Could realistic space combat have mass market appeal?

>>212706667 (OP)
Yes, I think so. They've already been trying to force more realistic science and hardish scifi movies. Just ignore the complainers demanding more star-warsy ww2 dogfight slop.

>>212706667 (OP)
realistic space combat would just be maneuvering and firing rockets at 1000s km distance
most effort would be put into counter measures
best analogue would be submarine hunting like in that one episode of star trek

>>212707879
Yes, that's what happens in most of The Expanse. Firing torpedoes at each other from long range and trying to defend with countermeasures and CWIS turrets. Sometimes things line up so they're fighting closer in more visual range, but it's rare. They use camera zooms to show that ships are really far apart. Sometimes they want to board another ship, or there's pirates luring in freighters

>>212706667 (OP)
Nah, it's fucking boring, even in the book.

>>212706667 (OP)
Maybe but you gotta focus on the people rather than try to show it directly on screen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJr34OirtbI

>>212706667 (OP)
Falling Frontier looks promising, if it's ever coming out:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1280190/Falling_Frontier/

>>212706667 (OP)
Realistic in what sense? Using current technologies no, it would be ships firing whatever order of magnitude above hypersonic speeed is called missiles from massive distances and zero ability for defending ships to intercept or take meaningful evasive action

>>212708337
>everyone on the bridge, shield your eyes!
>they all want to keep peaking around their fingers

>>212706667 (OP)
Space "combat" is just putting jet propulsion on rocks and other drones and flinging them where the enemy ships are going to eventually be in ten to fifteen hours.

Anyone tried Nebulous Fleet Command? It seems properly autistic with 3D movement, physics etc. But it seems to be in perpetual early access.

>>212706667 (OP)
I wanna see realistic space combat with unrealistic weapons like Gundam mega particle cannons.

>>212707879
This, it would be two AI's who keep shooting small missles at ships that are so far away that you can't see them. It would be very boring to show.

>>212708083
Man The Expanse ships are only "realistic" at first glance. There isn't a single radiator and they are firing projectiles and mass driver slugs. Where does all the heat go?

>>212709189
Sorry, but this is retarded.

>>212709251
Maybe its explained in the books?

>>212709251
True. The show does the best it can with the material. They do talk about heat issues in the books, like the stealth ships are only spotted because they're a slightly different temperature from the rest of space. They're absorbing all the incoming energy instead of reflecting it, so they're heating up after a while. When they go full attack mode they radiate heat like crazy.

>>212709331
That's fine that you think that. Still 1,000,000X more real than your x-wings and enterprises.

is it time for space boat kino?

>>212709452
>ships still fighting at near point blank range exchanging missiles and machinegun fire at close range while whipping around at 999G's

Its just as bad as muh Xwangs and Pikards.

>>212709490
>that lynx thing
you just know

>>212709605
Did you notice it has a human hand?

>>212709490
Not even remotely realistic. However it has lots of numbers, so autism++.

>>212709706
You can only pick so many realistic elements before it gets really, REALLY dull. Expanse had to do away with realistic acceleration and fuel capacity for fictional ultra-efficient engines. Honor's realism is the massive distances and military tactics/strategies with the provided technologies. At least it's a step in the right direction away from childish slop towards something more intelligent. Their propulsion/shield tech is a genuinely neat scifi concept that's novel.

Expanse was a great middleground of harder space combat without going full autistic. A "true space combat" depiction without bullshit tech we can't fathom would be something like playing Children of a Dead Earth, which itself is you spending hours designing ships with a giganillion radiators to dissipate heat and then playing on max time adjustment in game to get orbital intercepts where you actually fight for like 5 seconds and see who gets obliterated. Fun to play but that shit would be bonkers to watch and it'd be impossible to convey the scale of your engagement distances.

>>212706667 (OP)
If combat in space was realistic, you would be effectively dead the moment your foe saw you. There is nothing to hide behind.

>>212706667 (OP)
no, and anyone who says otherwise is a midwit

>>212709490
i'd watch it. get's very 'chosen one' but the plots are interesting.

My idea of realistic space combat is something like logh

>>212711095
The first few were pretty good. He's terrible with endings though. He was going to conclude it years ago, but chickened out and now it's just been continuing endlessly with no real point to it

>>212709251
>they are firing projectiles and mass driver slugs. Where does all the heat go
Maybe they heat up the projectiles

>>212709251
the guns are outside

>>212706667 (OP)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kPeXFV94bsE

Been there done that. Also Andromeda before that had point defense as well though they were lasers.

>>212709490
jeez, its this kind of book cover art that I would not mind being redone by AI

>>212706667 (OP)
Yes, absolutely.
The story and characters matter more anyway.

>>212708524
that sounds pretty cool

>>212707879
And humans would have zero involvement in it. It's literally the most boring shit imaginable.

>>212709242
>that are so far away that you can't see them
kek it's a movie. you can put the camera wherever you want. the audience gets to see everything.

>>212713139
then maybe the focus shouldn't be on the space combat? or maybe one of the characters could be one of the AIs?
Y'all lack imagination.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0UfFNpOsxw

I would absolutely watch more of this minus the Bing chilling

>>212709918
>complaining about "childish slop" in science fiction
oh the irony

>>212706667 (OP)
If space combat were real, no craft larger than a truck would ever be deployed because any kind of damage is immediately fatal. Space combat would be large swarms of drone ships passing through one another, all distanced 10.000s of miles from one another at a any time.

It would be incredibly boring.

>>212706667 (OP)
I had to watch this on a dogshit TV in prison and I couldn't see what was happening the ghosting was so bad

It would have to be all drones or it would look like a science regression. Like how email seemingly doesn’t exist in the Star Wars universe because it wasn’t a thing in77

Every day I'm reminded that most of /tv/ are incredibly uncreative, and unironic brainlets. They truly can't imagine the red apple in their heads and have no inner monologue. I'm so thankful they'll never be trusted to make any shows.

>>212714256
>It would be incredibly boring.
why would it be boring?

>>212715161
They think "realistic" means it has to be 100% scientifically accurate, held strictly to all laws of physics, made by stuffy, ancient professors who don't watch tv or care about entertainment. The idea of a middle ground between that and star wars nonsense is impossible to fathom.

>>212715451
wow. they sound like a bunch of faggots

“Realistic space combat” is if anyone ever figures out your position, heading, and velocity, they’ll send a basically invisible proximity warhead to meet you.

>>212716329
Nope

>>212708440
>procedurally generated
shan't play.

>>212709490
Anyone read this? Its pretty kino, like hunt for red october in space.

>>212706667 (OP)

How can there be tracer rounds in space?

>>212718108
Things can get hot and glow and not need oxygen for combustion

>>212718108
The burning chemical has its own oxygen

What would a realistic spaceship look like?

>>212716329
Yep.

>>212719018
Utterly non-aerodynamic.

>>212719018

>>212719365
sauce?

>>212706667 (OP)
There has never been a space battle, and there never will be. It makes no sense at all.

>>212719622
That's Avatar 2, but i take it you're just joking, because nobody remembers the movie once it leaves theaters because it has no lasting impression on the hundreds of millions of people who saw the Avatar movies?

>>212706667 (OP)
I wish X4 had more rapid fire guns like this. I can't stand half the weapons. Also miss fighters having more guns, and ass turrets.

>>212706667 (OP)
realism gay

>>212714773
This is in reference to what?

>>212717117
I recommend dark intelligence for a book series. Never heard of your author but will give it a gander.

>>212706667 (OP)
I prefer my "realism" japanese
https://youtu.be/7NzuRnvL79w

>>212706667 (OP)
What's realistic space combat even mean?

>>212722138
You know how star wars is just flying fighter planes around shooting machine gun lasers are each other in visual range and missing most of them as very slow moving naval vessels trade broadsides? The opposite of that.

>>212709918
>You can only pick so many realistic elements before it gets really, REALLY dull.
that's the silliest thing I've ever heard. people write stories based on past and current reality that are compelling. ever seen a submarine movie? storytelling is much more about human drama than the setting, even in a hard sci-fi the focus is on how that tech affects human society and the human condition.

>>212707560
If the ship has already matched rotation with the station (0:09), then it already is experiencing centrifugal gravity.

>>212719365
these things are seriously the best part of the entire Avatar franchise. and proof that you can make something fairly realistic look really cool.

>>212722498
Yes, I have and there's a reason why they're NICHE and there's only a few of them. You want blockbusters for mass market appeal like OP said, and you can only pick so much realism. As was already discussed extensively in the thread. Primarily you sacrifice engine speed, fuels, time between destinations. Sometimes you can bring in energy shields like Honor Harrington but that would be one of the non-realistic things you might include along with your many realistic things.

>>212722629
Hunt for Red October was literally a blockbuster and one of the top grossing movies of 1990, an outstanding year in film.

>>212709668
I'm guessing the artist probably didn't know how to draw paws. The other paw is conveniently hidden as well.
Unless it's some sort of alien.

>>212722869
https://honorverse.fandom.com/wiki/Treecat
It is an alien called a Treecat. They have six limbs.

>>212706667 (OP)
Can some explain to me why this is "realistic space combat"?? It looks fucking stupid.

The Red Rising book series does a good job with space battles I think, especially in describing the very grisly effects that space weaponry has on people. Hopefully it eventually gets adapted one day.

>>212723515
Yes, it is really stupid and not for really smart fellow like yourself. Now head on back to the supermen threads where the really smart people hang out.

>>212724057
So you can't explain why it's realistic? You're just as bad.

One neat part about Expanse ships that's unlike the usual, the decks are setup like the floors of a building. Each is perpendicular to the thrust rather than parallel. This allows varying levels of artificial gravity while under thrust. If it were set up like the enterprise, they'd all fly to the back wall when the ship accelerated.

>>212709251
They ignore heat because stealth is vital to the plot. Really it's space opera but trying really hard to look like scifi.

>>212706667 (OP)
>>212709189
>>212709251


Something I always though of watching the Expanse - Those PDC rounds.. they.. don’t lose momentum. You miss what you’re shooting at, and someone many years from now could get absolutely rogered to death by hypervelocity rounds out of fucking nowhere.

>>212724969
Space is big. Bigger than you can comprehend. So the chance of that happening is negligible. However, there's a natural version as well (micrometeoroids) and the vast differences in velocity involved are such that it's a actual concern. We're talking something that might be so small you can't even use a normal microscope to get a good look at it, but that can punch a hole in just about anything because they're so fast. There's a thing called a Whipple shield, which is basically just an aluminum foil shield you put on the front of the ship, that protects from them. They punch a hole in the shield but are neutralized as a result, as opposed to punching a hole in the hull.
TL;DR: It doesn't matter because it'd never happen, but rocks do this already so spacecraft would need defenses against it even if space combat didn't happen.

>>212725171
makes me wonder why even bother with the big space rounds when you could just aim a shotgun blast of gravel which would be more cost effective

>>212725289
The Expanse doesn't really make sense as science fiction. It's just window dressing; the 'science' part is mostly nonsensical. There are a lot of ways to defend against missiles in space, and slapping a CWIS on your ship is one of the worst.

>>212714256
>Space combat would be large swarms of drone ships passing through one another, all distanced 10.000s of miles from one another at a any time.
But you need a carrier for the drones, don't you
Especially with the realistic amount of fuel the drones could carry
So yeah you would have big ships

>>212722590
What's with the mirror

>>212725534
Camouflage. This way the target won't see a large attack space ship and try to defend themselves, instead they'll just see a big space mirror.

>>212725453
I feel like real space combat would be all energy weapons. This is getting into /k/ territory and why isn't there ever a thread on there about this stuff I don't know.

Anyway, energy weapons are the obvious primary arm at long range, you just have to solve the diffusion issue but with current tech hey're still effrctive way way past the range of ballistics and missiles (a laser would ablate away a missile long before it made contact).

>>212716329
If you make minor random adjustments to your trajectory often, your exact position can be off by hundreds of miles 1 hour later. Just to get into low earth orbit, you're traveling 20,000mph.
Also radar exists.

Full space combat autism is really interesting to think about. But its like feudal generals trying to guess what warfare with airplanes would be like. They'd joust or something, right? Shoot arrows?

>>212727016
>Shoot arrows?
I mean, air to air combas is just trying to shoot the other guy with a lot of boolets over anything

>>212727016
DEWs have a lot of problems; no idea if they'll be fixed or not. But it's a reasonable guess they could be used for point defense well. I have much less certainty they could ever be used offensively; the distances are too vast.

>>212714256
>muh drones
Don't you have some /k/ thread to shit up?

>>212706667 (OP)
unless theres some sort of agreement made beforehand space wars would just be planets sending a million nuclear rockets at eachother's capitols

>>212725171
The objects you're describing are a huge issue in our orbit because decomm'd satellites will smash into other ones which throw fragments everywhere

>>212706667 (OP)
What exactly are they doing here? I don't get it

>>212728516
They're a problem everywhere. It's worse in cluttered orbits, but even on weird transfer paths you need to be prepared for them.

>>212722577
not to mention the thing decelerating and flipping around like that immediately prior to docking would mean everyone should be strapped down and all hatches battened. they literally made a point about this in the with that loose drill flying around during combat

>>212708083
>that's what happens in most of The Expanse
no it really isn't. it's used in several key parts but the majority of the expanse (tv series at least) is lots of close combat

>>212729401
They assumed that guy knew what the fuck he should be doing considering he was a belter

>>212729452
if he was in the ship during that flip sequence he wouldn't be floating in his cabin casually reaching for a boot, he'd be trying to hold onto the wall or something and have bruises everywhere

>>212727016
>I feel like real space combat would be all energy weapons
that's why stargate went with railguns and nukes in space

>>212725487
>Especially with the realistic amount of fuel the drones could carry
not necessarily. depends on how long they need to be active for. with enough of them you could just charge something like a capacitor and let them run and come back to home when they are low and swap for the next drone

How do you clean space battle debris after the battle?

space is fake btw why would we have an atmosphere if we’re in a vacuum

>>212725597
they're landing on a planet where the natives shoot bows and arrows

>>212729620
belters come scrap it

>>212729620
space janny

>>212729620
You basically just pray it's too spread out to cause any problems, and if it's not you're fucked

>>212729629
Because vacuum is fake. There's atmosphere everywhere. You can breathe on the Moon or on asteroid no problem.

>>212707879
if the distance is too big the torpedoes can easily be shot down and any salvo dodged.

the shorter the distance the shorter the time between firing and the impact. the goal is to get to the point where dodging becomes impossible without either ripping the ship apart or killing the people on board.

which is why railguns are so dangerous in the expanse, the very high projectile velocity makes them hard to dodge even at a larger distance.

>>212706667 (OP)
>locate IR signature of enemy spaceship 0.5 AU away.
>shoot rail-gun projectile at relativistic speed
>rips them in half, igniting the oxygen tanks

How thrilling.

>>212730142
Realistically any missile could be accelerated to speeds where even if it got destroyed the fragments would still anihilate the target.

>>212730332
sure but since that would expected the potentially affected area could be avoided, so once again distance and reaction time would be the important factor.

>>212730332
Even if you destroyed with explosives, which would push the missile and its fragments in other directions too though

>>212706667 (OP)
Same as stars, if anything's going to blow up get some drones to do it,

>>212710966
>pic
Isn't that basically just stars shining on each other?
Is the night sky some kind of ... star war?

>>212730142
>killing the people on board.
There's basically no chance any warships will have humans on board.

>>212722590
Honestly when it comes to sci-fi tech wank, Avatar is a really good series for that.

>>212706667 (OP)
>realistic
>space combat
>space
That's a bit of a oxymoron you got there, OP.

>>212713310
This thread is asking whether "realistic" space combat is fun and you are now saying "well, let's just not focus on that ok?"
You are autistic

>>212713310
>or maybe one of the characters could be one of the AIs?
You have a very fantasy view of AI. These AIs would have no reason to have any personality. They are just software in tge ship's hardware with one purpose: blast the enemy to bits.

>>212706667 (OP)
No. What you call realistic is low tech space combat which is boring as fuck. When ships can warp directly to you and you have shields to mitigate damage so you can insert acting and energy weapons are short range so theres lots of blinky lights in your face. its a proven formula, nobody wants to see some space submarine shit

>>212706667 (OP)
No, and there is nothing realistic in the Expanse.

>>212732629
That's not true; I can think of at least one realistic thing. And that's gangbangers getting shitty face tattoos.

>>212713310
>Y'all

still waiting for space pirate kino
I'm a universe bender and being unable to manifest this is one of my few failures. I must become more powerful.

>>212710826
Is this game any good?

>>212732861
NTA but it's excellent at what it's trying to do. Calling it a game is not exactly accurate however.

>>212732957
I see I see, yeah it looks cool, its been on my wishlist.

>>212706667 (OP)
How do stop the death star or that planet that shot beams. The beam would be so big you can't deflect it. It only takes one bad planet. Don't let it happen to you.

Gotta talk about that ride, kid. Next clue to the case.

>>212709251
There's only so much you can get away with for a mainstream show, ships just obeying basic physics is already a big ask.

>>212709251
Liquid droplet radiators that you just don't see :)))

>>212717117
Your life ended here, stalker.

>>212706667 (OP)
Yeah, but you would have to pay Neil DeGrass Tyson and top reddit moderators to promote your movie first.

>>212716329
>basically invisible
No such thing in space

>>212732478
This isn't /x/

>>212710826

>>212720190
>no "lasting impression"
>every film is the highest grossing movie of the year
>millions go to the theme park in Animal Kingdom
>5 more on the way
kek we still doing this meme?

>>212706667 (OP)
I'll let you know when we have a real space battle.

>>212733312
>ships just obeying basic physics
I mean they don't do this at all in The Expanse though.
Like there is zero part of it that's realistic. It's maybe more believable than Star Wars to someone who doesn't know what they're looking at, both both are equally valid representations of space.

>>212733492
*sorry 4 more

What is this from? Eve?

>dae realistic space warfare?
>NO NO NOT LIKE THAT
Thread is so autistic.
If you don't want realistic space battles don't ask for realistic space battles idiots.
Realistic space battles will be dormant unmanned suicidal drones mining vast areas of space and sacrificial drone minesweepers triggering them.

>>212710925
That was trying The Expanse. They are fighting with missiles and turrets to shoot down the missiles most of the time because the distance is huge then the nanosecond they get to close it's a railfun fight and then it can't be dodged. Whoever fires the railfun first wins.

>>212730575
Not really, we are talking speeds that would outrun any explosive shockwave and at best just slow the fragments down a little.

>>212722186
So not realistic just not flashy, gotcha

>>212709251
casings?

>>212706667 (OP)
That's not remotely realistic at all. The ships wouldnt even have simulated gravity designed like that

>>212719018
Unamnned stealth drone floating at low temperature. drone sentinels scattered for thousands of miles in every direction. If they track something the main drone (or drones) retracts the radiators, "hide" the engine heat behind super refrigerate shell (only temporary, obviously) and shoots a laser at 10000 miles away target. If it doesn't get a perfect one hit kill, (sentinels see the enemy entering in combat mode, possibly raising mirrors), everyone would launch super hot decoys and keep shooting.
It would be all automated, all on radar, target and attacker wouldn't even see each other, and it would last seconds.
Basically a boring minefiled of turrets and sensors.
Anything else would be fantasy on par with star wars, at least until some kind of unexpected technology pops up on the horizon

>>212732448
by science fiction you mean the design of thechnical stuff?

>>212722682
Hunf for Red October didn't have fughts occurring at 100000 miles away and you had the benefit of the submarine being manned

>>212729476
always the same. a crew of writers does their best to keep things consistent and a producer says "'here's a scene my kid wrote" and it's all over

>>212730142
>railgun
no solid amoo would be used. It would move the attacker making it unable to aim

>>212732718
Fair enough

>>212735586
MSC makes more sense.

>>212709251
boy, I hope someone got fired for that blunder

>>212735643
Yeah. I feel like current sci-fi films never bother to focus much on their in-universe props, vehicles or items. The most recent thing people remember is probably the Ornithopter from Dune, but that's it. Meanwhile in Avatar, despite the environmentalist theme in these movies, they didn't mind focusing on their sci-fi props. They even went out of their way to showcase them in a big way; the ISV space stations, the helicopters, gunships, and now with Avatar 2 - the boats, crab submarines and their various tech, etc. Say what you want about those movies, but they have a great showcase of sci-fi mechanical designs imo.

>>212725534
its a sort of whipple shield iirc. they're getting to a pretty decent fraction of c in transit so even interstellar dust can cause damage. the mirror shields the ship from it.

>>212732819
you must be a Europeon

>>212735973
>MSC
What does it stand for?

>>212736086
That's nice and all, but sci-fi is not just cool props.
When you say "it has good sci-fi" people thinks about more substantial things, like themes and concepts

Frankly speaking Ithink sci fi is dead, and mostly used as cosmesis these days. Props reflect that

Haven't seen A2. I found A1 a pure void, and I didn't come back the sequel. A1's vehicles were good, nothing particularly original

>use more resources building a single ship than humanity has ever used on a single engineering project
>gets hit with one volley
>the ship implodes, killing thousands or even tens of thousands of people instantly, irreparably destroying the ship and sending all of its materials hurtling infinitely into deep space
>we're somehow going to acquire the resources to build fleets of these death traps and send them wantonly into battle
>this is the best case outcome for the future of humanity

>>212738009
Best case is unironically deep space cryo ships or just sending genetic material to planets or, ahead of time, just shooting teraforming material to planets hundreds of years in advance

>>212738009
Robot mines make resources robot factories make parts, robot plants assemble ships. It's all worth 0 if you remove capitalism retardation.

>>212738009
you could make the same case with military equipment in general. millions are lost every time a rocket explode.

>>212738513
>millions are lost every time a rocket explode.
not in space, literlly lost forever

>>212706667 (OP)
>Could realistic space combat have mass market appeal?
anything realistic in space is super boring and lame. distances are too big and speeds way too slow.

>>212732623
I like both

>>212706667 (OP)
No even the expanse isn’t realistic

Realistic space combat is ships lobbing nukes and tungsten rods at each other from thousands of miles away

>>212724969
The odd of that happening are unbelievably small

There’s shit flying through space all over the ifs of it hitting you are minimal

>>212725453
>super efficient (((Epstein))) drive that allowed for constant acceleration for weeks or months on end.

Yeah I mean it’s fine they hand wave that away for the plot but their propulsion system is pure fantasy

>>212739798
The chances of it hitting something are maximal, they never lose momentum so they will eventually hit a target. That might just be in 20 million years at its likely hitting rock or ice or an atmosphere

>>212728667
I believe that ship was trying to run a blockade so you see this little
Yellow dots those are is point defense cannons taking out incoming fire from the blockading ships

>>212732623
What people want is classic sale warfare but in space

Broadsides, boarding actions, big explosions etc

>>212706667 (OP)
Space combat has never existed. There is no telling how it "realistically" plays out

>>212739860
wrong board

>>212732852
The expanse? like half the show is dealing with ungrateful colonists on the moons and asteroids resorting to piracy and terrorism

>>212733508
First of all they do offer realistic space stuff as in momentum, gravity, geforces, and a scale that is accurate ie we don’t need to fly off between solar systems they are too far apart and there’s thousands of rocky bodies right here “close” to earth,

But yes they add fake tech like “juice” which magically saves you from 8 g turns and engines that are miracles in their ability to work etc but that’s fine if you want realistic space for read the right stuff or Apollo 13,

>>212735087
There is no artificial gravity in the expanse they rely on spin or acceleration “gravity”

I liked the Gundam style combat where their high tech engines and stuff blocked things like radars so despite being hightech space warefare its relatively classical because theyre having to rely on eyesight for target acquisition.

>>212738009
Humans have done that with ships since forever

>spend your entire treasury on an armada
>sail it to England
>get btfo by a storm then curbstomped by a much weaker navy days later

Yeah nobody would risk it totally unrealistic

>>212739910
Okay nerd you know what I’m talking about go get stuffed ina locker

>>212732554
>>212732585
you are both faggots.
"realistic" doesn't mean 1-to-1 with reality, it means more grounded than something like Star Wars.
If you made it so super realistic that it is boring (which also makes no sense because you film it however you want), then you could focus on the characters and how they deal with and react to the situation.
again you are both faggots

>>212740067
>fake tech like “juice” which magically saves you from 8 g turns
Well explain how that's complete magic

>>212740228
What could they inject into you that prevents your brain and other organs from turning into mush ?

>>212740184
I don't even think k you know what you're talking about anon

>>212740277
I’m talking about the chances of an object into hitting “you” ie a space traveler

Not the thought experiment of a chunk of debris flying through the void for millions of years before finally hitting soemthitn solid

Go die dork

I don't get why they don't do this with Top Gun 3. I feel like that's a billion dollar idea

>>212740257
Brain juice, duh

>>212740327
>Go die dork
>>212740184
>get stuffed into a locker

>>212740434
I’m 35 lmao

Unironically I did stuff a kid in a locker in hs tho

>>212706667 (OP)
No one wants realism in SCIENCE FICTION. You fucking nerd. It's why the word FICTION is included. Go outside.

>>212724969
Going back to the original thought:
In The Expanse, the bullets will have some most likely things happen:
>they are eccentric enough from the solar ecliptic that they shoot off into interstellar space and never bother anyone
>they manage to get close enough to a planet that they burn up in atmosphere and never bother anyone
>they get close to a planet and miraculously enter a stable orbit, and then have about as much chance to hit someone as any other piece of space junk
>they eventually get sucked into the sun and never bother anyone
>they enter into a very strange orbit around the sun, like a comet, and have an even smaller chance to hit something than if in orbit around a planet

>>212706667 (OP)
>realistic space
>all cgi

>>212740616
>I'm 35
Sure you are Lil buddy. You're a big mean bully grrrrrrr

>>212740762
You will learn that most people are utterly incapable of understanding scale

That’s why people can believe flat earth because they really can’t comprehend how small we are compared to an planet, and you can’t explain it to them they are incapable of understanding it their minds simply can’t grasp it.

It’s why people still think we are “running out of room” becuse ya know my city is crowded or that we are “running out of recourses” even though we’ve barely scratched the surface of the planet in relative terms

So when you tell them “no the chances of these objects hitting anything are tiny” they can’t understand it because they can’t comprehend the sheer endless space out there

Same reason all sci fi is usually so bad with scale, whole planets taken over by a handful of guys, one city planet and everyone else is some backwards farmer etc etc the only setting that even comes close but still shoots low is 40k because they are intentionally trying to be absurd


“The imperium is 1 million worlds” and it’s press across the galaxy which has 100-400 billion stars at current estimates lmao

So the Galaxy spaning imperium only controls 0.000025% of the galaxy lmao

>>212740942
Yes I am as much of a nerd as you people and I still looked good and pulled pussy

Get on my level

>>212741213
>Yes I am as much of a nerd as you people and I still looked good and pulled pussy
>Get on my level

>>212741395
>I can’t imagine somebody not being a loser like me so it must be a lie

Kek okay

>>212735664
>100000 miles
doesn't matter if it's 100000 miles or 100 yards: it's the "no visual contact" part that matters. and Hunt for Red October still managed to show us cool submarine shots even if the characters couldn't see anything.
same shit applies to space combat
>and you had the benefit of the submarine being manned
guess what, you could still have manned in your "realistic" setting

Someone needs to think of a way to make space combat realistic the way Dune made hand to hand combat realistic by introducing their shield tech

Some sort of technology that can justify the sort of close quarters combat that everyone finds fun while giving a plausible explanation

>>212742550
>close quarters
why does it need to be close quarters?

>>212742583
anyone got that retard-staring-into-colour-cube.webm thing? because that's the 'mass market'.

>>212742583
So it looks cool in movies and stuff

>>212742583
energy weapons hitting the shield does some funky sci-fi stuff and turns both the shield wearer and the shooter into a nuclear explosion.
conventional bullets are stopped by the shield.
you have to slowly penetrate the shield with a melee weapon so it won't activate.

>>212742858
Expanse did both. Too much close quarters and it's just star wars babyfood again. You can still make long range fighting look badass. We don't need yet more ww2 plane dogfights in space. Science fiction used to be aimed at more intelligent audiences and has been dumbed down extensively to sell more.

>>212742765
you can put the camera wherever you want, right? doesn't matter how far apart the ships are, you can show both shooting and being shot. and then have some wide shoes to indicate the scale, and some internal shots that show radar screens and such.
The audience may be dumb, but the filmmakers should be smart.
>>212742858
why does it need to be close quarters to look cool?

>>212743236
It doesn’t I’m just saying that’s why people want it

They want to see a naval battle in space they think that’s cool like Star war

>>212743236
>why does it need to be close quarters to look cool?
Most likely all they know is star wars type slop and everyone rags on submarine fights since they're slow and just showing people inside bracing and reacting. They're not creative enough to imagine long range space fights being entertaining and enjoyable

>>212743356
>They want to see a naval battle in space they think that’s cool like Star war
they think that's cool, yes, but that's not only what they want to see.

>>212743405
>everyone rags on submarine fights
no they dont
>They're not creative enough to imagine long range space fights being entertaining and enjoyable
they're not the ones that have to make the movie so it doesn't matter

none of you have played Children of a Dead Earth and it shows

>"realistic" space warefare would just be both sides firing as many long range weapons at eachother as possible, and hoping to get more missiles through the enemy automated defenses than the other guy
>just sitting there watching blips on a space radar

>>212741885
I'm no loser my dad works at Nintendo Lil buddy

>>212743628
that's how real current year earth based fire control systems have worked for decades now

>>212706667 (OP)
Kind of. The Expanse is about as close as you can get without being boring to most people.

You could make it like a submarine movie, but then it needs to be more about the crew and the tension rather than the actual combat.

>>212743757
>more about the crew and the tension rather than the actual combat
this is true of any space combat kino.
otherwise it's just a tech demo

>>212743756
We just in reality watched multiple countries exchange long range missile fire over hundreds of miles and launching interceptors to destroy incoming. It was more kino than any movie kek

>>212708440
>if it's ever coming out
yeah it looks dead. most recent dev announcement was in 2023. also it has been delayed since 2022 when he was hopeful it would be released in 2022. no clue what could have happened to delay it 3 more years and have the dev go silent for 2 years

>>212743056
There's nothing wrong with star wars manlyfood

>>212733312
why isn't there any hair physics aside from the pilot episode?

>>212740206
>then you could focus on the characters and how they deal with and react to the situation.
There wouldn't be any characters in a realistic space warship. It would be an impersonal AI

>>212743757
I liked in star trek enterprise they had to use tow cables instead of tractor beams

>>212745121
No, as has been stated many times before, you choose the level of technology and realism. Just because something exists doesn't require it to be included. It can still be 75% realism versus the 5% currently.

>>212706667 (OP)
no, not mass market
even naval battles don't have mass market appeal, so it always ends up focusing on one guy or small crew

>>212745084
The show was already very expensive which resulted in it getting canceled twice and still not finishing the final three seasons. They have many cgi heavy scenes to show off fun space physics stuff like floating sex, drinking floating liquid droplets, pouring drinks in coriolis so it curves, etc. A lot of it gets overlooked or viewers don't appreciate the work they put into the series. I think they did a fantastic job with what they had available. Not perfect, but no show is.

>>212745332
Realism itself is completely meaningless. Why argue that one show is more realistic than another because the ships fight at extreme distances and they cannot travel faster than light? Why not argue that, actually, it is more realistic that electronic and AI-boosted cyberwarfare becomes much more pivotal and renders all your fancy gadgets as being completely useless and if you want to do anything, I suppos3 you could ram them?

>>212740067
Ironically, juice is one of the most realistic things about The Expanse (except they neglect to ever show how it's removed from the body).
The rest is actually incorrect though; they just put on a facade to make it seem like it's accounted for.
Some examples:
>Momentum
During battle everyone is always somehow going near zero relative speed, when in practice they should fly by each other at extreme speed and the entire battle window would likely be no longer than a few seconds until they're completely out of range again. This is the thing they probably do best on, although there are a number of limitations in portrayals due to physical constraints for filming.
>Gravity
Yeah this is just wrong. They're almost always at 1g or act very much like it, despite not being so. Stations and ships are portrayed this way as well, even though it's not possible for most of them to have such a high acceleration imparted, even by spin like they talk about. For example, Ceres is a dwarf planet, not just an asteroid. Spinning it to .3g would require about as much energy as it'd take to deorbit the moon. I don't think I need to elaborate how ridiculous it is to saw that such a thing would ever happen. Also,
>Geforces
Asteroids would be ripped apart when sped up. The crews consistently show little effect from combat maneuvers, even walking around during them (with apparent difficulty). The g-forces involved with what's shown aren't like 8g, more like 30 plus. That's not survivable, even with the juice.

Finally, while it's true we don't need to do interstellar travel, with the Epstein drive there's no reason not to. There should be a large number of interstellar probes that already got to their destinations. That travel time would be measured in tens of years (less on the ship), but the Epstein drive has existed for more than a hundred.

>>212733351
My life didn't end, stalker. The police knows it hasn't. They know yours has. Enjoy prison.

>>212745544
I’m not saying their portrayal of physics is perfect but they attempt to do it unlike most sci fi, your issues with the gravity is simply impossibility not impossibility and limitations on budget and acting


How is juice realistic?

>>212706667 (OP)
Depends on how it is depicted really.

Is the expanse worth watching?
Do I have to tolerate niggers and trannies in it?

>>212745640
The use of an injected substance to change the viscosity of your blood is very achievable. It'd likely be a lot more damaging and unpleasant than shown, and again you need to remove it after. If you've seen The Abyss, the hyper-oxygenated liquid is real too. It's just so miserable it's never used. That rat scene is real though.

>>212745471
>Why argue that one show is more realistic than another because the ships fight at extreme distances and they cannot travel faster than light?
because it is more realistic.
>Why not argue that, actually, it is more realistic that electronic and AI-boosted cyberwarfare becomes much more pivotal and renders all your fancy gadgets as being completely useless and if you want to do anything, I suppos3 you could ram them?
that also sounds like a great idea. no one has the answer to what is "realistic" when it comes to space combat. no one is saying it has to be one specific thing, but we are saying it's definitely not more Star Wars

>>212745714
There are niggers but it’s one of the only settings that isn’t just sprinkling them in for diversity points they literally have different places where different ethnicities migrated too while colonizing the solar system. Surprisingly modern politics has very little impact on the show

>>212745714
Not really. Yes, one of the main characters is a nigger that always gets saved from her mistakes, and the only main white character is portrayed as having a complete lack of any morality (he's still based).
One of the later main characters is in a polycule with multiple non-binaries. I'm not exaggerating. It's also a plot-point.

>>212745760
Also fun fact the main character has jungle fever, in the book his gf that gets blown up in the first episode is supposed to be African

>>212745640
>>212745736
Fuck, forgot to address the physics part.
My point is that they don't really attempt it. They use real words and ideas instead of flux capacitors and and unobtanium, but that's where the differences end. The capabilities are still just as ridiculous, and anything slightly inconvenient is completely disregarded (heat). Their own rules aren't even consistent, like with travel times, crew sizes, or the capabilities of different types of ships.
It's very much made to fool people who know nothing about physics or space travel, and works. But the realism is entirely superficial, and it's no more or less realistic than Star Trek.

Why do expanse ships lack radiators? That seems like a major oversight for supposed "realistic" scifi series?

>>212745737
>that also sounds like a great idea.
Thanks. We'll get our swashbuckling space-pirates yet. Let the ghosts in the machines fight each other while we fight amongst ourselves.

>>212745893
Short answer is the plot doesn't work if you can't have extremely good stealth and ships just disappearing left and right. Having to actually address heat means you have to admit that stealth in space is basically impossible, so they just ignore it wholesale.

>>212721514
Found one

>>212745893
Why don't you look it up yourself while you're enjoying your star wars, dumb shit

>>212742550
Gundamn does that. The generators used by both space ships and the mecha release particles that fuck with radar focing close range engagements.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BMR4c__lYA

Sig Zeon!

>>212745871
That’s completely retarded dude they at least address realistic distances and scales, they actually address that they’d have to deal with gravity and planetary biomes incomparable with human life and momentum instead of just hand waving it with artificial gravity, hyperspace, lasers, inertial dampeners etc


Claiming that it’s basically just Star Trek is totally disingenuous and you know it

>oh it isn’t 100% accurate so it’s the same as being total fantasy


Gay

>>212745871
It's 100x more realistic than star trek. Nothing in star trek will ever remotely happen in reality. A large amount of things in Expanse will happen or are essentially possible now. So shut the fuck up

>>212707560
the expanse is the soul exception. everything else is back in ww2 dogfighting but IN SPEHS

>>212745760
>>212745776
Sounds reasonable, might give it a check.

>>212745927
Gay and lame copout.

>>212739960
what people want is space submarines. main reason the expanse got so many seasons despite the nonsense ayyyliens plot and woke undercurrents

>>212746326
Of all the shows worn woke undercurrent it’s not the expanse

You never watched it

>>212746007
Again, they don't though. They hand wave it, but with an explanation that sounds more convincing than other scifi babble. None of the solutions are any more plausible than a flux capacitor. Spinning up Ceres is just as feasible as making a replicator.
You just think one sounds better because you're ignorant.

>>212746040
This is just wrong. I'm sorry you feel personally attacked that your series isn't realistic. But I can't think of anything in The Expanse that is feasible IRL. Even the base ideas such as Earth being united under a single government or that ships can stealth are pure fantasy.

>>212745927
>>212746302
That’s also not correct the stealth ships exist for 1.5 seasons they are prototypes they never use stealth tech again

>>212746342
Not him but nigger the entire belter story is about current modern day anti-colonialism and racism sentiment
The fucking ending in particular

>>212746363
No YOU are dumb and incorrect

Outside of the aliens, the human tech in the expanse is correct even if implausible the replicator is pure magic

Spin gravity and thrust gravity are real even if their representation in the show isn’t perfect. You could “spin up ceres” but you probably wouldn’t in reality like you said the amount of effort wouldn’t be worth it but that doesn’t make it the same level as inertial dampeners and warp drives,

Just fucking stop oh are pretending to be smart lmao

>>212741064
ukraine war shows most people dont even have a good sense of space in a 3d scale or, god forbid, with 6dof. like flying drones. Since the monke brain has evolved on walking on the surface and not up down the axis

this extends to other orientation tasks like positioning yourself in space. like when reading a map

>>212746397
But that’s fine because it makes sense that a bunch of ignorant miners in the belt would be retarded and angry that they are subject to greater powers

That dynamic doesn’t make it woke, making it woke would be saying that Marcos was the hero of the story. Instead he’s a psychotic terrorist revolutionary and mass murderer

Yeah sounds super woke

>>212746377
they use the stealth tech to coat asteroids they destroy the earth with

>>212746640
Oh yeah Thad true but still doesn’t make them totally invisible it’s just to help

>>212746377
I'm not talking about the stealth ships of Mars, but that ships (or missiles for that matter) can ever not be known and precisely tracked at all times.
For reference, JWST could see a car on Ceres. Hiding an entire fucking ship (MUCH bigger and hotter than a car) is insane.

>>212746476
Ceres would fall apart if you tried to spin it up. Things like jamming outgoing signals are pure fantasy.
I'm literally a doctoral physics students, what's your qualification?

>>212706667 (OP) Imagine taking guns to space instead of using synchronicity to avoid problems.

>>212746342
says the faggot who never saw the show. Its multi-culti undercurrent was in there since season one and went into overdrive after the pajeet pilot got cancelled for wanting pics of bob and vagene

after that its only girlboss after girlboss, specially the broccoli haired whiny engineer, with your typical melanin level worship sprinkled here and there

>>212708083
Attaching to the hull that fast would liquefy anyone onboard those pods.

I don't know why scifilets constantly hold up The Expanse as the best "hard scifi" show when it isn't. Did you all forget the episode where the ship flies around all four of Jupiter's major moons inside of 30 seconds using maneuvering thrusters?

>>212746773
That's because Amazon took over which is different than the first three seasons. And the story went very Belt-centric so there needed to be mote Belters that you seethe about

>>212746711
>im a doctoral physics student

>>212746518
bitch there is no reason belters should be this multi-ethnic, multi-racial hamster colonies like they depict them. IRL dynamics these kind of situations are exactly where racial and ethnic tension runs high with rivaling gangs forming based on common identity. Faimly, ethnicity and then race. Who might work together against a common enemy but will always plot to stab each other in the back

get the fuck out of here

>>212742550
Realistic space combat would entail firing high-carbon chaff clouds or rail gun rounds at something 100,000km away and it exploding with no warning.

>>212744811
Any time you see a game update that says "I've", instead of "we've", you're not getting that game.

>>212746825
>THAT CGI IS NOT 1000% SCIENTIFICALLY ACCURATE SO YOUR IDEA FOR REALISM WON'T WORK AND WE NEED TO STICK TO STAR WARS!!

>>212746844
fuck off with your amazon excuse. source material, the books, were exactly the same in essence and direction. in fact even stupider, specially in its final conclusions that thankfully never made it to the show

the woke was always there and intensified with its creep as irl social media purity spiraled into extremism

>>212746518
They say Marcos had the right ideas but was evil at the end. There's also all the evil characters that get redemption arcs (Naomi, Avasarala, Peaches, Filip) but that might just be christcuckery.

>>212746866
Cope and seethe.
I've got a masters degree and am actively contributing to scientific research in the field. You have your feelings and whatever you can desperately google.

>>212746917
>whiny pissboy projection

>>212746889
There are like 30 billion people in the solar system. Most Earthers live on basic and can't get real jobs. The whole system is a melting pot. And belters have shit tons of gangs. They're not some homogenous group that all work together peacefully. They have a shared identity since they're treated as disposable by the Inners and any shitheads that jeapodize the group are spaced immediately. You're a moron that didn't watch the show.

>>212746825
>>212746711
>it’s not 100% true so it’s 100% fantasy

Stop being autistic

>>212746773
That’s just literally not true the expanse main cast is 2 white males and 1 light skin Indian and 1 half black girl. Of them all the black girl is the least noble and heroic throughout the story and is the gf of the main protagonist who’s white

Ancillary charecters you have a hard ass Persian lady, a brunch of white black and Asian military leaders, an Asian villain and a white villain (but doing bad stuff for good reasons) and the big bad of the whole show is literally a brown anti colonial terrorist

There’s absolutely no pushing of extra browns or anything like that beyond what makes sense for the setting.

Browns existing =\= woke

>>212746979
Concession accepted.

>>212746995
>There are like 30 billion people in the solar system.
They say this but don't back it up. Like when meteors and 'planet buster' nukes hit populated cities the casualty counts are only in the low millions, which would be on the low side for modern day Earth.

>>212747009
>2 white males
Huh?
Amos and who?

>>212747009
Flying around all of Jupiter's moons that quickly is in fact fantasy, since the rapejeet was breaking the speed of light with what amounted to emitted gas.

>>212746978
>I have a masters degree

And I have a family loser lmao your credentials ain’t worth shit physics hasn’t advanced in 20 years I’m very unimpressed

>>212747021
There was no argument to concede to.

>>212747047
Canonically it's steam actually, which makes the water shortage and stealth even funnier

>>212746935
Only one of those is an evil character with redemption and that’s flip and it’s not really redemption he just turns on his dad,

peaches is an anti-hero bent on revenge


The worst two aren evil lmao

>>212746889
This is an aspect of the shows budget

In the books belters are tall, skinny and pale and mixed races. Humans literally have started to consider them aliens in the books they aren’t a rag tag bunch of minorities that’s just how the show decided to make their mix of culture obvious to the viewer

>>212747122
>torturing people in violation of international laws isn't evil
>being an interplanet terrorist and pirate isn't evil
>blowing up ships and tearing apart people with your bare hands to protect your genocidal maniac of a father's feelings isn't evil
dude c'mon

>>212746889
They aren’t unified they are a bunch of warring clans

>>212747030
They never give a count in the show

In the books billions of people die, Marcos is the biggest mass murderer in history. In the books too they talk about the war between earth and mars being the largest war in human history to that poin so I’d assume that also killed hundreds of millions of people,

>>212745910
>We'll get our swashbuckling space-pirates yet
I didn't agree to that

>>212747205
>torture to save the planet from terrorists is le bad

Go be a fag somewhere else

>>212706667 (OP)
>>212709251
>>212727016

>realistic space combat
>ballistic weaponary

you can kill everyone in a space ship by just shining a beam of warm energy on them. with no way to vent the heat, everyone inside cooks.

>>212747269
They do give counts in the show actually, they're just not exact. A number of the news feeds specifically say 2 million.
Billions in the books is much better. But the TV show fumbled that.

>>212739992
Yeah but without all the strong lesbian diversity.

>>212747480
she's actually pansexual don't fucking misgender xhe fucking bigot nazi piece of shit

>>212747454
Yeah I agree the show tired to make the earths dis aster seem like a background incident, it also seems like they changed it to from 3 massive strikes to a bunch of smaller ones

They didn’t make the attack seem as deviating as it should have

>>212745443
floating liquid is one of the easiest things to do in cgi though might as well tell me there was broken glass in the show

>>212746363
>Spinning up Ceres is just as feasible as making a replicator
why do you say this? it's very possible. it just might take over a hundred years to achieve something like that. you just need thrust over time. even a small thruster would accomplish it given enough time

>>212747269
In the show, the war between Earth and Mars feels like a 24-hour whoopsie. Same with the asteroids. For a show that tried to be big, it always felt so small.

>>212747690
And in the story it did take a hundred years. They said it was a marvel of engineering that took the brightest minds of humanity. And they made a business spinning up asteroids throughout the belt since our solar system was all that was avalaible for the forseeable future

>>212746912
kek

>>212747690
Because it would literally spin itself apart. You would need to compress it first somehow. If you're terraforming at that level (Ceres is a dwarf planet) you don't need to bother spinning it. It's literally easier to just make an artificial habitat next to Ceres.

>>212747690
HES A PHYSICS STUDENT DONT QUESTION HIM

>>212747802
Just spin it as fast as it can go without making it spin apart

For a smart guy you are pretty fucking dumb

>>212706667 (OP)
I can't believe we got through an entire Expanse thread without spinning the Drum

>>212747727
Why are zoomers watching everything in the background?

The war between earth and mars starts in season 2 with the Ganymede crisis and continues through the entire third season with many scenes of dozens of ships blowing each other up as well some city in Brazil getting nuked

>>212747802
ah I see. you'd not only have to spin it fast enough to counteract its gravity but also fast enough to create artificial gravity, so it is impossible to spin it quickly enough to create gravity without also causing it to rip itself apart. it is silly in the expanse that there aren't large stations in the belt. for a whole solar system there aren't many notable locations

>>212748106
You could say that that about all sci fi

There’s enough space and rocky bodies in our solar system alone to have trillions of humans and expand for thousands of years.

Each gas giant would be like a mini star system in and of itself

>>212747690
>>212747802
what you would really do is hollow it out (easy, because of low gravity) and then use the material to build a cylindrical habitat (or bring your own prefab) and put it in the cavity. This will provide shielding from cosmic rays and micro meteors.

>>212747882
Doctoral students are more like scientist interns than students. They do independent research and don't take classes.

>>212748106
There are tons though. Due to budget constraints, the tv show didn't do the best job showing the sheer scale of some of them. The asteroid stations housed many millions of people. Which is why it was a gigantic deal when the ice hauler was destroyed since all those people would run out of water and air with too many missed shipments

>>212748495
>many millions
I thought the books said the Belter population was like 2 million?

>>212748670
Belt population is listed as between 50-100 million. Mars is 9 billion, Earth 24 billion. It's no wonder they'd be in a gold rush to the new systems where it's finally empty again

>>212748495
>all those people would run out of water and air with too many missed shipments
how do you "run out" of water in a closed system? are they constantly ejecting it into space?

>>212749174
they drink and it turns into pee pee poo poo

>>212749174
Because people come into and leave that closed system, taking their water with them.

>>212749174
They use it in ships for reaction mass thrusters