Thread 96317616

Which is the better system for fantasy dungeon crawling bullshit?

>>96317616 (OP)
GURPS

>>96317616 (OP)
Depends on the edition, though I personally found D&D 4e more fun for that purpose then any other D&D or Worlds edition.

>>96317616 (OP)
OSR style D&D.

>>96317616 (OP)
Savage Worlds has more flexibility than D&D, so I prefer it for that reason.

For example, you got a character bleeding out in D&D that is sixty feet away. RAW, the only character that can move that far and delivery first aid/a potion? A level 3 rouge or a level 3 monk because they can use their special bonus action effect for that movement distance.
How retarded is that?
SW? Pretty much anybody can make the attempt fine.

>>96317616 (OP)
Neither 5th ed nor Savage Worlds actually treats a dungeon as anything more than a themed backdrop for the same kind of fights you can have anywhere else in those games.

If you want to actually dungeon crawl instead of hit things with a cosmetic grey stone backdrop, you need a game engine with rules to support the crawling part. Only OSR and NSR games actually do that.

I like 3.5 :)

>>96317616 (OP)
D&D of any edition. SW is okay for short pulp fantasy campaigns, anything else and it really starts to suck and the sole reason you'd stick with it is for nostalgia.

>>96317639
>though I personally found D&D 4e more fun
Opinion discarded

>>96317616 (OP)
Might I suggest this game?
it does have mud and blood dungeon crawling and traveling.

>>96317616 (OP)
SW fantasy companion fleshed out traps, poisons, and other typical dungeon delving fare to the point I would recommend it over most editions of D&D. Pretty much the only edition of D&D better is B/X and that mainly beats it out for a focus on dungeon crawlers being high lethal affairs with very structured turns for the players and environment.

If you aren't going for very structured dungeon environment tracking? Savage Worlds does action better.
>>96317639
>4e
4e is good for board game dungeon crawling. Arguably the best rules for board game dungeon crawling. For RPG dungeon crawling it's not great.

>>96317616 (OP)
D&D. For the record, I don't like D&D and I love SW, but SW sucks for dungeon crawling.

Savage Worlds is total shit. The only combats that are satisfying in the system are against swarms of mooks. A single high toughness creature is just a pain to fight snd it gets wild attacked down to nothing, or it is a barrage of constant rolling 13 damage against 14 toughess and accomplishing nothing. There are also no dungeon crawling mechanics. With gritty damage and lots of supernatural buffs to toughness it might work, but really any OSR DnD system is better. I have run a savage worlds fantasy hexcrawl

Savage Worlds is total shit. The only combats that are satisfying in the system are against swarms of mooks. A single high toughness creature is just a pain to fight snd it gets wild attacked down to nothing, or it is a barrage of constant rolling 13 damage against 14 toughess and accomplishing nothing. There are also no dungeon crawling mechanics. With gritty damage and lots of supernatural buffs to toughness it might work, but really any OSR DnD system is better. I have run a savage worlds fantasy hexcrawl and it was basically a power wank. All it takes is a d10 strength fighter with great sword wild attacking to put out 15.2 damage on average per hit when you factor in modified expected values for exploding dice. Hit with a raise? That's a solid 19.4 average damage. That will almost hit a dragons toughness. Anything else in the game? Annihilated. You need multiple monsters to even challenge PCs at all. A savage worlds combat of 4 wild cards vs an ogre is the equivalent of four 40 hit points guys against a single 10 point guy.
>bbb ut savage worlds doesn't use hit points so you can't make that comparison
You're right, with how toughness is all or nothing, it's more like four 60 hit points guys against a 10 hit point guy. The only way to wear down PCs is with permanent injuries from every wound as gritty damage. And this isn't even getting into AoE spells annihilating everything once you get to seasoned or veteran or whatever.

Anyway yeah fuck savage worlds. Run BX or ACKS instead for dungeon crawls. Savage Worlds is only good for shitty fuddlore WW2 supernatural games where you pick muh .45 caliber for +1 damage and katana is the most powerful medieval melee weapon in the game. LOL what a joke of a system.
>but no SWADE is different
It does fix some things, but it still keeps the core damage mechanic of the system, which is total shit, and the same skill list as the main system, which is total shit, but now you get free ranks in some skills, i.e added bloat.

I like D&D 4e.

>>96318944
If you’re going to play a board game dungeon crawl just play HeroQuest

>>96318614
>Goblin Slayer TRPG
>no rape or pregnancy rules

>>96319942
HeroQuest is far too basic and the rules for it are retarded (roll to move, can't spot traps on the other side of a threshold, etc) all while out of the box needing a game master for it to function at all.

The D&D adventure board games use a modified 4e ruleset and it works incredibly well.

>>96320129
You don't really need rules for either.
You lost? If female you are getting raped and impregnated and tortured until you die. If male, you are getting killed or tortured then killed. If trans? They are using your birth gender to decide what to do. Roll a new character.

>>96320671
>Roll to Move
There is the "Unthreatened Movement" optional rule where your movement dice default to 4s when there's no foes on the board.

>can't spot traps on the other side of a threshold
that is a smidge of a problem...

>needing a game master for it to function at all.
There's an App for that! You can even use it to play Single Player!

>>96320129
There be not. But at least it's a good game.

>>96320936
Man, I get there are ways to fix stuff. I'm of the personal opinion that if I have to fix something then the core game is shit.

For example "untethered movement" shouldn't be an optional rule, it should be the standard rule with the game revolving around said rule for mission setup and such. Playing RAW can have someone tearing ass around the board while his companions are moving very slowly splitting the party because of a shit luck factor. The game plays like this is the expected outcome with how enemies handle where ganging up on a line adventurer and beating their brains out is kind of the only viable way to succeed from a GM point of view. Good player teamwork and proximity makes the game damn near unwinnable from a GM standpoint
The "traps being invisible on the other side of a threshold" is total bullshit and, once again, the rules know it which is why a large amount of them are just on the other side of a door.
Needing an app for solo play is a lazy ass fix and one that ensures it will not even be an option in less than ten years as the app won't function and Hasbro isn't going to invest money in keeping it alive.

HeroQuest is a good, modular, very beginner focused dungeon crawler. Seriously what I would recommend to complete board game newbies who don't know shit about tabletop at all to ease them into that genre of game. If they have any experience at all? D&D adventure games, especially from Temple of Elemental Evil onward, is a much better choice.

>>96317616 (OP)
Savage Worlds.
Mainly because I want D&D to fuck off and die, so any chance I can convince others to play literally anything else, I am going to do so.
PbtA, SW, SotDL, Thirsty Sword Lesbians, FATAL? Yup, pick those over D&D.

>>96317616 (OP)
I prefer D&D, specifically B/X and 3.5.

>>96317616 (OP)
dungeon crawling? OSR.

but that's not how most people play D&D. which is why they probably shouldn't be playing D&D.

>>96317616 (OP)
What are some good advice for vreaking through high toughness enemies?

>>96328364
Usr Wild Attack. It's the most powerful option in the game.

>>96317616 (OP)
Savage worlds.
With the Gold & Glory supplement and maybe the Fantasy Companion.
D&D's sacred cows are a pain.

>>96317616 (OP)
>Op mentions dnd
>Thread isn't solely dedicated to shitting on dnd

You did good today anons. I know this took restraint and I'm very proud of all of you.

>>96329264
Even die hard D&D haters can admit that it is a good system for straight up dungeon crawling. It sucks dog nuts when it tries to do anything else though.