Thread 724700027

>be Halo remake
>use real-time reflections for the water
>on a level where no objects ever go over the water
>you can't even get close enough to see your own reflection on the surface because the remake added an invisible wall at the shoreline
>the only reason we can tell it's real time is because the water has the usual Lumen bugs
What the fuck happened to game optimisation?

>>724700027 (OP)
It's made on UE5 and I'm suprised there aren't more people talking about that, just goes to show you this remake is dead in the water.

Looks tinny.

>>724700027 (OP)
>What the fuck happened to game optimisation?
Unreal Engine 5 + zoomers

>>724700027 (OP)
It uses screenspace reflections which are cheap as fuck and you can easily turn off.
If you want to complain about optimization then you should complain about using dynamic global illumination in a game where the time of day never changes. Waste of performance.

>>724700345
what's the point of even taking about it
it could give you cancer and retards would buy it anyway
we will get another CE remake in 5 years

>>724700027 (OP)
>>be Halo
Wow, already shit.

>>724700485
SSR is literally part of Lumen.
The UE5 "raytracing" unironically uses SSR whenever possible, and switches to Lumen-RT reflections when there's not enough data. And you can instantly see the low-res, low-quality reflections stick their ugly head out when SSR disappear.

It literally looks and runs worse than the Planar Reflections we already had back in Half-Life 2 days.

>>724700636
Man HL2 had such good reflections. What happened?

>>724700749
Deferred Rendering + lazy devs happened.

We got shittons of performance boosts, but then the GenZ devs wasted those new resources on hi-poly modeled pubic hair on some NPC, with 4K PBR textures slapped on top.

They then cope with mental gymnastics like "OMG but you gotta render teh scene TWICE!! It's 2much4 our 2000 times faster hardware!!"
It's kinda the same thing with pre-baked lighting. Lots of whining about "omg it takes TIME!", but nobody mentions that lightmap rendering is now GPU driven, and takes literally seconds to minutes. And most games could get away with static lighting conditions, and the visuals + performance would improve exponentially.

While ranting about all this, I gotta post one of my truly oldschool reflection tricks. Funnily enough, the RE2 remake still used something similar in cubemaps, when you disable SSR.

>>724700027 (OP)
>What the fuck happened to game optimisation?
Outsourcing. The department adding each piece of the puzzle will never be in a position to approach the levels in a manner required to wonder why you need this component other than it simply giving you money and because a lot of them are barely competent at what they do and will simply slap whatever comes out of the box onto the project and ask for their paycheck.
Add that to the fact that there are too many cooks and you're going to have nobody bothering with asking how much salt was put in the stew before serving it.

That's a gross simplification. There is also stuff like demands from investors both from hardware companies, clueless old men (donald trumps 50 year old cousin jumps around a lot) but also competitors thinkig they're sinking the ship with what half-cooked plans they got and what little info they have. And there is of course even more going on.

>>724701126
>translucent floor
That's clever.

>>724700027 (OP)
>every thread is a bunch of foreigners (including OP)
>every thread has the same videos and pics posted
This is totally organic.

>>724701524
>Jeet seethe
Totally organic reply.

>>724701840
>optimise colour armour favour paedophile encyclopaedia
>but you're the jeet
Sure thing, Sanjay.

>>724701524
>same videos and pics posted
Yeah maybe cause we're all looking at the video uploaded by Microsoft, mate.

>>724702175
>mate
>another foreigner
>doesn't recognize (or should I say, recogniSe) plurals

>>724702342
https://arch.b4k.dev/v/search/image/7syrMZ40UqY9TlbIV8Ymmw/
Have you anything else to say?

>>724702057
>autistic screeching
>still mad that people are criticizing a multi-billion corporate UE5 slop demake of fucking Gaylo
Can't make this shit up.

>>724702448
>still doesn't recognize plurals
>>724702462
>so dumb he doesn't know what I'm talking about
>thinks I've ever played Halo

>>724702518
Plurals would include, at least partitively, the OP video, you mongrel.

>>724700027 (OP)
At 7 seconds, beneath the island, you can see its basic bitch screen space tho

>>724702518
Stop trying to change the topic, shill jeet.
Halo is gay as fuck, and so are Unreal 5 games and de-makes.

>>724701126
I miss when devs did stuff like that
Even as a kid I wondered how they made the reflections on that level look so good
Now it's like if the engine can't do effects like this for them, they just give up and accept that it's gonna look like shit on most hardware

>>724702629
Stop trying to change the topic, poor jeet. I never mentioned Halo until you did, and prove you've ever run a UE5 game.

If we're trashing UE5, I get especially offended when I see some indie game with "retro" graphics use unreal engine 5
2 examples are Abiotic Factor and Misery. Zero fucking reason to use UE5 for games that look like that when you can just use UE4 or Unity and it will have much better performance.

>>724702896
Can't they disable the UE5 specific features?

>>724700027 (OP)
Why did technology got nerfed recently? I thought Western games never suffer from bad optimization.

>>724704150
>I thought Western games never suffer from bad optimization.
They've always been the primary driver of worse optimization even back in the 90's. Japanese PS1 games could easily run at 60fps while the average westslop averaged in the teens.

>>724704150
laziness and devs taking up a "just throw hardware at it" approach

>>724700027 (OP)
Only thing I will say is that all these new games look blurry, even with all those post processing tools or whatever else they use. Which tells me they can't make shit run well on modern hardware, either because they can't optimize or because hardware is not there yet.

>>724705426
It's the shitty upscaling + TAA

>>724700027 (OP)
Oh yeah that bullshit of reflections disappearing at the border of the screen, I hate it so much, why bother killing performance for something that looks so ugly?

>>724704150
Unreal Engine 5

>>724704150
>>724700345
ESL trash.

>>724700027 (OP)
Technically the Pelican you ride in on goes directly over the water. That doesn't make this remake less dumb.

>>724701126
I hate that after the trick is revealed I cannot unsee this.

>>724707842
The cutscene isn't even first-person anymore though so there's no point

>>724700027 (OP)
this looks great, why is everyone so upset?

>>724707903
Lol wut?

>>724708210
If the player can't control the angle they're looking at the water then that's all the more reason to fake the reflections in the cutscene

>>724700412
How does that even happen?

Greed + Jeets

>>724700027 (OP)
ITT: Zoomers and browns with 13 year old hardware bitch about the future of graphical engines.

It's in its infancy. Of course it's going to be a little janky for a few years. I remember with Unreal 3 Engine was released and the same type of bitching was prevalent. Upgrade your PC's niggas, UE5 looks awesome on a PC that doesn't suck dick. The technology has to move forward somehow.

>>724708472
>It's in its infancy
Fuck off, reflections looked better 20 years ago. THAT was when reflections were in their infancy.

>>724708472
Exactly we should all do our part and upgrade our systems for the improvement of the gamer ecosystem. Grab a RTX 5080 during the next Black Friday deals.

>>724700412
This just looks like real life. All these webms do is show how poor you are.

>>724708325
Lumen

>>724708568
They weren't real reflections retard. It was all smoke and mirrors to trick you into thinking you were looking at reflections. We finally are on the cusp of having powerful enough hardware to actually simulate photon paths and create real reflections in real time.

tl;dr: Upgrade your old ass hardware

>>724708589
This but unironically. You're not poor are you?

>>724708850
>They weren't real reflections retard. It was all smoke and mirrors to trick you into thinking you were looking at reflections
And they looked better while using significantly less compute. Why are shitty buggy reflections like in the OP video desirable?

>Retard that knows nothing of old school planar reflections is posting UE5 shit as if it looks good

Maximum irony.

>>724709149
The funny part is that the game he's posting doesn't even look impressive. I've seen those visuals surpassed on PS4 titles lol.

>>724708980
>Technology should never push the boundaries of the status quo because I'm poor

>>724709191
>Doesn't list any examples
Not him but your concession is accepted

>>724700027 (OP)
>I want to play modern games but I don't want to use modern hardware: The Thread

>>724709246
That logic would only work if the reflections actually looked better compared to 20 years ago; they don't. You didn't answer the question: Why are shitty buggy reflections like in the OP video desirable?
>>724709364
Why has this become a thread where an insecure poorfag flexes his 1440p monitor? The central focus of the original post was about the reflections looking bad when a superior effect would require less compute. In the software world this would be considered a regression at best and a bug at worst.

>>724709312
>>724709191
>Battlefront 2015
>Uncharted 4
>Last of Us 2
>Forbidden West
>Detroit: Become Human
>God of War Ragnarok

>>724709509
"Reflections" from 20 years ago were not actual path tracing or they were pre-baked. Yes, it's less resource intense, but it doesn't move the state of the art forward.

just buy a 5090 are you poor?

>>724709932
>it doesn't move the state of the art forward
And "ACTUALLY FUCKING LOOKS BETTER" moves the state of the art forward; not shitty buggy reflections that look worse. Once again, you haven't answered the question: Why are shitty buggy reflections like in the OP video desirable?

don't you guys have rtx

>>724710007
Because if new technology doesn't go through this infancy stage where things are janky, we never get a net improvement over what we've been using for the last 20 years. Unreal 3 was equally janky when it came out, and it culminated in Batman Arkham Asylum which in my opinion is one of the best implementations of the Unreal engine ever. UE5 is going through the same growing pains right now.

>>724710397
>where things are janky
We already know how to do reflections faster and better. You keep saying that this is some transitional stage where things will get better...and then what? We'll still have more computational inputs for no perceptible gain. If it can't and will never make games look better, why not invest the compute into something that will?

>>724700027 (OP)
you can find some ages old games with solid water reflections.
It isn't even that hard to do, but modern devs are too lazy to even do lod, because nanite can do it for them

>>724710503
>invest the compute into something that will
I'd argue that lighting is the single most noticeable way to improve how your graphics engine looks, even in some ways over texture resolution. What engine feature do you think would be a better expenditure of system resources?

>>724709959
No, but a 5070 runs all modern games at max settings at 1440p just fine. I'm set for the next 7 years or so.

Unreal engine is such a blight on video games especially when you can trace back issues whole games directly to the dogshit engine

>>724700027 (OP)
okay what the fuck they got of that big rock the jackals were on

>>724710659
>I'd argue that lighting is the single most noticeable way to improve how your graphics engine looks
Yes, and once again, the method displayed in the OP video has inferior results over 20 years ago. If a methodology looks worse, and runs worse...then it is worse. The single most noticeable way to improve how the Halo remake's water looks would be to not use shitty SSR on a level entirely surrounded by water.
>What engine feature do you think would be a better expenditure of system resources?
More dynamic shadows (look at the bipeds in this screenshot) would be preferred over SSR.

Once again, you have not answered the question: Why are shitty buggy reflections like in the OP video desirable?

>>724700027 (OP)
It looks way too lush. If I didn’t know better I would assume this is a remake of an Africa level from Halo 3, not the barren desolate ringworld of Halo 1.

>hey you know that thing you like?
yeah
>we make it look different now, pay us

i dont get it. you ever seen that shitty video of gordon ramsey making a grilled cheese in like a fireplace and he burns the fuck out of it and none of the cheese is melted?

thats what these remakes are like. i make a better grilled cheese with regular sandwich bread and some american cheese. sure gordons ramseys might look and sound fancy but it fucking sucks.

>>724708850
>They weren't real reflections
It was never about "being real", it was about LOOKING GOOD.
The chase for le real reflections is what has brought us to ray-tracing crutches and dlss and framegen.

>>724710986
>Why are shitty buggy reflections like in the OP video desirable?
They're not desirable, but it's actual ray/path tracing, which is the beginning of a new technology that if mastered, optimized and then implemented well is a far better looking and realistic replacement than the tricks we've been using to simulate reflections up to this point.

>>724710397
>new technology
Is that new technology in the room with us right now? All I see is lazy slow ass 30 years old tech replacing 15 years old tech designed to run fast and look good

>>724700507
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nplefywEFI

>>724711341
>is a far better looking and realistic replacement
How could it possibly provide any perceptible graphical improvement on a level where no dynamic objects fly over the water, which you can't even go near?

>>724711289
All of which are cool new technologies in their infant stages. I have a 5070 and DLAA is the best anti-aliasing I've even seen in my 30+ years of being a gamer. It's genuinely the best AA out there. Framegen gives me 200+ FPS on a 5070 consistently at 1440p now with minimal input lag thanks to DLSS 4.

>>724711459
Yeah, I guess you got me there. I guess it's a poor implementation. But that's not the engine's fault.

>>724711341
>but it's actual ray/path tracing
is it? is it normal for ray traced reflection to disappear at the edge of the screen like it is in the clip?

isnt that normally a screen space reflection issue?

>>724711787
It is SSR

>>724711346
Path/ray tracing in real time has never been feasible until now.

>>724712486
It still isn't feasible in real time and it's still the same tech from 30 years ago, they're just bruteforcing it with more power

>>724712647
Yeah, this thing about pushing the state of the art is total bullshit. There's nothing we can do on the software side of things until hardware improves.

>>724711553
>All of which are cool new technologies in their infant stages
Cope.

>>724712815
The worst part is that memetracing is objectively worse than old lighting because it's not even real time lighting, it's a semi real time texture baking solution. We went from baked textures to real time lighting to baked textures again in just 10 years, it's fucking insane.

>>724700412
Jeets and AI coding

>>724713058
>it's a semi real time texture baking solution
Hmm?

Every time someone goes
>NEW TECHNOLOGY NEEDS TO BECOME THE STANDARD
followed by
>WHAT, YOU POOR? UPGRADE YOUR HARDWARE
you're just a brainless shill that doesn't care for context, logic or scenario, trying to show off to people who genuinely do not care.

>>724700027 (OP)
sar the future is real time ray traced AI generated lumen enhanced DLSS upscaled 5x frame gen nueral net bespoke frames sar please do the needful and buy the 5090ti super sar

Use case for new hardware?

>>724716104
Why do we need DLSS and framegen to replicate the graphics of PS4 games?

>>724700027 (OP)
enshittification

>>724700412
How can people defend this?

>>724708472
>retarded nvidia shill defends the enshittification of graphics and performance

>>724719829
They've never known anything better. Same as you go to their country and ask how they can live like this.

>>724710986
>nothing in that scene casts a shadow
What the fuck, isn't that the entire point of deferred rendering?

>>724708472
>retard thinks these graphics look good

>>724710397
>and it culminated in Batman Arkham Asylum which in my opinion is one of the best implementations of the Unreal engine ever
Huh? It stuttered on traversal, it didn't look much better than Gears of War.

>>724710397
Wasn't Arkham Knight built in UE3 as well?

>>724721081
Yeah and that game still looks good

>>724700537
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nplefywEFI

>>724700027 (OP)
>you can't even get close enough to see your own reflection on the surface because the remake added an invisible wall at the shoreline
Is this true?
I remember in the OG version I drove far into the ocean then stood on the Warthog and jumped to see the island from afar. Soulful moment.

>>724700027 (OP)
Too much goddamn trees, rocks and details. This level never ever gave me the impression even back when I was a young lad playing Halo CE in enjoyment that its actually supposed to look like this due to console limitations. So why is it people think this looks okay?

>>724700027 (OP)
man, all those graphics really made the game better

>>724723626
Graphics whores won't be happy until foliage covers the entire screen. The fact that enemies you see you through it while you can't see them hasn't occurred to them.

>>724700027 (OP)
I don't hate how the game looks, but I don't understand how more people aren't disappointed by the skybox not being the ethereal twilight of the original with a thin atmosphere and wispy clouds so you can make out all of the stars.

>>724725507
Yeah it doesn't even look like you're on a ring. It just looks like some generic beach sequence from some generic FPS.

>>724722610
Yep.

>>724701126
The microcosm of development mimics the macrocosm of society. Wasteful spending of resources has never been, is not and never will be indicative of wealth, but crippling generational debt -- independant of the kind of resources in question.

>>724726660
Same shit happened during the fall of Rome. Decadence.

>>724701126
>blaming deffered, the foundation that made open-world possible

Kill yourself retard.

>>724700749
they forced a resource-intense meme functionality in game engines so they could continue to sell hardware that bruteforces performance

but also let's make everything resource-heavy and just not bother with any basic optimisation

>>724729393
UE5 isn't even bad, you CAN optimize it. It's just that H1B devs don't.

Fantasy life i and Sonic racing crossworlds both use UE5 and run really well, it’s a dev problem, not an engine problem
Well except for lumen but then again it’s the dev’s fault it’s on

>>724700027 (OP)
>>724726218
It's unfinished, they may add it by November 2026. Just tell Halo Studios about it without sounding like a complete ass.

>>724719829
That's how it works in real life.

>ray tracing has some graphical glitches
We are just starting to use the tech. Give it 10 years.

>>724731087
>9th gen launched 5 years ago

>>724700636
Why don't they just use planar reflections?

>>724730982
This only NPCs don't notice real life assets pop in and everyone disappears when you don't look at them