Thread 213673870

after rewatching this recently, I realised that, if you don't get caught up in the visuals and soundtrack, the film lacks depth
characters do things for no reason
set pieces just happen - big thing happens, then another big thing. There doesn't seem to be a in universe narrative of what connects them

it's actually quite shallow. still like it, just isn't as good as I thought

>>213673870 (OP)
t brainlet

>>213673870 (OP)
I think it's a hard book to adapt because alot of it is just internal monologs and characters thinking about other characters

Dune is a book for midwits. So it's perfect fodder for Villeneuve slop.

>>213673888
yeah? go on then

What's the point of the shields?

>>213673870 (OP)
Have you considered than in most real world conflicts things are not so intricatetly weaved? Often big, apparently unrelated things just happen and change the course of history.

>>213673962
To stop big ass lasers and bullets.

I wanted more of the guerilla war, but it was just a montage of them ambushing few collectors and suddenly they stopped most production.

>>213674046
the climactic final battle was like two 5 second exterior shots and an interior where all the sardaukar get killed off camera. absolute CINEMA, bRAVO DENIS

>>213673978
big cop out for the script being shite

>>213673870 (OP)
Facts. The production value and acting is great. But it doesn't save the generic plot. Unironically Dennis's worst flicks.

>>213674001
They stop bullets and lasers but not edged weapons? What about arrows?

>>213673928
Prisoners, Arrival, Enemy, Sicario, BR 2049 are kinos of the highest order.

>>213673962
to give a plot reason for everyone to use swords

>>213674142
They stop energy weapons and anything going "too fast". In the books they are trained to kill by slowing down the knife right before the shield so it penetrates it. In the movie they mention it at first but then just kind of forget about it later during the fight scenes.

>>213673870 (OP)
I like Part 1, its decent but I don't get why people prefer Part 2.
I think Part 2 is a mess. I'm not a book reader do idk what they cut but Part 2 feels like it has 6-8 hours of material shoved into a 2 hour film.
Feels so rushed.

>>213674258
yeh, completely agree. Part 1 somehow seems more coherent. I liked the build up. I liked Isaac. I liked Momoa

>>213674181
>Prisoners, Enemy, Sicario are kinos of the highest order
FTFY
Dude needs to get the fuck off this bloated budget, Nolan-esque science-fiction train he's been on for over a decade now, cause this shit ain't working. Not entirely his fault, a lot of issues are the screenplays are just ass, but it also feels like he's getting tired or maybe too comfortable? Cause Dune, especially Part Two, was visual barf. The cinematography, the editing, I don't know man. That shit was just ugly as sin, and the story being retarded didn't help obviously.

>>213674306

The twist in arrival is so ass

>>213674181
Arrival is the only decent one. Sicario is fucking abysmal.

>>213674380
didnt realize sicario was his. it's ok

I watched these two movies earlier this week. They were cool but honestly they didn't feel all that captivating. I thought the lore was the most interesting aspect, but the lionshare of the film is just rather boring stuff focusing on paul and frankly he does not come across as very interesting. He lacks any agency and his arc just boils down to following the path that has been paved for him. You could say I came in expecting a cool sci-fi film duology, and it delivered a somewhat flaccid heros journey political drama.

Oh and about the scene in OP where paul uses those nukes. The first time around I didn't even realize those were supposed to be nuclear missiles being fired. There is no flash and paul just gazes at the explosion no problem. Unless I am missing some key lore detail here I find it concerning that a sci-fi film cant even depict nukes right.

>>213673870 (OP)
duh. if you've seen enough costume drama or stage plays, dunc is just setpieces with eye candy. The relationships are flimsier than a daytime soap.

>>213673895
Drive My Car showed it can be done, by transposing private thoughts into expressive works of the characters. Maybe this means retooling the major characters through mind reading abilities of secondary/minor characters doing their jobs.

>>213674256
Yeah I remember because there's that scene where Josh Brolin is sparring with Willy Wonka and there's literally no other reason for the scene except to exposition dump the shield logic, but then the movie never follows it in real-time. Ever. Especially at the end of Part One, when Idaho Potato is doing some goofy unnecessary self-sacrifice and niggas are just swinging at the speed of light, and sometimes the shield works and sometimes it doesn't. May as well have just not had them at all, kinda like the Spacing Guild.
Now I hear that lasers + shield = nuclear reaction, but there doesn't seem to be any reservations in the two instances lasers are used. They just use 'em because it's convenient, without any knowledge of if who they're shooting at has shields, which they likely do because fucking everybody has them, so what gives?
Kinda seems like these movies are just wanna-be Shakespeare with a bunch of pseudo-sci-fi schlock to pad out the runtime.

>>213674416
surely those arent meant to be nukes
that would make no sense

anyone see this version yet?

https://fanedit.org/dune-the-hybrid-cut/

>>213674416
issa mubi of glamor shots of walking

>>213673870 (OP)
>it's actually quite shallow. still like it, just isn't as good as I thought
A good example of this is sietch Tabr. It's a dusty, sterile empty cavern excluding one see where it is used as a gathering place for many different fremen, but not an actually lived in authentic community of fremen unwinding and living with their families and friends when they aren't be brutal survivalists/warriors in the desert - unlike in the book. And THEN after mostly seeing the sietch as this empty sterile cavern, the movie expects me to feel saaad when Feyd bombs it to hell. Why the fuck should I care? Why should I feel any sense of an actual community being destroyed? So stupid. I also hated stuff like the Emperor's throne room ALSO being an empty stark cavern rather than opulent as all fuck, which would have lended to what Walken/the filmmakers said about the Emperor as an individual being meh is fine as long as everything surrounding him is impressive.

>>213674463
not heard of it but maybe I'll watch it.
I really liked the maple cut of the hobbit. New to fan edits but they seem promising

>>213673895
Present the main characters through BG's, as if the women are malicious therapists manipulating their clients.

walken is miscast as hell
I don't like the o________o alien as his grown up sister either

Stargate > Dune

>>213674570
I'm hesitant to watch this because of Roland Emmerich

>>213674543
>Zendaya is ugly as fuck and sounds like an American teenage when every other fremen has an exotic accent. Shits up the movies A LOT
>Pugh is ugly - enough said considering she is playing Irulan
>I hate Anya as an individual and actress, so enough said again
I think only Jessica is not totally derailed by the actress they chose lol

>>213674258
The last 100 pages of the book feel incredibly rushed.

I turned off Dune (2021) after 25 or 30 minutes. It's a shameless remake of Lynch's 1984 movie, only slower and with a lot more depressing visuals. I honestly don't understand "the appeal". Maybe faggots are just gay for Timothée Chalamet. (Btw. the ending -ée is always female in French.)

>>213674603
I thought pugh was cute in this even though she generally looks podgy

>>213674448
I had the exact same reaction as you. After I had seen movies I went digging around youtube consuming lore videos and this shit dropped in my recomendations.
https://youtu.be/M9T1RmjfL00?si=BLK3PdDd7-156uaP
Nigga what do you mean those are supposed to be nuclear detonations?

>>213674443
Fremen don't use shields as it attracts all worms on the vicinity

>>213674603
Gurney is good too. Josh Brolin does it ok. Still third best but not bad.

>>213674646
oh dear

>>213674258
>idk what they cut

It's not even a matter of cutting. The plot is wholly unrecognizable. It's not Dune at all. It's just an entirely different story altogether told with characters named after characters from Dube.

>>213674595
I would be too. I watched it when I was young enough to not even know or care who the fuck was directing, so maybe it's nostalgia that keeps me going back? All I know is I fucking hate Independence Day.

>>213674258
Part 1 felt like those Berserk Golden Age movies in that they were being faithful to the book and adapting the general plot points of the story but that was it, barely felt any connection to the plot or characters and was just in it for the spectacle.

Part 2 changes stuff around, especially in regards to Chani's characterization and how Paul's ascension is framed but I think they made the movie more engaging and I was actually invested in the plot beyond just the visuals. Like I actually saw Timothee as Paul and Zendeya as Chani instead of just Timothee and Zendeya dressed in sci-fi outfits.

>>213673938
the film does a pretty good job of explaining everything, what do you mean big things arent connected?
all the events of dune 1 minus Paul escaping are orchestrated by the emperor conspiring with the harkonnens.

>>213673962
herberts somewhat clever excuse to have combat go back to swords and daggers: the invention of holtzman shields. using any projectile weapons against them would cause a nuclear explosion, ensuring mutual destruction

>literally one of the only fremen with lines in the film
>introduced as a side character, interacts a lot with the main chars

>dies for no reason just to get 8 harkonnens, what was the fucking point

>>213674416
Oh and the whole duology I am wondering how paul is going to take his revenge by defeating the harkonnens and the emperor. Dude is basically living with the afghan mujahideen going against galaxy wide superpowers. And just conveniently both the emperor and the harkonnen just decide to land their asses on the surface of the planet so paul can conveniently defeat them both in a single fucking battle. Imagine if the entire US and China leadership just went down personally into afghanistan and allowed the goatherders to defeat two superpowers in a single afternoon.

Image this cinematography but for 12 part show of 1h+ episodes

>>213674826
that doesnt mean set pieces happening one after another make a compelling narrative
>ok i am in the north ... im not madhi though
>actually you know what im going south
>chani I love you btw
>hell yeah i am The Man now
>yeah lets take over the galaxy and watch nuclear explosions from 2km away

>>213674603
I find Pugh and Zendaya to be hot.

>>213674647
The two times lasers are used (that I recall, anyway) are in Part One, while Duncan is fighting the Stormtroopers they use a laser to open the door. Yeah, you could argue they were there looking for Fremen, but they found Idaho, and he has a shield, which means behind that door could be and to some degree are a bunch of people with shields. So maybe don't use the laser? Ah fuck it.
Second time is in Part Two, Josh Brolin and the Fremen use one against the AT-AT, which I thought was kind of odd. I mean, the spice tractors attract worms anyway, right? So why don't those things, as well as the foot soldiers who are inexplicably walking beside it have shields? I mean who gives a shit?
Ah fuck it. It's just a movie, right? Who needs to take five minutes to iron out the logic of the plot device that make the action as goddamn boring as it is.
Don't even get me started on that retarded ass scene where Paul and Zendaya shoot the mosquito helicopter with an RPG.

How did this fat fuck survive the gas?

>>213674944
built different

>>213674871
hbo will buy it for that in 2030 if the world hasnt ended yet

>>213674954
Maybe he only got a little whiff of it

>>213673870 (OP)
You sound like a very stupid person. Stick to capeshit

>>213674912
I read somewhere baron practiced hormesis out of paranoia, not that that is mentioned, sounds like an ass pull but anyway

>>213675047
>capeshit
yeah that's what this film amounts to
thanks for stopping by

Everytime I see /teevee/ discussing the DUNC movies I'm reminded how you're all a bunch of midwits with surface level analysis crying about the most obsolete shit ever. Eat your popcorn, do your basedfaces and shut the fuck up

>>213674892
you kinda skipped all the scenes connecting those bits together eh?

Ironically the visuals are what I like least about this movie. Everything looks like it was taken from an architectural digest, nothing looks lived-in, nothing looks like it came about out of human necessity. Everything looks designed, and the design language is more important to Villenueve than believability.

>>213673870 (OP)
Zendaya doesnt help either.
In the first book you kinda want paul to win even if he is a piece of crap fanatic.
In this movies she is always there to undermine everything that paul says and does.

@213675579

>>213675579
Does it frustrate you that you aren't actually very smart or is it something you haven't realized yet?

>>213673870 (OP)
So....are you say the Vilinueve Dune movies are to the Dune books what the LOTR movies are to the LOTR Tolkien books?

visual eye candy that dazzles mouth-breathers but are full of empty calories compared to the books?

>>213675807
>the /teeveenian/ felt identified and needed to reply with lowkey hatred out of his virgin screen watcher insecurities

>>213673870 (OP)
Yeah I guess if you were blind and deaf, a lot of movies would lack depth. wtf is your point?

>>213675938
>posts cartoons
lol

>>213675907
I have seen the movies but I have read none of the books. The LOTR movies felt so much more captivating than the dune movies. I was absorbed into the world in LOTR. With dune I was either disinterested or scratching my head at the world building. How does that giant pool of water not evaporate instantly? Where do the fremen get their food and tech? They have no factories that we can see. All we see them do is squat in caves. Can I see the space navigation in action? And why do these scci-fi people not have computers. Oh I see they went to a war against AI robots long ago and humanity went full luddite. Would have been real cool if the movie communicated that instead of making me google this setting defining piece of lore.

>>213675977
That's all you had bait-eating low IQ fren ?
right on the midwit

>>213676367
the Game got me not less then 2 hours ago I'm immune suck shit faggot

damn that anon got rage baited pretty hard

>>213676355
so maybe read the books all these questions and more are answered

>>213673870 (OP)
This review brought to you from watching clips on youtube.
Maybe actually watch the movie.

>>213675615
a 5 second inner monologue of exposition does not make a narrative arc

>>213676537
that's not a fucking solution to a movie being garbled, shitlord

>>213676537
Yeah but the point is that the film should deliver me a viewing expirience where I dont end up asking such vital questions. Most films succeed in this, Dune's do not. Of course in all fantasy/sci-fi film things need to be left out from the books, but the film needs to stand on it's own without pushing the viewer to read about the lore online to find out basic information.

>write to the emperor
>ok he is here now hello
>write to the great houses
>ok they are here now hehe
they've got better fast travel than late-game GoT

>>213676679
In the miniseries they had the baron explaining his plans in a lot of scenes.
you dont need an autistic voiceover to tell complex plots.
It also helped a lot to see the harks as evil master minds.

>>213676675
>>213676679
I can't really speak to that I've read the books so many times I can't say if it does or doesn't explain enough in the films to make for a coherent story. I can say that it all made sense for me, and I work with youngsters high-school kids and 20 year olds etc. and they seemed to understand at least the general idea of what was going on and why and how things were happening.

>>213676773
Never seen the miniseries, but after the movies I feel like I would have preferred to experience the story as a series rather than two tightly packed movies. That was like what, 5-5.5 hours of combined footage and we spent almost 2 hours developing a really flaccid love story between two characters that are both bland in their characterisation.

>>213676645
>ok i am in the north ... im not madhi though
>actually you know what im going south
>chani I love you btw
>hell yeah i am The Man now
this is perfect example of what I mean, the movie did the entire water of life thing all of it, how do you not get what is happening? Jessica explains everyone explains you see it it takes up a huge part of the second movie before the big finale. How do you not get it? Again I know what is happening but I manage a restaurant and their are a ton of kids and young people and everyone seemed to get it.

I watched part 1 on IMAX when it came out, and I have never been so bored by a movie in my whole life.
never bothered to pirate part 2

>>213676808
Hey dont get me wrong I liked the films overall and it's not like I couldn't follow the narrative. It just felt like for what has been hyped as the greatest sci-fi epic that defined the entire genre, that has been claimed to stand neck and neck among titans like the LOTR franchise, it felt strangely lukewarm and unfulfilling.

>>213676994
ok thanks for sharing

>>213677011
sure as you said you haven't read the books all I can go on is my own experience and what the kiddos said theirs was, they seemed to get it more or less and for myself I thought it did justice to the story although it left out a lot of bits and pieces over all it definitely told the story. Chani was horribly miscast but thats neither here nor their

Am I wrong for thinking Part Three is going to be the biggest piece of dogshit? The only way it works is for the first act to randomly introduce the Spacing Guild and Alia into the pre-existing narrative. It's going to be exposition whiplash.
Not to mention Messiah is already pretty boring as fuck.

>>213676355
>And why do these scci-fi people not have computers. Oh I see they went to a war against AI robots long ago and humanity went full luddite. Would have been real cool if the movie communicated that instead of making me google this setting defining piece of lore.
They explain this like 20 minutes into the first movie.

>>213677105
What is your opinion on the scene where they fire the nukes to blow up the rock formations and paul just casually looks at the blast no problemo? I feel like it is a great example of the way the film is bad at communicating information to the viewers. Again in most films or media I could maybe stomach this, the thermal flash of a nuke is basically never depicted realistically, but in a sci-fi film, a sci-fi film that is supposed the be the crowning jewel of the genre, I just cant let it slide.

>>213673870 (OP)
>There doesn't seem to be a in universe narrative of what connects them
Wrong. But there is a lot missing and time skips between the scenes. It's a missed masterpiece.

>>213677201
Nope Messiah is awesome and seriously maligned by zoomy idiots, its Paul and the Fremen at the height of power. Alia is beginning her schizo shit. Chani and Irulan doing their rivalry thing. The last of the Corrinos and the Sardukar. The Guild and the thelaxiu making their presence known, its good stuff. No idea if the movie will do it justice but Messiah is Peak Paul God Emperor shit.

>>213677313
What part? Asking genuinely here. Name the minute and the scene. I have the 4K torrent opened on my VLC right now and I promise to apologize for being a retard if I actually missed that.

>>213676994
Part I and II is the first book and Dune has quite the dense worldbuilding which is why the first movie is mostly slow with a lot of exposition. Part II goes all in from there. You should watch it, even the two movies back to back if you have the time.

People who didn't read the book don't khow how of a feat it is to condense such a story in a time constrained movie format. Most hardcore Dune fans love them. Some subplots had to be omit or some were (tastefully) change but all the most important narrative and ideological aspects of the book made it into the movies. Beside the movies are suppose to make the watchers interested in reading the books too.

>>213677378
Link me a working stream site and I can give timestamps. otherwise it's early on and it's the twink talking.

>>213677325
Funnily enough I just watched that and its fine. Atredies atomics used to bring down the shield wall is exactly what happened in the novel. The scene just before is Paul telling them all what is going to happen I believe the line was
>Gurney will make the path for you
And then you see the atredies atomics used and Stilgar and the main horde come in on worms, so yea just fine with it it is very very close to how I always imagined it happening

>>213677376
Messiah is the Fremen at their peak, and Paul at his lowest. That's the entire plot and his realization of the last 12 years of his rule; that he isn't in control, and really never was.
Hopefully the movie actually portrays the Fremen as the fucking lunatics they are, but I doubt it.

>>213677378
When The Butlerian Jihad is mentioned

>>213677325
they are nukes yes but nukes from 10'000 years in the future

I am tired of Denis' dishonest filmmaking.

>>213677313
there was no fucking war the bultaran jihad was smashing thinking machines the only "war" was people trying to protect said machines Brian is a stupid faggot and I hate this has to be constantly clarified. THERE WAS NO WAS AGAINST THINKING MACHINES

>>213677516
FUCK OFF IDIOT

>>213677454
Hydraflix.vip is a pretty good stream site
>>213677477
Yeah I understand that they used the previously shown nuclear missiles to clear a path for the worm rider attack. But my problem is the fact the nukes dont have thermal flashes. The explosion does not look like a nuclear detonation. What is happening with the narration (explosion is nukes) and what the movie shows (explosion is NOT nukes) are at odds with each other.

>>213677516
>/teeveenian/ midwit growl into the void

>>213677577
they are nukes 10'000 years more advanced then we have simple as

>>213677577
>Hydraflix.vip
They got hit. A lot of streaming sites did.

>>213677543
Incorrect.
https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Butlerian_Jihad

>>213677505
>>213677605
Man that is just not a satisfying answer

>>213677577
one the nukes are not our nukes they are super advanced space nukes, two yes the explosion in OPs image is the nukes destroying the shield wall, which is a big mountain/cliff not sci-fi shields. Three using nukes against other people is a violation of the treaty but Paul kinda circumvented that he didn't attack the Emperors encampment, he shot his nukes at a big cliff, no harm no foul.

>>213677633
Works great from where I live. Sorry for phoneposting.

>>213677633
no I am correct Brian is a fucking idiot nd Frank disowned the wrong son. The Bultarian Jihad was because an early bene gessirt woman was going to give birth. She went to a hospital and the AI decided to terminate the pregancy because it was unlikly to survive. As she was Bene Gesserit of course she would've insured its survival. Her name was Serena Bulter and so the Bultaran Jihad where humanity smashed all the "thinking machines". Brian Herbet is a fucking moron that wiki is fucking stupid and you have no idea what you are talking about, shut the fuck up.

>bro that futuristic nuke doesn't look like a nuke !!
fucking quality discussion of Dune here

>>213677671
ok as I said read a book, at the very least you should understand just from the movies that tech more then 10'000 years in the future is not like ours.

>>213677688
It is a nuclear detonation. By definition the release radiation. I feel like at this point we are just doing mental gymnastics to justify a dishonest piece of work by the filmakers. Is there a specific part in the books where they outright state that the nukes of the setting have special properties where the dont release massive burst of thermal radiation and are comletely fine to look at?

>>213677846
no it doesn't work like that 10'000 years from now, sorry no mental gymnastics on my part. Just wait till you see the stone burner in Messiah its going to make you so confused.

>>213677802
Ok can you tell me why the gigantic pool of water does not just evaporate away at a planet that is hot like a dry sauna? Is the H2O of the water so futuristic we dont have to worry about such a thing?

>>213677955
they are kept deep underground

>>213674448
they literally said at one point something along the lines of "we found the family's atomics"

>>213677794
>brian
Nigger idk what you're on about. The butlerain jihad is Frank Herbert canon. It's mentioned in Dune, Messiah, COTD, and God Emperor.
If you're just trying to say it wasn't skynet, congratulations nobody is saying that.
If you're trying to say there wasn't a hundred year war across the entire universe (lol scale), you're retarded.

>>213676490
Jeez just take the L you fucking cry baby

>>213677955
Because the water is underground away fron the Sun and is getting filled constantly by the Fremen you fucking retard missing the forest fron the tree with your dumb nitpick.

>>213677900
Aight I'll bite. Tell me about the stone burner. Also I thought the movies are some 20 000 years in the future, and in the setting they count their time since the creation of the spacing guild or some shit.

>>213677967
atomics in dune are not the same as we understand them, they are atomic bombs but far more precise, for instance they have ones that can slowly release an atomic explosion very very slowly burning into the core of a planet. kinda like our depleted uranium bullets on a much much larger scale

>>213677971
you are retarded you stupid nigger, look its very simple the bultarian jihad was not a "war against machines" no more then if you went around smashing computers is one. Brian re-imagined it as a war against AI. and you are completely retarded. don't ever talk about the bultarian jihad again you have no idea what you are talking about.

>>213678021
heres a sneak peek >>213678030 oh and guess what looking at it directly while it burns does burn out your eye balls

>>213677543
>there was no fucking war
Except the 100 year long war across the entire universe that is mentioned in every single Frank Herbert book.
>>213678089
>It wasn't a "war against the machines"
Nobody is saying it was skynet retard. It was people v people. People who thought machinery thinking is good and people who thought machinery thinking is bad. You're fucking retarded swinging at ghosts.

>>213678159
no there wasn't and it isn't mentioned in any of franks novels, you are a victim of Brians ret-con you fucking idiot

>>213678159
to clarify if you actually had read dune not brains nonsense then my explination is what happened exactly what happened its right here >>213677794
however looking at the current state of shit it would seem this is trying to be scrubbed, however it is all in the dune encyclopedia published long before frank died explaining exactly what happened along with illustrations. In short you are reading his sons fan-fic which is dumb as all fuck.

>>213678119
Well in that case it would have been nice if the movie had like a 15 second scene where they establish that these specific nukes work like that instead of just saying "atomic warheads" and priming the movie viewer to assume they work like regular nukes. Even just alter the line to have the dude say something like "radiation suppressed atomic warheads" and I as viewer would have been on board with the lore. Like sure you as a book reader are on board with the lore and thus have no quarrell with this stuff, but I consider it needlessly vague and misleading to not give that simple specification to the film watcher.

>>213678196
>it isn't mentioned in any frank novels
Right. Except that it's in every single Frank Herbet book in the Dune series. You're retarded.

>>213678268
>brian
Frank.

>>213678306
here I found a simple explination of the actual jihad, it looks like someone out their is trying to preseve the actual story
https://dune.fandom.com/wiki/Butlerian_Jihad/DE
this isn't exactly what is in the encyclopedia but its pretty close, stop with this nonsense, yes billions died no it wasn't a "war against AI" well it was but not the way you are thinking of it.

>>213678294
I'm not talking about your gay nuke debate here but anything action related in the Dune universe is meant to be use as narrative points to continue to support the grander ideological story and not be the focus points of it. I don't think the normie are ready to understand what's gonna happen in Messiah. Its gonna be a lite Thanos 2.0 but with no recovery

>>213678306
no Brian, you dipshit the jihad itself is mentioned but it wasn't a "war against cymeks with an AI overlord" nonsense that Brian wrote it was people against people, some defending using thinking machines and some wanting to destory them

>>213678359
>yes billions died
Right. In a war. Which you said didn't happen >>213677543
>there was no fucking war

>>213678359
>no it wasn't a "war against AI"
Nobody said this. I have repeatedly told you everyone knows it's not skynet. Do you not know the skynet reference and that's why you keep talking? Fucking pajeets man.

>>213678294
or you could just assume that 10'000 years in the future things work a bit different

>>213678425
fucking idiot I am done talking to you you are a Brian sycopant, you can't comprehend that he rewrote the story to make shlock. Keep beliveing what ever you'd like, back here in reality Franks idea f what the bultarian Jihad was is quite different and there is an entire book to corroborate it. No matter how much they try and scrub it from the internet the encyclopedia of dune will always exist and the real version of the bultarian jihad will as well.

>>213678425
idiot
please read >>213678411

>>213678394
If Joker 2 scores 100/100 on causing butthurt to the normies who idolized the protagonist of the first movie, where do you think dune part 3 will rank? Again I have not read the books, just seen some lore summary videos on youtube, but I feel the part 2 made a somewhat focal point that hey maybe allowing a charismatic leader to drive people into a religious war is perhaps bad, so surely it cant be that severe of a whiplash.

God I can't wait for skynet to take over and kill all indians.

>>213678443
I feel like for most people "a nuclear warhead" is a pretty solid basic concept. Like just release a bunch of energy with a nuclear fission/fusion reaction. The setting also has people still conduct combat with knives. Watching the movie it felt the theme was that no matter how far you go, certain concepts and tools are eternal. A wheel is a wheel, a knife is knife, a nuke is a nuke, religion always exists in the soul of human etc. even in a setting where we have anti-gravity devices primitive tech still exists and is viable/common. So when the character utter "nuclear warhead" I am led to think about nuclear weapons as they exist today. They could have said sci-fi mumbo jumbo warheads, but they didn't.

Also is it 10 000 years from today or 10 000 years from the spacing guild creation? Because all these anons keep saying 10 000 years from now and I feel very confused.

>>213678394
well said

>>213673928
this i was really dissapointed while reading it
i thought it would be more.. grandiose

>>213678577
>thinking critic score matters
The damage Paul cause on the universe is immense and at the end of it he doesn't fulfill his destiny on top and have a whimper loner-tragic end. Anybody who root for Paul on a surface level are gonna get it, that is if DV nail the landing here since its more than just that in Messiah.

>>213673870 (OP)

Film is a composite artform, so there's no need to pretend two important features of the storytelling are irrelevant when trying to assess depth.

>>213678869
I guess that where you either have to suspend your disbelief or read a book, as I said the kiddos seemed to get the concept and idea of most of the tech and and the setting, human computers. Shield tech, the idea of prescience and seeing only bits and pieces vs seeing the whole picture. The voice even biological control that the bene have over their own bodies, and so on. But for me it is difficult to judge, I understand all these things having read the books I'm not saying your dumb or anything for not getting it. Far from it I'm very curious what concepts you did get vs what was not explained properly in the films. The only ting I don't get is misunderstanding Pauls level up to unfiltered prescience I thought the movie did a fine job of showing exactly why and how he was able to achieve that level.

>>213678394
>>213679027
https://www.nme.com/news/film/dune-part-2-will-be-more-of-an-action-movie-says-denis-villeneuve-3554181
Hey I fully believe that checks out for the books, but the film director said that atleast for the second part he would lean more into the action. So even if in the book the action is just a narrative tool, the filmaker said he would focus more on the action. So when you are discussing the film I believe it is fully reasonable to scrutinize the action scenes.

>>213679145
if you don't think a galaxy wide upheaval and outward expansion resulting in all manner of abnormalities and stage tech is grandiose then idk what to tell you.

>>213679269
messiah has a ton of action scenes so its not surprising.

I agree OP. Both of the movies felt off, like a shit edit job with little to no buildup before a major scene happens.

>>213679269
Guess what, he wants to focus on the action because normies are also retarded for it $$$$ and may I remind you that you're the one asking why the explosion doesn't *Boum* the way you want.

Here's a bad continuity cut in the feyd arena scene at 4:00 to 4:02.
https://youtu.be/HRlRXyGk72I?si=MnTpnwl-njI6RCR3
Now that's surface level !

>>213679220
Well a big thing that I didn't get was how do the fremen sustain themselves technologically to the point they can endure fighting a war against the harkonnens. Watching the film the fremen came across as afghan type hide in the desert type warriors. And yes I know the books came out in the 60's before the soviet-afghan and the USA-afghan conflict. But in any guerrilla warfare type situation the guerrillas need someone to back them up, to provide resources, weapons, vital technology etc. The fremen have incredibly advanced suits, amazing thumpers to summon the worms, laser weapons etc. so am I just supposed to believe they have a fully self sustained industrial sector capable of mining raw material needed for the tech, production facilities, countless scientist and technicians to support all the science required. Because all the movies show me about the fremen is that they are a bunch of mujahideen fuckers that have no business maintaining such an operation and not having it be bombarded from orbit. They travel by riding those sand worms, which kinda leads me to believe that it is their only and primary source of logistical transportation. You would think the technologically and financially infinitely better off harkonnens would just shoot rockets from low orbit at those sand worm riders. Overall I just have a hard time buying into the whole idea that the fremen can just sustain a successful war effort against what is explicitly described as an obscenely wealthy adversary. And even moving forward with their galactic jihad, how are the fremen supposed to go up against all the other houses in space warfare and warfare on other planets? Like sure on arrakis they are masters of the environment and that helps them in local guarrilla warfare, but in space battle they are a fish out of water.

>>213679932
I guess they didn't really show the sietches properly, they have a whole civilization, millions of them, they trade spice with the spacing guild and smugglers. Very little of that was shown in the movies so fair enough. I guess think of it like the taliban selling heroin for weapons and tech but on a much higher level.

>>213673870 (OP)
>No Count Fenring, Thufir Hawat or "Look in that place you dare not look" speech
It's TRASH!!

>>213679932
as far as orbital weapons thats the province of the spacing guild, and the fremen bribe them with pure spice. Also the great storms hide a lot of activity making Dune difficult to track anyway, but space tech? thats the spacing guild and no-one fucks with the spacing guild ever. You pay them. until Paul comes along and threats to destroy all spice they kinda fucked that up in the conclusion of the movie as well what he actually does is place "bombs" made of the water of life in various points around the planet over "spice blows" these are natal yeailds that will create spice soon. If he blows them all up at once it will kill the worms and hence the spice. And The Spice is all without the Spice there is no guild. That is the real trap that Paul and his Son are stuck with. Finding a way for humanity to survive without spice.

>>213680050
And others are crying that Harkonnen didn't had enough screentime too. DUNC needed more screentime that's pretty much all agreed and its not a bad thing in this case. Now read the books.

>>213680217
I have read the books countless times what do you mean? this is me >>213680215
the real dire problem is the problem of the spice something that isn't properly addressed, it is central but you have to make it more apparent. Without the Spice their is no human civilization.

People shit on Lynch for speedrunning the war with Harconnens but the book does that shit as well. Dune 1984 ending is more complete and thematically rich than Herbert's blatant sequel hooks.

>>213680263
Well its a hard task since the first Dune book is entirely/mostly on Arrakis. In the first movie Leto ask his mentat how much did it cost for the Emperor's messenger to get on their planet. I'm sure we will some of that in the third movie since Paul will be controlling the spice flow.

>>213679220
Oh here is another big thing that kinda eluded me. It is nothing too major but just a bit of lore that bugged me. Maybe they explain it in the later fim(s).

If spice is ABSOLUTELY necessery for space travel, how did humanity colonize the galaxy in the first place and discover arrakis? My only guess is they did it with computers, found arrakis and then later went full luddite, leaving them dependent on the spice.

>>213680476
you have gurney and the fremen selling spice to the spacing guild, they left all of that out
>>213680497
yes it was computers before they found the spice

>>213680623
Its interesting but not relevant enough to the main story so it was cut. That's it. Literally the first few minutes of the first movie explicitly state the importance of spice for the universe. People are goldfish

>>213680769
>people are goldfish
true

>>213673870 (OP)
i read the book so am able to just fill in the plot for the most part

>>213674256
>but then just kind of forget about it later during the fight scenes.
It's said in the book that expert fights like Duncan Idaho are such phenomenal talents that they can slow down their blades so adeptly that it looks like it's going full speed. You can actually catch this a little bit in the Duncan's fights

>>213677955
>>213678003
>>213677965
Honestly, I always thought they were based on something like these: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qanat
>read the book in highschool

>>213680954
I just watched the finale for the 2nd part and it shows gurney and the fremen doing this during the final fight in the court yard

>>213680421
he makes it rain on arrakis, its fucking stupid

There's an ice cap on Arrakis. True story.

>>213680132
>Thufir Hawat
80's version of his death couldn't be topped anyway. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCbR0wZWJxQ I only wish he stabbed himself with the poisoned blade instead of pulling that stupid fucking heart valve

>>213674944
>fat fuck

You answered your own question

>>213681351
I know it's a deleted scene but they should've included "I just wanted to stand beside my duke one last time".

>>213681022
That's really cool. Thanks for linking

>>213674842
She doesn't exist in the books, but in these films they make a point of her practically being Chani's best friend. You'd think Chani would at least give a fuck, but Denis didn't seem to.

>>213674902
Rare footage of Zendaya actually looking female.

>>213674842
>>213682574
Should've been Harah.

Yeah it's a villeneuve film

>>213674944
>enormous body mass
>anti-gravity tech
>poision may possibly be denser than air (pretty likely)
>still got a dose, meaning he needed to be strapped to weird medical machinery and/or his Grease Bathtub just to live
He kind of didn't, really.

>>213674754
>The plot is wholly unrecognizable. It's not Dune at all. It's just an entirely different story altogether told with characters named after characters from Dube
Surely you're exaggerating.

>>213675907
The Dune movies (all of them) get the point of Herbert's books about as well as... well not at all, really. Anyone who's read Herbert's books know they're about Frank's hardon for man's effects on his environment, as well as how man relates to his environment while existing within it, both as an individual and a collective.

All of these movies pay lip service to that at best, and fuck all at worst.

>>213677201
Messiah fucking rules. I'm partial to its sequel, and God Emperor is the best out of all of them, but Messiah rules because there's actual, legitimate empirical shit happening while Paul's at risk of losing literally everything.

It's great. I doubt Denis will be able to pull it off (Chani is important, and Zendaya ain't it,) but it'll be interesting to see, anyways.

>>213682624
Fucking agreed. Jamis got a lot of screentime, but not having his wife and kids around was both funny and sad.

THE TOOTH! REMEMBER THE TOOTH!!

>>213674258
Because Dune 2 is just a capeshitified version of the first movie

>>213673870 (OP)
Dune 2 is much better than Dune 1

>>213680215
Ok so again I have not read the books but why is exactly spice locked down on arrakis? I understand from the brief internet lore I have seen that it is the sandworms that produce the spice. Surely it would not be too hard to find or terraform another planet to match arrakis and have the worms live there as well. Like the fims make it explicit how spice is the greatest most important mcguffin in the universe so I would assume it would be in everyones best interest to make sure a single planet cant possibly sustain a monopoly on the substance. Like imagine if the poop of panda bears was the most valuable thing ever and nobody else thought to cultivate bamboo so they could also have panda bears?

>>213683652
The spice being locked down basically creates an artificial stalemate between the houses, so that the sides can pretend to have their powerplays and what not in the background. The meta story is that groups have been planning to usurp the resource for themselves to break the stalemate. If everyone had access to spice worms, it'd be all out galactic war for centuries/millennia, instead of the make-believe war that has been happening for many years.

>>213683652
>Surely it would not be too hard to find or terraform another planet to match arrakis and have the worms live there as well.
Many baby worms/fish have been smuggled off Arrakis but they never live in their new habitats. I don't remember if it's explained why or if it's just hand waved.

>>213683969
>If everyone had access to spice worms, it'd be all out galactic war for centuries/millennia, instead of the make-believe war that has been happening for many years.

Operating under the belief that all conflict is ultimately based on control of resources, if the spice is the only resource that is limited, surely in the long term liberating the spice would result in post scarcity harmony like in star trek. Even if that process takes milleniums. Hell aren't those witch ladies supposed to be the type of guys to play the millenium long game? At least it would be a better solution than just keeping mankind on edge forever over this single resource. Or perhaps I am being too naive in my assertion that even if resource scarcity was solved humans would not wage large scale warfare.
>>213684103
It certainly was not adressed in the movies.

>>213684363
It's never brought up until messiah which hasn't happened yet. It probably wont be brought up because it's not really relevant to the story being told in the movie.
You seem kind of retarded anon.
Did this scene stress you out aswell?

>>213684363
>Operating under the belief that all conflict is ultimately based on control of resources, if the spice is the only resource that is limited, surely in the long term liberating the spice would result in post scarcity harmony like in star trek. Even if that process takes milleniums. Hell aren't those witch ladies supposed to be the type of guys to play the millenium long game? At least it would be a better solution than just keeping mankind on edge forever over this single resource. Or perhaps I am being too naive in my assertion that even if resource scarcity was solved humans would not wage large scale warfare.
The make-believe war would become the real war once everyone has control over their own resources. The Beni Gesserits are playing the long game, and manipulating everyone so that they can maintain unilateral control over the universe by birthing a being somewhat similar to a god. They require everything to be maintained around the spice funnel on Arrakis. This requires careful planning around blood-lines between civilisations, and if one was to die out in a war, it would destroy their attempts at creating god. While liberating the spice could lead to peace, peace may also foil their plans.

Idk, personally, I think the story is feminism = bad.

>>213684439
Hey I just want to talk about the movies on a movie forum as a guy who never read the books and who found the films to be kinda underwhelming. No need to mean :(

As for the pulp fiction reference, I think it was a cool choice to keep the content of the briefcase mysterious. It served the genre of the movie. With the dune films the genre of the movie that is being advertised is a sci-fi goliath and a war epic with incredible lore. So when i plop my girthy ass on the seat I expect gripping science fiction, cool expansive worldbuilding that swoops me in, long grand strategic bouts of warfare etc. And the movies just kinda failed to deliver that. I am sure the books deliver that, why else would they be praised to all hell. But the movie did not which is why I am discussing my experience with the films with you fine gentlemen.

>>213683652
>. Surely it would not be too hard to find or terraform another planet to match arrakis and have the worms live there as well.
in the 2nd book paul is rulling spice control the guild secretly starts smuggling worms off world with the help of rogue fremen.

>>213682832
denis said messiah is his favorite dune book and he is making these movies so he can make messiah. i have faith

>>213684622
>Idk, personally, I think the story is feminism = bad.

Yeah now that I think about it, it was kinda stupid to partially construct my post around the bene pasta ladies. Even from what I saw in the films they were overwhelmingly the shadiest and most malicious feeling group. An exclusive (ethnic?) religious cult with superpowers that have integreted themselves with all of the elites, planning their own secret schemes that they insist is totally the best for the universe.
>>213684751
Makes sense

>>213684665
>gets pulled into a story
>wants to know more
>wants to discuss it
>didn't like it btw
tiresome.
You want every singular detail explained but didn't even pay attention to the details you were presented with the first time.
I think you may have gotten too overwhelmed with the visuals and didn't pay attention to what actually happened and what was said.

>>213673870 (OP)
The movies are shit but they are being made for goyslop cattle not people who read the books so it doesn't really matter anyway

>>213673870 (OP)
>set pieces just happen - big thing happens, then another big thing. There doesn't seem to be a in universe narrative of what connects them
This is why I didn't even bother to watch Dunc. It was an obvious spectacle with nothing holding it up beyond the visuals ( a lot of the movie looked like ass anyway) and the bwooooms and the name Dune.

>>213684903
More so I did not get pulled into the story, wondered why, saw this thread and wanted to discuss it. No need to be hostile my man.

>>213684942
meh. the movies are really good, the books are great. only thing id change in dunc is add fenrig and choam. Fenring is fucking cool especially at the end. and choam is just funny paul taking over the entire corporation lmao

>>213684994
You're genuinely fucking retarded though.
>>213679932
>how can fremen compete with the occupiers!?
cause they outnumber them massively. explicitly stated in the movie. You forgot to watch it though.
>how can they have monies!?
cause they smuggle spice, the most important & expensive thing in the universe. explicitly stated in the movie. You forgot to watch it though.
>why they no bomb them from orbit!?
explicitly stated in the movie you didn't watch.

>>213685110
Rude

>>213684884
>Yeah now that I think about it, it was kinda stupid to partially construct my post around the bene pasta ladies. Even from what I saw in the films they were overwhelmingly the shadiest and most malicious feeling group. An exclusive (ethnic?) religious cult with superpowers that have integreted themselves with all of the elites, planning their own secret schemes that they insist is totally the best for the universe.
One of the Frank's main ideas was that leaders shouldn't be blindly followed, and the Gesserits embody this by being the orchestrators of the leaders. Everything in this universe is shaped by the hands of the witches, but, much like in reality, people only see the leadership and get caught up in petty power-battles that end up furthering the cause of the witches in the end. If you're a /pol/ user, you'd say they were much like jews.

>>213681296
Its true
>>213685315
prude

>>213673870 (OP)
its game of thrones in space. you cant really cover it in a single movie, or even two apparently. it is a saga that requires a series of movies or tv show

>>213683652
Spice being a difficult to gather resource is to the Emperors benefit as it distracts the Great Houses to making plays for Arrakis instead of the Golden Lion Throne. The Emperor also does rotate which house gets dominion over Arrakis every so often, which just causes more distracting conflict

>>213674306
hard agree. BR2049 was a poorly done rip off
put better this blog: https://shellzine.net/blade-runner-vs-blade-runner-2049/

>>213685586
Honestly I did kinda formulate my post to dogwhistle about the jews, but in a tasteful manner. Hell the bueno gesserit are a female only society while the jewish identity is also explicitly passed down the maternal line. Considering how much the religious themes are in play the jew card is not even too much out of the left field. Hell with the gaza conflict it is downright topical for the films to promote this aspect.

Bump

Jason momoa was too much of a capeslop casting choice

>>213688974
I have not watched a single marvel multiverse or spinoff movies. To me Christopher Walken was the biggest miscast.