Thread 718090617

>Tank: "I will protect everyone so we can win against the enemies!"
>Healer: "I will support everyone with my healing spells, I won't let anyone die!"
>DPSissy: "My true enemies are my own DPS teammates, I need to have higher numbers than them in order to satisfy my ego, I don't care about the rest of the team and whether they live or die"

>>718090617 (OP)
You know, this trinity is funny because you only need to gives everyone items like potions (or medikits) to blast into oblivion.

it do be like that

>>718090617 (OP)
If the trinity is so important, why do devs make aggro nearly impossible to lose as a tank?

>>718090617 (OP)
Trvthnvke

>>718090617 (OP)
>Healer: "I will support everyone with my healing spells, I won't let anyone die!"
Huh?

>>718090617 (OP)
tank is objectively the best

I respect the average dps more than the average healer
t. ank

>>718091208
Don't bite the hand that feeds you

>>718091283
the hand that goes "i decide who lives and who dies" with a tank can be replaced with someone who can do their job

>>718091085
Artist name?

>>718091465
ChatGPT

>Tank&Healer: We got our first few kills and now we now overgear the encounter. My job has been trivialized. No one will ever die again until the next raid tier. *falls asleep*
>DPS: Must push 1% more. I can do better than this. I'll never stop improving my gameplay.

>>718090617 (OP)
I don't have dedicated tanks or healers in my games and they're much better because of it.

>>718090617 (OP)
Support is the most masculine class
DPS players are more likely to troon out

>>718091618
[NOTE]: Most DPS players don't do this.

>>718090617 (OP)
But I want to actually be the badass hero who fights the monsters, not some sidekick who stands back and manages green bars or gets his shit kicked in like an inanimate object.

>>718091902
>attacking their ass and shooting from the sidelines
you are a sidekick too

>>718091618
this is what got me to switch from main tank to dps

>>718091902
DPS players are the side characters lol

>>718091902
>Who fights the monsters
>Sits on the monsters ass so he doesn't have to get hit by anything

lol

>>718090617 (OP)
thanks for protecting me tank-sama
all my heals are yours :3

>>718091948
No, the DPS is the badass who gets up close and personal to the enemy, skillfully dancing around its attacks and then breaks the enemies legs, jumps on its back and crushes its skull.

>"My true enemies are my own DPS teammates, I need to have higher numbers than them in order to satisfy my ego, I don't care about the rest of the team and whether they live or die"

Sucks but it's either that or retard DPS doing the bare minimum to not be accused of being carried.

>>718092110
What game?

>>718092110
>*pokes the enemies butt for 10 minutes*

I played this at launch and I felt some of the dungeons and raids were genuinely difficult. However, I picked it up recently again with the new patch and all the content seems face roll easy now. I dunno. Maybe I just got better at mmos.

>>718090860
They didn’t used to do that

DPS is literally the brain-dead role for retards to feel included and feel like they're a part of the team

>>718090804
any game that does this is shit, every mmo or whatever else that switches out healers for "everyone takes care of themselves" shit immediately devolves into people looking up guides for the best DPS class to clear content the fastest because no one can actually heal properly, which just becomes a design problem

>>718092234
Assuming you mean WoW, you didn't get better. They dumbed down raids considerably.

>>718091902
>the man standing toe to toe with the monster, matching it blow for blow as the only one worthy of the foe's attention
>inanimate object
lmao DPSissies have WILD egos

>>718090617 (OP)
In raids with multiple healers, the healers compete with each other too

>>718090617 (OP)
tanks don't protect shit

>>718091902
You are the sidekick, tank is the hero

>>718091989
Getting hit is DPS loss, we've already established that DPS is a cutthroat role where getting hit will get you kicked

>>718092405
The tanks job is literally getting his shit kicked in.
You could replace him with some random metal box and it would probably do the job better because it takes longer to break.

>>718092110
Is this what you're imagining when you're playing MMOs? If only there was a game actually like that. Not just pressing 1-2-3-4 repeat for 10 minutes while avoiding red circles

>>718092438
yeah about who can steal whose boyfriend

>>718092338
That's why skill based action combat is better than tab targeting

>>718092520
What game?

>>718092531
You need to play better games then.

>>718092496
You aren't fighting the monster. You're poking their butt for a few minutes until they keel over.
I have more respect for monster hunter players.

>>718090617 (OP)
DPS is just the extra you added to the group to grind the boss faster.

>>718090804
Nope.
>Potions are all HoT and have a CD

>>718092601
Bro if there was an MMO with actually involved combat I'd be on that shit like flies on an african. But they all boil down to
a) boring press tab press buttons
b) KMMO slop
c) something that tries a semi-unique idea and fucking dies

>>718092621
Poking its face is DPS loss

I've played as all 3 in FFXIV over the course of 10 years. I've been 99 percentile in all 3 roles. If you dont work together, you're a faggot working against the rest of your team for no benefit to anyone. Every role has selfish people and every role has egotistical niggers. That being said, I enjoy playing dps the most. Tanking isn't that fun and healing sucks when people decide they're gonna die to easily avoidable mechanics, not for higher dps but because they're retarded. Although, someone dying affects everyone and not just healers but people expect healers to do things they sometimes can't do given the situation.

>>718092476
I protect soft weak healslut boys

Dofus went beyond the Trinity. Turn-based tactical combat really solves most issues.

>>718092338
There's no need for tanks or healers. PSO2 did it right.

>>718090617 (OP)
DPS players are literally just a fast-forward button, they are the least important members of the team mechanically

>>718092767
So where does the 'Fighting' the monster come in from?
Poking its asshole with your sword isn't fighting it. DPS could be replaced by a timer other players have to last through and no one would really notice.

If I was in a real life MMO or RPG or something I'd want to be the healer to be honest because I'd rather not be fighting, you know?

>>718092775
you press 1 and you sometimes press 2 as the dedicated panic when you need to hard recover from the mistake that you made and have the mechanic overwrite what a bad player you are

>>718092832
PSO2 fights can literally be done solo so i don't really see what the point of that is

>>718092841
No? 99 percent of raids have some sort of dps check mechanic. Almost no raids require offtank switching or healing checks. DPS is the only class that has you actually doing something.

>>718092520
>the guy that outlasts the boss in a toe-to-toe fight, has the boss's sole attention, is viewed by the boss as the largest threat
vs
>the guy that the boss is literally ignoring and pretends doesn't exist
Hmmm I wonder who the protagonist is...

>>718092635
Whoever made this image has never played a dps and it shows. They also romanticize tank and healer. None are all that complex and they all have to do the same thing in a slightly different way

>>718093013
kek, dpsfags are delusional

>>718093023
It's a joke made to make fun of an old comic that was the opposite and overexaggerated DPS difficulty.

>>718090860
Because DPS were too retarded to manage their threat and it became an issue so they doubled threat of tanks to compensate.

>>718092975
pso2 content isn't "played once a week", the faster you clear the faster you get back in
solo isn't faster, hp scales with number of players but solo is always the highest multiplier of hp per player

>>718092976
So you're saying that without that entirely artificial check there's no reason for DPS?

>>718093120
I only read the text but looking at it in its entirety, I can see the joke now. Everyone wants to feel more important when they're all the same with slightly different priorities

>>718093228
Then what's the point of having different classes, anon? Everything within this context is just artificial if you trivialize things like this

For me it's
>Tank
>Damage
>Support
>Flank

>>718093221
The other players aren't NEEDED, there's no reason for them to be there, the only reason the HP multiplier is there is to convince you to play the game with others despite the fact all that does is make the HP bar go down faster, they have no real reason to make the enemies healthier in solo for any other reason than to try and convince you the game is still an MMO when it isn't, you are playing solo even when you're playing with others

>>718092925
No I don't. Why are you making up some imaginary gameplay simplified to an absurd degree to get mad about?

Damage dealer has at least 7 different kinds.
>Single-target damage dealer
>AoE damage dealer
>Melee damage dealer
>Ranged damage dealer
>Setup/Burst damage dealer
>Poison/DoT damage dealer
>Summon-based damage dealer
Healer
Buffer
Defensive buffer (Feca)
Positioner - can be done through many ways
Debuffer
Summoner - another way to do all the of the above, while interacting heavily with line-of-sight and body blocking mechanics.
Tank/Durable - classes with built-in defensive measures for themselves, making them superior targets for their party

And every class effectively encompasses 2-4 of these roles.

>>718092865
>could be
It's called enrage, for the exact opposite effect

>>718093157
In FFXIV, its the opposite. People were too stupid to play tank and maintain aggro, they just made it impossible for tanks to lose aggro unless they weren't pressing buttons. I played tank before the changes and had zero issue holding aggro but when I played healer or dps, I'd see tanks constantly losing aggro because they wouldn't press their buttons

t. Played ARR and saw how awful everyone was, not just tanks

>>718093013
The one who actually fights the boss is the protagonist, not the inanimate meat shield.

>>718093390
>boss looking at the DPS that doesn't have aggro
Come on, now. Let's not make things up.

>>718092110
>casts shadowbolt for 10 minutes straight

>>718093612
Correct, so the tank is the protagonist.

>>718090617 (OP)
DPS is meant to be an easy role for new players because in most situations it's a safe role to give to such people, it's safer to have a retarded DPS on your team compared to having a retarded tank or a retarded healer

Good Elios are so cool.
>Can heal
>Can damage
>Can heal and damage through portals - technically infinite range
>Can position things by forcing them through portals

What other MMORPG even has a class this complex and rewarding?

>>718093673
None of you are, it's an arbitrary team event

>>718093625
>there's no such thing as boss mechanics that target players lower on the threat list
why are you here when you've never even played an mmo

Tanks and healers aren't evenm needed.
All that's needed is a DPS that is strong, fast, clever and skilled and has some items on his hand like healing potions, teleport scrolls, smokebangs, fire pots and grenades to escpae or turn around the fight if things do not go as planned.

>>718093695
It must suck to be the only tard on /v/ that cares about Dofus

>>718090617 (OP)
The problem is tank and healer aren’t any fun, and you don’t have options.
>1 viable tank class, everyone else is fucked with hybrid tax
>1 viable healer class, everyone else is fucked with hybrid tax
>10 fun viable DPS classes
Why? The game doesn’t matter. They all do this.

>>718093963
>some items on his hand like healing potions, teleport scrolls, smokebangs, fire pots and grenades
Name 5 different MMOs where shit like this is actually important

>>718093594
You're correct in that case, but if your still over threating when you'vev already seen your tanks limits you're still bad. But I feel you. 9 time out of 10 I had to tank as a summoner because of bad tanks in the early dungeons.

>>718093963
you don't even play MMOs

>>718093921
>the guy that the boss occasionally decides to swat at for being a nuisance being portrayed as the big hero that the boss is looking at
Just asking that you be honest with yourself.

>>718093963
name a single MMO where you can do what you're saying

>>718094110
try not to pull a muscle moving those goalposts so far

>>718094038
They are just meant as escape options if the fight does not turn out as planned.
Usually, a DPS won't even need those but if you are surprised by an enemy 10 levels higher than you or 10 enemies ta once, they will save your life.

when i print the dps meter i'm #1 idk how much more protagonist you want

Technically, there is only two kind of interaction : Those with the enemies and those with the teammates.
So technically, to surpass the trinity, you need to give each class various number of based around interacting with the enemies and and interacting with teammates. Lets call them Fight and Teamplay respectively.
Then, you have a system where you can let the player to build their characters according to their favored playstyle.

>>718094158
Dark Souls online mode.
Mount and Blade online.
Mordhau.

>>718094236
OK so you're not talking about MMMOs, alright.You can do whatever you want in single player games and I'm sure those tactics work well.

>>718093986
it's an abstract kinda feel

>>718094320
not an MMO
not an MMO
not an MMO

>>718094158
NTA but you can clear dungeons in WoW without healers or tanks

>>718091283
Healers are indians of MMOs.
>Self important
>Very bad at what they do
>Whiny
>Inflated ego
>Can be replaced easily

>>718094576
some dungeons sure
there's nothing wrong with content that doesn't require every single role, function or mechanic at every moment

>>718094617
Wrong! Healers are the SLUTS of MMOs. If 10 fat ugly fucks would rape a healer in all his orifices at once, he would actually enjoy it and beg for more.

>imagine playing a game just to tank so the dps have fun
>imagine playing a game just to heal so the dps have fun

Cuck energy. But hey I guess some people like it like that

>>718094617
>"Healers are indians of MMOs."
>Describes DPS players
What did she mean by this?

>>718094617
...but enough about DPS players

Surely there will be an MMORPG that will release where the boss isn't a retard.
>Oh wow look at that mage charging up a huge fucking meteor to hit me
>I'm going to keep hitting this dude poking me with a toothpick

I mentioned this some threads ago but I would really like to see a WoW private server that tries to surgically remove the trinity from the game.
Tank/heal specs removed, Only hybrid/self healing and bosses redesigned so anyone can tank. I bet you it would be fun.

>>718094771
>so the DPS have fun
meanwhile you cry about group finders being 90% DPS?

>>718094830
Add friendly fire, line-of-sight requirements, and range.

>>718090617 (OP)
>DPS
This always sounds wrong. "I am dpsing as a dps right now!"
The other roles have all real names, DPS also needs a normal name imo.

Alright, hear me out.
>Fighter -> Focus on fighting the enemies
>Support -> Focus on helping their teammates
>Sappers -> Set up useful environemental tools for their teammates, like making a bridge to cross a river or digging a hole to avoid a AOE

>>718094963
Just a shot in the dark, but remove aggro?

>>718095004
Or the tank has another role of actively intercepting the boss to save the mage casting. But sadly a lot of the active mmo playerbase are gooners who don't like a challenge.

>>718095180
>ACK! MY TRIED AND TRUE COMBAT SYSTEM
MMO devs would never

>Tank: Boring
>Healer: Boring
>DPS: Fun
Smple as

>>718095334
DPS is fun for low IQ people

>>718095258
That would be crowd control, which if actually effective would be logical in drawing aggro, as opposed to spamming taunt

>>718095180
Yea, bosses would have reduced singletarget damage so they don't oneshot everyone. Just pop some defensive cooldowns whenever you're tanking the boss. There could also be some new mechanics like consumables that makes enemies switch targets.

>>718095407
DPS is the only one that takes skill

>>718092338
If your game would only reward DPS performance if the trinity were removed, that would be a design failure. You are blaming the trinity for not bandaid-ing a fundamentally badly designed game or dungeon, you need to shift perspective.

>>718095678
Threat/aggro mechanics are a joke. Thank god I don't play shit MMOs.

>>718095114
no it doesn't. DPS is snappier and shorter than "Damage Dealer"

>>718090617 (OP)
>OP: I am a fagget

>>718090617 (OP)
A pure healer class is basically the most boring thing to play as imaginable, and only works in games where you control multiple characters, rather than one.
Any game where you control one character in a team should only ever have healers than can also tank and/or attack.

>>718094617
>Can be replaced easily
You have never played an MMO without matchmaking

engagement levels
---
dungeon tank
raid dps
raid tank
dungeon dps
healer
pet class

>>718093437
that is the tank's verbatim role, the tank has add thread button and the tank has "send the aggro to me for x seconds because i do not have aggro" button
qed

There used to be two more roles. Crowd Control and buffer/debuffer.
The trinity makes for shit games.

Jesus was a healer

>>718096173
if you're going to get on that dildo the trinity is tank/healer/mez

>>718096260
jesus held threat on all the jews at the same time

>>718095696
>which is a design problem

>>718096365
dual spec holy / prot paladin then

>>718096260
>>718096365
Jesus DPSed your sins

>>718093403
>The other players aren't NEEDED
the other players are needed to make up for poor gear, there typically aren't solo clears of a new boss during the first weeks of content till you get the gear (augments) from clearing the boss
there is a time limit, you need sufficient damage or sufficient players to clear the boss, in the beginning you do not have sufficient damage without sufficient players
geared players will always clear content faster, allowing for more frequent clears
>words words words
weird cope, you don't have to make shit up to call pso2 crap, it's crap

>>718096497
technically he reckbombed them

>>718096403
A design problem the lack of a trinity has nothing to do with

>>718096079
>dungeon dps under raid tank
you clearly don't play both of these roles. raid tank is so fucking easy you can liken it to classic raiding most of the time. there are like maybe 3 mechanics you have to worry about, 1 taunt swap, 1 defensive, and 1 bomb you have to run out of the group. oh you might have to actually corral some mobs too, how fun!

>>718098328
yet it's still more engaging than dungeon deeps

>>718095936
Sometimes you just want to relax, not have to pay attention to mechanics, and just press heal buttons.

>>718098443
how? dungeon dps is constantly dodging shit on the ground and selecting proper dps targets while interrupting the casters, also dps get selected for and deal with like 80% of the mechanics in a dungeon.
i assume you run content at such a low tier that interrupts and mechanics are just for show?

>>718095936
yeah but consider the following: if we want joe to play we also need something for his stupid fat wife to play, and joe shows up on time

>>718090617 (OP)
Whew whee some shit ass tank or healer is mad lol

>>718098826
>DPS cuck gets Trvked
Sorry the tanks and healers need more gear so we can clear. You'll maybe get a piece of pity loot no one wants right after the guild leaders GF/Best Friend/Guy that's funny/Guy that pays the guild leaders sub.

>Tanks
Rarely a thing in PvP, they're an exception and based off rare mechanics.
>Healers
Often countered in PvP by mechanics
>Damage
Kings

>>718090617 (OP)
The need to out dps everyone else is good though. I played a ret paladin in wow and there was another ret in my guild who always out dps'd me. I studied that mother fucker's logs and learned everything I was doing wrong. This was a net benefit to the raid

>>718099359
>ret

>>718099216
Tanks rarely being a thing in PvP has been shit design always, fundamentally it has always just meant that healing is too strong for a player to ever give up some damage for defensive capabilities

>Tanks
Unkillable chads in PvP can take infinite damage
>Healers
Unkillable chads in PvP can heal themselves forever
>DPS
Cannon fodder. Shrimp to feed the whales to keep them interested in continuing to play.

>DPS
>Nigger
>Tank
>Masochist slut
>Healer
>Normal slut
Everyone sucks
No point in fighting

>>718098706
>interrupts
i hit e very exciting
>mechanics
cmon

>>718090617 (OP)
>dps: "i will actually kill the enemy which is what we came here to do"
yep, i'm thinking based

>>718099548
>complete non answer
you know i was genuinely curious why you had that opinion but now i see you're just another nigger.

>>718099646
sure you were, that's why you said
>i assume you run content at such a low tier that interrupts and mechanics are just for show?
it's a real mystery why i don't write an essay about the challenges of pressing 5 for blizzard in deep interlocution with your sincere interesting in the topic

>>718099825
*interest

>>718092635
Healing is ironically the role that requires the least amount of effort. I healed all of Vanilla wow and I mostly sat there twiddling my thumbs. I never bought a single consumable and never got a single world buff intentionally

>>718099825
yes because i dont see how you could just hand waive one of the most important parts of running a dungeon. interrupts and mechanics are literally the only thing stopping tanks from pulling all the mobs from boss to boss.

>>718100010
depends on the iteration of the game. every role is like that in vanilla wow.

>>718100010
>Playing classic WoW
Every class requres zero effort.
Maybe tank does the most because they actually have to solve aggro issues from retards farming 90 consumables and world buffs then wondering why they die in 2 seconds with no tanking gear popping 10 hr cd skills and intentionally ripping aggro for more rage.

>>718100064
you're condescending and say vague things like "interrupts" (again, cmon) and "mechanics" but expect detailed and fleshed out reasoning in reply. no, you get what you give.

>>718098706
what games are you playing that interrupts are exclusive to dps

>>718098680
>>718098816
I suppose the best way to implement something like that would be to have the healer class(es) have the option to spec into only healing/buffs, but it should not be optimal, since otherwise everyone who plays healer would feel pressured into the optimal build.

>>718100437
lol
i am not asking for an essay simply why you think dps is lower engagement in a dungeon. i gave examples as to why i think they are higher engagement than raid tanking. you say my examples are vague but don't care to elaborate other than saying (cmon bro). you've given me nothing.

>>718100570
the tank generally needs to use his interrupts to position the mobs well, so casters don't stick in their spots on pull. the dps generally need to interrupt the "important" casts so the party doesn't die.

>>718101005
>the tank generally needs to use his interrupts to position the mobs well
?
again what game

>>718101005
What game are you even talking about bro? It's not wow, because all tanks have interrupts and there's no such thing as an important interrupt because they're all important. It's not xiv because interrupts aren't nearly as crucial. I am mystified.

>>718090617 (OP)
To be fair, the DPS in this case is doing his job, which is to cause as much damage as possible. They just don't have to be dicks about it, just like the others.
>tanks: they often berate you if you step out of formation/get aggro
>healers: they often think the rest of the team is a bunch of morons who can't take care of themselves

>>718101442
>>718101313
you're both getting so focused on one part of this conversation when it started with me being curious how RAID tank is lower engagement than dungeon dps. Raid tank literally deals with maybe 3 mechanics (max) on any given fights. if you're trying to tell me dungeon dps is lower engagement id love to hear why.

>>718101787
what game are you playing where tanks use interrupts to position mobs and can't use them for "important" casts
actually, what game are you playing at all

>>718090860
DPSissies cant be bothered to wait 0.1 seconds before full sending everything

>>718101876
have fun talking to yourself, you have nothing to say on the main topic.

>>718101965
>can't name a single game
I accept your concession.

>>718101787
What game?

>>718090617 (OP)
>DPS: I will thin enemy numbers so the tank isn't overwhelmed
Retard. Everyone is important. The trinity is a garbage system by the way

>>718090860
Enter :

>>718099435
>Healers
>unkillable
Healing sickness makes healing less effective as a fight goes on, damage eventually overcomes it.
>Tanks
>unkillable
they deal no damage, they eventually die and lose

>>718101787
Why is it so difficult to just name a game buddy? Also the tanks job is to
>keep aggro
>don't stand in the poop
>manage defensive cooldowns
>manage offensive cooldowns
>interrupt
>position stuff
>deal damage
>encounter specific tasks

DPS
>don't stand in the poop
>manage offensive cooldowns
>interrupt
>deal damage
>encounter specific tasks


Unless you're in a shitter guild where tanks damage doesn't matter and as long as he's hitting something lazily enough that it doesn't lose interest, you'll notice that tanks are just DPS with more responsibility

>>718090860
Good MMOs don't have aggro systems. They just have enemy AI.

>>718102684
What game?

>>718102732
>ignoring all the shared responsibilities
>keep aggro
this is not a real thing. remember we are comparing raid tank to dungeon dps. Raid tank is not losing threat ever and if they are they press taunt and magically the problem is fixed.
>pretending dps don't have to manage their own defensives.
>raid tank positions the boss at the start of the fight and then maybe moves it a few times depending on the fight,
in between all of these tank actions during a raid there is so much down time where you're just jerking off.
look at the end of the day i think we just don't agree.
i mainly tank when i raid and i think its fucking BORING with very little engagement compared to dungeon dps.
i doubt there's more to discuss.

>>718103439
I see you're just ignoring the fact that tanks also have to deal damage again. It must be great being you, just ignoring any potential challenge to your point of view and bullheadedly repeat the same points until the other guy decides you're clearly retarded and disengages. You must feel you win so many arguments.

There are huntards on this very thread who never used feign death

>>718103610
yeah bro tank dps rotations are so advanced and interesting

>>718090617 (OP)
DPS is the role where you get to have fun. Tank and healer are the chore roles where your job is to enable the DPS to have fun. The trinity is a dogshit concept that needs to be abandoned.

>>718103689
yeah bro dps rotations are so advanced and interesting

>>718103828
yes, 5-10 button rotations are objectively more interesting than 3-5.

>>718103913
what game's rotations are you referring to?

>>718104006
>It must be great being you, just ignoring any potential challenge to your point of view and bullheadedly repeat the same points until the other guy decides you're clearly retarded and disengages. You must feel you win so many arguments.

>>718104102
so you don't play any specific games?

>>718104102
I typed that and I'm not the guy you're talking to. I stopped arguing with you because you're retarded. That guy obviously wanted to laugh at you more.

>>718104220
and you made a great point, against the other guy. thanks

>>718104370
I don't get it, why would someone who doesn't play MMOs be talking about them??

>>718104797
so... does this mean you play any MMOs or?

>>718102638
WoW really does take interesting and meaningful mechanics and down them down for the most baseless retards(WoW players).
I can't believe they made a stupider version of SATA

>>718102770
name 1

>>718105320
Dofus

>>718104990
Based XI CHAD

>>718090617 (OP)
Is there a single MMO that's actually about finite resource management and isn't just cooldown slop.

>>718105915
cooldowns are a resource you manage

>>718105915
Resource management is a pretty core part of ESO's gameplay

>>718105915
Dofus
Every turn you have a limited amount of actions based on your AP and MP points, ie a finite resource. Skills have cooldowns as well, but that's just another layer, not just cooldown spam.

>>718105949
Stamina/mana regen is just another form of gainer/spender cooldown slop btw

>>718105430
I thought you said "good mmos"?

>>718105915
What you don't like build meter spend meter slop?

>>718106067
what are some good MMOs?

>>718104990
i don't know what timeline you're from but tricks of the trade was added to wow in 2008

>>718106067
Dofus is the best MMO of 2025, therefore it's good.

>>718106192
>Base job in FFXI
>Released in 2002
Wow that was an easy argument to win.

>>718106287
>FFXI
literally no one has ever played this aside from contrarians

>>718090617 (OP)
There should be a 4th class, an offensive focused buff/debuff class

>>718106417
Then why is WoW stealing mechanics from it including by name? lol.

>>718106501
>implying anyone at blizzard has ever even looked at FFXI
lmao
you are alone in this delusion, retard
it's way more likely that they stole it from ultima

>>718106494
wow added augment evoker. i remember them being good on release but i havent played since then. doesnt FF have bard or something?

>>718106574
>Yeah I'll just keep saying retarded shit and distorting reality to continue to lose an argument
Wow anything else retarded to say like Ultima online wasn't 1000x more niche than FFXI.

>>718106095
Ultima Online Outlands
>>718106241
>Kowtow to care bears and ruined PvP
>Good ever after
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

>>718106727
people in the US played ultima
nobody outside of japan played FFXI
i know you REALLY want to larp super hard as this epic oldfag gamer but you're just completely incorrect on literally everything you say

>>718090617 (OP)
i chuckled because its true, but another reality is that tanks can do everything and are almost always OP

>>718106805
You know you can just google player counts for these old games and see how wrong you are.
You're literally comparing a 100k peak game to a 500k peak game.

I like playing dps but queue times and the feeling of being the most replaceable element in a group and the one with the most measurable performance (damage) leading to extreme competition for a spot in raids is making me want to play healer or tank.

>>718106906
it's like you didn't even read my previous post

>>718106805
Everquest was more popular than Ultima and was the game FFXI took the most inspiration from.

>>718107157
I don't really care to read un-medicated delusions about some dog shit game no one played.

>>718107284
right, that's what i said when your genuinely retarded ass brought up the notion that blizzard stole from FFXI
i expect your concession in your next reply, if that wasn't it already

>>718107369
>N-no you
>A game with less than a million accounts total is actually more popular than a game with multiple millions of accounts
>inb4 shit like bots which further proves my point that no one even bother to bot your dogshit game
I accept your concession.

>>718107479
parroting is an admission of defeat

i immediately pop all my cooldowns and spam aoe 0.1 seconds into a pull
tankoids need to be kept on their toes at all times

>>718107548
Schizobabble is an admission of defeat

>>718106787
>Kowtow to care bears and ruined PvP

what are you talking about?

>>718100010
Ranged dps is the most easy to play. Positioning is rarely important. They completely avoid any melee based mechanics.
Healers can often use support spells to increase damage or even heal through mechanics that would otherwise kill your group so your group has more dps uptime or can pull bigger packs.
>tank dies you wipe
>healer dies you wipe
>dps dies ummm youtube

i don't know, lately i only have fun playing tank, i feel like a grunt playing dps, i have almost no agency in the group as a tank i do my routes, i pull whatever the fuck i want and is kinda like playing an arpg solo with other npcs supporting me, bonus point if it's a tank that can heal himself and then you can ignore even more your party

>>718107962
Agency for DPS players is crying in the chat when they don't understand what's happening. And it's always the funniest shit because the answer is usually them managing to find a way to fuck something up that wasn't immediately fixed for them by their dad the tank/healer.

>>718107962
if i'm playing with randoms, i like to tank for the reasons you described
if i'm playing with people i actually know, i prefer to heal or dps

>>718090617 (OP)
>Mage: I would have helped but I was out of mana

>>718107937
>dps dies you wipe
>healer dies you wipe

um... explain this then chuddy?

>>718090617 (OP)
I just don't get why you'd want to tank. It is easily the most boring form of gameplay in any game ever. You just stand there and press the die slower button. Thanks for doing it though cuz I won't.

>>718108428
tank dies you wipe*

It sure does feel great being the only party member that matters.
This expansion fucking sucked but this moment with my friends was really cool and fun.