Thread 76629799

Are you already a vegan? If not, why? Need help?
If you don't like vegans you could still be on vegan diet, just avoid saying in public that you are vegan.
The biggest reason to be vegan is ethics and animal rights.
But if you want to be lean and healthy, it's also a good choice.

Not yet.

>>76629799 (OP)
How do you know someone is vegan?
Do not worry, they will tell you

>>76629876
That's good. We need to promote veganism, everybody should be, if someone doesn't, they will kill him.

>>76629799 (OP)
Terrible image. Being vegan and /fit/ almost always requires the intake of processed foods such as tofu, protein isolate, TVP and Seitan. Relying on whole plant foods for protein is not a very enjoyable experience as it requires eating pounds of edamame/lentils every single day and can make cutting extremely difficult due to the high calorie per gram. The meme of "you must only eat whole foods" is stupid and not supported by evidence.

Sverige might be a bit cookoo but he's absolutely right about vegans.

>>76629930
There are some high protein vegan foods, like lentils, pumpkin seeds, onions. But yes, it might not be enough, you could then eat isolated protein from plant source, tofu.
This image is not made by bodybuilder. Maybe we need vegan bodybuilding guide.

>>76629799 (OP)
Veganism = starvation

>>76629951
He went on a vegan diet, so he should know firsthand how destructive it is to the human body.

I want to lift and gain muscle. Chicken, which costs me 28 cents an ounce, contains at least 8 grams of protein per ounce at only 70ish calories. This protein has a complete amino acid profile necessary for muscle repair and growth.

Can you share a vegan product or recipe that I can try to replace one chicken meal a week with? For my chicken, I just cover it in Montreal steak seasoning and throw it in the air fryer. I could do that with soi beans but is it gonna be the same?

I already replaced my English muffin with butter and jam in the morning to just oats, almond milk, and jam, so I'm already doing a vegan breakfast.

>>76630109
>This protein has a complete amino acid profile
why did you include a sentence that implies vegan protein isn't complete while asking for advice? claim ignorance or arrogance, not both
>>76630046
>>76630050
you're dumb

>>76629799 (OP)
I am not vegan because I like eating animals more than I care about their welfare. If they didn't want to be eaten they shouldn't taste good and/or should evolve to fight back more effectively.

>>76629799 (OP)
>ethics and animal rights
Hey quick question
What do you do with all the rodents, all the birds, and all the insects that eat the crops
Do you (a) live together with them in peace and harmony, or (b) cover the crops with pesticides, root out the rodents with dogs and threshers that tear them apart
Oh hey, question #2, what does crop farming do to soil? Does it enrich it, enliven it, fertilise and maintain it? Or does it leech it and sap it of all it's value until it's completely worthless dead ground impossible to bring back to life?

>>76630109
TVP

>>76630233
I have a feeling you're being dishonest with you not having heard a rebuttal to this stupid argument. But in case you honestly have not:
1. Most crops are fed to livestock, thus not raising and eating livestock would reduce those deaths
2. There is zero evidence to the amount of animals killed in crop deaths, just speculation.
3. You cannot prove that there would be less deaths without agriculture. As in wild lands are incredibly brutal with much more biodiversity and much more death compared to farmland. I would bet more animals die in dense wooded forests than they do in empty farmlands.
4. Vegans generally just want animals to be given equal ethical consideration to humans. If humans were ravaging our fields and eating all of our crops as insects and rodents do. Most people would be okay with using force to stop them, while still not being okay with raising and killing humans for food. Reminder that humans also die in the production in crops.
5. Crop deaths only exist due to our indifference towards animal suffering. A fully vegan world would come up with ways to avoid the need for crop deaths such as indoor farming.

Per your questions regarding soil. Crop farming mostly exists to feed livestock(See 1.) Also with our current population monocroping is necessary to feed all of us.

>>76630138
>you're dumb
Not an argument

>>76630291

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26502280/
>Despite substantial differences in intake and deficiency between groups, our results indicate that by consuming a well-balanced diet including supplements or fortified products, all three types of diet can potentially fulfill requirements for vitamin and mineral consumption.

>>76630291
Funny enough, the evidence shows vegans have higher plasma B12 than other diet groups.

>>76629799 (OP)
Post a timestamp ed picture of your body right now and if isn't a laughable mess, I will become vegan immediately.

>>76629799 (OP)
>Are you already a vegan?
No, I'm on carnivore
>If not, why?
I don't want to starve and age horribly
>Need help?
You definitely do

>>76630318
What's up bro? Think of all the cows and chickens you'll save. Let's go.

>>76630138
because I'm not a vegan and when I google "high protein vegan replacement for chicken" it tells me seitan and tofu and then other places say seitan and tofu aren't complete proteins. sorry I'm not as smart as you bro
>>76630248
hell yeah. at 50 cents an ounce on Amazon, that ain't too bad. thanks g

>>76630962
you don't have to be smart to avoid making implications about things

>>76629799 (OP)
NOOOOOONCE

>>76629930
TVP is fucking gross. Shame, the idea is so cool.

>>76631000
you're right, but do you not think you're a bit sensitive to take me stating a desire as an attack on veganism? do you wonder if your unnecessary pedantry directed at someone amenable to your cause might be misplaced or counter to your goals? do you care if you feed into the stereotype of vegans getting high on their own farts and being so off-putting that they make others wary of their lifestyle?

>>76629909
That's how you know Hitler was a psyop..if it was about saving the whites he would have been a normal human being not some limp wrist Low t hippy vegan

>>76631095
>I was simply stating a desire
We backtracking now are we? Stop being weaselly and admit you made a stupid implication.

>>76630109
>I want to lift and gain muscle.
You can do this on vegan diet.
>Can you share a vegan product or recipe that I can try to replace one chicken meal a week with?
Onions products, lentils, pumpkin seeds, peas.
>I already replaced my English muffin with butter and jam in the morning to just oats, almond milk, and jam, so I'm already doing a vegan breakfast.
That's good. You don't have to go 100% vegan from first day, you can slowly reduce animal products in your diet.

>>76631767
>>I want to lift and gain muscle.
>You can do this on vegan diet.
no, you can't
you can do that with TRT or steroids on a vegan diet, but you can't do it on a vegan diet
stop lying to people

>>76630221
>If they didn't want to be eaten they shouldn't taste good and/or should evolve to fight back more effectively.
Evolution doesn't work this way and it's too slow.

>>76630233
Do you realize that to produce one lb of meat you need to produce like 10 lb of plant food and feed that to cow/chicken/pig? So still, meat eating kills 10 times more rodents, birds etc.

>>76631805
>>76631767
mental illness

>>76629930
>requires the intake of processed foods such as tofu
technically tofu is processed, yes
but that really stretches the common understanding of processed, where it is associated with unhealthy food
tofu is arguably a very healthy food with literally zero adverse health effects

similar with Seitan
it's processed, yes
but there is no evidence for adverse health effects

Tofu and Seitan are both quite old foods as well
Tofu is eaten for >3000y
Seiten for >1200y

>>76629799 (OP)
I don't like veganism in general, so no

>>76631149
Hitler was not a vegan.

>>76629930
You missed the part where it says whole food based, not whole food only.

>>76629799 (OP)
>if you want to be healthy, veganism is a good choice
Lol

>>76631818
>he believes in psychiatry

>>76631320
it's probably hard for you to think when you're not getting meat with a complete amino acid profile. it's necessary for brain development

>>76629799 (OP)

I hate Animals(except for cats)

>>76632244
Why

>>76632244
cats are devils, they murder birds, reptiles, animals, for fun

>>76632391
They are animals and I want to slaughter them like animals.
>>76632244
Cats are one of the dumbest and most vile animals and pets to ever exist, they are literal parasite. That's why fags(vegans) and women love them so much, they are all mentally fucking ill.
>>76629799 (OP)
You're a fag. Imagine living ONCE(ONE TIME) on this planet and starving yourself with restrictions like a fucking slave. Why are modern people such dumb cattle. Just fucking enjoy all kinds of food.

>>76632999
Just chiming in to say I fucking love cats, and women go crazy for that shit.
You’d think they’d be turned off by some grown ass man losing his shit about how cute some kitty is, but I’ve had many women tell me they absolutely love that about me.
Animals are our special little frens, man.
Act like it.
>cats are one of the most dumbest and vile pets to ever exist
Fuck nah, dude.
As we transitioned into agrarian societies we NEEDED those little dudes.
Farming and storing grains with everyone’s well-being hinging on a crop not getting fucked up during the off season so that civilization as we knew it could survive?
Rats, mice, and bugs will fuck your shit up. Bad.
Enter cats.
Their enthusiastic pest control allowed us to survive as a species, no wonder the Egyptians considered them gods.
We’d be fucked without them, homie.

Personally I would never have an indoor cat, but that’s because I think it’s not very cash money to restrict one indoors like that and I also don’t want to clean shit out of a box on a daily basis.

>>76632999
Oh shit, I didn’t realize that this was such a fucking dumb thread.
Anyone that would get so heavily invested in these dumb arguments likely be swayed into thinking critically.
Also, nobody’s fucking eating cats lol

Eat whatever you want, just don’t be mean to animals when you interact with them, because that’s shitty.
>t. had a small funeral for a squirrel that got banked off my roof by a hawk yesterday. He was bleeding very badly internally and was not long for this world, so I put him in a shoebox with a towel after I stopped my cat from mauling him.
His name was Peanut, and his last moments were spent getting soft pets instead of in abject horror, being literally ripped apart.
Just be kind when you’re able to, man.

>>76633190
>>t. had a small funeral for a squirrel that got banked off my roof by a hawk yesterday. He was bleeding very badly internally and was not long for this world, so I put him in a shoebox with a towel after I stopped my cat from mauling him.
>His name was Peanut, and his last moments were spent getting soft pets instead of in abject horror, being literally ripped apart.
>Just be kind when you’re able to, man.
You are a good man. I hope good things happen to you in life.

>>76629799 (OP)
>The biggest reason to be vegan is ethics and animal rights.
True.
>But if you want to be lean and healthy, it's also a good choice
False.
Eating a wide variety of high-quality plants is smart; intentionally avoiding foods that would easily cover known and glaring nutritional weaknesses is not. What ever happened to vegetarians, pescatarians, and the like? The difference between "I'm okay with some dairy, eggs and fish" and "no animal products, period" is enormous. I get that you want to harm other creatures as little as possible but if that's your entire goal you're sacrificing a huge chunk of your health in order to feel like a better person on one specific, already sort of dubious level, and if others have to bend down to help you out of being weak and sick then your selflessness is really in question.
Hope you're at least taking your b12.

>>76632999
>They are animals and I want to slaughter them like animals.
But why?
>Cats are one of the dumbest and most vile animals and pets to ever exist, they are literal parasite. That's why fags(vegans) and women love them so much, they are all mentally fucking ill.
I don't love cats. I like that they are introverted and they can rest for hours while looking from the window. But at same time I hate them for murdering birds and rats.
>Imagine living ONCE(ONE TIME) on this planet
Are you sure about this?
>and starving yourself with restrictions like a fucking slave
I can afford this, quality people can do this.
>Just fucking enjoy all kinds of food.
Animals are not food.

>>76633221
Veganism can be healthy. The problem is some vegans eat too many vegetables and salads. They should eat nutrients dense plant foods all day, like I do. Eat legumes, nuts, seeds, then also vegetables.
>Hope you're at least taking your b12.
Yes.

>>76633419
>Animals are not food.
Yes they are.

>>76629799 (OP)
anti-vegan (mostly just eating animal products)

>>76632237
>still is not admitting he made a mistake

>>76632237
Plant proteins have all amino acids. You just need to eat more of it.

>>76631791
What do you gain from spreading misinformation that causes harm?

>https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6358922/pdf/sports-07-00012.pdf
>To summarize, our data suggest that whey and pea proteins promote similar strength, performance, body composition, and muscular adaptations

>https://www.mdpi.com/2072-6643/12/8/2382/htm
>no differences found between pea and whey proteins

>https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33599941/
>A high-protein (~ 1.6 g kg-1 day-1), exclusively plant-based diet (plant-based whole foods + onions protein isolate supplementation) is not different than a protein-matched mixed diet (mixed whole foods + whey protein supplementation) in supporting muscle strength and mass accrual, suggesting that protein source does not affect resistance training-induced adaptations in untrained young men consuming adequate amounts of protein.

>https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33905293/
>Despite marked differences in habitual nutrient intake, healthy, young vegan and omnivorous men did not differ regarding vascular and skeletal muscle structure and function, or cardiovascular fitness.

>https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7312446/
>A practical application is that consuming plant protein can support strength and muscle development comparably to whey protein

>>76632999
Kill yourself.

>>76633221
See
>>76630306
>>76630304

>>76633856
I'd rather stab you to death, like a prey you are.

>>76633843
You're a shill faggot
Just one hole at a glance, imagine I had time to throw on debunking all these junk studies you just listed
You fucking disingenuous homosexual dweeb
>Participants were instructed to maintain their usual diet and physical activity throughout the study. At baseline, after 6 weeks and during the 12th week, participants completed food logs (two weekdays and one weekend day). Participants were instructed by a Registered Dietitian Nutritionist (RDN) about completing the food logs. Diet records were entered into Food Processor SQL Nutrition and Fitness Software by ESHA Research, Inc. (version 10.11.0, Salem, OR, USA). Total kilocalories (kcal), grams of macronutrients, and percent contribution of macronutrients were compared to evaluate if participants maintained their diet composition.

>>76633888
>self report study
Man.

>>76633888
Well they are considered the standard body of evidence which most nutrition scientists would agree on. Feel free to "debunk" any of them, not that you have the statistical qualifications to do so anyway. You would have to be a complete idiot to think you can't gain muscle with plant protein considering how many vegan body builders there are. But I'm sure every single one is roiding and every single study is fake and gay.

I realized I forgot this meta-analysis from this year
>https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/39813010/
>No significant difference was found between plant or animal protein for muscle strength

>>76633203
Thank you, anon.
I wish the same for you.
We can’t force others to be kind, but we can do our best to lead by example.
You’re gonna make it, homie.

>>76629799 (OP)
>The biggest reason to be vegan is ethics and animal rights.
So you don't give two shits about the insects wiped out by the pesticides to protect plant crops, the small furry critters that get wiped out because they have no insects to feed on, or the reptiles, raptors, and small feline and canid species that get wiped out because they have no small furry critters to feed on. Got it.

>>76629799 (OP)
Humans don't even have rights, you want me to give a fuck about "animal rights"?

I don't think I could live without milk, eggs, red meat, cheese, etc. Sounds like hell

>>76634767
God bless

>>76633843
I wish I could buy plant protein isolate. I have to rely only on foods, it's hard to get enough protein.

>>76634860
Wrong, I do care about the small animals. But to prevent them from dying I would have to stop eating food at all and die.

>>76634868
Yes.

>>76634881
Not at all.

>>76630461
What the fuck? What's the purpose of posting this?

>>76635803
He thinks everyone that disagrees with his retardation is automatically a ketonigger.

Not yet.

Vegan or die.

It's a shame to not be a vegan in 21 century.

>>76629799 (OP)
>The biggest reason to be vegan is ethics and animal rights
Killing animals for food isn't immoral and animals don't have the right to not be killed for food

Is that all you've got?

Vegans are retarded and malnourished.
Carnivores are retarded and malnourished.
HUMAN
BEINGS
ARE
OMNIVORES

>>76634860
see
>>76630288

It's like you guys are just bots repeating the same shit over and over.

>>76634881
>eggs milk and cheese absolutely necessary

>>76629799 (OP)
No. Being a top is a better choice. not all of us want to have nice assholes for you to rate anon.

>>76639670
Not absolutely necessary, anon, but they're pleasant to consume, and their production doesn't have to be harmful to animals either

>>76629799 (OP)
>The biggest reason to be vegan is ethics and animal rights.
At least you stopped calling it healthy or sustainable lol.

>>76639719
>and their production doesn't have to be harmful to animals either
Tell me how you think milk is produced.

>>76637840
Killing animals is wrong. They have consciousness, they can suffer, they are like humans.

>>76638326
Meat industry is big and they have bots.

>>76639994
>Killing animals is wrong. They have consciousness, they can suffer, they are like humans.
Who cares? Go protest predators in the wild.

I tried it for half a year and it didn’t work for me so I stopped.

yeah cause vegetarianism and veganism have done such wonders for india

>>76640023
I care and you should do. You will be born as animals next time.

>>76640172
Why I didn't work, what happened?

>>76640838
Okay pajeet

>>76639841
You think milking a cow is harmful to her? Get over yourself, retard.

>>76640993
So I guess you're just not going to answer the question then

>>76640838
Do animals not eat other animals? Because they do that all the time. They're better at it than we are. For fuck's sake, deer eat meat, too.

>>76629799 (OP)
Are vegans pedos? Why is the little girl in the pyramid? At the bottom no less.

>>76629960
I look at this and all I can think of is taking massive shits from all of the fiber.

>>76641021
Ok

>>76640999
I just answered it, pedo vegan. Milking a cow doesn't have to be harmful

>>76641069
Please stop responding to me. I'm not interested in having a discussion with you if you're not going to answer the question.

>>76641005
>Do animals not eat other animals?
This is evil and we have to stop this.
But first humans, you have enough intellect and alternative that you shouldn't eat meat. You know how to buy vegan food and take B12 supplement.

>>76641015
>Are vegans pedos?
Yes, because vegans are based.

>>76641069
It is harmful, cows have milk for their children. Also commercial milk production keeps cows in horrible, crowded places. They have hell.

>>76630138
I may be dumb but I'm still right.

>>76641397
Ask your mother how her tits felt before you were weaned and she had half a day away from you. Also they're only in the pen to keep track of them for milking. The rest of the time they're chilling in the barn or out on the pasture. It's hardly what anyone sane would call hell.

>>76635674
>Only I can determine which animals can be slaughtered for food