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Anonymous No.723953586 [Report] >>723953658 >>723953896 >>723953956 >>723954060 >>723954263 >>723954543 >>723955321 >>723955569 >>723955645 >>723956016 >>723956216 >>723956454 >>723958230 >>723958574 >>723958672 >>723958787 >>723958948 >>723960030 >>723960576 >>723960758 >>723960783 >>723960903 >>723960906 >>723961396 >>723961470 >>723962032 >>723962097 >>723962427 >>723963978 >>723965894 >>723966325 >>723969780 >>723969793 >>723978787
What makes the Souls formula so much more popular than other third person action games?
Anonymous No.723953658 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
Risk and reward.
Anonymous No.723953896 [Report] >>723953973
>>723953586 (OP)
there's no input dexterity or complicated move lists but they still offer an accessible challenge.
Anonymous No.723953956 [Report] >>723954993 >>723957875
>>723953586 (OP)
exploration and level design
Anonymous No.723953973 [Report]
>>723953896
We can close the thread now.
Anonymous No.723954037 [Report] >>723955242 >>723959096 >>723974861
ive been around since demon souls but im really starting to get burnt out on it these days after like a bazillion iterations of the same game.

I with they would mix things up a bit, like having actual plots and charachters, or find a way to integrate a more rewarding loot system
Anonymous No.723954060 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
They are good
Anonymous No.723954263 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
No canceling trash, no canned combos, the attacks you choose to string depend entirely on enemy states without necessarily having enemies incapacitated
This leads to a more open and interesting roster of enemy designs that neither have the same predictable hit reaction nor defeating them is its own unique strat
Anonymous No.723954543 [Report] >>723954598
>>723953586 (OP)
no idea I tried one of the games and found the combat really stiff and boring while the controls felt bizarre. I didn't find it difficult, although I didn't play it for very long. I still have no idea why people like it, the combat is not good.
Anonymous No.723954598 [Report] >>723956169
>>723954543
if you found the controls bizarre you probably don't play a lot of games
Anonymous No.723954670 [Report] >>723966515
Actual strategy has to be used rather than retarded button mashing
Anonymous No.723954993 [Report] >>723955371 >>723959446 >>723961481 >>723975869
>>723953956
This.
Which is why I cannot understand, for the life of me, why they keep leaning into open world and weird, roguelite design. The community made a big deal about its bosses, which were never the main focus until like...DS3. Demon's Souls was all about the stages, and all of the bosses were gimmicks (which I think was good--they were all memorable and fun to figure out). Dark Souls did the interconnectivity thing. DS2 tried to have the best of both worlds and kind of met in the middle. Bloodborne was 110% aesthetic and art design.
Even Sekiro, which had a much bigger focus on bosses, still delivered a textured, interesting world to explore, even though it was basically just "Bloodborne 2: Japan Edition".

Elden Ring was the beginning of the end. I haven't even kept up with what they're doing since Nightreign and Duskbloods. Both look like shit.
Anonymous No.723955242 [Report] >>723956834 >>723959384 >>723973118 >>723974861
>>723954037
For me, it's the dogshit From Software quest design. I'm really struggling to remember the last one I enjoyed. Maybe Solaire in DS1?
The intent seems to be to make the quest stages cryptic to invoke a bygone atmosphere of mystery in games that has been lost to "walkthrough culture". Demon's Souls in particular has a lot of other inscrutable elements that play off this. And yet, in making tedious hunts for shuffling NPCs across massive gameworlds, and making players solve cryptic non-puzzles to progress their stories, it's done nothing but strengthen "walkthrough culture".
Anonymous No.723955321 [Report] >>723962017
>>723953586 (OP)
It marketed itself over being le hard a lot in everyone's face while a normal action/hard game is simply hard and doesn't make a big deal of it.
Anonymous No.723955371 [Report] >>723957926
>>723954993
>they keep leaning into open world and weird, roguelite design
They made 1 Open World and 1 Roguelite
Anonymous No.723955569 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
The risk of death and loss of souls is a cheap thrill that can make the game exciting, without totally wasting your time like retro arcade games.
Anonymous No.723955620 [Report] >>723956456
Requiring actual skill and knowledge instead of being button masher shit like DMC/Bayonetta.
Anonymous No.723955645 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
It's easy, you just press two buttons. Even braindead normalfaggots can do it.
Anonymous No.723955812 [Report] >>723956270
If it was solely difficulty, then other action games of that era such as Ninja Gaiden II, Bayo and even DMC4 would have been bigger success stories. The dark fantasy is definitely a huge draw and lends itself well to the difficulty and tone, especially as Game of Thrones was at its peaks around the time of Souls' release.
Anonymous No.723956016 [Report] >>723956058
>>723953586 (OP)
hard game. future of fromsoft's looking grim with tension and design are being removed left and right in an attemp to appeal the masses. they succeed but we'll never get a real adventure game ever again
Anonymous No.723956058 [Report]
>>723956016 (me)
*hard game(but not really)
Anonymous No.723956169 [Report] >>723960089 >>723961554
>>723954598
I do actually, having attack set to the bumpers and triggers in a 3rd person game focused on melee makes zero sense. attacks should always be mapped to the face buttons.
Anonymous No.723956216 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
brand recognition
Anonymous No.723956270 [Report]
>>723955812
Playing Dark Souls 1 and watching early (good) seasons of Game of Thrones was peak comfy.
Anonymous No.723956454 [Report] >>723957318
>>723953586 (OP)
movement and animations
try moving around in a couple of non souls games, then go back to souls
everything is super responsive and has weight to it

Other games are for some reason not able to compete in this department at all.
Anonymous No.723956456 [Report]
>>723955620
I like souls games but getting all S in hell and hell is harder than anything in souls games, I'm afraid. smashing your head into a wall doesn't teach you anything other than don't be a quitter, a participation trophy at most.
Anonymous No.723956834 [Report] >>723958554
>>723955242
>I'm really struggling to remember the last one I enjoyed
Maybe you'll remember after reloading two more times.
Anonymous No.723957169 [Report] >>723964131
i get the appeal of souls but beople praising the combat is beyond me
there are many games out there with a better designed and programmed combat system
actually it doesn't even seem that lauded since 90% of discussion is lore talk, builds and exploration
Anonymous No.723957318 [Report] >>723957554
>>723956454
it (was) not that uncommon to see decent movement and animations, anon. plenty of kusoge games at the time had the same, if not better performance on the matter
Anonymous No.723957554 [Report] >>723958095
>>723957318
lol no, even just going by animation weight, I've never seen a studio do it better
everything is always anime level bullshit with people swinging around 0 lbs paper weapons and "smooth" transitions that take away from how responsive it all seems when playing
Other devs don't have any idea how to make a good character controller at all
Anonymous No.723957803 [Report]
It’s dope
Anonymous No.723957875 [Report]
>>723953956
This. And what pushes the exploration is unparalleled enemy design/animation and level design. Both dragging you in.
Anonymous No.723957926 [Report] >>723959628 >>723960332
>>723955371
They successfully leaned into those things as their last two games, which have now made them more money than the rest of their products in the series. Where do you think they're going to go from here?
Anonymous No.723958042 [Report] >>723958202
its just nice to have 1 video game series where you dont have to do listen to npcs, read tons of text, look at cutscenes, stare at menus or do slow trailing/stealth missions

you just press buttons to do shit and thats been just missing forever
Anonymous No.723958095 [Report] >>723963819
>>723957554
you can make anime bullshit moves and still make it feel impactful, you just don't like that style of animation
it's a matter of preferences but don't go around saying that dark souls does it better than everyone just because it has heavy-feeling animations
Anonymous No.723958202 [Report] >>723959789
>>723958042
bullshit nigga, not only from does plenty of that but there are many recent games that don't waste time for the player with cutscenes and wall of texts
tired of this "fromsoft saved gaming" narrative
Anonymous No.723958230 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
marketing
Anonymous No.723958554 [Report]
>>723956834
>*reloads one more time just in case*
Anonymous No.723958574 [Report] >>723958770
>>723953586 (OP)
they're mechanically very simple games and the kind of challenge they offer (short, endlessly repeatable sections that require rote memorization and not much else) ensure that any retard can eventually beat them with enough patience
Anonymous No.723958672 [Report] >>723958770
>>723953586 (OP)
The combat mechanics aren't based on canceling and fighting gimmicky enemies
There's actual enemy and playstyles variety that isn't bop it
Anonymous No.723958770 [Report]
>>723958574
>>723958672
the duality of souls threads
Anonymous No.723958787 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
Anonymous No.723958791 [Report]
Slow in a way only monster hunter used to be. Floaty action feels too much like an action platformer. People have been coded since the NES to lean into action combat thats slow and its all about range and zoning like a fighting game but not 2d slop for apes.
Anonymous No.723958948 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
Elden Ring showed me that the best souls games are Demons Souls, Dark Souls 1 and AI Limit.
Anonymous No.723959026 [Report] >>723959075
Relatively low skill ceiling coupled with heavy reliance on fundamentals, heavy emphasis on exploration, innovative online mechanics, satisfying and weighty animations and possibly the best base control formula in the genre is what really sold the masses initially. I cannot overstate enough how good the control scheme was 15 years ago in particular, back then action games were stuck with atrocious garbage with terrible lock-on mechanics, awful cameras and overly complicated input systems.
Unfortunately, Fromsoft didn't really innovate in these 15 years and in some aspects moved ass backwards.
Anonymous No.723959075 [Report] >>723959181
>>723959026
>low skill ceiling
Anonymous No.723959096 [Report] >>723974861
>>723954037
Having actual plot and characters is why i liked armored core 6 so much. Especially compared to how utterly ATROCIOUS shadow of the erdtree was story wise.
Anonymous No.723959181 [Report] >>723959464 >>723959695 >>723959738 >>723959828 >>723960076
>>723959075
Yes, extremely low. Possibly the lowest among all arpgs. It's based on pure pattern memorization and simplistic spacing with no complicated mechanics to distract you from it whatsoever. Navigating the world was unironically harder than fighting stronger foes head on in des and ds1, unfortunately they didn't really understand the appeal of their own games.
Anonymous No.723959352 [Report] >>723960401
Personally, I like Soulslikes because they combine hack n slash combat with RPG world design and progression. It really is that simple. It's a surprisingly rare combo. Most other "action" RPGs are gay Diablo shit or even gayer Bethesda shit. The only hack n slash RPG I can think of with half-decent art direction besides Soulslikes is Nier. Nier and Dark Souls have pretty much the exact same appeal for me
Anonymous No.723959384 [Report] >>723960213 >>723960359
>>723955242
>and making players solve cryptic non-puzzles to progress their stories, it's done nothing but strengthen "walkthrough culture".
I get you. The biggest flub they made with this kind of thing is the DaS1 DLC. Like, in principle, making accessing the DLC a cryptic thing that's cleverly integrated into the world instead of something you just get for being a paypiggy is something I respect, but the way they actually put it in was so poorly thought out and tryhard that virtually everyone just ended up using a guide.

The Asylum return/Painted World was fine and actually well hinted at. The idea of having some item that's relevant to some aspect of the lore Oolacile in this case that you want to investigate is great, but it's just put in in such a random way, and the fact that the 'gift' pendant is useless but this random other one just happens to unlock a whole new section of the world, if only you go to the one part of the game you have the absolute least reason to ever go back to, but only after doing this late game part after using the DLC...it's absolutely mental if you didn't know to expect this or why this random drop is there.
Anonymous No.723959446 [Report]
>>723954993
you got filtered by the bosses. thanks for letting us know you're a shitter
Anonymous No.723959464 [Report] >>723959514
>>723959181
>It's based on pure pattern memorization and simplistic spacing with no complicated mechanics
Clearly for you, a shitter that can't play it
Anonymous No.723959514 [Report] >>723959698 >>723961094
>>723959464
Oh, post your playtime faggot.
Anonymous No.723959628 [Report]
>>723957926
Every game of theirs profits more than their previous game retard, bar exclusives
Even sekiro with how much cheaper it was to produce
DS3's success didnt stop them from making an actually creative action game with its own features (sekiro) instead of more ds3 style garbage

this may seem alien to you but fromsoft actually makes the games they want to make and think its fun. Miyazaki directed Deracine of all things.
Anonymous No.723959695 [Report]
>>723959181
>. Possibly the lowest among all arpgs. It's based on pure pattern memorization and simplistic spacing
have you tried not being a shitter that dies so much you need to memorize
Anonymous No.723959698 [Report] >>723960934
>>723959514
All those hours and you still can't extend hitstuns and combo attacks
Anonymous No.723959738 [Report] >>723960986
>>723959181
>i cant believe the developer decided to maximize different appeals in different games instead of making the exact same game over and over again
Anonymous No.723959789 [Report]
>>723958202
>listen to NPCs
You can skip all dialogue. You can't do that in most modern games.
>read tons of text
You have to go out of your way to do that. Never do the games shove a wall of text in your face when you pick up a document or whatever. You have to manually go into your inventory and examine an item, which is something only players interested in lore will do.
>look at cutscenes
There are practically no cutscenes, other than the opening.
>stare at meus
I mean, it's a fucking RPG, but it's got the least amount of menuing in any RPG I've played
>slow trailing/stealth missions
And these obviously don't apply at all.

Give me another modern game that avoids all these shortcomings, if it's so common
Anonymous No.723959828 [Report] >>723960023
>>723959181
The only modern Fromsoftware game I would define shallow is Sekiro, because it misses a lot of interactions with various attacks and your own attacks don't have the power and range to pull off the most interesting things an experienced player can actually do in Souls games
Anonymous No.723960023 [Report] >>723960660 >>723960916
>>723959828
you can only really say that for elden ring with its crazy moves, otherwise youre probably just overestimating the coolness of older souls stuff while underestimating sekiro

from ganking minibosses, to doing stuff like bestowal + spiral cloud, to dual wielding fire and poison, to ducking under enemy attacks much more freely because of the better crouch and slide that can flow well into a strong prosthetic you couldnt land otherwise, shurikenning enemies midair, etc is all pretty cool all things considered. And if you just stick to the most basic options for everything, the CLANGCLANGCLANG is at its core more interesting than just someone doing dodge and poke in every souls game (other than once again elden ring because it actually makes fights that make it harder to exclusively roll/walk and poke so it encourages you to bring some cooler moves of your own)
Anonymous No.723960030 [Report] >>723960105
>>723953586 (OP)
It actually taps into our primal fight or flight parts of our brain far more than any other games out there. Souls-Likes are very melee focused games usually. When you miscalculate you get punished hard. However when your timing is spot on you will usually punish the enemy hard. This genre actually taps into how real combat is far better than most other games besides boxing or MMA games themselves. It arguably does it better than fighting games even since SF has hadouken spam and Tekken has juggling. The spacing that happens in Souls is non-existent in fighting games.
Anonymous No.723960076 [Report] >>723970739
>>723959181
I didn't realise pointing out something as obvious as Souls combat being simple could cause so much seethe, great job anon
Anonymous No.723960089 [Report] >>723961407
>>723956169
Between left hand/right hand and light/heavy, that's all 4 face.
So now where are run, dodge, interact, use item etc? You'd rather they be put on shoulder?
Same with Armored Core, left/right slot 1/slot 2. Where would you put the rest?
Anonymous No.723960105 [Report] >>723960598 >>723960889
>>723960030
have you seen For Honor?
Anonymous No.723960213 [Report] >>723960359 >>723962357
>>723959384
It really makes you wonder how much thought Fromsoft actually put into these sort of design elements. Like are they actually pitching different ideas, testing, refining, or did someone just throw together the first thing that popped into their head and say "yeah, ship it"? It really feels like they do the latter in a lot of cases, which is why I can't take seriously anyone who talks about them like they're some GOAT developer.
Anonymous No.723960332 [Report]
>>723957926
After their super successful open world game they made a level based mech shooter
Then they made a rogue like

I know it totally sucks the narrative but armored core 6 does exist
Anonymous No.723960359 [Report]
>>723959384
>>723960213
I mean, it's no more retarded than certain Resident Evil and Silent Hill puzzles being unsolvable bullshit without a guide. It's bad game design, yeah, but it's just one of those bullshit things gamers have always accepted
Anonymous No.723960401 [Report] >>723960449 >>723960515
>>723959352
Zelda would be exactly what you really want, but it just dropped danger and difficult combat for decades, despite that being a foundation of the series.
Anonymous No.723960449 [Report]
>>723960401
zelda isn't an rpg you retarded jeet
Anonymous No.723960515 [Report] >>723962565
>>723960401
Yeah, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, and Twilight Princess are all at the top of my backlog. They definitely have the world I'm looking for. But, as you said, there's no way their combat is gonna have the intensity of Dark Souls or Nier, since they're fucking kid's games
Anonymous No.723960576 [Report] >>723960801
>>723953586 (OP)
People are dumb so making a simple game centered around one single dodgeroll mechanic is a guaranteed success among lazy masses who can't focus on anything besides pressing one button at correct time.
Anonymous No.723960598 [Report] >>723982215
>>723960105
Nobody cares. We don't see For Honor clones we see Souls-Likes.
Anonymous No.723960660 [Report]
>>723960023
>And if you just stick to the most basic options for everything, the CLANGCLANGCLANG is at its core more interesting than just someone doing dodge and poke in every souls game
I don't necessarily disagree with your other points but I do disagree with this. Previous Souls games give a variety of defensive options even at the simplest level; you can roll, parry, shield-camp, reposition, abuse the environment, just run away and make distance, so on. The clang-clang is very rigid and requires you to press the exact right button at the exact right time and that's it, there's no room for expression with it and just anything different you might try to do would just lose you momentum. (Again, assuming we're just talking about the basic options.)
Anonymous No.723960758 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
It's extremely easy to pick up and play. You don't need to learn all kinds of mechanics and moves and combos. There's nothing demanding in terms of input execution
Anonymous No.723960783 [Report] >>723964297
>>723953586 (OP)
it's the nortubel of action games
Anonymous No.723960801 [Report] >>723960886
>>723960576
Literally no one was making this retarded argument when Demon Souls, Dark Souls, and Bloodborne came out. "Rollslop" (not just the terminology itself but the sentiment) is a normie tourist faggot meme that's only emerged since Elden Ring's release
>inb4 but muh matthewmitosis video
He was simply lamenting the lack of DeS-style gimmick bosses, he has no problem with the roll being the main defense mechanic because that'd be retarded and that's the way it's been since the very beginning
Anonymous No.723960804 [Report]
whoever took this screenshot needs to turn anti aliasing on lol
Anonymous No.723960886 [Report] >>723960962
>>723960801
your shit series has been normalfag bait for at least a decade you brain damaged fromtranny
Anonymous No.723960889 [Report] >>723982215
>>723960105
NTA but I've always believed that For Honor matches Souls combat very well in terms of intensity and investment. The only problem is that it's a comp multiplayer game with a boring setting, instead of a dark fantasy action-adventure
Anonymous No.723960903 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
It is a million times easier to design and implement. Action games may just be the most difficult genre a studio could choose to work on. Souls like combat is very straight forward in terms of animations and mechanics.
Anonymous No.723960906 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
>Great enemy design
>Great combat design
>Great variety that ties with both
>Manages to create a meaningful progression system throughout the game
I played any Souls game for several hundreda of hours, but Nioh bored me to tears in 40
Anonymous No.723960916 [Report] >>723982335
>>723960023
>the CLANGCLANGCLANG is at its core more interesting than just someone doing dodge and poke
Actually delusional sekirokek overrating a glorified block button.
Anonymous No.723960934 [Report]
>>723959698
what an adorable comment from a shitter who considers stunning capra demon with zwei r2 "extending hitstun"
Anonymous No.723960962 [Report]
>>723960886
>no argument
Huh wow, would you look at that
Anonymous No.723960986 [Report]
>>723959738
>maximize different appeals
>by nerfing the everliving shit out of levels and littering them with checkpoints
Anonymous No.723961094 [Report]
>>723959514
this nigga rolled for 2500 hours lmao
Anonymous No.723961167 [Report] >>723961185 >>723961304
souls games are the most astroturfed games in existence. the mental gymnastics people do to convince themselves they like the games is straight up delusional level. you fell in with the the sheep cattle
Anonymous No.723961185 [Report]
>>723961167
>you fell in with the the sheep cattle
Anonymous No.723961304 [Report]
>>723961167
You need to realize it's literally impossible to hold the level of animosity you hold towards Souls without it being personal. You clearly got filtered hard by the games, that's literally the only explanation. I've never felt as much anger towards ANY game as you have with that single post you just made. If you want to demoralize Souls players, I suggest being more subtle and aloof about it, instead of making it so obvious that you're a bitch
Anonymous No.723961396 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
peak level design
meaningful build diversity
well tuned difficulty that forces you to engage and not auto pilot
atmosphere is the perfect amount of edgy angst (everyone craves it even if they wont admit it)
not hiring American anime voice actor
Anonymous No.723961407 [Report] >>723961572
>>723960089
that's simple square should be light attack and triangle should be heavy attack
Anonymous No.723961470 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
what other third person action games?
Anonymous No.723961481 [Report]
>>723954993
>Which is why I cannot understand, for the life of me, why they keep leaning into open world
You don't know gaymers. Moment to moment experience is a secondary concern.
Anonymous No.723961554 [Report] >>723961743
>>723956169
People who get filtered by bumper/trigger-based melee combat over square/triangle-based combat are the whiniest babies I've ever seen.
>WAHHHH, IT'S A DIFFERENT BUTTON, I DON'T LIKE IT WHEN IT'S DIFFERENT
I couldn't think of a more pedantic complaint if I tried
Anonymous No.723961572 [Report]
>>723961407
for which hand?
Anonymous No.723961743 [Report]
>>723961554
>I couldn't think of a more pedantic complaint if I tried
Yes, but it was a very common complain when demon's souls first came out. Of course for gen alphas and people who got into gaming later the OPPOSITE is true, they will often complain when a game uses face buttons for attacks instead.
Anonymous No.723962017 [Report]
>>723955321
"The game was hard and playtesters bitched about how hard it was so I made it harder"
-a dead eternally butthurt retard

Character action games have been advertising how "hard" they are for the entirety of their existence.
Anonymous No.723962032 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
1. the immersive aspect of not putting quest
waymarker.
2. The level design and enemies feel like it was made by people who enjoy games. Dont know how else to put it.

I compare this to God of War ragnarok, which has a huge budget with lots of voice acting, but teh exploration is absolute shit because everything is marked, all quests are labeled and given way markers, and the main story areas feel very linear.
Anonymous No.723962097 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
It's fun
Anonymous No.723962357 [Report] >>723963037
>>723960213
That's why I brought up the Asylum return in contrast. That was really well thought out on multiple levels; anyone paying attention will see a bunch of stuff in the introductory section of the game that you can't properly take advantage when you're first there, which really motivates you to try to find a way back afterwards after being taken to Firelink. It's not completely obvious that this is possible, but there are hints and thing motivating you to investigate, the Raven remains, so you naturally wonder if it could take you back some how. At some point you might discover the elevator, and if you do and end up using it, you'll be shown a view of the big tree and rooftop each time, but the game never tells you exactly what to do, it just drops these deliberate breadcrumbs that make you feel like you want to explore certain things. It doesn't even tell you how to longjump, but your'e free to experiment and eventually discover this stuff.

In comparison, the DLC access is something you can see how it would have seemed like a clever idea to those pitching it "hey, let's hint at where the entrance is by putting stuff in the item description that references something that would be near to the hidden entrance, clever players would surely pay attention and figure it out, but otherwise it's be a cool secret". But it fails to establish any context hinting why any of this would matter or be of any importance. The random Golem enemy that drops the key item just appears without any explanation, even if you've just installed the DLC, there's nothing ruling out that some random/unknown set of circumstances just caused this thing to appear, and there's no reason to think the item you get is of any importance, the game throws tons of random shit at you that means nothing, so there's no reason for someone to go "oh Oolacile, that's the place that Dusk illusion lady talked out, surely I should go back there and investigate to see if this leads to anything".

...
Anonymous No.723962427 [Report] >>723963042
>>723953586 (OP)
In DMC, MGR and NG etc you go from room to room, get locked in and kill an arbitrary amount of spongy enemies before you're let out and repeat the process for the entire game. This paired with the mission-based structures and combo meters just makes the games feel very outdated and arcadey, the Souls games are the polar opposite of all this, there's a heavy focus on exploration and player agency, beautifully crafted worlds that flow together seamlessly with tons of things to find scattered around.
Anonymous No.723962565 [Report]
>>723960515
>Yeah, Ocarina of Time, Majora's Mask, and Twilight Princes
Yeah, on of these is not like the others. TP is hugely more restrictive and just less imaginative, it's really not worth playing and does nothing the other 3D games don't do better.

>they're fucking kid's games
That's irrelevant. The NES games have more/better fundamental difficulty than those other games, Nintendo don't just make games for fucking babies or whatever people think and the N64 games actually have better thought out/integrated lore/story and shit than Souls does.
Anonymous No.723963037 [Report]
>>723962357
A huge chunk can also be blamed on their archaic and downright laughable "progress doesn't happen until you leave and reenter or reload an area" design.
Anonymous No.723963042 [Report] >>723963586
>>723962427
>there's a heavy focus on exploration and player agency
Such a shame they failed to understand what people liked about their games and continuously nerfed exploration past bloodborne.
Anonymous No.723963586 [Report]
>>723963042
No, It's about walking through a themepark castle and fighting gael copy no.38. IT SOLD MILLIONS and everyone LOVED IT
Anonymous No.723963819 [Report]
>>723958095
not what I'm saying.
other games do it badly, DS has great movement controls and great animation weight
99% of other games do not
Anonymous No.723963978 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
Little to no dialogue and mostly unscripted gameplay. Nobody gives a shit about your failed career as a hollywood reject.
Anonymous No.723964049 [Report]
I have never played a souls game

I watched a few gameplay vids and it just feels like disrespecting your time

Closest I've played is Hollow Knight and I didn't like it that much either
Anonymous No.723964131 [Report]
>>723957169
name a few so i can play them anon
Anonymous No.723964297 [Report] >>723965493
>>723960783
Who?
Anonymous No.723965493 [Report] >>723966525
>>723964297
Let me put it in simpler terms. It's the Ratuken of action games
Anonymous No.723965894 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
The emphasis on enemies. The enemies are the stars of Souls.
Anonymous No.723966325 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
Perceived player agency via character build choices and optional level orders.
Anonymous No.723966515 [Report] >>723966894
>>723954670
>rpg stat check slop that can be cheesed through grinding
>no boss requires clever stuff like positioning or spacing during their fights, it's literally more of a rhythm game than sekiro
Thanks for the funny post anon. I love dark souls shitters and their delusion so much it's unreal
Anonymous No.723966525 [Report]
>>723965493
Who?
Anonymous No.723966894 [Report] >>723967569 >>723967570 >>723967863 >>723969430
>>723966515
Wrong, positioning and spacing and understanding the range of enemies and your attacks is the most important thing in souls games.
Anonymous No.723967569 [Report] >>723969430
>>723966894
That would be true if you couldn't iframe through most attacks. This isn't actually obvious on an initial playthrough, but once you know, you know.
Anonymous No.723967570 [Report] >>723969430
>>723966894
That would make sense if repeat rolling i-frame wasn't a thing
Anonymous No.723967863 [Report] >>723968905 >>723969627
>>723966894
I used to think that DS1 enemies were too limited in how they behaved, but Elden Ring has shifted my perspective quite a lot. Giving every enemy a "full kit" and attacks that adjust their range to always reach the player has dumbed down the combat and forces relying on iframes more often. You can still manually evade stuff, but absolutely not the first time you fight something because it's all knowledge checks. Attack hitboxes and active frames don't properly reflect what you can see and using lock-on makes enemy tracking way too aggressive.
Anonymous No.723968905 [Report] >>723969627
>>723967863
The slow limited movesets synchronized well with the combat. By adding movesets that made it faster, fromsoft fucked up their direction and their games also, so they had to resort to adding more flasks & faster rolls, which didnt fix anything
Anonymous No.723969430 [Report] >>723971115
>>723966894
>>723967569
>>723967570
The i-frames are limited and you also have limited stamina and you have to wait for the stamina to recharge if you ever depleat it completely.
Some attacks can't be rolled. Some attacks can't be blocked. And some both.
You are being disingenuous or are uninformed or both.
Anonymous No.723969627 [Report] >>723970219
>>723967863
>>723968905
Actually retarded
Anonymous No.723969780 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
It's slower
Anonymous No.723969793 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
You can brag that you beat the most hardcore game ever made online
Seriously most people just play souls game for showoff
Anonymous No.723970219 [Report]
>>723969627
Where's your argument?
Anonymous No.723970739 [Report]
>>723960076
This board is filled with DS3 and ER dickriders who don't play other games, but have sunken thousands of hours into both titles and mastered every meta autistic trick like lock on pivot cheese, menu weapon swapping and gesture hitbox avoidance. They like to feel special and impressve because of their NEETDOM, so any criticism aimed at those games is perceived as an attack on their persona
Anonymous No.723971115 [Report]
>>723969430
there isn't anything to manage when you can roll 4-5 times immiedietly after ng (with almost half a second of i-frame). try name 10 attacks that can't be dodged. souls' difficulty keeps getting faker and more artificial each time, I'm not surprised It's finally rotted your brain
Anonymous No.723973118 [Report] >>723974361 >>723974604
>>723955242
"the world is dead and you are the last remaining humans" plotline was cool in like two games max afterwards it's just showcasing laziness. I don't give a fuck how you word it but that's basically what it is.

The stilted animations and interacting with the world is like cartoonishly bad. I still pick up glowing balls, I still roll into empty barrels and tables that immediately disintegrate the exact same way since Dark Souls came out 16 fucking years ago. They truly have not technically moved out of the PS3 era
Anonymous No.723974361 [Report]
>>723973118
>I don't give a fuck how you word it but that's basically what it is.
The games work fine when the way you interact with them work with the setting. It's especially cool how it makes sense to be able to kill NPCs and just naturally face the consequences of that without some forced morality system that barely works. Having the scenario just repeat because they can't get other forms of interacting with the world working does get old though.
Anonymous No.723974604 [Report]
>>723973118
>The stilted animations
13 years later and they finally figured out how to animate a jaw moving up and down on their standard player/NPC mesh.
Anonymous No.723974861 [Report] >>723975152
>>723954037
>>723955242
>>723959096
Lies of P is a great mix of both. After the DLC and updates, I put the game at 9/10, actual masterpiece and I can't believe the game exists.
Anonymous No.723975152 [Report] >>723975596
>>723974861
Lies of P is not a "mix", there's none of Fromsoft's dogshit storytelling and quest design in there
The story is told you plainly. Together with DLC they answered every single question that may arise.
And there are literal NPC markers on the teleportation screen hinting what NPCs have new dialogues
Anonymous No.723975596 [Report]
>>723975152
I say a mix because there is some sense that you are discovering the world as you play. You get the mix of reading into discovered notes etc. and learn as much as you want. A casual can absolutely come out of the game not knowing who Paracelsus is, not knowing who the king of puppets is etc. Yo get the fun of having something to dig through but without the anxiety of overlooking suff. There is even a single random exploded carcass within Krat tucked away in a corner that I found before the carcass reveal. Among lots of other things they do in LoP this is how i prefer to get obtuse lore and souls combat
Anonymous No.723975869 [Report]
>>723954993
/thread

Demon's Souls was about the experience moreso than "muh difficulty muh bosses muh epic chorus muh rolling". Dark Souls refined that. Dark Souls 2 was made by the King's Field devs so it resembled that brand of hanky adventuring exploration. Bloodborne was mechanically simple but coasted on vibes and immersion alone. Roll Souls 3 was the beginning of the end.
Anonymous No.723977120 [Report]
You don't have to make quest.
You don't have to make dialogues.
You don't have to make exploration.
Yiu don't have to make a setting.
Just copy-paste enemies and artificial difficulty.
Anonymous No.723978787 [Report]
>>723953586 (OP)
The general from soft rule set of Stat paramter gear, risk-reward level up system and build variety is really good.

A lot of other third party action games do the bare minimum if there are RPG elements, like Dark Siders II having like 2 "builds" with a Blizzard esque stat tree, or doing the good of war thing where you just unlock new weapons that are just combo fluff.
Anonymous No.723982215 [Report] >>723982464
>>723960598
what does that have to do with the post? Its not even the same genre, i brought up a fighting game
>>723960889
i think a really well executed game in that style with fh's directional block/parry/defense etc could be an immense success
iirc The Surge did something like it but that game kinda blows
Anonymous No.723982335 [Report]
>>723960916
>actual delusional soulskek overrating a roll button and poke in between boss recoveries
this goes both ways dummy
Anonymous No.723982464 [Report]
>>723982215
The second did and that one was great.