Thread 23391969

How could mobile suits counter ukraine style kamikaze drones?

>>23391969 (OP)
Wing covers this
Mobile dolls are better than your average dude

Literally just don't open the hatch. The real world counter to the typical cheapo meme drones is putting covers over your hatches because these tanks are designed for you to get out and look around sometimes. Any mech with the typical sort of sensors and cameras you normally see can just leave the door closed.

If you want it actually directly approached as a future warfare idea, watch short peace. Anti-tank drones used with distraction tactics against a mech with lasers set to anti-drone. It's the best that's been done with the concept.

>>23391969 (OP)
Minovsky particles.

>>23392064
I imagine drones attached to tethers could provide a "third person view"

>>23392064
Hey alexa, play that clip in 08 MS team when a bunch of guerillas using RPGs took down a zaku patrol

>>23391969 (OP)
>>23392123 is one part of it, you immediately may need to use fiber optic drones like the EF was already using with their conventional missilesin the OYW to use suicide drones, or alternatively you need to have those suicide drones work akin to relatively uncommon self-guided UC missiles and have them track things like heat signatures or the target by eyeball or so forth.

Mobile suits themselves already have several layers of protection drones need to get past. One thing we need to remember is that with enough protection a single suicide drone is actually not always enough for a vehicle like a tank, given it is protected adequately, so the drone needs a relatively hefty warhead. Zakus have been shown to have anti-infantry flechette weapons which could be used against drones in 08th MS Team and MS IGLOO, which would presumably be repurposed to be fired against drones. MS like the Gundam and other EF machines tend to have head vulcans, which would also be an immediate option and which can be effective against drones of certain types. Presumably, with the right sort of ammunition and tracking equipment, head vulcan effectiveness against small drones could be dramatically increased.

Mobile suits are relatively maneuverable, so many drones used against them might need to use the tractic some interception quadcopters use as-is of flying extremely high into the atmosphere and then flying down onto the MS, though this is usually a counter-drone tactic as opposed to an actual aircraft or ground vehicle interception tactic and would likely not be as effective against MS actively moving via their jets or hovering (e.g. common jumping, Dodai/Base Jabber flight, Dom hovering). This is complicated, however, by the fiber-optic requirement. It would presumably be a good idea to attack MS while they are parked using bomber drones as opposed to suicide drones, but just like in the current war this is countered by concealment and defensive construction.

>>23392064
>Literally just don't open the hatch
not all kamikaze drones are small quadrocopters dude

>>23391969 (OP)
Would any drones even put a dent on a mobile suit armor?

>>23392381
whatever would carry whatever load that can reliably pierce MS armor enough to disable it
e.g. universally destructive ones would be a bit bigger than bazooka shields

>>23392387
>bazooka shields
bazooka shells* sorry for the dyslexia

>>23392381
See>>23392326 and >>23392374
Some modern drones are just cost efficient remote control missiles IE the iranian one and then there are quad copters off amazon with an IED taped to it like in syria, ukraine, maybe America soon, both are meant for zerg rushes

>>23392381
The most basic anti-tank drone is literally just an RPG warhead strapped to a small drone. There are drones that drop grenades as well, but those are meant more for anti-infantry and there's no point using that against a tank unless the hatches are open and it's not moving.

RPGs have disabled mobile suits before, but only by hitting certain spots. To guarantee a kill, you'd need ambush tactics with multiple drones.

>>23392394
What must be remembered about Shaheds (or really the Geran at this point) is that they are really just cheapo cruise missiles rather than anything like a quadcopter suicide drone. They can be countered with enough anti-air fire, and they are not used against moving targets. A version with wire guidance for such attacks would presumably be an okay anti-MS weapon but it's still about the equivalent of EF wire-guided anti-MS missiles while lacking their speed. An ideal head vulcan target, in some senses.

>>23392404
that's NOT cool, Shiro
you don't shoot a Zaku in the dick

You people ought to read about ATGM spam during the Yom Kippur war.

>Each division was provided with a massive quantity of Saggers – sometimes as many as 1,250 missiles for the first three days of the fighting (460 on the first day alone). Each launch team was allocated twenty missiles and each infantry division twenty-four carriages for toting them.
>"The Egyptians concentrated fifty-four antitank missiles on every kilometer of the crossing. No tank could withstand that". Facing this massive missile array was the IDF’s thinly stretched tank alignment, which was incapable of providing an effective tactical answer and altering the battle framework.

>>23392419
To be fair some militaries started making their own loitering quad drones

>>23392557
Or the Mujahideen RPG teams.

>This was a lesson that both the local mujahedeen and Soviet army quickly learned during their 1979 to 1989 war in Afghanistan. At the beginning of that conflict, the Soviet army typically assigned one RPG-7 to a motorized rifle squad. As soldiers gained experience in fighting in the mountainous terrain, they saw the advantage of adding more RPG-7s. The mujahedeen found the weapon even more valuable, adopting tactics that included forming armor-vehicle hunter-killer teams. “50 to 80 percent of the personnel were armed with RPG-7s. This could be up to 15 RPGs,” says Grau.

>>23391969 (OP)
Im surprised that haven't make mobile suits that control remotely via Newtype power

>>23391969 (OP)
They already do. Minovsky particles jam radar and radio waves, so the only drones that could possibly function in an MS environment are fiberoptics-guided.

>>23392064
This is stupid and false. There's loads of footage of drones hitting tanks in the treads, engine compartment (because believe it or not, tanks are designed to face towards the enemy and put all the armor there), in the gap where the turret ring is, and so on. The videos you see of kills on tanks with their hatches open are because those tanks have already been abandoned (due to being immobilized by mines or anti-tank warheads or a drone and thus a sitting duck) and the grenade down the hatch is a coup de grace to prevent the tank from being salvaged and repaired to be used against them again.

>>23392419
The British are developing a laser anti-drone system that can shoot down drones very quickly and gets around the "expensive anti-air missile the costs more than the drone it shoots down" problem since it just requires electricity. Presumably in a future with MS, they can mount a half-dozen of these on an MS and just power them directly from the Minovsky reactor.

>>23392735
More than just the brits, a cheap laser has been the dream of many a defense contractor

https://www.defensemirror.com/news/11684/US_Navy_Laser_Weapon_Fires_at__1_Per_Shot

>>23392735
In the case of the Geran missiles aren't really needed methinks, I am speaking out of my ass but I really am saying that they're countered by more old-fashioned shell-based rapid firing AAA like Gepards. MS vulcan guns adapted to fire an airbursting round would be a good defense against suicide drone threats as well as missiles.

Gundam actually seems to already have laser weaponry, stuff like the EF's old Depp Rogg bomber were equipped with them as point defense weapons and they were more common in prevous years, but apparently they were countered in-setting with relfective coating technology. That said, this is very old information, so far as I can tell, so a future Gundam entry or one not connected to UC could easily choose to use these lines of thinking.

>>23392796
The defensive turrets on the Albion are stated to be laser guns, but they look like they're shooting off-color mega particle beams anyway instead of a fast near-instantaneous laser beam

Any mech series where they stomp on and shit all over tanks typically has nothing to fear from drones, because they ARE the drones of their setting, the new big upset to established warfare that everyone is scrambling to deal with. If it can walk through tank fire, there's nothing to fear from even smaller, more disposable stuff. Its role has already been established, the old world doesn't matter to them.

Any mech series that actually does directly tackle it just gives them point defense measures. Of course the series made before drones didn't give them drone counter measures and the series made after might. Makes sense. Stick a little CIWS on the gundam and he's good to go. Armored Core already had that settled.

It's like everyone wants to extrapolate the russians using old dogshit that can't keep up with modern war anymore and say "yeah the gundam is like that, right? A big old hunk of shit in a stagnant force that can't keep up with new developments?".

>>23392326
I'm not not taking any advice from 08th, unless you want to say the pilots should get out and dodge the drones by leaping around.

>>23392890
>leaping around
I know the shockwave of a 120mm round would've pulverized that guy's gruts but consider he wouldn't have to hide under dirt to pilot a kamikaze quad up into Topp's pussy

>>23393271
If a ball can survive a lengthy burst of zaku machinegun fire in 08th's wacky world, a zaku can only die if the writer decides it should.

>>23391969 (OP)
Why did you guys keep asking a stupid question of why is a "space fighter" like mobile suit will lost to earthborne drone? Mobile suits are space fighters that destroy space battleships and other bird planes (which all our air vehicles are modelled from) and change the state of war in SPACE. The fact that they are so effective in destroying ground vehicles is just a side benefits but a big mistake of Zeon because the Earth Federation is like a cockroach. Zeon wasted resources on the invasion of Earth with space fighters on Earth and fallen to a stalemate until the Earth Federation can make their own army of mobile suits.

>>23392557
The Toyota war was better. Shoot, put the hammer down, Shoot, put the hammer down, Shoot, put the hammer down,Shoot, put the hammer down, etc etc etc.

>>23393406
>will lost to earthborne drone
>and other bird planes
>just a side benefits
Why do you sound like a certain anti-Korea schizo?

>>23391969 (OP)
retard orc tier modifications in ukraine have already raised the needed amount of drones to disable a 70 year old tank into the dozens
weak spots and open hatches are all drones take advantage of and mobile suits always have big blocky square cladding over the arms and legs etc etc
not to mention every one has a built in anti air system which is the mobile suits "head"

>>23391969 (OP)
arguing about the potential of 'modern' pgms in gundam is one of the most autistic sci-fi topics of discussion that doesn't involve star trek

The future of combat is tunnels

>>23392404
In the PLUMS

>>23392702
GQ had mulitple instances of an MS responding to a newtype not directly in the cockpit, with no specific modifications for that. All of them were clearly not intended behaviour, with even people who are supposed to be familiar with the tech being surprised, so it might be that if there are psycho controls, there is inherent capability for remote control that just isn't explored. Though all of them happened in relatively close proximity and with line of sight, so practicality of it might be limited (in one instance the pilot nearly vaporized herself lol).
>>GQ
Close enough to UC to be considered.

>>23391969 (OP)
The RX-78-2 no diffs rapid fire 120mm rounds.
The man portable drones used in Ukraine could not carry nearly enough ordinance to damage it.

>>23396853
>tunnels
Awww yeah my ace combat training will final pay off.

>>23391969 (OP)
They can't.

>>23399033
Stop bumping this thread, discussion ended

>>23391969 (OP)
Minovksy particles and blitzing down any fiber optic line they see