Thread 96818935

Blood Angels edition

>Previous Heresy: >>96798742

>HH 3.0 - Complete gofile - All Books:
https://gofile.io/d/cnJk0N

>New Edition, to a great wailing and gnashing of teeth:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/setting/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/warhammer-the-horus-heresy/
>Thread FAQ (very old, remembers Age of Terra)
https://pastebin.com/iUqNrrA8
https://pastebin.com/8riDmnhS
>30k TACTICA & TIPS
https://pastebin.com/Tm2P4QLp
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Age_of_Darkness-Warhammer_30k/3.0_Tactics/General_Tactics

『Adeptus Titanicus and Legions Imperialis』
>Official FAQ/Errata/Downloads
https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/downloads/legions-imperialis/
>List of Titan Legions with Badges and Colours
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17Jccq0V--SwJifLVLwbisYnQeqLlS2pMSiPbGXp1Brs/htmlview
>More lists
https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/List_of_Titan_Legions
>What size magnets do I need?
5x1mm
>Tactics
https://1d6chan.miraheze.org/wiki/Adeptus_Titanicus/Tactics

>Thread question:
Play Titanicus?

Titanicus has been played! 2.5k, 5 hour match (+30min setup). Legio Mortis won by 2vp, we scored the same for the primary objective so the game came down to secondary objectives.
Quite some funny happenstances. I failed quite a few of my order rolls, just as many as I made with my Legio rules, in fact. This was the first game my opponent had played with said rules and I benefited far more from it even if I went without orders more for those pesky 1s on the d10.

Turn 1 was fairly usual except for Jim Awakening the Machine Spirit which hampered its movement quite drastically. The artillery warlords lobbed a bunch of missiles for the most part. That reaver would suffer quite badly.

Turn 2 would see the Mortis reaver there die to Laserbeak's overpowered shots. Even after quad 1s on the laser blasters, thanks to previous damage and the extergimus maniple's bonus, the graviton ruminator would silence the reaver, a beneficial result that would see it block the mortis warlord's volcano cannons for the rest of the game. Or it would have if the thing didn't roll a 5 for every goddamn volcano cannon shot afterwards.

How do y'all feel about having bespoke rapier crews? I'm going to be getting 8 (magnetizing for 4 tech weapons and 4 ammo weapons) and I'm debating just having my 16 crew just be standard crew with bolters so they can also be part of my tactical squad, because doubling up would sure save me a lot of space.

Those two warhounds would make an absurd number of shield saves throughout the game. Well over 30, with 20 hit rolls in a single turn only dropping 2 void shield levels with enough blanks on the reactor die to force only a single ineffective reactor overload.
The Pale King on turn thee would unload onto the pair, catching a third dog in the belicossa blasts, but wouldn't dispatch them and would be laid low by the opposing Mortis warlord's cannons.

>>96819007
Of course mortis won, theyre the best!

Bossman would take one of the pair down turn four, but not anything else. For the rest of turn 3 there, however, most of the action would consolidate in the middle of the battlefield.
The double-melta dog would destroy a building in fury but that gave a clear line for blastermaster to attack the other dog, only dropping its shields and being exposed in return, however blastermaster would survive even after significant damage.
Off to the side the other reavers would maneuver for a future turn, laserbeak was taking hits but its void shields reignited twice between turns 3 and 4 sparing its life.

Turn 4 saw a lot of shit happen. The melta dog raced forwards only for Bossman to take the four dialogue option and >Leave. The second Mortis reaver lined up an attack only for Stripes to come on its flank only to get mounted in return.

First Stripes would rip the head off the reaver causing it to explode. Then after the warhound would be shot apart by Laserbeak causing IT to explode on the opposite side of Stripes. The Mortis warhound on the objective kepts its meager shields intact long enough to evade catastrophic damage and hold the objective despite a walord and reaver unloading onto it (it was just under the warlord's carapce guns).
The Mortis secondary objective was to kill 2 chosen titans at range for 5VP each, my secondary objective was to kill up to 3 titans in melee for 3vp each.
We were both quite pleased with the game. My opponent is of the same mindset as me where the objective is secondary to the experience so victory is just a bit of candy on top of a sweet game. We need to try to play a bit faster though as we couldn't roll for turn 5 (despite really deserving to) for simple time constraints.
Next time we play will hopefully be a Warmaster clash.

>>96819007
that playmat makes me want to make a board using garden pavers

>>96819184
It's easier than you think!

Spooler anon, post something!

>>96811750

Primarch is apparently also a rank that one could be promoted to. None of the legions did though.

A girl custodian called Aristea is the door guard of Guilliman.

Guilliman talks about Russ and the Lion returning to Terra and already feuding again. The Lion stuck a longsword through the chest of Russ during a fight on Terra.
Guilliman wishes his brothers hadn't come back at all.
Prayto explains to Guilliman that he still can't sense the warp and they begin to think it is dead/gone and that the Emperor killed chaos.

The cult leader Julatta finds a crashed thunderhawk with a near death Thousand son marine in it. He tells her that they failed and he can't feel the warp anymore either. He tells her there is nothing left for them except to run.
Later they find a village and stumble upon 100s of diseased wasted away people but who are still loyal native Terrans. She proclaims them unbelievers and her small cult is torn to pieces by the Terrans as she dies crying.

The Phalanx is very ruined but Dorn has ordered it repaired with priority.
Archamus visits it and sees new marine aspirants 11/12 years old training to become marines. He is shown new methods of training which are just beginning, the psycho-conditioning. To make better marines with even less humanity.
He is unsure if it is a good idea but as both Dorn and Guilliman agreed to it and want it done he accepts it.

Next he meets Corswain and Bjorn in a secret area of the Phalanx. Dorn wants him to convine them to convince their primarchs to support his idea of a crusade. They say their primarchs have their own minds but it's pretty obvious he planted the seed in their mind to convince their primarchs.

Next Hassan overhears an interrogation regarding Keeler and how she has somehow escaped off world. They are seeking to clamp down harder on believers.

>>96814674
No, nothing like that in this.

>>96819664
>The Phalanx is very ruined but Dorn has ordered it repaired with priority.
lol. lmao even.
Thanks for your efforts, Anon.

Finished my Autek Mor kitbash, I’m so happy with how he came out!

>>96819664
thanks anon

>>fem todes
is this new?

>>Guilliman wishes his brothers hadn't come back at all
god I hate him so much. shows up late and then starts to complain other legions don't do things his way

>>96819970
Oh no! Not the servo titty sucker!

>>96818935 (OP)
Painting my Legio Venator as we speak anon

>>96819117
Cool wrote up and some good action shoots anon.
What rules do you use for your dudes. The custom legio rules?

>>96819664
Next Hassan has a meeting with all the High Lords in an effort to convince them to go against Dorn and stick up for themselves even if it means supporting Guilliman.
They get offended and say he is trying to use them like Malcador did.
They all leave and Hassan is deflated.

The traitor gang lost a few IW and WB getting to the space station but once aboard they find an old Blood Angel ship a bit larger than a stormbird.
The WB offhandly give the repair job to the IW who do it while seething in their mind the whole time.
While repairing it the lone SoH, Xhamaddon tries to recruit the IW to his side so he can overthrow the WB. The IW, Theokon tells him that he should run when the chance arises as everyone wants to kill the SoH now.

When ready they manage to escape back into the sol system as some more fleeing traitors distract the Ultramarine killer ships.
The WB leader, Adraharsis makes the plan to go to Neptune as forces had been left there during the initial attack.

Next the meeting to decide what to do next occurs.
All important people on Terra attend.
Two chairs are left empty for the Raven Guard and Iron Hands as there is nobody of high enough rank on Terra to represent them.
The Khan has to be helped to his chair by two retainers which greatly annoys him.

Guilliman begins the talk and says he can't tell anyone about the exact condition of the Emperor because they don't understand his condition.
Guilliman warns everyone that mass production of traitor marines is happening on Luna right now and that is why it should be their focus.

Dorn meanwhile steps up and says Luna and Mars can be retaken in time but the traitors should be hunted down while they are in disarray.
Dorn maintains that chaos will come back while Guilliman says he doesn't know that for sure.
Every other primarch and Raldoran agree with Dorn's idea to launch a new crusade.
As Guilliman looks defeated Dorn stands happily but a voice cuts in.

>>96820104
yeah build-a-bear rules from the campaign compendium.
I did a first draft of some homebrew rules for Xestobiax but I felt silly so it didn't go any further.

>>96820067
Faster!

>>96819664
>Primarch is apparently also a rank that one could be promoted to.
The Legions had "Primarchs" before the actual Primarchs were found (barring Alpha Legion [this too is a lie])

>>96820125
>but voice cuts in
Who? I bet it's Valdor. Tell us who was that?

Still some highlighting to go, I probably won't bother taking anymore photos of this squad if anons are getting sick of updates, but pretty happy with how they came out in the end. Dickbike squad underway currently.

>>96819970
Cool mini bro, notice how it actually has a torso unlike the plastic cataphractii

>>96820665
Nice, a bit funny how the vox lad stands out because of the red torso making him an easier target

>>96820665
Which white primer did you use?

>>96820665
beautiful scars. I'll have to go archive diving to get your recipe since they turned out fantastic

A while ago one of you guys recommended using a smoke paint to make really great looking Iron Warriors and Iron Hands.
Problem is, I don't remember if it was Tamiya or Vallejo. Does anyone remember which one?

>>96820998
95% sure it was Tamiya. Vallejo is a lot browner.

>>96820879
>>96820883
Don't think I posted. Black undercoat > sombre grey air vallejo > ulthuan grey air > vallejo white at increasing levels of zenith
>>96820876
He's a special boy

Pretty happy with how these Sons of Horus plasma squads turned out

>>96818935 (OP)

>TQ

I do play Titanicus, but more Legions Imperialis lately. Also FVCK YEA LEGIO MORTIS

>>96819076

I mean, it's explicitly canon.

#SHATTERED

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/xbtm4kh4/rebuilding-the-shattered-legions-survivors-band-together-and-fight-back-in-warhammer-the-horus-heresy/

>>96821163
Fucking hell, GW really keeping up the pace with the rules releases for 3.0, and free rules documents no less.

>>96821163

Dammit when are we getting more LI content?

>>96821182
Shame it's for a shit edition.

>>96821191
That's just, like, your opinion man. Locally HH has surged in popularity because of it, we got twice as many active players as there were at the height of 2.0

>>96818935 (OP)
Legion Imperialis bros; where you @?

>>96821206
Pigs rush to eat slop, more at 11.

>>96821206
NTA but 3.0 is trash

>>96821247
>>96821251
Let me guess, at least one of you plays Fury of the Ancients in 2.0

>>96821048
Thank you airbrush chad

>>96821237

Waiting for legionbuilder to make it into the OP.

>>96821267
No, I am not a waacfag. If you enjoy 3.0 good for you, still trash tho.

>>96821274
Soon™
Some gaylord next thread needs to include it ffs + the rules in a mega

>>96821163
For HH2 how are the Shattered Legions? I'm very indecisive when it comes to painting so an army that let's me mix and match seems fun but I also don't want to eat shit every time I play

>>96821397
Peak schizophrenia. The rules each individual unit is affected by dynamically changes depending on which models you remove as casualties. Easily the most complicated army rules ever.
Then there was also dumb broken shit like Shattered Legion NL dreads being unable to charge any unit ever.

>>96821163
>IH get FNP 4+ against volley attacks
Neat.

>>96821163
>Not the actual worst thing ever to listbuild/play
>Most traits seem useful
>Can actually take legion specific wargear/units
Heartbreaking: free PDF once again utterly mogs $70 book you paid for

>>96821450
It has become rather obvious that the Libers are concessions the rules team made to appease the suits. All the fun and flavour is being put in free PDF rules and the tactica journals.

>>96821460
only the marine libers

mech and solar auxilia libers have tons of fun in them

>>96821419
I didn't know that casualties had an affect on the rules.

>>96821522
Only for 2.0 shattered legions. It was obnoxious as fuck, not to mention it like doubled the time it took to play a game.

>>96821397
>>96821419
Blackshields peaked in 1.0 with the kino Marauder squads, a modellers wet dream.

>>96821552
Just wait until tactica journal: blackshields :^)

>>96821163
>Picking legions that make sense to be together lore wise and are the 'usual suspects' for a shattered legion force
>Picking legions that synergise well together gameplay wise
>Just picking whatever legions I think are cool and want to paint and just finding a way to make it work
Which path do I choose bros

>>96821632
>Play UM and RG
>Legions were (relatively) tight, just didn't get the chance to mingle much during the heresy because of the whole ruinstorm thing
>Legion traits work well together for a mobile shooting force backed up by fast melee
>Have been looking for an excuse to put down other projects to get working on painting them more
All 3 :)

>>96821632
>Super human tard strength + power armour
>just get your head ripped off without effort from other super human
Hate this dumb shit, try pulling off (heh) another humans arm or head

>>96821632
Just go for whatever you think is coolest; GW is liable to find some way to pair up and make canon excuses for everything (and there's likely evidence already that whoever you pick have or could chum it up) and rules change at the drop of the hat. You're buying for the long term, not just in the moment.

People will roll their eyes at literally any shattered force list that isn't the OG 3, so just pick what you think is cool. You have to paint it and stare at it, so no point collecting half an army you don't like

>>96821675
I feel like the OG 3 are one of the worst possible choices for the Sharted legions purely because IH and RG are just black armor.

>archmagos is T6 W6
>doesnt have bulky

HUH???!?!
he only gets bulky (bulky 7 to boot) if he's on a pimp throne

>>96821759
Don't body shame magos-chan

can you take a warlord detachment (the primarch/retinue/heavy transport one) and not fill the primarch slot?

I need the retinue slot, no I dont want to logistical benefit for it, im doing that with other stuff already

>>96821861
No, but you can take a legion champ for his unique detachment that is the same thing just with a terminator slot instead of primarch

>>96821861
Nah. It'd be too convenient

>>96821878
playing mech, listbuilding is a bitch with the subfaction rules they have

Has anyone got a screen snap of the saturnine command squad rules? Honestly thought I had it but I apparently don't

>>96821889
I may just have to drop the retinue idea and take units of castellax instead
guess it kinda works out, can mount them with darkfires for some extra anti-armour punch
.....or I take 2 thanatar-calix and just sit them at the back with a magos giving them comptroller 2 because fuck you

>>96821552
>praising anything with 1.0 blackshields or shattered legions
The only more obvious sign you're a WAACfag would be saying you played thousands sons, solar aux, custodes, or that actually S10 Ap2 large blasts were fine

>>96821895
Here you go anon

>>96821919
Cheers anon, appreciate it

>>96821759
THE CERTAINTY OF STEEL MOTHERFUCKER

>>96821503
3.0 Mech is the blandest the faction has ever been wtf are you on about you absolute spoon.

>>96821919
Praetor can take the Deep Strike wargear but Centurion can't, right?

>>96818935 (OP)
I'm glad to see someone carrying on my work :,)

>>96821951
That is correct. Centurion seems more suited to sitting in a regular saturnine terminator squad.

>>96821163
These traits seem kinda nutty no? "LD9 or less always passes" is insane, the SoH and UM ones are also pretty great, as are WB

WB rhino rushes in particular seem sicknasty, add EC and maybe NL and you have the makings of a scary despoiler swarm. Charging 3d6 pick highest so you dont worry about disordered, always hitting on 4+, +1 to combat res if you kill anything.

So now all that's left now is Zone Mortalis (presumably 2nd or 3rd Thursday in November) then we're in wild west? I'm expecting we get the Superheavy journal tactica announced soon alongside the glaive to also release in November, since we seem to be going for a journal every 2 months pacing.

>>96822131
would be nice if they actually did a fucking reveal stream, we're still waiting in what the talons will look like

do we even know if they're having a stream this saturday?

>>96822131
Its surprsing how decent the legacy PDFs are, just in terms of design/rules quality. A big step up from 2e.

>>96821163
The DA trait seems a little underwhelming compared to some of the others.

>>96822124
Is there a way to even get Centurion to Deep Strike?

>>96822176
It makes them slightly better at fighting Night Lords which is mildly amusing.

>>96822176
How about the salamander trait?

Meanwhile SOH get arguably a better legion trait than their actual legion trait.

Found this one online.
Are Mortificator Consuls worth getting?

>>96822092
>o take mono-legion units from each of your legions separately
Thats called "taking allied detachments" dumbass

>>96822131
>then we're in wild west?
IIRC there's supposed to be a stream within the next two weeks so I figure we might get a new roadmap shortly.

>>96822209
>primaris conversion
You posted this to trigger me specifically.

>>96822224
Isn't it more like truescaling a termie body? Probably pre-Leviathan.

>>96822184
Putting him in the same unit that a saturnine praetor with the deep strike wargear is in.

Spoiler anon, I summon you to this thread! Please.

>>96822209
Speaking of Consuls, how come they can't use Indomitus armor? That was fairly common during the Heresy, right?

>>96821397
Shattered Legions in 2.0 were the single worst written army, with every legion having majority/minority/flaws that change dynamically instead of a proper legion trait, and you can't take any legion-unique units or gear. No allies either; I'm honestly not sure what the fuck they were smoking when Blackshields were just kind of okay in the same book. The amount of tracking you have for each squad slows down the game dramatically.

3.0 at least appears to be a lot more streamlined about it with three consistent, conditional minor rules.

>>96822253
Both 2.0 and 3.0 deal with Indomitus Terminators as a Legacies unit than an armor type, so no characters or anything. Similar deal with Custodes, who can't have Aquilon Terminator HQs.

>>96822253
Because they don't want you to use Leviathan to convert a bunch of them I guess.

>>96822209
If you’re not going to use contemptors probably not, but the stave will never not be funny and besides that he’s just a techmarine. The only downside being that he sucks in combat vs infantry

>>96822131
I imagine there's a bunch of releases queued up like the teased cataphractii or the breachers
I'm honestly surprised we still haven't seen things like the sicaran variants when all that takes is a different weapon sprue on the normal one...

>>96821919
Got the Phraetus Anointed page(s)?

>>96822253
Why would any leader choose shitty indomitus when chad taratros and catpractii exist

>>96822372
Because they haven't been upscaled yet.

>>96821912
You seem unable to read anon, kek

>>96822372
Because they haven't been upscaled yet.

>>96822381
>>96822404
I'm speaking lore

>>96822346
What if I... used a Leviathan Dreadnought instead?

>>96822468
Many reasons, boiled down to "that's what was available".

>>96822481
I mean you can, they’re still good this ed. his unique detachment only can field contemptors though

>>96821163
Fucking gender neutral pronouns. Fuck you GW.

>>96821163
Nice. Very cool.

>>96821427
>IF + AL fire volley bolters

>>96822365
These?

>>96822576
Alert, alert, ESL detected

>>96820125
Kane the Fabricator general locum speaks up that they were promised Mars would be freed as soon as the opportunity arose. The Mechanicus refuse to support any crusade until Mars is reconquered.
Aphone Ire also puts forth that they won't support a crusade until Luna is retaken.
Dorn is shocked and then one by one each high lord speaks up their reason for supporting Guilliman until Dorn is outnumbered.
Valdor sits and only watches the proceedings without speaking once.

Guilliman tells Dorn that his crusade will have to wait, an awkward silence settles until the Lion speaks up that they will be as one mind and if the council wants to focus on Lun and Mars then that is what they will do.

Hassan wonders who managed to get the high lords to follow his idea.

Luna was always the place the traitors intended to rule real space from as they knew Terra would be consumed by the warp if they won.

The chief apothecary of the sons of Horus, Vardesh Kraiya is stranded on Luna in command and mass producing traitor marines with Heliosa-78.
They've managed to make 7000 marines in a few weeks, although most are unstable.
He resolves to fight to the last for Horus.

The traitor gang specifically the word bearers are undergoing heavy warp withdrawal, one who had been poessessed is hiding in the bowels of the ship rocking back and forth like a child until found and claiming he is really okay.

They reach Neptune and find it to be a mostly blasted to pieces mess. The hives have been made into ruins. They are close to despair when a odd malfunction happens on an instrument. They find a weak warp source coming from a moon called Laomedeia.
They had sent a cult called the Paths of Revelation to prepare it for chaos in the past.
They have somehow used warp sorcery to make their moon appear ruined.

>>96822835
You nincompoop. Singular neutral in english is "it".
Using "they" was considered until the 2010s a grammatical error, to the same level as ebonics/pidgin.

>>96822576
You are the ESL. Proper english here is
>"it's"
>"his"
>"her"

"their" is lgbtqia+ slang, and is a pidgin of english, just like "we was" in ebonics.

>>96822913
>"it's"
>"her"

>>96822875
You're here! Yay!

>>96822913
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singular_they

Does the atomantic pavise rules of the araknae applies to itself?

>>96820155
What rules do you use

>>96821077
Noice
>>96821082
REEEEEEEEE FUCK MORTIS NEVER FORGET SHEDIM DRIFTS REEEEE

>>96822835
Faggot.

>>96823207
Yes, it is within 3" of itself after all.

>>96822875
>Vulkan enters
>"Then came Vulkan, by contrast still a figure of vitality and magnificence. Perhaps that was to be expected, given his unique gift [...]"
so is it known to everyone that he is perpetual?

>>96823516
Nah, he means black don't crack

>>96823186
Dishonest coping

>IF & IW once again have complimentary traits
Can love bloom on the battlefield?

>>96822875
>spend years preparing for most important event of your life
>fail to protect Emperor anyways
>Gman comes and denies you vengeance
Dorn had a hard life

>>96823516
I mean, people aren't supposed to know that Dorn killed Alpharious either yet some random librarian recognizes Dorn's Primarch killing weapon

>>96823608
Hey, Dorn will have his revenge in Iron Cage. All as he has wanted.

>>96822875
Irony is that the primarchs are right (which the reader knows because of hindsight) and the weak humans are all wrong (also Bobby G)

>>96822209
Umm sweaty that's a primaris model

>>96823667
How' that?

>>96823684
That failing to wipe out the traitors when they could (before they flee to the Eye) is what allows the Long War to begin. The traitor legions and chaos are always the greatest threat to the imperium. The humans wanting to secure Mars and Luna are logical but we as the reader know that letting the Astartes get away now fucks the imperium in the future and dooms it forever (well even more so than losing the Emperor and the Web way doomed it)

>>96823332
Cheers, I'm building my first HH army (IW) and araknae look pretty usable in the Ironfire Cohort detachment. I don't know about the arquitor bombard though...

Are the recent BL books on HH any good or is it all 100% slop? I read like 1 or 2 of the Siege of Terra series and it was the worst shite I have ever consumed. They fucked up so much. The perpetual shit was always cancer.
Only good HH novels were ADB's early books with Lorgar, Angron, et al. Dan Abnett is shit, no clue why he is so hyped. He's trash

>>96823831
I liked Saturnine

Would it make more sense for a Castellax that is part of a Space Marine legion to have the body be Mars red and the pauldrons be the legion's colors. Or the whole body being the legion color?

>>96823810
The arquitor is great, what do you mean? Very tough tank for only 150 points, and all its guns are either decent or good.

>>96823712
Right but failing to stomp out resistance in Mars and Luna can be just as bad because its at your doorstep.

>>96823858
Whole body in legion colour.

>>96823860
It seemed to me on first glance that the vindicator's demolisher cannon was much better than the morbus bombard

>>96823712
>Send all available forces to snuff out the remaining dregs of traitors
>Uppity dissident magos nukes the imperial palace, destroying the golden throne
>Second eye of terror opens
>Warp travel once again rendered completely impossible
Welcome to the Age of Strife 2.0: electric boogaloo, this time with daddy issues addled demigods
The imperium was fucked no matter which way they went

>>96822576
Does it really matter that much?

>>96823887
Different roles. The demolisher cannon is for busting tanks, with a bit of infantry killing on the side. The arquitor's guns are much better at suppressing and killing large blobs of infantry.

>>96820347
But they were called Legion Masters, no?

>>96821163

>Dark Angels trait ability is also bascially nothing.
Well, they're being consistant.

>EC ability removes the main advantage of taking WS elite troops.

...this is actually better than their normal legion traits. Dafuq?

>>96823937
How did this get approved, honestly? You only lose (most) unique characters and detachments. But those detachments are just icing. Many are meh or bad.

>>96823874
FUCK! I don't know what legion I want to paint

>>96823831
>Only good HH novels were ADB

>>96821648
strength and durability do not have to scale at the same rate you dimwit. Just look at bugs they are really strong and rip each other's heads off all the time.

>>1.12.2

Remember when entire units could only use a single krak grenade or meltabomb in melee? Man 7th edition rules were so shit.

>>96823990

Eh, it's fine. Not great, just fine. I think Blackshields are better and more interesting to build than this, but minmaxing those traits into something apalling is going to be someones jam.

>wake up
>My entire knife portfolio is down 70+%
What legion should I start with the remaining dregs?

>>96824178
>knife portfolio
Huh?

>>96824161
Yes, I remember 3.0

>>96824192
Valve made it so their gacha knives can get traded in for more rolls and it nuked the market
The fact that there's a market for knife skins in a video game is fucking retarded, but that's what it is
>CS2 knives had a market cap of 6 billion dollars
What the fuck?

>>96824227
4 bil now LMAO

>>96824178
Night lords since you seem to be only edge with no real contribution to anything meaningful.

>>96823858

We have precedent for both "Mech colours, Legion shoulderpad" and "All Legion colours" so take your pick. Personally I prefer the former.

>>96824161
Is this how this is meant to be interpreted, 1 attack per squad instead of 1 per model? Or is it one per model and you are bemoaning that people couldn't throw out 40-60 kraks at once per unit?

>>96824178
>Retarded
>Gambling addict
>Wannabe cryptobro/nftbro
Have faith, word bearer

>>96824216
Nigga what? Every model in a unit can use a krak grenade or melta bomb in 3.0, it's how my deathwing companions have been wrecking AV 14 vehicles and why tactical marines absolutely annihilate anything with rear AV 10

>>96824327
It got changed from when HH still used the 40k 7th edition rulebook to when HH got it's own version of it.

>>96824368
I can't find anything that says that in the 7th core rules. If anything the grenade section on how many grenades get used is ported straight from 7th into 1st ed hh.

>>96824327
It’s one per model

>>96824473
Guessed as much. Ty.

>>96824436
there was a faq they did in 7th that limited grenades to 1 per unit in combat and everyone hated it

>EC+AL+WB despoilers
>melee hits on 4+, precision 4+ volleys, 3d6 charges
Dangerously based

>>96824530
>facebook<dot>com/1575682476085719/photos/pcb.1610528622601104/1610526962601270/
I finally found it. I guess like the rest of the 40k side of things for 7th I just ignored it.

>>96819664
>A girl custodian
Piracy it is.

Think this reads as a Ravenwing Praetor? finishing a converted Sammael for 10th but I want to jump start 30k DA now that I’m finally finishing up 40k for friendly games. Got a magnetized power sword/lance arm too.

>>96824850
>forgot to rotate
Guess I’ll kill myself

>>96819664
>A girl custodian called Aristea is the door guard of Guilliman.
LMAO I'm so glad I didn't spend money on this Woke marxist crap

>>96824161
Yeah at least Vorax didn't get raped

>>96823904
Yes it matters when political activists ruin the hobby because they cannot let a hobby just be a hobby.

>>96824856
>>96824850
yea? what else would he be? a space wolf?

>>96824904
just meant as the armor and styling, I want to make sure the 30k fellas fit in instead of just using modern 40k kits

>>96819664
>Guilliman talks about Russ and the Lion returning to Terra and already feuding again. The Lion stuck a longsword through the chest of Russ during a fight on Terra.
Oh right Wraight wrote some scenes in the Leman Russ novel that should be playing out in parallel to this story.

>>96824957
Yea the armor looks fine. Shoulders are MKIII and the armor looks like MKVI(? the feet are anyways). But really its a fairly bespoke piece and thats fine for artificer armor.

>>96824968
>shoulders are MKIII
Clearly MkIV (thin trim) with some extra plating, which is available for various shoulder pads.

>>96824850
>>96824856
>Terminator hands
>Pr*maris arms
>Replaces the original plasma cannon that fits nicely with huge oversized gravis plasma cannon meant for dreads and vehicles
>Didn't used greenstuff to remove the in-built stormbolters on the sides
>Poorly fitting shoulderpad on the right shoulder

I absolutely hate it. But I guess it would pass the armour autism test.

>>96823870
Loyalists control the space around Luna and Mars they can't escape they are just stuck there seething.
> Le magos nuke the palace!
Part of what the emperor was doing on the Golden Throne was maintaining the shielding on the Palace. If the forces of Chaos gang banging it for months couldn't crack it some fuck boi magos launching a nuke isn't doing shit

>>96825002
>Replaces the original plasma cannon that fits nicely with huge oversized gravis plasma cannon meant for dreads and vehicles

the jet bike is actually a 3d print my friend made me but it had a multi melta modeled. I had to cut it all the way out and then panicked realizing I couldn't figure out a replacement till another friend gave me some castaferrum arms. I grabbed the wings from the horrific finecast sammael GW sent me (which is when I realized I needed to convert)

> want a Warlord titan volkite weapon
> Go to Warhammer website. Reaver version is available but the Warlord isn't even on the website
> Message them asking if it was even still around
> Got a response to watch warcom for announcements.
So they are either soft squating AT or we are getting a new Warlord titan with more plastic weapon options.
But I'm pissed I want resin weapons and they don't even have some on the website to buy
> Le third party!!!
They are all within a couple bucks of GW anyway and don't have free shipping.
> Le recast
The only recasters making them are so shit in quality they are basically unusable.

should I take 2 thanatar-calix in 3k? my list is drastically lacking in anti-tank otherwise

any alternatives to doing that? for around the same points cost

>>96825211
>soft squating AT
I hope not it looks like a lot of fun

>>96825294
It's a shit ton of fun

>>96825273
Consider how many real tanks you're fighting in your lists - not ifvs like land Raiders, but predators and vindicators and kratii. I've been doing double vultatax to discombobulate AV14 and then relying on the innate S8 melee weapons on castellax and domitars to wreck anything rear AV 10

>>96825390
Is that Angron sculpts as meh as it looks, or is it the clearly not ideal paintjob that drags it down?
Stormcast would have been a lot better within the lightning, or if they absolutely had to, a bit more OSL around it so it wouldn't look so much like just blue-white branches.

Dark angels defendes.their stronghold agains an Alpha legion incursion. But the loss was enormous as the Mastodon perished against the kgihts melta

>>96825425
Fully painted everything?
Cool narrative board?
What the fuck is this?
Is this still HHG?

>>96825390
>cheap
Well damn I didn't know Fortune 500 CEOs browsing /hhg/.

>>96821163
Shattered legion DA being better than Vanilla DA despite also being bad is funny to me.

>>96825444
Your Mastodon is lovely anon ! great work.

>>96825383
well my list does have double vulturax in it already
maybe some darkfires on myrmidons or castellax then? myrmidons have vanguard 3 so can double up what they want to shoot at

never seen anyone use myrmidon destructors though, are they bad?

>>96825602
Myrmidon destructors got hit with weapon nerfs + losing innate BS5 + castellax are actually worth considering now so frankly they don't have any weapons that we can't get elsewhere for cheaper and in an easier slot

>>96825444
RIP beautiful partybus

>>96821206
it pretty much killed the scene over here

>>96825707
Granted, both can get BS5 back but myrmidons can natively score where automata can't

>>96825211
>So they are either soft squating AT or we are getting a new Warlord titan with more plastic weapon options.
That's what happened to the dire wolves, not that out there. AT stuff apparently still sells really well.

Right. Got my first 3 characters for my blackshields. Now all I need to do is find a good source of mk5 bits so I can butcher together marines.

i'm doing a paint project to make a nice mini for each of the original chapters, maybe also the blackshields and knights errant
which armor fits each chapter best?

>>96825211

I'm hoping we get a new starter set to drive interest to the game. There's some Ukrainian recasters that are ok.

>>96825523
no price too high for warhammer gooners and their onions toys

does anyone play with 3rd party rulesets/additions? I really like Liber Panoptica's militia rules (cause 2.0/3.0s are anemic in unit options) but I'm curious to see if anyone plays with other 3rd party army rules or has seen them out in the wild

>>96823330
SEAmonkey.

>>96825895
Post 'em

>>96825424
>Is that Angron sculpts as meh as it looks, or is it the clearly not ideal paintjob that drags it down?
I think the angle's hurting it most, you get more of a sense of dynamism with it when looking down at it from a higher angle

1. is the "make a unit malefic" prime advantage any traitors? or only marine traitors (if so, lame and gay), i.e can i make a mech unit thats in a prime slot malefic? (no, not via heterodoxist)

2. ....do heterodoxists just cast cyberthurgic rites at their FULL INT characteristic?
malefic states "models with the malefic sub-type are not affected by special rules that negatively modify their leadership, cool, willpower or intelligence characteristics", and cyberthurgic rites state under invocation checks "the difficulty value of the cyberthurgic rite is applied as a negative modifier to the focus' intelligence characteristic" (theres also the malefic -1 and the target isnt mech -1 too)

SURELY theres something i'm missing here?

>>96825820
Castellax actually can't get BS5, they're WS/BS3 innately and need to get buffed to BS4, and they only have a 6++ in melee. But they're also only 5 points more, base T6, and come with a pirate of bolters or flamers and have firestorm to shoot twice

>>96826177
>is the "make a unit malefic" prime advantage any traitors? or only marine traitors (if so, lame and gay), i.e can i make a mech unit thats in a prime slot malefic? (no, not via heterodoxist)
Only legiones astartes unit can take true believers

>>96826177
>malefic states "models with the malefic sub-type are not affected by special rules that negatively modify their leadership, cool, willpower or intelligence characteristics"
An invocation check is not a special rule, it's a type on intelligence check. There's a very specific definition of what a special rules, it's things like Fear or Armorbane.

>>96825523
Holy fuck 900 USD for that piece of shit? My god sigmarxist really are the lowest of the low.

>>96826236
>900 USD
*excluding applicable taxes

>>96826236
It can get so much worse.

Well...guess I'm getting laid off...3 weeks after I got promoted
Good thing I already bought all the models I was planning to for my word bearers, so that should keep my occupied for a good 6 months and I can pivot to cheaper and smaller army size games after like necromunda I guess

>>96826544
Sorry to hear that, Anon

>>96825425
holy shit I had to do a double take when I saw everything was painted and fun terrain. This is amazing anon.

What ratio of lightning claws to thunder hammers on night raptors?

>>96826544
What sector did you work in? I’m sorry man

>>96826224
ah okay, makes sense

shame any traitor cant get "make a unit malefic", i'd have loved some malefic myrmidons

>>96826895
Don't worry you'll get that when they sell you back the proscribed techno Arcana in journal tactica: the Martian civil war: part 1

gotta bring up comptroller vs vanguard thing as I noticed something while reading the mech book

support unit special rule says
"A unit that includes any models with the support unit (X) special rule may only ever score a maximum number of victory points equal to the value of X for controlling an objective, regardless of the value of that objective, or any other special rules models in that unit might have (such as the line (X) special rule)

Vanguard DOES NOT have this last sentence (and in fact instead tells you to see the core missions in the rulebook)
thus, I think that it's the intention that comptroller stacks? otherwise vanguard or comptroller would have this little sentence in it
thoughts?

i'll ask around as well mayne

>>96826987
I'm so glad I'm the only mech player in my area so I don't have to be embarrassed by waacfags this desperate

>>96820665
GJ Chogo bro

>>96827038
hey, I dont wanna cheat and the "vanguard stops it" argument is flimsy based on what the rule tells you to look at

theres literally 2 different intentions the rule is giving off

>>96825425
VENGA BUS IS COMING!

>>96827059
The reason is he's still mad at the Emperor telling him he can't bring horses on the Great crusade so he has to settle for bikes and jetbikes, then turns around and looks at the space wolves, death korps, attillan rough riders, and even the mechanicum lol

>>96826311
Abaddon is a character people actually care about.

>>96827126
he should have died at the Saturine gambit, RIP

>>96827112
Trying out an onslaught mission for the first time this Saturday, bringing out the myrmidax cohort, blood slaughterers, and greater brass scorpion to defend against my buddy's ultramarines and knights, excited for them with the expectation that they'll probably lose because it's my first playing with nearly every model in the list lol

>>96825602

Only the Lord has their old WS/BS5, but they're not too shabby. Solid Vanguard unit since they have actually good guns, and they're not so dependent on being buffed all the time. If you attach a caster you can bump them up to BS5 or BS6 on the Lord, and if that squad gets into melee combat the Lord becomes at least a Champion-tier challenger purely because The Myrmidon's Path goes hard at BS levels high enough to score AP2 D2-3 crits.
I think they're just squeezed between Castellax Destructors with a scoring cybernetica Magos attached on one end of their role and Thallax with a ton of photon thrusters on the other.

>>96827271
what guns should I give them?
I feel like for the amount of shots you're getting+good BS, darkfires are the way to go for just about everything
the conversion beamer not having a 30"+ mode really hurts it but AP3 small blasts is still solid

So why were they meeting in secret?

>>96821163

I like the look of this. The EC and Sons of Horus traits make melee dreads (and WS4 termies, in the former case) very solid picks, there's lots of good stuff to supplement them and the +morale bonus for picking only two legions is a cute bit of game design.

My Istvaan 3 Survivors force was already 1500pts of Mech, 700 of AAF Blackshields and 800 of Death Guard, maybe I produce the most snowflake army possible and go for 800pts of DG/WE Shattered Legions instead so I can perfectly line up my model count from each legion with Morturg's testimony.
Sucks to swap the DG Inductii out for Tacs, but in exchange I get Move Through Cover, the morale bonus and a cosmetic Word Bearer trait, so it works mechanically.

>>96827412

My three Destructors have Darkfires, although I haven't gotten a game in with them yet. Beamers seem solid, but Mechanicum has far more efficient ways to carpet-bomb MEQ off the table. Darkfires have a nice wide target profile and they can finish off almost any injured squad to get you Vanguard points if possible.

It is slightly annoying that Myrmidax, Macrotek, Malagra and Reductor Magi get fuck-all use from Comptroller because all the units they can match arcana with with are either Automata, have Vanguard or lose half their movement when they join a Magos. It would perhaps have been nice if Secutors didn't have it.

>>96827446

(sorry, cosmetic World Eaters trait, no WB in this army)

>>96827414
Russ didn't want anybody to know he bit Horus' dick off

played against one of the 1e xenos fandexes and it was pretty ok
bog standard "what the fuck is a tomb world?" mechanicum affair getting ambushed by a bunch of necrons
wraiths are absolutely silly since they have a 3+ invuln but everything else went down pretty easily

>>96826311
>1:6

why would you want a 40cm statue of Abaddon of all things

at least get one of that lady commissar from a few years back or something

is the game good

>>96827725
no

>>96827725
yes

>>96826987
Vanguard does have that sentence

compare

>may only ever score a maximum number of victory points equal to the value of X for controlling an objective

with

>may only ever score 1 Victory Point for Controlling an Objective, regardless of that Objective’s value

the "regardless of that Objective's value" means no other Special Rule can alter it - you could have an Objective that should be worth 1+5 bonus VP for Controlling when all special rules are taken into account, but a Vanguard unit would only get 1 VP regardless; there's no need to specify that another Special Rule can't change that

now if there were a rule that could temporarily or permanently lift Vanguard from a unit and replace it with something (or nothing), then that would be different, because that unit wouldn't have Vanguard and wouldn't be subject to the VP cap, but Comptroller (X), Line (X) and even Support Unit (X) don't do that

is it worth using the special weapon options for csm

>>96827778
huh? what a csm?

>>96827788
Buddy was a little lost and posted in the thread with the heresy era mk3 thousands sons instead of the one with the big tiddy Eldar, somehow

>>96822875
OK he makes 7K SoH and then what? Where he will find armor, guns, and ammunition for them? Officers? Supplies? Are they going to fight naked? And what good are 7K Inductii who should be obliterated with ease by single UM or DA chapter seeing they brought fresh veterans with actual cohesion and combat experience?

Dropsite massacre is already on amazaon/audible for all you good goys

>>96827529
*and he liked it

>>96821912
>1.0 Blackshields
>broken
pick one and only one, the closest thing to broken was the +1 S/T trait in ZM and the list scaled like ass due to armour and vehicle rules.

>>96827861
fake news

>>96827725
3rd really sucks balls, but now each edition lasts only 3 years so maybe it'll be better then - or maybe it'll just have blast templates removed for accessibility and points costs removed, since they want the 40k audience. Either way you'll need to buy new books and re-learn everything all over again. Hurray

>>96823831
You are almost literally me, I don't like Abnett either and I haven't read any of the siege books.

>>96822875
Back on Terra, Archamus goes to meet Dorn.
Rations are only given to those who express fealty to the Imperial Truth.
The Dark Angels take over the pacification of Terra while the Space Wolves take over space duties around the sol system and the blockading of Mars.
This allows the Ultramarines to consolidate their forces for taking Luna.

Dorn sends out his remaining marines in ships to places around sol where the traitors were strong to look for signs of chaos.
He also has a meeting with Kyril Sindermann and they come to an agreement where Dorn will give him funds and a secure location to study chaos and how best to combat it.

Archamus goes off on the search for chaos.

Hassan pays a visit to the golden throne as he wants to retrieve Malcador's body, along the way he encounters a custodian with black robes and another with almost fully black armour.
He is stopped from getting too close by Amon, from a distance Hassan can see that the Emperor's face is stuck in a frozen scream.
It turns out someone else already claimed Malcador's body.

Everyone prepares for the Luna invasion, marines, mechanicum, excertus and the army.
Prayton meets and invites Atok and his fellow Salamanders to join him in the first wave.
Prayton notices that Atok has an inactive force sword taken from a cultist they found (julatta got it from the thousand son).

No primarchs participate in the invasion, they give a few reasons but mostly it seems none of them want any other to get glory and prestige. They also want to be the ones calling the shots and if they leave Terra then their brothers influence grows.
Rumours begin to spread of what happened in Ultramar during the heresy.
They all fear more treachery.

>>96827839
They don't intend to win anything just fight for the sake of it.

>>96827534
Badass. Fluffy. Fun.

Great job guy.

>>96823516
All high ranking people seem to know it. And Vulkan speaks of it pretty openly to Prayton earlier that his brothers only want him because of his 'gift'.

>>96819995
>>96824697
>>96824866
This is the extent of her so far.
Wouldn't be surprised if adb forced it in since she is a non-character.

>>96828203
funny that he crowbars in a femstode but his lizard brain ensures she's just a footnote

>>96823303
I always have motive mastery (+2 on full stride and charge orders)
I usually take gunnery command (+2 on first fire and split fire orders) unless I use a myrmidon maniple in which case I pick something funky to try out.
Sometimes I'll take Engines of War instead of Gunnery Command so I can take an Axiom Maniple of 2 warlords and 2 reavers.
I did try Noble Lineage there once and it was okay.

>>96827941
It's up for Australia so maybe it will take a bit more for other regions

>>96828203
Why Lion, Russ and Dorn meet in secret? They plan treason against Guilliman or what?

>>96828203
ADB added mandatory important foid to his books even before GW and BL went full Woke.

>>96828052
Just play 2.0 with some tweaks.

>>96824856
Looks fine anon

>>96822902
Correct.

Plasma cannons on Scimitar Jet bikes?

I want to read about gengis kahn mans but pirate bay failed me. Anyone know where i can get the torrents for the white scar books?

>>96828102
I really like that the chapters have those excerpts from in-setting historical books.

Got a sweet deal on characters, got Kharn, Angron, axe praetor, apothecary, chainfist cataphractii dude, cataphractii dude summoning a bloodletter, Evander Garrius, three JP dudes and one on foot. All that plus 10 despoilers converted out of 40k zerkers for $40.
The only problem is that I was planning on going IF. I guess Garrus is there and one dead IF on Angron's base, lol.

>>96829012
Sound like you have been saved from playing the piss legion

>>96829044
I just like color orange. I guess WE can also be orange-ish. Although classic blue-white is also good.
Color scheme > lore for me and I'd have chosen RG or IH but they're fucking black and I hate that.

>>96829059
But IF are yellow, and WE only use some red towards the latter half of the HH.

How is the Mechanicum in HH 2.0? And how true is this meme?

>>96829092
>How is the Mechanicum in HH 2.0?
"power wise"? Fine, some really strong units there (like the myrmidons)
In terms of in-book balance? Terrible, half the list is worthless and carried by a couple overtuned options

>how true is the meme
Depends on how you choose to play. But they can be the most elite army in the game by virtue of "big robots" and super elite infantry.

>>96829092
Depending on which units you bring, either the most broken OP army in the game or utter garbage. No in between, mechanicum's internal unit balance was a complete joke in 2.0

>meme
Very true. Every army in 40k looks like a horde army, with how much GW keeps lowering the point values to force all the tournamentfags to buy more and more models.
Meanwhile myrmidons in HH were so busted in 2.0 I'm pretty sure an army of nothing but myrmidons could still beat an army twice their point cost, and it might still not be a close game.

>>96829145
How are they as allies? I'm considering grabbing some mech for Flesh is Weak Blackshields for the sheer dark mechanicum conversion opportunities.

>>96829182
>How are they as allies?
The same as they are as an army. Depends on what you take. The balance between units just isnt very good, some units are good, some amazing, many really terrible.
So it depends on what you take in the allied detachment really.

fwiw I believe the proper "darkmech" options were all fine. The blood slaughterer was a cheaper faster, much weaker dreadnought and the !leviathan was exactly that, a !leviathan and subsequently very nasty.

>>96829182
Nta but they can't interact with marines the same ways they do with their own robots because marines are automata and mechanicum things look for the cybernetica subtype. This probably wasn't intentional and got changed in 3.0 but with how weird that specific oath is who knows. In the militia article they specified that no one likes playing against an entirely fearless army (made up of militia that falls over to a stiff breeze mind you) and then they put out that. Then there is the fact that now enemies can clamp krak grenades and melta bombs on basic marines too which doesn't sound too intentional either. Changing the part of the text about switching the type to automata to instead add the cybernetica subtype doesn't feel right either because an already very strong oath now can also be buffed by cybertheurgy allies and these guys lack a cybernetica cortex so that's a fluff error as well.

Tldr. As marines are now automata but not cybernetica mech can't buff nor herd them but the marines lack the programmed behaviour of mech bots which might not be intentional. Just like most 2.0 things you can try to fix broken parts but you risk breaking other things in the process.

>>96829154
>>96829145
What made Myrmidons so busted in 2.0?

>>96829316
T5 3w means theyre really hard to kill, their plasma is really dangerous (they hit on 2s with shooting) and their universal hatred makes them dangerous in melee too (where their s6 power axes ID marines due to rad grenades).

>>96829316
Myrmidussy was too tight, too moist.

>>96829327
Right, what about the big shooty myrmidons, where they broken too?

>>96829316
Tons of damage both with shooting and melee, and incredibly durable for a ridiculously low point cost.

Is there an epub of the Dropsite Massacre yet?

>>96829358
double plasma

>>96822902
maybe in american english, the talking dog of english

>>96824899
You are illiterate

>>96828328
The original custom rules were so abusable that even the new much more reigned in traits never really caught on around me. I do like them though, I always thought loyalists could do something cool with the trait that allows them to switch orders every round instead of once per game

>>96828681
(*Note* "some tweaks" includes but is not limited to: complete ground up rules rewrites for 5 factions, 60% of the rites of war, 40% of the special weapons, all vehicles, blackshields, shattered legions, the entirety of the legacies PDF, and a minimum of 6 legions)

>>96829708
Yeah, anybody saying 2.0 only needs some tweaks either never played, or only played with and against the top tier legions using exclusively dreadnoughts, terminators, and lascannon HSS.

>>96829327
> Hit them with the demolisher cannon no one else was stupid enough to take
Lmao.
> Immediately does after one shot to all the other shit
The one shot was worth it (it wasn't)

Pintle Multi Melta; is it worth 25pts? Doesn't feel like an awful option to give your Rhinos something to do in later turns. Feels like a good chance to ruin someone's day rather than just act as cover.

Am I done yet?

>tfw 2 weeks without a 30k game
I guess I need to start posting models so people can laugh at them

>>96830518
I think most of the pinte weapons are decent. Flamers and havocs are good CC (havocs potentially OP even), meltas give you that nice damage especially since rhinos arent "you look at them and they explode" now

>>96830518
Most of the pintle mounted weapon options seem to have a place now. Except combi-plasma, can't find any reason to take that one over any other weapon.

>>96830518

I think every Rhino should have some kind of Melta. A Combi Melta is 70pts while the Multi is 85pts; Assuming you can't get into Melta range on T1 then the difference is being able to throw a lucky shot on turn 1 and remaining a threat T3-4.

Why aren't exploding results prevalent in Horus Heresy? If 40k has auto-wounds and exploding hits, why didn't HH follow in the same step? Not sure on how such mechanics affect game balance on a larger whole, but I'd like to know why.

>>96830518
I think so. Rhinos are not exactly a joke anymore with AV12 and 5HP. They are not that easy to kill anymore and if they have a MM on the midfield it's probably not a good idea to ignore them
Worst case scenario your opponent has dedicate some heavy weapons to shooting at it rather than something more important
The Heavy flamer also looks fun to be annoying with and it's a lot cheaper tho

>>96830814
Because vehicles getting one shot and exploding or being crippled by every thing that penetrates their armor has always been a terrible mechanic that grew to be an even worse idea the more commonly available anti tank weapons became

>>96830814
Autowounding is fucking retarded and no one liked having their vehicle blow up because of a lucky las canon shot

>>96830904
He means multiple hits on rolls of 6 to hit or similar effects. Its a good question, since there are so many rules in HH both in this edition and last editions that proc on particular hit or wound rolls.

>>96830814
Because they're a cancerous mechanic that leads to mega retarded shit like people re-rolling most of their successful hits because getting more exploding results is better than keeping successful hits.

>>96830958
Good ol' 8th edition kastellax rerolling anything that wasn't a 6 to hit because they would always use that one strat to do a MW on a 6 to hit
I almost miss them sometimes, at least the game had some sauce back then

>>96830936
Multiple hits on a roll of a 6 are effectively +1 or 2 to hit and there's already rules that do that.
It's just a lot less common in HH because no every gun and unit need to have a super special rules

>>96829059
>but they're fucking black

why do they even give us the option of taking chainswords or chain axes on any unit when they do exactly fuck all unless your opponent specifically takes shit units?
If an assault squad is going to be entirely useless unless you pay an additional 50 points replacing their shit weapons and even then they're going to be only nearly useless because WS4, what's the fucking point???

>>96829092
Tech Thralls fill the horde option but most people would rather have killbots and murderborgs.

>>96831042
They did tease us with some new infantry stuff, so hopefully we get proper 30k Tech-Guard. Just loading up on automatas is like playing marines with only vets, dreads and terminators.

>>96831002
Chainswords are effectively +1A on the units that have them and come with shred you dumbass
Chainaxes are very much an upgrade with +1S
>Muh WS4
Post models

>>96831002
Chainswords still do more than they did from 3rd to 7th edition, including 1.0

>>96831002
>There is no reason to ever take anything other than tacticsls because that's all you need to win the game!!
>but also don't you dare take the units expressly designed to threaten tacticals because those apparently useless WS5 units might be there to stop them!

>>96830974
Almost every gun in HH has a special rule and many of tgey have a lot of special rules. Horus Heresy is much worse than 40k for having weapon profiles being a piles of special rules barf. However its much better at not having other random sources applying additional special rules to weapons that are not part of the weapon profile.

>>96831140
how the hell are 20 chainsword attacks going to threaten tacticals, exactly? Or even chainaxe attacks? Or am I spending like 300 points to bully a tactical squad when I could spend that 300 points to be able to kill stuff better than a tactical squad + also the tactical squad?

>>96831262
If you were going to buy a melee unit to kill tacticals it sure as shit would not be an assault squad.

Night raptors with thunder hammers. Ill have the other half of the squad with claws methinks.

>>96831262
Are you new or just retarded?
Despoilers and assault marines are mainly ablative wounds to deliver power weapons.
It's not that hard to understand

>>96831335
>heavy support squads
>a unit that is an avenue for heavy weapons
>comes with heavy weapons

>support squads
>a unit that is an avenue for support weapons
>comes with support weapons

>assault squads
>apparently an avenue for power weapons
>does not come with power weapons
>optionally get to pay 30 extra points beyond base cost for the unit to fulfill its intended role to any capacity
>unit does not perform intended role without this additional, optional investment

yea I guess maybe that's what the designers were going for but uhhh doesn't seem like it

>>96831262
MEQ chainsword vs MEQ is 1/12 to kill anon

slightly less likely than a bolter/bolt pistol, but Despoilers can make Volleys and Tacticals usually can't, so you either shoot the Despoilers before they get close which may not be possible, or you spend a Reaction to Overwatch them when they charge, or you get double-whammied with bolt pistols and melee attacks while making 1A per Tactical

chainaxes are exactly as likely as a bolter/bolt pistol to kill MEQ

oh wait are of the firm belief that a 1 or a 6 is impossible to roll, you dog-eating halfwit

>>96831547
>Despoilers can make Volleys and Tacticals usually can't
??? have you played any games or are you just theorycrafting here buddy

>>96829708
>describes about 80% of the work required to fix 1.0 to the same standard
>>96829755
Or they're just not WAACfaggoids who're happy with the standard GW-tier balance of "eh, it pretty much works" which requires basically four changes(1 dread per 1k, switch around the way Brutal wounds work, get rid of the Interceptor exemptions to how Reactions work, bump up THs by 5-10 points), because they play cool fluffy armies like Our Lord Bligh intended and don't spend their lives on Mongolian basketweaving forums obsessing over fractions of a percent of dice probabilities.

By contrast I can say with certainty that 99.99% of 2.0 haters falls into one of the following few categories: retards who can't into Reactions, tournament cockroaches who spend their whole lives trying to break the game and then whinge that they succeeded, and outraged 1.0 powergamers who hate that their artyspam/mech/custodes/tsons list isn't as strong.

>>96831702
Are you okay?

>>96829708
>>96829755
I wrote my groups 2.5 fixes in a day and the full supplement rules in less than a month. We're really enjoying it so far, playtested a good chunk of stuff and tweaked some things. I think we're going to finalize changing brutal once more to be damage after saves like one anon suggested on here.

All that to say, it's not hard to house/grouprule things. Or steal stuff that folks like me make if you don't want to do the work. Or go back to 1.0, which is a perfectly acceptable thing to do also.

>>96818935 (OP)
anyone got the link to the horus heresy novels mega, realised im missing war without end and i wanna read it

>>96831769
Did you manage to fix mounted/bike units?

>>96832228
In what way? One of the very first changes we made was increasing Toughness by 1 across the board. Did you have other concerns?

Here it is just for when I'm not paying attention.
https://gofile.io/d/AmA6RH

>>96826037
Just finished carving in the battle damage and getting em sprayed.
(Ignore the assassins)

I don't mind GW being a company that is a business. IMO much better then a bunch of hobbiest trying to pretend they run a game.

I do not love the idea of needing to rebuy whole armies and mega nerfs. But I do understand why GW does it . But some stuff they do it just mind blowing, and it is either extremly stupid of 3d chess level.
I mean they release a new edition, everyone gets a new set of rules. Each legion of sm shares a bunch of units with other legions and then has a bunch of cool "only ours"+AL stuff.

The cool legion specific stuff is the driver for you to want to buy those 3000+pts. Maybe even start a new army and rebuy certain (shared with other legions) models. And then GW does stuff like, lets make the White Scar legion rule powerful, but make the WS units bad or without a niche to use. That will draw people to paint their armies WHITE with red diagonal paterns.
DA have to knights and plasma theme. That is their draw. No it doesn't mean that every DA has to be Knight with a plasma canon. But then I look at the Enigmatus, the Iron man, the Interemptors and just think why. And to make it even more mind blowing, there is no patern here. Because when someone legions get very bad units, others get ones dripping with cool rules often for same or even fewer points, then the bad units. I get it maybe in a game like w40k, where you army hop to get the "best" build for next tournament/event/store game. But with HH people play A Legion, heck they sometimes play A Build of a legion. It is as if GW didn't want to make money. And on top of that someone who goes through 3-6 years of bad times, can sometime become a very vocal detractor of GW games. And there are people who will not play GW games, after their interaction with "oh this game has those people".

Or to make it short. I don't understand why GW doesn't give all legion units at least cool/good rules.

>>96832274
well my main concern right now, in this edition. Is that mounted units are exempts from a ton of interactions (scoring, blocking scoring, entering terrain etc) in the game. While not getting anything in return and being on top of that punished by lack of venguard , nevermind line.
On top of that GW seems to have this, IMO cool, idea that venguard or line can be replaced by other characterful rules or ways to play. Which means lacking both of those rules, kind of locks you out of any form of potential new ways to play. It doesn't help that GW did a lot to nerf speeders, especialy the WS one and attack bikes.

>>96832348
Bro you will have to come to accept how mindblowingly fucking stupid GW has been for a long time. It's not new and it's not even isolated to editions of any game system. Even when they make good decisions, they find ways to make you hate them in some manner for it. The only way to stay sane is to pick and choose what you really like and fill in the blanks elsewhere. That sounds a little vague, but you have to apply that attitude to every level and facet of this hobby. lulz

>>96832324
Har is tiny?

>>96829566
The WD traits were insanely broken but the new ones are more tame which makes them better for not-kooky games.
Bit it's a shame you can't naruto-run disruption emitter warlords anymore

>>96831597
uh huh

are you now saying Tacticals and Despoilers are evenly matched, or are you about to pivot back to pistols/bolters/chainswords don't do anything to MEQ

what's your endgame here? pretending to be so autistic that you couldn't possibly grasp the context of what you're replying to? a child could have understood what you're claiming not to understand

are you really dumber than a child, anon?

>>96832555
Harr is huge. But very lent forward. If he was standing upright he'd be a head taller than the champion.

>>96832828
>pistols/bolters/chainswords don't do anything to MEQ
and
>volley fire with bolt pistols is not a feature unique to despoiler squads
can both exist at the same time without needing to pivot anywhere.

I mean even the two options you presented
>are you now saying Tacticals and Despoilers are evenly matched
and
>pistols/bolters/chainswords don't do anything to MEQ
can co-exist.

So what exactly are YOU trying to say here?

My point is and always has been that assault marines with chainswords are terrible and not even good at bullying tacticals. Other people keep saying shit like
>but muh power swords
>but muh volley fire
which are just autists who cannot possibly grasp of the context of what was initially said.

And to be completely clear I never said shit about despoilers because at the end of the day they're "good" because they have Line(2) so even if they never swing their weapons at anything they can at least impact the game, so I don't care if 100pts of despoilers with chainswords/axes can't do anything but shit on an objective for VP but if a unit is so-called designed to bully tacticals it should do it better than paying an extra 10 points per 5 models to get 2 attacks that hit 50% of the time to have a moderate chance to kill more than 1/10th of a squad of tacticals.

>>96832376
I was discussing the efficacy and range of tweaks for 2.0/writing your own rules/returning to older rules sets. I have zero advice for 3.0 besides hope for a vastly improved 4.0 in a few years or write your own 3.5 homebrew in the meantime. Good luck with whatever you choose.

So, no spoilers today?

>>96831769
How many people play SA in your group anon?

>>96832924
Assault marines should never, ever do volley attacks. Their whole strength now is in their high mobility and having a 5" set up move, meaning nothing can volley fire, overwatch or react to getting charged by them. And anti-grav means hiding behind terrain or intervening units also doesn't work. And with twice as many attacks as tactical marines, they will win close combat eventually. But they don't even have to, all assault marines gotta do is lock tacticals in combat because units in an assault don't claim or contest objectives. They are ideal to bully tactical squads or HSS with, not to mention wreck vehicles with low rear AV with their krak grenades.

But yes if you purely only look at damage output and ignore all other aspects of the game assault marines look bad.

>>96833548
>But yes if you purely only look at damage output and ignore all other aspects of the game
Come on anon, where do you think you are, this is the WS5 Cataphractii Terminator capital of the world since at least 2012

>>96833575
I know, it's why I rarely respond to posts about units or strategy. If people are still convinced thunder hammer terminators are the absolute peak of tactical expertise after all this time, nothing will change their perspective on anything.

I really hope they do something interesting with mk4 and make it fit with the redesigns of the other marks.

>Veteran Heavy Support Squad
>BS 4
Why are legions giving the most expensive guns to only their least accurate veterans? Are they stupid?

>>96833768
It’s going to look exactly like your pic but with less ornamentation.

>>96833485
2 people. One has them for allies, the other as a full fledged force.

>‘There can be no warning. No signal. I have said this. I have explained this.’

>‘Actions are all that matters!’ The shout is sudden, an axe blow to any sense of calm. ‘Honour needs no explanation. I need no greater right or truth.’

>‘Spoken like a tyrant son of a king.’ It is Mortarion, air sucking between words, voice a rasp. The Death Lord takes a step from the shadows so that the three primarchs are a triangle, with Angron at the narrowest point. ‘You are a selfish child, Angron. You do not agree, and so you would break what we make. You would make all of us pay the price for your sense of what is right. You would kill us and our warriors – not for their ideals, but yours. Just like our father.’

>For a second Maloghurst thinks that Angron will lunge at his brother as he did Fulgrim. But the Red Angel does not move. He just stares, transfixed, like a beast struck between its eyes. The Death Lord turns his back, bows his head to Horus and stalks out of sight. Horus looks at Angron. Maloghurst can tell that the Warmaster is waiting. Choosing, considering what to say. If anything can be said.

>Angron’s face twitches, then he too turns and is gone. The gathered leaders of the Warmaster’s host watch him go.

Mic drop moment

>>96833851
>It’s going to look exactly like your pic but with less ornamentation.
You have no idea how much I want this to be true

>>96834033
>You're acting just like dad
>emotional crit

Raptor squad built. The helmets really dont play nice with the MKII bodies, future squads will probably use just the regular NL helmets since those arent as wide.

This is now a whole box of stuff I need to prime.

It's like 30% a Khârn story for some reason.

>>96834033
morty seems to be enjoying himself in every part you've posted

Melee weapons on tactical vet sgts, yay or nay? I remember an anon here suggesting it and it does sound interesting, but is it actually worth it?

>>96834479
100% nay. 2 attacks with WS4 so he'd never swing a single battle from loss to win and 3+/0 armor means he both deals no damage and wasting 15 points on a fist would just give enemies free money when he's the easiest precision kill ever.
Vet tacticals are a unit who are borderline bad already and guaranteed trash if you have them in melee combat at all.

It'd have been worth it if GW knew how to design games and made melee upgrades 5 points for weak melee squads and 15 points for super melee squads, but GW are retard children so anyone buying elite gear on units too crappy to accomplish anything with it is a losing idea.

>>96834599
Well, I can probably semi-reliably get him to WS5 with the NL legion trait. But yea, that was more or less my consideration for why I didnt do it originally (its not really enough to make the unit actually good in melee).

Not sure why tactical vets would be bad, they seem like a pretty cheap unit for the package youre getting (2w bs5)

Anyone have any experience magnetizing the main guns on a deimos vindicator? Not sure How I'll make and/or insert something into the demolisher cannon to hold the magnets.

>>96834699
15 points for 2 bolter shots hitting on 2+ is objectively dogshit compared to 10 points for 3 bolter shots hitting on 3+.
And most of the upgrade guns are terrible, unlike heavy supports. They're not actually durable for the cost, as they have no invuln and 2W each just makes them exactly as easy to kill as 1 wound models for the meta weapons (hammers, fists, phoenix spears, etc) in which case you pay 50% extra for 0% extra durability. They're only Line(1) instead of Line(2) so you pay 50% extra to get 50% worse objective bonus for them. They're useless in melee. Disintegrators, their gimmick, are mediocre in 3rd edition, you pay extra points like it's god's chosen gun and yet they're trash weapons where everytime you fire them it eliminates several of your veterans via overloading (and that includes if you want to return fire at enemy shooting the vets). Unlike plasma guns, there's not a "return fire but don't overload" mode, so vets are forced to either be 100% defenseless pacifists or do massive self-damage. And they perform even worse compared to troops because they take up an elite slot which there's a shortage of (whereas troops are in excess) and there's plenty of times Troops get bonus Prime Advantage buffs unlike elites. Troop tacticals even get access to a free prime teleport option to appear anywhere on the board a few inches from the enemy and open fire on it (so they can teleport onto an objective if the enemy is standing in spots and wipe out wounded enemy units)

There are some tiny amount of niche situations where veteran tacticals wouldn't be trash, but it's very much not the norm.

>>96833548
responding to a post saying volley fire with assault marines is bad by saying volley fire on assault marines is bad and then denigrating the tactical acumen of the post you're replying to sure is a choice you made

>>96834033
> Angron is a stupid shit
Full story at 11

>>96834918
>15 points for 2 bolter shots hitting on 2+ is objectively dogshit compared to 10 points for 3 bolter shots hitting on 3+.
Its 0.83 wounds vs 1 wound, assuming the tactical stands still. In return you have twice the durability.

>>96835016
>>96835016
>>96835016

>>96834918
>2W each just makes them exactly as easy to kill as 1 wound models for the meta weapons (hammers, fists, phoenix spears, etc
Anon, if you have tactical vets in combat with a thunder hammer melee unit (meaning what, vets, terminators, command squads) you fucked up and the durability for everything short of a terminator is nothing.

2w is very relevant against the threat profile they (and tacticals) will be facing, small arms fire. 15ppm is not the sort of target you fire lascannons at.

>>96835020
the reason you are a total retard is anyone can buy 30 tacticals for the cost of 20 naked vets. That's 60 hits vs "veterans" scoring only 33. Almost an 100% increase in offense.
30 wounds vs 40 wounds is only a 33% increase in wounds instead of the 100% extra bolter hits (and again - the second ANY dmg2 weapons are ever used, the tacticals are actually tankier than the vets because they're 10 points per wound while a thunderhammer makes vets into 15 points per wound as well)

>>96835061
>the second ANY dmg2 weapons are ever used, the tacticals are actually tankier than the vets
And the second ANY template weapons are used your 30 man blob is going to evaporate. Which one is more likely, precious D2 shooting going at cheap tactical vets or the exact weapons made to hose low tier infantry being used on low tier infantry?

>>96835061
>tacticals standing still
>in the "run at objectives" edition

>>96835076
Yep. It’s why ashen circle being considered a mid tier unit and saturnine being called awful is stupid. These units have signs above their heads telling people they evaporate infantry for fun and people still can’t read it

>>96830518
Seems like waac-faggotry to me

>>96832479
you are definitly right. I just don't know what people do when GW does a change that makes your army illegal or border unfun to play. Especialy if they can't afford to rebuy the whole army in one go.

I man 4 tacticals, 2 rhinos, 2 land raiders, 2 predators, 1 kratos is over 2 of my monthly salaries. Even if I used the stuff I have now, which is bad. That is like 4+ years of saving up. In 4+ years we are going to be end of middle 4th ed? For all we know tanks could be bad then, and it could be all about jump troops or fliers or who knows what.