he thinks he has to do everything himself.

>>23394117
To say nothing of the fact that defending the government facilities is not some unimportant grunt job

>>23394111
>>23394115
>>23394116
Alright, enjoy your dead thread. If you guys are just going to cry "bait" and not engage in a real discussion I'm out.

So long, gay faggot.

>>23394107
>Japan really does not care for it at all.
How come?

>>23394107
>I think western fans cling to both moreso out of contrarianism than for their inherent qualities, honestly.
That's the impression I always got too. It hardly ever gets brought up as a matter of discussion in and of itself.
>>23394099
I agree the atmosphere was nice. Still, it felt...incomplete, somehow.

>>23394084
>I hadn't seen SEED in like 10 years so don't really remember the organizations/history when I watched it.
Rewatching Seed and Destiny will not answer any of your questions about the villain buildup. None of the movie was foreshadowed anywhere, it's quite literally "here's a new villain nation"

>>23394090
Then CE was never for you in the first place because 51% of the entire appeal of Seed was Fukuda-isms and his wife's writing. The other 49% is Astray, which is why Fukada keeps getting asked about Astray.

>>23394155
He's a troll.

>>23394155
That’s why it’s easy to ignore Freedom is a thing.

>>23394000
>If you like Shinn you have NOTHING to complain about in this movie lol
Not a big complaint, but I would have liked that rematch against Shura.

>>23394136
It's a victim of its length. It's not bad, just lacking. The only real criticism I've found otherwise was that it's hard to reconcile Logos going after DSSD with Destiny.

Honestly thin shinns character would've been better if he went the snaking Skywalker route and was fully corrupted by his trauma and done some very malicious actions.

>>23394136
Segment of the Gundam franchise seem to have their specific niche of fans. E.g., fans of UC may not necessarily flock to every AU. Asking why CE doesn't have it's own 08th MS Team is sort of like asking why the G Gundam universe doesn't have its own gritty war drama set in the period of intense global war before the Gundam Fight tournament was implemented to replace conventional war.

The answer is.. why bother? Why CE? It kinda clashes with the existing style of stories already set in that world. You can argue that CE is loosely based on the UC OYW as a template and that Seed is a modern retelling of MSG up to a certain point, but the people who enjoy the CE setting in general typically don't enjoy it because it mimics UC, but for other reasons.

How about Stargazer? It's not the same as 08th MS Team, but it leans more in that direction than Seed and Destiny did. You have a special MS team deployed to tackle specific missions. Sure, they have Gundams, but they're last generation models with minor upgrades that are really only a step or two above some-but-not-all grunts, still a hundred stair-climbs below the likes of Destiny and Strike Freedom. The pilots themselves are just naturals, maybe the best of their academy class, but not medically enhanced druggies. Sounds a whole lot like the 08th MS Team, who are not aces but with hard work and a bit of luck they tend to keep winning against the average zeek forces they come across. They have Gundams, but they're janky and don't perform at the level of the famed RX-78-2.

The problem is that the audience doesn't like it. The people who thought the genetic engineering lore in CE is cool, don't like the science-theme because it's science-y. They like it because it's a convenient excuse for the MC to be a special boy. Stargazer's scientific backdrop of the title Gundam being used for deep space exploration with an AI? The same 12-15 year old audience that is locked on Seed and Destiny don't care about that.

>>23394176
That was a sword duel, who cares. It's Kira that never got a proper rematch against Shura because Shura needle'd the poor Rising Freedom.
The guy that split Shinn's Immortal Justice in half got the Arondight shoved in his face.

>>23394205
>That was a sword duel, who cares.
I do.
>It's Kira that never got a proper rematch against Shura because Shura needle'd the poor Rising Freedom
That's true. If only we could kill him twice...

>>23394214
At least Athrun gored him.

>>23394040
Yeah because showcasing the kids of the previous generation are always a sure fire hit for a sequel.
>sees Boruto
Nevermind.

>>23393983
So what's the Persona 5 of Gundam?

>>23394000
Shinn does get treated as comic relief sidekick in the first half of Seed Freedom, but even then he's treated quite endearingly compared to whatever the fuck they did with him in Seed Destiny after Angel Down.

>>23394300
I remember when Yashahime came out even though Sesshomaru's daughters were the main characters it was Moroha, Inuyasha and Kagome's daughter, that most people liked.

>>23394311
>So what's the Persona 5 of Gundam?
NTA but Unicorn.

>>23393847
>His movements were stilted, as was his control of the Dragoons.

Wrong. In many ways, Athrun is a better pilot of SF than Kira.

Athrun was able to use feints, distractions, and combos on Shura. Like forcing him into position with Dragoons, forcing him to activate FT armor and staying in one spot to absorb a blast, then slamming him with railguns. In addition, Athrun survived the entire battle without any damage to Strike Freedom.

Meanwhile both times Kira fought Shura, Kira suffered damage to Freedom. The first time had Rising Freedom, nearly destroyed and covered in needles. The 2nd time, Kira was getting pressed back hard and lost some of his weapons.

Athrun is a better pilot. Just like Fukuda directly said in an interview.

>>23394348
>Meanwhile both times Kira fought Shura
+the rest of Foundation's forces
+Orphee and the Ziggurats
Athrun couldn't even beat Shura solo without losing an arm off his machine, Kira slaughtered the Cal-re.a 1-on-1 almost as hard as he slaughtered the Savior.

>>23393776
>just make a longer beam saber!

They DID. It's called an Anti-ship Sword.

>You don't need a physical blade if all it adds is length.

Did you even watch the show? Shields can still block Anti-ship swords. Why are you whining about this 20 years later?

>>23394563
>+the rest of Foundation's forces
Oh wow. You have a shit memory. Kira fought Shura for a 2nd round before Orphee showed up. Kira was still losing in the solo 1v1. Go rewatch the movie grandpa.

>>23394348
See >>23393791

>>23394596
Director Fukuda >>>>>>> more authority than >>>>>>>> his staff underlings.

Even the Super Robot Wars staff have changed their minds and agreed with Fukuda now.

Sorry you lose.

>>23394574
>completely unrelated nonsense
I was talking about the ambush earlier in the movie, where Kira fought them off for 20 minutes alone.
>Kira was still losing in the solo 1v1
He lost a beam rifle. Athrun lost a whole arm. Did you watch it?

>>23394609
>Director Fukuda
Says that they're strongest in the order of Kira > Athrun > Shinn
You lose

>>23394348
>Just like Fukuda directly said in an interview.
Post it.

>>23394609
>Even the Super Robot Wars staff have changed their minds and agreed with Fukuda now.
Post it.

>>23394622
>Post it.
It's literally in the movie you dummy.

>>23394626
Don't yell at him anon. He didn't watch the Directors Cut 4K Remastered version of the movie. They only watched the streaming version. So they don't know about the new scenes of Athrun being said to be strongest pilot.

>>23394626
Post the interviews. Or are you that same pathetic bastard who thought MSF's EMP was a Cyclops system because "somebody" "somewhere" posted it?

>>23394622
I assume they're talking about the fact that most of Destiny's appearances take place after the show so everything happened exactly how it did in canon and in its most recent appearance in the mobile game DD the plot is played straight with everyone siding with Kira over Shinn, though that's because the game covered OG SEED so everyone's already fought alongside Kira.

>>23394626
>>23394633
Why are you replying to yourself

>>23394622
>Post it.
Yawn. This old tactic. People like you always yell about sources when you lose the argument.

You can thank Japanese fans for providing a partial transcript of the Fukuda interview. Athrun is better.

You lose.

You can apologize now and admit you are wrong.

I'll also accept your lack of response as a concession.

>>23394645
Fukuda doesnt know what hes talking about. I dont care about his opinion at all

>>23394641
The characters literally say Athrun is the best pilot in the Directors Cut version of the movie. You don't really have any argument left here anon. Just drop the topic and move on.

>>23394648
>Asks for quote
>Receives quote
>That doesn't count
Why are you like this?

>>23394645
>You can thank Japanese fans for providing a partial transcript of the Fukuda interview. Athrun is better.
A partial transcript? That 'interview' is entirely online on Gundam.info. In fact, I can do you one better than your fake translation.
https://www.gundam.info/news/event/01_14473.html
>Q. In the show, Athrun was using the Strike Freedom Gundam, but I thought it was a machine that only Kira could handle due to his processing capabilities. Why was Athrun able to use it?
>Director Fukuda: That’s simply because Athrun is amazing. Kira may be a special Coordinator, but he was no match for Athrun — that’s what it means (laughs).

It was a joke answer, and you took it as a statement of fact. You really are that same guy, lmao

>>23394645
>>23394648
>>23394660
>>23394662
How tilted are you?

>>23394662

This is why no one bothers to give sources anymore in Seed threads.

It's same pattern. It's been going on for decades now.

1. Get into argument.

2. Mentions databook or staff member interview proving argument correct.

3. Anon demands source.

Option 4a. Source is provided. Anon calls source shit and disregards source.

Option 4b. Source is not provided. Anon yells that you are lying and that you made it up.

There is no winning with these people.

>>23394669
>It was a joke answer
Then explain why the characters actually say Athrun is the strongest pilot in the Director's Cut of the movie?

>>23394645
>>23394680
Bro, you're just making shit up constantly and freaking the fuck out and replying to yourself again and again when called out

>>23394669
>It was a joke answer, and you took it as a statement of fact.
>Fukuda wasn't being serious!
And there is it folks. His new "out" that his head canon came up with. Dude just can't take an L.

>>23394687
Shura says it to fuck with Shinn. Shura has never met Athrun and Shinn even immediately starts to question him about it.
You took Shura at his word too? Christ.

>>23394697
Even a machine can tell it was a joke. He's asked a question and gives a blunt answer "he's amazing" and laughs at the end of it. And you'll note that nowhere does the term "skilled pilot" or "piloting skills" come up.

>>23394697
I honestly miss that doomposting retard from the last threads. At least he had the decency to shut up.

>>23394691
That’s the kind of thing that has hurt CE discussion over all these years so it shouldn’t be too shocking. People just love to make random shit up.

>>23394704
>Even a machine can tell it was a joke.
Let's see.

>>23394640
Come to think of it, after Z, I don't think they've ever done a "Archangel as the bad guys" story again, have they?

>>23394725
>The answer is a mix of serious and joking tones. Director Fukuda provides a straightforward explanation ("Athrun is amazing"), which could be taken as a serious in-universe justification, but the addition of "(laughs)" and the playful phrasing ("Kira-kun... wasn’t a match for Athrun") suggest a lighthearted, joking tone. It feels like Fukuda is poking fun at the question while still giving a nod to Athrun’s capabilities, rather than providing a deeply technical or serious explanation.
I asked 20 times, and all 20 answers were the same. So yeah, anon confirmed less able to understand humor than a bot I guess.

>>23394729
NTA but no
SRW Z's treatment of Kira was seen as pretty preposterous, changing his character for the worse just so half the cast could shit on him.

>>23394704
NTA, but why should Shura bother messing with Shinn? Was he even particularly high on his radar for the effort?

>>23394770
Would*

>>23394770
Because the Accords are sadists who think they're superior beings, and are enjoying shit-talking Compass. They're using their mind-reading abilities to make it easier. They belittle Kira for not knowing how to swordfight, suggest that Compass isn't all that great, call Shinn the Freedom Killer, compare him unfavorably to Athrun, and as they leave, Shura singles out Agnes for praise despite her objectively being the least skilled pilot there.

TL;DR: He's an asshole.

>>23394783
Fair point. Still, Shura's interest in Athrun hardly seems like it only exists pertaining to the scene.

>>23393896
Speak for yourself man, I'm a certified SEED Psycho and I fuckin' loved every minute of it.
Ordinarily I hate callbacks, but I felt a lot of them were done tastefully. Shinn's nickname of 'Freedom Killer', getting close to Requiem using MC being called the 'Nicol tactic', certain stock shots that got reused a lot in Destiny being reanimated.

As a funny aside because there was a bit of debate about fan service - when Lacus is about to launch in Proud Defender, we can see on Murrue's screen that Lacus has set it to 'sound only' because she was embarrassed about the pilot suit.

>>23394739
Did you not consider Fukuda was just trying to keep the tone of the event fun? I can't believe you need a bot to help you analyze this WackyModder.

>source this
>Interview that
If I need to go that far beyond the source material to make sense of things that should've been evident in the actual show/movie itself, then the directing and writing has failed.

>>23394792
At the very least, he knows about Athrun enough to be able to tell his way of piloting SF apart from Kira. I just wouldn't take anything said in the fencing scene at face value, because we do see they're deliberately trying to get a rise out of Compass.

>>23394795
>when Lacus is about to launch in Proud Defender, we can see on Murrue's screen that Lacus has set it to 'sound only' because she was embarrassed about the pilot suit.
I actually never caught that. Nice.

>>23394799
NTA but isn't that why he'd give a joke answer and not a serious one?

>>23394084
>It looked like they flirted with the super robot genre
No, they went full super robot and it was awesome. You're just a faggy fake mecha fan.

We know that the Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice was suppose to be mass produced, but do we know who those mobiles suit were suppose to be mass produced for? Were ZAFT and EA suppose to adopt those suit after the initial testing from COMPS by Kira and Shinn?

ZAFT was already field testing their next-gen suits in the Gelgoog and Gyan, even had them assigned to COMPS, so why would ZAFT adopt the Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice in their ranks?

We saw no new suit from the EA in the film, so I assume they would be the biggest adopters of the Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice in their forces.

ORB would definitely adopt the suits given they spearheaded development of both of them

>>23394807
>NTA but isn't that why he'd give a joke answer and not a serious one?
A light hearted tone doesn't mean the answer is a joke. Not to mention this was a live Q&A fan even where you have to keep the energy fun and lively. There are so many interviews out there with Tomino and other anime creators where they laugh or chuckle during the interview. That does not mean their answers are false.

>>23394704
You are looking at the wrong scene and you aren't looking at the 4K Directors Cut of the movie. Athrun is called the strongest pilot in it.

>>23394567
>They DID. It's called an Anti-ship Sword.
That's a physical sword with a beam edge and apparently the physical part does nothing.
>Did you even watch the show? Shields can still block Anti-ship swords. Why are you whining about this 20 years later?
Your screenshot shows nothing that a beam saber couldn't do. You haven't given a reason for why you need the physical part of the sword since the extra weight doesn't do anything. People have always assumed that the point of the anti ship sword was that the extra weight from the physical portion of the sword allowed it to cut through tougher things than a regular beam saber could. But if that's not the case it's just a really stupid weapon.

>>23394826
They were supposedly going to be Compass's main suits going forward. Not necessarily mass-produced in the sense that they become their grunts, but produced in numbers so Compass squads can all have their own Freedom and Justice.
>We saw no new suit from the EA in the film
I think they've mostly given up on MS by that point and went all-in on MA.

>>23394827
Calling him 'Kira-kun' and answering bluntly, 'because Athrun is amazing' 'Kira-kun is no match for Athrun' suggests it's a joke even without him laughing.

>>23394837
That isn't correct. Anti-ship swords exert physical force even when blocked, and can function even if thrown (although you probably shouldn't use your sword that way). They have enough cutting power to cleave through anti-beam shields and MS in a single swing in a lot of cases.

>>23394826
>We know that the Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice was suppose to be mass produced, but do we know who those mobiles suit were suppose to be mass produced for?
According to Fukuda, they were meant to be used by Compass ace pilots. So I would imagine Kira training a bunch of younger Compass pilots on his style of fighting. Kira uses Strike Freedom while his trainees under his command use Rising Freedoms. Like a mother duck and her ducklings. Same idea with Athrun. IJ leading a bunch of Immortal Justices.

>We saw no new suit from the EA in the film, so I assume they would be the biggest adopters of the Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice in their forces.
EA and Orb were supposed to take over production of Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice. EA has grater industrial capacity than Zaft. That would be EA's contribution to Compass.

>ZAFT was already field testing their next-gen suits in the Gelgoog and Gyan, even had them assigned to COMPS, so why would ZAFT adopt the Rising Freedom and Immortal Justice in their ranks?
They won't. RF and IJ were meant for Compass specifically. Testing Gelgoog and Gyan with Compass was just Compass doing a favor for Zaft. Compass was engaged in conflicts and the data they received from battles would help Zaft.

Given time, I believe the idea was for Compass to gradually get more ships and more suits. They would become like Londo Bell in UC. A small elite task force to handle conflicts before they get out of control. Fukuda said that the economies of all the major powers had crashed, and that military budgets were limited. That's why old suits were still being used by all sides. So It would also be cheaper to share the responsibility of funding Compass, a small elite task force, than to funding a giant military with the latest weapons.

>>23394849
>Calling him 'Kira-kun' and answering bluntly, 'because Athrun is amazing' 'Kira-kun is no match for Athrun' suggests it's a joke even without him laughing.
Then the onus is on your to prove it's 100% a joke. You need to find a quote from Fukuda saying he meant it as a joke. Because the evidence leans heavily otherwise. Both Fukuda saying Athrun is the strongest and the movie repeatedly saying Athrun is the strongest (including the new dialog I the 4K Remastered Edition) support other anons argument.

>>23394851
>Fukuda said that the economies of all the major powers had crashed, and that military budgets were limited.
I hadn't thought about it, but that would make sense. Logos was probably holding a lot of that shit up, and the global crackdown on anybody even suspected of working with Logos would probably be pretty bad for markets. Oh, and Break the World and that whole war thing.

>>23394849
>Anti-ship swords exert physical force even when blocked
The MS is still pushing too, you know. But the back of an anti-ship sword would provide a handhold for additional leverage and grip when pushing.

>can function even if thrown (although you probably shouldn't use your sword that way)
Huh? Beam sabers have always been able to be thrown. Beam boomerangs are literally the same tech as beam sabers but in a slightly different shape and optimized for throwing and retrieval.

>They have enough cutting power to cleave through anti-beam shields and MS in a single swing in a lot of cases.
I've seen them stab fairly well, but swinging? I don't know about that, they've been blocked pretty frequently.

>>23394861
ZAFT apparently was able to afford to make new suits, so I guess that implies that the PLANT economy wasn't too bad post Destiny, at least in comparison to the nations of Earth. Even Orb was able to upgrade their Murasames to the Murasame Kai. A small upgrade but an upgrade nonetheless. The EA seems to be in the worst shape economically, with their forces still fielding even 105 Daggers.Which makes sense given, as you say, the LOGOS crackdown and the Break The World incident.

>>23394856
Nah, I think it's pretty obviously a joke.

>>23394864
>The MS is still pushing too, you know. But the back of an anti-ship sword would provide a handhold for additional leverage and grip when pushing.
I was specifically thinking of how Gaia was sent reeling by some of Impulse's swings. Beam sabers shouldn't have that same sort of forceful effect.
>Huh? Beam sabers have always been able to be thrown. Beam boomerangs are literally the same tech as beam sabers but in a slightly different shape and optimized for throwing and retrieval.
An anon earlier in the thread made me look through 6 different databooks to try to find info about the Sword Strike, and what I gathered is that the Schwert Gewehr and beam boomerangs carry capacitors that let them function out of the MS's hands. But that might just be some BS the books added to make them sound more special and it's actually standard on all sabers, so nvm that.
>I've seen them stab fairly well, but swinging? I don't know about that, they've been blocked pretty frequently.
I was specifically thinking of this.

>>23394887
Mu seems a bit kill happy...

>>23394887
>Nah, I think it's pretty obviously a joke.
I think you are trolling. Providing evidence please.

>>23394895
He's a professional through and through, I don't think he's ever done the no-kill thing. Bear in mind that Neo Roanoke's memories were tweaked, but not so much his personality.

>>23394899
Nah, topic is boring, I've done enough. I am curious about these added '4K remastered lines' if you have them though.

>>23394880
>ZAFT apparently was able to afford to make new suits, so I guess that implies that the PLANT economy wasn't too bad post Destiny, at least in comparison to the nations of Earth
The Gelgoog and Gyan Storm hadn't actually been mass produced yet. They were just test types. Most of the Zaft fleet was still using Zakus and Goufs.

The Gelgoog and Gyan were also designed with limited budgets in mind. The complexity of the suits were reduced as much as possible to save on costs. In addition the Gelgoog and Gyan share many common components between them to save on even more money.

If the databooks are to be believed, the Impulse was mass produced foe Zaft ace pilots but the costs and logistics for maintaining them became too unbearable for Zaft and the Impulse was cancelled shortly after developing the Destiny Impulse pack. The costs were ballooning out of control.

>>23394849
>That isn't correct.
Obviously. But you have people in the thread saying the physical portion does nothing but give range. >>23393591 That would be really stupid if that was the case.

>>23394887
>6 different databooks
How do you people even find these? Are they translated?

>>23394887
>I was specifically thinking of how Gaia was sent reeling by some of Impulse's swings. Beam sabers shouldn't have that same sort of forceful effect.
In the same episode the Perfect Strike's anti-ship sword fails to do anything to the Calamity's shield (>>23393611), so I think that's just Fukada power levels in play both here and when it comes to the Armory One battle. After all, the Sword Impulse also gets one of its anti-ship swords broken in half when it clashes with the Chaos in mid-air.

>An anon earlier in the thread made me look through 6 different databooks to try to find info about the Sword Strike, and what I gathered is that the Schwert Gewehr and beam boomerangs carry capacitors that let them function out of the MS's hands. But that might just be some BS the books added to make them sound more special and it's actually standard on all sabers, so nvm that.
Could be. Seed is sort of known for being vague about the technology, there's certain some odd examples here and there like the Windam having VPS or not. There's even that one databook entry that sounds really apologetic about the Windam's performance and hypes it up a lot, even though they drop like flies throughout the show. All I know is that anti-ship swords are basically meant to be stronger than a standard beam saber, so maybe the capacitors help with power delivery and keeping voltages stable. Capacitors have additional function besides just being a short term battery, like being available to help jump-start systems that draw a lot of power when turning on.

>>23394919
>That would be really stupid if that was the case.
Why? The anti-ship sword is still using the same power source as a normal beam saber: the battery.

>>23394923
Honestly? I find them on sadpanda. Just search for Gundam SEED non-H.

>>23394926
>Fukada power levels in play
Kek it's possible. The most charitable interpretation I could come up with would be varying levels of anti-beam resistance.

>>23394936
The physical portion should still provide cutting power. IIRC, Arondight cut right through Akatsuki's shield/

>>23394936
>Why? The anti-ship sword is still using the same power source as a normal beam saber: the battery.
Because it weighs more. Swinging something heavier at something will do more damage than something lighter.

>>23394926
It's not about power. It's about versatility and reach. AS swords can still be used even if the beam is turned off or the battery runs out. The physical part of the blade is still sharp.

>>23394936
Driving in a nail with your palm vs using a hammer.

>>23394939
>Because it weighs more. Swinging something heavier at something will do more damage than something lighter.
For Gundams, the phase shift armor negates most of any potential damage. So all that happens is the enemy suit is knocked out of position and the enemy pilot is stunned for a moment.

Remember that Anti-ship swords werent really designed to fight other Gundams. Sword Strike Gundam was meant to fight against Zaft ships and Ginns. Both of which don't have armor to stop Sword Strike. Ginns don't really carry shields, and ships are just ships.

>>23394944
Unless the material you are hammering a nail against is also made of metal.

>>23394938
>The physical portion should still provide cutting power. IIRC, Arondight cut right through Akatsuki's shield/
Give Cagalli credit. She did use her beam saber and clash against Destiny's AS sword.

You fuckers lied, the physical part that runs parallel to the beam is a FLAT surface, it's not sharp except for maybe the tip

>>23394880
>>23394910
I like how economics plays such a heavy role in MS development in the SEED universe.

>>23394975
There's a lot of neat shit like that you can find out about with some looking. Like I just learned the other day that the Strike Dagger is just a 105 Dagger that they cut costs on, and the striker pack hardpoint on the Strike Dagger is functional, they just covered it up. The ZAKU wizard system was thought up so they could abide by the treaty's limits on MS numbers while still technically having as many melee or artillery units as needed.

>>23394968
Yes, only the tip is sharp. The rest just has mass going for it if you're, say, underwater.

>>23394950
That's completely misinterpreting what I'm saying. The beam edge of the sword is being carried by the force of the weighted swing giving it more power. An anti ship sword should be able to cut through things a normal beam saber couldn't.

>>23394910
>If the databooks are to be believed, the Impulse was mass produced foe Zaft ace pilots but the costs and logistics for maintaining them became too unbearable for Zaft and the Impulse was cancelled shortly after developing the Destiny Impulse pack. The costs were ballooning out of control.

In hindsight, this was so obvious. Each piece of the Impulse is made from complex engineering and the latest tech. Abandoning/sacrificing parts in combat would be crazy expensive. Military hardware is designed to be as robust, long lasting, and effective as possible. The hot-swap nature of Impulse is only worthwhile if the swapped out parts can be recovered in combat and can be quickly reused.

>>23394938
>Just search for Gundam SEED non-H.

>it works
Holy shit this opens up so much opportunity for autism for me
Thanks anon

>>23395001
>An anti ship sword should be able to cut through things a normal beam saber couldn't.

It does. Just not on the first swing most of the time. With AS swords it usually takes multiple swings and slices to cut through shields with anti-beam coating. And that's assuming the AS sword isn't previously damaged.

Remember it's an "anti-ship" sword that CAN be used for melee with mobile suits. But the primary role is cutting through ship hulls. Most of the time the hulls are made of inferior metal and not anti-beam coated.

>>23394926
Fukuda and other staff members have said the people who write the databooks check in with them. If something doesn't appear in the databooks its usually because they don't want the information written, and the staff want the flexibility to change their minds about technology later.

>>23395001
>An anti ship sword should be able to cut through things a normal beam saber couldn't.
Anti-beam coating dude.

>>23395058
Since ship hulls are like that, wouldn't a pure beam saber like the ones on the METEOR units be better for attacking ships? After the initial swing into a ship, the physical sword has to stop at some point inside the ship (unless you're doing something silly like only cutting small parts or shaving off layers of the ship hull like a pot roast), so wouldn't the blade or the tip get caught and snag on the inside of the ship unless you carefully extract the blade from the ship in the same path it entered?

This is why saws and cutters for large objects like wood or concrete have cutting edges that run all the way around (chainsaw) or use something else like continuous water spray coating the spinning blade as lubricant.

>>23395087
>Since ship hulls are like that, wouldn't a pure beam saber like the ones on the METEOR units be better for attacking ships?
Well yeah. But Meteor's beam sabers are "anti-colony" beam sabers. They are massive and it's overkill for attacking a ship. At that point you aren't cutting a ship. You are melting most of it.

>>23395058
>>23395068
>anti-beam coating
That's what the extra weight is for. There is more than just a beam hitting it, there is physical impact as well. You're not just tanking a beam saber, you're tanking a beam saber with extra mass behind it. Your coating should take far more damage and whatever you're blocking with is taking physical trauma.

>>23395095
We can have a halfway point, there's a huge range between a saber hilt that fits in the palm of a hand, and the METEOR. Hear me out, maybe have a beam saber hilt the size of a pringles can compared to the hand, and optionally a really big battery on it, or a cable to plug it into the battery on backpack or torso

>>23395111
>That's what the extra weight is for.
And that's what the physical part of the shield is for. Anti-beam coating heavily resists the incoming beam, and the physical shield blocks the blade. Thus the blade is stopped.

>>23395112
The issue is power consumption. Suits with batteries have limits. Only nuclear powered Gundams are capable of what you are suggesting. The AS sword extends the length of the beam, but keeps the "width" of the beam the same as a traditional beam saber.

>>23395205
The physical shield should cave, we've seen it happen to some units with anti-beam coating on their shields.

>>23395262
Eh...thats debatable. Mass production shields like on Daggers have a good chance of breaking on the first hit. But Gundams with high custom end shields can probably block several swings. It's not advisable to take it head on, but the Gundam shields can do it.

And that's not even counting beam shields. Or those shields with beam shield emitters like Infinite Justice.

>>23394645
I usually don't say this often, but ok. Fair enough. Thanks for providing source. I'll give you credit there. Athrun is more lethal than Kira. Fukuda said it too.

>>23394645
Based. Kirasissies in shambles.

>>23394619
>>23394648
Get fucked lmao

>>23395282
>those shields with beam shield emitters like Infinite Justice.
Destiny's shield works the same way.

>>23395392
Destiny's shield is just an energy beam shield. It lacks the physical part.

>>23394563
>Athrun couldn't even beat Shura solo without losing an arm off his machine
Athrun used his arm as bait to literally kill the motherfucker. Kira got his suit(S) eviscerated without even putting a dent on Shura. He needed his mom's mahou shoujo particles to "win".

>>23394926
Didn't Fukuda say he hated Astray and doesn't consider it real Gundam Seed?

>>23395398
Ah my bad. I keep thinking the yellow center is the emitter. But apparently it's not. The energy emitters are solely on his fists.

>>23392870
>>23393574
>>23395406
It's such a weird contrast seeing how powerful beam shields are in Seed Destiny, but seeming them shatter like glass in Seed Freedom.
I wonder if Fukuda did this intentionally because of conplaints from the fans?


>>23394563
Interesting. I never knew Saviour Gundam had phase shift armor on the shield too. Still learning more fun factoids even 20 years after Seed Destiny aired.

>>23394069
That guy piloting Buster is such a loser. He just sat there and let his teammate get killed.

>>23395437
>I never knew Saviour Gundam had phase shift armor on the shield too
It doesn't.

>>23395444

Not according to this picture.
>>23394563

>>23395447
Animation error obviously. The whole "fight" against Savior was conceived on a shitter I reckon.

>>23395459
>Animation error obviously.
How can you claim it's an error with no proof?

>>23395460
Because not a single shield has PSA. Including Savior's >>23395444

>>23395459
Databooks disagree with you. They say Saviour's shield was part of main body during transformation. Not a disposable accessory like Strike Gundam. So VPS was added to Saviour's shield. And the shield was made aerodynamic with wings.

>>23395462
>Because not a single shield has PSA.

1. Sword Strike Gundam
2. Blitz Gundam
3. Aegis Gundam
4. Raider Gundam
5. Forbidden Gundam
6. Calamity Gundam
7. Destroy Gundam
8. Destiny Gundam
9. Infinite Justice Gundam
10. Rising Freedom Gundam
11. Immortal Justice Gundam

You really suck at paying attention to details don't you?

>>23395468
>4. Raider Gundam
>5. Forbidden Gundam
>6. Calamity Gundam
None of them have PSA. They're all colored in hangars. Enough.

>>23395463
>They say Saviour's shield was part of main body during transformation
True.

>And the shield was made aerodynamic with wings.
True.

>So VPS was added to Saviour's shield
Source? I remember it saying its just coated like other shields, also seen in >>23395444

>>23395476
>None of them have PSA. They're all colored in hangars. Enough.
They have TPSA (Trans-Phase Shift armor). That's phase shift armor and it counts.

Although it's strange it's never used again.

>>23395406
Destiny sure does carry a lot of junk on its back. That cannon is huge.

>>23395476
>None of them have PSA.
I'm pretty sure they do.

>>23395559
That's a folded Arondight. Shading makes it look like it's part of the cannon.

>>23395481
The Windam and Destroy in Destiny are supposed to have VPS armor, but are shown to be the same color when powered down. So there’s speculation it may still be Trans Phase armor, with VPS used instead of PS.

>>23395793
The databooks confirmed that Destroy Gundam has Trans-Phase armor and a defensive g-panzer. However it's unknown whether the Destroy Gundams we see in the movie are even functioning at full power. Because it's pretty ridiculous that Freedom Gundam's railguns could KO a Destroy Gundam. But those same railguns just bounce harmlessly off a Black Knight. Not even leaving a dent. Total inconsistency.

>>23395829
The original Freedom's railguns also damaged the first Destroy in Berlin. Destroy's protection has always been inconsistent.

>>23394049
Astray?

>>23393781
>Anyways, Kira has never lost a battle. The only MC to do so.

>>23393333
There's another reason Athrun's the best pilot. He has the power of pic.

>>23396244
Astray is worse than the mainline in both regards nowadays

>>23394767
This.
And the thing is Kira in SRW Z still ends up being in the right.

>>23397482
For Durandal, yeah. Even L makes him the bad guy, despite there being no animosity between Minerva and Archangel. But no so much "I know these guys committed illegal experiments and are trying to cover it up but Cagalli is crying."

>>23384879
>Meteor plays in the background
>Shinn: So, this is what it's like to be on the heroes' side.

Wackymodder admitted he browses and argues in Seed threads. So if you are wondering why we have one anon who is so obsessed about beam sabers clashing, it's probably him. Dude won't accept that beam sabers do clash in Seed.

He also hated the Seed movie. He doesn't like that they made beam sabers clash. He also went on a 45 minute rant about giving Strike Freedom a physical Katana made no sense. That the Proud Defender should have given Freedom more beam sabers.

Anyway, just thought I'd mention it in case any anons as raising their eyebrows at why we have one anon hyper obsessed with saber clashes.

>>23398961
>Wackymodder admitted he browses and argues in Seed threads
Well yeah he used to openly post here back in like 2014/5. He admitted he has autism too as if it wasn't obvious. IIRC the thread was about his ''fixed'' Destiny.

>saber clashes
Japanese Youtubers also say they don't clash. I can't find the exact video but I'm pretty sure it was this guy https://www.youtube.com/@Gamore that said "Since beam sabers can't clash in SEED universe, pilots are trained to catch blades with their shields instead" something like that. If I dig up the exact video before this thread archives I'll link it. IIRC it was something about Impulse.
And it's true, even they "clash" it's usually for a single frame and the big clashes instead are almost always saber-to-shield like >>23393792 https://youtu.be/1Zonk--fzNQ?t=67 or shield to shield like Legend versus SF https://youtu.be/2W265ItpKMo?t=229

They even reanimated some of the scenes in the remaster where beams clashed into beams being parried by shields like pic related.

They don't clash. If they did we'd have some epic clash scenes like so many other Gundam series. Instead every skirmish that ends in a frame/stand-off is with shields against sabers.

>>23399041
Or it could've been this channel https://www.youtube.com/@sumanga-minnanohannou/shorts I remember that female bot voice spouting trivia.

I would bet that's not why the scene was changed. Fukuda has specifically said that Gundam Seed shields are also weapons. Other Gundam shows treat shields as disposable, but Fukuda said that Seed Shields are weapons that can directly be used in combat, and have a lot of destructive potential. Like a shield bash or a hitting weapon.

Fukuda is also a fan of dynamic combat and every part of the suit playing a role in combat. In the original scene, Strike isn't doing anything with the shield in the left arm. It's just hanging there. Fukuda strongly dislikes that. The suit must always be doing something with both arms. So the scene was redone so the Strike's left arm is playing a role.

That's why beam sabers always attack the shield first. Because it's a literal threat. If the pilot ignores the enemy shield, then you will get situations like:

- Athrun throwing his shield as a weapon

- Kira ramming the enemy with Strike shield and Freedom's shield.

- Athrun ramming an enemy with his Zaku spike shield

- Etc etc.

- Everytime a shield is ignored by an enemy, it gets turned into a weapon.

The sabers aren't clashing other sabers because they can't. The sabers are clashing the shields because that's only way to stop the shields from being a threat.

Even in the Seed movie, shields are huge threats. They have hidden weapons and can fly around. If you watch the movie carefully, the Black Knights specifically target Freedom's shield FIRST because clashing against its beam saber. I don't know why Seed fans ignore the importance of shields and how much they mean to Fukuda. He has said how important shields are several times.

>>23399041
Japanese wikis also say it. I’m pretty sure there’s a Wikipedia page for beam sabers that talks about it too. It’s just one of those things that’s common knowledge there.

>>23399041
I would bet that's not why the scene was changed. Fukuda has specifically said that Gundam Seed shields are also weapons. Other Gundam shows treat shields as disposable, but Fukuda said that Seed Shields are weapons that can directly be used in combat, and have a lot of destructive potential. Like a shield bash or a hitting weapon.

Fukuda is also a fan of dynamic combat and every part of the suit playing a role in combat. In the original scene, Strike isn't doing anything with the shield in the left arm. It's just hanging there. Fukuda strongly dislikes that. The suit must always be doing something with both arms. So the scene was redone so the Strike's left arm is playing a role.

That's why beam sabers always attack the shield first. Because it's a literal threat. If the pilot ignores the enemy shield, then you will get situations like:

- Athrun throwing his shield as a weapon

- Kira ramming the enemy with Strike shield and Freedom's shield.

- Athrun ramming an enemy with his Zaku spike shield

- Etc etc.

- Everytime a shield is ignored by an enemy, it gets turned into a weapon.

The sabers aren't clashing other sabers because they can't. The sabers are clashing the shields because that's only way to stop the shields from being a threat.

Even in the Seed movie, shields are huge threats. They have hidden weapons and can fly around. If you watch the movie carefully, the Black Knights specifically target Freedom's shield FIRST because clashing against its beam saber. I don't know why Seed fans ignore the importance of shields and how much they mean to Fukuda. He has said how important shields are several times. He views them as just as almost as much a threat as beam sabers when it comes to combat.

>>23399041
>Japanese Youtubers also say they don't clash.
I don't give af about what "YouTubers" say. I care about what the official staff say. I care about what the writer says. I care about what Director Fukuda says.

>>23399121
It’s true.

>>23399041
I am not sure if you are aware but Mitsuo Fukuda said seed pilots cannot easily clash with their beam sabers. To do so requires a lot of skill. He even said that a shield is more important than a sword. So basically beam saber clashes are normal in other gundam universes but in seed it's a very difficult maneuver to pull off. So only ace pilots do it like in the seed movie. Everyone else makes due with a shield.

>>23399131
>I know more than the people who have free access and full understanding of every interview, every episode commentary, every databook!
Humble yourself.

>>23399041
>Well yeah he used to openly post here back in like 2014/5. He admitted he has autism too as if it wasn't obvious. IIRC the thread was about his ''fixed'' Destiny.
Then why does he rage when Fukuda is like "lol of course sabers clash. Go watch the Seed movie." Shouldn't his autism respect the Director of Gundam Seed as the ultimate authority?

Apparently no one in this thread read the interviews where the great Fukuda said that shields are more important than beam sabers.

>>23399131
>>23399150
>>23399160
>>23399163
Get a grip dude, nobody cares about your crush on Fukuda

>>23399041
Gamore changed his opinion on beam saber clashing over a year ago after seeing Gundam Seed Freedom. He now admits beam swords can clash. Gamore just wanted to see it happen on screen. Same with a few other channels too.

>>23399131
Well sure but the point is: Wackymodder didn't come up with it.

>>23399182
Your info is out of date. Wacky's new obsession is Femto Tech Armor. He got really upset in Discord when he Shinn defeated the Black Knights because according to him, beams shouldn't be able to defeat Femto Tech armor. Wacky's mind literally interpreted immunity to beams to mean ALL beam weapons including beam sabers.

He started yelling about how none of Destiny's weapons should work at all against the Black Knights and that the staff forgot their own lore. That Destiny needs physical weapons to beat FT armor. And that Gelgoog's beam saber should have done nothing against the Black Knights.

If you want to join his madness, then be my guest. I'm curious if you want to support another 400 post thread about FT armor vs beam sabers.

>"ayo fuck SNEED the next movie finna flop!"
>400 replies about anti-ship swords, phase shift armors on shields and fucking beam clashing
>on and off for literal decades
Yeah, CE isn't going anywhere lol. Westerners are obsessed with it just as much as the Elevens.

Hopefully we get a cool new SEED vidya gaem too.

>>23399206
I did not know that, my info is indeed out of date. I know he's a sperg but that really sounds like he unironically embraced his memed up nitpicky hatred for SEED as his entire personality instead of just letting go.

Then again I reckon this must feel like a nightmare for him. Years of relative peace then all of a sudden SEED is back and dominating the Gundam discussion once again lmao

>>23399206
>And that Gelgoog's beam saber should have done nothing against the Black Knights.
What is this dudes deal? Does Wackymodder think a beam saber would do literally nothing to FT armor? Like water hitting the ground?

>>23399221
It's truly bizzarre to be honest. Wackymodder surrounded himself with people that just agree with everything he says, and they treat him like a wise saint. Nothing he says is wrong. I almost want to publicly disagree with him to see what he would say, but I'm sure I would just get instabanned.

>>23399126
That's actually really cool. It's too bad he so much of a hack otherwise

>>23399126
If that's the real reason, then I can excuse the lack of beam saber clashes.