Thread 213586697

>A disappointing performance from John Wick spinoff Ballerina has left TV and movie production company Lionsgate facing a $94 million quarterly net loss.

What went wrong?

>>213586697 (OP)
All female led action films flop

women

>>213586697 (OP)
Nobody likes female assassin movies. They're all the same and they always fail.

>>213586697 (OP)
Get woke, go broke.

just stop trying to make female led action movies. obviously doesnt have enough appeal

>>213586697 (OP)
Oh no, however will it survive?

I think it's time to accept that most of the appeal of John Wick is Keanu Reeves and none of these spinoffs are going to work.
They're planning on a Donnie Yen and a Norman Reedus spinoff that are going to crash and burn too.

>>213587003
Saw 11
>you know you'll watch it

Woke is dying but is gun interest also dying? I imagine FPS sales are shit compared to COD4 days, does anyone care about bang bang plot armor movies and TV?

if they didn't have her running around beating up guys three times her size it might have worked

>>213586697 (OP)
Its so obvious it has nothing to do with money. They know people dont want to see this shit but keep making it.

>>213587035
Of course. JiggyC is the only thing that gets me into the theater come October.

Has there ever been a female assassin box office success? It seems like a niche kind of movie.

>>213586697 (OP)
furiosabros... I-I mean ballerinabros... what happened?

>>213586697 (OP)
Man this is so unexpected. How could this possibly happen?

>>213587068
Atomic Blond did well. Ballerina would've also done fine if it was within its original budget and didn't require Chad to reshoot 90% of the film.

>>213586697 (OP)
im not against female assassin movies.
>>213586927
kill bill you stupid faggot.
with everything said above, why would they take an established franchise built around Keanu and take out Keanu? Keanu was the Kean-glue that held that flimsy retarded franchise together. Removing Keanu exposes how shallow the writing/lore was. Nobody gives a fuck about anything else except seeing Keanu shoot guys, and having a reason for it. I've only seen the first one, young dumb evil kid kills his dog. Perfect. I don't need to know about the lore, or underground assassin's club, all i needed to know was that Keanu 1.retired 2. not somebody to fuck with. Cool scene was when that mob boss dad who you'd assume could pull strings, held his son and said "I can't save you". That brief moment tells you everything you need to know about Keanu without going into some retarded lore. The dog was more than a dog, it represented the last tie Keanu had to his wife, and it got brutally stomped to death. Simple, relatable, effective.
Making a movie without Keanu and having more lore was a horrible idea.

>>213587097
For every At9mic Blonde there's a dozen The 355, Charlie's Angels reboot, Cleaner etc

>>213587042
For the most part she isn't. She gets her ass kicked fairly often and only really wins because of weapons.

>>213586927
Anna and Atomic Blonde were both highly kinographic.

>>213586697 (OP)
Ana was always overrated around here because of BR2049. The premise was going to lose money no matter what but she lost them more money.

>>213587068
La Femme Nikita was one of the highest grossing French films of all time, zoomie.

>>213586697 (OP)

Not everything is meant to be a cinematographic universe. John Wick was cool, the man was avenging his dog. We didn´t need 4 movies a spin off show and a spin off movie. We just didn´t.

>>213587212
Len Wiseman lost them money by being a shit director. It went from a $60 million dollar film to a $90 million dollar one. On the original budget it would've made back its money.

>>213587035
They've got Saw, they've got The Hunger Games, they got shit I can't even remember like Expendables and Den of Thieves

>>213587068
>Has there ever been a female assassin box office success?
Grossed $50mill in 1993, about $110mill in nowbux. Not huge, but no flop either.

It sucked ass, that's what went wrong.

>>213586697 (OP)
I only even know about this movie because it popped up when I watched the first JW on Amazon
>>213587022
Only spinoff I would actually like to see is one with Willem Dafoe. I saw the miniseries one with Mel Gibson and it felt like it was made by committee.

>>213587229
Especially since most of the appeal is the action sequences and it's clear that these for hire actors/directors can't fucking do it.

>>213587022
>>213587266
Donnie Yen at the very least can fight. If they do a spinoff before he was blinded it would probably be fine. Him being a blind assassin for 2 hours would be painful.

>>213586697 (OP)
wow, i can't believe the 100lbs woman assassin movie didn't succeed

suspension of disbelief only works for men in action, if this hoe wanted to play assassin they should have made it a softcore porn where she used her pussy

>>213587068
>>213587226
>>213587241
the tv show was also pretty good "la femme Nikita", been ages since i watched it, pretty dated now, but still comfy

>>213587226

The original show was also great. Josephine

>>213587068
That’s bedtime you’re a culture war dumbass. Female lead action movies have been a thing for decades at this point yet people like you insist they can’t make money

>>213587142
And for every John Wick there is hundreds of dogshit male action movies

>>213586697 (OP)
They already did like 5 female john wick knockoffs before they were able to put out this spinoff, wasn't going to end well
Surprised they haven't done some assassin team up movie with all of John wicks friends from the movies

The only spin-off that ever was successful was Frasier. Everything else has been garbage.

Yea, including Better Call Saul.

>>213586697 (OP)
Maybe you don't have to make spinoffs of every successful product

Female assassins make sense when they're sexy and poisoning people.
Ballerina seemed very intentional in that she never tried to use her attractiveness to give her targets a false sense of security.
She's one of the guys essentially.

>>213587107
Okay but kill bill is a tarintino movie, it supersedes whatever genre he makes because he sells solely off of his name. Not a good example.

>>213587330
>he doesn't want to see blind assassin kino
You sound gay

>>213587022
>most of the appeal of John Wick is Keanu Reeves
He is and he is also very u derrated as action movies star. He always puts in 200% effort.
Unfortunately it was obvious in Ballerina that his knees are completely fucked up.
It was visible in JW4 already, but he barely walks in the spinoff.

>>213587477
Not really.
Prior to Kill Bill he only made Reservoir Dogs, Pulp Fiction and Jackie Brown. And of those three movies the only one that was a massive critical and commercial hit was Pulp Fiction. Reservoir Dogs made no money and Jackie Brown was hated.
Kill Bill is a large part of why Tarantino is as famous as he is.

>>213587517
He was noticeably slow in John Wick 3 compared to the other actors which is why John Wick 4 has barely any hand to hand combat. His body is falling apart sadly.

>>213587226
nobody cares about french cinema.
nobody who has sex at least.

>>213586697 (OP)
what? I don't believe that

>>213587447
That's too "male-centric". It's what they go out of their way to avoid in all these movies. Also why a lot of these female action stars are so old nowadays.

>>213587609
>nobody cares about french cinema.
>nobody who has sex at least.
all the french do is have sex though. they can't even have paternity tests because they can't stop fucking eachothers wives and underage daughters.

>>213587481
It's a fun gimmick for 20 minutes and then it gets stupid. And the way he acts for most of John Wick 4 (outside of the Osaka scenes) he might as well have his vision.

They need to stop making these live action female action movies, this stuff only works in anime.

Sick of the girl power shit. It’s fuckin gay

>>213587603
Don't know if you saw Ballerina but he is barely standing in that one, much worse than JW4. It's okay though, he is 60 years old man, I'll always appreciate him.

>>213587722
im not talking about french cinema within france, of course they're gonna like the shit they make, and yes the french fuck.
What i meant to say and should've clarified was
>nobody outside of france cares about french cinema, and those outside of france that keep up with it, are virgins.
It's like a cooler version of anime, but somehow gayer and more annoying, because you at least comprehend an anime fan to be an annoying faggot, but anyone too into french cinema may trick the initial individual into thinking they have something interesting to talk about, but in reality they are also an annoying faggot.

>>213587735
and then she gets double penetrated by street thugs three minutes later
the hentai scenes in mezzo forte are so kino

>>213587735
Masterpiece

>>213587425
Family matters
Honeymooners
Angel
Boston Legal
Melrose Place
NCIS
The Andy Griffith Show
Happy Days
Pinky and the brain
Xena
Daria

>>213587735
japan used to be one of the best animators of all time, but even they have fallen for tweening/rigs and slopification.

>>213587824
Yes they are.
Same with Kite, yes, including the NTR.
I hope his new movie also has the femc get raped.

>>213586697 (OP)
I saw the first Jack Wick and didn't understand how anyone was impressed.

>>213587003
They have MJ + bunch of franchises

the witch part 1 was kino, too bad part 2 was godawful slop

What's with all the [Sad News] and [Great News] threads lately?

>>213588079
it's one or two autists that emulate the 2ch/5ch style of shitposting where they post with [悲報
] or [朗報] (sad news/good news) and then some inflammatory topic

>>213588079
>lately

>>213588079
Bait is the only way you get any engagement

>>213586697 (OP)
>John Wick (2014)
>Budget $20–30 million
>Box office $86 million

>Ballerina (2025)
>Budget $90 million
>Box office $132.3 million
If you had spent 20-30 million on it, it would have made a profit.

never even heard of this movie

why didnt they name it Jane Wick

>>213588173
Wet Wick

>>213587226
kino

You're still falling for this? Movie studios report every movie as a loss so they don't have to pay out contracts to the actors and crew. The movie profits are shifted to other parts of the studio and redistributed to the board and CEOs as bonusus and raises.

Movies just don't make money from the theater, they also make money from merch, dvds, toys, streaming, etc.

Saying it's a loss is just a way to trick people that don't know any better and to keep the lawyers off their ass with their "creative accounting".

>>213588445
>merch, dvds, toys
Bro, what year do you think it is?

>>213588574
I don't think they're making billions on that stuff consistently, but they are definitely making more than they report. Especially with all the distribution contracts. The movie is available on multiple websites and streaming. Those sites have to pay for that.

>>213586756
>>213586927
>>213587107
>>213587477

Ballerina is not a bad movie, but it had to big of a budget . It cost $90 million and made $132.3 million.

>John Wick (2014)
>Budget $20–30 million
>Box office $86 million

>John Wick: Chapter 2 (2017)
>Budget $40+ million
>Box office $174.3 million

>John Wick: Chapter 3 – Parabellum (2019)
>Budget $75 million
>Box office $327.7 million

>John Wick: Chapter 4 (2023)
>Budget $100 million
>Box office $447.3 million

>>213586697 (OP)
People just want more Keanu Reeves and action. They don't want spin-offs and an expanded world of John Wick, who gives a shit.

>>213586756
>>213586927
>>213587107
>>213587477

some successful action movies with a female lead: Alien and Aliens, The Terminator and Terminator 2: Judgment Day, the Tomb Raider films, Kill Bill Vol. 1 & 2, The Hunger Games series, Salt, Lucy, Wonder Woman, and Captain Marvel

Small budget movies, especially horror, can make money. Big budget movies can make a lot of money but a lot of franchises are crashing and burning. Rather than 700 million or hitting a billion and being big hits, many things are hitting 500 million. Mid budget films go practically no where, especially with such small marketing budgets. If this film had been cheaper, it would have been fine, but they felt the John Wick franchise would do the heavy lifting. People are still trying to make universes.

>>213588673
Ahtually, ppl don't even want Keanu Reeves that much, some of his movies that failed : Generation Um… (2012), 47 Ronin (2013), Knock Knock (2015), and Replicas (2018) and The Matrix 4

>>213588755
Correct. Hs

>>213586756
also, I hate Jurassic World movies, but the current one is earnin a lot.
SAD!!
!!

Somehow it was more unrealistic than the John Wick films.

i dont think many guys are going to see a movie called ballerina

>>213589271
Am I blind or did his body just completely fucking vanish?
Outside of the fact that the entire scene is just retarded in general, where the fuck did that first dude's body go? You don't even see any blood or guts or anything where he exploded, which is insane considering the other guys blows up like something out of fucking Gears of War.

Just watch the better version.

>>213589271
If this had been a John Wick, Keanu would've been thrown across the room by the explosion, as it should've done here

>>213586697 (OP)
was it the only lionsgate film released in that quarter? Or it's easier to blame ballerina?

>>213587573
I am so tired of zoomer revisionist history on this board. Shut the fuck up.

>>213586697 (OP)
Good. Burn it all down to the ground.

>>213586697 (OP)
Men don't want to watch women beat up/kill men.

>>213586697 (OP)
God made it clear that women are to remain silent in church. Lesbians and man-haters remain angry (and will remain so into perpetuity, so ignore them) about this and think they can invent a world where God isn't necessary.

>>213586697 (OP)
>over reaching after end of series
>literary who character
>female
>so it is basically rip off of Nikita/Black Widow?
>dubious marketing, went under radar

>>213588700
>Alien and Aliens, The Terminator
These are horror films. The titular monster it the star of the film, the female lead is there to survive it.

>Terminator 2: Judgment Day
Arnie is the star AND the lead of this film.

>Tomb Raider films
Box office bombs

>Kill Bill Vol. 1 & 2
Reducing Tarantino's flicks to "action movie" is disingenuous.

>The Hunger Games series, Salt, Lucy, Wonder Woman, and Captain Marvel
Only liked by women

>>213590150
Nobody cares about your desert demon and his greedy, pedophilic churches.

>>213590122
I'll watch it if she's sexy and there's lots of gratuitous shots of her butt and cleavage, otherwise I have little reason to watch such drivel.

>>213590122
Wrong. They dont want to watch films made for women, that show women beating up/killing men. The shows made for guys are very different. See 70s Wonder Woman for men vs the feminist trash that was Gadots

>>213590065
Facts don't care about your feelings Boomer.

>>213586697 (OP)
This actually sucks because it was excellent. I was legitimately blown away. Also, the “cult” was basically Israel lmao.

>>213590065
>>213590353
Case in point: death proof bombed hard

>>213587573
No really, everybody including myself went to see the movie only because of the name Tarantino, who was massively known back in the 90s, Kill Bill is early 2000s when his name had time to get known by everybody.

>>213589973
They had a bad fucking year
Only thing that's done okay was Den of Thieves 2
Right before Ballerina were Another Simple Favor, Shadow Force, and fucking Hurry Up Tomorrow
They've actually put out like 20 movies so far this year, you heard of almost none of them

>>213590341
I only want to watch shows about girls fighting if the girls are sexy and scantily clad and fight other sexy, scantily clad women alongside the mooks.

>>213589271
The way she moves lacks grace or really anything which could make the scene believable. I paused it midway, it's just embarrassing. How did people become so artless? Even martial arts is art. Truly art has been thoroughly destroyed now, it's over.

For the record To Aru no Kagaku no Railgun which is a spin off of To Aru no Majutsu no Index is more popular than the later even though it has a female protagonist. So popular in fact that the Chinese website "Bilibili" is named after her. So these "filmmakers" just don't know what they are doing, absolutely inept, don't blame it on anything else than lack of skill and consideration, an affront to art.

>>213587068
I was going to say Hanna but apparently it only made 60 on a 30 budget which is pretty mediocre. That's the only good one I could think of, and even then it's more of a child assassin movie than a female assassin movie.

>>213587022
Terrible, love Yen, HATED him in the Wick movie.

>>213586697 (OP)
Ballet is gay. Didn't watch Black Swan, didn't watch this, only watched From Russia with Love maybe four times.

>>213588656
What could've cost that much? Flamethrowers?

>>213590251
>Arnie is the star AND the lead of this film.

Kill thyself

Did they really think that an interquel spinoff starring a new, less intriguing character would do as well as one of the main films?

>>213591182
Nta but the first movie was meant to be a vehicle for Michael Biehn but Arnold stole the show.
Second movie was Arnold and Edward Furlong with Linda Hamilton a distant and annoying third.

>>213587192
shut up faggot

>>213587824
Back at the collage I saw a few screenshots of mezzo forte and it looked cool so I requested it from a friend who had premium accounts for a filesharing host that hosted it. Once I got the movie I learned that it is a hentai, which was pretty embarrassing. If he did watch it he never brought it up

>>213586697 (OP)
What year should Ana have made this movie?

>>213586697 (OP)
How is their Net loss because of one shit movie?

>>213586756
No one actually cares about realism, everyone just expects an out of touch hypocritical self-congratulatory political lecture now if there's going to be a woman action hero.
It's been like this since at least the 60s, people just didn't mind before the mid 2010s because the plurality of narcissists who eat that shit up wasn't so extremely loud and aggressive they broke their own public peer pressure model yet.

>>213586697 (OP)
Who could have possibly seen this coming? I’m blindsided.

>>213586927
Nikita is one of my favourite movies full stop. You just have to get it right and the woman has to be imperilled rather than kicking ass. That's why the Alien franchise was popular, Ripley was just the plucky survivor and the same goes for Sarah Connor. A woman beating an endless stream of men in hand-to-hand combat is not believable.

>>213591697
Studios put all their eggs in one basket these days but also move the basket into a jackhammer testing facility.

>>213587022
Just cast a younger guy who looks like him as him for a series of prequels
You know, Hollywood, instead of ALWAYS doing the "last ride and swan song of retired badass with legendary reputation", for once show how they gained that reputation to begin with, how they got so good, a fresh heros journey

>>213586697 (OP)
I liked this. It was cartoonishly over the top.
>grenade scene
>ice skate nun chuks
>plate smashing
>DBZ flamethrower battle

It was fun

>>213587238
>Expendables
The franchise that has managed to somehow become exponentially shittier with each new addition. You think they've hit the bottom but they always manage to make it so much worse.

>>213591666
2010

>>213587172
She kills an entire village of assassins almost single-handedly.

still better than this

>>213591933
with guns and grenades

>>213586697 (OP)
Tired of skinny tiny women beating up 400 6foot tall or more trained male combatants with ease

>>213592059
Yeah, it still isn't believable.
I don't know how Tarantino managed it for Kill Bill, maybe because it was so cartoonish and deliberately over the top but it doesn't work very often and it didn't work with Ballerina.

>>213591111
advanced hollywood accounting and hooker and blow budget way up

>>213586697 (OP)
because literally anything is more entertaining than watching modern shows/movies.

>>213586927
this was kino

>>213588700
I hope she sees this bro

lol why the fuck did they give a cheap knock off of a Keanu Reave vehicle a budget of 90 million dollars. If they just gave it the same budget as the original it would have been a mild success. The oiriginal probably only got away with that budget because it was Keaunu Reaves who already had a ton of experience with action movies

>>213593919
Budget isn't necessarily how much a movie was given to work with, but how much was spent on making it. I imagine it ballooned out of proportions during reshoots trying to make the movie work at all.

>>213586697 (OP)
the movies are hollow tripe.

>>213589271
>green filter over everything

>>213587425
you forgot mandalorian and grogu

>>213586697 (OP)
hollywood accounting

No one wants to see women in any capacity beyond 30 second goon clips.

>>213586697 (OP)
Why did it cost more to make than the fourth Jon wick movie?

>>213587573
>prior to kill bill Tarantino only made his best movies
Come on now

>>213595045
Shit ton of reshoots and delays

>>213586697 (OP)
This movie would’ve been better if she did little flippy pirouette kicks like she was actually ballet dancing instead of trying to struggle cuddle wrestle on the ground.

>>213586697 (OP)
>What went wrong?
tatttoos

John Wick didn't needed a "universe".

Fuck, it didn't even needed more than a trilogy of films.

>>213596295
Should have just been 1 movie.