Thread 12102901

Technically a metroidvania?

>>12102901 (OP)
Zelda II is a Castletroid

>>12102901 (OP)
Personally I referred to it as a 'linkaroonie'

>>12102901 (OP)
It's a RPG

technically a shitty mess.
but nobody wants to think that because nintendo.

>>12102945
Where’s the branching paths, equipment stats and romances?

>>12102964
Yeah I agree on the first two rpgs need muh choices and all that but...
>romances
Are you a woman or a faggot?

I'm gonna filter metroidvania. It's scientific fact that every thread with this term is fucking dogshit.

>>12102901 (OP)
It's a Adventure game with a HUB world (Hyrule Field)

>>12102964
Most JRPGs don't have branching paths, he has plenty of equipment that actually has different stats on damage dealt and taken and as for romance......... Link has like 6 different women in this game that want his Master Sword.

>>12102964
>romances?
lmao gay

>>12102953
based, fuck nintendo!

>>12102901 (OP)
Yeah you could make that case. Some of this stuff is pretty subjective. I mean the vast majority of action RPGs fit what I would call Metoidvania. Maybe some rougelikes don’t quite fit. Maybe theres some action RPG that is completely linear with no locked areas and no backtracking, but I can’t think of one. At that point its less of an RPG. Megaman?

Metroid, Castlevania 2 and Legend of Zelda were all made around the same time when rpg elements were being inserted into the platforming/action genre in the middle years of the NES. They’re really part of the same movement in gaming. So if you call Metroid and Castlevania 2 the basic models then of course Zelda is right there, it’s just overhead. Kid Icarus is another one cut from the same cloth of implementing some rpg stuff.

The “Metroidvania” genre was well established by 1987 or so in my opinion. The first entries of the genre could be Jet Set Willy or Adventure, maybe Montezuma Revenge and Pitfall 2. All involve some backtracking and locked areas and item use.

If you say that Symphony of the Night is the prototypical Metroidvania like I’ve seen some people do, you’re ignoring the long history of the genre. Zelda OOT doesn’t have all the items and stats and etc. Thats’s a weird take though because you have to at least include Super Metroid, which has none of those things. And if you include Super Metroid in your definition, why not the original Metroid? And at that point Castlevania 2 is no stretch either. Then we’re at Zelda again.

Randomizers make it a Metroidvania

>>12102901 (OP)
it's clearly a 3D Hero Third-Person Action RPG Puzzle Hack N' Slash Horse 'em Up

It sucks. Its slow.

>>12102964
there's nothing written where it says that RPGs can't be linear

>>12102901 (OP)
Zelda is Zelda, there's a reason so little games like it exist.

>>12103098
Kek

>>12102901 (OP)
It's an action RPG. Zelda has always been an action RPG series.

at this point metroidvania just means "video game with locked doors"

>>12102901 (OP)
no, you can go everywhere right from the start

>>12105437
Not without the use of glitches.

>Walk around
>Nothing happens
>3 hours later something happens... sort of
>Walk around again for a while
>Things sort of start happening
>7 hours later something happens
>Game over
Did I get the authentic Halo experience?

>>12105318
>No leveling up system
How is it an RPG? Closest thing it has is getting more hearts and items but that doesn't make it an RPG, otherwise it would be kind of difficult to make an open world action game and everything would be linear.

>>12105880
Leveling systems aren't a hard requirement in RPGs.

>>12105914
Super Mario World is an RPG then and you can't convince me otherwise

What is with this somethingvania meme?

>>12105914
Yes, they are

>>12102901 (OP)
No it's a zeldoidvania-like.

>>12102901 (OP)
Its a soulslike metroidvania boomer shooter

>>12105914
Having a numbers based progression system is like the whole appeal of RPGs.

>>12102901 (OP)
>>12102905
>>12102942
>>12102971
>>12103042
>>12103078
>>12105365
>>12107273
>>12107280

the correct term is willyvania

>>12102901 (OP)
Its a smell-you-fartia.

>>12102901 (OP)
>Technically a metroidvania?
Its willyvania you mean.

>>12108170
this and retropilled.

>>12102901 (OP)
no because it's pretty linear

>>12108170
*David Crania

>>12109196
>Highly non-linear game is actually linear
This is news to me

>>12102901 (OP)
>I can only comprehend something if it falls into some commonly used term/label
>if it doesn't, then I can't understand it
I hate the younger generation.

>>12102901 (OP)
Zelda has a different approach to level design. Metroidvania maps tend to be highly interconnected with most areas usually connecting and looping with multiple others, Where as Zelda has many dungeons that are completely self-contained from the rest of the world

>>12108170
it's search action.

>>12102901 (OP)
This and ALTTP and Zelda 1 could be classified as extremely linear metroidvaniast since you can technically go out of your way to leave a dungeon when you get the item then fuck off to another dungeon or part of the world sometimes, they are barely, barely metroidvanias.

>>12102901 (OP)
The term Metroidvania was not originally coined to describe a whole genre. It was a term coined by Castlevania fans to differentiate between the classic Castlevania games like Castlevania 1 or Castlevania 3, who focus on linear stage-based progressions, and games like Symphony of the Night, which focus on non-linear exploration. If you actually play Symphony of the Night and Super Metroid, you'll find that they're actually really different games, and labeling them as the same genre kinds of disrespect how much differences there are in their game design. The fact that it now designates a whole genre is just another example of language degradation.

Unlike what's popularly believed, Symphony of the Night was not actually inspired by Metroid, but by The Legend of Zelda. Of course, Ocarina of Time was also inspired by previous Zelda games, because that's how sequels tend to work.

So you can retroactively call Ocarina of Time if you want, because people bastardize terms all the time, but you're using a term that was invented after Zelda and was invented to describe a game inspired by Zelda.

>>12110162
sure seems like SOTN is a hell of a lot closer to super metroid than TLOZ to me.

>>12108170
>>12110142
Usage of the term Willyvania greatly discounts the numerous other search-em-ups on the Speccy, a genre it truly pioneered and excelled at. For this reason, I've recently taken to referring to the genre as Sabrewillya, so as to also note the influence of the genre defining classic title Sabre Wulf.

>>12110156
> you can technically go out of your way to leave a dungeon when you get the item then fuck off to another dungeon or part of the world sometimes
You never need to do this for any of them. They are each inherently very non-linear games that let you play dungeons completely out of order, there are parts where you can nab an item and leave early so they're even more non-linear, but you have huge amounts of freedom to fuck around and find out you can straight up do a late dungeon much earlier.

>>12110189
OoT and aLttP are only really like that if you purposefully go out of your way to do things out of order, and it often requires knowing movement tricks or glitches.

Zelda 1 is the only game in the series where you will organically do the dungeons in the wrong order unless you're using a guide, and that usually manifested as you doing all the dungeons that are easy to find first. 2 is more linear, but 1 and 2 both have the "keys are a generic item you can use in any dungeon" thing going for them.

>>12110192
>and it often requires knowing movement tricks or glitches.
Except it generally doesn't.

Doing, say, Water Temple before Forest is inherently 'tricky', in that it involves messing around with progression by leaving Forest early or doing tricks with Farore's Wind and jumps etc.

But doing Fire Temple or Ice Cavern before Forest? Fire after Spirit Temple? Well at any point after Forest? Completely doable with no tricks or 'catches' whatsoever. If you allow 'item nab', yes, the game opens up even more, but it doesn't need you to resort to that stuff at all as its inherently freeform.

>>12110206
That's a different level of open than Zelda 1. Something like 80% of people probably played OoT in the exact same order, especially before sequence breaking became popular in 2001 during the Metroidvania zeitgeist.
On the other hand, almost no one does the dungeons in Zelda 1 in the suggested order, and it's been that way since the 80s.

>>12102901 (OP)
Literally aonumaslop.

>>12108170
>>12110175
the thing about coining genre terms is how it requires international recognition to be accepted, like how we call italian directed western films spaghetti westerns

>>12110213
>most people follow the same path (because OoT has characters and plot points that tell you where to go and Z1 doesn't) so that makes OoT more linear
No, it just means (You) are a dumb disengenuous faggot.

I also find it funny how sidequests and other optional content are never included in these discussions. Apparently the only thing that determines a game's linearity are the order in which you can access dungeons.