Thread 212099777

You know if they had turned Aliens into a fairytale like Peter Pan or an ancient Arthurian legend or an aesop like David & Goliath then Aliens & Giger would have had way more lasting power instead of references & tributes and barely 4 films in 20 years by Fox.

I MUST HAVE HIGH QUALITY IMAGINATIVE DISCUSSION ON THIS CAMBODIAN BASKETWEAVING AMERICAN-CHINESE FORUM IMAGEBOORU HYBRID.

If Giger or someone had actually written a world design book on the level of JRR Tolkien then Aliens would have had way more lasting power. Throughout media Predator & Aliens only had what can be considered references and tributes to them rather than actual retellings of the story like Disney's retellings of fairytales.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cqzYjWLqgNA&list=RDcqzYjWLqgNA&start_radio=1&ab_channel=Sega-Mag

>>212099777 (OP)
The Alien(s) brand has actually been in a very unique situation punching way above its weight, glancing at how different and nonetheless high quality its entries are. After a decade and a half hiatus post Resurrection, Prometheus and Covenant even took things into an (aesthetically) classicist direction, which gave them cultural staying power but not massive box office success. David & Goliath Alien, while great on paper, roars Predator, so the problem should be apparent right away. I agree they ought go for a Peter Pan story eventually and Prometheus 2: Paradise might've even had comparable qualities, had it been made. Not sure how you'd make Alien properly Arthurian, though, perhaps in a Grail quest way, which Prometheus somewhat did already, the black goo turning out to be a sort of anti-Grail.

Now with steady Disneyfication, we might well be royally fucked. Romulus was mediocre and Earth is a coin flip from what I can tell. Prey and the Predator brand they surely plan to crossover with, are the products of a video game brained manchild, as occurs to me. Hope hinges on Earth delivering more than FOTMslop and the increasingly unlikely happenstance that Fassbender's David character receives a satisfying conclusion.

The music is very nice typical of quality Hollywood productions, but there's nothing unique about it. There's no memorable leitmotifs

>>212099777 (OP)
OP, you mind if I turn this into a bit of an image dump? Only good shit, of course.

>>212100270
From having watched Alien1979 recently again I can see why it punches above its weight. I haven't watched a more wholesome "horror" movie than Alien, it almost felt like some sitcom show in space between friends. Even when the crew is on edge and complaining they still act like adults taking the shit on each other and not dramamongering teenagers like most people were expecting out of a horror movie. The cat lives despite Ripley dropping it. Ripley survives despite originally feeling like she's the doctor from Alien 3, a character that feels like a red herring that gives his backstory and then promptly dies.

That juxtaposition and contrast is what makes audiences put their butts in seats and appreciate it. They need familiarity and shielding.
Because the moment you put it from the perspective of the space jockey or Alien you lose your wholesome audience and attract a difference audience with far different standards and expectations.
Hellraiser attracts a much different audience than Alien & Aliens despite Hellraiser being right up Alien's alley. Same with Riddick same with a lot of IPs that have themes and aesthetics that seamlessly blend together.

Resurrection, Alien 3 and Prometheus attempted to attract a different audience, but it was obvious their directors had nothing to do with the directors of Hellraiser and similar venues such as The Shawshank Redemption that beats Alien 3 and most prison escape movies into next tuesday. With Riddick Escape from Butcher Bay also beating the shit out Alien 3 and Resurrection. Resurrection was something "weird" where the hybrid alien and weyland yutani idea unlike Alien 3's depression was held in the background rather than in the foreground because the director obviously had no intention of telling the lifestory of scientist Chucky & Ellen Ripley clone as they tried to live in a prison laboratory facility like how Alien 3 did by taking so long with showing the prisoners doing their daily tasks.

>>212100730
Have you read The Tourist? cause I have not. I intend to read it, but something tells me I should not expect anything just like with Species. Species is what audiences were expecting out of Alien; a dumb horror flick for slop lovers who just sit their butts in the seats for a cheap thrill.

>>212100528
Go right ahead.

>>212100707
Still the best AvP game in terms of singleplayer. The graphics have aged but the game still holds up because of the lighting and pace.

>>212100730
>Hellraiser
To be fair, Kirsty isn't too dissimilar from Ripley. What keeps her beneath 'ole Ellen is the fact the movie shows her slutting it up, while Ripley is a mom, lewd shots or not. And, if it needs spelling out, Weaver's magnificent facial bone structure.

>>212099777 (OP)
>>212100707
that is a good video game

>>212099777 (OP)
Predator did just that with the "it hunts during a hot summer" and also it's based on a /x/ story about WW1 soldiers encountering an insectoid super soldier, but everybody at Fox and apparently Disney is too much of a piece of shit to follow its guidelines.
Fox treated its own IP like a bastard child it didn't want. The actual British production company were the only ones who cared about Alien https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandywine_Productions they of course butted heads with the Americans severely. Goes to show that Britbongs understand and appreciate goth stuff a lot more than merrimutts.

>>212099850
>>212099777 (OP)
>>212100270

A.i posts

>>212101110
Ah Brutalism architecture is already seen. Too bad it was behind the scenes.

>>212099777 (OP)
O'Bannon & James Cameron got lucky by using a structure often seen in crime drama thriller detective stories together with teenage horror. Lots of talking and filler but instead of annoying teenagers it's young adults and grown ass men talking sci-fi stuff and weapons in Aliens case.
There's tension inbetween that wholesome messing around, but what's interesting but absolutely normal in any detective movie is ... that once the murderer hits his victim like a viper ... the tension deescalates instead of the opposite as it normal.
Most horror movies do not have that advantage.
Normally once the facehugger hit the tension only raises higher, the victim does not walk it off as if nothing happened like a red herring.
Same with Aliens.
Then the structure repeats itself. Normally you do not see that in a horror movie hence Alien 3 & Ressurection ... once shit hits the fan ... there's no turning back to everyone minding their own business as if nothing happened.
Alien 1 & Aliens 2 goes through the whole anticipation, tension, climax, etc. twice. That's why they're so long... and again you normally see Detective movies being 2 hours long. Even horror movies usually are no longer than 90 minutes even less, you don't see horror movies being 2 hours and 30 minutes long since they don't have much to say. There's no plot to unravel. Horror is like a weaker detective thriller genre, almost like a subgenre of Thriller. Horror usually doesn't bother going through everyone's backstory unlike detective shows where you NEED THAT in order to get that Agatha Christie plot going on to let your audience judge who might be the killer, who's a red herring, etc. both Alien & Aliens have a traitor among them who practically helped the murderer.

>>212100803
The combat is tight.

Scorn.
Dark Seed
Direct homages to Giger.

There were a few more which were not direct homages.

>>212102106
I told you to clean your corn before you eat it, man. Damn Children of the Corn references.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EF98G8lWZeA&ab_channel=AdultSwimEurope

Won't post Mutilated Shaw #2, it's too horny.

System Shock, Signalis, Blame! , WH40k Tyranids, Spirits Within, Starcraft, Morrowind 3, DUNE, Metroid, Hellraiser, the list goes on and on and on with a lot of unheard of niche games such as Joymax's Atrox taking inspiration from Lovecraft and Giger and many other influences.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NaDn0dF7bBk&list=RDNaDn0dF7bBk&start_radio=1&ab_channel=DarkNation


>>212101971
Also they got lucky with Giger's biomechanoid designs painted black because back then anything porceilain and biological looking was obvious that it was plastic and fake.
The Alien on the other hand had a massive advantage by being mechanoid by its nature and thus all the metal & plastic & material did not have to simulate a 100% biological being, but a robot that isn't a quite and all that black made it not as obvious.
Also bones, bones are something weird that are very easy to fake because they're not flesh. Bones and metal go extremely well together like bread and butter.

The alien's pearly white glossy see-through white teeth and seethrough aesthetic and steam coming out of it mistaken for a ghostly appearance absolutely makes audiences doubleguess what the hell it is and is 2x uncanny valley.
The less fleshy the Alien looks the better.

Yep initially envisioned as a transulescent creature.
https://youtu.be/FvOCWvI5JF4?t=374
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j6cu_NnEXTw&ab_channel=MaciekKarbownik

Image dump done for now.

>>212102461
>what too much monster does to a fella

>>212099777 (OP)
Predator 2 is the 3rd best film in the alien/predator franchise. Aliens wishes its atmosphere was as kino as scorching LA

>>212099777 (OP)
Cameron doomed the franchise to mediocrity. Scott tried to salvage it with the prequels but it was too late.

>So how would you make the world design?
Mysteryfrens got a point that it undermines the mystery, but I don't think it would undermine the uncanny valley. Sadly DarkHorse comics and many new friends nowadays seem to think too highly of the canon, that once a canon is established you can no longer work around it nor completely invalidate it despite Hollywood constantly doing it without a second thought.
Copying existing stories, religions, human concepts such as tanks, hierarchy, etc. like Dark Horse and Killer of Killers did does indeed make your audience bored cause "Oh it's just Egyptians but with Beyblade and YuGiOh" "Oh it's just another civil war but with a biomechanoid paint applied on top".

As such while I appreciate everyone saying aliens are nothing biblical, nothing too deep, even just necro ants or niche parasitoid wasps that are bottom of the food chain in their world that's highly dangerous and only the strongest survive ... I do not like the idea of thematic ice,lava,acid,desert,spike,gooey,earth cave,void worlds.
I do appreciate instead putting the aliens in a MC Escher world, Brutalism, and a Blame! world.
The cave walls done in James Cameron's Aliens never came off as distinct from the desk space jockey ship and the deleted scenes' resin that is literally Giger's art.

All the fanatical religions connotions? A small footprint. It would be like science worshippers appreciation the shape of DNA itself and the bacteriophage's shape. It would give a little more substance to Ash's "structural perfection" comment, Weyland's obsession with learning from it and even Spiderman Symbiote's allusions of having something to offer , again almost like Weyland was either aware of controlled of it. Typical and generic but from a
https://spiderman-animated.fandom.com/wiki/Promethium_X
https://youtu.be/oIg1aEYrXWw?t=86

The strangerchanger xenomorph just being DNA itself that adapts a little too well. Just a natural space occurrence that is considered by many intellects normal is how the Alien could be handled. Just like the nanoworlds, but again with a propher mathematician's touch or a proper architecture engineer's touch; MC Escher & Tsutomu Nihei, respectively. Or in this case Giger's love for guns and trauma over birth where a baby and its mother is connected a dozen apparratus and injected with a bunch of needles and substances. Doctors are natural gritty psychos, not everyone can be a doctor. Not everyone has the appreciation for nature's parasites and life's viruses, cancer and science, which makes it scary, uncanny and rightfully dangerous in the hands of normals and morons, but beautiful and full of endless potential in the hands of an intellect.
Just got to actually get an actual intellect and not a monkey with a camera to write the script or the bottomest rank of the LOST series writer which I do not and I cannot understand how they both have fallen in their talent so much, the culture/the current era really influences and degrades us all who engage with it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLt4ZXcDdIQ&ab_channel=PlayStation

Familiarity in characters from cats to humans in contrast with the uncanny valley and create audience attachment... but respect for the uncanny valley by not lowering it to the levels of Starship Troopers' non book versions. Promise of At The Mountains of Madness with actual competence. A segway and half translation into the world of the uncanny by a third party Alien that does not reveal its secrets but presents itself well and makes you more curious while learning its basics and small neat features, while having a world design writer fully prepared with endless books about the world and how it neatly works.
The warframes from Warframe. The Tennos are explained just like The Engineers, but the warframes/aliens themselves are not.

>>212102581
>>212102609
>>212102632
>>212102661
Should have been his own scifi series. It's a neat design and the idea had a lot of potential. Zero reason to restrict the movie to a shitty barren rock world except them pretending it's le Alien prequel it's obviously not.

Take an eldritch character with a history, shove it into The Honeymooners In Space or Vietnam and suddenly you have all your in-world characters audiences scratching their heads who was that guy cause he seemed important. With a history and ability much stronger than Jason & Freddy.
As such we go back to Ridley & O'Bannon's idea that the xenomorph was still in a larval state and did not reach its final proper evolution due to environment and other things. As such a new powerful xenomorph breed could be introduced that elevates them to universal threats and cures, seraphim and demons, but as usual copying from sources not everyone is familiar with such as MC Escher or sources nobody understands.

>>212103722
I don't mind it (only the quality of the images posted, for which I'm sorry).

It could've been its own thing but marketability would've suffered. Look at Raised by Wolves. Excellent show canned after 2 seasons.

>>212103722
Ridley really wanted to tell "his" android story "he" ripped off from Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep? adapted by Hampton Fancher and David Peoples into Bladerunner.
I found Fancher's villains and heroic secondary characters a million times more interesting in Bladerunner than Harrison Ford... just like many people have said Batman is the least interesting character and the villains surrounding him are a million times more intriguing.

It's just unfortunate that most drawfags are not writers and that includes Hans Ruedi.

>>212103845
Still got canned kek. It wasn't marketable at all since everyone was expecting it to fulfill on its promise. Instead it just bait and switched everyone.

>>212103845
>>212103722
Spirits Within and a bunch of other things did similar shit much to their own detriment ... in Spirits Within case to an exceptional detriment since it went from magic fantasy to sci-fi Starcraft/StarshipTroopers/WH40k and unlike Warhammer it really did not copy anything at all from its other IP, but they needed the marketing.

>>212103722
>Should have been his own scifi series.
I find it impressively pathetic how manchildren companies like 20th Century Fox survive for so long even still persisting underneath Disney instead of every executive, supervisor, etc. being blacklisted and fired completely from ever touching anything at all. I'm impressed Brandywine productions is even allowed and Disney didn't just make their own in-house production company and executives take care of it.

Meanwhile much more entertaining and marketing-pro extroverted companies such as Nintendo, Capcom, etc. treated their production studios and creatives with much more respect, admiration and intelligence in marketing.
Spiderman, Batman, TMNT, Megaman all treated with marketing & creativity as one rather than separated. The companies never fought among each other.
Megaman had like 7 spin-off series running at the same time.
People want a more mature Megaman for teenagers? give them Megaman X.
People want Megaman's arch rival but in a post apocalyptic era? Give them the Zero series.
People want the new generation of what happened after Zero died? give them ZX.
People want the digital Pokemon Beyblade tournament era where they can self insert and keep Megaman as a PET? give them Megaman Network Warriors.
And they each received a video game and an anime series ... for the most part ... the fact the video games barely touched 3D and FPS is another can of worms.

I'm not sure what Fox's loveboner was for APJAC Productions and Planet of the Apes which got so many sequels, high-budget TV Show, video games, etc.
compared to Alien where one of the executives was downright disgusted by Giger's artwork and told his caretaker to send him back to Switzerland.
Same with how distracted and sabotaging the executives, directors, Fox was to Brandywine productions since the 1st film and miraculously there were no deaths and sueing over creative liberties and tea time in Alien 3. Almost felt like The Company.

>>212104287
>downright disgusted by Giger's artwork and told his caretaker to send him back to Switzerland
To be fair, they've only ever used like two ideas of his. The creature and the space jockey. They didn't like his eggs, or the additional sexual imagery, or the luscious lips on the alien, etc. Maybe they could have used his style for a creepy engineer city. But they've already started shitting on the creature making it more retarded and far less scary anyway, so who cares.

Brandywine Productions had a significant and often contentious relationship with 20th Century Fox, primarily through their co-production of the "Alien" franchise. The partnership involved both creative collaboration and legal disputes, particularly concerning profit-sharing from the films.

APJAC Productions, founded by Arthur P. Jacobs, had a significant relationship with 20th Century Fox, particularly in the mid-1960s. APJAC released its first film, What a Way to Go!, through 20th Century Fox in 1964, and followed up with Doctor Dolittle. 20th Century Fox also produced the Planet of the Apes franchise, which APJAC produced. In 2019, 20th Century Fox was acquired by The Walt Disney Company, and the studio was subsequently renamed 20th Century Studios.

Perhaps someone more knoweldgeable on Arthur Powell Jacobs' relationship with 20th Century Fox's executives can shed some light on how Arthur had such a good relationship with the directors Fox sent and with Fox's executive and overall a smooth production compared to Brandywine where in every intereview it's common knowledge that they butted heads with Fox every single time.

So anyway, we all know prometheus and covenant are not part of alien. Predator neither, it was just a fun game/toy tie-in. The Alien franchise' biggest fuckup was not retconning Alien 3, and not having a "Lucas" come in to create an actually story arc. Someone with a passion, and ideas for a long multi movie story, with many characters and factions. Just giving it to random directors to makeup whatever shit they want with no regard to anything else doesn't work. It's baffling how they thing that could ever generate something worthwhile. And no, Ridley nor Cameron would be right. Cameron doesn't give a shit about a long story. He makes big blockbusters you don't think to much about then moves on. Ridley never wrote shit in the first place and didn't care about most of the stuff fans liked. Ridley likes Androids and creations with daddy issues.

>>212104672
I'd say I'm surprised DarkHorse never attempted to write world design, but similar to Marvel there is no cohesion and they're just a lowly paid writer with a limited available amount of pages. The most they could do is create a few characters and locations like the red aliens, new technology from the marines, etc. but nothing grand that could be its own world. Nothing on the level of Tolkien.


https://www.youtube.com/shorts/v1MWGuG31GQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EOgVcvFYvRk&t=450s&ab_channel=TheLeaderboard
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mx_Dvxh1Hjo&ab_channel=Jethild
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrtBqmxwaN4&ab_channel=MovieFacts
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=intJPrVtNh4&ab_channel=Luetin09
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=on45nTFmce4&ab_channel=SockSensei

I just want some sort of ending to David story. Anything really at this point.

>>212100707
we have to go back even further

https://youtu.be/SdX87mJXHk0?si=T1pB_4TNxvC4audG

>>212106530
I don't. It's pretty obvious where they'd go with it. He's be an evil overlord of a horde of thousands of xenos. Using them to attack Earth because he hates all humans. Wow. The primary reason everyone gave Ridley's Prometheus a shot was for the promise of a fresh and interesting tale of Humanity's creators and how they changed over the eons. He didn't deliver on that. No one but you and Ridley gives a shit about David the angry android.

>>212106530
Here's your ending to David's story:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NoAzpa1x7jU&ab_channel=GuillermoSt
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbTt31YvqvM&ab_channel=TheLaymansMedia

>mfw watching Alien 3 - I get it now.
https://www.avpgalaxy.net/alien-movies/alien-3/7-things-you-didnt-know-about-alien-3/

My mind subconsciously thought that during this scene Ripley was hugging the Alien. My memories somehow managed to mix Alien 3 with Alien 4.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmF_IO6Aiag&list=PLZbXA4lyCtqqpCdNLXmPhoosI-LvbFfD8&index=3&ab_channel=Movieclips

>>212107766
>Danny Devito watching Alien 3 Assembly Cut.

Alien 3 needs to be remade with a different script without Ripley in it and with the dragon alien with woman lips and a woman's butt in it.

I want Aliens + CUBE