Thread 213544326

How come paying Critical Drinker off for a good review and astroturfing Julia Garner being sexy didnt work?

I guess people don't really care about the F4, and it doesn't help that none of the previous attempts have been good.

The Fantastic 4 are really gay.

>capeslop
grow up

Pedro Pascal just isn't a movie star.

nobody likes the fantastic four
are there more fantastic 4 movies than superman movies? it feels that way. and they're all bad

>>213544382
>>213545072
It's not that people don't care about F4, it's that people are sick of the MCU. The people that still give a shit go the opening weekend, and that's it.

>are there more fantastic 4 movies than superman movies?
If you're just counting theatrical releases, there are as many Christopher Reeve Superman movies as there are F4 movies, if you count Returns or the Donner cut of Superman 2 as equal to the unreleased '94 F4 movie then it's still even.

>>213544326 (OP)
It just wasn’t a very interesting movie desu

The fact that they can get 400m+ just off Marvel branding alone means they just have a built-in audience.

They should be reducing the budgets. Maybe it'll be good for them as a lot of iconic scenes in history were made because of budgetary constraints.

>>213545431
>It's not that people don't care about F4
No. It's true. No one cares about the boring superhero family that all dress in the same uniform like they're going to Disneyland. But you're also correct about MCU being on the descent.

>>213544382
yeah, agree, same happened with man of steel, after the previous atrocious attempt nobody expected anything from it

>>213544326 (OP)
I’ve interacted with a bunch of normies and old friends this past week. None of them care or have EVER cared about the F4. They either view them as boring or a “support squad” at best. Nobody really sees them as a flagship team. They like Doom or Silver Surfer more. The only sincere fans of the F4 are 50+ years old and are an alienated portion of the MCU base at this point who would rather stick to their Kirby comics than see how marvel butchers their favorite characters next. That’s why this shit failed.

>>213545519
>No. It's true. No one cares about the boring superhero family
No, I get that, but that isn't the factor in play. Remember nobody gave a shit about Guardians of the Galaxy before the movie came out, hell nobody but actual comic nerds gave a shit about Iron Man or Thor before the MCU. That's why Marvel used Iron Man, because it was one of the few properties that they still owned because no studio was interested in making an Iron Man movie. If this movie had come out, identical as it is now, after the first Guardians movie or just after Civil War it would have been carried by hype for weeks.
The MCU is dying because general audiences are tired of capeshit, it's only because Disney has so much money tied up in Marvel that they haven't abandoned to series, if it were just a regular studio like Universal, Paramount, or even Fox (before the buyout) this genre would have died out completely five years ago.
Disney are forcing this shit to go on because they are still making just enough money to justify it, and because the MCU is still going all the other studios are pretending capeshit is still viable because they can coast behind it.

>>213544326 (OP)
Nobody cares about fantastic four
they only care about kino surfer

>>213546288
Fair point. I concede, senpai. But I'd also argue that space pirates with guns and a talking racoon (with guns) and others has some inherent appeal to work with. At the very core of what they are, the F4 just feel lame. Even before Disney MCU took off, F4 had their chance, basking in the support of successes like X Men and Spider-Man. They're just kinda wack.

>>213544326 (OP)
there's no draw power from any of the cast

>>213545516
>They should be reducing the budgets
Superman and the F4 are $100 mil budget IPs. They don't have the immense global appeal that a character like Spider-Man has.

>>213546178
>“support squad” at best
Literally always that OTHER team that shows up in the Avengers and X-Men cartoons. They mostly care about Doom and Thing's beef with the Hulk.

>>213546385
>At the very core of what they are, the F4 just feel lame.
That's because they have bad PR. Every movie keeps trying to do a "family team" fights Doom and maybe convinces Silver Surfer to ask Galactus not to eat them, and they make both Doom and Galactus kinda lame. F4 should be doing cool space shit. Imagine Star Trek (TOS or early TNG) but with The Incredibles.

>>213546461
F4 no but Superman should have that appeal. WB fucked up

>>213546529
>Bad PR
Maybe. But I lean into them being a little lame. You're never going to have a serious leader that audiences look up to when his power is fucking stretching.

>>213546529
>>213546659
I mean come on bro look at this. I'm willing to be proven wrong but this guy is just a dork.

>>213546659
>You're never going to have a serious leader that audiences look up to when his power is fucking stretching.
This is true, mainly because Reed is always depicted as a fairly smart, socially awkward guy, who can reach for a book from across the room. Reed in the comics is presented as having an intellect that can also stretch further than normal human genius and also kind of a dick. If Reed were characterised more like House in the movies audiences would respond more.
Don't get me wrong, on paper F4 are super lame, but it really doesn't help that hey have yet to get a film that is willing to at least try and do something more interesting with them. The 2005 F4 movie at least had a great cast and had the characters play off each other well (especially Ben and Johnny), the just bitched out on Doom.

>>213546811
I appreciate your breakdown. That does sound more appealing than what I've seen advertised in his screen adaptations. Any good comics of the F4 you'd recommend? I'm willing to give them a chance.

>>213544326 (OP)
>Julia Garner being sexy
It's almost like reddit and 4chan have absolutely no standards at all.

I swear yall will literally fuck any object that ever so slightly resemble a female human being

>>213544382
Are we ready to admit the only reason anyone went to see the original F4 movies was because of Jessica Alba?

>>213546928
who are these people, actually? that movie came out in 2005, people didn't need to go see a shitty movie to see pretty women anymore. in that year, you could probably bring up alba in less clothes as quickly as you could type it into google, when google wasn't shit even

hilarious that this is still a better portrayal of johnny storm

>>213544382
It's not f4 it's Pedro and dog shit writing.

Asked in my friends group chat about F4/Sups. Only two males saw the movies. Both think the films are in the same level "from decent to Ok but I preferred Superman". No recs.

>>213547129
I actually like the suit, except that baggy trousers. If it was all tight fitting, it'd be the perfect F4 suit

>>213546178
That’s exactly why I knew this movie would be a front loaded disaster. Marvel nerds would show up opening weekend but nobody else would. Nobody cares about F4. The Incredibles took F4 and mogged it. And why? Because went all in on camp and comedy and didn’t go all serious. Why first F4 movie was moderately successful

>>213546847
It depends on what you like in comics. I'd recommend the stuff from the 90s because that was when Marvel was trying to get weird and experiment with their characters (for the last time really), and Claremont did a run during that time as well. John Byrne's stuff is good and he added She-Hulk onto the team to replace The Thing and Byrne is She-Hulk's best writer by far, his run on her book defined the character. If you want a really different take there is the Mark Millar Ultimate Fantistic Four run where in typical Millar fashion everyone is a total asshole, it also crossed over with Marvel Zombies which if you haven't read is a fucking amazing series, and has some good F4 stuff (don't spoil it for yourself). I think that would give you a good mix of F4 at both ends of the spectrum.

>>213545431
>It's not that people don't care about F4
I'm very fond of the Byrne and Simonson runs but this has never once been the kind of property you'd make a movie about. It just doesn't work that way, and literally the only reason Fox kept shitting them out was a contractual obligation to keep the rights from reverting to Marvel. It's a hugely dated concept that modernization won't fix. Many of Kirby's ideas were not adaptable (Eternals, Inhumans) and studios are too greedy and stupid to accept this.

>>213546288
>nobody gave a shit about Guardians of the Galaxy before the movie came out
And then Gunn said "fuck your color palette, we're going to make this like Bill Mantlo would have"

>>213545465
This...
People are crying out for a decent action blockbuster.
If word of mouth for F4 was good, the movie could've made money.
It was just a shit movie.
You don't need to blame the cast, or cape fatigue, or people being tired of the MCU...
It was just shit.

>>213547129
Stan Lee felt the same way when the 2000s film came out.
Chris Evans Johnny was the perfect wiseass

>>213547796
>this has never once been the kind of property you'd make a movie about.
Going back to what I said here >>213546529
>Imagine Star Trek (TOS or early TNG) but with The Incredibles.
Maybe the best choice for Marvel is to give up trying to make them into a movie and do a TV series. Honestly that would be a smarter move for Disney, instead of the stupid shit they did with the D+ shows trying to take movie characters and do TV shows, take the characters that are better suited to long form stories and make those into shows, F4 going on Star Trek exploration movies into different planets and dimensions. Hell even Spider-Man would be better suited to TV, where it focuses more on Peter struggling to maintain a normal life when he's constantly needing to do superhero stuff. Same with X-Men, longer arcs that can let characters shine, instead of "It's an X-Men movie, better centre it on Wolverine" meanwhile nobody knows anything about Colossus except that he's Russian and turns into metal, or that Nightcrawler is German and can teleport. Imagine having the chance to do an entire episode where Nightcrawler and Storm get lost in cave system, Nightcrawler can't teleport because he isn't sure which way to go, and Storm can access her powers because they're underground, and on top of that she's freaking out because Storm is MASSIVELY claustrophobic. You'd never get to see that in a movie, but I guarantee it'd be a best-of level episode.

>>213548037
>Maybe the best choice for Marvel is to give up trying to make them into a movie and do a TV series.
I'm the guy who said it has no legs as a movie but god damn would it ever as a series considering the metric ton of soap opera shit

>>213547043
most people were still on dialup in 05 you dumb broccoli head

>>213544326 (OP)
no thanks I don't support the "mandate"

>>213544326 (OP)
Surely this will finally hammer into Marvel execs heads that F4 will never be as popular as they think it could be
Third time's the charm

>>213548298
oh yeah i forgot we're probably talking about gooners from third world countries like the united states, my bad

>>213544326 (OP)
i watched the flash yesterday and comparing it to the thunderbolts the flash is just so much better quality wise. i don't think people realise just how bad marvel movies are because 1. the competition has improved 2. marvel movies have gotten worse and 3. most people have been watching nothing but marvel for a decade. they have shit cgi, shit acting and shit plots.

>>213549071
Agreed. The Flash is not a bad movie and only bombed because of the Ezra boycott. All complaints i’ve seen about it nobody had a problem with the exact same shit in Spider Man No Way Home.

>>213545431
>it's that people are sick of the MCU
so tired of people throwing this out as if it's some explanation
WHY are people sick of the mcu?
its because they abandoned comic accurate casting or finding charismatic actors and instead its all forced corporate pre-approved room temperature slop
the lead up to infinity war was peak because people who knew the comics could kind of tell what was going on, which gave people a rough idea of what to expect and create fan theories for, but the actual execution was also not bad
the Kang bit got fucked up now its not clear that any movies are "going" anywhere anymore

>>213544326 (OP)
They didn't pay off the Drinker he was trying to help sink Superman, lol.

>>213545431
They're not sick of the MCU. In the first round, they established characters that people loved, then brought them together when they added the metaplot. That made audiences care about that plot, because they cared about the characters in it. But the Big Three are gone, and they're trying and failing to do it again with new characters, but they're also adding he metaplot at the same time, they're rushing things, badly.

It's the same reason the DCEU failed, besides hiring the walking cancer that is Nolan. They didn't take the time to set up any of their characters properly, save Superman. Any wonder why Cavill is the one guy everyone simped for? Even Gadot fell off fast after one bad movie, Cavill had one good one, two stinkers and Snyder's patch job and he still has people wanting him back.

>>213549721
>Any wonder why Cavill is the one guy everyone simped for?

It's just a lot of gay men doing that.

>>213546351
Maybe they should have actually put him in the movie then.

>>213546288
If audiences were sick of capeshit then The Boys and Invincible wouldn't be so popular.

>>213544326 (OP)
you cant force people like pedro pascal

he is a fucking weirdo degenerate.

>>213544326 (OP)
>Pedro Pascal
yawn, pass

>>213544326 (OP)
A movie can be good and still flop.

>>213544326 (OP)
The last times the F4 was relevant even in the comic slop community it was when:
1.Sue Storm cucks Reed with Namor
2.Reed becomes an evil incel and takes over the world with a genetically engineered master race

And option one is out of the question since they made Namor a goofy mexican with little boy swim trunks in the MCU, so the second one would have been their best option.

>>213549181
>WHY are people sick of the mcu?
Because genres shift in trends. People are sick of superhero movies in the same way they got sick of westerns, or disaster films, or space movies, or movie about radioactive mutant monsters. There will always be superhero movies in the future, the same way there are still the occasional western, but its time as the dominant genre is fading. Audiences just want something different.

>>213544326 (OP)
I have Pedrophilia fatigue.

>Fantastic Four 2005
Great cast and overall solid movie but they shit the bed with Dr. Doom. The man is a Central European dictator wizard, not a generic American rich guy. He's also visually striking in the comics but he looked ridiculous in the film. This dragged the entire project down imho.
>Fantastic Four: Rise of the Silver Surfer
Decent enough until Galactus shows up or more accurately DOESN'T show up. Big, big mistake cockteasing us with the big guy, such a cowardly move that the franchise deserved to fail at that point
>Fantastic Four 2015
Non-starter due to black Johnny Storm. Never gonne watch it
>Fantastic Four 2025
Non-starter due to Pedro Reed and Silver Surfette. Never gonna watch it, never gonna watch an MCU movie with Pedro in it

Critical Drinker and Nerdrotic loved it, WTF I love The Fantastic Four: First Steps now with bogged hag and faggot.

Marvel sisters...

>>213550589
You'll never know if either one of them loved it or not since 1) neither one are film critics and 2) every single thing they say is political posturing meant to push extreme right-wing rhetoric for clicks.

>>213544326 (OP)
Here's why:
>Reed was poorly cast with flavour of the month annoying moustache man
>Sue was poorly cast with bogged hag-era unlikeable woman
>Johnny was poorly cast with uncharismatic random from recent but now forgotten popular TV show
>Ben was poorly cast with a complete nobody with unsuitable girly voice for a rock monster
>Lady Silver Surfer was poorly cast with current attempt to push her into everything beaky-nosed girl
>Galactus was poorly designed, but well cast
>first 3rd of the film was just backstory
>second 3rd was interesting but fell short of being good
>final 3rd was just a cheap live-action knock-off of the Incredibles

Honestly, the Rise of the Silver Surfer was an objectively better film, and that still sucked.

>>213550964
>Galactus was poorly designed
He's comic book accurate.

>>213546351
he looks so STOOPID

>>213550992
He was never drawn with Ralph Ineson's face.

>>213545431
>It's not that people don't care about F4,
It is and the saddest thing is that had they fought harder to get back the rights whole the MCU was hot it could have elevated them same way it did for Iron man, Captain America and GOTG but now that the MCU as at a state where even if you make decent to ok films the public will reject it if its not from an already popular property there was no way a F4 film in the current year was going to be successful

>>213551017
No one gave a shit about the Guardians of the Galaxy before James Gunn got ahold of it either but it turns out that if you make a good movie with a good cast people will enjoy it

>>213544326 (OP)
>movie is mid slop at best
>go see it gush! itsh a return to form, go away now!

>>213550964
>Johnny was poorly cast with uncharismatic random from recent but now forgotten popular TV show
>Ben was poorly cast with a complete nobody with unsuitable girly voice for a rock monster
Did you somehow mix up those two? Ben's actor is from The Bear.

>>213544326 (OP)
It's just that bad. It's down there at the bottom with Brave New World, Marvels and Quantumania. It makes Eternals look like a decent flick.

>>213550936
How is "men and women should be equals" extreme right wing rhetoric? You're basically outing yourself as extremist when you take that stance.

>>213551144
No idea what the Bear is, I meant Johnny was that weirdo from Stranger Things.

>>213551231
lol.

>>213551144
Is that the one where the grizzly gets all tooted up on coke?

>>213551017
The MCU could've cast better and younger actors.
>>213551108
Too bad Gunn bombed with Suicide Squad 2 and D-list characters.

>>213546178
>I’ve interacted with a bunch of normies and old friends this past week. None of them care or have EVER cared about the F4. They either view them as boring or a “support squad” at best. Nobody really sees them as a flagship team. They like Doom or Silver Surfer more. The only sincere fans of the F4 are 50+ years old and are an alienated portion of the MCU base at this point who would rather stick to their Kirby comics than see how marvel butchers their favorite characters next. That’s why this shit failed.

You're a retard. Do you think anyone cared about Guardians of the Galaxy before the movie?
F4 failed because it's an absolute stinker.

>>213551255
I didn't see it but in the comics the Suicide Squad is always full of D-listers, it's part of the charm

>>213546288
>If this movie had come out, identical as it is now, after the first Guardians movie or just after Civil War it would have been carried by hype for weeks.

So much cope, instead of simply admitting the movie is garbage. It's soulless trash and a flop with no redeeming qualifies, and it would have been soulless trash and a flop even if it came out right after Infinity War.

>>213551312
>So much cope, instead of simply admitting the movie is garbage.
No that's what I am saying. I'm saying that even with the film as it is, people used to be so stoked on the MCU they would have convinced themselves that the film was perfect.

>>213551246
Exactly. Someone who thinks Drinker is anything beyond anti woke is deluded by years of brainwashing, to the point that it's comical. The first part of every brainwashing program is making the subject believe everyone else is the programed one. Drinker bases his reviews with a heavy weighting on whether something is woke or not. There's weird outliers though, like his disdain for the Avatar movies. I can't fathom why he hates them when they're so politically neutral.

>>213551391
>I can't fathom why he hates them
For me it's the fact that the aliens look fucking stupid

This guy is not handsome enough to be a movie star. He's got a face for community theater.

>>213544326 (OP)
Drinker trashed Thunderbolts if you think he's on the Disney's payroll.

>>213551458
That's because they didn't pay him for Thunderbolts, they paid him for Sloptastic Sores

>>213551424
Right. Feige didn't really want to attract women with casting Pascal and him, or attracting men with casting Kirby for that matter.

>>213551497
Pretty sure he was going for the gay audience with those two bits of casting

>You just have to be good bro

Reminder that this piece of shit made over 800 milly while the critically acclaimed reboot flopped hard. Yes it really has all to do with timing than just being good and 2016 is where capeshit peaked for general audiences.

>>213551538
I watch for she

>>213551458
Dude, she is so fucking locked in on that cheese. Seriously, what is it with women and cheese? Sure, I'm partial to a good double cream brie, but women are total fucking fiends for that shit.

>>213551538
the reboot flopped because they dumped it on streaming the same day it came out in theaters

>>213551627
Kek.

>>213551353
>people used to be so stoked on the MCU they would have convinced themselves that the film was perfect

They really wouldn't. That movie is The Marvels tier.

>>213544326 (OP)
people are just tired of seeing every franchise being about girlbosses who beat up and rescue weak, stupid white men

film is literally DEI, doesnt mean you need niggers everywhere. It simply means depiction of all the dregs below white men. For example, the end has an angry, powerful female, who uses force (mind you no weaponry nor harm towards a human) while the closeted homosexual Pedro craddles a child, aping from the flash. Who wants to watch the genders inverted for the nth time? I guarantee the lack of verisimilitude in films has caused the audience just wanting to see niggers behave as niggers, the enemies be foreigners and the protagonist to be just that and only that

>>213550589
What a fucking fag.

>>213544326 (OP)
It's okay, they've been teasing the Namor cuckolding arc. That will definitely bring the fans back.

>>213544326 (OP)
After trying for what is it now, 3 times? I think its time to realise fantastic 4 just is not gonna work in film.

>>213550936
>extreme right wing rhetoric
>Critical Drinker

You’re in a cult

>>213551492
This. Marvel needed F4 to succeed and they couldn’t have Drinker influencing the box office negatively

just got back from it. it was decent. female silver surfer didn't bother me because it's just galactus' herald and she gives Johnny something to do. pedro was fine, he was more interesting than chudsphere makes him out to be. he plays autism well. biggest problem with the movie was the baby cgi which was unbelievably bad. and the cutaways to that travel black woman all the time.

>>213544326 (OP)
They had the visuals right but the cast is dogshit. Three literal nobodies and Pedo Rascal.
Marvel are fucking cooked for the foreseeable future because they blew the format that made them money.
Phase 1 to 4 almost all lead up to Thanos and the Infinity Gauntlet.
Then they added a bunch of TV show bullshit that nobody gave a fuck about and the movies it spawned tanked.
Then they made a black guy their big bad and he was arrested for domestic abuse and fired.
Now they've decided to make all of their movies borderline standalone with a three-second teaser for some bullshit that may or may not happen on day that nobody gives a fuck about.
The end credit teaser in Thunderbolts was for this shit movie that nobody fucking cares about and is flopping like diarrhoea.
Avengers is going to be the biggest flop in cinematic history and no, RDJ isn't going to save it.

>>213546602
James Gunn is a one-trick pony who only ever does ensemble movies like Guardians and Suicide Squad. He gets a Superman movie and has to cram it full of as many characters as humanly possible because that's all he knows.
It's amazing that they put this guy in charge of their entire cinematic universe because he made a couple of decent Guardians movies.

>>213553716
they should make a 3D animated movie under Pixar and call it "The Fantastics" or something

>>213544326 (OP)
>astroturfing Julia Garner being sexy
Are you retarded?

>>213555483
are you? that bitch could smoke a cigarette in the rain with her hands tied behind her back, that nose is like a natural canopy, it's even casting a shadow in her own face it's so large

Simple. is Disney+ fault
Why waste money going to the theaters when you can wait a month and watch it at home?

>>213551391
lol.

>>213554899
nobody mentions how the whole "Multiverse Saga" hinges on watching the Loki show. It may be a popular show compared to the other Disney+ slop but it's nowhere near as popular as the movies

>>213550838
glad I watched a camrip of Brave New World
>the big twist of the story is President Ross is Red Hulk
>but that's spoiled in every trailer they made showing him disappear behind a podium and Red Hulk pop out
>even the movie posters show Red Hulk
>even worse if you didn't watch the D+ show you're not going to understand the B plot
>even though they quite literally said you don't have to watch the D+ shows to get the movies
thunderbolts really shouldn't have introduced Sentry if they're not going to give him anything to do besides just be there. He's also just horribly miscast, but I guess they cant find any attractive males to play heroes anymore

>>213556783
Why does every Marvel character need to be mentally ill?

>>213544694
>Pedro Pascal just isn't a movie star.
He really isn't. Social media departments of these production companies think he is because he has a cult on Filmtwitter/Instagram etc but those people tend to be disconnected from reality and not representative of reality.

>>213556783
>He's also just horribly miscast,
True.
>but I guess they cant find any attractive males to play heroes anymore
Hollywood deliberately doesn't cast masculine men.

>>213557019
There are no movie stars left. They're all social media influencers.

>>213544326 (OP)
Even his pose is awkward. This is not combat, strategy, or Sci fi fantasy. Just posing

>>213556159
That whole storyline was binned as soon as Kang got arrested so now there is nothing leading up to Doomsday apart from a single after-credit scene in a movie that nobody went to see.
Zero hype for Doomsday.

>>213556159
If Loki can enchant the multiverse to keep it alive why doesn't he just time stop the decay of the multiverse and go about doing his business?

>>213547452
also make the emblem bigger and give it a slightly lighter shade of blue

>>213551538
it had aura

>>213544326 (OP)
Be KIND, be Punk Rock.

>>213544326 (OP)
There's literally no reason to see this movie

>No must-see-on-the-big-screen action scene like Thanos throwing the moon
>No set up for Doomsday
>No cool showcase of powers like Black Panther detonating vibranium vibrations
>All the characters are subdued versions of comic counterparts
>The actors were directed to tone down their acting
>Fucking Galactus which should have been a showstopper just causally walks through NYC and gets pushed into a black hole by Invisible Girl

>>213544326 (OP)
>stoopid people still believe in Critical Faggot's opinions

>>213545519
FF failed because it was bland and offensively inoffensive.

>>213547796
>Many of Kirby's ideas were not adaptable

yeah probably concepts like slave races and people like Moleman driven underground for being ugly, or Ben Grimm actually punching the shit out of something.

>>213546288
>The MCU is dying because general audiences are tired of capeshit

Audiences are tired of BAD MOVIES that keep straying further and further away from the source material

>>213550589
both of them are faggots and paid for political agents. not even capable of actual movie critique

>>213551391
>Avatar

Cameron is still jerking off to his fantasy version of Fern Gully/Dances with Wolves. We couldve gotten more Alita instead.

>>213554975
Gunnman cant do aspirational types of characters, he can only do scrappy antiheros

>>213551538
capeshit fatigue and bloated budgets it is over for marvel.

>>213544326 (OP)
>astroturfing Julia Garner being sexy
she is cute and weapons is doing well. It isn't because the movie is bad. People don't want marvel movie anymore. It is a tainted brand.

>>213559775
He would have been a better choice to direct Thunderbolts which I believe is something he really wanted before Disney fired him.

>>213546602
superman nailed completely the Usa audience, what are you talking about?