Thread 719963539

22 years later... was Sonic Heroes kino?

It looks and sounds fantastic but the actual gameplay is trash.

>>719963539 (OP)
>”what if we to the sonic stages from adventure, made the controls super slippery and also made you play the same stages FOUR times”
Why…

>>719963539 (OP)
Like all Sonic games, its fun out of the box but much better with QOL mods from the community

>>719963539 (OP)
It's fine when it's not glitching out to the point of unplayability.

>>719963539 (OP)
Heroes is the GOAT

>Every playable character had their own colored aura whenever you jump, roll or dash or attack.

SOVL

I like everything about it except playing it. Still not as awful as Shadow 05 but it really shows it's the first Sonic not made for Sega consoles.

>>719964083
Every time I get back to replaying it and start having fun, something stupid happens. Like a bumper sends me in the opposite direction and kills me, or I glitch through the floor with a flying stance or something stupid like that. And I've never not played this game in a GC so it's not an emulator issue. Definitely the point where Sonic games started getting glitchy, SA1 and 2 were never this flimsy.

>>719964028
What sorts of mods are available?

it's fucked up. Sonic Heroes look like plastic. Just play Frontiers instead.

>>719965647
SADX was glitchier.

>>719963539 (OP)
tw...twenty two?

SSSOOOONIIC HEEEROOOOOOOOES SONIIIIC HEEEROOOOOOOOOES

>>719965647
>>719965863
Seems like SEGA started struggling to polish their games as soon as they went third party

>>719963539 (OP)
I remember basically always being the power character because the speed characters got me killed too much.

>>719966157
didnt one of the adventures on dream cast have a game breaking bug in one of the last levels?

>high speed platformers that encourage getting to the end as fast as possible
>”hey wouldn’t it be funny if we occasionally killed the pace by making you have to fight a horde of enemies with the same attack?”
Why was sonic team so obsessed with adding combat sections during this time?

>>719966157
>>719966369
Renderware engine was trash

>>719966962
Because they were stuck on Sonic game duty while clearly wanting to work on other games so they just decided to put their ideas in Sonic instead

>>719963896
It's not the same stage.
If you ever played as the weirdo fag trio you'd know it becomes a garbage hunt instead!

I also heard it's supposed to adjust the difficulty depending on the team you pick but I never really noticed.

>>719963539 (OP)
Story is remarkably awful. Script is absurdly cheesy even for Sonic. Voice acting is probably the worst it's ever been. Having to replay some sections of the same stages over and over across campaigns is retarded. The plastic look of the characters help them stand out from the environment, but they look terrible up close. Losing the key after one hit is shit.

>>719967321
>they just decided to put their ideas in Sonic instead
Shinobi and Billy Hatcher are just about as finnicky to control as the Sonic games of this time but I love those games so much more than any post SA2 game, I don't give a shit, I love them.

>>719966962
The combat is not that bad if you stay leveled up, switch characters, and get into a flow state. The real problems are the mental tax of remembering the active character and which buttons switch, and losing your level ups on death. Switching active characters should have been achieved by holding down a shoulder/ trigger and you should have kept levels on death.

No.
It was lackluster and save for some good tracks, it wasn't worth the purchase.

>>719963539 (OP)
Heroes has always been secretly kino and people with high IQ will learn to utilize the moveset and physics to skip slower sections (almost like it's a Sonic game)

Aesthetically the zones some of the most iconic and Sonic defining things post classic era and for good reason. Seaside Hill/Ocean Palace has become the definitive Sonic stage, eclipsing Green Hill.

The rest of the game, like the gameplay, VA, and level design, is average to poor though.

>>719968445
That's cool and all but it doesn't make Robot Carnival disappear from the game, these things still drag the game down. Game would have been better off without the mandatory stop and go taking away development time.

QRD on the Sonic Adventure engine? Was Sonic Jam the original starting point?

>>719969321
I don't know if it's the same exact engine but Sonic Jam was the skeleton of the Sonic Adventure they working on for Saturn before moving development onto the Dreamcast.

Every time I replay 3D Sonic games with a fresh mind I remember why I didn't like them.
>emerald radars in SA2
>controls and combat in Heroes
>"kill every single enemy" missions in Shadow
>medals and werehog in Unleashed
>everything in 06 and Lost World

>>719963539 (OP)
It's just sort of okay-ish, and only after you get used to the jank. It's difficult to defend. Even if I like the Team gimmick conceptually speaking, there's just so much else working against it.

>>719968154
I wouldn't have minded a XP system for Heroes instead of the level up orbs. That way the enemy mobs would gradually scale with your levels, so by the end you're dealing with enemies faster, rather than having a chance to tediously fight a bunch of high level enemies at level 0 attacks.

I guess there's an argument to be made for not having leveling at all, but I don't know, I kinda like the feeling of progression in a Sonic game.
>Secret Rings
Okay, maybe not THAT much progression.

>>719968445
You've been at this for years and you're not any more right than when you first started. Heroes was 100% not designed with movement based physics in mind. Anything you post is purely unintentional. Find one example of needing the Rocket Accel to reach a hidden item or power up like with SA1's spam dash and the 1UP in Speed Highway. Go ahead, I'll wait. Face it, the Rocket Accel was just an undercooked mechanic among many others in Heroes that serves no real purpose other than speedrunner tranny shit.
>git le good xDDD
It's not even hard to use, moron. It's just not implemented well at all.

>>719969068
>Seaside Hill/Ocean Palace has become the definitive Sonic stage, eclipsing Green Hill.
Ehh. It mostly just shows up in racers, though. Green Hill is still going to be Sonic's 1-1, at the end of the day. Even Frontiers still uses Green Hill asset flips, when they could easily use Seaside Hill if they really wanted to since it was in Generations too.

>>719969321
Jam was an early prototype for SA1's engine, yes. You can really tell with beta Windy Valley's art direction and level design which would feel right at home on the Saturn. Also worth noting that SA1 started life as a Sonic JRPG on the Saturn, but whether or not that was before or after Jam is unknown.

>>719968445
>flying is yellow power
>shadow has yellow power

>>719969547
How is it unintentional? The Rocket Accel was specifically made to be the spindash equivalent of this game just with the tacked on mechanic of having your teammates push you for a greater burst of speed. Not every SA1 spindash trick was intended either.
>it's not even hard to use
Heroes has a very steep learning curve because most people can't even think to do simple stuff like this and call every combat section forced. And there's no speedtranny glitches here, just using the added height from bouncing on a badnik so cope nigger.

>>719969538
>>emerald radars in SA2
At least that's partly fixable with the PC port and mods, you can return it to the SA1 version where the radar works for all three emerald pieces at all times. Not that it really helps those levels be more fun honestly, just less tedious.

Heroes was my first 3D sonic game on game cube then adventurer 1 and 2
i still think i like hero's more then 1

>>719963539 (OP)
>>719963741
This.

It just as broken as most modern sonic games, hell the pinball level could be a '06 level

>>719963741
It's more fun to think about playing than actually playing it.

>>719970224
>It just as broken as most modern sonic games
Another case of /v/ still thinking Sonic is stuck in the 00's. Sonic games have been pretty decently polished since Colors aside from Sonic Boom which wasn't Sonic Team.

>>719969437
How much of Sonic Jam remains in SA1?

>>719963539 (OP)
with mods, yes

>>719965647
Shadow was the better game of the two. Aesthetical preferences aside, StH was the closest we got to an ideal Sonic game besides S06 where it was an action platformer from beginning to end instead of wasting your time with dogshit gimmicks. The only drawback was the mission structure, but Shadow Reloaded Mod made one of the best Sonic games out of it.

>>719965647
I remember SA2 having SOME problems. Like when you were going REALLY fast, usually with regards to rails, and sometimes the homing attack just couldn't lock on properly, but they were manageable if you set it up properly.

>>719970472
Expert Mode is what StH should have been from the start

>>719970408
Remnants of Sonic's old design still being in the game. Like certain mission graphics will show Classic Sonic in them and the Sonic Jam model is still used in certain scenes where he's riding on top of the Tornado.

Why the fuck did they throw out the physics and stuff from SA2? Heroes and Shadow feel like absolute shit to play.

>>719970584
windy valley is also somewhat reminiscent oft he sonic jam hub, especially the beta version of it

>>719970472
Shadow plays nothing like a Sonic game. The levels are not designed like Sonic levels. Reloaded doesn't fix the core flaws with the game.

>>719970472
Shadow sucks fucking ass, I definitely enjoyed it less than Heroes. It implemented a worse version of Heroes' gimmicry with those garbage Hero/Dark objectives, adding even more unfitting stop and go garbage to Sonic, lots of it plagiarized from Jak and Daxter 2-3. To me this is the point Sega went creatively bankrupt with Sonic and just started blatantly stealing shit and pandering. The Adventure games are so, so much better than Shadow, that's the ideal Sonic game right there. The only way to enjoy Shad05 is playing the neutral route and never bothering with anything else.

WHAT GOES UP
MUST COME DOWN

>"Heroes is good, actually!"
Sonic fans are actual subhumans, holy shit.

>>719971287
The coping will never end. They are starting to pretend that Forces was actually great all along and that Sonic 1 from Genesis is better than Sonic 3&K. Weird bunch of people

>>719963539 (OP)
I have a lot of nostalgia for this game. I need to go back and play it to see if it actually holds up.

>>719971287
>you're only allowed to like this pre-approved list of Sonic games, your personal preferences don't matter

>>719971879
You're free to like whatever you want, but "like" and "good" are not the same.

>Sonic Heroes was my first Sonic game
>remember going over to a friend's house to play SA2B only for me to complain how shitty of a game it felt in comparisson
I've been programmed to love this game

>>719963539 (OP)
eh, I loved it as a kid but when I did a run of it this year it didn't really hold up. It wasn't a bad time or anything but I only did a team sonic, I had no desire to play it again 3 times and no way in hell was I going for the chaos emeralds again.

>>719963539 (OP)
It's a masterpiece and only ugly low IQ retards complain about the "slippery" controls and having the play it 4 times.

>tails flies
>but knuckles can fly by holding hands over a giant fan
>also we'll put giant flagpoles all over the area for no reason at all so sonic can raise his y position too
>but make sure you use tails guys
>yah he's worthless for everything besides lvl 3, but make sure you use him

More like Sonic Zeroes LMAO

>>719963539 (OP)
I like the concept but it has bad level design and isn't very fun to play.

>>719963539 (OP)
No.

>>719963539 (OP)
sonic was never good

>>719970686
If I remember correctly they DID use adventure’s physics. It’s just that they bumped up the acceleration and nothing else for the speed characters so they ended up feeling slippery

>>719963539 (OP)
>but its buggy
just give it a steam port and the autists will fix it just like they did for sa1/2

>>719980275
gnuuy