Thread 723876886

>video-games are the most profitable medium in existence
>people love to watch let's play/streamers
>video-games allow space for competitive play and even olympian level shit like speedrunning
>...
>nobody gives a fuck, gamers are not wearing shirts of their favorite players or teams, it's nowhere near the fandom of real sports like basketball or soccer, most gamers still treat as a niche
I for one don't give a flying fuck about sports or e-sports, but it's undeniable that e-sports failed to have any cultural impact in our society.

>>723876886 (OP)
The people involved are known to crack under minor pressure.
You can have a fine esports faggot league going for weeks and 1 spilled spaghetti moment can kill it instantly because its weak men all the way down.

>>723876886 (OP)
Watching sports has always been gay, and watching e-sports is even gayer
speedruns > e-sports

>>723877359
either way, both scene are too small to be significant.

It's like if fans enjoyed playing soccer, enjoyed watching someone with a go-pro playing soccer but didn't watch any of the games.

If we had video-game olympics, we could have multiple categories, including speedrunning.

>>723877198
This is more in fps that the big meltdowns happens from what I see

>>723876886 (OP)
Because it's not appealing to watch manlet koreans dominate every relevant e-sport

>>723876886 (OP)
>
child trafficking and blackmail/drugs are the moat profitable things dude

>>723878605
girls are very into k-pop these days and they all have their favorite ching chong.

Couldn't boys have the same? Sure some of these koreans have charisma, right?

because they are far more interested in appealing to casuals and getting sales than making a game with actual competitive value.

imagine if MLB needed to sell copies of baseball, and in order to get more baseball sales, they started allowing people to use pitching machines instead of learning to pitch because they wanted the casual audience.

>>723879163
most people into sports are casuals, and normalfags are very into watching someone else playing,

The only way I see it, people into sports cheers for a team, an simbolic idea. People into watching streamers/let's play are into people, cult of personality.

>>723878664
I knew I shouldn't have become a doctor. Mum was right.

Counter-Strike is one of the most long-standing esports to this day. Despite that, it's barely profitable because fans have gotten used to watching the games for free instead of paying for them like traditional sports. As a result, all of the big companies pulled out from the scene very early on. The only thing propping up the modern esports scene is a collection of shady/straight up illegal gambling and skin trading companies. The tier 2 scene is also filled with match fixers and cheaters.

>>723876886 (OP)
Because esports is not centralized

>>723876886 (OP)
The reason you cannot english.

>>723879320
part of the reason casuals watch sports is because they are physically and mentally demanding and take years of training in order to master, and its impressive seeing people pull off such feats during a high stakes game. dumbing down games so casuals will buy them removes the need for training, and makes watching them boring.

>>723879468
I can't be bothered to proofread the shit I post on 4chan.

>>723879620
>posts AI slop
>English isn't correct
Hmmm

>>723879753
>ai slop
wut????

>>723876886 (OP)
>TI
>Evo
>Big arenas for shooters
>Wtf LoL does
>And so on
Another delusional aspie thread!

>>723878605
This

>>723879835
Anon, this shit is only noticeable if you are into this shit, for everyone else is just a niche like speedrunning.

You can't go near a sport without immediately bumping into a team and their fanbase, it's inseparable from sports. video-games and e-sports on the other hand it's more akin to the olympics, people at most know about some good player and what country is very good at a game, but there is no fandom.

>>723876886 (OP)
Metagaming always ruins the spectacle, dudes playing the same 3 characters in a fighting game etc.

>>723880946
I guess the problem is video-games as a medium is not fit for our current model of sport fandom.

>>723879806
Not him but i hate that from now on and forever, you might as well consider everything you ever see online fake. Bet my life your vid was generated

>>723876886 (OP)
I don't even watch sports and you want me to watch some niggas playing video games before a computer?

>>723881094
I understand you. AI slop is pure cancer, and made me paranoid about every media.

>>723876886 (OP)
unlike sports which require you to be physically active and skilled to participate I can play videogames all I want instead of watching a team of koreans dominate the scene

It did.
It took off, and league's worlds were getting millions of viewers.
The issue is the games don't last. There's an inherent issue with video games where there are concerns of balance, things HAVE to change, and new content has to be added or people leave. So, they make changes, people disagree, and things adjust.

It's still relatively popular but nowhere near what it once was, even if they claim the numbers are going up, the lack of discussion about it prove otherwise.

Other games have tried but they forced money into the pots rather than work on expanding the environment. Again, league is really the gold standard, they spent YEARS doing grassroots work, offering up free premium currency and offering to set up and provide hardware for college tournaments. There were league clubs in every college I visited from 2011-2014.

Stuff like GDQ went very very very quickly from being about speedrunning, and raising money for a good cause to being a vehicle for advertising with speedrunning as a backdrop (also drama related to the community lmao).

In the west, the truth of the matter is as follows:
Asians completely fucking shit on everyone else. It's just the reality. In the west focus is on streaming because advertisers make more money from streams, and so do the streamers, so no one practices for actual games, meaning the asians who are forced to live together and practice 12 hours a day perform better.

The biggest thing though is like I said, the issue with games having to evolve and change. Until we find a "perfect" game that needs no updates and retains players, people will move on from popular titles, and the esports will have to start all over again, over and over.

Because it’s fucking gay. All these plokoons are methed out and weight 110 pounds

Because unlike real sports where doping is disincentivized with bans, they promote adderall usage and refuse to punish it when it provides objective benefit.

>>723876886 (OP)
Highly competitive gaming is as mindnumbingly boring as watching speedrunners. Same shit every time. Hardly anything ever changes and you rarely get any new blood winning big upsets.

>>723876886 (OP)
An issue for me is you can't really atttach yourself to a team or player too easily. Teams are temporary collaborations of players that at any time can be gutted, you can like iterations of them but thats it.

overwatch.
blizzard put BILLIONS, with a B, into advertising and shilling overwatch esports, promising massive leagues sponsored by cities/states just like major sports franchises.
And then it just never produced anything. They had like 20~ matches per year.

Esports is gay and tries to turn complex micromanaging into a spectacle, it inherently has to dumb down mechanics so people unfamiliar with the game's minutae can comprehend what's happening. This is counterintuitive to the viewing experience and means that "hype moments" take over all other manner of commentary.

Underground competitive gaming, which is effectively a few hundred autists doing exhibition matches ad infinitum, is significantly better than esports due to the simple fact that it doesn't try to appeal to everyone who watches it. Unfortunately, it's often decentralized, which means there's no money and thus no incentive to keep a recurring league going.

sports feel rigged or sketchy as it is.
letting the 'sport' be on a computer allows for all manner of dishonesty to be directed at the audience. it's really senseless to get emotionally invested in something with no real dedication to being genuine.
also i watched video and arcade top 10 on TV as a kid and i hated how it was 5 mins of excitement, 20 mins of ads and fucking around, which left a bad taste for competitive vidya.

>>723883787
forgot my image AND the point associated with it.
look at the 'distance travelled' stat compared to 'total eliminations' here. either they're making shit up, telling lies, or people had to travel thousands of miles for every kill.

the game fucking died and there was no reason to lie. so if they'll lie without inventive to, why wouldn't they lie when a shit ton of money is on the line?

>>723884018
AAAAAAA 4CHAN ATE MY POST AND I FORGOT TO REATTACH THE IMAGE FUUUUUUCK
but i mean really, explain this

>>723884018
>>723884089
funny thing, according to the investor reports following shutdown when discussing and dissecting concord, they mentioned that exact metric, and said "It represented "miles travelled to reach the battlegrounds for every match". So, the weird spaceship loading screens.
They just said each map was hundreds of thousands of miles apart.

>>723884089
>thirty one thousand miles per kill
*circumnavigates the earth twice to kill u*

>>723876886 (OP)
because video games are not a spectator sport
how anyone didnt immediately understand that is fucking bonkers to me
of COURSE no one gives a shit about 'e-sports' because the very essence of vidya is PLAYING THE VIDYA, NOT WATCHING SOME OTHER CUNT PLAY THE VIDYA

>>723884089
If It was after they closed the game, I would say it's all the running they were doing to kill themselves to finish matches early

>>723884197
oh so it's literally fucking nonsense pretending to be a relevant statistic.
proves my point exactly. who the fuck is going to watch esports if there's even a CHANCE some 'pro' will be judged based on something completely insane that's out of everyone's control but the game developer's

>>723884390
what an absurd way to frame the situation.
have you ever heard of a small, obscure pair of websites called "twitch" and "youtube"?

>>723876886 (OP)
Because games are unironically too complex to understand at high level, I've played various minor games (no starcraft or garbage like that) at a top100 level in the world, the moves you do, no matter if it's a turn-based or real time game are completely alien to anyone below your level, even people who play that game can't understand what you are doing or why you are doing it, playing games at high level is simply not relatable, while watching someone throw a ball or scoring hit at a shooting competition is very easily understandable, a car racing ahead or doing a dangerous car overtaking in a race, all visual acts that have an immediate impact.
So if you don't understand what you are doing nobody will be interested in watching it, it's the same in streams, the most popular high skill streams are very unpopular related to watching whores on twitch or joke/social/casual streams aimed at entertain rather, because the former will only be watched by the top 10/5/1% people who actually can learn and understand what is going on.

>>723883643
>Underground competitive gaming, which is effectively a few hundred autists doing exhibition matches ad infinitum, is significantly better than esports due to the simple fact that it doesn't try to appeal to everyone who watches it.
Thousand times this.
I miss when fighting game tournaments, and EVO it self was all community driven like you can't imagine.

>>723884197
this is like saying your movie has tens of thousands of people in it because you have a 3 second shot of a phone book being flipped through during the opening credits.
this is like saying you have 'grass-fed beef" because you dress up in a ghillie suit when you bring them their grains

>>723884557
>youtube
vast majority of videos are not 'watch someone else play x game' but are on other topics
>twitch
anyone who unironically visits or watches twitch is unworthy of being acknowledged or interacted with to start with

>>723876886 (OP)
CSGO is massive all the rest failed to reach that level due to bad casting scenes or other problems

>>723876886 (OP)
>why didn't e-sports took off?
Good morning SEAr.

>>723876886 (OP)
>e-sports
YWNBAS

>>723884854
>he thinks i was saying youtube is all gaming
>he moved the goalpost from "nobody watches" to "nobody of worth watches"
don't seek a career in law

Nobody gives a fuck which ugly skinnyfat motherfucker can shove the most stims into their body

At least in real sports there is usually some kind of drug testing, players who cheated are banned for life etc. there was a minor fuss about drugs in esports a long time ago but it went away because everyone just pays a doctor to diagnose them with something that means they're allowed to stim up.

Same thing with every professional cyclist having 'asthma', nobody gives a shit about those lycra fags either

>>723884854
You're on a video game discussion board you pretentious faggot

>>723885585
>>723885125
>no valid refutations
i accept your concessions of defeat

why do people like watching real sports? I don't like watching esports or sports, but I enjoy playing both. Is it really just because athletes have really nice bodies? I feel like that is the only real difference, other than that people have a stigma against gaming as being easy and degenerate.

>>723876886 (OP)
E-sports took off, retard.
>nowhere near the fandom of real sports like basketball or soccer
kek

>>723876886 (OP)
>but it's undeniable that e-sports failed to have any cultural impact in our society.

You say that in any Asian country. It's just that European and American were all raised with real sports.

>>723885796
wake me up when e-sports start showing on TV, people change the channels in bars and work to have e-sports in the background and you casually see dudebros wearing e-sport teams merch.

>>723885993
>casually see dudebros wearing e-sport teams merch.
surprisingly I do see that pretty often

>>723876886 (OP)
you have to know the game to be able to even conceptualize enjoying watching other people play, therefore every esport game can only be as big as the game's popularity. This is a filter that normal sports don't have because any retard can understand ball must go into score gadget of choice

>>723885993
>wake me up when e-sports start showing on TV, people change the channels in bars and work to have e-sports in the background and you casually see dudebros wearing e-sport teams merch

Pretty sure you can find that in Korea or even some country in Europe.

>>723886230
>you have to know the game to be able to even conceptualize enjoying watching other people play
Counter Strike is the only e-sport that doesnt have this problem. You can explain Lol's objective easily, but that's about it.

>>723886603
I'm surprised that starcraft is so popular for this reason. A lot of what decides games at the highest level is extremely nuanced shit, like stuff that is far above the commentators and 99.9% of players. Like, "oh he didn't build a worker on 15 to get this building out 3 seconds earlier because the other play commonly does xyz build on this map so the build is designed to attack right before this unit traditionally comes out, but the other player preemptively didn't build a worker on 12 supply in anticipation to counteract this early attack," while commentators spout random irrelevant strategic takes and parasocial nonsense. Truly the spectators have no idea what is going on other than "oh this unit killed that unit." I must imagine that league and CS are the same for pros

>>723876886 (OP)
Because I personally don't like it.

>>723876886 (OP)
No money in it.

>>723876886 (OP)
Probably because like half of all events have a scandal with someone trying to cheat especially the FPS players.

>>723887274
If I wanted to watch nerds use complex math and prediction against each other then I'd just analyses of the Ukraine war. I play games to do goofy shit. This niggergook hyperoptimization is so goddamn boring if not in irl.

>>723876886 (OP)
Because people want to watch athletes pulling off some stunts with their own body. Watching 10 nerds clapping and hammering on their peripherals is just boring, no matter how flashy the game looks.

>>723876886 (OP)
At every point on the ladder it's filled with thieves and incompetents. Competent professionals still don't respect the business so you only get third rate failures who are willing to take bribes, cheat and cut corners. Esports fails because good people aren't interested in making it work.

>>723888159
because if you are talented, why the fuck would you choose esports? It is hard as hell to be good at any game, why not spend 1/10 of the effort and get a hot gf with a great career instead? Other than the love of the game, wtf is the appeal? So it attracts a ton of losers who have no other options

>>723888289
>Putting your talent on a gf
Nta, but even that is a waste of time and effort. If you're the upper 1% of the talented people, you put your efforts into stuff which would make you rich.

>>723888387
same thing. What I meant is spend the effort (on something) and as a result get a gf and a great career on the side. Like, you can grind for 16 hours a day playing a game, or 2 hours a day on some wallstreet job and end up with stability and respect from society at 200k a year. Otherwise you can get shit on as a "pro," make $30k a year, get no respect, and also have no future (and no gf)

>>723876886 (OP)
because its just all koreans with 0 personality, also starcraft 2 was never fun to watch imo...didnt mind watching League sometimes but idgaf about CHINA team vs KOREAN team when they all play the same safe shit

>>723888547
Do you understand how human beings work at all? Considering you're posting anime girls, probably not. Hopefully one day society will realise the cure for your disease

>>723888658
well I certainly don't understand what you are getting at so no apparently I don't understand

>>723888547
>gf
Is overrated as fuck, the first few months or half a year is surely "magical", but that fades quickly. Again, if have max-tier talent, you wont waste that on a "gf".
>respect from society
Who gives a shit what a rando thinks about you when you're one of the most talented men on the planet.

>>723888289
I wasn't talking about the players I was talking about everyone else, the staff, management, coaches and such.
Nothing wrong with the players, you'll always have plenty of talented players because the people who do that do it for the love of the game and the money comes second.
It's everyone else involved who fuck it up. And the point of the thread was to talk about why it isn't working and that's the main reason why. It won't get better until someone or some company is willing to step up and do it right. Which will probably never happen but yeah.

>>723888974
Come on, most of the pros are cheating the shit out of the games they play.

>>723889159
We're talking about fan sports not online matches. There's no way to get rid of cheating in online play but it hardly matters. The games people go to watch are what people want and cheating by the players at those is very difficult to pull off. And still player cheating is the least of the systems problem. All it does is change who wins sometimes and most of the time the viewers aren't aware so it's not like their pleasure is lost.
The corruption of the system itself is what makes it impossible for it to become as legit as stuff like baseball/football.

>>723883246
That games competitive scene revolves around who has a better tank+healer combo. It’s like an endless stalemate where they rotate over and over until someone makes a “mistake”
Over watch was never as good as battleborn because there’s no item building or nuance to the characters besides who lands the headshot

>>723876886 (OP)
It took off last decade, now the hype is dead

>>723876886 (OP)
>shows pic of stadium full of ganers at an esport event
>asks amazingly stupid ass question
I imagine you do other stupid things like taking a picture of a turtle and then posting it to the internet and asking why don't Turtles exist?

Esports gives away Millions to the winners and millions watch it and thousands show up to the events every time.

Fix whatever wrong with your brain.

>>723889735
>battleborn
ok randy

>>723876886 (OP)
One problem it had was that the people financing e-sports just decided to copy what normal sports did to earn money. It did not however work, for example people into e-sports do not spend as much money in the hobby as people into sports do with team merch and so on. E-sports still exists though, but it's still trying to figure out what the fuck is the model they need to adapt in order to also earn money for their sponsors as well as pay their own staff to justify the scene existing.