Thread 41111583

Welcome to Oneirosophy General. Oneirosophy means "dream wisdom".

The fundamentals:
>Every single one of us live in their own reality. Your world is your private dream.
>What you truly are is an "open space of awareness" in which experiences arise.
>Reality is idealistic (Idealism: All of waking reality is a mental structure, a dreamed reality).
>As you progress on your path, trought techniques, knowledge and understading of the subjective experience, your increace further lucidity (Lucidity: A state similar to gnosis or satori where one regains consciousness of the illusory nature of waking reality, just as one becomes lucid in a dream).
>An open mind combined with healthy caution is the correct mindset for all approaches targeted at the subjective experience. Never believe something without personal evidence; never dismiss something without personal evidence.

Main Sources:
>DimensionalJumping Index
https://old.reddit.com/r/DimensionalJumping/comments/38c3yk/how_to_jump_between_dimensions/

>Original Forum
https://old.reddit.com/r/Oneirosophy/

For beginners:
>Manifestation Repos
https://codeberg.org/manifestation

>"Two Glasses" Exercise
https://old.reddit.com/r/DimensionalJumping/comments/38c3yk/how_to_jump_between_dimensions/

>"Just decide" Exercise
https://old.reddit.com/r/Oneirosophy/comments/2hesk3/just_decide/

>An Alternative to the Ladder excersice, "Dream Food Delivery"
https://files.catbox.moe/osrtxc.png

—/ Extra resources /—

>The Nature of Dream Control, by "The Cusp"
https://rentry.org/4ovkzccw
https://rentry.org/ynt5biqt
https://files.catbox.moe/p2d7e9.pdf

>Carlos Castaneda
https://archive.org/details/cc-all-books-in-one-20-texts-interim-version
https://www.reddit.com/r/castaneda/
TriumphantGeorge on Carlos ideas: https://old.reddit.com/r/Oneirosophy/comments/35v1kv/some_insights_from_lucid_dreams/crg6s87/

>Universal Line
drive.google.com/drive/folders/1X9dB7eDI5RcHOBvixGjAhZ_lgJjJIhGq
https://archive.org/details/UL-the-complete-works

Let me open this thread with first and foremost highlighting the chain of posts of the user "The Cusp" from his ancient thread in DreamViews called "The Nature of Dream Control", that's now available on the extra resources section. Absolutely essential oneirosophist reading. You will find the same conclusion about reality in which /one/ is founded upon.

Gem

Ok, where are the people that have grips with John stuff, now we can discuss it along with Neville and see what's happening.

I will use the waiting method you mentioned to manifest a redbull drink, cheers!

>>41111635
Waiting method? Do you mean the alarm one?

Dumping this awesome thread. Any thoughts on Castaneda stuff?

>>41111583 (OP)
I've only ever had one dream I remember from my life.

I was a German soldier in winter 1944, and I kicked open a door and bombs were going off and blood and snow and tears were flying all around me and the voice in my head said if you don't stop running forward you won't die. And I didn't, explosions were all around, blood tears, and snow, and I kept running and shooting. That was in 2009. Do with this information what you will.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rg__zq_HZ1g&t=3s

>>41111680
Interesting. Also, just to mention something related, does anyone remember that guy that lived an entire lifetime inside a dream and woke up from a coma?

>>41111639
Yes B.T.W I will start reading the U.L tomorrow

>>41111715
Nice. Tell us if you have any doubt or observations.

>>41111719
I must be open minded, that's it, thank you

>>41111612
How do I get instant returns? I tried doing a command session and when I opened my eyes what I wanted to be there materialized in front of me wasn't there. From the parts of UL I've read this is because your conclusion is your command, yet I don't remember subtly concluding during the session this would take longer than instant. From my probably bad interpretation of the texts merely comprehending and identifying with the attributes is supposed to bring it, yet it didn't? I've tried multiple times, UL has worked for non-instant returns but every system I've found haven't yet shown me a step-by-step solution to the materialization/supernatural block.

>>41111714
Cool, thanks for your feedback sir :D

B.T.W, can i skip the email questions/answers or save them until i am done with the core material?
i rather jump into John's actual work

there does not seem to be an index here to know where can i start reading the actual material of John, any number's page i can start with?

>>41111730
>How do I get instant returns?
The problem with this question (for me, and anyone else really) is that it could have happened for an infinite amount of reasons. So anyone telling you why or not something happened or didn't, could be, most of the time wrong. My approach to UL is that no matter what happens or not, I'm free of evaluation of any notion failure or success, so i don't mind. Remember that the point of the material is grounding you in mechanical facts, and acknowledging reality as a dream, so you advance pedaling perception-experience and let the result lead the way.

In short, keep going. You are already "that", so at some point in your future sessions, you will find out why something didn't happen or happened. Like a "revelation".

>>41111737
It's optional, but i absolutely recommend it. It has very common doubts about UL answered by John itself.

>>41111756
The OP is already tight, but here's the index that the girfag shared in some past thread; Universal Line recommended reading guide (Using as index the complete works PDF along with the ATWA epub). From first to last:
- ATWA 2000 (Avaliable as separated EPUB)
- ATWA 2000 Text & Stories (Pg. 624)
- ATWA Story 37 (Pg. 170)
- DBS Protocol (Pg. 85)
- Shared Emails (Pg. 165)
- GoCotU (Pg. 125)
- IAT Painter's Guide (Pg. 172)
- IAT (Pg. 179)
- Advanced Portrait Painting (Pg. 281)
- Advanced Financial Gain (Pg. 317)
- A Deeper Look At Your First Two Essentials (Pg. 394)
- Q&A #1-3 (Pg. 420)
- Q&A 1 Updated (Pg. 1)
- YLOVEALK (Pg. 527)
- OAP Series (Pg. 576)
- ILKRH (Pg. 664)
- ITOCSMRH (Pg. 723)
- Misc #1 (Pg. 414)
- Misc #2 (Pg. 468)
- Misc #3 (Pg. 622)
- Misc #4 (Pg. 652)
- Misc Images (Pg. 786)

>>41111764
OK, i will start from page one, thank you

>>41111770
Before reading the Q&A, read Advanced Portrait and Advanced Financial Gain, as well two essentials. The Q&A is an answer to those.

>>41111769
okay, i will surely check out the whole thing without an exception, following that guide, albeit i have a PDF version

>>41111583 (OP)
So can I use this to become a hot girl

>>41111774
Thank you again
will do

>>41111779
The complete works is the only complete compedium we have of the papers. It's unorganized, maybe it was made in a rush, so i hope the index clear things up a bit. ATWA was the earliest one we have of him, and it was released in epub format for a better compression.

>>41111788
You can, but if you get serious about it, please, tell us how it goes. Also
>pic related

>>41111792
Good, Good

>>41111677
His community is certainly interesting...

>>41111800
>>pic related
Based but if you were a hot futa why would you stay here

>>41111827
If you could do anything, period, why would you stay in a place that you don't like? Most of the time, is that some people just don't know better, but that's just a hollow guess.

>>41111835
Yeah exactly. If I woke up as a big tiddy futa no way in hell would I come back to this reality to blogpost about it instead

Relevant pic.

>>41111840
Dreams are flexible. You wake up, you return to the "baseline" or your accustomed instance of the world. In theory, if you could have a persistent dream any time you want, you could go back here and report back your experiences. This is the foundation of lucid dreaming as a practice after all.

Check this out about "persistent dreams": http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/hyu/persistent-realms-other-lucid-dreaming-techniques-i-use-39218/

What this anon could have done, is create a dream world where he engage with his sense at full, and could go back whenever he want just like that. But if you decided to stay there, would you return? And if you did, would be the same instance from where you departed?

>>41111858
I've had lucid dreams as a futa. If I permanently had a futa body I'm not going back to my current one

>>41111800
>You can, but if you get serious about it, please, tell us how it goes.
But thanks anon. I was shitposting but I DO want to be a big titty futa with a huge futa cock, so I'll be serious lmao

>>41111899
Remember that any person could do anything for any reason. Only what you do and your reasons count. It's the only thing you can live after all.

Got the ATWA EPUB, as well as the complete works in PDF already
I feel like i am about to reach God mode, bros, but first i have to grind the texts

>>41111991
It will be fun, this is how ancient wizards did it, its like studying some ancient alchemical text lol

>>41111998
Must remain optimistic and confident about my ability to get through the text

>>41112003
In the context of manifestation and magic, i think this brings a new perspective in asceticism. Is there ANYTHING more worth pursuing than magic? Especially when this world is your playground? I'm in agreement with John, Carlos and George about the fact that magic is simply who we truly are. Even as kids, we have the vague, intrinsic notion of that idea.

>>41112029
I mean, we all talk about life being suffering and various problems, but what if there is a way to make life fun and comfy and beyond?

>>41112043
forgive the grammar issues, am sleepy

>>41112043
The original Oneirosophers realized that staying in suffering was a human choice. Nothing to be ruthless with the fellows out of the loop, but it's simply what it seems to be the case. Its really hard for a person attached to a dogma to recognize that we're all free will agents on a journey, even if we pretend we are not.

>>41112057
Original Oneirosophers ?
Who?
i thought it was a recent trend in reality creation

>>41111756
I recommend starting with Advanced Portrait Painting, Advanced Financial Gain, and First Two Essentials. Before that, John didn't used the Universal Line metaphor, and it were early stages with a more holistic approach, while past these texts and before Universal Cosmic Master, John started to use the vedic lingo. So these three papers i mentioned are the middle ground, and give you the most essential idea on what UL is truly about at the core. At least that's what i think.

>>41112068
Check the OP

>>41112079
>holistic
I mean secular.

>>41112079
lol not sure if i should start with that or this approach
>>41111769
but given you are the anon who put time and effort into creating and running this general, i am going to follow your suggestion out of whim

>>41111938
>Remember that any person could do anything for any reason.
Well, being a "big titty futa elf girl with a 20 inch futa dick" seems like a decent choice to me
Where do I start

>>41112104
The OP seems like a good starting point :)

>>41112088
you mean Carlos Castaneda?
I had the impression you were talking about some mystics from the ancient times, sorry for the mis understanding

>>41112113
T-the *cough* the Op... anon, read the entire thing please aaa! *dies*

>Original Forum
https://old.reddit.com/r/Oneirosophy/

>>41112088
also yes i have seen that subreddit before, we already talked about it and how/why it got closed alongst of the dimensional jumping sub

>>41112117
yes, yes, don't worry, but when you said "the original" i had the impression of something older in time, sorry again, but yes i have lurked that subreddit since i have seen it linked by you in a former LOA bake

>>41112109
Well, there's a lot there. I mean in terms of exercises I can do tonight

>>41112118
Well, the idea of Oneirosophy comes from there, so when i say original oneirosophers, i refer to them, including TriumphantGeorge. This general is not about them, of course, if not about furthering this branch of magic that they proposed. Remember that this is for archiving things using your own faculties at the fullest extent, and uncovering reality as it truly is: Your dream unfolding.

>>41112137
I just like the sound of this because it seems simple and closer to the intuitive idea we have about magick/manifestation, instead of:

>nooooooooo, you gotta mental diet
>noooooooooooooo, you gotta detach
>nooooooooooooooooo, how dare you say you are tired of waiting for many months of 0 improvement
>nooooooooooooo, how dare you check the 3D

I love Neville but we have to admit his system has too many rules and regulations

>>41112155
after many months*

>>41112155
>>41112137
seriously if you are God as Neville says then why does it have to be this complicated?
i never feel like a God practicing the law

>>41112155
As a personal opinion, i personally reject every single thing that is new thought or occultism (like magick in general), they are different faces of the same coin to me. In the case of magick, it's just a bunch of woo woo spooky bullshit that's seems more for halloween decoration than any pragmatic application, but it's the less worse of the two, at least is obvious that the return doesn't come from there. New Thought it's more detrimetral because it condition the individual to regulate in arbitrary fashion his already functional pattern recognition and to dimiss his own intellect. Hell, that's why this exists:

https://www.reddit.com/r/NevilleGoddardCritics/

Anyway. Im going to use an analogy: Oneirosophy is a videogame, the game starts, and the premise is this one:
>This world is your own dream.
That's the fundamental fact you have to act upon for the rest of your existence, with all that implies. After that, it's pretty second nature to sort the useful information from the junk.

>>41112175
Almost a decade for the Neville general to figure this out, and it was impossible to make a wake up call. Sad! The worse part is that taking reality as it is could actually make his stuff to function. Just replace "Assumptions" with intent and decisions. Which one sounds better?
>Just assume
Or
>Just decide
It's your dream. You don't have to assume. You just have to know the facts, and decide for yourself.

A God by defination knows no limits, if he wills something, he gets it in no time, he would not need some arbitrary limits and rules

>>41112155
George basically extracted everything useful from Neville and made a synthesis that explained the basics in a more technical way. If nobody has read Neville before knowing about George, i don't see the utility of doing so now imo.

>>41112155
I also forgot:
>NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, you have limiting beliefs deeply engraved in your subconsious that prevent you from manifesting

>>41112175
>>41112203
We, as dreamers, are beyond "God". God could be many, there exist various types of Gods. The "ultimate reference field" is one. You are your world, and beyond it.

>>41112193
again, i love neville, but how the hell do they expect me to feel like i am the operant power in my reality with all these rules and regulations

>>41112212
>So, erm, how do i troubleshoot?
>Not my problem bro just assume lmao

>>41112224
Amazing

Posting in the greatest thread on 4chan right now.
You guys may not realize it, but we are making history here.

>>41112232
it's just silly man, for the people who want to convince you that you have divine-like powers

>>41112248
and it has not even started yet

>>41112193
Btw, making remarks here: I said MAGICK, with "K" at the end, not magic. Magic is what this general is for, like the one from the disney sorcerer's apprentice film. You dancing among the stars and rejoicing with your unfolding dream imagination, unapologetically, unbounded. The true spirit of reality.

>>41112271
cute

>>41112029
>In the context of manifestation and magic
Not to argue about semantics, but they are one and the same. Keep that in mind.

>>41112271

Amen brudda. I practice Magic im a fucking wizard. Magick is for narcissistic fat losers with painted nails that hang out with trannies

>>41112372
This. Wicca is cringe.

>>41112372
Crowley basically added the "K" to it, as far as my limited knowledge

>>41112386
I never get nothing about "western magick" in the first place. It's so dumb
>Yes, indeed, we can summon all these ancients spirits that wagged battles along my ancestors and gave us the promethean flame and the enochian astrological knowledge. We will bend le reality to our le will...
>WHAT?! ASKING FOR FIVE DOLLARS?! Nuh-huh, can't do!

We are going to be doing a lot of retrospective in shit like that from now on lmao

>>41112419
had no idea they were like that, keeeek

>>41112419
BTW, can you tell me about your journey with manifestation and magic and how you arrived to John's stuff? i would love a detailed story

wow I was so into this like 6-7 years ago. watched that jim carry documentary about him identity switching to andy and other characters on acid and legit believed in this stuff for 6+ months.

>>41112155
>>41112212
you have forgotten:
"Your desire/affirmation/assumption did not feel natural to you man"

>>41112436
It's really simple. I was just a malcontent lone wolf kind of guy that had this vague sense that "everything was connected" and that "something was up". Suddenly, one day, as if i was just guided by some strange presence, i stumbled with the LoA general. I read neville stuff, and it FUCKED ME UP COMPLETELY, but, at the time, it was exactly at the moment that ULAnon and SMAnon arrived to make contributions about reality, which leads me to John, and then, to the legacy of Oneirosophy.

Some people say that UL stuff fucked them up, but for me it was COMPLETELY THE OPPOSITE. It was thanks to George and John that i got my shit together. That's how i concluded and decided that the path i wanted to partake in my life as long as i exists had to be the one of the Oneirosopher. Its also so much fun! To see the life like one of careless youth and know beforehand that there's so much to look forward to, "expansions opportunities" as John would say. And also, the idea of "being all alone" and this world being my playground were just the icing on the cake for someone who doesn't want to be part of society, and always liked being a lone wolf. Now i know that i can be the best AT THAT.

LoA never made sense to me because...
(1/?)

>>41112490
Because New Thought is like acting like retarded women! I'm a man, i love artistic depictions of violence in media, i love bitches and titties, i love cash, i love being racist and fun banter, i love inserting myself as the hero, i love acting aggressive and assertive in a Travis Touchdown or James Bond fashion, i just love having fun according to my own nature. Feeling?! ""Positivity""?! PRAYER?! Fuck that hippie trash, fuck this noise. Being a docile sheep is for some, but not for me.

I was, perfectly fine acting like myself, so why would i change that? Behavioral remedies are for the cattle that has no identity of his own. They don't care about self preservation because they don't have nothing to preserve themselves. I don't give a fuck about that. Living by your own rules, doesn't that sound appealing? Whatever happens, or not, i have no regrets whatsoever. This material, this path, this general, and this inner realization, is my reward for being true and loyal to myself, let the world burn to ashes! I'm BEYOND that.

Truth feels so good.
(2/2)

>>41112525
>>41112490
Awesome but what do you mean by: "Some people say that UL stuff fucked them up"?

Do you mean like they could not handle the power?

>>41112537
They can't handle the facts. Why do you think people over at the Neville general reject John findings EVEN if his stuff just simply works at long term? Why do you think there's so much misery in the iron age? As the logic follows, everyone reap what they sow. Look around you for instance, what do you see in the catalog? Most of the trash in that ocean of mud is mostly endless scaremongering and wilful ignorance. "Yeah dude, i believe in god BUT I WILL NEVER NEVER NEVER NEVER GIVE MAGIC A TRY I SWEAR", it's stupid.

I remember showing Paolucci stuff to someone i personally meet, and he just read the ULAnon cheat image that get shared sometimes in the Neville general; and he just lost it! He was having a breakdown and started to give me some schizo babble like if something just broke inside of him or whatever, i had to calm him down and just suggest that he forget about it. That's how it is, you can't drag people to this, this is self discovering and personal transformation, they have to find out on their own.

Some people won't agree with me with this one, but that's alright, but my suggestion is to tag along with people that are already in the know, that are already "part of the game". You won't discuss a videogame with someone that is not playing it, right? Is more constructive to your path stick with other Oneirosophers, so you don't have to spoonfed forever.

>"Where do you get this stuff?"
>Direct them to this general, do it yourself

As simple as that...

>>41112581
Awesome, Thank you

>>41112581
but yes, many people are born as cattle by nature as Aristotle says, especially in spirituality related circles

>>41112608
No problem. Remember that i'm just an anon, and i have no intentions of being a tripfag, despite how strong and obvious my way of writing is. Keep your eyes on the prize, and your feet on solid ground. Good night, and sweet dreams

>>41112626
G.N, i will start reading A.P.P.T.U.L tomorrow

>Thread theme
https://youtu.be/6D8P6RDKbos?list=RD6D8P6RDKbos

I have been practicing or trying to practice various forms of the LOA for 5 years now. I've read all of Goddards work, Ernest Jones, and Joseph Murphy. I couldn't get any of it to work consistently. Almost two years ago I decided to abandon it all as I felt I was just deluding myself. Anyway, yesterday I came across SMAnon, read the pdf, and I attempted the hand raising thing. It was right before bed and I spent about 10 minutes. Nothing happened during the session. However, I slept fucking horribly, feeling disoriented and stressed all night long. I didn't dream of anything particularly interesting. It's 2:30 in the morning and I cannot sleep. I'm curious if anybody else had a reaction like this one? I should note that I'm very skeptical of all of this, and the only reason I gave this new (to me) method a chance was because SMAnon said that belief didn't matter. When I used to "practice" LOA as Neville and others described I always felt very stressed out by intrusive thoughts. Sorry if I'm not completely coherent. Tired, and don't feel well. Sorry if this isn't the correct general - came here from the /loa/ one. Just looking for some help/insight.

I feel like synchronicity at least can be fully explained by what we know about the reticular activating system.

Good morning, have a fine day ahead all of you

So, i found about some fun stuff:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mage:_The_Ascension

>Reality is not fixed, but rather a set of agreed upon assumptions enforced by the collective will of humanity, the Sleepers. Mages are those people who recognize that reality is not static, and realize that through the application of their will, usually channeled through rituals or other similar "mystical" or "scientific" practices, reality can be changed
Mages are these individuals with the power to warp reality, who know the power they possess and use it to the best of their ability.

The problem is, of course, that everyone has that ability. And there are seven billion people in the world.

You can change reality to suit your whims. So can they. You want to fly. They don't believe you can.

This conflict in belief between you and everyone else is called Paradox, and the consensus (the unconscious beliefs of the rest of mankind) metes out punishment through Paradox.

Paradox can cause your magic to go haywire, cause physical damage to you and the area around you, or even manifest as a sentient entity, intent on making you pay for breaking the Laws of the Consensus.

Of course I am not saying this is exactly what John is implying or saying, just noticed the wacky contrast

>>41114362
>Sorry if this isn't the correct general
It's actually the "correct one", if you want to discuss the subjective experience, which include manifestation. Also, remember to partake your own research, and take what is said in here with the correct focus and your own understanding.
>I have been practicing or trying to practice various forms of the LOA for 5 years now.
Remember that "Oneirosophy", and magic overall, has nothing to do with LoA (either with Law of Attraction, or Law of Assumption). New Thought and New Ageism has taught you that your perfectly fine, natural feelings, and normal cognitive processing faculties, were wrong (Saying that is actually insane, but its true). If we may discuss tools, including whatever you find useful from NewT/NewA, you can use your common sense to find out that the foundation of it its shaky...
>When I used to "practice" LOA as Neville and others described I always felt very stressed out by intrusive thoughts.
You don't actually have intrusive thoughts. What you could have, if you enter in the Nevillean cycle, is "thoughts that were perfectly fine, but now i consider intrusive". That's my way to say that: Every thought is intrusive, because none of them are. I repeat, you were working perfectly fine before, so what happened? I'd say nothing happened, you simply absorbed wrong ideas.
>Anyway, yesterday I came across SMAnon, read the pdf, and I attempted the hand raising thing.
This, if i can digress, suggest another wrong idea. The most useful part of his contributions were his insight and progress to define the core of reality and manifestation, but his perspective comes from the one of a former chaos magician, so take that in mind. There's also the fact that what people got from him is "so i can raise my hand, so what", and missed the forest for the trees (Stuck in a method that was not the source of any return, instead of the observations on reality made)
(1/?)

>>41114907
>When I used to "practice" LOA as Neville and others described I always felt very stressed out by intrusive thoughts. Sorry if I'm not completely coherent. Tired, and don't feel well. Sorry if this isn't the correct general - came here from the /loa/ one. Just looking for some help/insight.
Remedy sections of my reply it's a suggestion, and only suggestions. You will have to undertake action that resonates with you the best. First, rest as much as needed, none if this will matter if you end up dead or sick of the head. If none of this is true, nothing happened, life goes on, but if all of this is true, then you already are more "aware" than before.
In Oneirosophy the first fundamental is the following:
>Every single one of us live in their own reality. Your world is your private dream.
This is the logic you should follow, the foundation of it all. In your dream, would your so called "intrusive thoughts" be a problem? When you were younger and thought all kind of sick stuff, did that impede you to do anything? Thoughts are just thoughts, but your experience in New Agers cycles has taught you that your return and source of experience doesn't come directly from there, so it wasn't a waste of time, it was a lesson to learn. If this world is your private dream, then you simply take the dust off your clothes and continue, as if nothing ever happened, because it didn't.
(2/?)

>>41114959
>Just looking for some help/insight.
An immediate suggestion would be to, first, as pointed before, to rest, rest until you're calm and have cooled down, lie on bed with your eyes open for a good twenty minutes or so if necessary, but you need to be cool headed to this to be easier for you, think about your health. Second, after you are in a better shape, you could try the "Dream Food Delivery" Exercise from the OP, which is the easier and less demanding one of the bunch. As an less immediate suggestion, read Universal Line documents, and then the Index listed from the OP. Your past experiences will make more sense then.
Remember that you have to trust your common sense, intellect and your own need for self preservation. Believe doesn't matter and never mattered, it's a modern invention from new agers, why would you believe something that it's not true? Read the sources, and consider what it means to exists, so instead of believing, you can know it, and understand where it lies the true catalyst to change.
(3/3)

Would it make sense to seek greater control over my dreams prior to seeking greater control over *this* dream? I imagine the rules are essentially the same, given that we are essentially saying that I am both Chuang-Tzu who dreamt he was a butterfly and a butterfly currently dreaming he is Chuang-Tzu.

>>41111583 (OP)
Anyone have any experience with Paolucci's inner returns?
It's supposed to be a sort of pocket dimension where you can do anything you desire.

>>41114611
>The problem is, of course, that everyone has that ability. And there are seven billion people in the world.
This can only be a problem if you threat this as a conflict. This is where the hierarchy of truths comes in handy. Paradoxes only arise if you mess up the order from the hierarchy. Remember that the "First Person View" is the one dreaming everything, including other people. "Non dualism" and "Solipsism" are only terms to define something, but they are not optional, its what your experience actually is. Our own existence is "non dualistic"/"solipsistic" by itself, if you pay enough attention.

>Vampire: The Masquerade
A lot of media is founded on lower truths, because conflicts and drama are candy for a vast array of people on the iron age. But the true is that evolution across expansion is as, if not, more exciting than imaginary conflicts that leads nowhere. But, nothing wrong with it, as long as being aware that the characters are all dreaming, and part of a dream, which could make these things more enjoyable! But always, hold the greater truth as paramount, i'd say, you could make more sense of your world, and reconcile this knowledge with it.

>>41115010
After getting some things done, inner returns would be my next step. If you read his Complete Works pdf, the stories from the earlier documents have some inner returns situations to get a basic idea of the premise.

>>41115016
I've never looked into this UL stuff. Are the "Complete Works" in the order in which I should read them for the first time?

>>41115058
*cough*... The op... this thread... read them, Anon... *dies*

>Universal Line
https://archive.org/details/UL-the-complete-works
>>41111769
>>41112079

Very important post from Oneirosophy answering the following
>"Why don't we discuss our own experiences more in this sub?"

>>41115198
Of course, despite how wonderful Oneirosophy is, reddit will always be reddit... I'll hope that the 4chan iteration knows better, and get that there is no need to partake in any piss measuring contest

>>41115063
So should I start with ATWA or advanced portrait painting? Those two indexes appear to be completely different, as in there is zero commonality between them.

>>41115216
No, let me explain. The index is the chronology of the papers, because they are unsorted, so if you want to read all of it, that's the chronological order, so you don't get lost reading at random and hoping for the best. The other answer is a recommended starting point, by the reasons it explains.
>"So, what do i do?"
What you see fit.

>>41114371
>TG perspective on synchronicity over manifestation

Remember that, when examining the sources listed from the OP, and taking in mind the insight and ideas from other anons, you are not putting yourself under some foreign thumb.
>You are your own master.
Think of John and George, not as "teachers", or gurus, or a replacement for your invisible dad, but fellow dreamers that share with you the facts, foundations, and useful ideas about how to go forward across your own world. For the Oneirosopher, "The Truth" is the only oracle they have, and his own "higher ideal" his only path to follow.

>Something about Universal Line
When you catch the analogy of the "transparent sphere" as your own field of perception, suddenly, the "orb" that mages of mythologies and media makes more sense, isn't it?

>>41115485
>that mages of mythologies and media ponders*

Okay, i read advanced portrait painting through universal line for an hour, taking it slowly as i should, i had an impression this will be a pretentious world-salad but the author actually puts effort to explain his abstract concepts through a fun dialogue-like method mixed with fun pictures, in general, he is holding your hand through the material, there is also a sense of him playing the devil's advocate with you to make sure he clears any confusion or doubts that the reader might have

>>41115341
this needs to be in every upcoming /one/ thread

>>41114362
>I have been practicing or trying to practice various forms of the LOA
Just for the record, Oneirosophy is not LoA, UL is not LoA, and Sorcery and Magic in general is not LoA either. I feel a bit dumb pointing out the obvious, but it's useful considering that people are coming from the other general to here. People have erroneous misconceptions, and think that whatever New Ager invention is the root of the matter, when a simple examination shows directly that's not the case (Use your eyes! Use your head!). LoA is LoA, i mean, Law of Attraction and Law of Assumption, and this stuff in here, is the stuff in here. There are no laws to abide in your own dream, the root meaning of the world Law implies binding of sorts under a regulated environment, "i need to follow this or else...", there's no such a thing if you follow the fundamentals correctly.
>Pic related
>>41115845
The OP is already at character limit, and it has everything necessary, but the archives will do just fine (it would be a great reminder and incetive for the new blood to "lurk moar"). Also, when you examine the core idea from the fundamentals listed in the sticky, it means the exactly same thing in the post you pointed at.

>>41115836
People who give their impressions on UL (emphasis on "impressions") are people that probably never read the material themselves. A general habit of the Neville general is not reading the sources, not even Neville, so they see the UL material, and they are immediately shut down by the aesthetic, and then further shut down by the implications of it. They probably just read an opinion of john stuff of someone who saw another opinion, of someone who saw an screenshot of someone who was a former student and thus an interpreter... And then you wonder where you went wrong lol

Also, i never get the general attitude of the neville general towards John stuff. Neville will say that the user can be "god", but you have to take his word for granted, and undertake all sorts of remedies (quite the contradiction here...), but then you have another guy that actually can show you WHY you're THAT in the first place, and the fullest extent of it. So why do they cower? Pointing out what you simply see and gathering your own personal evidence furthers your own "self awareness" towards lucidity, more useful than worshipping idols.

>>41115905
kek, it's kinda hard to find anyone who has an opinion on the U.L online (wether they read it or not) i found some stuff here:
https://www.reddit.com/search/?q=john+paolucci&type=comments&cId=e1e0abc5-fdd8-4e5f-ae36-c10b725c6142&iId=0112e051-56bb-49b6-9ccf-875f6d060443

no idea which percent of them actually read the material fully, when they can just ask A.I to "sum" it up or rely on the opinion of another guy who heard a 2 sentances summary of the U.L

>>41115962
>Use AI
Yeah...about that. I don't have the screenshot in handy, but when i used to lurk on /pol/ the AI couldn't even give an simple answer to "How many years have been since X". AI could be very deceitful and omit information or misinterpreting ideas too, because they are programmed using as a baseline a "ordinary wisdom person". It COULD work, but i don't use it because it fails and lie more than it serve. If they couldn't even get a date right, how i can rely in this roko basilik to give me a qrd in metaphysical knowledge????

Either way, it's something else to consider. Remember that magic always existed, with or without "AI" and the industrial age. Internet served the purpose as a nexus to connect all realities and discover this knowledge, but computer technology as a replacement of your own magical thinking is...not something i would opt for.

>>41115905
"You're the Operant power/God, bro"
but...
>nooooooooo, you gotta mental diet
>noooooooooooooo, you gotta detach
>nooooooooooooooooo, how dare you say you are tired of waiting for many months of 0 improvement
>nooooooooooooo, how dare you check the 3D
>you have limiting beliefs preventing you from manifesting
>you have limiting beliefs deeply engraved in your subconsious mind from a very long time preventing you from manifesting
>your desire/affirmation/assumption/scene did not feel natural to you

I love Neville and believe his stuff work but, it's a system full of rules and regulations, contradicting its whole premise

>>41115993
You don't have to repost it, but yeah, i get that. It's not exclusive to Neville, but every single new ager or new thought material out there, because they apply religious doctrines and behaviour but remove the religious premise. One worse than Neville is that "A Course in Miracles" thing, a big new age tome that it's really dumb, and is along Zeland "Reality Sneed" the
>big ass book of nothing burger
Few pages in, you have Jesus lecturing you about "magic is le bad..." despite telling you RIGHT after how he himself used magic and he used it as well to "communicate this stuff to you". Who writes this shit? Besides, you also have jesus talking about freud. Why? I mean, this is Ao3 bottom of the barrel tier fan fiction (Why Freud in the first place? Why not Jung? Isn't more fitting?). It has some interesting bits like that remark of Adam not waking up from his dream on Eden, but that's it, the rest (specially the remaining books beyond the first) is pure behavioral remedies for the christcucked. Sigh... New Age is trash, and i will live on this hill.

Anyway, this is all about seeing the core idea of it. Reality have layers, like ogres, that are like onions. We have Neville material, remove a layer, and you have new age material, remove a layer, and you will find the core idea, remove a layer, and you will find the conclusion of said idea, and there you can evaluate properly, and probably end up: "Well, this fucking sucks!", and you discard everything about it.
>Instead of the leaf, aim straight to the root, and the entire vine of trouble dies.
Like aiming straight for the head of the snake. If you have the fundamentals in mind, you have no issue navigating your world. You won't fall for a trap or a dead end like the new thought or occultism ever again.

>>41116040
Pretty cool, let us see where this leads me

>>41115871
>There are no laws to abide in your own dream
Then why does John Paolucci declare there are 7 rules?

>>41116237
>7 rules
What? Do you refer to the non change attributes (twelve)? Or the "five laws of the universe"? Either way, the attributes are "non change" from the "Ultimate reference field", while the five laws of the universe is actually a metaphorical premise that he uses to explain reality as a dream. That's my present understanding of it.

>>41116291
So there are or aren't laws?

>>41116319
That's a good question. So, there are? Your dream, your rules.

Why at the end of Advanced Portrait Painting does John advise that if one is gullible enough to believe him, to seek a psychological professional?

>>41116481
Probably is a way to tell you to be cautious and relying on your own judgement instead of just believe him because he told you so.

In so far my understanding at the moment, Neville tells you that you are the creator/operant power but even that implies a separation from the world around you, J.P directly tells you that it's all you, a dream you have, you are everything in his system, no separation between you and your reality

>>41116843
just like everything, person or event in a dream is still always just on dream, thought etc. it never stops being you only an illusion of separation, or wave

>>41116878
I 'll be honest, in spite of reading it carefully and J.P doing his very best to explain things in a digestable and approachable way, am still struggling with "getting it"
but am only a single hour in, the text is over 800 pages long, there is a lot of space for all sorts of types of explanations, metaphores, re-phrasings, Q.A, and etc
not to mention the practice/exercises/first hand experiences that i can have

>>41117048
even jp himself encourages to reread multiple times, its such a "simple" concept but grasping it and embodying it takes a lot of work to rewire how we perceive the totality of oap, i still struggle with it myself

>>41117181
ugh, well he is trying his best to explain overly complicated subjects to a layman's mind, i can easily see that, i respect his effort, i have to put some effort too

>>41117181
>>41117048
kek, it took me a whole hour to get through 12 pages, but that's okay, no need to be in a hurry

>>41117181
There was this anon in /loa/ few threada ago that spammed 10 hours of listening to brain tracy, then earl nightingale and later jospeh murhpy and NG. He did it for a month and he keeps going more. He manifests fast now and is a whole new person, all his beliefs shifted to positive beliefs etc. so i'm thinking imagine listening to complete UL works for few hours a day, for a month, you will be so intuitive with it, it will be a second nature and your returns will flow effortlessly as you integrated and infused UL identity. Relevant pic

are JP's older works still good like DBS? Am I going to miss anything big if I read the old stuff but not the new stuff? What changed really?

Does Paolucci ever say how he developed UL? I know it's mechanical facts, but did he always notice them even as a kid or was he already knowledgable about metaphysics before realizing UL?

>>41111583 (OP)
I'm the anon that made this post. >>41088555

I didn't want to shit up that /loa/ thread with more of my success story. that end part where i talk about Christian sorcery. I can slap some info here for you guys about it. I haven't even started, but essentially you learn to go into 3 alternate realms that are attached to this reality.

when you go into these 3 realms you get 3 magical powers. one power from each realm.
1. the power to heal the sick
2. the power to command all machinery including computers.
3. the power to kill on command (like darth vaders force choke)

after you go through these 3 realms you enter what i presume to be purgatory. After that you meet an angelic guadian and he teaches you stuff before you can pass beyond him.

Once you pass beyond him you're allowed to meet "Christ" not jesus christ, but the entity that is Christ. This christ entity is what jesus had in him as well as every other incarnation of "christ".

After you meet "christ" you're allowed to meet another guardian and then if you pass that you can go into Angel world and chill with angels. From there on you are gifted with more magical powers.

>>41111677
>Any thoughts on Castaneda stuff?
It works bro, but that castaneda sub reddit is ban happy and all the information on how to move forward is jumbled up in the wiki. I've told them to fix it, but they refuse. That place gets at least 3 new people every week, but the mods scare them away by talking mad shit to noobs.

I've barely scratched the surface myself. I figured out how to go into dream land and instead of moving forward to awaken my double, i'm just fucking dream girls and going into fantastic voyages. kek.

I should have already tapped the double and should be in the deep red zone, but i'm still in beginner red zone enjoying life. I have no need to become a sorcery. I just want to coom. kek

>>41117563
I forgot to mention that you have to accept christ as your lord and savior otherwise when you go into those 3 hell realms you're going to get royally fucked up and gang raped by multi-dimensional beings that can stalk you day and night.

awake or asleep without accepting christ you're fucked.

You're literally meeting demons, devils and all sorts of evil entities that want to keep you from meeting christ. Also there's no group help. you're own your own on the journey and if you get fucked up, then you're fucked.

good luck anon.

>>41117631
how do you start it though? what christian sorcery tradition is this specifically?

>>41117212
Yet he didn't nor will he accomplish anything.

>>41117212
there's nothing scientific there, imagine the kind of person who made that, i say it as a Neville-fag

>>41117212
>Implying The Universal line is the same as Neville's slop that lacks any substance

>>41117212
No sane person would partake in any of this mental labour. Is either real or not, don't need to prove something that's not there

>>41117212
MFKer thinks listening to Shitville's lectures on repeat thousands of times will make them manifest anything
you have to go back

>>41117961
Even john paolucci says to retain material good, listen when you're doing commute. He did that himself and he said he learned something new everytime he listened. I'm just making an argument for listening to UL 4+ hours

>>41118007
This is basic repetition and learning, something we all need, since nobody here is even close to FFE

>>41118025
NTA but the problem is that John stuff is centered around the idea of getting used to the truth (the world as your own dream realm), while Neville is more of a self help author with infinite amount of remedies on top of that. The idea of getting UL with osmosis trought repetition makes sense because is all about remembering who you are (any notion of failure or strain the user have is result of forgetting) so you just let your natural thought process do most of the heavy lifting. Neville and Murphy are insane, and have you to make all that stuff listed in that image apparently. UL is like walking, you don't remind yourself that your feet is touching the floor, you just walk without a second thought, you act normal because is not a bizarre add on, its how it always has been.

>>41117212
The "subconscious" is a completely made up shit from New Agers to conceal magic and create a sisyphean task for people to keep selling books. They played us all like absolute fools.

>>41118173
it's their way to rationalize that stuff but lol Neville tells you that you are le operant power but he still tells you to work on impressing your subconsious mind, as if it's the engine that does all the manifestation and you are reliant on it, so much for le God

>>41117341
After "God of Command of the Universe" is where his most prominent bits start, and from Portrait Painting and on, he finally introduce the concept of Universal Line.

>>41118192
What's there to rationalize? Is either true or not, and if isn't, then there's no reason to keep downing over it. If anything, that's coping, that's being in denial.

>>41118377
their hippie-fembrained shit

Couldn't stop thinking about becoming a big titty futa all day at work.
I need more motivation

>>41117212
>Knowing the truth right off the bat is not recommended for beginners
Talking about misleading...Book deal mentality. There's are no books to buy anymore.

>>41117212
Absolute state of Neville cucks

In the original Oneirosophy forum, some users shared media that assimilated the dream-world metaphor in some sense. One of my favorites "outsider artist" made very interesting animated videos that truly encapsulate the general disjointed nature of dreams. Very interesting stuff overall.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GOJgBxMM6Q
https://youtu.be/pNvZbHT4WyA

>I went to sleep in my dreadful little bachelor’s flat—a police flat—at Earlsfield after starting to look through Staniland’s property. Bowman had sent it over in an old suitcase. I dreamed that far below me, under the walls of a ruined fortress, there was a field faded brown by drought with rocks lying in it. I was abroad somewhere—somewhere that smelled—and sitting on a terrace that I suddenly found was made of rotten canvas. My legs dangled over the edge and my feet were so far from the ground that the soles tingled. On either side of me well-dressed people chatted to each other, unconcerned. Then the whole structure yawed, swayed and fell devastatingly away; I screamed as I fell towards the field with the rocks in it. ‘They have to get you in the end,’ Staniland remarked calmly as we fell together, ‘otherwise there’d be no end to the pointlessness.’
>I woke up sweating.

── Derek Raymond, "He Died with His Eyes Open" (1984)

>>41117643
NTA but if i have to guess, he's using the stuff that Castaneda taught along Christian aesthetics and proactive metaphors.

>>41117563
>that castaneda sub reddit is ban happy and all the information on how to move forward is jumbled up in the wiki
Imo, i think /r/Castaneda stuff is off topic for Oneirosophy. The original Castaneda material is useful, yeah, but that community is something entirely unrelated to us. They abolish manifestation, is not idealistic at all, and, in general, they are a bunch of nutjobs the lot of them lol. Honest to god reddit schizos that still act upon the worst part of the site. Kind of a shame, because they are really fucking close in some aspects, but it would melt their redditors brains to a puddle...

>>41120416
Yeah, it cannot be re-conciliated, i will make some adjustments to the OP in the next bake, but if anyone want to get into that rabbit hole, well, there it is...

>>41111583 (OP)
>DimensionalJumping

Try this for "Qliphothic Hell Dimensions".
https://archive.org/details/TheBookOfSitraAchra/page/n103/mode/2up
">Every single one of us live in their own reality. Your world is your private dream.

No; we live in a shared world. However; not everyone around you is a real soul; some are spirits interacting with you.
Not all people are "first person percievers of reality"; some are interacting with your experience of reality ("imps").
Government is very imp based (God "mains" Necropolis civilization for macro; ie civilization is built through spiritual strategy games; loads of people are "undead racial group"; skeletons, ghosts and fairys etc.
"imp" is a very broad general term for "non real soul"; "Minion type intellect"; loads of different types of imps.
You can get involved in imp-summoning yourself. For example the Quimbandan tradition ("inferno genome culture") is the source of most of the hip-hop scene; rappers tend to be "Exu Hellhound imps" coming from someones involvement is "dabbling in the occult". See hellhound pet minion in "Grim Dawn" occultist class; compare to hiphop artists and "freddy krueger" (notable "Exu Hellhound").

>>41120507
>No; we live in a shared world.
Stopped reading there.

>>41120507
You believe in all this crazy bullshit but the idea of solipsism and magical idealism is too "out there" for you? Really?

>>41114907
Anon, I believe you are correct but I personally wouldn't classify neville as "new thought" or even new age for that matter. The entire dilemma of /loa/ was that, at its start people would actually come in, read the material, and master it, but now it's become a victim of the same exact proof loop discussions about "am I doing it right?", "resistance", "impressing the subconscious" and other meaningless garbage as r/nevillegoddard is. As TriumphantGeorge (who said that Neville was one of the giants of his philosophy) would say are more concerned with 'flitting about' than actually practicing anything, and this leads them to try and solve problems that simply aren't there. Neville himself despised second causes, and at the end of his life completely got rid of things like the golden rule (that one lecture or book where he said that other people are just mechanized dolls to the dreamer). I still think Neville or really any kind of information is useful for Oneirosophy if 'read correctly', because we are cultivating wisdom after all.

>>41117212
>scientific
get the fuck away from me

>>41120507
This is some top tier occult larping. I too am an imp based God who does hip hop and dresses like Freddy Kreuger.

>>41120597
>I still think Neville or really any kind of information is useful for Oneirosophy if 'read correctly', because we are cultivating wisdom after all.
This is absolutely the correct mindset. With the fundamentals in mind, whatever you come across are only tools that you decide to adapt. When you read text, what you are actually doing trough interpretation is re-imagining ideas that "fit into your dreamworld". You do it with a solid foundation in mind, in this case, the fundamentals of /one/

On a side note (and noticing a pattern here), i'm starting to think that, for the 4chan version of Oneirosophy (making an exception with George and the original forum, obviously), i'ts advisable to stay away from subreddits, because it's obvious that from the nature of that site, they desecrate and process ideas that give a nonconstructive impression of the sources.
>/r/NevilleGoddard
>/r/Castaneda
>/r/nonduality
Reddit communities and the redditor's mind is absolutely detrimental influence. Although, it can't actually "influence" you if you are clear in the fundamentals, and consider that most of the things you have read so far in the Neville general have a lot of misconceptions about exploring the subjective experience (Not to mention the normalfag target audience, and the hostility towards proficient posters).

>>41120507
>Not all people are "first person percievers of reality"
From which perspective did you type this post? You silly bozo

>>41120854
Denton, stay out of the ladies restroom. That kind of activity embarrasses the agency more than it does you.

>>41120880
Ngl, as Oneirosopher, i sometimes feel like a secret agent myself

As far as i get it, the /loa/ general seems to be a container space for the normies, retards and women to sniff their farts, while /one/ is for the people that just want the truth no matter what. Cool place all around, has potential

>>41120597
Wait, I heard Neville actually got rid of the entre subconsious concept later in his last lectures

here is a 2017 q&a which is not in the compendium for you UL content addicts

https://files.catbox.moe/6l3bph.pdf

there seems to be a big emphasis in J.P's writings relating to the alleged fact that we constantly play a hide and seek game with our selves and everyone around us, with the limited perception and lack of realization of our identity as being the supreme cosmic commander in each respective reality of one of us, it's like I am the God whos the fabric of this reality emenates from but i somehow made it that i put my self in the identity of a regular-nobody to gaslight myself into believeing i am not the source and commander of everything in my verse

>>41121460
It is! Refer to the one in the internet archive, is the the first document actually

>>41121764
>>41121460
Oh, wait.
>The compedium
You were referring to the drive folder. My bad, sorry, im still a bit sleepy. Yeah, the folder also doesn't have the latest text or the DBS one. Still, thanks for the posts

>>41121469
If you get deeper and deeper in the manifestation phenomenon, you will realize sooner or later that either nothing works, or everything does. The only common factor would be the experiencer itself, as any given method made with an particular intent in mind would have an effect. When people revise methods endlessly (like a power coming from some spirit, or his "positive vibes"), they run in circles trying to track them down as the source, which is part of said "hide and seek game". There's also the thing about "knowing". I think that what Paolucci and John are explaining (which is closer to "it" than other sources) is pretty much the "endgame" of it all. The root meaning of the word "Mage" comes from "wise man", which means that the mage knows, not "knows everything" in the literal sense, but "everything needed to know about reality", the cover up uncovered.

It also made me realize how things like physics, science, math and general industrial age ordinary wisdom stuff (the ordinary western view of things) is part of said cover up, because all of that cease to be a thing once you realize that is all a dream. There used to be an entirely different world before all that noise that was just fine after all.

>>41121859
>Paolucci and John
George and John i mean. Jesus, i am really sleepy.

>>41118538
>Motivation
It seems that you got a pretty good motive going on there.

>>41117936
There's nothing "scientific" about the subjective experience, at all. Sources that claim to be end up hitting their heads against the wall sooner than later because of the implications.

>>41120953
>silver case
Kino as fuck, and oddly appropriate for this general

>>41111583 (OP)
You can't have any dream wisdom without real life events following the dreams.
Which means you can read the dreams and analyse the psychological and current circumstances of thousands of people and gain absolutely nothing.
And you can have dreams and remember them to interpret once they happen irl and gain some wisdom

>>41121859
I mean yes, even in L.O.A circles you get to hear:
"affirmations/visualzation work through you, not the reverse"
>it also made me realize how things like physics, science, math and general industrial age ordinary wisdom stuff (the ordinary western view of things) is part of said cover up, because all of that cease to be a thing once you realize that is all a dream. There used to be an entirely different world before all that noise that was just fine after all.

big if true, people worry about muh circumstances and life's hardships when they might literally be capeable of flying or releasing lazer from their eyes, almost comical

the thing is that if people are conditioned and programmed to believe since birth that something is impossible for them or that they have limits, they 'll go with that belief for life, as opposite to someone who is born in a place or time where they are free of any of such said programming

>>41121883
>oddly appropriate for this general
Kill the past in general! Specifically from the original TSC to Killer 7 and 25th ward, they are great examples for the Oneirosophic view of reality in some aspects, specially the story around the character "Tokio Morishima"

>The reason why Tokio portrait changes when the perspective of the storyline does is because each character percieve reality in his own way, including Tokio himself.
>At the end of 25th ward, Morishima character get a consistent portrait across all storylines POV, materializing his inner look
The most remarkable example of the bunch would be Flower Sun And Rain, which is presented as, literally, an entire dream unfolding in real time.

4chan is the place that TG would have preferred over reddit, because this platform is heavily skeptical so it serves a great purpouse to the Oneirosophic cause.
>Anons come here, ask questions or make remarks
>Others give insight about the subjective experience, they both learn
>The seniors move on, while the noobs hang around and become more proeficent. The cycle goes on

It's a useful loop.

>>41121900
This stuff doesnt even have to do with the supernatural, is ordinary life lessons 101 that if you don't decide to go beyond boundaries for ypurself, you will stay there as much as you agree to. Your ideals are there for a reason, its for you to find out about this.

>>41120953
>has potential
Yeah, don't blew it retards. As far as i'm concerned, this is the most useful place on /x/ as we speak.

>>41111583 (OP)
Before I woke up right now I had a dream that I was with my dad and my grandma, and in a chest of drawers I discovered a plastic bag with a preserved black and white guinea pig inside, and I showed it to my dad and said
>I don't think this is alive
and my dad said
>I know that. That's Tezu. Remember Tezu, mom? We needed to get his grandmother's permission to bury him.
But I somehow wordlessly was aware that Tezu had been dead for decades and that, naturally, having the lifespan of a guinea pig, so was Tezu's grandmother.

What is the significance of Tezu?

>>41121927
I will be honest, I have been in this Neville-rabbit hole for a while by now, and i am currently reading the U.L, but even then i still feel like a tiny bug in this world, not the source or God, i guess being a massive "failure/loser" of a human being (normie terms, yeah) causes you to have a poor self esteem, i am not really trying to turn this into a vent/therapy/whinning post but yes i struggle to identify as my true self that of being the source of everything around me

>>41121951
I was going to say that certain people with low self esteem do fine all the time, but i realized that you never truly "know" about what's going inside of them, it could be all a ruse; but it's because it is! When you "get" or "know" how a person is feeling, you actually made that up, you just imagined it and accepted it on the spot. What happens inside other people in your dream is all a guessing game, you see what you want to see because they're also part of the same source. But the presence you call (You) is the only one (as far it concerns you) the only person in the world about you can know for certain what's going on inside, what does he know, what does he do, what does he feels, what's going on. That's the "One all person" there.

>>41121936
Real slow too... I guess is because it requires actual knowledge, study, application and subjective experience to be discussed. It's "fools proof" to say the least.

>>41120416
I agree with a post made back then. If you stand as Oneirosopher, and create a synthesis of TG, UL and CC, you basically have the truth of reality itself. You of course have to realize that with your own interpretation and inner realization (You can't fool your mental faculties, but we can play the fools if we lie to ourselves for awhile).

>>41121937
Dreams have the meaning you gave them, because the experiences you have also have the meaning you gave them. I know about a guy that is totally at margin when it comes to /x/ related stuff that keep having dream premonitions all the time since youth, but it's more of a pre defined or fixed pattern in his own experience.

Dreams could be anything: A mesh of memories, random variations of places where you has previously been at, entirely different worlds; people say that your "dream reach" only goes as far as your experiences you had so far but i beg to differ greatly, as
>First
You can imagine all sorts of scenarios, even the ones you didn't experience (your desires, the pre conceived "limits" you have, even your interpretation of ideas, comes purely from imagination)
>Second
All kind of patterns are already contained in your conciusness (In another, more ordinary way to put it, in your neural network repos, already present within your brain)
Anyway, keep exploring.
PD: That's a cute little buddy there, it would make a good dream companion.

>>41121980
the way i see it is that when you are a "giga-loser" who has failed at many things in life and you get into this manifestation shit/reality creation shit you 'd have doubts if you can even do conscious manifest, because you have failed at so many ordirnary things, let alone something esoteric or metaphysical (sorry for the buzzwords)
if you can see what i mean, but this is not my vent post or anything, i have been told i have to trust in my self and the process
>When you "get" or "know" how a person is feeling, you actually made that up, you just imagined it and accepted it on the spot. What happens inside other people in your dream is all a guessing game, you see what you want to see because they're also part of the same source. But the presence you call (You) is the only one (as far it concerns you) the only person in the world about you can know for certain what's going on inside, what does he know, what does he do, what does he feels, what's going on. That's the "One all person" there.

that's a useful insight, thank you, even going by everyday logic and common sense, i can't ever insert my mind into the head of the guy or girl next to me and know what is going on inside of his or her head

>>41122219
Any notion of "success" or "failure" is also made up by you. A normal farmer in the offsprings can be seen "as failure" in contrast to someone of "higher status" but in reality he live a normal and fulfilled live by himself and doesn't mind. Winning or failing is a dualistic notion that you yourself also created (literally, as is your personal orientation in life) and there's no such a thing in a dream; only indifferent actions of the first cause and its effects, everything else (emotional aspects) are part of the sensory theater and not with the source. Trace back these aspects to your experience so far across your world.

>>41121889
>You can't have any dream wisdom without real life events following the dreams.
Elaborate. The rest of your post doesn't follow this remark, as your experience doesn't seems to be "altered" at all if i get what you're saying correctly.

>>41121917
The Neville general seems to be trapped in a sort of fixed pattern / "proof loop" cycle itself.

> General get stuck -> A anon makes significant discoveries -> The general start to chimp out and the good posters get exiled -> general get stuck...

Of course, this was since the ULAnon thing, when people were starting to be able to explain their reasoning and the mechanics of the subject, but now that the /r/Neville audience decided once and for all to become neville purists, i really doubt that studies on reality / subjective experience will ever get any post on there ever again. After all, it was a moment when they had the monopoly of manifestation on the board, and there was no other place to publish findings and insight. As for /one/ goes, tripfags are also welcome to hang out, but the problem is that they will have to get serious to get any interest from the general. I'm starting to think that there's no need to gatekeep after all, as Oneirosophy (the way of truth) gatekeeps itself just fine. Hmmm

>>41111583 (OP)
John Paolucci seems more and more a fraud to me.

The knife-fork allegory isn’t clear at all. First, he says that space is the common denominator of these two objects. But then he argues that we additionally need time to accurately define the knife or the fork.

But notice how this makes TWO "things", TWO "common denominators", not just 1, required to present an object (; and no, saying "attributes" is just wordplay).

So the knife (or fork) becomes a common denominator for space and time, not the other way around, since "space" and "time" are too vague and abstract concepts.

So you already can’t resolve this flawed argumentation, and it's even before this "first big simple fact" gets proven (it's not). I'm stuck in this part and can’t move on.

>>41122261
Thank you.

>And in the bloodlit dark behind his eyes, silver phosphenes boiling in from the edge of space, hypnagogic images jerking past like film compiled from random frames. >Symbols, figures, faces, a blurred, fragmented mandala of visual information.
>Please, he prayed, now—
>A gray disk, the color of Chiba sky.
>Now—
>Disk beginning to rotate, faster, becoming a sphere of paler gray.
>Expanding—
>And flowed, flowered for him, fluid neon origami trick, the unfolding of his distanceless home, his country, transparent 3D chessboard extending to infinity. Inner eye opening to the stepped scarlet pyramid of the Eastern Seaboard Fission Authority burning beyond the green cubes of Mitsubishi Bank of America, and high and very far away he saw the spiral arms of military systems, forever beyond his reach.
And somewhere he was laughing, in a white-painted loft, distant fingers caressing the deck, tears of release streaking his face.
── William Gibson, "Neuromancer" (1984)

Gibson had some correct ideas about the flexibility of consciousness and presence, and it was the main vehicle across his most remarkable novel, bouncing across the cybernetic realm and the dystopic industrial landscape. Isn't the hallucination knows as the matrix also a "collective dream"? I think "Neuromancer" inspired stories would be actually way more interesting if they lead into the metaphysical rather than the trashhumanistic side of the current age. Maybe Oneirosophy is the true future after all!

>>41122374
>John Paolucci seems more and more a fraud to me.
I couldn't even bring myself to read the rest of your post. Everyone is a fraud because nobody is. If what John its explaining to you doesn't ring any bells, then try another source on the matter and see how they are connected or how it can be of use for you. But if your basis of examination is all about "personal posturing about a guy i don't like", you are, probably, wasting your time instead of doing research with the correct focus and getting to work. Consider also that this is only you shooting yourself in the foot and hindering your own progress.

>>41122393
>>41119608
What a synchronicity there. I didn't have in mind posting two novel excerpts about dreams that were published in the same year, and have nothing to do with each other. Nice.

>>41121873
I mean I know what I want but I'm just completely lost when it's time to do anything and I just let my thoughts run wild instead of focusing

>>41122532
If your "thoughts running wild" impede you to do anything /one/ related, take a rest. Seriously, we just go on rampage blindly for a good chunk of adult life that we don't bother to just pause, even for a dozen minutes, and lay yourself to rest. Even once a day, is good to pause and just let the experience run havoc, because if your efforts for any cause seems to be useless or even make matters worse, then why not just simply stand by and get off the ride? Even once. In that way, you can even trace back why your mind is in the current state, from where is your inner content coming from, and deducing things from there. Focus on solution, not in problems.

>>41122415

I'm literally laying out which points in the knife-fork passage don't make sense.

Why don't you yourself explain to us why the argumentation makes any sense, if you know better?
You're attacking me for no reason.

>>41122632
>You're attacking me for no reason.
No, you consider my remarks an attack, i'm only telling you what i think. I have to remind you that you're on 4chan and this is board culture on display, /LoA/ (and the rest of /x/) has conditioned you to believe you're somewhere else, so you will also have to remember that as much as needed. You should expect the kind of fixation and attentiveness you would find on the best off topic thread on /v/.

Anyway. So, you're failing to get a metaphor...so what? What of it? What that proves? (Or not). As i said, if you have a hard time with UL stuff, just drop it, find another source, or do something else that is more worth your time. This is only a suggestion, and you would do as you see fit either way. I'm not a "UL prophet" and i don't act in a "me against it" kind of way, i act under the fundamentals in which this school of thought is founded, and UL material is incredibly useful to extrapolate on that, even in parts that the OG /one/ crew didn't even reach. Get your perspective in order, and calm the fuck down. You have nothing to prove, only things to do... I guess.

>>41122632
Also
>if you know better?
Another faltering, if you allow me to observe. I don't know better than anyone, period. I only know enough to get by. In the other general some other poster called John a loser because he live his life in a way that doesn't make sense to him, so if you follow the logic, he may as well conclude that we're all a bunch morons losers that are deluding themselves and go back to the neville group or whatever other hole he crawled from, because there is a real possibility that we're all just trolling just like the nobody general and jay ray threads does. NOBODY in the world will fulfill your personal ideals and you are playing the fool waiting for someone to do so.

>>41122663
Alright, whatever.
This isn't a metaphor, it's an analogy, JP tries to logically deduce a "mechanical fact" out of this supposed analogy. But it's contradictive and doesn't make sense. That's what I'm saying.

>>41122683
>This isn't a metaphor, it's an analogy, JP tries to logically deduce a "mechanical fact" out of this supposed analogy. But it's contradictive and doesn't make sense. That's what I'm saying.
It can't be contradictory. If you read all of his documents, the overall lesson remains the same. At this point, he just blatantly try to remedy with the easier most comfortable "option of least resistance" he can come up with because nobody can get what it means be "consciousness" or presence. They keep being fixed on the metaphors and observations of the world, instead of looking at the big picture. As for my suggestion, as you said you were stuck, you can do either of these two
>Keep reading the text until it clicks, and you get what you "need to get" from it.
Or
>Drop it, and either try again later when it makes more sense, or check other sources, or do something else idk

If we keep going further down this conversation, we're gonna run in circles. You will have to jump over it with your next move. Best of lucks.

>>41122706
>It can't be contradictory.
Okay, then why does he first say just space, but then brings up time as another necessary "attribute" to define the knife/fork? So space alone can't be the common reference field for objects, whatever JP even means by "space", it's not scientific;
None of these points are resolved.

As for the rest of your post, JP literally makes clear that his arguments are all based on self-verifying logical facts, that I should approach this with a skeptical attitude.

>>41122752
>Okay, then why does he first say just space, but then brings up time as another necessary "attribute" to define the knife/fork? So space alone can't be the common reference field for objects, whatever JP even means by "space", it's not scientific;
I don't know what specific parts are you correlating here, or what texts from the matter are you reading, but i'm going to tell you this: The "non change attributes" John is talking about, is actually the properties of a dream world. Let's use some of them to hammer the point home: So, if you're dreaming, it makes sense that every choice you make is "the correct one", even if you define it as a "mistake" (Practice and general learning experience, even in ordinary means, follow this flow of events), because in a dream, in a subjective reality, you define by yourself what is good or bad, so it's always perfect choice, and sufficient supply as well because the target delivers when it does. Another one is the "All knowing, all seeing, all doing"; if you know that you're dreaming, then that's all there is to know, you're the only person doing anything at all there, and seeing what's there is to see, because anything else is just that, the dream unfolding.

Under Oneirosophy perspective, the 12 attributes of the OAP are
>The properties of your dream world
Try to examine these attributes under this perspective, and see if it makes more sense that way.

>>41122551
I'm trying to focus on exercises and doing rather than reading. Although I don't really know what the exercises consist of besides trying to completely blank out your thoughts and "feel" for stuff.

I also get too excited at the idea of being a stacked futa and envision it too much.

>>41122752
>As for the rest of your post, JP literally makes clear that his arguments are all based on self-verifying logical facts, that I should approach this with a skeptical attitude.

Yes! That follows one of the fundamentals of /one/
>An open mind combined with healthy caution is the correct mindset for all approaches targeted at the subjective experience. Never believe something without personal evidence; never dismiss something without personal evidence.
You have to get going from the starting point that your life is your own dream, and see how the logic, your train of thought, can make sense of this statement naturally. Remember that this is about TRUTH, not make a believe, and your present perception is not a basis for guidance, because you're not that, you're beyond that. At least, you are if you're following this to the fullest extent.

>>41122784
>I also get too excited at the idea of being a stacked futa and envision it too much.
This can only be a problem if you threat it as such. When you were a kid, you probably got excited about a million of things and regardless you had a good time either way. Instead of trying to act like "le heckin serious adulting muh spiritual path", act just as you truly are. Instead of trying to frame your goals with anxiety, see them with ambition.

I swear guys, so many people get conviction even under the most insignificant of things and causes. Now that you know that this life is your dream, and you can accomplish everything you can imagine trough the truth, why act timid all of the sudden?

>>41122812
Well I want to be serious about it rather than just fantasize about my 16" long futa cock all day

>>41122818
Then just do it. But don't think that any sensory theater like your feelings or thoughts, or any of that inner content is impeding you, keep that in mind.

>>41122752
>it's not scientific
Oneirosophy is not scientific. Will "science" as is popularly know nowadays even be a thing if this is a dream?
Also see >>41121880

>>41120507
Take this shit to /loa/ they'll love it.

Hey guys. Been disillusioned regarding this stuff (including LOA) for a couple years now, but earlier this week I decided to look into it again. I came across SMAnon/shifting magick, tried the hand raising thing and failed, read some of the UL stuff and found it unconvincing. Went on the dimension jumping subreddit very briefly and wasn't really interested. I decided to move on. Anyway, today I was trying to find out about the project Gadaffi was trying to build, with giant concrete pipes, to create a sea within a depression in Libya. Anyway, I came across the Qattara Depression Project, which is in Egypt, and the Great Man-Made River Project which includes giant concrete pipes, and is in Libya, but has nothing to do with creating a sea. Anyway, I know this is more Mandela Effect, but it seems related, and has certainly made me interested in this stuff once again - though I don't know where to go from here.

>>41123015
Could you care to share some details about these projects you mention? Also, another outstanding synchronicity from my end, i was about to post something similar regardless "locations" that historians nowadays can't figure out if they ever existed.

>The image of the Piri Rei's map was scanned from the frontpiece of a first edition of Hapgood's Maps of the Ancient Sea Kings. Most theories about ancient unknown civilizations are based on absolutely no physical evidence, usually just hearsay and speculation. What really would shake the basis of our knowledge of history would be an actual artifact.
>The Piri Re'is Map is only one of several anomalous maps drawn in the 15th Century and earlier which appear to represent better information about the shape of the continents than should have been known at the time. Furthermore, this information appears to have been obtained at some distant time in the past.

Source: https://sacred-texts.com/piri/index.htm

Along with Atlantis, there seems to be a myriad of "ancient civilizations" and places which existence is only thing of legends with the current atlas of the world we normally see "the planet" from. Would these places actually exists but in other way to explore what we call "this world"? If you explored a dream world, made a map, and leave an artifact behind so convincing, but there's no trace at all from our current atlas, what then? Is an interesting aspect to wonder about under this notion.

>Mandela Effect
Yeup, it's related to us.

>>41123015
>has certainly made me interested in this stuff once again - though I don't know where to go from here.
Check the fundamentals first if this is something you want to do. If you're inclined to follow, accept those fundamentals as the basis from which you are going to act upon from now on (It's really important at long run, trust me). Then, take a look at the exercises and cited sources. Remember that this is about truth, your life is truly a dream of your own, but you have to realize that in a way that makes sense to you.

Take it easy. As this >>41111764 image suggest, deciding that this is the path to follow is like planting a seed. Take in mind ideas and facts over this basis, and adapt ideas that aid your needs. Remember that the general discussion is all about sharing ideas and insight to further lucidity, you could share "feats" and "sucess stories" if you feel inclined to do so, but i personally discourage it, it's simply not useful. That's all.

>>41123056
>Could you care to share some details about these projects you mention?
Sure. Basically what I remember is that prior to Gadaffi's government being toppled, he was laying down giant concrete pipes that were to take water from the Mediterranean to a massive depression (area below sea level) in the desert, as part of a plan to green the Libyan part of the Sahara. He wanted to demonstrate the worthiness of his Third Way, an alternative to capitalism and communism. It appears to me like this "event" split into two: the Qattara Depression Project (which was only ever an idea), and the Great Man-Made River (a completed project).

>>41123094
>Check the fundamentals first
I'm sick of hearing this. I've read all of Neville Goddard, and various other LOA authors, I've read the entire pdf released by SMAnon, I've read some of the UL Complete Works. I feel like the goal posts just keep moving. Whether it is people moving the goalposts because this is all BS, or if it is the universe moving the goalposts for some unknown reason (demiurge, or whatever), I don't know. I just want to fucking change my life consciously. FUCKKKKK

so am reading the sections where he explains the daily 10 minutes pracice thing, he explanation is very good and comprehensive but i still don't get its point
when i start with the intent of "i will materalize my painting" what exactly am i aiming at?
it's not like when you go to a meditation with the intent of manifesting wealth/health/love etc

or is the point just being more used to my "divine" nature?
connecting with my true essence and forgetting my ordinary perception on my self as an ant on earth

>>41123174
C-calm down... it's only a few paragraphs. Read this thread also, you are lurking on 4chan anyway, so it's like reading a shit post, but instead of shit, it's actually a post. You also sound frustrated or in strain, follow the general advice that this thread has given about relaxing and pausing for a second. Again, check the fundamentals (less than 30 seconds reading wtf!) and what we have discussed so far. Also
>Whether it is people moving the goalposts because this is all BS
If you actually follow through the logic, you are the only person moving goalposts here. So, there is overwhelming evidence under the sun, and you still think this is all BS? That this is a massive monumental joke by EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THE WORLD, just for you? Calm down, and think, you should investigate and do this in a detective-like fashion. Also, from our perspective all you could be saying could be false, and so it's the same from yours to us.
>See the facts, and decide for yourself.
If you can't decide now, relax, calm down, and do it later.

>>41123174
Also
>and various other LOA authors
The only "LoA authors" are Neville and CO, as well the others "Law of attraction" crap that its grinding you down, there are no other "LoA" authors. I could extract everything wrong with your post and where you're coming from your current understanding, but it's simply not useful for either of us. Again, cool your head, check the facts, and decide for yourself. You will decide for the rest of your life, so you may do it as best as you can manage.

>>41123202
>or is the point just being more used to my "divine" nature?
Get used to seeing reality as a dream of your own doing in a pragmatical manner, and everything that entails.

>>41122900
>Will "science" as is popularly know nowadays even be a thing if this is a dream?
Interesting albeit uncomfortable thought. Thinking doesn't even work in dreams. You will dream something, it will make "sense" and then you wake up and realize it didn't actually make sense. What if this dream is like that? Is all our thinking about this shit idle? Can we actually come up with any sensible conclusions as to how to go about seeking some control over this dream?

>>41123174
>if it is the universe moving the goalposts
Who is this universe you're speaking of? Why does this universe have inclinations towards you specifically? Is this Universe lady in love with (You) and want to get your attention?
>I don't know. I just want to fucking change my life consciously
Stop externalizing your consciousness then, that could be a start.

>>41123254
alright thanks
i do not have questions about the technique really, J.P explains and answers every technical question i might have

>>41123218
>If you actually follow through the logic, you are the only person moving goalposts here.
If the logic is true, which I remain unconvinced of.
> So, there is overwhelming evidence under the sun, and you still think this is all BS?
I haven't seen it. However, if this is a dream, then the so-called evidence would be irrelevant, paradoxically.

>>41123174
Neville mindbroke so many people, this is insane.

>>41123234
>it's simply not useful for either of us
Is anything you say?

>>41123275
>However, if this is a dream, then the so-called evidence would be irrelevant, paradoxically.
You're on the right track. You will realize that the only evidence you will ever need is the personal one.

>>41123283
That's something you will have to decide. Whatever is useful or not, you decide, using your personal life orientation or goals to determine the best way to carry on. Normal life stuff. If nothing i say makes sense to you, just say it. This is the only sane general or thread on this board right now, so you may as well make a wake up call while you're at it.

>>41123299
>That's something you will have to decide. Whatever is useful or not, you decide, using your personal life
Then why did you decide on my behalf earlier?
> I could extract everything wrong with your post and where you're coming from your current understanding, but it's simply not useful for either of us

>>41123312
Nice catch. But that's only me disagreeing with you. Make of that what you will.

>>41123324
>Make of that what you will.
That's what I'm trying to figure out how to do.

>>41123335
You will. The fact that you're here is more than enough to set you in the right track. Again, i can't stress this enough: This is the truth, your mission is to uncover it, and find the final answer to this world by yourself.

moo

>>41123354
Best post ITT

>>41123369
thanks
also, nice

>>41112989
>Better Half
I'm fond of Nemlei games myself. This one have some relevance to our topic.
>A misguided attempt at curing his depression with magic, leads Thiu having to live with his other self. Mages are apparently as unreliable as you are. What now? Miserable comedy about self loathing. Great read if you hate yourself! Have fun with more and less asshole characters.

Underground wizards aside, we have an interesting premise here. Across the story of this one, the protagonist split himself in half to get rid of his worse emotions, leaving the miserable one from one side, and the best half, the happier one, in another. But as the story progress, the better half get more miserable, and the miserable half regain a sense of hopefulness from this experience. Conclusion: Both consciousness had all the emotions all along! Each one is "their own individual".
Every dualistic notion of the world is wilful omission of the big picture that encompass all aspects of existence. Originally, when it came to the metaphor of Dimension Jumping, people were wondering where "my other me" went when i "jump", because they were confusing themselves with their notion of being a person on a world, when what every single one of us is "presence", consciousness. With no wizards that gets us a buddy, we still find ourselves in constant division, dividing aspects of our personality in lessers and greater, which is usually more harmful than useful in any regards to the practical daily life. The solution? Recognize these experiences as a part of you as well, remember that every half you seem to split yourself into, is already the "better one" waiting to "merge", i mean, the truth to be acknowledged (These cheesy platitudes regain a different meaning under this context, isn't it?).

>>41122829
>Then just do it. But don't think that any sensory theater like your feelings or thoughts, or any of that inner content is impeding you, keep that in mind.
Still, I want to be doing the thing that will actually get me to cooming with my futa cock between my tits rather than just imagining it

>>41123218
>it's only a few paragraphs. Read this thread also
Didn't address previously but I already had read all of it.

>>41123517
Well...figures ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Carry on soldier!

So this anon understood UL/ONE-thing easily after reading two books. One is highly popular, being Kybalion. I'm intrigued about the first book he recommended, Vivekachudamani translated by Christopher Isherwood. Has any anon ever read something from Vivekachudamani? Or any other non-duality book and after UL was a lot easier to grasp?

>>41123545
>Vivekachudamani
That's just Vedic metaphysics. UL is pretty damn similar to anything Vedic if you take a closer look. Along with that, the Bhagavad Gita, Upanishads and the so mentioned Vedanta stuff also could throw some light if you're inclined to connect the dots from there.
>The Upanishads are a continuation of the Vedic philosophy, and were written between 800 and 400 B.C. They elaborate on how the soul (Atman) can be united with the ultimate truth (Brahman) through contemplation and mediation, as well as the doctrine of Karma-- the cumulative effects of a persons' actions.

The "ultimate truth" is the first oneirosophical fundamental, and also the "ONE thing" that UL alludes to.

Source: https://sacred-texts.com/hin/index.htm#vedas

>>41115871
>pajeet terms
yawn

Imagine the newbies coming to here and having to read 800+ pages material, I think it's some good filter down here especially when you see how many at Neville's communities ask the dumbest question that could have been answered by reading any chapter from any of Neville's books

>>41123545
He also mentioned "The Book of Causes" as another of his sources. In his own words
>It's like a schizo rambling Ancient Latin version of JP.

Source: https://archive.org/details/the-book-of-causes-liber-de-causis

>>41123603
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

>>41123584
>persons' actions.
Inactions, and actions-not-taken. And no, I didn't just say the same thing twice.

"1. Why everything has one thing in common: Everything has to have one final common reference field to define individual differences or present things to be distinctly different from another.

2. Why everything is ONE thing: Whatever time and space have in common is undimensional completeness. It is a meta-physical solid whole. Any aspect of the universe contains all of this ONE thing and therefore is ONE thing, not just a part of ONE thing.

3. Why everything is ONE all-person: If all of ONE thing fills the container I call myself, the self I call me, is the whole. All my parts are abstractly resident in a no-parts metaphysical state. I am Mr. Totality: a portable walking universe who is running everything forever right now.

4. Why I needed to pretend that I am merely a localized realm-being: In my completeness, I had no place to expand full-fill-ment, so I shut down perception for an expansion opportunity. I seemed to become many; an ant in the scheme of things.

5 .Why I can command my universe right now as if I were not merely a realm-being: Because I never stop being Mr. Totality even if I pretend to not be. I own the ONE all-mind — the intention that dreams everything into existence. I do not have to act on my experience of an isolated recipient of variations once I know that I am the only one in the universe."

>>41123610
It's only a quote from the site. I plan to read this stuff myself later and keep furthering trough useful metaphors (as well just for fun bits here and there), but it's great that you're interpreting this in a way that makes sense to you, that's the spirit.

>>41123613
Langauge is abstraction.

>>41123631
This. The "source" is beyond any language. That's why this is something graspable by any person across different backgrounds. However, language serve as a tool in this context.

>>41123640
>However, language serve as a tool in this context.
So does the grass. Out. Now. You know what to do.

>>41123652
>

>>41111764
Why can there be an infinite amount of reasons? Why would it be totally unidentifiable why a return didn't happen? What even has the power to dilute your commands? What's stopping me from getting a revelation now instead of in decades? I've been trying to keep going for months and UL command session returns still haven't gone past normal LOA, in time or in full fulfillment. I'm not hostile to UL whatsoever but this seems as random as goddard's promise. Either way bringing this part of the whole schematic into the light could give useful new info.

>>41123640
>That's why this is something graspable by any person across different backgrounds.
Langauge doesn't make anything graspable, it just gives one the illusion that they've grasped it.

>>41123659
it might be because you still haven't fully lived in the knowing that you're OAP, its a sort of conviction. you have to KNOW this as a fact by understanding the material and knowing its truth, just as you know 1+1=2

>>41123659
It is always because you didn't prove One-thing correctly, there's always some gap in the understanding with these type of issues (not that I have results, but what seems to be the common thing with people that have consistent results, they get materials)

>>41123659
Remember that my remarks are my personal perspective. Take that as it is.
>Why can there be an infinite amount of reasons? Why would it be totally unidentifiable why a return didn't happen? What even has the power to dilute your commands? What's stopping me from getting a revelation now instead of in decades?
I feel you're daffy ducking. I know it sounds funny, but seems to be falling into a spiral of endless questions that would not exist if you started from the get go of this being your dream (That's why JP tells you to remember that you are in your private dream and act upon this. Is not an affirmation, but a reminder; remember what he says about forgetting who you are). Remember the remedy the post you replied suggested: Just keep going forward and pedaling ahead under the correct notion of reality. You are asking a question about a place where only you are residing into.
>I've been trying to keep going for months and UL command session returns still haven't gone past normal LOA
Remember this is /one/, not /ul/, use whatever it works for you, no holds barrels. You will end up with a personal way of advancing towards lucidity that will just click naturally with (You) because that's what this is all about. Don't make this harder than it really is.

>>41123679
But you know nothing.

>>41123713
Why must I understand anything?

>>41123734
This is actually a good question. If is a mechanical manner, you and everyone else already have access to it in some form or another. It comes down to become absolutely self aware of the source to direct it at will. Integration.

>>41123606
It requires from the user to actually get serious about this.

Why can't I control my lucid dreams?

>>41123779
Good question. So, why can't you do that?

>>41123734
That's right, you are not understanding it, so now you are using your OAP state of all knowing, all seeing, all doing to bring forth possibilities of [no results despite months of trying]. You can't half ass an intention (I bring forth 1 million $) when your identity is shaky (I am not that powerful, actually I did not prove ONE thing, how the hell is everything indivisible,... etc) You are playing tug of war with yourself and that's why there is no change in external world.

>>41123791
>You are playing tug of war with yourself and that's why there is no change in external world.
But there are plenty of changes.

>>41123791
I had the impression this stuff would be simpler than Neville's..

>>41123805
The field of change is a lie. Only that doesn't change is true. That's "ONE thing", you as the ultimate reference field. Try to get away from the FPPoV, you just CAN'T, it will create division. You are the container of the entire universe. That's why the only thoughts, imagination, ideas and dreams you have access to are all yours.

>>41123808
>I had the impression this stuff would be simpler than Neville's..
No, the real deal starts now. You will find the hard way that Neville was an offshot (At least, in my honest, personal opinion).

>>41123821
>Try to get away from the FPPoV, you just CAN'T, it will create division
I've done so in my dreams.

>>41123805
Sorry, I misread that you meant you had no results. So you've been getting partial returns, well the same applies, give it a thumbs up as a means to manifest your actual return while still studying the materials more. Once you truly get it, then you will have full results

>>41123722
Well why should I take that presupposition in the first place then? Doesn't seem immediately obvious, its seemingly longer lasting, supernatural stuff doesn't happen as much, and in my dreams anyways I don't have powers even when lucid.

>>41123808
It's actually more simple once you get it. But you have to be absolutely open to the truth, no matter what.
>>41123835
How in the ACTUAL FUCK you will experience existence in a way that is not from the first person view???? DRAW IT

>>41123837
>Once you truly get it, then
Why?

>>41123829
Well, as I said before J.P's way of explaining complicated topics is nice and almost pleasant to read at times, but I am not sure if i can understand the material and be able to imply it for my personal benefit but i have to trust myself

>>41123855
I mean, remember that this is "the natural state of things", or truth, so the mechanics of it are already at play as we speak. You are already getting "full results" at all times. You have to see what's up with that. Realize where are all those questions coming from. Not trying to infringe you or something, just making an observation.

>>41123849
>DRAW IT
Even if I could draw, I wouldn't be able to draw it

>>41123513
>TG perspective on what "imagination" actually means.

>>41123909
-____-

>>41123872
Dreams don't have mechanics. They seem to, then they don't, or it's this then that.

>>41123926
>Dreams don't have mechanics.
You have no clue what you're talking about.
https://www.dreamviews.com/induction-methods-techniques/143852-dream-control.html

>>41123940
> Dreams within this dream seem to have mechanics from my current perspective in this dream

>>41123954
wut

>>41123954
I dub thee the meds mechanic.
Go now, the kingdom demands thou takest thy meds.

>>41123958
Haven't you ever read Alice in Wonderland?

>>41123958
>>41123976
Or had a dream?

>>41123976
Nope, but it's actually on topic tho. I do recall, at least, Neville doing allusions to it iirc. John in his material mentions the "wizard of oz" analogy also.

Is the Cheshire Cat a good example of "One All Person"? The Wonderland as a dream world, and an free will agent unbounded by the arbitrary rules of the domain. Again, i never actually saw anything related to alice, but the idea just came up to my mind.

>>41124009
No. You really should read it though.

>>41124009
Also there was a comment of TG about cats as unbounded dimensional beings somewhere, it was more as a joke than anything, but i can't find it. The PullPush reddit tool is also down for the count.
>>41124018
Eh, doesn't catch my attention, but i'll think about it.

gay thread

>>41124029
But the nobody general is the other way around!

>>41124020
> If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn’t. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn’t be. And what it wouldn’t be, it would. You see?

>>41124046
It's certainly interesting. I'm more of a "hardboiled" guy myself tho. I did read the little prince, it has some nice bits.
>“And now here is my secret, a very simple secret: It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is invisible to the eye.”

Literature could throw some nice metaphorical insight now and then. A future post idea from my part: Oneirosophist interpretation of "Blood Meridian" by Cormac McCarthy.

>>41123958
Consider dream logic + idealism (you're currently dreaming)

>>41123976
>>41123988
Or schizophrenia?

https://youtu.be/etOkZ6YBAZY

While our personal interpretations on "god" may differ, the character of the Judge is one i consider a very alluring one. I remember that some people catch this novel as some gnostic allegory, but i don't see it like that. It's been a very damn long time since last time i read this one tho. I want to revisit it, it was one of my favorites books.

Holden is a very cool example of the ominous presence of the supernatural in a world "devoid of light" or so to speak, as he is a fully realized metaphysical being. Also, important quote for our topic:

>Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent.

>>41124089
Idea for the next thread: Oneirosophical perspective on autism and schizophrenia. Although, i don't see myself doing any contributions on the matter...

>>41124080
>dream logic + idealism
Our first fundamental, basically.

>>41124109
All your posts are a contribution to said topics! You just don't know it.

>>41124123
Good caaaaaatch

>>41124119
> I'm dreaming
> Dream logic is unreliable
> Here's some dream logic regarding how it all works

>>41124131
Cool story bro

>>41124139
Or simply,
> All logic is dream logic if one is always in a dream

I wonder if there's somewhere out there that have a hold of these lost UL documents. One of my favorites aspects of UL is the "Hierarchy of beings" stuff, it's really candy for the mind, as i absolutely love angels and all that bluff.

New thread. Get in here
>>41124151
>>41124151
>>41124151

>>41124146
Check the archives

>>41111714
>that guy that lived an entire lifetime inside a dream and woke up from a coma
Tell me more, please.
( For years my biggest wish is to suddenly wake up in hospital still being eight, and discover that all the shitty life I had since then was just a bad dream. )