Thread 76518981

>>76518981 (OP)
I'm not watching some annoying faggot be wrong for nearly two hours.

>>76518981 (OP)
about to watch it

>>76518981 (OP)
>Mfw I just squatted

>>76518981 (OP)
I really liked Lyle when I first binged all of the Solomon Nelson vids a while ago but at this point I feel I’ve heard him say all he really can about training. I will look into his rapid fat loss method more if I decide to do some crazy cut in the future.

>>76519002
> bb bench
Already been debunked by the the top bodybuilders of the modern age, i used to argue over this years ago and even on here
there is no fucking counter argument, the best of the best agree that db & pec deck is king
> ohp/row
sub-optimal at best, isolation is most often king in hypertrophy unless you target the longest & thickes musclegroups.
> squats
i kinda agree but disagree, its not optimal but it feels rewarding and theres too many people who cant even squat with proper form at all

recycling old news like making content to people eating fiber replacement in modern times

>>76518981 (OP)
More like Dyel McDonald lmao

Dyel McDonald LMAO

>>76519403
>>76519184
lol nice one dudes

>>76518981 (OP)
This guy looks tiny lmao
>>76519170
SwedishFaggot

I thought the big 3/4/5 lifts were enough to get you to your natty limit.
Doesn't optimal only matter for roiders?

>>76519184
Thread's over. Anyone else who posts after me is officially gay

>>76518981 (OP)
>YOU'LL NEVER GET 300 POUND OHP GOYIM!
>YOU'LL NEVER NEED OR HAVE A BIG DEADLIFT IF YOU'RE NOT BUILT FOR IT SO GIVE IT UP
>OY YOU SHOULD BE DOING MEME MACHINE EXERCISES LIKE HACK SQUATS AND LATERAL RAISES INSTEAD
>YA SHMUCKS AREN'T MADE TO BENCH PRESS BIG WEIGHT SO PACK IT UP! YOU'LL NEVER GET THOSE BIG NUMBERS (LIKE THE HOLOCAUST, PLEASE REMEMBER THE 8 MILLION JEWS WHO DIED) SO JUST STOP DOING THOSE LIFTS TO GET BIGGER

That's the video. Lyle has effectively became what he swore against the most, a recycling bin of bullshit fitness content.

I don’t care what he thinks, I enjoy doing these lifts and I’m gonna keep doing it.
What’s next? Breathing is bad for you?

>>76519444
>>76519458
watch at least the first third where he says what he means

>>76519461
No Lyle, I won't.

how much does he bench?

>>76519444
>Doesn't optimal only matter for roiders?
the literal exact and precise opposite is true

if you take enough gear you will grow from anything

>>76519444
3/4/5 is not nearly enough to hit natty limit wtf are you talking about? You need to strong af to hit natty limit. Those are late beginner numbers.

>>76518981 (OP)
>big 5
ah so we're just making shit up now huh

>>76519449
the title is ragebait. he says the big 5 isnt something that everyone should subsribe to by default. it depends on how your proportions relate to the lift. also is he a jew? his name is mcdonald, thats not a jew name

>>76518981 (OP)
Lyle. Bubbie. Please don't maliciously attack my 5 favourite lifts.

>>76519530
He's a fake Irish.

>literally named McDonalds
>hates exercise
lmao

>>76519170
I own a barbell and a squat rack and a bunch of weight so I'll stick to the big 5 and make plenty of gains anyway despite what some dickhead thinks might or might not target 2 extra muscle fibres in some obscure secondary muscle that I'm hitting in my daily life through regular exercise anyway.

His ultimate point is that ordinary people shouldn't do big lifts because their too technical and people don't have a point in getting big lifts outside of the purpose of powerlifting or oly lifting.

What a pussy.

>>76519601
no, the point is that people should stop recommending the big 5 as (the best) hypertrophy exercises to everyone because unless you are a powerlifter you can probably be doing something better

>>76519621
>you can probably be doing something better
hypertrophy wise I should add

>>76518981 (OP)
He is right in the sense that you should manipulate the lifts to your liking to grow your muscles, for example heel elevate squats for quads if a normal low bar squat only hits your lower back and that's not your goal. He is also right that machines are better than free weights for hypertrophy because you simply can milk exercises in their most difficult range without the risk of major injury, like a hammer press machine.
How is this controversial.
The same reason why you drop the pendlay row as an back exercise the moment you reach 1.7x your bodyweight, because it will turn into a spine and hamstring exercise and not a back exercise because of the weight and leverage.

>>76519621
I can accept that point, but I find that fitness guys are the most passionate about shitting on competitors, and this guy has a product to sell: https://store.bodyrecomposition.com/

>>76519630
I mean iunno, more exercises is more risk exposure for retards to do dumb shit
Some accessory lifts are complicated, nonsense, or both while compounds are effective enough
It's a fair point either way :)

>>76519458
>What's next? Breathing is bad for you?
yes: https://www.normalbreathing.com/
and Pavel sells a breathing course for $400 at https://strongfirst.skilltrain.com/Pages/Public/Courses , "SECOND WIND express"

>>76519638
>I find that fitness guys are the most passionate about shitting on competitors
a lot of them do do that, just indirectly by making new shit up every week to make the other guys look stupid because "they're not up to date on their science"
lyle has been saying the same stuff for years

>and this guy has a product to sell:
the books are free if you know where to look
and he's sharing lots of his knowledge for free on solomon's channel and his webstie
his coaching only makes sense to buy if you know him but you can get a lot of what he would tell you from reading and listening

>>76518981 (OP)
Counterpoint:

https://youtu.be/tzCIi4HaQ4Y?si=IWALPGMD5JZyyKWs

https://youtu.be/OCErTa5x2Vw?si=kmHZz5Y4M9SG1bDG

https://youtu.be/vPX7eNLFgBs?si=MXdvzS4WpU8IyaAS

>>76519681
>counterpoint:
>roidtranny

>never benched squat or deadlifted.

>Look better than 90 percent of /fit/

Shhhh don't give out secrets

>>76519698
The secret is nobody cares how good you look if you dont have big bench. Sam sulek is not the best bodybuilder but hes the most popular because he benches a lot. Simple as.

>>76519693
He's natty

>76519760

>Irrelevant babble

Yawn

>>76518981 (OP)
>a jew has an opinion
don't care, they deserved it

>>76519771
In his mind

>>76519780
jews wouldn't give good advice to goys so I don't know what you're talking about

>>76519787
dyel alert

>>76519797
Roidtranny cocksucker

>>76518981 (OP)
>kike israel
>shlomomon kikeson
yeah, ok.

>>76518981 (OP)
>bodybuilding only
Good advice, but I don’t care

>>76519693
i kek’d

>>76519760
nobody cares about how much you bench you fucking retard, except other sweaty gymcel manlets. stop having this gymcel morality, the only thing that matters is your appearance. “b-but bro i want to get strong” for what? your oofy-doofy accountant job? you aint a pro athlete JFL

>>76518981 (OP)
>malnourished jew debunks staple lifts that have built elite bodybuilders and powerlifters across multiple decades

>>76519829
women only get wet pussies if you bench 2pl8+
>>76519830
>t. didn't watch video

>>76519801
mhm dyel

>>76519829
Holy fucking shit you're pathetic
>What's the point of getting strong if you're not going into the NFL
Lmao how about longevity or health? How about not being a burden to those around you when you're older? How about situations where you actually might need to do something with your body?
>vanity post
Oh okay you're just an unironic homosexual.

>>76519837
women dont care about your bench man, I seriously hope you’re kidding. They care about your face, height and other quality genetical traits. A lean, athletic body can complement your appearance and increase women’s interest, to an extent.

Even if you could make the argument that they somehow care about your strength to some measurable degree, the bench press would be the most irrelevant lift. It’d be much more impressive if you could OHP a lot or do a lot of pull ups or sth

>>76519859
at 3pl8s they turn into a waterfall

of course I'm jokung dude

>>76519859
post body

>>76519854
mate you arent consuming copious amounts of caffeine, destroying your tendons and ligaments, skipping cardio, skipping training your rotator cuff, bulking etc. because you care for your “longevity” and “health”. You do it because either consciously or subconsciously you believe (incorrectly for the most part) that what you’re doing is going to improve your appearance and increase your attractiveness to women. Everybody in the gym does it from women irregardless of whether he is the broccoli head zoomer, the middle aged dad or the balding roidtranny.

You want to do an activity that can belp you do something with your body if you have to? pick up running, swimming or martial arts or sth to that degree. Lifting man-made metal in an air-conditioned space isn’t benefitting you in any way whatsoever on this

>>76519859
How do you explain the moment I got 2pl8 bench I got a gf?

>>76519867
kek apparently i need to lurk moar

>>76519872
you ain’t getting my body but this is my forearm at 6’2” with very long limbs and a 6’4” wingspan

>>76519902
idk man i’d say correlation does not imply causation or sth to that extent

>>76519883
you're sighing at this guy ruining his body, while recommending running?
brother, none of that stuff you complained about is required for lifting. This is like complaining about aimbots in reply to a kid saying that he wants to improve his aim.
>>76519854
that post is about vanity, but it's also responding to vanity: >>76519760
>The secret is nobody cares how good you look if you dont have big bench.
the reply to "be vain about the number you bench" is "be vain about your looks, because only guys care about that number"

>>76519932
to be precise my issue isn’t with lifting per se, but with copers who possess so much self-delusion that they can’t admit even to themselves what they truly lift for and try to cope with “health”. Lifting is very beneficial both mentally and physically and I also lift, but I will never cope so much as to believe that I am consuming 3 cans of redbull before lifting because I care for my “health”

>>76518981 (OP)
I do the big 5 because they are fun. Worrying about having an optimal routine is for nerds and faggots unless you are an actual professional

>>76519575
yes, barbell is better than nothing and me or other people who provide solid advice are dickheads because of that or that you cant afford dumbbells and/or machines

>>76518981 (OP)
In order to make any argument against any lift, you have to ignore all the bodybuilders and athletes that do the big 5. Then he can go ahead and make his points about how there are no results to show these are good lifts.

>>76518981 (OP)
When it comes to working out or training, why does there need to be a discussion or argument? Just show results, everything has already been done. There is no argument, just show the results. Anyone who has to argue already doesnt know anything

>>76518981 (OP)
These guys suck and the other half the fitness industry, like people who play sports and s&c coaches don't talk to them at all. Its really strange when you first see it. None of these guys even have buddies that play sports. Most of them played almost no sports growing up. Lyle did some stuff, but not much.

>>76519983
Saying things like
>F*** THE BIG 5
makes you a dickhead.

>>76519829
Normies definitely care about how much you bench.
It's the only lift I get asked about when someone decides to talk about gym or lifting with me. How much you bench bro is not just a meme.
I use it as a measuring stick. I still do incline db bench.

>>76520148
when a normie asks the question, does he care?

>>76519002
im watching it twice for both of us

>>76520148
They dont care anon. Its all they know. Even if you say it, you probably will get a response of "i used to bench 225 when i was in high school" and thats it. If they actually cared, they would ask for advice and possibly if they can come workout with you.
People are just being nice and showing some interest in what you do.

>>76519170
Barbell bench > dumbbell bench and it's not close.
Only some gyms have pec deck machines.
Ohp/row are suboptimal but so is dumbbell benching.
Squats are fine.
>>76519983
Barbell squat is superior to many machines.

>>76520332
>Barbell bench > dumbbell bench and it's not close.
if you have long arms barbell bench is fucking dogshit for you, you will never feel it in your chest
>Barbell squat is superior to many machines.
similar thing, if you have long femurs squat is great for your ass but shit for your quads

>>76519518
what do you mean?
all the popular beginner "strength" programs recommend the "big 5" (rows, squats, deadlift, press, bench)

>>76518981 (OP)
> durr it's le suboptimal for bodybuilding
Don't give a shit, I train for strength and performance.
/thread

>>76520711
>muscle size is somehow not related to strength of a muscle
you stupid?

>>76519446
Crazy how the thread did indeed get extremely gay after this post. (I am enjoying my last moments of heterosexuality to point this out.)

>>76520711
Ahh, the good ole strength cope. You are not allowed to post until you reach a human bmi

>>76518981 (OP)
finally

>>76520722
You can rape 2 birds with one stone by doing.... THATS RIGHT CLASSIC BARBELL LIFTS. WOAH ALMOST LIKE THEY ARE CLASSIC FOR A REASON

>>76520725
25.2

>>76520749
So only a little overweight while being skinny fat. Nice bro

>>76520751
Not skinny fat that's for sure. Little overweight I'll grant you

>>76520749
they are classic because machines didn't use to exist

>>76520760
Yeah it's a trend, all the posters on fit who use machines or do weighted pull ups/dips are lean and look good and all the powersharts who focus on spinal erector based lifts are fat and look terrible. I'm the same BMI but below 15 percent body fat. More power to you but just a consistent trend

>>76520749
>You can rape 2 birds with one stone by doing.... THATS RIGHT CLASSIC BARBELL LIFTS. WOAH ALMOST LIKE THEY ARE CLASSIC FOR A REASON
impossible to isolate a specific muscle group
barbell might focus too much on a specific muscle group if you have weird leverages

>>76520779
I do weighted pullups. And I guess I'm in between ottermode twink calibros and obese powershitters

>>76520791
> impossible to isolate a specific muscle group
Only an issue with deadlifts and arguably OHP.
I'm not saying don't do anything else aside from BSD or anything

>>76518981 (OP)
Go away. Australians are gross

>>76520148
Because bench is still the most widely known exercise, especially among people won’t don’t gymcel, but people won’t treat you differently because you bench 3 plates or sth (maybe if they’re gymcels but why would you care about impressing gymcels?), but people WILL treat you differently because you are lean and have developed well the muscles that DO have an actually beneficial ROI (the shoulders which have the most ROI by FAR and then the back, biceps, v-line/abs and forearms in this order).
Don’t make gymcelling an end in itself but remember WHY you began gymcelling. Never engage in a gymcelling activity -like bulking & skipping cardio- that minimizes instead of maximizing your looks

>>76521943
Based self knower

Who the fuck uses Squats for hypertrophy?

I use that shit for strength as a starting movement

>>76519002
Seriously. If i want retarded takes im already home

>>76520332
> Barbell squat is superior to many machines.
your message explains how you dont understand the mechanical differences as to why someone shits on barbell in the first place

>>76521943
autism, the post
dont be exceptionally good at anything, youll become a docell

>>76518981 (OP)
>shits on the bench
BASED. Fuck that faggot lift. Overhead press mogs.

>>76519184
That's all that bald faggot had to say and he would've won. He got roasted by Lyle

>>76522149
He's shitting on OHP too

>>76519170
Rows and ohp r p good 4 upper back and shoulders ngl
Also if u don't like big lifts 5x5 you're a faggot

The cope itt is unreal. Wow. Everyone back in the day had no issue with the big lifts. I hate you contraion faggots. Don't think for yourself, stay within the norm. God

>>76521961
dozens of articles and posts and videos over the internet

>>76518981 (OP)
Solomon Nielson? More liek Dyel McDonald amirite

>>76521943
this mentality of endless rows of performative bullshit vs being yourself is why you all struggle with depression and forming meaningful relationships

>>76519170
Now do pullups, the alpha of the big 5.
>>76522314
Come back when you hit 100 reps off every set to failure.

76519170
Ur nose is showing

>>76519461
Buy an ad you fuckin boomer faggot

>>76520699
there's only a big 3 and you know it!

>>76521943
looking good doesn't get you women if you're autistic

>>76522443
pullups more like the alpha lift of the twinks and the malnourished faggot nigger

lyle is right and as usual all the people that like to bench just reacted to the thumbnail and argue against shit he didn't say

>>76518981 (OP)
Why should I trust these DYELs? Dude looks like he's never touched a barbell in his life.

>>76522749
lyle benches 405

>>76522752
But I thought the bench was useless??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqlOTEtGhQk
Weird how unc was a TFtuber before giving hot takes on weightlifting.

>>76522756
it is, he benches 405 and doesn't even look like he lifts. he proved his point.

>>76519142
Yeah when you know the truth and the truth doesn't change with every study that comes out there's not really a whole lot to say about it. These are just further extrapolations on that nearly singular truth so you almost always know why before it's even stated you don't even have to hear him out you can probably go step by step through his reasoning on a note card then check them off as he makes those exact points.

>>76522736
exactly like it happens every time and like he predicted in the video?
no way.....
>>76522777
checked digits of truthful truth (which doesn't change because it's the truth)

>>76520203
Doing god's work, thanks for taking the bullet for me

>>76519126
ngmi

>>76522443
I love pullups but i dont even feel it without weight attached to my waist

hence the absolutely not optimal flaw with many of the big fives, either its a mechanical flaw from bb vs db or just poor stimulus in general compared to many simply isolation movements

>>76522314
i mostly do ohp for warmups, i dont really get that brutal pump from it like i do with lateral raises.
i lost the feeling of having a lifting for my ego after 8 years of consistently going to the gym, i leave when im satisfied.

the big fives are flawed mechanically and are spread to stimulate various different groups simultaneously
but wouldnt rule them out completely

>Deadlifting is a meme
>Bench press is a meme
>Doing stretches is a meme
Maybe this guy is on to something...

>>76524662
if thats what you got from those video you either didn't watch them or YOU are a meme

>>76524662
>Maybe this guy is on to something...
has been since the start
>>76524671
well deadlifts are mostly a meme
stretching is mostly useless
and the bench is sometimes a meme
with a big asterisk that it depends on what your goals are
if you wanna deadlift then deadlifting is fine
if you wanna be stretchy then stretch
if you have nothing but the bench or like benching then bench

>>76522443
>Come back when you hit 100 reps off every set to failure
>does 5lbs of ohp and rows till failure
You're retarded
>>76523977
>spread to stimulate various differences groups
Why is this a bad thing?
I think the tie ins is something you cant get with isolation.
I also feel like these time proven movements work better when it comes to bringing up my physique holistically they aren't flawed at all, maybe with programming but at the end of the day millions of people have gotten big off the basics. It's just another form of training and a damn good one at that

I dont understand why I should do
>hip thrust
>leg press
>hamstring curl

when I can just squat and deadlift instead and still get great leg/ass gains

seems like with the machines you run more of a risk of being disproportionate because you're trying to isolate each muscle and do them all separately

also there is the risk of having disproportionately large legs when you isolate your lower body too much like what happened with will tennyson

look at olympic lifters by comparison, they usually look great and have perfectly proportional legs IE athletic (what most people outside of muscle mass monsters regard as looking good) vs trying to get a muscle as large as possible and looking like a freak

>>76525064
>also there is the risk of having disproportionately large legs when you isolate your lower body too much like what happened with will tennyson
willy boy mainly squats
he even entered a powerlifting competition

and he has good leg genetics
and saying that if you over do a muscle you ruin aesthetics is not a dig against any exercise but an obvious fact about being stupid

>look at olympic lifters by comparison, they usually look great and have perfectly proportional legs
they squat for strength not size

>>76525064
Exactly idk what these kids are on
>>76525107
>muh strength or size
If your natty theyre the same thing.
>big bench press, big chest

>>76519859
The way hes holding that cat is really angering me

>>76525127
by the neck like it's mother would?

>>76525064
>seems like with the machines you run more of a risk of being disproportionate because you're trying to isolate each muscle and do them all separately
yeah nah, this sentence reads like those "I don't want to get too bulky/muscular" things that people who never stepped foot in a gym say

>>76519002
fpbp

>>76519530
Also thought he was a jew. He looks a lot like one and he hangs with solomon. But apparently he's not.

>>76525064
if you have long femurs and bad ankle flexion squats will mostly work out your ass/lower back and not your quads
>also there is the risk of having disproportionately large legs when you isolate your lower body too much like what happened with will tennyson
what? this is what literally happens with squat
>look at olympic lifters by comparison, they usually look great and have perfectly proportional legs IE athletic
why do you assume olympic lifters squat all day?

>>76525623
>why do you assume olympic lifters squat all day?

because I was an olympic lifter and we squatted all the time (back and front)

of course we did other things too (push press, jerks, the actual olympic lifts, clean/snatch deadlifts) but there were no machines in the gym apart from a GHD setup for back extensions

>>76525640
Still waiting on a barbell tard to post body, I wonder why they never do....

>>76525640
just because it worked for you and your few friends doesn't mean it will work for everyone else
i have long femurs and squats never hit my quads

>>76519601
he's right though. too many normies snap their shit up and end up fat and broken

>>76519636
its because no one on /fit/ lifts

>>76518981 (OP)
I just hit a deadlift PR, am I gonna die?

>>76519002
/thread

>>76519636
1.7x for how many reps though

>>76525064
>look at olympic lifters by comparison, they usually look great and have perfectly proportional legs IE athletic
Oly lifters nearly universally have tumor quads

>>76525647
I posted back. Now u post back

>>76526052
you wont die but you just ruined your gains

>>76518981 (OP)
Advertising threads like this are against 4Chins ToS.
GTFO

>>76518981 (OP)
>bench press is not a push, it is a pull of your arms using you pecs
that guy is a genius i tried it today and bench press never felt so good (i have long arms)

>>76527864
>>bench press is not a push, it is a pull of your arms using you pecs
This is honestly retarded, by that logic every exercise is a pull because muscles only activate by contraction.

>>76527893
nigga it is just a cue to activate your pecs more during a bench press

>>76527893
Lol someone let mr bird chest out of his cage to flap around again

>>76527893
It's honestly not retarded because when people hear bench PRESS they then press the weight up and away instead of bringing the arms in with the pectoralis

>>76525064
I remember seeing this years ago and thinking it is very impressive now I can tell he is DYEL

>>76518981 (OP)
He looks like a jew and the presenter is named Solomon.

>>76530046
the advice is good though

>>76519142
>>76522777
This is why Starting Strength Radio is the most important podcast on the internet. Half the time they don't even talk about lifting.

>>76520332
>Only some gyms have pec deck machines.
Any gym worth its salt has one

>>76518981 (OP)
@grok, summarize this for me

>>76520026
>nor everyone has tge right proportions for those lifts
Yea, just listen to the one un a thousand who has the right proportions because he has shown the result. I'm not even mentioning a survivorhip bias with all those bodybuilders that make it, while millions fail doing tye same shit.

>>76520332
can you just do pec deck with cables tho? i have never a gym without cables

>>76520332
a pec deck is just a fly in a machine

just do dumbbell flies if you dont have one

>>76519170
The best chests ever were all built with heavy bench fuck off

>>76534742
>have long arms
>biceps/triceps are the limiting factor and will give out first
you stupid brother

>>76519630
As a beginner? Do your main compounds for overall gains. Then do isolated lifts for areas you want to be esthetically pleasing. I've attached an anime picture so people have an excuse to ignore me.

>>76535484
>Do your main compounds for overall gains
what is an "overall gains"?

I said for hypertrophy
and if your focus is hypertrophy then most likely machines will allow for better hypertrophy than compounds

>>76535490
I think you guys are on totally different wavelengths and they are trying to say that a total beginner can get a lot of muscle growth with the compound lifts while also getting stronger, which is true but doesn't really have anything to do with what you were talking about.

>>76534742
Just not yours tho

>>76535019
>biceps are limiting your bench
Who are you

>>76520148
You know you can just lie about how much you bench, like 99% of people do?

>>76519883
>skipping cardio
Ah, this is a projection post

>>76519002
This plus he looks j*wish

>>76519883
>Health
>Running

Lmao. Runners are mentally ill and always beat to shit with wrecked joints