Thread 724545030

>tiny attack range
>very slow movement without run, but run has has awkward weight to it that can sometimes fuck you over
>stupidly long turning animation that doesn't need to exist, and only shows up to screw you over 0.001% of the time if you fumble the controls
>full of sidegrades instead of upgrades
>everything about shards
>niggardly hitboxes and attack timings forcing you to get hit if you pogo SLIGHTLY too high or too low
>uncompromising hitboxes demand precision, but the controls lack fluidity and contain a bunch of small awkwardnesses that add up
>lots of enemies and bosses have tiny little slides or bounces at the end of attacks to dishonestly force 2 masks of contact damage, because the devs don't want you to just learn fights, they want you want you to learn the microscopic details of those fights
>too much blocking, backdashing, teleporting
>you have more movement tools than hollow Knight but going fast is just NOT ALLOWED most of the time
>visibility is often garbage
Everything is hyper-balanced to be unfun or weak, but then you have clawline which is extremely overpowered and cheap to use, so why the NO FUN ALLOWED attitude everywhere else?
>finding all fleas gives you... -1 silk skill cost IF you're at full health and IF you waste a blue slot on it
>doing the passing of the age quest and climbing the dumb spike tunnel gives you nothing but a memento and a small epilogue scene that makes the ending WORSE
>lots of hidden rooms that are just shards
>heavy overreliance on breakable walls, hidden passages because TC are obsessed with the player "earning" every shitty bundle of shards and sidegrade they get
>magnetite brooch ONLY collects rosaries
>rosaries get deleted by spikes
>lots of troll hazards designed only to be annoying, not an actual challenge
I had fun with the game, and I'd say it's a 7/10 or 8/10, but it actually baffles me how hard the developers worked to limit the fun and maximize the annoyance.
I think they have a certain kind of autism.

One thing I will say for it though: The needle upgrades felt significant and were helpful.
In Hollow Knight the fully upgraded nail never felt sufficient, and the game seemed to be balanced around the idea that max upgrades + Fragile Strength was the baseline.

>>724545030 (OP)
>stupidly long turning animation that doesn't need to exist, and only shows up to screw you over 0.001% of the time if you fumble the controls
the turning animation does not prevent you from doing anything, it can be animation cancelled
other than the sprint wwhich can be compensated by being good at pressing buttons
>>full of sidegrades instead of upgrades
i thought people wanted this, but it does feel like it tends to more power. architect charge attack and tool spam, shaman with volt filaments and the +40% damage buff to spells, hunter getting stronger..
>tiny little slides or bounces at the end of attacks to dishonestly force 2 masks of contact damage
honestly it would be cool if getting hit by contact damage outside of a blatant attack motion made you get hit and staggered like normal, but without taking the damage, and without getting any iframes so you can be hit afterwards
>>you have more movement tools than hollow Knight but going fast is just NOT ALLOWED most of the time
i liked going around with silkspeed anklets and flea brew
>>finding all fleas gives you... -1 silk skill cost IF you're at full health and IF you waste a blue slot on it
what teh fuck were they thinking
>>doing the passing of the age quest and climbing the dumb spike tunnel gives you nothing but a memento and a small epilogue scene that makes the ending WORSE
did you not play hk1

>>724545030 (OP)
The game feels like it was made specifically for the HK speedrunning autists.
Reminds me of that one psx aliens game, which came out hard as balls, because apparently by the end of development playtesters good so good at it he could finish it with a pistol.

>>724546289
>the turning animation does not prevent you from doing anything, it can be animation cancelled
>other than the sprint wwhich can be compensated by being good at pressing buttons
It's just that it barely ever shows up, and it feels like it only exists to blindside me and make movement unreliable.
>i thought people wanted this, but it does feel like it tends to more power. architect charge attack and tool spam, shaman with volt filaments and the +40% damage buff to spells, hunter getting stronger..
Yeah, it kind of funnels you towards the meme builds. I didn't want to use those, I wanted more setups to be useful.
>honestly it would be cool if getting hit by contact damage outside of a blatant attack motion made you get hit and staggered like normal, but without taking the damage, and without getting any iframes so you can be hit afterwards
This is a good idea. I had no problem with the contact damage IN GENERAL but there were times it was really dumb.
>i liked going around with silkspeed anklets and flea brew
I mean you CAN go fast sometimes, there are just a lot of troll hazards and low visibility trying to make you go slow. But I was also annoyed because a lot of fights that seemed like they would be "go fast" fights actually punished you for doing that, and instead you had to be slow and precise and wait for safe openings.
>did you not play hk1
I got bored at the last boss and never ended up finishing it, so maybe HK did the same.
By the way, thank you for the thoughtful response, it's rare to see a balanced take

>>724546708
>The game feels like it was made specifically for the HK speedrunning autists.
I didn't think that until act 3, but now... well it's hard to say, because it's not HARD, and practically anyone can beat it, but I think it requires a specific type of player to find it consistently fun rather than annoying.

>>724546890
How many gacha games do you play?

>finding all fleas gives you... -1 silk skill cost IF you're at full health and IF you waste a blue slot on it
It's weird because it's almost entirely inferior to Weavelight, which recharges silk faster, lets you recharge 4 bars, works all the time and is much easier to get. If you didn't need to do the flea carnival to get act 3 and the last pale oil it would be completely not worth doing.

>>724547090
>How many gacha games do you play?
None. I played FF Record Keeper for a couple of months like 10 years ago if you'd like to make something of that.

>>724546890
>it's not HARD
>it requires a specific type of player to find it consistently fun rather than annoying
Well put.
A lot of decisions TC feel like they specifically wanted to waste players time.
Like, for example, a boss I would beat in 1-3 tries has a nontrivial platforming challenge before it, so it wears me down and it takes me twice as many tries to beat it.
I dunno, maybe it's me getting old.

>>724545030 (OP)
I took the beast pill for my 100% 30 hour chiev and i'm almost done by 15 hours playing cas 97%

>>724547273
>I dunno, maybe it's me getting old.
Getting older makes you value your time more, but other than that I don't think it's related.
I'll still happily spend hours playing games and overcoming challenges if I don't feel like my time is being wasted by STUPID shit, which happened sometimes in Silksong.

>>724547384
I only understood half of that, but good luck.
I do think I want to replay it with architect spam now that I've beaten it "properly". It should go a lot faster.

>>724547572
He's going after the achievement that requires beating the game to 100% completion and is using the beast crest and he's so efficient at it that he's 97% done playing casually with little effort.

>>724547572
>>724547746
Meant to say 100% completion in 30 hours or less and he's on pace to beat it to 100% completion in almost half that time with the new build.

>>724545030 (OP)
My take exactly (I like the hidden walls though), good game, good atmosphere, good music, but WAY too many needless *fuck you* moments to the player.

>>724547793
Thank you for the translation, anon.

>>724545030 (OP)
I thought it was generally pretty easy and very well balanced around your moveset and abilities. Much better than the first game too.

I just don't see the mind break people get over this games, there were a few bosses that took a couple of tries but it's always just a matter of pattern recognition.

>>724547175
I mean you can and probably will equip both plus volt on Shaman.

Yeah the game has too many game design decision to be annoying. I appreciate the art and the stuff that's in there, but fuck is it painful to get around it all. The times I didn't have fun or was annoyed were more frequent than the times I could calmly enjoy the game.

i shouldnt have to work so hard installing mods to fix their overcooked game

Its by far easier than HK. They simply give you a lot more tools to fuck over enemies, the number one being fast healing for 4 hearts. Now i have no clue how hard they're gonna bend us over in the dlc, so my opinion might change, but the base game is easier
and i honestly like it, i was worried we were getting another godseeker

>>724545030 (OP)
those are all valid criticisms

the game has tons of flaws, I still had fun with it but once I was done with act 3 I never wanted to play it again

>It's not HARD
>You just die a lot
Dishonesty.
>ackhtually I barely died git gud
Supreme dishonesty.

>>724545030 (OP)
filtered

>>724546289
>other than the sprint wwhich can be compensated by being good at pressing buttons
there's definitely an annoyind period of startup once you press the sprint button where you can't cancel it with a jump, I'm not sure I get why it's here it makes movement feels shitter than it needed

team cherry obviously took a lot of inspiration from megaman x for their protags core movement and yet they still can't give their players a satisfying dash jump

>>724545989
That's just mathematically false. The needle and nail upgrades give the same boost to the player in both games but in Silksong every enemy has an innate modifier for how much damage they take from the needle. Thus, the first upgrade in HK is a massive 80% damage boost while the first upgrade in SS isn't that big because the level 2 damage modifier on most enemies is lower.

https://hollowknight.wiki/w/Damage_Values_and_Enemy_Health_(Silksong)#Health_Values_and_Damage_Modifiers

This is why you quickly started one tapping enemies with just one or two upgrades in HK, but in SS enemies remained relatively tanky even with a maxed out needle

I thought it was fun and not that hard. Hardest boss took like 10 attempts for me. I'd call that medium difficulty at most.

>Beast
>flea brew
>flintslate
>cross stitch
yeah, It's Beastly time

>>724553502
>fury Hornet noises
very cute indeed

>>724552728
I died a lot more in Sekiro, and I didn't come away from that feeling like the game was constantly trying to jew me. I often got that feeling from Silksong.
(The shitty camera against the Lone Shadow Longswordsman was aggravating though)

>>724545030 (OP)
this is what happens when you only playtest your game yourself and forget that it should be fun for the players who pick it up for the 1st time and not a gauntlet for tryhards who replay it for the 10th

>>724552856
>they still can't give their players a satisfying dash jump
I like the run a lot more than the dash in Hollow Knight, which was always annoying me with how it couldn't be cancelled and you had to go the EXACT distance
But yeah, the new dash still isn't perfect. I think there's too much of a gap between walking and running. Sometimes you need a quick burst of speed but the dash will take you just a little too far and cause you to take damage

>>724546890
>and practically anyone can beat it,
People were literaly modding the game to make it easier. Majority of players are worse than DSP.

>>724553840
That's funny I feel the complete opposite.

>>724553002
>That's just mathematically false.
Maybe, but are you accounting for enemy health values? Because late game enemies in HK felt a lot tankier to me (without Fragile Strength at least) than Silksong enemies. But maybe it's just a matter of being faster in Silksong, having clawline, etc.
I didn't notice much of a difference from the first needle upgrade, but the later ones felt more than sufficient to deal with enemies quickly, even voided ones for the most part.

>>724554013
>Majority of players are worse than DSP.
I'm consistently surprised that he manages to beat these games. Every time I see him play something he's awful at it
But he's semi-decent at fighting games so maybe that translates to games like Silksong

>>724554086
Different strokes I guess, but I was just trying to illustrate that dying/difficulty isn't the problem, there are other aspects to the design that make it a better or worse experience

The game isn't hard, it's just insanely annoying. If you're on PC, then do yourself a favor and install the bench warp mod, the backtracking is retarded even by metroidvania standards.
The economy is plain fucking bullshit, there's 0 reason as to why 99% of the enemies drop shards only. Faggots always say that converting beads into anal bead strings is a good investment but it's genuinely fucking retarded. I maybe lost around ~300 beads my entire playthrough due to dying twice. I definitely lost a LOT fucking more converting them. The game is so stingy with prices that you're just fucking yourself if you convert them

Bosses are top notch, areas are fucking annoying. Most wishes are dogshit

tldr Hollow Knight is better

>>724554491
>just install savestate mod bros

>>724545030 (OP)
Team Cherry wanted the game to be difficult, but somehow spun that into no fun allowed. Most of the boss fight are great, the actual difficulty of the game is well-balanced, the problem is all of the exhausting bullshit they forced in to make it "grueling and hostile".

One of my favourites is not being able to heal because you dared to use Clawline for traversal, and it drained your full spool silk in 20 seconds. This whole game is a case study of "you shouldn't do that because it's questionable design and will only inconvenience and frustrate players... oh you did it anyway? Huh."

/v/ros
Should I get an 8bitdo pro 3 or an ultimate 2 Wireless for 2D games?
I really wanna play Silksong but not with the crappy Xbox controller

>>724554816
Clawline doesn't deplete silk when you use it on an enemy, retard.

>>724545030 (OP)
All action games feel strangely SHMUP-like as of late.

>>724555354
Traversal, anon. As in, using it as a movement tool, like a long-range dash.

>>724552856
its definitely very satisfying, it just requires good spacing just like the dash attack
that dash jump in silksong does infinitely cooler things in combat than anything you get in mmx

I'm trying to beat Coral Tower, and it's really fucking frustrating having to watch Hornet lie there on the ground for several seconds every time. Like jesus fuck GET UP ALREADY!

>>724555841
made for BWC

>>724545030 (OP)
I fought this guy pretty much last (in act 3) because I forgot about this part of whiteward.

I just face tanked him and beat the shit out of him. I killed him first try and thought there was gonna be a second phase. Why do I see people complain so much about this boss?

>>724545030 (OP)
most of those are intended by the devs though. you can't just pick qualities you dislike, invalidate them, and then say the game is not difficult if not for these "points I don't like".

>>724554167
Im pretty sure health values are used in the mathematical analysis of
>How many hits it takes to kill enemy
You're just wrong here.

>>724556559
a lot of people are bad at the game

>>724545030 (OP)
>it's not hard, except it is

>>724545030 (OP)
>full of sidegrades instead of upgrades
Horizontal progression is superior to vertical, I can already tell you don't like video games and are a brainless automaton so I stopped reading there.

>>724552856
>team cherry obviously took a lot of inspiration from megaman x for their protags core movement and yet they still can't give their players a satisfying dash jump
Yeah, in MMX I would dash jump all the time, but with silksong I never dash jump, since it requires a huge startup for no reason.

>>724555519
But you move slower with it unless you're hitting an enemy. The speedbooster is a way better traversal tool.

>>724554491
>Bosses are top notch
I don't even think that's true

the amount of good bosses is kind of meagre, most of them are sort of shit

>>724547273
There's a reason why fromsoft started putting checkpoints infront of boss arenas.
Dying to a fuckyoudifficult boss 100 times is not as annoying as having to run back to the boss 5 times fron fucking narnia

>>724554683
How is it a savestate mod? All I did was a add a feature that I should have been in the game by default. Hell, even the game somewhat agrees with me since they added something similar in act 3, just a lot shittier
It doesn't make the game easier and in fact actually makes it harder since I miss way more upgrades due to backtracking a lot less. It also doesn't erase a single boss runback since in either case I would be starting from a bench

>>724555569
>it just requires good spacing
that doesn't mean anything I wasn't talking about combat in the first place

having to arbitrarily wait for a set number of frames before you can cancel your dash with a jump doesn't bring anything to your movement besides gutting the fluidity

I know you're probably going to come back with a variant of le git gud so I'll just tell you to dilate in advance

I don't know what the fanboys are coping, but you can absolutely tell they very specifically made sure a lot of your moveset is annoying to use
>hunter pogo stops way too soon for no reason other than to make it slightly more annoying to use
>beast pogo has a long as fuck startup for no reason other than to make it slightly more annoying o use
>dash has a delay before you can use it to jump for no reason other than to make it slightly more annoying to use
>all the good move tools use silk for no reason other than to make it slightly more annoying to use
>tools have two different ammo limits for no reason other than to make it slightly more annoying to use
The result:
>everyone uses the wanderer crest, with one or two autists using beast.
>everyone uses the tools to just delete bosses with some autists who just don't use tools at all because of how easy they delete bosses

>>724545030 (OP)
>>tiny attack range
Reaper, Longclaw, Clawline, and Pale Nails fix this. I'd chalk this up to a progression thing, but it does get kinda annoying with all the flying enemies in gauntlets. I might try switching to Reaper with Longclaw and see how it fares.
>>very slow movement without run, but run has has awkward weight to it that can sometimes fuck you over
Didn't have much of a problem with this, but I suppose there are times when Hornet feels very heavy and hard to get off the ground when dashing. Is that what you mean?
>>stupidly long turning animation that doesn't need to exist, and only shows up to screw you over 0.001% of the time if you fumble the controls
This was awful when trying to fight First Sinner without relying on Clawline, but isn't this a nitpick? IIRC you can dash out of the turning animation.
>>full of sidegrades instead of upgrades
Hate how they made sure to over-nerf Shaman Crest and the flea egg at the end of the game.
>>everything about shards
Ugh yes.

Comment was too long to quote.

Is there any reason as to why the beast pogo has that long start-up before you do damage?
It's literally the only time I've seen a spin-jump in a game be so bad.

>>724557920
It's there for us Beast Gods.

>>724556559
It's an AGONIZINGLY slow fight. The thing hides underground and spends half the fight unhittable, only pops up to run across the arena or shoot stuff at you, is only vulnerable for a fw seconds, and has long periods where you're doing nothing but dodging spears.

The runback with the elevator is annoying, the fight drags on, the whole thing is just a huge grind on your patience. It has a lot of health, deals 2 mask damage and has awful telegraphs on its attacks, so it's way too easy to misjudge and get rammed by it. That plus it's well hidden and gates a silk heart. The whole thing is just exhausting design, and the complete opposite of Team Cherry's usual high quality boss designs. It's not a duel, it's not a fast-paced dance where your opponent can be damaged at any time if you're good at ducking and weaving. It's a SLOG.

>>724558206
That doesn't answer the reasoning as to why they felt the need to nerf a spin jump.

>>724557642
I mean, the real answer for most of these is that Team Cherry demands precision and doesn't want to make your base moveset too easy to use. You're supposed to get a feel for the Hunter pogo so you learn to ALWAYS use it at the correct height. You're suppposed to manage your resources constantly, etc.

I get the idea behind it, but man does it get taxing having to always be running at 100% while playing.

ngl i thought the game was fair and not annoying or punishing and i unironically think this board is full of 'mad because bad's.

>>724558434
i'm a beast god

>>724558623
>demands precision
It's one thing to demand precision, it's another to purposefully nerf your movement so it ends up being annoying to use and also look bad.
The result of their weird nerfs is that no one uses hunter's crest for traversal, and no one does dash jumps unless they are forced to do so.

>>724558848
I don't care about your furry tendencies, I'm talking about the specific move in this video game.

>>724545989
>get to the citadel and the deathly ill, dying worker bugs take 4-5 hits again.

>>724559058
A long range dive kick like in smash would have been neat, but I think it was kept short because that "wouldn't fit what a pogo is supposed to be".

There's a lot of that in Silksong. Loads of stuff that could have been really awesome if the devs had designed it all to be easier.

>>724559058
>nerf
>nerf
>nerf

>>724559358
>take standard movement tool that exists in billion other games
>make it worse
Sounds like a nerf to me

As a trve Steel Heart chad, I can tell you it's not worth to learn any crest other than Hunter. Thank you

>>724552425
Not even remotely. Silksong starts off the bat with two damage enemies and the first mask is wayyyyyy into the game.

>>724559614
What makes it the best? I figured Wanderer or Archi would be best to do more damage.

>>724559713
The first mask can be obtained before even fighting Sister Splinter
>First part in Far Fields
>Second part in Shellwood
>Third part before the Wormways door
>Fourth part bought from the Bone Bottom store

>>724545030 (OP)
Not what that word means.

>>724546708
This, I did not care for SS.

>>724560010
>Wanderer
Garbage tool slots and range, only redeeming quality is the DPS, but when you're up shit creek you don't need more DPS, you need better ways to survive and Wanderer won't save you
>Architect
Fun but unsustainable for an entire playthrough given the sheer number of shards needed

>>724560171
>spamming porn images
Where?

>>724553002
HK was actually much worse about this, in HK every boss's HP was scaled to your nail level so it would take the same amount of hits to kill it, but the spell damage is unaffected by the nail level so it would mean your spells deal less damage as you upgrade the nail. Hence all the speedruns just skipping nail upgrades and spamming spells instead cause it's the most optimal.

>>724557663
>3 late game items fix this
Oh gee thanks

>>724560253
Uhhhhhh >>724558223

>>724560215
>Didn't play Hollow Knight
Quick Slash was the most broken thing in the first game, and that's still true in Silksong. Wanderer offers FAR more than just "more DPS".

>>724555271
I used a Pro for Silksong and it was good. >>724555841
Coral Tower is where I dropped the game. >>724559225
Don't forget getting to act 3 and finding those very same enemies have at least twice as much health now.

>>724560109
>I looked this fact up to make a point
Nobody found their first mask till half way through if not finishing act 1. I still dont even have half of the second mask and im running around the citadel.

>>724560496
>Spamming
where?

>>724560710
I didn't look it up, I just failed too many SS run in act 2

>>724560496
> 1 image
> spam.

>>724545030 (OP)
it's not hard but it is filled with nigger bait to make hard headed people get themselves into sticky situations. there's a reason the two guys who made it keep saying with a wink and a nudge
>if you find something too difficult we encourage exploring
>then they laugh in australian
they pretty clearly are australian shitposters of this website. each post here and anywhere else on the internet is just further proof they can keep doing this stuff more and more in the next game. outside of gauntlets and bosses where the door locks behind you you can literally at any point simply walk away from something that's too bullshit at that moment. the game was designed very well about player agency where you can decide up until the very last second of committing to something to not commit and do something else and when you keep that in mind the game is pretty simple. t. just delivered all the food and I think I have to fight lace for credits to roll or I have no idea what's left.

now I need someone to post that steam review where the guy is saying that it should have had ero scenes in it
>fragile hyper sensitive woman takes so much damage from coming into contact with anything
>constantly making erotic groans and moans
>naked NTR segment
it was hilarious and I thought I saved it but I didn't and I need it now more than ever

buy an ad, subversive kike shill

>>724561849
>no u

>>724561743
that doesn't make much sense because the OP's point is that even exploring is needlessly a pain in the ass

you're right about them being australian 4chan shitposters though, playing the game sometimes felt like trying to have an earnest conversation in this shithole and being met with blatant lies to farm (You)s

>>724545030 (OP)
I don't think that's what niggardly means, anon.
For example, a niggardly hitbox would be a small hitbox, particularly on your own attacks. It makes little sense to describe an enemy's hitbox as niggardly.
You could call their hurtbox niggardly, if it was particularly small for no good reason however.
Regardless, the word wouldn't really be my first choice for describing these sorts of things.

It is also etymologically unrelated to "nigger", which surely is what you were aiming for.

>>724562184
>you're right about them being australian 4chan shitposters though, playing the game sometimes felt like trying to have an earnest conversation in this shithole and being met with blatant lies to farm (You)s
at least you get it now. I never found exploring that bad. the only hard stops I ever faced just needed a full night's sleep before one and done'an a boss that I kept fumbling

>>724545030 (OP)
>I had fun with the game, and I'd say it's a 7/10 or 8/10, but it actually baffles me how hard the developers worked to limit the fun and maximize the annoyance.
Consciously you think this, but subconsciously your brain translates the annoyance as challenge and increased the dopamine when you overcome the challenge, meaning the annoyance results in objectively higher amounts of fun in your brain chemistry.

>>724562341
All this discourse just reminds me of Dark Souls when it dropped and went mainstream. Casuals are coming to grips with their first hard 2D game.

>>724560638
But the pro only has 250 Hz polling rate and bad latency compared to the ultimate 2

>>724545030 (OP)
Well I liked it and found it's a worth sequel. Making it difficult instead of a baby game was a nice idea too, people are still talking about the game a month 2 months later because of that and many are still playing it.
>ah but unfair difficulty
Eh I didn't feel it. Only part about your post I agree on is the dash having this weird delay before you can jump, it's like they committed too much to how it feels instead of making it video-gamey, everything else counts for HK as well or feels in nature with how HK did it.

>>724561743
>just go somehwere else!
but you never actually get stronger in this game. This isn't elden ring where you can just go grind. Lets say you're getting pissed at the flying enemies in that one area before the judge boss. Or stuck at that boss.
You go and explore every single other place and come back, nothing will have changed that makes Hornet better at killing those enemies or the boss itself. I beat the judge as soon as I could, entered the next act, then returned to explore everything possible. Nothing changed between how I was than how I ended up, despite missing 2 and a half areas.

>>724562341
>as challenge and increased the dopamine when you overcome the challenge
That's wrong because I had more fun with HK and HK was easier. Never did the super special challenge at the end of HK btw, so I'm only comparing the main game.

I 100%ed the game and wouldn't recommend it to anyone.

>>724557268
>let's mod Lordvessel on sl1 and ruin the game for myself
Oh, you're one of those

>>724561849
What kind of mental illness construes this as some kind of woke/jewish propaganda?

“Nobody lives as long as me so I don’t want to try to form a meaningful relationship and lose them.”

>WTF IS THIS WOKE SHIT!?

>>724560171
You were never the target audience, dude. If you were they wouldn't be putting silksong teaser behind PoH. This is how it feels to be gatekept. Remember that or cry about it

>>724565619
b-but the bug woman should have fucked me!

>>724565092
apparently there's sperg fromdrone who seems convinced that if you don't get le ebin sense of accumplishment about beating hard bosses in these games you have an issue with your dopamine receptors

very bizarre but I should be used to retarded opinions from this fanbase

>>724567467
This is unironically correct, lack of properly functioning dopamine receptors is a symptom of clinical depression. If you don't experience the normal emotions of frustration followed by enjoyment when playing hard games like Silksong, it means you need to talk to a psychiatrist.

>>724568375
Except that Hollow knight was more fun and it was easier.

>>724568850
It's been 8 years, that's more than enough time for your brain chemistry to be corrupted. You should get it checked out, stuff like that can ruin your life.

>>724568964
Except that I played hollow knight right before silksong, because I only heard about hollow knight due to all the silkshong shilling.

>>724569069
furthermore, I'm still enjoying other games, including ninja gaiden (I'm going through the entire series before getting to the newest one) which is way harder, digimon story (which is easy as fuck), and I play roguelikes like tome4 all the time.
Your theory is fucking retarded dude, shut up about it.

>>724565619
any mention of sex drives la creatura into a tendie-tossing rage due to their autism and virginity. strangely, so does a lack of sex, resulting in the average half-literate midwestern mutt being a pathetic, dopamine-depleted wretch.

>>724569069
>>724569237
Responding to yourself can be an early symptom of schizoid personality disorder, that's another thing you should check up on with your psychiatrist when you get your depression symptoms checked out.

>>724569376
>Responding to yourself
Do you not know what "furthermore" means? Did you think I was attempting to samefag instead of just making a continuation of the post you fucking retard?
Way to ignore the argument to attempt an epic gotcha that you utterly failed at.

>>724569569
You seem to have anger management issues anon, altogether it's pretty obvious you're a jumbled mess in your head. I hope you're able to get that all treated properly, but you need to admit you have a problem first before it can be dealt with.

>>724545030 (OP)
Ah, I did wonder who we'd complain about today. I'd say Nyleth or Seth tomorrow.

>>724565171
>he didn't even 131%

>>724569740
Nyleth is too obvious, literally nobody seriously complains about it except to make bait threads.

>>724569730
>lose argument
>begins spouting "u mad" as a cope
Unc got blown the fuck out and now xe's going to spend the rest of the thread never addressing a single argument and just desperately attempting lame passive-aggressive xitter-style "clapbacks".

I like it when games try to trick me.
I love it when areas pile on ridiculously one-sided trials against you.
The Mist is my favourite area. The Mist is my most feared area. I loved and hated all of it. The near-invisible traps falling from above or the completely invisible spikes that you have half a second to react to. The falling platforms. The teleporting to the very start of the area if you fall once. The enemies who will never stop pursuing you if you don't manage to reach a screen exit, and when they catch you they stun you, steal your silk and do two damages. And on top of that, they respawn constantly on the outside of your screen. It's great and horrible and I never want to go there but it's always an highlight of my playthrough. I hope they keep doing that shit in the DLC.

>>724570054
This is an English language website, please refrain from typing in non-English languages from now on, thank you.

>>724570327
>The enemies who will never stop pursuing you if you don't manage to reach a screen exit, and when they catch you they stun you, steal your silk and do two damages. And on top of that, they respawn constantly on the outside of your screen.
Got less scary when I realized I can just pogo them until they go away.

>>724570372
Nice clapback, sister! You show that chud!

>>724547090
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxyL3Ymbwn4

>>724568375
>ummmm go to therapy sweatie
lmao

a caricature of themselves

I find the graphics of this game very unappealing! Basically just a tick above Salt and Sanctuary. Imagine if a true artist had a go at this. It would be incredible!

>>724570327
Is that the guy whose name means "fuck" (as in s*x) in sweden, country of the gays?

>>724545030 (OP)
>>724565171
I agree with this.
This game has so much good in it, yet on almost every turn devs make conscious decision to taint what's good and fuck with the player.

I'm so glad these types of games do not have a difficulty slider because it makes me feel better about not being as bad as games as I thought. I don't consider myself good at games but every boss took me less than ~30 minutes (including runback) besides Karmelita (which I ended up niggering using Beast Crest). Are people just bad at games or do they just lack the patience?

>>724574179
For me, I'm patient and diligent. I don't give up easily and I'm willing to keep chipping away at a boss until I overcome it. ...but I'm also very accident-prone and make a lot of dumb mistakes. Games like this make me feel like a blundering retard with how many mistakes I make. I'll beat a boss eventually, but only after screwing up the timing on a pogo and falling on it, dodging an attack the wrong way, stumbling into the boss, etc.

>>724557401
>now you can instantly dash jump out of any tiny platform without any extra space to sprint
>now you can dash jump towards any enemy from anywhere
giving player more isnt for the sake of it, youre gonna be making the game around different qualities. if you just slapped being able to instantly dash jump from anywhere it would obviously be silly

also why are reddit spacers always so gay?

>>724576359
>>now you can instantly dash jump out of any tiny platform without any extra space to sprint
yes that'd have been better, thanks for the worthless post you quintuple nigger

>>724576359
>if you just slapped being able to instantly dash jump from anywhere
That is literally how megaman x and zero works (you can even dash jump from the wall grab) and those games play just fine. Nothing in silksong is as hard as the spike section from the end of X8 too (an otherwise meh game)

There were only two really annoying parts for me.
>courier's rash delivery, which I probably did before I was intended to because I realized that if I had double jump I'd cut off a good minute off my route at least
>flea minigames, namely flea juggle because of how much you need to manage where you send the fleas (bounce was really easy, dodge was so-so)
Both of which are needed for maxing out the needle, so they aren't really optional.

>>724576825
>900s of cool platforming challenges just became blander because they werent made around it
well done
>>724577697
yeah they play fine but its almost like you can make different games for different appeals
clearly seems like people liked this one thing much more than mmx so maybe theres a possibility mmx isnt strictly better

god its a good thing you guys arent the ones making videogames or else they would suck

>>724545030 (OP)
>tiny attack range
Those games always takes time to get used to.

>>724580225
>making the movement feel worse is good because sales = quality!
Fanboys really have no brains

>>724580341
Yes but it's really annoying all the way through, i'm going to use hyperbole but
>Everything outranges you
>Everything multi hits
>Everything flies just outside your range or flies closer to you so you take contact damage mid animation
Its infuriating

>>724545030 (OP)
Having clocked like 160 hours into this game over 2 100% runs + steel soul and a lot of screwing around, I can safety say I believe contact damage outside of attack animations should always be only 1 mask regardless of enemy size, and especially if the enemy is stunned. Yes, it would make wanderer even more broken but it's a single player game, who gives a flying fuck. They shouldn't have nerfed anything. Good thing i'm done with the game now that thread storm is useless. TC are making the same mistake the darkest dungeon devs did, thinking they have to make the game an annoying grind and remove every viable tool for some reason.

>>724580225
>900s of cool platforming challenges just became blander because they werent made around it
are you legitimately brain damaged

they'd obviously have designed the game to accomodate a dash jump with less startup frames, what are you even trying to say here

plus most of the fun platforming sections in silksong don't even have much use for a dash jump currently, like mount fay, cogwork core or the surface

also here's

more

reddit

spacing for you

to

cry

about faggot

>>724562193
Actually, it works if you are talking about generosity or grace granted to the player.

>>724562341
Not me. I beat the bosses in these games out of spite. I have never felt a moment of satisfaction or accomplishment beating a hard boss. I know the boss can be beaten, it is designed to be beaten, so there is no satisfaction or accomplishment. I do it to prove I can and that I won't be put off, but there is no satisfaction in it, just the grim "Fuck you," that comes from proving the developers weren't as clever as they think they were in breaking players. I derive fun out of exploring in games and seeing the level design, and it is shit in SS.

>>724565619
This is what happens when puritanism in the West is reignited by Muslim propaganda.

>>724556559
I actually found the fight quite fun, I just needed a screenshot for the post, and he's a good example of enemies having unintuitive bounces/slides on the end of their attacks to try to force you take contact damage when you to attack.
Plus I always thought he looked fucking goofy

>>724556817
But I'm not talking about those qualities in relation to difficulty, I'm saying they demonstrate a pattern of stinginess and unfun-ness. They cause a little extra damage here and there but I don't think they make the game difficult exactly, just frustrating

>>724556943
>it's not hard, except it is
Not particularly. I'm not saying I didn't have trouble in parts, but I've played harder games that I thought were also better games.
A lot of the things I mentioned don't even have anything to do with difficulty, but I get the feeling you didn't really read the post.

The only fight that really made me mad was the beastfly due to the constant random adds.
Every other fight didn't have a billion adds so I didn't rage.

I HATE BILEWATER
I HATE BILEWATER
I HATE BILEWATER

>>724556964
>Horizontal progression is superior to vertical
No, it's just different. SIlksong has too much of it for the genre, especially since most of the sidegrades don't make all that much difference to the way you play. A lot of the tools do fuckall. Crests are more significant, but often end up feeling incomplete.

>>724557257
>Dying to a fuckyoudifficult boss 100 times is not as annoying as having to run back to the boss 5 times fron fucking narnia
I don't mind (most) runbacks so much since I'm actually playing, but having to wait for 10+ seconds of obnoxious shit like a boss introducing itself, that's annoying. Especially since their roars freeze you in place, cancel your charges, etc

>>724586942
>A lot of the tools do fuckall.
Damn I guess everyone who said the Architect Crest is overpowered and is only outclassed by Wanderers was wrong

>>724557642
There's also a weird couple of dead frames after using the reaper pogo, where the game won't accept inputs and it can fuck you up if you're too fast. I also found my jumps getting dropped if I pressed the button too soon during a parry/deflect animation
There's a lot of small shit like that that makes it feel bad to play. With most developers I'd say it's an oversight, but I'm convinced Team Cherry does that shit on purpose, and it's annoying

>>724586765
I hate bilewater becuase the idea of hornet having her core violated by maggots makes me too aroused to play well.

>>724587054
yes this

the runbacks with actual platforming like groal don't akshually bother me that much, but having to play the memory song every single time you lose in the coral tower and then having to charge the superjump to go back on top of it was insufferable

total waste of time

>>724557663
>Reaper, Longclaw, Clawline, and Pale Nails fix this.
I used reaper most of the time, but when I did use hunter or wanderer the enemies bumblefucking into you to deal contact damage became really annoying
>but I suppose there are times when Hornet feels very heavy and hard to get off the ground when dashing. Is that what you mean?
That and the wind up on a lot of running attacks, minimum dash distance (even if it's short). It felt kind of inconsistent because some moves are much more responsive than others.
>but isn't this a nitpick? IIRC you can dash out of the turning animation.
You could say it's a nitpick, but I don't think it should be in the game. The only reason it's there is to make movement more awkward, and it honestly feels like they're just trying to add unnecessary input complexity for the sake of it. Anyway, even if you can dash out of it, by the time you realize she's doing it the damage is often already done (literally)

>>724560113
>Not what that word means.
If you're talking about "niggardly", I think it's fair to call Silksong stingy

>>724557257
Fromsoft jumped the shark in terms of "memorize these attack patterns" style bosses and it's too late to go back on that type of design because their fans expect it now. Stakes of Marika were a necessary concession to make the headbashing process not be 50% of the game's runtime.
Silksong is nowhere near that level of attrition in its boss difficulty or its runbacks, especially with how many tools and options and lifelines it gives the player.

>>724588182
that's the complete opposite

elden ring and from games in general have far more options to completely trivialize difficulty and cheese bosses, silksong is extremely limited in comparison

>>724562341
>Consciously you think this, but subconsciously your brain translates the annoyance as challenge and increased the dopamine when you overcome the challenge, meaning the annoyance results in objectively higher amounts of fun in your brain chemistry.
It's fun to overcome challenges, but sometimes it just pissed me off too much to feel any real sense of reward from it.

>>724569740
I wasn't actually complaining about this boss though, just using it as an illustrative screenshot.
Seth was a pain in the ass but Nyleth was fine

>>724564984
That's my issue with it. Masks might as well not exist with how few and far between they are, and silk hearts are completely pointless. At best you might find a crest or a tool, but there's a good chance you won't use the former and the latter is crippled by the shard system being dogshit, assuming the tool you find is even any good

>>724562341
Consciously I think this, and then when I think it all I feel is "well I did it" with zero sense of satisfaction. Pantheon of Hallownest made me feel the same way

>>724579534
>courier's rash delivery
They put the little wall just outside of camera range in the Grand Bellway travel station SPECIFICALLY so you would smack into it before it's even onscreen and damage the goods
THAT'S the sort of shit I'm talking about with this game

>>724565171
I would recommend that most people put the game down at the bad ending in Act 2. The steps to unlock Act 3 and Act 3 itself suck, and quitting early turns a long slog into a tighter experience

>>724586745
>The only fight that really made me mad was the beastfly due to the constant random adds.
The second beastfly fight has worse adds, and he can fly offscreen so you have much less time to react to him
That was pretty annoying

>>724589050
I deleted it with tools, fuck that shit.

>>724588862
>metroidvania inspired by classic games is full of asshole moments
oh no! better cancel these pieces of shit how dare they not respect my time

>>724587090
>Damn I guess everyone who said the Architect Crest is overpowered and is only outclassed by Wanderers was wrong
I was referring to the blue and yellow tools, but I don't blame for you for thinking I was referring to the throwable shit. It's weird that they're all called tools.
And yes there are obviously some useful blue tools, but a lot of stuff only makes a small difference. I think if you're going to have a game full of sidegrades, they should at least have more impact.

>>724589182
Name one asshole moment in metroid.

>>724588302
Sure, but that's what you'd expect from an action RPG vs. an action platformer. And their respective boss difficulties are tuned to compensate for that. If "cheesing" were the default playstyle, you wouldn't need the pre-boss checkpoints in the first place.
>>724589182
Yeah, I think the "retro" difficulty design is what's making people assume the game is fucking with them on purpose. I hate to imagine what the reaction would be if the Classicvanias or Ninja Gaiden were to come out nowadays.

>>724588753
>Masks might as well not exist
I know it's the last boss and all, but Last Lace doing 2 damage with EVERY ATTACK was really annoying. Especially since a lot of that comes out really fast, and sometimes she'd hide her attack windup behind void buzzsaws, teleport into you, do that single tendril pillar that's always really hard to see...

>>724589182
There's no excuse for putting an off-camera wall there just so the player will sprint into it and have to redo the whole annoying mission. It was the worst troll in the game for me, moreso than the fake benches.
And the player WILL sprint into it because of the time limit. It's 100% intentional.

>>724555569
>that dash jump in silksong does infinitely cooler things in combat than anything you get in mmx
Name them, and use examples of where this can't happen in Mega Man X if for no other reason than to prove you've played it

>>724589242
>boss doors start retaliating after you get comfortable with the first one
>crocmire jumpscare
>needing to trial and error the doors you can go into before you get the varia suit
>it's faster to just say every boss fight rather than name them one by one
>especially ridley and mother brain
>the literally unavoidable damage at mother brain before you get the murder beam
>the fucking maridia tunnel
>every single platform that crumbles when you step on it
>that one asshole chozo statue
And this is just going off my memory from a game I haven't played in years. And instead of whining for devs to make the game easier we just accepted everything as part of the challenge back then.

>>724589529
Lost Lace*
But I'm also glad it was the last Lace fight, because she annoys me as a character

>>724589772
NTA but none of these are asshole moments. The developers didn't go out of their way to troll the player like Team Cherry

>>724589529
As annoying as it was, in HK when shit does double damage you know it's serious. Early on it's just explosions but the the hardest bosses do it too (which kind of negates the health upgrades you got over the course of the game but whatever). In Silksong basically everything does double damage right from the start. It's just an annoyance to deal with because it's a sloppy way to "balance" the changes they made to healing

>>724588862
I don't remember this one

do you even go through grand bellway when you deliver the bug bacon?

>>724589703
The excuse is the entire point of the quest being memorizing the path so you can do it within the alloted time. There's no way a single person did it on their first try no matter how good they are at the game.

>>724589772
>crocmire jumpscare
Are you gonna sit here and tell me you died to Crocomire?

>>724589925
>do you even go through grand bellway when you deliver the bug bacon?
You don't have to, but I went through Sinner's Road > Exhaust Organ because I was most comfortable with that route.
I tried to go through bilewater a few times, which was fucking stupid

>>724589182
classic games were hard but they weren't designed like that, honestly at some point silksong almost feels like i wanna be the boshy bullshit

>>724589902
>the developers didn't go out of the way to make platforms crumble and immediately reform, locking you out of whatever was on the route beyond them, forcing you to go back so you can try it again
Dude what the fuck that's literally the worst kind of asshole move, there isn't even any indicationg that they'll crumble or way to react.

>>724590082
ah ok makes sense, I did the blasted steps route

>>724589961
>The excuse is the entire point of the quest being memorizing the path so you can do it within the alloted time. There's no way a single person did it on their first try no matter how good they are at the game.
First try or not, if you get to the citadel without taking much damage, you have a good chance of making it to the chef dude. If you're running (and you will be) there is literally no way to see the wall before you smack into it and it can absolutely ruin a run that was going to succeed. Expecting the player to remember a wall they had no reason to contextualize as a trap before to before is shitty design.

>>724589979
The jumpscare, not the fight (which can also be a bit of a dick if you mistime too many missiles).

>>724589902
The giga ray beam from mother brain before you get the murder beam was pretty assholish actually.

>>724590314
What jumpscare? The skeleton at the end? Because at the start of the fight he's just standing there

>>724590173
Okay, the crumbling platforms are a mild example, but none of the other shit counts. It's not full of it like Silksong, and it's also a much more forgiving game so it doesn't impact you as much

I like silksong

>>724590291
>if you get to the citadel without taking much damage, you have a good chance of making it to the chef dude
lmao, that's only where you need to start paying attention to your platforming and routing if you didn't do the easy way of starting from the end and killing every enemy.

>>724589902
It's funny how this ultimately comes down to player psychology, where you're inclined to read intentionality behind Team Cherry's design choices because it's a modern game, whereas similar moments in retro games are "just how they did difficulty back then."
>>724590097
>boshy
This is a revealing comment as well. Players have become paranoid because "troll games" are definitely a thing. The determining factor in whether the player is being trolled seems to be whether you enjoyed it or not, or could theoretically have completed it on the first try, both of which are individual to each player.

>>724546708
>The game feels like it was made specifically for the HK speedrunning autists.
I just smashed my face through most challenges though and sadly won most of the time before even learning the challenge.
I genuinely had an easier time with Silksong than I've got with Hollow Knight, before or after Silksong. Even now, afterwards, I still find Hollow Knight more difficult.
The healing is super good in Silksong. Makes the game a lot more forgiving than Hollow Knight.

>>724590443
>The giga ray beam from mother brain before you get the murder beam was pretty assholish actually.
Doesn't it always stop short of killing you?

>>724590530
>Gives example
>NOOOOO THAT DOESN'T COUNT!!!!
Filtered faggots can't accept the truth, how surprising...

>>724590586
>if you didn't do the easy way of starting from the end and killing every enemy.
I didn't even think of this. That's clever.
>the webm
HAHAHAHA

>>724590653
Yes. The whole point is to get your health low for the finale sequence with The Baby

>>724590097
>comparing a skill-based platformer where you can learn and react to everything to an entire series of trial and error memorizing bullshit
Now I remember defending Super Meat Boy from people who insisted it was the same thing as IWBTG. What the fuck

>>724590653
Nope. It drains 3 full tanks. Won’t really matter that much if you got all the tanks in the game, still really mean though since it is unavoidable and a player would just have to keep fighting her until they had four tanks left.

>>724590615
I'm inclined to read intentionality behind Team Cherry's design choices because the whole game is like that, and they constantly communicate that intention to the player. They were clearly inspired by Dark Souls' reputation and had an autistic fixation on building their own game that way.

>>724590173
Unironically give me an example of this scenario, because I can't think of any. Usually crumbling blocks exist as a way to let you leave a an area where an item was, or to signify you need to come back with speedbooster

>>724590653
It's actually a famous run killer for minimalist runs, you need to get exactly enough health to survive it and do the whole fight perfectly or else you're done.

>>724590731
I literally said that example does count, but that it's a mild one.

>>724590965
>>724590824
Okay, it's kind of bullshit if it can unavoidably kill you. I'll concede that one.

>>724590960
I obviously can't remember everything but one that stuck with me is the area close to where you start, you need to find a way to go into a door high up and there's a bunch of crumbling blocks right in front of an energy tank. Hit them and you have to redo the whole section.

No but seriously, isn't it strange how combat game design is just 1 hit deaths and needing to avoid complicated attack patterns for hours at a time? It's either that or RPG numberslop, there's literally nothing inbetween and it's been like that since the dawn of video games. Where are the novel ideas?

>>724591454
>Where are the novel ideas?
There's definitely a problem with 99% of games just being imitative now.

>>724591454
There are a lot of games where you can get 5/6 shot without healing taken into account on the harder modes, with exceptions given to the truly powerful fights. Even in Ninja Gaiden 2, the game /v/ sucks off the most, you can survive a surprising amount of hits from enemies and bosses on Master Ninja. In Silksong, the game feels less punishing later on since you can get a bunch of masks and healing in this game is pretty easy compared to the hardest fights from Hollow Knight 1.

>>724591880
>and healing in this game is pretty easy compared to the hardest fights from Hollow Knight 1.
Yeah, being able to heal in the air and heal 3/4 masks at once makes it much easier.
I still hate how you lose ALL your silk if you get hit though. I don't think it needed that.

Just wait until the content updates add bosses that input-read and throw an omnidirectional projectile when you try to heal.

>>724545030 (OP)
Stick with bingtendo faggot. they'll you'll get a banana behind every wall.

>they'll you'll get
GOOD MORNING SAR

Okay, I'm getting hang of this beast's pogo now. It's basically a cooler jump attack. Any tool(any color) should I be using other than flintslate/flea brew?

>>724592553
I meant to type 'then'. Autocompletion fuck up, I guess. I swear I'm not a jeet. Bingtendo gives you a momentous 'reward' behind every wall and 'secret' room.

By far the best boss in the series. It feels criminal that she's stuck in the otherwise mediocre Act 3

>>724590443
The Mother Brain fight is a glorified cutscene, how did you die to that?

>>724589772
Lmao none of those are asshole moments besides the Crocomire jumpscare which can't even hurt you
>Muh Maridia tube
The game literally tells you that you can break it 2 rooms over, how do people get filtered by this?

>>724589961
>There's no way a single person did it on their first try no matter how good they are at the game.
I did because I waited until it was the last thing to do, and took the Blasted Steps route. The timer is extremely generous when you have the anklets and flea water, and having clawline and double jump makes it easy to avoid damage. I think I got hit once in the Choral Chambers, got lost a bit because I didn't have the compass on so I needed to remember which side room led to the dining room, smacked a door at the end, and still finished with plenty of time to spare.
The biggest source of difficulty in anything in this game is people being impatient and wanting to finish everything the moment they first get to it.

>>724588612
>Seth was a pain
How? Literally just don't hit him when his shield is up. Karmelita and the Coral Tower gauntlets were both far harder

I can't imagine even bothering with Steel Soul. Without a Godhome to practice, I know I'll die to some rando boss a few hours into it.

>>724594686
You practice by doing the same route on a normal save file in parallel.

I'm really not good at the game, like 70 hours and still on Act 2. But most of my wasted time comes from exploring, I didn't really think spots people gush about like the High Halls gauntlet were that hard. I reached the end like on the second try because I was already used to using clawline, pogo and thread storm to deal with flyers. Then it took me a few more tries of being stuck on the two big guys at the end, until I just spammed poisoned tacks at them.

Same with Bilewater and Groal. Really not that hard. But I already had the the tool that prevents maggot infestation.

>>724588862
Yeah motherfuck this. I began to feel everything was designed this way, they can't fucking relax with the potentially annoying shit for a second.

>>724595005
>70 hour in act 2
LMAO. And I thought I was bad taking 74 to clear act 3 100%.

If you didn't deliver the rasher up through Wisp Thicket then you did not beat the game.

>>724595005
Thinking you're not good at the game by itself makes you better at the game than most of the people who do think they're good at the game.

>>724595005
Exactly. High halls gauntlet was a joke. How are people claiming anything in this game is as hard as the DLC in Hollow Knight? They're out of their goddamn minds.

>>724595252
Didn't even know wisp thicket let anywhere. Thought it was a dead end.

>>724595417
It leads to the Underworks, with a flea in that area.

Would a Silksong Pantheon with no tools be harder than the HK one with no charms?

>>724595417
it's behind a breakable wall in a secret area
they had the politeness of adding a flea so the flea map gives a hint

>>724595350
Karmelita and Lost Lace are harder than any non-godhome DLC.

>>724595515
Nah, HK is more reliant on charms, while SS splits them between tools and crests.

its not hard but too punishing

I'm playing through the game a second time, and shards are pretty much the only thing that still feels like ass to play around even when you know exactly what you're doing at all times. Two damage out the ass? Meh, I'm not really getting hit anymore. Silk/heal economy? Meh, I'm not really getting hit anymore. Diagonal pogo? I'm used to it, but it is still cringe for platforming. Flying enemies? I know how to kill them. But shards? Still feels like ass to see how fast you go into debt even by just using them for fun to kill things around the environment, not even getting into blowing the tools when you're in trouble. In the running for the all time most overtuned mechanic ever.

>>724596214
If the magnet worked on shards and resources didn't get destroyed with hazards then that would be enough. The main issue with shards is they scatter so much that you lose most of them, whether it's from enemies or caches.

>>724545030 (OP)
Beat the high halls gauntlet and uninstalled. Took them 7 years to come up with gauntlets and bosses with ads? Lmao.

>>724596352
Maybe. I just did Chapel of the Reaper and Moorwing and blew like 80 shards between them because I wanted to get them done first try, and my first thought was "damn imagine if I had actually died here and used those shards for nothing, I would be so fucking pissed." I'm gonna be in financial shambles for a really long time after that, because up next is Shellwood where there's a lot of flying cunts who are just begging for sting shards and triple pins. Game definitely feels balanced around your NG+ run instead of your NG run and even then it feels overtuned. I guess that's what meme quotes like this >>724595889 boil down to.

>>724596214
counterpoint: buy a shard bundle.

>>724597000
Counterpoint: that changes nothing about the system being bullshit

>>724596874
Well for Moorwing specifically you have the options of recruiting Garmond, moving the fleas, or using a key to get to Shellwood the other way.

>>724597319
Garmond does negligible damage by design, he's mostly there for the fun factor, and I don't want to skip the fight.

>>724597372
You never skip Moorwing completely, because he's outside the bellway in act 2 instead.

>>724597253
Not on my machine. manage them better, shrimple as that

>>724595005
I'm on my second run through the game. I thought I'd try for the 5 hour speedrun. It took me 6 hours to clear act 1. Just can't just ignore most of the game, I MUST go everywhere and poke at everything until I know everything by heart. Unfortunately this means I'll probably never git gud

>>724597460
Nah dude adding one more chore to constantly have to go back and do to be allowed to play the game, like running back to merchants just to exchange rosaries for shards, is cringe, and it being the least cringe option means the system as a whole is even more cringeworthy. It's a shit mechanic that only exists because Team Cherry was insecure about speedrunners saying that Hollow Knight was too easy during their hitless P5 runs.

I only started using red tools like halfway into act 2, before that I was always full of shards and thought the game had too many.

>>724597790
>Team Cherry was insecure about speedrunners saying that Hollow Knight was too easy during their hitless P5 runs.
I agree the execution of shards had problems but you don't need to be disingenuous about it.

>>724598247
yeah same, which is another reason why the system sucks

completely pointless for pretty much half the game and then when it starts getting interesting it's a pain in the ass to use (a common theme)

>>724545030 (OP)
I think if the double damage was removed, it might be on par with the first game.

>Greymoor wasn't always used to gather Silk that fell from the Citadel. It used to be a farming village

Did The Citadel just fuck up everything?

>>724598518
Of course they did. Almost everything in Pharloom is negatively affected by the Citadel, including the Citadel fucking itself up. It's kinda the whole thing of the game.

>>724598518
>>724598793
It's why, for all the time they already spent on the game, they should've unironically held off on act 3 for the final release and done an entire "Pharloom in the past" world as DLC. The "good" ending might've seemed underwhelming, but the game as a whole wouldn't have overstayed its welcome, and the DLC would've made people nut harder than all of HK's DLC combined.

>>724598997
Act 3 is fine. The issue with Act 3 is that you're too burnt out from Act 2 to enjoy it.

speaking of that and that's probably already been said but I think the worldbuilding in silksong isn't nearly as good as in hollow knight

the way the areas are set up and connected doesn't really sell the story they're trying to tell, like the citadel turning the previously pristine waters of bilewater into india isn't portrayed well, we have the putrified ducts that kinda come out of nowhere and don't really work as a sewer or toxic landfill area and the whole idea of the citadel polluting the environment also doesn't sound very convincing when the machinery seems to be powered by slave bugs physical activity and not by some sort of toxic resource

anyway I liked the first game world better, felt better realized

>>724599238
The silk itself is the toxic resource, since it's made of soul. Why do you think the Mist Wraiths exist, and why the maggots eat silk? All of the waste dregs from the cremated bodies pollute the surrounding areas before the silk itself is collected from Greymoor.

>>724599405
I would also like to point out that the Citadel being profoundly dirty and grimy is made evident on the Underworks workers. Several of them have the task of cleaning the gears and pipeways but Hornet remarks that there's so much grime on their clothes that they're just smearing old dirt on top of new dirt

>>724597790
Buying shards at all is considered a failure stage, because It means you've failed to manage them properly
>Team Cherry was insecure about speedrunners saying that Hollow Knight was too easy during their hitless P5 runs.
That has nothing to do with our conversation?

>>724600169
nta but I disagree, buying shards is as valid a decision as any other rosary purchase. It's probably why they thought they didn't need to make shards magnetic, because players could choose to buy shard bundles if they wanted to. The rosary economy is very much tuned so the player needs to actually think about what purchases will help them the most instead of trying to buy everything at once; it only becomes a rosary grind for 100% runs.

If you EVER needed to grind for or buy shards, you're playing the game wrong, holy shit. Tools are powerful as shit. If you're using them, you should be winning. It's literally why they have the shard limitation.

>>724593468
Cause it's not like the other posts said. The cutscene part can kill you.

>>724589772
nigga forgot about the fake spikes you gotta jump through to fight Draygon