Thread 23399450

Does Banagher really deserve the title of "Worst Gundam protagonist" like people on here say? Why so much hate?

>>23399450 (OP)
He's one of the best along with Kamille, Uso, Argo, Setsuna, Bellri and Machu.
If you disagree you're stinky.

>>23399450 (OP)
>Worst Gundam protagonist
That goes to stutteretta.

>>23399456
Weird way of spelling "Io"

Banagher is mediocre but I don’t hate him. Mika is worse.

>>23399486
Mika doesn't count as a character, let alone protagonist.

>>23399450 (OP)
I straight up can't name a single interesting thing about this dude other than "SORE DEMO..."
People can bitch about Suletta, but at least she's got the interesting bit about being a brainwashed freak for half the show.
People can bitch about Machu, but at least she's really fucking emotional and doing only what she wants.
I don't know what Banana even does.

>>23399503
Mika is at least funny, Tekkadan having to carry him around like a sack of potatoes during S2 is one of the funnier things I've seen in anime. Also he scored.

>>23399513
This says more about you than anything else.
In other words, average unicorn discourse on this board.

>>23399456
Weird way of spelling “Machu”.

It's fucking Kio, Jesus Christ he gets the FX and is instantly capable of non-lethal takedowns I hate him so fucking much.

>>23399450 (OP)
People just use the "muh magic space wizards" excuse to hate anything that's not late 80's and early 90's Gundam OVAs (e.g. 0080, 0083, 08th MS Team). It's also funny when people use that excuse to criticize Unicorn but then ignore that Zeta, ZZ and CCA also had bullshit magic space wizards.

>>23399566
You could say the same about Kira and the Freedom.

>>23399595
>You could say the same about Kira and the Freedom
If you wanted to be disingenuous, sure.

>>23399530
Machu isn't even her name

>>23399566
>66
Doubles speak the truth. It's Kio.
But this is mitigated a bit by Flit being such a badass.
Show and Kio still suck though.

>>23399450 (OP)
Zero personality, gets all the chicks anyway and is THE face of the retarded as fuck power escalation of newtypes
And yet I can name worse. Judau, Suletta, Kou, IBOguy, AGE S3 kid, hell AGE S2 kid too, Hathaway

>>23399566
Kio is just well written Kira

>>23399566
Kio has the benefit of sharing his show with two other protagonists so he doesn't stand out as much on his own. Well that and AGE being kind of shit to begin with so no one really cares.

>>23399719
How is Judau worse than Banagher

>>23399595
>You could say the same about Kira and the Freedom.
Kira's nowhere near as bad, Kio pulls that shit out of his ass instantly.
>>23399903
That's a fair point.

>>23399450 (OP)
He's not the worst, but he defiantly lost point with that ARX-014S bullshit

>>23399450 (OP)
Banagher isn't bad, the only annoying part is "the power of friendship and emotions™" literally reversing the Neo Zeong into nonexistence, no other series to date has given a newtype that level of magic bs, and the complete psycho-frame isn't an excuse.

>>23399905
The entire ZZ cast besides Judau's sister are annoying self-serving assholes until they flip their serious switch on halfway through the series

>>23399450 (OP)
No one thinks he's the worst, In fact, most people like him.

>>23400037
You're just mad Captain Beecha's leadership was rock solid the whole time.

>>23400037
>nooo you have to obey the military regime!!!!!

There's at least 3 gundam protagonists objectively worse written than him now so no he doesn't

all waifufags are bad by default, but at least Banana is pretty and has a good voice. Same can't be said about Garrod, for instance

>>23399450 (OP)
He's a non-character

>>23399450 (OP)
>Worst Gundam protagonist

He's not even in the Top 5, who the fuck is calling him that?

>>23399595
the main character of UC is a magic space wizard trying to create more magic space wizards because his magic space wizard dad is dead. if you have a problem with magic space wizards your soul is weighed down by gravity, earthnoid

>>23399450 (OP)
>Worst Gundam protagonist
Kou exist.

>>23400445
No he’s definitely top 5.

>>23399450 (OP)
He's insanely boring. There's plenty of bad Gundams but their protagonists generally have at least one entertaining scene. Destroy Mode outright makes Unicorn fights worse so even his suit's cool factor is completely negated.

He's literally just Kira but in UC. I thought Kira is the most popular Gundam MC? Why is Banana less popular than him?

>>23401109
Kira had something going for his character until he got blown up by the Aegis, then he became bland piece of cardboard for the remaining 70ish episodes of CE and the movie gave a mangled attempt to make him interesting again. Banagher was bland from beginning to end with his only memorable trait being the word "soredemo" and liking beam magnums

>>23400523
>main character of UC
Pfffhahahahaha.

>>23401109
Banagher is a far worse Kira
Kira would have shoved a beam saber in Loni's face

>>23401083
Kamille in the first half of Zeta
Judau if you're a ZZ hater
Kira fucking Yamato, full stop
Kio, easily at the very top
Sekai
Mikazuki
Io
Suletta
Solari

All of these are easily much, much worse than Banagher.

>>23399513
Holy shiet worst opinion of all time. Liking Mika just because he scored despite having no personality or individuality

>>23400037
midwit take

Did Banagher have any notable piloting feats? I can't recall anything that wasn't just the NT-D kicking in.

>>23401318
No conventional piloting feats, other than just pushing the psycoframe to new levels.

>>23401318
Not really. He's a talented newtype but he's in a machine that would be godly in any newtype's hands.

lol Jona
juuuuuuust kidding Narrative is even better than Unicorn

>>23399450 (OP)
Worst will always be Kio. It's impossible to be worse than him.

>all these people shitting on Kio
You probably don't even remember AGE

>>23401406
I remember a scene where he blocks his ally's beam rifle and then proceeds to let said ally get shot down by a vegan. Bitch isn't even an equal opportunity muh peacefag, he is just a straight up traitor.

>>23401318
He had mobile suit simulation training as a little kid, forced on him and enforced by punishment of pain, he just repressed it until he actually had to use the Unicorn. And in the OVA, he did on several occasions shoot down or disable mobile suits without killing the pilots in Unicorn Mode, so it's not just the Destroy Mode and NT-D carrying him (though it does allow him to perform a lot of the more absurd feats). And for a pilot in the UC setting, that's still pretty good.

>>23401404
I would argue that Mikazuki and Suletta might be worse. Mika isn't even so much a character as he is Orga's appendage, and Suletta was just lackluster all across the board due to how much of a clusterfuck her show was.

Kinda unrelated but I am rewatching ZZ and Judau hit women a lot. He almost punched Fa in the face too

>>23401287
>Kamille in the first half of Zeta
>Worse than Banana
Lolwut? The nigger gets into his suit all the time despite fucking killing his dad. Are you just following the memes?

>>23401459
It really depends on if you consider characters that fail to elicit any emotional response worse than one that elicits active loathing to the point he was written out of the show when it came time for the OVAs. I can certainly see the argument for them being worse even if I disagree.

>>23399450 (OP)
Banagher has no character, no personality, he's a flat boring character with no motivation other than to "do good".

>>23401109
Kira actually has a character arc where he is forced to come to terms with what he has become and actively tries to change his ways. Say what you want about his godmode hacks and pacifism but he at least noticeably changes and grows and doesn’t have the answers to the universe. At least he walks the walk and still kills people when it’s necessary. Banagher is always right from the very beginning, instantly susses out both the Feds and Zeon and outwits everyone that he gets into a debate with, but he’ll still let countless civilians die because newtype fee fees. Then he wins with the power of magical friendship and because he’s the most newtype-y newtype in all the land. Kira might have weird writing that SEED never really calls him out on but at least he has a coherent arc. Banagher is Kira but boring, and that’s a miserable showing all things considered.

>>23399450 (OP)
The problem with Banagher is that he’s too perfect. He’s a straightforward good person in a morally gray setting. His response to conflict for any reason is “Why can’t we stop fighting?” He has no arc because he’s perfect from the start and doesn’t suffer the same moral quandaries a lot of Gundam pilots deal with. He’s basically just a vehicle for the story to happen around him.
However, being bland isn’t the same as being bad, so I don’t feel like he deserves to be in the top 5 worst list.

>>23401631
Judau knows how to handle a woman.

>>23401631
So?

>>23401631
Judau stopped out of respect for Kamille

>>23401903
It's weird because all the pieces are there for Banagher to grow and develop, but he just doesn't. Banagher from episode 1 is effectively the same guy as Banagher from episode 7, whereas Amuro, Kamille, Judau, Domon, Heero, Kira, and Setsuna are completely changed by the end of their series.

>>23399503
>>23401292
More dimwits filtered by IBO lmao

>>23399450 (OP)
He cannot be the worst main character in a world Machu or Jona exist, but even then he aint all that bad either, hes just kinda boring

>>23402063
No he stopped because Bright stopped him.

>>23399450 (OP)
Mate, he's literally only remembered for spamming soredemo, he's incredibly nothing otherwise.

>>23401109
He's boring and that's the ultimate sin.

>>23401318
The Unicorn literally just needs him as a flesh CPU.

>>23401406
He's simping for Vagans despite Vagans being remorseless cartoon villains, there's a reason Flit overshadows him.

>>23401631
To be fair UC is filled to the brim with women who do deserve to get socked in the face.

>>23402078
>Banagher from episode 1 is effectively the same guy as Banagher from episode 7
You could say the same thing about Machu, atleast banagher kicks some ass, hes far from the worst

>>23402078
He would say he has some good development in Episode 4

>>23401287
>Machu nowhere in this list
Gquackstard…

>>23402986
Never saw GQ, never will
>>23403014
In what sense? He waffles and flip-flops and ultimately does nothing.
>I have to get out there and stop Loni!
>It's too sad, I can't...
>I have to stop her...! Gundam!
>I can't do it!!

>>23403290
I didn't put her on the list because I haven't watched GQUUUUUUX yet.

If Banagher is the worst, who is the best overall?

>>23403806
Amuro.

>>23403806
For starters, Banagher isn't the worst, we've already established that. But to answer your question, Amuro is probably the one you'll find the least complaints about. Uso, Domon, Garrod, Loran and Flit are also up there.

>>23403820
>we

>>23403820
No we haven't established that, maybe you decided it on your own but speak for yourself.

>>23403815
>>23403820
Yeah, Amuro would be my pick for best, same with Char being the best Char.
God I love most of the original UC stuff.

>>23400292
Still insane to me that bright just completely abandoned them for the finale, how could he trust Beecha to be a captain?

>>23403839
Watch the show retard.

>>23399450 (OP)
No, because Suletta and Kira are still worse. Banana is just too passive for a Gundam protag.

>>23403820
Speak for yourself Bananafag.

>>23403829
>>23403835
>>23403901
None of you bitches can give any solid reasons why any of the characters listed in >>23401287 are somehow not worse than Banagher. Just because you have a hate boner for the character, does not mean that worse ones do not exist.

>>23403838
Nope. Several other characters were better Chars than Char.

Iron Mask
Schwarz Bruder
Zechs Merquise
Rau Le Creuset
Meijin Kawaguchi

>>23403926
Why the fuck are kamille or judau even on that list? That's retarded. You are retarded.

>>23403806
Banagher isnt even top 5 worst anymore
Best is easily Kamille, Lora is really good too

>>23403926
Stop posting please, you keep embarrassing yourself.

>>23399908
>>23399648
>Kira's nowhere near as bad
>First thing he does with the Freedom upon returning to earth is cripple numerous ZAFT mobile suits with such pinpoint accuracy from bullshit beam spam.

Guys just say you hate funnels and children. That's what your argument boils down to.

>>23399450 (OP)
Jona, Kou and Kio all are easily worse than him, I'd also put all 3 members of the Build Fighters Tri Team as worse than him too.

>>23399450 (OP)
He’s the worst UC protag.

>>23403806
For me its bernie kamille or garod

>>23404130
Pretty sure Io is worse.

>>23404170
Naw, Io has character growth. It's just in the manga instead of the shitty anime.

>>23403926
Embarassing and retarded taste.

>>23399595
I can cause Kira "Jesus" Yamato is also one of the worst of all time

>>23399450 (OP)
??? Pretty sure Kio has that title. On /m/ at least.

Banagher is based.

>>23399450 (OP)
>>23401903
What completely broke me about Banagers character was the torrington base attack plotline.

This little bitch spends the entire time crying and moralfagging while Loni is actively murdering civilians right in front of him. Him taking the high ground and refusing to kill her goes against the entire narrative of gundam where the supposed good guys are nevertheless forced into doing horrible things by war, and this bitch just chooses to not do it?
If it was Amuro or Kamille in the unicorn Loni would have been so fucking dead.

>>23404368
The changes from the novel were fucking retarded and made that episode much worse. Not that it was good before.

>>23399719
Hathaway did nothing wrong and Judau is a chad

>>23399450 (OP)
Banagher is Amuro/Kira if done right by people who actually understands humans.

>>23403815
I found Amuro to be kind of annoying in 0079, until like 2/3 through he is a whiny ass motherfucker who both doesn’t want to pilot the Gundam but also gets mad if someone else dares to touch his Gundam, even if White Base is under attack and Bright put him in time out for doing something retarded. Of course his growth throughout the series is good, and he comes off as less of a bitch than Kamille does, but frankly Judau was more enjoyable throughout because he isn’t a huge fucking crybaby about getting into combat and actually wants to pilot the Zeta/ZZ. Compared to Bangarang, all the other UC protags are just more entertaining though, he doesn’t develop at all and is too retarded to stop calling Mineva an alias she made up and used for an afternoon. So if I was ranking UC protags from the series I’ve seen, I would put them:
Judau>Amuro>Kamille>Banager

>>23404544
Banana Lint is a fucking terrible character who even Kira has more value than in comparison.

>>23399450 (OP)
Soredemo

>>23400037
Why should Judau and his friends care about world peace when they're busy trying to pay the bills?

>>23402078
>Banagher from episode 1 is effectively the same guy as Banagher from episode 7
Anon, do you not realize that the entirety of Unicorn takes place inside of four weeks?

>>23406361
>>23402078
pretty sure banagher changes, he's a mopey fuck in the novels who get forced to come to a party with his classmates but spends the time being anti-social

then at the end of unicorn he's got a girlfriend and briefly experienced some level of god-like ability

>>23406366
yeah, Banagher choosing not to become a god at the end of unicorn (in the novels atleast) is a more meaningful character moment than any gundam MC has gotten since maybe Setsuna

>>23404546
>Judau was more enjoyable throughout because he isn’t a huge fucking crybaby about getting into combat
I know what you mean but Judau spends the mid part of ZZ literally crying at the end of every battle because he hates it and killing people

>>23406557
To be fair a sane human being doesn't really like killing other people.

>>23399450 (OP)
The protagonist from gbitch stole that title.

>>23407260
weird way to spell Gcucks

>>23407260
Murderzuki was the worst, but Agent Sully gets a close second, I definitely empathize.

>>23412136
Stop ban evading duel.

>>23399450 (OP)
Hathaway Noa exist.

>reading Thunderbolt
>Io both personality and character design design come off like a villain
>Daryl comedy off like the protagonist
>Io for some reason is the MC
Maybe because I'm still in the beginning but Io is just a asshole who wants to fight with nothing else going fo him but the jazz shit. He's basically a murderer hobo

>>23399452
fpbp

>>23412493
Protagonist doesn't mean good guy anon
Also Daryl has his own issues going on as you'll find out

>>23412375
He's fine because the point is that he's wrong, fair to not like him though
Better than Setsuna who is wrong but the show pretends is right

>>23414257
Setsuna is right you faggot

>>23414257
I always hear the same cope from people defending Skyler White, this just makes you think how bad of a character Hathaway is.

>>23412493
>He's basically a murderer hobo

Jeez reminds me of some blue haired retard from a recent gundam show.

>>23414256
>Protagonist doesn't mean good guy anon


The problem comes when the history tries to make you sympathize with him or even try to make him look good.

>>23414257
>>23414724
Right or wrong about what lol

>>23414793
Im assuming his ideal that the ultimate goal of humanity should be to completely do away with weaponry and armed conflict and that we should just talk things out

>>23414816
But almost every Gundam protag has some variation of that ideology

>>23401409
That literally doesn’t happen. We’ve been over this for the last few months since it came back on Tubi, you all either misremember or make shit up. At least be honest about your hate

>>23401406
>>23401409
And like clockwork someone actually misremembers what happens with a shit meme

>>23399450 (OP)
No. At least he has character traits as opposed to someone like Machu.

>>23399450 (OP)
He's only the "worst" if you hate yourself, as he's nothing more than a self insert for the audience. He's hardly even an actual character.

>>23399450 (OP)
simple answer, no

>>23416227
>he has character traits
それでも

He feels so fucking passive it's ridiculous. Everything he does is reactionary instead of proactive. He spends so much time just being pushed around it makes it feel like the Unicorn only gives him power when enough people around him decide it's okay. At which point he just goes through the motions.
People shit on Kio from Age a lot. I get why, the kid is not a charmer. But ultimately when he decided to face turn into a Vegan sympathizer, he took the power of the Age FX and did what he personally felt was right, not what everyone was telling him to do. It was his idea to start chopping up both enemy and ally in battle just to make everyone stop fighting. It was stupid, short sighted and self centered. But I at least felt like Kio was using the unique power handed to him to do what he felt was right. Unlike Banana who just kind of goes where the plot tells him and only shoots in direct reaction, as if he's an NPC you have to agro.
So yeah, I do feel like Banana is more annoying than even my other least favorite Gundam protagonist.

>>23424609
To add, I have never seen IBO. But people in this thread are making it sound like Mikazuki is essentially what I hate about Banagher, turned up to 11. So maybe he wouldn't be my least favorite anymore if I saw IBO.

>>23402986
To be fair barely anything really happens to Machu of you really think about it lol.
So much of the plot is happening around her, not to her. A lot of the characters talking her ear off like Challia Bull and Lalah are just talking about problems that don't apply to her and she wasn't even forced to kill anyone in her short time piloting. It kind of makes sense she'd barely change.

>>23424614
Mika straight up only exists to do what Orga tells him and has almost no emotion for the entire series. Looking back, it’s pretty outrageous shit.

>>23403806
Amuro and Kamille.

>>23412375
>t. chanfag

>>23406107
>t.

>>23399450 (OP)
"Worst Gundam protagonist" is like trying to determine the one retard in a lineup of retards who is most likely to die to being mowed down by a minigun (The answer is all of them). Every single gundam protagonist has had some kind of idiot quirk where they're just hateable. Not to mention Gundam is a liberal shit franchise to begin with and pushes a lot of retarded leftist talking points like "The rich are bad" and "Fascism is self defeating" when neither of those are actually historically true.

TL;DR: Gundam is stupid and we should stop having threads made about it. Watch LOGH instead because it shows a more realistic approach to war instead of stupid giant robot toys banging against each other.

>>23401903
>>23402078
Tomino was right. He said UC Gundam does not work without a full war taking place in the story to drive the story forward and force characters into life and death scenarios. Either kill or be killed. Gundam Unicorn has no war and thus fails.

>>23404368
Banagher kills her in the novel. But Bandai was afraid of Muslim backlash. In the novel, the mobile armor was piloted by a family of Zeon Muslims. Banagher's weapons (including the beam magnum) just bounce harmlessly off it until he finds a tiny weak point and Banagher's kills the entire family with no regrets. But the producers were afraid of Muslims getting outraged and getting violent at this and changed it.

>>23424891
Banrise feared backlash from Muslims
Unicorn novels were written with Banrise supervision and final sign-off

Pick two

>>23424891
>Banagher kills her in the novel. But Bandai was afraid of Muslim backlash. In the novel, the mobile armor was piloted by a family of Zeon Muslims. Banagher's weapons (including the beam magnum) just bounce harmlessly off it until he finds a tiny weak point and Banagher's kills the entire family with no regrets. But the producers were afraid of Muslims getting outraged and getting violent at this and changed it.
>same misery porn as all gundams
>muzzies mad because lolmuzzies
many such cases!

>>23399452
fpwp

>>23399469
Prosthetic hands needed help to type this

>>23424622
sure, youve identified the problem, still doesnt make her better than banagher

>>23426695
Daryl Lorenz >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Io
its not even close

>>23424899
>source is i made it the fuck up

There's plenty of dead brown people in ZZ.

https://youtu.be/7DnQo4YXrKc

>>23427115
that was back before people gave a shit about offending them in a tv show made only for a domestic audience, not The Latest Worldwide Release from the global phenom

>>23406653
A sane human pretends to not like hurting people, primarily because doing otherwise puts them at a social disadvantage. Simultaneously said sane human looks for ways to hurt people that they can get away with, in the modern age this is mostly social violence. Humans at their core are all assholes, hence why it's considered a virtue to struggle against that nature and be a "good" person rather than something that is considered a given.

>>23415022
>>23415024
Just for you, I went back and rewatched the show. Here is what happens, kio bends over backwards to block shots on the vegans in episode 40 and then just sits by and lets the allies standing right next to him get blown the fuck up in the first 5 minutes of episode 41.

>>23403806
>Best
Amuro
Garrod
Domon
Arno Seabook
>Worst
Suletta
Whatever the newest gundam protaganist name is I haven't watched it yet

>>23424614
Mika is an attack dog. Dude outsourced his brain to Orga.

>>23424899
>>23424896
>>23424891
Im less offended that they changed, and more offended that they replaced it with some so stupid. Like the best they could was them arguing about parents, and the brown girl crying and saying "isn't it sad"? Then Banagher cries too and says he can't kill her.

Was THAT the best the writers at Sunrise could come up with? REALLY? I mean they could have asked Tomino for help. He would have had Banagher stain his hands with blood no problem. Look how many mobile armors Tomino blows up in his series.