Thread 95917253

Previously: >>95906763

Argue About Wishes Again or Something Edition

>Most recent bracket system update
https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/announcements/commander-brackets-beta-update-april-22-2025

>Outline article introducing the bracket system
https://magic.wizards.com/en/news/announcements/introducing-commander-brackets-beta

>Current banlist
https://magic.wizards.com/en/banned-restricted-list#commander-banned

>Former Commander website, where you can learn the basics, and read the format philosophy laid down by the rules committee
https://mtgcommander.net

>Statistically see what everyone else puts in their commander decks based on what is posted to the internet
https://www.edhrec.com

>Deck list site: You can search for decks that other people have made. Authors often have comments that explain their deck strategy and card choices
https://www.archidekt.com
https://www.moxfield.com
https://www.tappedout.net

>Find out what lands you can add to your deck, sorted by category, based on a chosen color identity
https://managathering.com

>Card search
https://scryfall.com

>Make custom cards
https://magicseteditor.boards.net
https://mtg.design
https://mtgcardsmith.com

>Proxy a deck or a cube for cheap
https://pastebin.com/9Xj1xLdM

>How to proxy using any printer
https://mtgprint.cardtrader.com

>Precons
https://magicprecons.com

TQ: I'm only making a thread because some guy started complaining. Speculate about rules changes under Wizards. Hybrid mana, wishes, planeswalkers as commanders etc.
We are apparently getting Legendary Vehicles as legal commanders in Edge of Eternity so I guess it's on topic.

Vehicle stonks are about to shoot up. Get them cheap while you still can.

>>95917255
Robots run on electricity and don't have souls. The word literally comes from some slavic word for slave.

>>95917253 (OP)
>TQ
It will eventually extend to any legendary permanent (except Planeswalkers for some stupid reason)

>I HATE UB! IT DOESN'T FEEL LIKE MAGIC AT ALL!

Yes, and that's a good thing.

>>95917259
God that art is atrocious. Screenshots from the games would probably look better and feel more dynamic

>>95917262
So they can be sentient, but even if they are they don't have a soul, even though they can be rizzing up your girl and she's into being Terminated?

the only vehicle I like is luxurious locomotive and its not legendary

>>95917265
fag shit

I had good games tonight with my insect deck and when I left the LGS a ladybeetle landed on me
Life is good

>>95917265
Don't make me tap the sign.

>>95917265
Anti UB faga will defend this

>>95917253 (OP)
I still have no idea how those cards are supposed to work and I have zero intention of looking it up because I just hate their design.

>>95917259
This dumb car was a monster during my prerelease. Easily my MVP.

>>95917271
this is a card I keep putting into and taking out of every deck

>>95917265
>It's XA'AM
Maybe it's actually a hive mind organism, that's what I always assume when I see an individual referred to as they.

>>95917270
You wouldn't ever know if a machine was "sentient"
You could program a machine to react to pain by screaming and act sad when left alone, but you will never know if it thinks.
All we can know is that by a 4 billion year process of evolution, you, solipsisticly are aware and "sentient" so presumably the other creatures like you are also, no matter how much their behavior suggests otherwise.

That is all you can know, that is all that is worth thinking about, ergo toasters don't get rights.

>>95917265
All of my hopes for this set ruined in a single image. We could've had Endless Space instead we get Seattle Unfinity.

>>95917279
>I still have no idea how those cards are supposed to work and I have zero intention of looking it up because I just hate their design.

So, in theory, I could attack once with Kain and then never get control of Kain again for the rest of the game?

>>95917286
How do you know a suit of armor is sentient?

>>95917300
Yes. However, if you attack a player, they gain control of it, and then they die without giving it to anyone else, you will regain control of it.

Not a huge fan of the spoilers so far but I do like vehicle commanders

>>95917280
I was going to build kenway just to play this card and I never did

>>95917300
In theory, yes. But he could always be killed/exiled and you'll get him back then. Or stuff like pic rel

>>95917302
Because it is fictional, the fictional world has the concept of a soul, and the magic of the world can ensoul something inanimate, therefore that with a soul is sentient.
Robots are explicitly not run on magic theyre run on electricity. If Robots were no different to Constructs in this game there would be no reason to give them different creature types.

I am a pubstomper.

>artifacts and arifact creatures!
>make your artifacts into creatures!
>vehicles!
>wokeshit!
>awful art!

I'm already tired of this set. Why can't someone Luigi whichever faggot at WOTC is obsessed with fucking vehicles and artifacts. Chrisy almighty I'm just going to make a deck that's nothing but artifact removal deck with no wincon and just as much artifact removal as possible and bust it out every time I run into some fag with their gay little artifact deck.

>>95917300
Holy shit, you've already been told about forced combat. That's clearly what he's designed for.

>>95917329
Can you cry about it you fucking baby

>>95917325
I'm confused? I don't see this can be your commander???

>>95917322
So a fictional suit of armor can have a soul, but a fictional robot can't? What kind of logic is that?

>>95917325
>Not liking based artifacts
Sorry there's not Dr. Troon art on the card for you to enjoy

>>95917333
>so the text on the card does what the text on the card does?????
>yes, if you don't like it, you've already been told how to get it back
What the fuck was the point of the question?

>>95917295
>casual format
every time I see this I laugh to myself

>>95917338
>So a fictional suit of armor can have a soul, but a fictional robot can't?
I didn't say can't, I said don't.
Again. Constructs are animated by magic, robots are animated by electricity. Magic can impart sentience, electricity can't. If Wizards wanted the Robot creature type to be sentient they'd just be fucking Constructs because those already exist.

>>95917325
>artifacts and artifact creatures
are a core part of magic from day 1
>make your artifacts into creatures
see above
>vehicles
a 32 year old game with 25000 cards can handle it
>wokeshit
fake news
>awful art
this one I agree with

>>95917356
>electricity can't impart sentience

>>95917325
This card MIGHT be playable in legacy stax.

>>95917300
This and a similar card Kharn the Betrayer rely on you and another player making a gentleman's agreement when it's cast to swap the card back and forth.

Unfortunately, you're too autistic to use this card because it involves basic social negotiation.

>>95917356
Not seeing electricity mentioned here chief

>>95917277
Since when?

>>95917325
I love pearl clutching little bitches like you, your whining is music to my ears while I'm popping off.

>>95917370
Why do you think creatures are sentient? Especially back when they were "summons"?

>>95917325
Artifacts are cool, you are lame

>>95917373
Fuck off asshole

>>95917356
>Constructs are animated by magic, robots are animated by electricity
is that actually stated anywhere? is there somewhere wotc says that's the difference?
>Magic can impart sentience, electricity can't
or this?

>>95917345
What the fuck was the point of your response

>>95917418
Case in point

>>95917421
no, he's making shit up because he has zero argument whatsoever

>>95917390
Because summoning is magic, and according to you magic, imparts sentience.

>>95917461
*and according to you, magic imparts sentience

>>95917369
>wokeshit
>fake news

lmao lol >>95917265

>>95917421
>>95917444
It is the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

>>95917461
>>95917464
All thumbs are fingers, not all fingers are thumbs. What the fuck do you expect to be said when you go out of your way to be retarded?
Imparting sentience is something magic CAN do. In the case of constructs that is part of what magic DOES do, but there are types of magic that don't impart sentience.
Everything in this game other than land is a spell. So by your logic, if all magic imparts sentience, Sol Ring and Lightning Bolt are sentient. That is clearly not the case. Constructs on the other hand are ensouled.

>>95917465
it's not woke CHUD it's called being rxspxctful

Thirty (30) starting life is objectively superior to fourty (40)

>>95917477
So why isn't it that summoning magic imparts sentience to the summoned thing, so the summoned thing can follow orders? Which might be useful to someone summoning, oh I don't know, a suit of fucking armor!

To be fair to the autistic shitflinging contest. Introducing robot as a creature was entirely redundant when construct existed and just results with a new creature type with sub-bar support rather than enhancing another creature type.

>>95917501
Broke: Robot should be Construct
Woke: Construct should be Robot

>>95917491
If you think robots animated by electricity can be sentient, why doesn't turning on a flashlight impart sentience?
Are you fucking dumb? There are different types of magic that do different things. Some magic controls minds, some magic blows shit up, some magic shows the future, and some magic imparts sentience. The imparting sentience kind is that shit that animates constructs. What the fuck is your problem?

>>95917512
Because real life is not Magic: The Gathering!

>>95917325
So this is why they banned Mana Crypt...

>>95917512
>it's this way because I said so!
lmao

>>95917501
To be also fair, introducing a separate type explicitly to NOT be supported by existing support is valid to prevent Urza from bodyslamming anyone who had the gall to play artifacts without him.

>>95917265
>they/them

>>95917517
The line blurs...

>>95917575
Like ornithopters or crabs, instant ramen is an inevitable outcome.

>>95917581
explain ornithopters imo I don't see how they're so inevitable like trains

>>95917501
Not every creature type needs dedicated support.

>>95917626
This is probably one of the reasons why, along with actual lore reasons that creature types got out of hand. Some tribes would probably just be too ridiculous

>>95917626
Why not?

>>95917588
They're called drones

>>95917259
Monocolor decks aren't all that popular in the first place, much less colorless, and there are only two (2) multicolor vehicles that aren't Transformers or Shorikai

My time has come

>>95917369
EVERY TIME a set or block has focused on artifacts, it has been some of the most heinously overpowered shit in the game.

And EOE came out swinging with a 3 mana colorless planeswalker that can ult every turn like it's breathing

>>95917709
the ult is bad tho
the -3 and the 0 are the only good abilities

>>95917713
>slapping an exponentially greater number of +1/+1 counters on your Vehicle commander every single turn is bad
>also this effect cannot be stopped
>ever

>>95917725
Its really not that good doe

>>95917709
>EVERY TIME a set or block has focused on artifacts,
I don't recall Kaladesh block or Brother's being anything outrageous.

>>95917725
>3 per turn
>exponentially greater

>>95917729
making Vehicles or Spaceships creatures without needing to tap any other creatures is pretty good

>>95917703
damn there's some equipments (and an aura?) that give a 4/4 angel on attacking. Having them all at the same time would be real fucking neato

>>95917734
3 per turn the first turn, then 6 per turn, then 9 per turn, then 12 per turn, etc

because he can keep popping the ult

>>95917735
>without having to tap
Nah you just need to get 7 loyalty and wait til upkeep and do it one turn at a time lmao the fuck are you on nigger. It is not very good.

>>95917725
>exponentially
>3 per turn
>needing to ult repeatedly to make it more
>ult TWICE to give +6/+6 to a single creature
lmao
Here, let me make it less shit to you. -3: grab Sensei's Divining Top
congrats, the ult is retarded and bad.

>>95917733
Kaladesh had energy

>>95917744
Am I talking to a retard?

>>95917725
>exponentially
No, it's extremely linear. You get 3. Then you get 6 with another emblem. Then 9. Then 12. Then 15. Then 18. Then 21. It's not fucking exponential

>>95917754
yeah and it didn't do anything particularly busted with it

>>95917744
Exponential doesn't mean "constantly increasing." Exponential would be if you had a way to proliferate for 7 ever turn to ult that Jace that makes more Jaces.

>>95917744
exponential would be 3, then 9, then 27, then 81 you massive dumbass

>>95917748
It's not really BAD because you'll have counters out the ass with that Tezzeret and after you've drawn enough moxen or divining tops you can start turning them into beaters.
Definitely more useful in 1v1 though.

>>95917744
This is a zoomer by the way.

>>95917762
energy was such a busted mechanic that it nearly killed Standard

>>95917772
he also gets counters off artifact tokens, which you can then also turn into creatures

>>95917762
>things edhonlies say
You dont have to have an opinion on everything!

>>95917300
seeing this guy again makes me want to try him out to abuse the shit out of homeward and hatred, but i already have a black voltron.
maybe i'll pivot the deck he seems fun

I haven't been able to play all week.
Show me real decks.

>>95917774
What the fuck are you even talking about? Aether Hub? Metalwork Colossus? Fucking Aetherworks Marvel? That's your standard of busted?

time to run a pirate ship as my commander

>>95917795
>nonenglish chains

Does anyone here play Duel Commander?

https://moxfield.com/decks/bJzcwF-MGEGTXPv4ywAjoA

Need some opinions on this deck and what to cut, need 3 cards still

>>95917802
It was cheaper sir.
I can recite the rules text sir. I was there when it was written

>>95917813
>Non.
>English.
>Chains.

>>95917820
To be honest I forget what Revel in Riches says more often than Chains

>>95917798
didn't modern boros energy just have cards banned

Is this playable?

>>95917833
That's not Kaladesh being busted. And the energy cards Boros Energy uses aren't even artifacts.

>>95917834
it's a better Dictate of Erebos so yeah

>>95917861
Any other ATLA leaks yet?

>>95917861
>>95917875
this isn't a "leak," it was shown on stream and shared on Wizards' social media

>>95917861
>>95917875
Is bending going to be parasitic as fuck or is it going to be like 'commit a crime'?

>>95917883
it's probably just going to be "whenever you do X, do Y."

Like Firebending 2 will probably be "whenever this creature attacks, it deals 2 damage to target creature"

>>95917888
Going off the back, lets say air is lifegain, blue is card draw, green is 1/1 counters, red is damage to opponents.
Because bending is combat I'm gonna assume all this will activate when they attack

>>95917813
I respect the "Do not recite the old magic to me witch" in the context.

>>95917888
That still seems like an irritating and masturbatory choice to keyword already simple but not evergreen rules. While it's not going to hurt long time players, can you imagine having to explain this shit to newbies?

I kinda hoped it would be some kind of binary effect, but the fact it has a "2" appended suggests it has a number based or process based effect.

>>95917906
>red deals 2 damage
>white gains 2 life
>green puts 2 1/1 counters
>blue draws 2 cards

we're back to OG design

>>95917915
I'm guessing that’d be the case for firebending 2, earthbending 2, etc

>>95917834
It's a Dictate of Erebos without Flash that eventually disappears and shits out a random stolen creature, so no.

>>95917915
>blue is far and away better than any of the other colors
OG design indeed

My people have fallen...

I'm building budget Shantotto Tactician Magician because the name is fun to say.

>>95917265
I think it's time to conquer Seattle

Did get there at the LGS tonight. Wanted to play another deck, but saw the pod had a Vivi and was certain he would be deserving of correction.
>Path'd and counter-warred to kill his commander
>hit him with Curse of Exhaustion
>stole Vivi with Treachery the second time around to ensure he would never use it again
Later down the line I hit an Ur-Dragon player with triple Bribery off my commander + Errant then stole his Miirym, got two Terror of the Peaks and two Bahamuts which basically ended the game.

>Magic in 2026
>you look for a Tier 3 table, finding a Tier 2 table with Davros, Kefka, Chun Li, and Frodo + Sam partner
>you glance over at the next table and the commanders being played are Spiderman, Negan, Abaddon, Optimus Prime, and 5c Miku in a Tier 1 table
>you spot a full Tier 3 table with Elminster, Tifa, Eleven, and Dogmeat
>another full Tier 3 table with Caesar, Cloud, Sokrates, and Black Panther
>finally find a Tier 3 table open, your opponents are playing Azula, Y'shtola, and Ezio Auditore da Firenze
>you spot a Tier 4 table nearby with Slicer, Marneus Calgar, Aang, and Dhalsim
>your next game has your opponents playing the The Fourteenth Doctor, Sauron, and Liberty Prime at Tier 3

>>95917795
>nu and sazabi

based

>>95918011
ok?

>>95917795
Based Shatterbro. My newer build has been doing pretty good, third iteration of the deck. Had it since the Prossh precon, this time going for all-in artifacts with no infinites due to my playgroup. Managed to pull off a Goblin Welder/Portal soft lock the other day that was pretty sweet. Still tinkering with it, but it's pretty goddamned comfy.

>>95917790
How would hatred help

>>95918115
I guess you're already going for combat kills so it would guarantee a oneshot at least once?

Precon, or a budget deck as my first EDH deck to learn with?

>>95918134
Precon for sure.

>>95918134
Yeah, precon. I think every precon ever printed has retailed for less than the cards sell for as singles. Unless your budget deck is something you really really want to build, can't get it anywhere else, you're such a unique little individual kinda shit, choose precon.
It's better value for money, it's better power level than you're likely going to build as a first deck, and it'll be a better vehicle for learning because people who generally know what they're doing put it together.

>>95918176
>>95918150
Alright. I'll start doing research into which precon i want to get and play

>>95918190
My recommendation is Urza's Iron Alliance
really good precon overall

what are some fun politics cards? particularly in mono white, but open to all fun cards. i love making deals. I want to make this thing with divine intervention as my wincon. game plan is to wager card draw and removal until i sneak out intervention and protect it

>>95917588
every society is gonna have niggas who can't fly, and some of those niggas are gonna wanna fly

>>95917834
it's playable right now

>>95917588
Leonardo da Vinci (the real one) made an ornithopter

>>95918203
Gluntch and Flumph

Tataru isn't going to put in the work you think she will.

>>95918223
That's obviously a completely different card.

>>95918190
Yeah see what's around. I haven't bought precons to play in a while, but pretty much all of the Bloomburrow precons were supposedly quite good and I expect they're not too difficult to find even though they're coming up to be a year old now.

it's fun

>>95918190
This one is really good if you can find it

>>95918244
Really? With her in the command zone with secret rendezvous effects and flickers, I feel like I'll be able to stack up treasures. I mean, I don't expect the deck to breach even bracket 3. I think the card is way overrated in the 99, but as the general with a deck made to flicker or proc her effect, it seems fairly reliable

>1:c'mon, man, decide what you're doing faster
>me:no offense, but I want to actually think about what I'm doing unlike your gf who just rolls a d6 and does it "randomly" while still avoiding you and I want to explain myself as well so that I keep alliances open for later, you two want to win at all costs which is pathetic, but good for you.
>1:oh yeah, right, you're just accustomed to the other lgs where their house rules forbid people from using dice to decide who to target
>3: I play there too and they have no such house rule
>4:that was mean from both of you, you can't hold it against me, the dice decided
>me:not really, you said while rollin the dice 1-3 means that you destroy one of my things, 4-6 one of his (4) things, because your bf isn't a threat even though he had a turn 1 sol ring and his board state is strong af

>inb4 this never happened
Kill yourself

>>95918273
one treasure a turn isn't much to write home about

Legendary living weapons should be commanders
Legendary creatures on the back side of battles should be commanders
Legendary vehicles on the back side of lands should be commanders

>>95918274
Remember to drive a wedge between 1 and 4 by asking them why they don't win more when they're 2v1v1

>>95918282
>on your turn, secret rendezvous (+1 treasure)
>next player's turn, tap temple bell (+1 treasure)
>next player's turn, cloudshift (+1 treasure)
>next player's turn, tap loran of the third path (+1 treasure)

there is obviously set up, but play the politics game, especially early. there are strong, repeatable effects that you can protect by offering the card draw to the person thinking about removing the commander.

and again, the deck isn't meant to be a wild powerhouse. it's supposed to be fun politics

>>95918314
I can't wait until Legendary Artifact - Equipment is a legitimate commander choice and EDH get's to taste the Hell of equipment control

>>95918319
its still a bad commander because who cares whether monowhite has 15 mana? they have awful payoffs for mana spells.

>>95918314
legendary lands should be commanders

>>95918319
>Cloudshift
remember that it's a may

None of the local stores have FIN singles for sale. Sad!

>>95918326
God I wish

>>95918328
>>95918336

>>95918385
oh fuck you drew a wojak saying my opinion in MS Paint, you fuckin got me dude

>>95917346
Why? Are you misreading it or something?

>>95917295
>the wishposter has just been quoting an old Reddit post verbatim
incredible

>>95918395
it was fun

im not saying you are wrong. im making fun of you because i asked for fun politics cards for a deck i was building, then instead told me to build something else. and don't worry about saying no to her etb trigger, i'm not going to pick you for it anyway!!

regardless, i'm just trying to have fun in my pod. perhaps my pods are just more keen to play lower power fun stuff. you guys *are* right, but i didn't ask if I should run something else. i just wanted fun white cards to leverage politics

>>95918385
I look like, say, feel, and do this

>>95918413
I think there are more fun/comfy politics cards to play, like Gluntch, with Tataru in the 99

>>95918420
i just like building mono color decks. also someone at my lgs is a frequent gluntch player, which is his comfort/pet deck. so it's a combination of a number of things.

>>95918405
You sound very schizo right now

>>95917875
Ah Progenitus support.

>>95918429
schizo like a fox

>>95917875
>look at this
>notice it has the Ally creature type
Allies are back??

Okay, so I played my commander, sacced my dude and drew 10 cards.
Now what? How do I turn that into a win without some lame infinite?

>>95918460
this is my problem with her tqbh I'vebeen collecting cards for her (undercosted overPowered shit) but then what

>>95918493
me on the left

>>95918460
Is making a big creature not enough for you to win

>>95918504
There needs to be a BG card that says "sacrifice a creature, it deals damage equal to its power to each opponent and you gain that much life" imo

>>95918506
There's pic related, Rite of Consumption, and Jarad.

>do straight up nothing for five turns
>no creatures, just land drops and literally two spells total, including Kaalia
>for five turns
>leave Kaalia sitting on the battlefield unprotected for an entire turn cycle
>finally start swinging and doing Kaalia things on turn 6
>people still get huffy about it

>>95918549
I've never seen Kaalia attack before

How many mutants are worth playing in Jenova?

>>95918506
Closest thing I could find

>>95918583
I saw a guy doing a weird mutant setup with Sultai partners (I forget the actual commanders but they were mostly irrelevant beyond the colors) and Master Biomancer

>>95918549
And did you win that game, anon?
Content is important

>>95918597
Yes. But I really could've been stopped at literally any point along the way.

Well maybe not once I passed the Avacyn+Boots threshold but that was like turn 10.

>>95918583
Literally any good stuff creature bro, stop being shit.

God damn, sore winners are insufferable

>>95918635
It's even worse when they pubstomp and just gloat nonstop about how powerful their deck is. Like yeah sure, my friend is using a precon, of course you're gonna destroy him with your $1k deck, dipshit

>>95917253 (OP)
Post your newest commander

>>95918635
stop complaining that I overpowered you when I gave you a runway a mile wide to stop me and won by turning creatures sideways

>>95918635
TRUE

>>95918644
Why is Dr who so cringe

>>95918654
Lack of men with buzzcuts

>>95918644
He's everything I wanted from a bird tribal/landfall deck

>>95918671
I don't believe you

>>95918672
this little bastard is going in my mairsil the nanosecond he gets a uw printing

>>95918676
so never

>>95918671
What is the context here? This just seems in poor taste

>>95918654
what do you find cringe about the card?

>>95918671
shit this would make for a neat voltron commander. set it up as a nuke/intercontinental missile that does a one-hit KO on somebody. Get a ton of treasures and reload to hit someone else

>>95918644
The better Meren

>>95918680
there's an episode of Doctor Who where the Titanic gets remade as a spaceship in the future, it almost crashes into Earth as a result of deliberate sabotage but the Doctor saves it.

It is not actually a terribly flavorful card in this context now that I look at it.

>>95918690
I'm not even sure what the treasure aspect has to do with any of it.

>>95918688
Which Aerith is better?

does anyone think prime time should stay banned? the lands enter tapped and 2 landfall triggers is low and it is just plain slow in modern day commander

>>95918671
I might actually do this

>>95918684
I dunno anon

>>95918715
lands have only gotten stronger since the ban, so yes, it should absolutely stay banned.

>>95918715
Are you retarded

>>95918721
2 tapped lands meanwhile tempt with discovery being totally legal and cheaper cmc and almost always guaranteed 2 untapped lands if not 4

>>95918733
Tempt With Discovery doesn't repeat every turn, and can very easily just be one land if you're playing against three people with half a brain between them. Prime Time just happens, then keeps happening.

>>95918715
Yes. Forever. Anyone with half a damn brain will always say yes.

>>95918676
>a uw printing
but then he won't be legal for mairsil

>>95918680
>>95918690
>>95918695
A planet of human-like aliens run a space-cruiseline to Earth, using it as a tourist location for the wealthy of their species. They have an incomplete picture of Earth culture and history though, and made their ship look like Earth's most famous ship, ignorant of the context.
The owner of the cruiseline is an evil bastard that gets kicked out of his company, and as revenge, conspires to have the ship be hit by asteroids and crash into Earth, all to tank his former company's wealth.
The ship does get hit, many passengers die, and the company's stock does take a substantial hit. However, The Doctor is able to save some people and ship from crashing into the Earth (which would be really bad for Earth because it's powered by alien nuclear engines). One of the survivors is a rich guy that's been an asshole throughout the episode, who is ecstatic that his stocks in the cruiseline's competitors are skyrocketing in wake of the incident.

>>95918719
what has nothing to with the card. answer my actual question. it's also from the edgier and sexier late night spinoff series.

>>95918056
Welder is so nice in the builds.
I miss running It That Betrays always felt too win more though

the "theory" that in-universe sets were going to be absurdly pushed power-wise in an attempt to match the brand power of UB seems to be bearing out

>pre-ordered the FF precons at a local internet store, that's basically just a giant warehouse with all kind of nerd shit (video games, official mtg products etc)
>always msrp or just the lowest price compared to every lgs near me
>suddenly get an e-mail week before the FF release
>"sorry our supplier has not sent us enough mtg stuff, don't be alarmed and please stop calling us asking for the status of your order, you will get a specific e-mail if your order got canceled on release day"
>"your order was canceled, sorry we received 95% less mtg products than usual"
Oh well, does someone have all the image files for the China man to order proxies?

>>95918690
So did Futurama copy dr who or the other way around?

>>95918797
the Futurama episode was almost 10 years prior to the Doctor Who episode

>>95918721
>>95918726
>>95918746
>>95918752
Prime time is still too slow to be considered ban worthy even if it was unbanned it would be a game changer meaning you're already playing high power I really doubt the 6 cmc creature with additional cmc used to combo him is gonna be faster than a optimized low curve high power deck

>>95918789
What actually happened
>All FF prices have doubled since release
>Store can either honor your order or cancel it and then sell your products for double
>Guess what they did

>>95918806
Amulet Titan is still a very powerful Modern deck, and he slots into Kinnan basically perfectly

>>95918807
Nope. They had none of it in stock. Might have sold it all second hand though, can't really check that. They had a couple of play boosters boxes, all msrp, but I didn't want those.

>>95918806
he generates massive value just by entering the battlefield, and six mana isn't "slow" in green.

got 2 final fagacy Coolector boxes at msrp . Really tempted to sell one for like 800 usd. You only get l ike 2 or 3 surge foils per box right?

>>95918774
cool AI art

>>95918806
>6 cmc creature with additional cmc used to combo him
Do you have any idea how easy it is to cheat creatures out? Do you have any idea how easy it is to ramp and bring him out on T3-4? Do you have any idea how easy it is to flicker/reanimate him? He's banned for a reason, and he's not going to get unbanned just because you're too dumb to understand why he's been banned all this time.

>>95918710
the one you posted since I can actually slide her into my orzhov lifegain deck

>>95918828
How the fuck did you manage that?
They're currently going for 1200

>>95918836
Stole it

>>95918828
I'm honestly debating buying some at 1200 because I have a feeling they're gonna keep going up

This feels incredible in mono white.
Is this what other colors are allowed to do all the time?

>>95918815
reading that decklist makes sense you're literally tutoring for all your non legend duplicates of well established bombs of lands but if it was unbanned in commander I think the game changer label would push it to high power games and timmys with bracket 3 decks that desperately need ways to win

>>95918858
>Kill your commander turn 3
Cool I guess

>>95917265
Either you are a Themporer or a Thempress, no inbetween. No exceptions.

>>95918858
pretty funny ngl

>>95918644
Got his power to 50+, killed someone in one hit, Alter of Dementia away people's librarys with him and Lord of Extinction afterward.

>>95917265
Magic is so horrible at world building, flavor text etc. that their loading screens in mtga about FF are making all of those games sound incredibly boring and bland. It's just the wotc way of doing things.

>>95918672
I normally hate commander and stay away, but vivi has me wanting to do war crimes playing storm-lists with curiousity to gain gas.

Any bm's lately?

If magic prints it I play it

>>95918889
>their loading screens in mtga about FF are making all of those games sound incredibly boring and bland
if the boot fits

>>95918890
daring today, are we

>>95918870
Drawing 4 for WW1 is pretty nice.
Drawing 4 more and searching another equipment for WW3 is also not bad.

Personally not sold on it as command zone tech, but thinking about it, it is pretty funny.

I wish there was a edh format with less cards like oatherbreaker but without the dumb planewalkers signature spell rules

>>95918910
I know it's what everyone else is doing poking around online. But all the players in my local meta want to do these days is slam creatures into each without much thought after they bitched out of constructed formats.

I want to teach them there is no escape from combo or control.

>>95918904
Yeah, doesn't work. The ff games and their worlds are great, retard. It's just the wotc coat of paint that makes it appear boring, because they're so incompetent

>>95918931
IF
THE BOOT
FITS

>>95918925
>see people having fun, but not in a way you like
>I must ruin this somehow

>>95918947
Keep seething, they/them mario throwing a blue shell is more your speed

>>95918947
THAT'S IT COWBOY. IT'S GO TIME.

>>95918870
4 mana draw 4 and get your draw engine is indeed quite good

>>95918506
Jarad + one card

>>95918955
Final Fantasy hasn't been good or cool since at least VI, and the MTG puts the large majority of its focus onto some of the lamest and gayest parts of the franchise.

Could we create a better format than edh?? I mean magic is literally turing complete. I feel like we could make a more balanced fun oriented format with rules like "NO UB cards allowed" life totals at 30 etc idk just brainstorming

>>95918806
Yes that's right anon, prime time is bad so just unban him, I won't fetch gaeas cradle and make 20 mana with it I promise

So is there a way to build this that isnt the same boring artifact loops like Teshar?

>>95918954
Should've kept playing the actual fun formats. Hell I would've even accepted limited but they don't even want to do that.

If I can't play my favorite formats I'll do the same for them.

>>95918806
Sometimes I wonder if people like this even play the format. Cyclonic Rift still lives as a posterboy of EDH as a 7 mana blue instant. CEDH isn't EDH no matter how bad you faggots want it to be.

>>95918986
all that will happen is they'll just continue not playing with you after a few tries.

>>95918968
>only 6 or older ff games are5 good
No, not even that looks interesting or not lame in mtg, so no, your point is still moot m

>>95918981
Mmmm now that's a bad ass card

>>95918993
Cool, I'm never going to dumb down my play because they want to autopilot.

>>95919000
I was being generous, VI is the only actually good Final Fantasy

>>95918991
>everyone always plays blue and every player with blue always has cyc rift and puts it in all of his decks
Good for you, I guess.

>>95917553
Is 'they' not plural to include the cat here?

>>95919008
that's nice. They just won't play with you because they want comfy kitchen table battlecruisers and you don't.

>>95919010
Keep seething, 6 is actually the worst one

>>95919014
why would the clinks and clanks of tinkering be an old comfort for a cat?

>>95918968
X was the last extremely good FF, FFXII has shit combat, FFXIII fumbles the gameplay and characters despite a great worldbuild, and I'm not even gonna touch on what's wrong with making pointless, endless MMOs which are borderline not even games.
>>95918979
Play Artifact = Make Knight
In white, where you have token doublers and blanket buffs, so why not slap in Elesh Norn and Panharmonicon to double the trigger and just make an army of dudes and glue as many keywords to them with enchantments/artifacts like Eldrazi Monument and Crashing Drawbridge.

>>95919010
It's really not that different from the others. Quit being a contrarian hipster.

>>95919017
whatever man

>>95919028
I already hate UB in all its forms, not liking most Final Fantasy games is practically tame in its hipster contrarianism

hey is anyone in this thread actually a real nerd and wanna brainstorm the logistics of creating a entirely new magic format and what that would entail?

>>95919047
Well first, anon, you would have to have an idea on what the new format should be. That's such a crucially important step one that no other work could be undertaken until such a time as the concept can be iterated on.

>>95919061
the concept is a multiplayer format that fixes everything wrong with edh which is subjective cause many people have diverse opinions on what exactly is wrong with it and makes it less enjoyable

What do you think?

>>95919078
That's not an idea. That's charitably a mission statement.

Tell me what we do with cards in this format. Do we pull them out of randomized packs and make a deck with them? Do we take them out of the packs, pick one and pass them to another player until we run out of cards? Do we bring decks we've made, and what rules do we have for putting together a deck?

Even fucking dandan has a concept behind it; your concept can't be 'fixing another format' because then you're not looking to make a format, you're looking to put your own stupid spin on an existing format you don't like under the assumption that you'll like it more.

>>95919034
I hate all mtg universe within sets, you're braindead retarded if you disagree.

>>95919061
>>95919047
40 card, singleton except basics, 3 player FFA, 20 life, decks have to be 1-2 colors at most. Color identity of your deck is decided ahead of time and you can't use cards outside of it.

>>95919098
I hate most Universes Within sets also. Magic just sucks these days, and it's UB's fault.

>>95919117
that already exists, it's called draft cube multiplayer

>>95919093
I've always had a idea since I've first heard about commander the name itself always made me think of a general commanding an army. You could create a board game type format called like General and have it be like more battle based with like any creature being the "General" and having a zone of 5 other creatures in a zone that are Lieutenants and making rules like if all your liutenants die you lose the game but the rules would have to force them out if someone successfully does 10 damage to you along those lines is stuff I've been thinking about lately

>>95919047
Unloved, a 100 variant of EDH where the cards in the 99 must each be in less than 1500 decks on edhrec.

>>95919136
it would probably have to be its own dandan where life totals don't matter and the decklists would have to be custom made for each individual player with their own themes

>>95919136
Have you ever played Warlord: Saga of the Storm?

>>95917265
this is tokenism

>>95919190
no is it just what i described?

>>95919194
No but it's worth you investigating for inspiration based on your idea.
Don't let your memes be dreams, anon.

>>95919285
>learning a game other than magic
yeah, no
fuck off shill

>>95919086
Is not going to replace Zask as my bugboy but I will be stealing things from the deck for him

Thoughts on this vibe?

>>95919329
Cool i guess

>>95919329
Shadowheart bros? Our response?

FF collector booster boxes will crash just like lotr did , just give them 6-8 months.

Chrono Trigger set when?

>>95918688
nice. i can see some potential

>>95919086
yet another boring jund commander.

>>95918644
the better meren / aerith / lathiel

>>95917253 (OP)
>We are apparently getting Legendary Vehicles as legal commanders in Edge of Eternity so I guess it's on topic.
Giving over the command of commander to WotC was a mistake. They will change the rules to fit their market schemes and you will be happy.

>>95919855
commander

>>95918203
>>95918273
>>95918319
>>95918385
>This will be the new commander stable it's so good
>HYPE HYPE HYPE
>$15
>What do you mean it's a may?
>What do you mean it only triggers once?
>What do you mean it only make one tapped treasure no matter how many cards they draw?
Who the fuck needs this so badly? Is there something I'm missing?

>>95919861
>Another monoblue artifact deck incoming
>sensei's divining top
oh lord have mercy

>>95918203
>force the game into a draw
>wincon
??

>>95917325
"He raged at the synergy, at the combos, at the power. But mostly he just raged."

>>95919888
it's the fotm bait now that people were insisting upon it couple threads ago

>>95919837
Actually love this nigga.

>>95919007
>mfw I understood that reference

There was no need to make a Legendary Kavu. Certainly not in a space set.

>>95919855
>They will change the rules to fit their market schemes
Right
>and you will be happy.
Wrong

>>95919594
Gimme three years. Expect more Suspend.

>>95919948
I thought Kavu were specifically a Dominaria thing and were like the FFVIII weapons raised by Gaea to defend the planet?

>>95919047
Yeah, so check this out: every new card past Dragons of Tarkir is illegal. Maintain most of the pre-existing Commander rules (no ante, Conspiracies, manual dexterity, uncards, etc). Make the banlist consist of The Power Nine (minus Timetwister), Channel, Fastbond, Griselbrand and Yawgmoth's Bargain. Come up with a snazzy name and bang boom pow, you've got yourself a winner.

>>95919988
The lore hasn't really mattered for about the last decade. WOTC will just use whatever they want, wherever they want.

>>95919948
>do thing get value
I HATE DESIGNSLOP
I HATE DESIGNSLOP
I HATE DESIGN SLOP

WHY THE FUCK DOES GRUUL GET TO DRAW CARDS OFF LANDFALL

>>95920014
Because everything is Commander and this is the hell the players chose.

>>95918969
You can, but nobody will play it with you.

I just preordered the Edge of Eternity display box
What are the chances of actually getting any good lands in those god awful playboosters?

>>95920014
BECAUSE GRUUL NEEDS IT
THEY NEED WHAT EVERY OTHER COLOR CAN DO BUT BETTER BECAUSE CREATURES ARE SO FUCKING HARD TO HAVE ON THE BATTLEFIELD APPARENTLY

>>95918715
It can be set free. So can Sundering Titan.

>>95917356
>removes all electricity from your body
>you die
weird

>>95918411
So you got beat up by a 2000/2002 Mesa Enchantress?

>>95918314
>>95918326
>>95918329
WOTC will make Legendary an obsolete supertype in our lifetime.

>>95918411
Jesus Christ, anon. Is it still their turn rn?

>>95918411
>The Albigensian Crusade, also known as the Cathar Crusade, was a military campaign initiated by Pope Innocent III in the 13th century to eliminate the Cathar heresy in Languedoc, southern France
wow, why isn't this highly problematic card not banned?

>>95918011
Azula's card(s) will be decidedly underwhelming.

>>95918695
Because heaven forbid every color doesn't get easy ramp.

Treasures were the biggest design mistake in this game

>>95917323
Is this you?

>>95917265
How will WOTC create a new meteor spell for this set?

>>95920047
1/9001

>>95918974
>>95918806
>prime time is bad so just unban him
This but Griselsbrand, he's a gamechanger not a wincon

>>95920054
>BECAUSE GRUUL NEEDS IT
>THEY NEED WHAT EVERY OTHER COLOR CAN DO BUT BETTER
This is more of a Green issue. Red is just along for the ride, in this instance.

>>95917265
Why yes the Edge of Eternity was closed off from the rest of the multiverse and they have completely alien concepts of society, which is why they have preferred pronouns. Fuck this shit, FF was a nice reprieve from all this nonsense, guess were back to regularly scheduled programming

>>95920116
I'm already highly considering just buying the lands as singles, since it'll be half the pice of buying the display box. It'll depend on what else is in the box.

>>95920131
True, only thing red provide is haste everything else green provides themselves.

>>95917265
I remember being appalled by the majority of art when I first bought the Shadowrun 5e core rulebook. I thought to myself, 'all of this looks like the awkward and borderline disgusting circus art you usually see on gypsy attractions'. But later I found out that this sickness of depicting humans and humanoids as uncanny skinwalkers with child-predator-smiles is found in nearly ALL modern publishing, especially in the p&p sector.
Nobody looks at this shit and goes "yeah that's super cool, give me more of that". They are clearly doing it because they have no other choice, because all of this dogshit artists are leftoid bootlickers that get hired based on their political ideals instead of skill. And now they are stuck with whatever this faggot dogshit is. Forever.

>>95920054
>>95920131
The crazy thing is green already has so much fucking draw power. I played against a monogreen deck a couple weeks ago and it was literally just simic without counterspells, it's gotten so out of control.

And in gruul specifically, so much of green's draw power cares about creatures entering or the power of creatures. Garruk's Uprising, Season of Growth, Beast Whisperer- but no they need a fucking landfall trigger draw now too.
It's just crazy to me that every color gets ridiculous designslop "do thing draw card" except fucking white. In white it has to be
>opponent does thing, draw card, ONCE PER TURN!!! NO VALUE FOR YOU! WHITE IS THE FAIR COLOR, IT'S NOT ENOUGH THAT YOU'RE ALREADY HAVING TO WAIT FOR YOUR OPPONENT TO DO SOMETHING, YOU ALSO CAN'T GET VALUE EQUAL TO THE VALUE YOU THEY'RE GETTING BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT FAIR MEANS!!!!

>>95920180
As another anon said: white is the cuck color in magic

>>95918806
Here's the question: why are you so eager for PT to get unbanned when his effect isn't unique. We already have lots of "Whenever creature enters/attacks/does combat damage put land onto battlefield" cards put there, and PT isn't legendary so it's not like you're losing out on a deck build either.

>>95918806
counterpoint, what about Sylvan Primordial?
the reason is because
I own a Sylvan Primordial and not a Primeval Titan.

>>95918806
If you think it's too slow you've lost your marbles

>>95920180
Frankly white's gotten more draw engines in the past few years than it's ever had before
>Caretaker's Talent, Enduring Innocence, Bennie Bracks, Tocasia's Welcome, Minas Tirith, Trouble in Pairs, Rumor Gatherer, Dawn of a New Age, The Gaffer, Chivalric Alliance, Firemane Commando
Obviously it still has very little and is cucked by once per turn clauses, but compared to it's come a long fucking way from putting all the burden for card draw on crappy artifacts like Mind's Eye or old and mold Mentor of the Meek. It's getting there.

>>95920277
cute robit

>No new class cards in FIN
>No new backgrounds in FIN
What were they thinking...

>>95920266
I got one of these in a pack. Thinkin maybe it's time we just go ahead and unban it :)

>>95918671
The only vehicle that's worth running as commander.

>>95920291
I asked one of the commander panel IRL and she said it's probably not ever being unbanned.
It being a gamechanger wouldnt do anything to stop it's power without ballooning the GC list with all the very good lands that primetime can tutor for you.
Dark depths and thespian stage was an example she gave, getting yourself a 20/20 flying indestructible creature on turn 4 is what the worry is, not just ramping with basic lands.
>>95920224
He wants it because its not basic lands like most land tutors are restricted to.

>>95920277
>caretaker's talent
kek, I remember my friend gifting that card to me because he had no use for it. I put it in my rocco street chef deck to great success.
gifted it back to him when it reached 10€+ value; using a proxy since then

I cast Crop Rotation finding Tabernacle

>>95920286
Needed to make room for the 30 clouds and sephiroths sorry

>>95920669
Fucking thankfully. Since 50% of the releases are UBslop it's just best we can move past them as fast as we can.

>>95920683
I can't wait for my new IU slop with ugly space ai art

>old LGS location
>random pairings for pods
>makes it so everyone knows everyone
>maybe you dislike some players, but it's all luck of the draw and there's a lot of variety to games
>post-COVID LGS moves to new location
>switches to fill and fire
>store is suddenly loaded with newfags who have no clue how to play
>low quality opinions are parroted from their favorite content creators
>"people" are cracking collectors boxes left and right
>because it's fill and fire now you can see the pods forming in advance
>you can see all the (sometimes literal) retards or sweats you might join into and avoid them
>end up waiting an hour+ until I find a pod of pleasant players or people I don't recognize
I miss my LGS doing random pairings like you wouldn't believe.

>>95920711
It's UW chucklefuck, and besides the They/Them spoiled they cards are pretty so far.

>>95918911
its WW2 tho, because you still have to pay the equip cost. Draw 4 for 4 is a great rate even in blue tho, outside of blue it's totally nutty.

>>95919874
Final Fantasy prices are wildly overinflated

>>95919948
>alright it's a Gruul legendary
>uhhhh
>Landfall and a ping
>also throw in a card draw, who gives a shit

>>95920047
you'll probably get at least a few

>>95920081
it already mostly doesn't matter since non-Commander formats mostly don't matter

>>95919155
This is one of the worst ideas I've ever read

>>95920127
I can understand arguments to unban Prime Time even if I strenuously disagree with them

anyone who thinks Grizzlebrizzle should be unbanned is either a drooling retard or an investorfag who bought a pile of this showcase and wants it to spike to the moon

>>95920224
there are very few land tutors that can get nonbasics, and even fewer that can get untyped nonbasics

>>95919314
Unhinged behaviour
>I WANNA MAKE X
>LOOK AT Y ITS SIMILAR TO X
>REEEEEE SHILL REEEEE

>>95920127
>Griselbrand unban
Fuck no.
>Fairly new to magic in general and EDH
>Entire group is, except 1 guy, who's been playing magic for 10 years
>He talks about some new cards he put into his deck
>Among those, Griselbrand
>"Hey isn't Griselbrand banned?"
>"Huh, oh yeah it is, so it seems"
>Read up that it's because people always reanimate it super early
>"Nah I'm not a degenerate combo player I'm not doing that don't worry"
>Shuffle up for our first game of the day
>Guy tutors Griselbrand into his yard and reanimates him
>Then takes 20+ minutes doing the activated ability to look through over a third of his deck
>Still beat him after a long game
>All just give him the look.tm
>Guy tries to backpedal saying it only happened this time
>"Nah. Take it out."
>Begrudgingly does so
I'm not trusting any of you niggers with Griselbrand. Good riddance.

Are they going to do a special edition of Final Fantasy just like they did for Lord of the rings

If I sac this guy to pay an emerge cost could I then use the 4 mana he makes from dying to pay for the rest of a colorless emerge cost for a total of 8?

>>95920869
Anyone else notice that it's always combofags doing this shit

>>95920277
>Obviously it still has very little and is cucked by once per turn clauses
Yeah thats the fucking problem. And you're here saying it's an improvement.
Meanwhile the whole reason this conversation began is a gruul card now has fucking landfall draw. No blue in sight. No impulse draw. No leaning into the core of the fucking color pair (big creatures).
Can you imagine if fucking white got that? Whenever you gain life, draw a card. Why not?
>oh but the gruul card was a once per turn draw!
It's a soft once per turn. You'll note that it didn't say it triggers for the 2nd land you play that turn, its the 2nd instance of the landfall trigger. So if you just happened to make copies of the creature, something red is more than capable of doing, and played multiple lands that turn, you'd keep getting the draw trigger.

>>95920986
>sacrificing a creature AND paying the cost
No. They happen simultaneously.

>>95920999
Griselbrand IS a combo card. What are you even going to do with "when this enters, draw 35 cards" other then that?

>>95920714
You have posted this exact story in these threads before.

>>95920127
>>95920830
>>95920869
trust me griselbrand is perfectly fine
time vault is perfectly fine too
if you unban them i promise i will play them fairly and unproblematically and not exile them with cage counters on them
wizard's honor

>>95921010
so this then is only referring to additional costs rather than a replacement cost

>>95920277
>>95921006
Its not a problem at all I never have less than 7 cards in my hand with my white decks
>once per turn
It is hard once per turn it can only resolve a second time once unless clone/whatever him. The same applies to whites once per turn idiot and white is better at it

>>95921028
Yeah, it's much easier to sac a carrot cake on the enemy turn then slap lands on the board on the enemy turn.

>>95921014
attack someone with it
-Sincerely, Timmy<\spoiler>

>>95921017
Fuck off, every week I have to relieve it while missing how it used to work.

>>95920830
You’re completely right, let’s unban recurring nightmare instead.

>>95921028
>>once per turn
>It is hard once per turn it can only resolve a second time once unless clone/whatever him
Yeah that's called a soft once per turn, retard.
As I already said, a hard once per turn would be that the trigger is tied to something that happened regardless of whether the card saw it. For example Monologue Tax cares about the 2nd spell your opponents cast each turn. If somehow Monologue Tax hit the field after they had cast their 2nd spell, you won't get the trigger if they then cast 2 more spells while it's on the field. There can only be one 2nd spell per turn. Hard once per turn.

>>95921068
No you fuck off with howling your sob story at strangers

How much do you think stores will be charging for End of Eternities Collector Boxes?

My wives boyfriend is taking her out for dinner on my birthday, and I was thinking of begging him to pick one up for me.

>>95921099
now there's an unban with some chest hair

Path of exile is the most overrated staple.
Ramping your opponents is a bad move no matter how you slice it.

>>95921194
It's not overrated because ramping them late game doesn't matter at all

>>95921194
most people would rather have a big bomb removal target than a basic land

>>95921194
doesn't matter if they get to ramp if they die this turn

>>95921194
If you are casting Path on something that's worth less than a land you are stupid.

>>95921194
I only run Swords in white. Path just not worth it

>>95921046
Literally yeah it is
>>95921101
No. The card itself is once per turn unless you Literally make it a new permanent just like whites. You are unbelievably bad at the game if the kavu makes you upset

What are some mono coloured commanders that'll make people think i'm a cool dude?

>>95921347
If you blink the card, you get the triggers all over again, you don’t have to copy it.
Again, you fundamentally do not understand that a trigger tied to something that can only physically happen once per turn is a hard once per turn, and anything that has to see the triggering event to trigger is a soft once per turn because you can do any number of things to reset the count.
It’s why Omnath Locus of Creation is so busted. You use the mana he produces from the second landfall trigger to blink him and then play more cards that let you play additional lands

>>95921381
all those blink spells in RG

>>95921390
>omnath is only rg

>>95921404
yeah Omnath's extra colors are really relevant to a RG creature like Tannuk

>>95921375
If by cool you mean, cold, as in should be stabbed and left for dead.

Why is it that whenever I sit down for a game and do end up losing, it's always to cringe gameplans. I have a pretty good win rate despite my personal restrictions (no combos, no time warps, only three game changers). But so often it seems that when I do lose, it's to some guy playing a kill on sight commander that slipped through? Or a dedicated combo that he tutored for with the table tapped out?

The wins are never anything interesting. It's always "cast this big x spell, game," or "you're all dead from x."

>>95921432
confirmation bias, you paradoxically remember the "unimpressive" losses more clearly because they provoked a stronger emotional reaction

>>95921432
>Why is it that whenever I sit down for a game and do end up losing, it's always to cringe gameplans
Because you probably play at a really high powerlevel despite your arbitrary restrictions

>>95921390
And? You don’t have to run the gruul spell as your Commander you fucking tard

>>95921375
Most monored things.

>>95920801
Vehicles can be commanders, colors mean nothing anymore, cats are chasing dogs and the world has gone mad

>>95917265
The robot is cute and the only people mad about pronouns spend way too much time thinking about them and I'm tired of saying otherwise.
Otherwise this is a really bland uncommon.

>>95921462
Well that's just not true.

>>95921631
You must be if you always stomp other "fair" decks

>>95921432
You sure your own wins aren't similar to those you're complaining about? Often enough players are blinded by how much they'd hate seeing the exact decks they're playing if someone else was doing it.

>>95921432
The problem is you're losing in the first place.

>>95920830
>>95920869
>>95921021
I just want him in my demon tribal Rakdos deck, I don't care if he's broken. He's my poor lost boy and I need him to come home, the demons are already broken he's power just means the game ends faster.
>bought a pile of this showcase and wants it to spike to the moon
I got a normal one in innistrad remastered

But all jokes aside he should stay banned and you guys make good arguments against him. I too hate with a passion combofags. I just want to ruin someone's day with my demon deck if they deserve it and he would make a perfect addition to the horror.

>>95920014
>extremely basic landfall trigger
>DESIGN SLOP
you're seriously so braindamaged that you're hating on regular shit

>>95921432
>only three game changers
You lost me there chief.

>>95921661
brother you already have plenty of ways to ruin someone's day with with your big Rakdos demons

you even have Fair Griselbrand just sitting there waiting for you to notice him

>>95919988
It's implied Kavu have been buried under the earth for thousands of years on Dominaria. There's a myth Yavimaya made them but it's not confirmed.
>>95919948
>>95920014
>>95920801
I'm more mad that they continue the trend of making undercosted legends with 4+ toughness so they can't be bolted or hit by aggro because dying fast to swings or damage is haram

>>95921668
>three mana 2/4 with generic upside
it's just fuckin lazy

>>95921691
He's aldready in the deck yeah I love his little smile.
>plenty of ways to ruin someone's day with with your big Rakdos demons
Indeed, more than enough, but Griselbrand would be the cherry on top.

>>95921718
It's so hard to even argue with you because you didn't even make an argument. You just listed the things on the card, called it "generic", and then said it was lazy.
What do you want me to do here? Point out that there's nothing wrong with the card having Landfall in the land-focused set? Or maybe that Landfall is a normal Gruul thing? Maybe that not every card has to be the newest and most innovative card in the world with 1000 lines of rules text? It's simple, it's clean, it even provides a one-time per turn upside if you're doing the thing. It's straight up Sabotender but better, what is the problem? What did you want? 4 different landfall triggers? three more colors? What would make YOU happy, anon? Oh right, you haven't been happy in years and shitting on neat little cardboard toys makes you feel so critical and smart and different from the pack despite you just being depressed with no outlet for your impotent aggression.

>>95921432
>Only three game changers
>"Only" the maximum number of game changers allowed in the bracket that explicitly unlocks availability for unlimited tutors and the most overloaded to shit cards in the game
>"Man why am I only ever losing to tutors and overloaded to shit cards?"
You're playing the wrong bracket if you don't want to go against an endless wave of cards that need to be instantly answered.

>>95921760
NTA but it's boring because it presents only upsides with no effort. Any decks with it at hte head will be incredibly same-y and very boring

>>95921775
>presents only upsides with no effort
as opposed to what?
>no effort
it looks like to even draw a single card you need to have multiple lands hitting per turn, which sounds like it requires you to have specific pieces to get that upside.

>>95921794
>2/4, so it evades most damage
>4 toughness means most creatures can't kill it in a swing, so it's a very good blocker in addition to its abilities
>2 power though, so it also can't get through someone else's boring commander.
It's boring because it offers no drawbacks or thought to play around. It's based around the idea of playing commanders of similar p/t and ability and sitting there for thirty turns doing fuck all.

>>95921819
>No drawbacks means boring
Do you find like 99% of the commanders in the game boring then?

>>95920014
>do thing get value
Kinda how the game has always worked no

>>95921760
(nta)
Because it's a commander that rewards you for a game action so basic that 99.9% of decks were already aiming to do it, and rewards you with wincon pressure+resources. Aesi and Tatyova were notoriously touted as the biggest simic slop commanders for having "Landfall - Draw a card" and this card is very similar in Gruul, trading part of its card draw for damage.
Landfall isn't exactly a strategy that's struggling either, given the existence of fetches meaning you can consistently double up on them while fixing yourself in the safest way possible. The legality of cards like Burgeoning and even Exploration combined with the restriction of answers like Blood Moon also mean it's trickier to answer a landfall strategy because you're not able to play the best cards for flipping the script on them and forcing out reactive play instead of letting them be on offense the whole game.
Landfall just simply isn't a strategy that needs more support.

>>95921827
is that not the general vibe of this thread

"do thing draw card" is practically a dirty word

>>95921661
I don't really have a problem with combofags. It's taking a goddamn eon to finish your turn. Same with Izzet players. I'm cool with some 20storm count. But don't make it take 20 minutes and then fumble and lose anyway.
Players that only start thinking about what to do the moment it is their turn tilt me. Of course it's understandable for new players and when you're piloting a complex deck you're playing for the first time. But when you've been playing a deck for half a year and still take 5 minutes to do play land play a 1-drop, then you need to get shot.

>>95921642
I literally never go infinite, never just drop a crackle with power or some other stupid effect that wins the game outright. I like winning with context on the board. Either a commanding board state or simply lethaling someone.

>>95920014
Come up with a better design that doesn't give value
What's that? You can't? Probably because a commander is not worth playing if it doesn't provide value

>>95921867
>It's taking a goddamn eon to finish your turn. Same with Izzet players. I'm cool with some 20storm count. But don't make it take 20 minutes and then fumble and lose anyway.
This. The only reason other decks don't get as much hate is because it's really hard to sweat over turning a dude sideways.

>>95921772
The game changers are almost immaterial. If I cut them the decks would still eat precons alive just by virtue of not being a heap of cards.

>>95921884
>R/G/1
>2/2
>landfall - deal 1 damage to each opponent. If this is the second time this ability has resolved this turn, return a land you control to its owner's hand.
Fixed it for you.

>>95921884
rofl the point is it's lazy-ass "value" just for playing a fetchland you retard

>>95921874
What are you playing?

>>95921906
rofl the point is that nobody plays commanders that don't provide value retard

>>95921914
>deliberately missing the point
Woman behavior

>>95921919
Stop talking about yourself

>>95921914
here's a popular commander that provides massive value but has several drawbacks instead of just being generically overall good

>>95921914
>rofl the point is that nobody plays commanders that don't provide value retard
He's so close to getting the point......

>>95921914
>>95921933
ha ha whoops

>>95921853
>this card is very similar in Gruul
>one card
>per turn
>ONLY on the second land
>COMPARABLE TO TATYOVA OR AESI
hahhahahahaha you're a fucking brainrotted retard

>>95921899
>lets you do the effect repeatedly without even having to dig for lands
this is STRONGER and MORE slop

>>95917938
What did jotc do to the fomori? I'm lost

Landfall really fucking mind breaks people apparently
>Oh you get value for doing something you're already doing!
That's literally 90% of the game is trying to get more value out of actions you want to take
The fact that>>95919948 is even being discussed as "high value" and "design slop" shows you how retarded this general is, it's the most mild fucking card in the world and it won't have any impact

>>95921819
>sitting there for thirty turns doing fuck all.
Sounds pretty nice though, I enjoy just sitting back and let everyone pay me a share of their turn without doing anything but profit.

>>95922058
>one retard spergs about anons rightly calling out boring-ass commanders with no downsides. Proceeds to melt-down.
Sad

>>95922076
>rightly calling out boring-ass commanders with no downsides.
You're retarded if you think there's "no downside". The downside is that it's not a strong card or commander at all

Making an Old Phyrexia deck but want a commnader that's not such crazy value as Yawgmoth, Kerrick, or Gix. Looking at Volrath or maybe Keskit but I'm not sure who would be thematically appropriate to partner him with.

>>95921977
the damage happens for every land regardless, you only get the card draw once

>>95921668
>the literal definition of designslop
>"why are you calling it designslop?????"

Anons here apparently live in magical Christmas land where you can flicker in g/r and play 10 lands per turn. I never thought that a shitty uncommon would be the card that broke the schizos

>>95921965
>Red card doesn't draw as much as blue card, therefore it is bad
No anon, you are the one with brainrot. "Uninteresting card that demands reactive gameplay from opponents the entire game while demanding nothing from its user" is not the same as "broken card that's warping the game." I'm sorry you feel a need to defend landfall as a strategy like it's your personal brainchild though. It's a decent entry point for novice players because it's so easy to build and pilot, but it genuinely isn't something that should see more support.

>>95922116
Did you make this picture yourself kek
The word "designslop" is slop and each of your posts is meaningless slop

>>95922116
Wow you put a lot of effort into this power point presentation of how you don't understand design at all!
>Kresh of all cards
lol
fucking lmao
see >>95921760
you look like a retard

Some cards are basic and some strategies are simple. Not every commander needs to be intrincate

>>95922116
>Triggered abilities are design slop
>Kresh
Bro your opinion literally fucking sucks rofl

>>95921760
here's a simple and clean design that encourages a somewhat unique archetype without directly enabling it or just being a list of generic effects for its colors.

>>95922144
This is slop actually

>>95922116
you leave Kresh out of this

>>95922118
>it's really shitty that gruul is now getting card draw for landfall. This is not part of the gruul identity and represents a general trend towards rewarding players for doing things they were going to do anyway, in colors that already have no issue with draw power because of hard once per turns, meanwhile white is absolutely suffering for draw and WotC doesn't give a shit
>"durrrrr but da gwuul one is a hard once per turn!!!!!"
>no the fuck it isn't. A hard once per turn is a trigger tied to an effect that can only happen once per turn like casting a 2nd card. A trigger that only cares the 2nd time it sees something happen is a soft once per turn because you can copy or blink it and just trigger it again
>"durrrrrrrr but dere not blink in gruul!!!!!"

You're impressively retarded anon. Did you get a crash helmet with your diagnosis?

>>95917795
Here's my cedh deck

>>95922125
>>95922135
>>95922148
>Kresh apologists.
Black: sacrifice
Green: +1/+1s
Red: power

I'm sorry you enjoyed designslop, but that's what it is.

>>95922148
I use Kresh as the Conan analogue in my REH pulp fantasy inspired deck, and he's the most soulful design I've ever enjoyed. Anyone who calls Kresh slop has a learning disability and occupies their spare time by chewing on rocks and small pebbles

>>95922156
"you can blink it" is in fact not a valid argument when referring to a color that sucks shit at blinking.
>but you can put it omnath
Yeah, Omnath is totally going to ephemerate THIS to get ONE EXTRA CARD on the condition of putting two extra land drops after this. Totally.

>>95922116
>These are all trigger abilities starting with "whenever"
I just can't even imagine being this wrong about how the game works and what constitutes a bad design
I'm so curious though, did you make this yourself just to poison the well?

>>95922170
Oh my god, this retarded faggot just hates everything that isn't a fucking vanilla Legends creature with no text. We get it, you're a hipster, nobody cares nigga. Go dilate before your neovagina scabs over again.

>>95922130
I agree to an extent although I feel "Landfall" is really pushing the envelope for how simple a "strategy" can be, given how every deck is generally trying to play lands and most benefit from maximum fetch count.

>>95922170
I'm convinced you're actually retarded if you're taking this image seriously

>>95921977
see >>95922101 but it doesn't surprise me you can't read as well as being dumb

>slop
>People are actually responding to it
It's a low IQ retard or bait guys, always.

>>95922189
I do agree on it lending itself top easily to "whenever you get value, get more value" piles, but I feel that you can do interesting things with Landfall. Land-matters is a design space I like a lot

>another schizo to add to the list after bm schizo
Damn son, just how many are we at? Anyone keeping a running list?

>>95922221
>he's retarded
oh no...
The point is that getting to put a land back in your hand in a landfall deck means you aren't even tutoring or digging for lands, you just get one back every single time.

>>95922178
>"you can blink it" is in fact not a valid argument when referring to a color that sucks shit at blinking.
Cool, that was never the fucking point you backwards spastic.

The conversation went
>gruul should not draw from landfall.
>green is overpowered for drawing as it is
>meanwhile white is constantly struggling for draw because Wizards hates white
>anon posts Caretakers Talent, concedes that it's still shit because it's a once per turn
>yes, that's the problem, plus most white draw is a hard once per turn. the gruul card might as well say "play land draw card" because as a soft once per turn it is abusable
>retard says it's a hard once per turn
>gets the difference between soft and hard once per turn several fucking times
>"durrrrrrrr gruul can't blink tho!!!!!"
The question of whether it's a hard or soft once per turn is fucking irrelevant to whether you can blink it if it's your commander and you're restricted to gruul colors.

For one thing, Conjurers Closet is colorless, so yeah you can blink it in gruul, fuck off newplayer.
But in either case, the colors you use to build the deck have nothing to do with the fucking mechanics of the game. If something only trigger once a turn because it is tied to something that never happens more than once in any fucking context, like casting your 2nd spell per turn, that is a hard once per turn. That is the meaning of the term. Fucking deal with it.

>>95922187
>Oh my god, this retarded faggot just hates everything that isn't a fucking vanilla Legends creature with no text
Oh my god you're this retarded faggot who completely misconstrues every post he doesn't agree with
Read the fucking text in this image. >>95922116
What does it fucking say anon? Does it say all cards should be vanillas? Does it say that? Or does it say designslop is bad because it doesnt give creatures effects that are creative and more than the sum of its colors?

I bet you're also the moron who gets mad when I break out picrel and demolish the whole table.

>>95922238
>>gruul should not draw from landfall.
why? green can do it. red pings from landfall, green draws fron landfall. there you go, gruul. red thing + green thing.
>>green is overpowered for drawing as it is
delusional.
>>meanwhile white is constantly struggling for draw because Wizards hates white
after modern horizons 3 this shit should have been dead and buried. what an insane statement.

>>95922182
>>These are all trigger abilities starting with "whenever"
Rem is an "if", but yeah "whenever" is a pretty good indicator of whether something will be design slop because it is the template for "do thing get value". Why do you think this is some kind of gotcha?

>>95922272
>>>green is overpowered for drawing as it is
>delusional.
Nice way to out the fact you haven't played against a monogreen deck in the last 2 years, faggot.

>>95922272
>Green should draw from landfall

>>95922234
Anti-Ub-schizo
Proxy-schizo
Swordbro
Bm-schizo
Hat-schizo
Sorcery-schizo

This new guy: design-schizo? DesignSlop-schizo?

>>95922281
Do you think your little PowerPoint presentation is some sort of gotcha?

>>95922292
It does less draw then blue and black, but more then white and red and usually dependant on creatures. The perfect spot for it, really.

>>95922306
>DesignSlop-schizo?
I approve. Do we include basiclands-schizo on here? He sperged out for like 36 hours that one time, or do we only include people that regularly post here?

>>95922411
Yeah we should add basicLands-schizo to the list

>>95921419
I didn't realize that card existed

>>95922306
>tfw still known poster not labeled as schizo
Feels good knowing I was right all along.

>>95922238
>white
>struggling for draw
What year are you living in?

Bm-schizo is my new favorite schizo

>>95922472
Alright which one are you? Anti-mill? Anti-infect? Come clean anon, we won't judge you.

>>95922472
Who are you????? This is the second time you've posted this at least

hi, i am looking for a ytube channel where 4 players play fairly strong/cedh decks.
plenty of those to go around but my issue is a channel without pronouns/sòy/onions all over the screen.
any suggestions?

>>95922472
>Unlabeled schizo

>>95922510
Sadly no such thing they are all pozzed

>>95922496
>>95922499
If I tell you then I'll just be put on the list. That's no fun at all because then it ruins the game.

>>95922281
>triggered abilities are bad design
Yeah, you're retarded.

>>95922518
Technically the same poster but not what I was known for.

>>95922537
Ah delusions of grandeur anon.

>>95922574
Getting warmer.

>>95918870
>>95918958
wouldn't cloud already be dead by the time skullclamp triggers?

>>95922542
No. Triggered abilities that boil each color down to a handful of mechanics and then just tick them off for each color on the card is bad design.
Queza is the perfect example of this
>white: gain life
>black: lose life
>blue: draw card
>Whenever you draw a card, target opponent loses 1 life and you gain 1 life.
Could we have had something creative instead? Could we have explored esper as its own identity rather than just being a pile of 3 individual colors? No, that would require effort. So instead print the fucking slop, and some retard somewhere will defend it to the hilt anyway.

Design that could be done by writing triggers on scraps of paper for each color and then pulling them from a hat is bad design.

>>95922583
He is equipped as the dies trigger goes. If equipment detached before a creature died, Skullclamp wouldn't work to begin with.

>>95922585
So... it's bad design because "I dont like it"?
Got it. I'd love to hear what you would consider Esper's "identity" that has nothing to do with Black, White, or Blue. Go on, tell me. I really wanna hear about how you somehow divorced the design of Esper cards entirely from their innate colors and it can't be connected even through extreme reductiveness to the original colors.

>>95922585
>Could we have broken the color pie instead?

>>95922306
>i-it's all one guy!
How about the schizo-schizo who can't stand dissenting opinions?

>>95922585
>Could we have had something creative instead? Could we have explored esper as its own identity rather than just being a pile of 3 individual colors
we could, and they have. but there also needs to be simple designs. Queza makes drawing cards into a wincon of its own so you gotta think: how do I draw the most cards?
for every Volrath there needs to be Grumgully. simple pieces are good for this game. there needs to be a balance of simple and complex pieces.

>>95922585
>why do things within the bounds of the color pie?
>why doesnt it say whenever you play a land it does 1 damage to each opponent but in esper????
Starting to think you dislike magic

>>95922636
Sounds like you made the list kek

>>95922642
This. Hating simple, easy to use designs is basically begging for complex-creep where cards have 10 lines of text. Sometimes I want a very simple payoff that makes me build around it.

>>95922636
The one where the entire thread responds to him telling him he's a fucking retard and he acts like it's a single person samefagging? I'm down

Are there any high interaction commanders that aren't oppressive?

>>95922681
Celestial Toymaker

>>95922585
Post a commander that you think has a good design

>>95922480
What are your favourite white draw spells anon?
>Helpful Hunter - etb draw 1
>Mentor of the Meek - low power synergy, pay 1 to draw 1
>Welcoming Vampire - low power synergy, draw 1 once per turn
>Mangara the Diplomat - relies on opponents to take actions, hard once per turn on second effect
>Tocasia's Welcome - low mana synergy, draw 1 once per turn
>Alms Collector - relies on opponents to take actions
>Archivist of Oghma - relies on opponents to take actions
>Beza the Bounding Spring - catch up mechanic
>Cut a Deal - everyone draws
>Enduring Innocence - low power synergy, draw 1 once per turn
Meanwhile literally every other color can draw as much as they want without constraint. If you don't think this is a problem I just don't think you play to be honest

>>95922660
You're already on the list

>>95920848
And that's good. There already is a problem with non-basics making 3+ color decks a breeze to run. Lans tutoring should never find anything but basics.

>>95922703
?

>>95922618
>So... it's bad design because "I dont like it"?
No its bad design for the reasons I explained it was bad design.
It is lazy and could just as easily be "designed" completely at random.>>95922618
>I'd love to hear what you would consider Esper's "identity" that has nothing to do with Black, White, or Blue.
You know how I know you're samefagging? Because you said the exact same fucking thing in multiple posts:
>>95922631
>>95922646
Nowhere did I say cards need to break the color pie. You're acting like some kind of histrionic faggot.
What I said was creative design means exploring the combination of colors as an identity of its own rather than just being a pile of its constituent colors. I don't know why this was so controversial to you that you had to samefag about it.
I'm starting to wonder if maybe you're on the Wizards "design" team honestly.

And to answer your question, the esper identity typically involves enchantments or breaking the "rules" of the game a little.
>Aminatou giving everything miracle
>Zur making enchantments into creatures
>Sen Triplets letting you play from other people's hands
This makes sense because the constituent colors lend themselves to power and control, so creating interactions that don't normally exist in the game is thematic for when the colors are combined.
I don't think a single fucking thing I've said has been ambiguous, cards ought to be designed creatively instead of just being a soup of keywords and triggers.

>>95922768
Game changer.

Every table I saw at the LGS last night had a Vivi or a Cloud or a Yshtola. How the fuck can people enjoy these linear decks?

>>95922776
What are you talking about?

>>95922792
They're the same people ITT defending designslop. They literally don't care what's printed on a card as long as it tickles their pickle.

>>95922769
It sounds like you have a particular idea of what Esper's identity is and want every Esper card to conform to that identity.

>>95922792
Because they're fun

>>95922800
See you didn't even know and had to look it up

>>95922769
You have bizarrely specific ideas about this game that aren't really shared by anyone else, including the designers

>>95922819
Yes I did know, i pulled up the image to show you.
Why are you being silly

>>95922306
There are no proxyschizos. You just outed yourself as antiproxyschizo

>>95922808
No I have this particular idea that combinations of colors have their own identities rather than just being a checklist of their constituent parts.
If you enjoy cards designed with the method in the pic here >>95922170 no one can stop you from enjoying that, but I can call you a drooling retard.

>>95922811
lol

>>95922827
Hmm good point, it should be anyi-proxy schizo

>>95922792
I won't need a convoluted flowchart to have fun

>>95922769
Okay, so YOU play your intrincate designs reflecting this particular theme. They make cards for you all the time. Other people can also want a simple payoff that is supposed to be built around to maximize value. Like I said earlier Queza turns draw into damage, so a Queza deck is asking the question
>"how do I maximize draw without decking out"
and that is a fun question to answer. that's it. a card being multicolor doesn't behold it to a special identity separate from its constituent colors. sometimes a Gruul card can be just red and green instead of a special third thing. That is literally just fucking fine.

>>95922857
>Other people can also want a simple payoff
Simple minded perhaps

>>95922769
>the phrase "color pie" means people are samefagging
lmao if that makes you feel more secure in your bad opinion

>>95922832
>No I have this particular idea that combinations of colors have their own identities rather than just being a checklist of their constituent parts.
Well, that idea is simply wrong. They can be both. There is nothing wrong with a card that is RB being a bit black, a bit red instead of finding an unique niche. There are pieces in this game that are meant to be simple to play around with.

>>95922864
I can't believe I'm talking to a genuine atheist right now

>>95922850
>does thing and draws a card
>oh my BASEDENCE I'm having so much fun with my Final Fantasy precon

>>95922869
>don't say shit about breaking the color pie
>are in fact very clear that color combinations should have their own identities more than the sum of their parts
>1 retard either can't read or can't comprehend
>posts 3 (THREE) times asserting you said something you clearly didn't
>get caught out
>try to deny it by acting smug
Lmao if that makes you feel more secure in your bad opinion :)

Unban Dockside

>>95922894
mindbroken

any fun card advantage for boros that aren't the usual suspects?

>he thinks I'm gonna play Vivi
>he thinks I'm gonna play Y'shota-lover
>he thinks I'm gonna play Teedus
>he thinks I'm gonna play Yurine
I'm too busy being a Golbez Chad. Yes, my turns WILL take 20 minutes of me making a clue and surveiling again. Yes I WILL make you watch me check each individual card. Yes I WILL debate for over a whole minute on each and every single surveil even if the answer is obvious.

>>95922893
Oh, you're actually mentally ill, my bad for responding to you.

>>95922920
So based...

>>95922259
Name a commander you like and explain how it isn't hipster garbage or "design slop". You can't.

>>95922920
>heh, I don't play your average everyday slop
>I play this OTHER slop
Prognosis is terminal retardation. Bullet through your skull, stat.

>>95922902
Oh did you want the last word? You're going to have to try harder than that

>>95922920
>Golbez chads literally RULE this thread
i kneel

>>95922955
>>95922696
I'm sure there's some reddit debate name for what you're trying to do.
In a conversation about design that is bad I don't need to post design that is good. I don't see why I would let you divert the conversation just so you can welch and nitpick something I ascribe value to.
Either you can defend the design I have criticized, or you can't. Which is it?

>>95922994
your critique lacks value or logic, so we're attempting to ascertain how fucked up your view of value is.

>>95922994
>Weaseled out of naming a commander because he doesn't want to get made fun of
womp-womp.

>>95922792
Name what commanders they should play instead. I'll wait

>guy sits down + shuffles up with Vivi
>have the comfy excuse of targeting the one UB player at the table because his commander is kill on sight
>spend the whole game cajoling the table to deal with him because "if he untaps his commander, we lose," until he's dead
Felt so good

>>95922994
If you have such strong opinions about bad design then you should be able to name a single good design. You can't. Your opinion comes off as childish and uninformed. You have an irrational hatred of triggered abilities, that's it

>>95922920
>NOOO YOU HAVE TO RUN TERRA OR YUNA FOR A SAGA/SUMMON DECK
No. I remove a counter and keep my Urza's Saga at lore 1.

>>95923010
How about legendaries that don't reward you for breathing? No I will not be spoonfeeding you.

>>95923000
>your critique lacks value or logic
It doesn't, it just makes you mad
>>95923006
Try harder
>>95923025
>then you should be able to name a single good design
And I can. But I have no reason to do it for you, because you're seeking a diversion.
Like I said, either you can defend the design I criticized or you can't. If you can't defend it, then trying to flip the script and criticize things I say I like won't help you, no matter how much you'll proclaim it a victory.

>>95923032
>I can not name a single commander to back up my position of what a well designed commander is because I am just regurgitating meme opinions
ftfy

>>95923034
>complexity creep good
>simple cards bad
>every single card needs to be a creative new design never before seen but also fit into these extremely specific views I have of color identity
you really don't know when you stop

>>95923034

>Like I said
Everyone has already ripped to shred your criticisms, I don't need to do anything. If anything, I was giving you a chance to redeem your bad opinions and you're not taking it

>>95923040
I get that you're super excited because you just bought your first precons and are starting to learn Commander, but as you mature in the game you'll come to realize those cards are stepping stones before you play real decks.

>>95923034
>try harder
You first, name a single commander that fits your nebulous standards.

>>95923032
>admitting you have nothing

>>95923040
See >>95923034, you low IQ paintdrinker
>>95923051
Why does anything about it have to be complex? Unless you're conceding that designslop is simple, only a stone's throw from lazy
>>95923052
>Everyone has already ripped to shred your criticisms,
Lel what cope
>>95923059
Huh?

>>95923017
>>95922920
>built a Vivi deck
>swapped Vivi with Shantotto
It seems you are out of luck. For my unblockable commander cock you shall suck

>>95923064
>huh?
Ironic you are calling anyone else low iq,
Post a single commander that fits your nebulous standards.

>>95923063
my group is too low powered for that

>>95923072
Oh no see you had me confused anon. You've been trying to derail the conversation repeatedly because you're unable to defend the design from criticism- so I was just a little confused why you thought just trying again would work.
Is it a result of your affliction?

>>95922920
>>95922792
What if I barely upgraded the Yshotola precon and kept all the FF14 characters in it?

>>95923010
I'll answer for anon. Instead of Ysholta
>Sygg, River Cutthroat
>more interesting
>one color less, restrictions on opponents losing life make for more thoughtful deckbuilding
>rogue typing can lend itself to oddball Lorwyn tribal synergies
>more open-ended than "Esper Goodstuff"

Instead of Cloud:
>Tetsuo, Imperial Champion
>Ratonhnhaké꞉ton
>Dalakos, Crafter of Wonders
>basically any "equip matters" commander that spices up your basic-ass gameplan
>"B-but none of those are NAYA equipments!"
tough fucking shit no one is chomping at the bit for naya equipment

Last of all alternatives to Vivi
>kill yourself
>no really
>just kill yourself
>you're playing vivi because he's ultra high-powered and wins the game with any number of cards