Has anyone else been following the #StopKillingGames controversy?
You know shits about to real when Louis Rossmann is getting involved.
I wonder if this would also eventually apply to software and SAAS as a whole?

>>105835326 (OP)
No
I don't need daddy government to save my games, I just pirate them at any version I want
>but online games
vote with your wallet

>>105835326 (OP)
I'm afraid companies like T2 will throw millions of euro like it's nothing and get their way with the EU

>>105835343
>vote with your wallet
The Crew situation disproved your bullshit.
>pay for the game in 2014
>get it removed from your account this year
You can't predict this. They should be obligated to include info among the lines of "we can take it away from you when we see fit"

>>105835352
>vote with you wallet
means
>don't give your money to anticonsumer corporations

>>105835326 (OP)
SKG will never pass in its current state because of the extra burden it will place on the indie developer community.
>Many marginalized developers—whether part of the LGBTQ+ community or working in underrepresented racial or ethnic groups—operate in environments already strained by limited resources, smaller teams, and systemic barriers to funding.
>“If these proposals become law without nuance,” said one Zurich-based queer indie dev who wished to remain anonymous, “we could be forced to release server code or build fallback systems we don’t have the budget for. Larger studios might weather that. We can’t.”

>>105835359
>le company is based in year X
>their owner moves around
>le company bad now

>>105835361
>If these proposals become law without nuance,” said one Zurich-based queer indie dev who wished to remain anonymous, “we could be forced to release server code
I fail to see the issue or difficulty

why do you think you get to own things?

>>105835326 (OP)
Games are not physical products you can "own". They are walks in the park, a softball game with your friends, a trip to an amusement park. They are just things for entertainment to pass the time.
You don't gain full ownership of the park or ball game because you spent $20 on a ticket. Funny how that works huh?

>>105835361
>we can't release server code because we just can't oka-ACK!

>>105835371
>fall for brand loyalty like a good goy
>get slapped
Manny such cases
Singleplayer games can be pirated and no corpo can take them away from you. Multiplayer online games have an expiration date and you know that from the start, if you don't approve of that then don't give them money

>>105835326 (OP)
>Has anyone else been following the #StopKillingGames controversy?
blacklisted whole lot of publishers in steam
they're so eager to fuck me over? ok, no monies for them then

there is an elephant in the room with live service games though. you get more what you paid for intially (patches, content updates etc). it's not as simple as buying a game once and keeping it forever. with a live service there is no "game". the shape of experience is constantly changing.
what to you want to "keep" exactly? what version, time slice of live service game?

>>105835379
KYS

>>105835392
I'm sure the sales for the next Mario, TES and final fantasy 7 remake will be devastatingly low after this

>>105835388
They don't if you can just sell host. Counter Strike 1.6 is still thriving. Same shit with other old multi-player games

>>105835405
"thriving" is hell of a generous description here

How exactly will this be enforceable anyway? Do these people just think every single piece of software ever has had it's source perfectly preserved still worked on by the original team that wrote it still updating it to this day?

>>105835415
Dunno about Americas or other places but in Poland we have a ton of non-steam servers with average 10k players everyday.

It's fucking scary seeing how fast the industry is altering the narrative. We're seeing a lot more SKG = Gamergate as we inch closer to the deadline at the end of the month. We got to be fucking careful and not fall for their tricks.

>>105835398
this makes it clear that you aren't entitles for service forever. a live service game is indeed a service, not a one time purchase of a tangible product.

>I wonder if this would also eventually apply to software and SAAS as a whole?
Is there any legal definition separating games and other software?
The main differences I see is that games have more one time payments while software now revolves around subscriptions.

>>105835420
The only people still playing CS1.6 are slavs so that's not surprising

>>105835440
I can imagine some 3000 years old Serbian who plays on his pentium 4 pc to this day

>>105835419
You are being retarded on purpose, it would only apply to games released after any legislation passes

>>105835421
>who don't play games
lolwut?

>>105835343
BASED. But it shouldn't be an issue in the first place for the layman.

>>105835326 (OP)
How about you just learn some fucking self-control and vote with your fucking wallet. The last thing we need is more regulations and government overreach. History has told time and time again that communism ends badly.

>>105835455
I see. Still not interested in this eceleb drama though.

>>105835361
>Many marginalized developers—whether part of the LGBTQ+ community or working in underrepresented racial or ethnic groups—operate in environments already strained by limited resources, smaller teams, and systemic barriers to funding.
What the fuck does race, gender, or sexuality have to do with making games or funding them?

>we could be forced to release server code or build fallback systems we don’t have the budget for
"OH BOO HOO HOO!! BUT I DON'T WANT ANYMORE EXTRA EFFORT FOR MY DOGSHIT GAME!!!"

If indie developers have the money to fork up dedicated servers, you cannot fool me in to believing that they would not be able to release files they've already made unless it's complete spaghetti.

That's why most indie developers make their games P2P, not only because it's cheap, but if they ever did want to stop maintaining their game, they wouldn't have to do anything.

What a cope.

>>105835326 (OP)
>I wonder if this would also eventually apply to software and SAAS as a whole?
Most SaaS is an actual service, not a one time payment pretending to be a good but then rugpulling you and saying "this was a service all along, retard!".

>>105835343
>vote with your wallet
Brainlet take. Not buying something is not the equivalent of voting against it.
Voting with your wallet is only possible if you're in the richest 1% and you're funding competition to whatever it is you want to "vote" against.

>>105835473
>be able use your enemy's tools against them
>refuse to use them and do nothing
Libertarianism is fucked because of this

>>105835361
>Many marginalized developers—whether part of the LGBTQ+ community or working in underrepresented racial or ethnic groups—operate in environments already strained by limited resources, smaller teams, and systemic barriers to funding.
Good

>>105835361
>“If these proposals become law without nuance,” said one Zurich-based queer indie dev who wished to remain anonymous, “we could be forced to release server code or build fallback systems we don’t have the budget for. Larger studios might weather that. We can’t.”
Good

>>105835486
Buying something is the equivalent to voting for it. If you're giving them your money you're telling them you approve of their practices, or at least that despite your grumbling their product is worth more to you than your integrity. You're always voting with your wallet whether you like it or not, and your money has a lot more say than your internet petitions

>>105835359
Whales will spend money over 9000 times on microtransactions on shitty live service games to keep them going, voting means jack shit if a handful of niggas are just enabling that shit. The principle only really works on more obscure shit that could actually use the money.

>>105835518
>WAAAH STOP PLAYING GAMES I DON'T LIKE!

>>105835495
>Buying something is the equivalent to voting for it.
Mhm, sure. Even if you follow that train of thought, you need to understand that a whale who spends thousands of dollars in a game is effectively having thousands of votes. You cannot outvote dumb people who waste their money. That's why we have regulations in commerce.
>your money has a lot more say than your internet petitions
Laws have more power than your money

there's like 10-50 live service games vs thousand of normal games. that's absolutely a non issue.
gamers just want to be angry, again. truly the most degenerate consumer audience.

>>105835518
And why so you think your opinion matters more than the opinion of the people actually finding the games with their purchases? You're whining on the internet while the whale is spending and spending, why would anyone want to listen to you? Why so you even play these games?

>>105835541
The point is that the money decides what gets funded. I agree wholeheartedly that the average consumer is a bumbling idiot who doesn't deserve his freedom of choice if he's wasting it like this, but it's clear that the average consumer is perfectly fine with this trend and will gladly spend his money on a game that will be unplayable in 5-20 years

>>105835541
>STOP HAVING FUN REEE!

>>105835547
It's the same principle as with banning whores - other women look at OF girl paychecks and join the whores, because it pays. It is an issue.

>>105835518
>>105835541
If a game is being funded by whales, it's slop and not worth your time.

>>105835600
>a game is slop therefore you should just abandon consumer rights
No, kys.

>>105835343
>>105835359
>vote with your wallet
This almost never works, because there's a sucker born every minute.
>>105835361
You've already posted this made-up drivel before.

>>105835631
>This almost never works, because there's a sucker born every minute.
That's the point. Consumers don't care about your protest, they're already buying the new AAA casinoware

>>105835622
Why should I respect people who don't respect themselves? Mentally defective people exist to be milked for profit.

>>105835641
Care? They don't even know about it.

>>105835645

>>105835326 (OP)
>Louis Rossmann
Who?

>>105835361
>(((Sosowski)))
Jew. Kike. NIGGER!

>>105835361
>corporate shill arguing semantics
And you posted a screenshot of this, why?

>>105835622
you have right to not play games you don't like, you know that?
a business has right to sell a service under specific contract which both parties agrees to.

>>105835421
>SKG = Gamergate
Stop trying to degelitimize SKG by comparing it to that Russian psyop.

>>105835645
Because, if you take your own argument to it's logical extreme, it would be completely fine to legalize murder just because you don't leave your basement. So, try to answer your own question in that case:
Why would you ever want to make a law that makes murder illegal? The solution is pretty clear, no? Just don't respect people who go outside their house and never leave your house yourself.

If you want an alternative thought process, then imagine that every single physical and digital product has a clause in the license that they can be taken away from you by the original distributor at any time, for no reason, without warning.
This is effectively living in a commie police state where you own nothing. If you're fine with living such a life, then I have no way of convincing you. You're in a completely different mental state and we can just agree to disagree with how laws should work and what purpose they serve.

>>105835692
>a business has right to sell a service under specific contract which both parties agrees to.
Only to some extent. If the license (contract) goes against the law, then no.

>>105835326 (OP)
i dont really care because it has been my lifelong experience that games that are good will be kept alive by fans well past their expiration date, and some faggot law clause will not stop them from preserving them and open sourcing them eventually, in nearly all cases.

it does make sense they would want this given how successful ie age of empires is now that its 20 years later and no one wants to play avowed.

>>105835326 (OP)
I had paid micro machines on Android and they killed it.

>>105835343
>vote with your wallet
This has to be the most successful corporate propaganda that gets regurgitated by retards pretending to be smart

>>105835343
How about we abolish kikes entirely instead?
That's what Stop Killing Games is all about. Right now, kike devs/publishers get to have their cake and eat it too.
They should only have their cake. (The IP rights)
We should always be able to eat it. (Consume the product)
Right now they can own the IP rights, and take the product away from us.

That ain't right.
If they're unwilling to provide the product, they should lose IP rights and it should be up to the market to create private servers/etc for it.
Big corporations shouldn't be able to rug pull entire games or series from existence whenever they please.

It's common sense.
Yo are a faggot.

>>105835705
Refusing to continue support for a shitty live service game is not a violent crime. If you have to resort to this kind of inane false equivalence to make a point, you have already lost the argument.

The simple fact of the matter is that gaymers are the biggest consoomers alive and refuse to do anything else with their time because they're so dopamine-fried that they cannot enjoy other activities. You cannot protect them from themselves because they do not want to be protected. They yearn for the slop. They say they don't, but they do.

>>105835774
I'm seeing a lot of "shoulds" here. Who do you think you're going to convince by appealing to common sense and morality? The "kikes" are the ones making your laws
The only unstoppable force in human society is economics, and the economy is eager to play the new call of duty with 20 new lootboxes and servers that will be turned off in a decade

>>105835421
This guy seems like some unhinged boomer developing dementia. He pulls shit out of his ass and then just improvises in his made-up point

>>105835811
The Crew didn't even last a decade.
Halo 2's online didn't even last 6 years.
You can buy a game, go to college, and lose that game before you graduate.

>>105835788
>Refusing to continue support for a shitty live service game is not a violent crime
Did I say it was?
>false equivalence to make a point
I'm making a point regarding how laws work and why they matter. All crimes are non-equivalent to one another.

You're simply avoiding the conversation because you know you're in the wrong and your logic makes no sense in the real world.

>>105835827
a movie ticket lasts 2 hours. what now

i agree that game sellers must inform consumers more about the thing they buy. but that's separate issue from stop killing games.

>>105835872
A movie ticket rents you a seat at the cinema. A more apt comparison would be buying a DVD
Of course nobody buys DVDs anymore, we just use netflix. Which has exactly the same issue of non-ownership as games

>>105835872
Not even remotely comparable.
They also come with showing times on the tickets, letting you know it is a time-limited consumable purchase.
You can also exchange them or gift them to people if you can't make it.

>>105835343
NNNNNNNOOOOOOO YOU CAN'T SAY THAT YOU CORPORATE BOOTLICKER STOP KILLING THE GAMERINOS IS PERFECT

>>105835343
>I just pirate them
Games you can pirate are irrelevant in the first place.
>vote with your wallet
Doesn't work.
>I don't need daddy government to save my games
You don't, until you do. And even if you were absolutely certain you'd never play another online-dependent game, you're given a chance to help fuck over corporations you're already "voting with your wallet" against. Or just do nothing and watch it happen. Instead you're wasting your time trying to discourage others from doing it, which -- guess what -- potentially helps them more than just buying a copy of their (supposed) slop.

>>105835326 (OP)
i'm a free software advocate and this campaign is retarded and attacks the game provider's freedom
you can't force an entity to provide support for something
it's their servers, they can do whatever they want with them
if you don't like the product or how they treat you, you're free to not buy it, or request a refund in the first 30 days
no one is or should be obligated to provide resources and support to you for free
just more power-grabbing and anti-business/anti-freedom practices by jewish EU oligarchs

>>105835985
obvious bait

>>105835398
this retarded campaign wants to force game providers to keep their servers running indefinitely for free, or provide free labor to make it possible for others to host whatever they were hosting
go check the FAQ on their website, this is what they are proposing
>>105836009
try to refuse any of my points you commie brainlet

>>105836017
refute*

>>105836017
obvious bait

think of the poor poor (jewish) game "providers".
they provide services like a 2bit whore, the campaign literally just helps you to record the whore performing sexual acts for you to wank to it later in private without spending another 50$ on the whore who literally has nothing to do except fucking costomers over.

>>105835361
It's not a law proposal. It's the parliament jobs to think about those nuances.

>>105836032
it's easy to not care if you're not affected because you're a lazy commie that doesn't produce anything of value
try making a website, now you need to deal with GDPR
try making a software, now you need to deal with free support (the other legislation EU is pushing that wants to require software providers to provide warranty)
try making a game, now you need to provide free resources when you're not able to support a game any more

if you want less gay games that treat you like shit, buy libre games instead and stop trying to force others to provide free labor for you

>>105836058
obvious bait

>>105835757
Voting with your wallet works just fine, actually
When other people's votes supplant your own vote that's just democracy working as intended

>>105835695
Anti-SKG is a Russian op. They're afraid that the EU will be perceived as a champion of consumer rights and people no longer fall for the old lie of "democratic deficit".

>>105836067
No it doesn't, nobody even got to buy that shit. Lmao.
People didn't even get the opportunity to vote with their wallet.

>>105835343
If too many people would do this the only games that would remain would be online only games so you can't pirate them and that is the problem. Single player games shouldn't need some stupid online only DRM. Diablo 3 is such a game that I never played online and making it online makes it a worse game. Diablo 2 was a better model. You had single player characters and server characters. If you play offline you can do whatever you want. Any mod you want. No internet needed.

>>105835326 (OP)
Paypigs deserves every last ounce of it

>>105836077
If too many people had sensible spending habits on gaming then predatory online games would bankrupt themselves with no players. You can't start an argument with "if everyone thought like you" then reach a conclusion that's entirely incompatible with that thought process

>>105835359
Based company is acquired. They don't care if they earn money from acquisition. It's a gamble with basically no risk. They might hit a goldmine by getting loved IPs and parasiting from it by changing it for the worse by monetizing it into oblivion. If enough people get's milked by them it's pure profit and in the worse case they just closes the studio to recoup the costs while at the same time eliminating the competition. The company before acquisition that made good games died. It's EEE at it's finest and it's what Microsoft is doing by acquiring all these game studios. Company acquisition should be illegal. It's anticompetitive practice and they should be fined significantly for doing that.

>>105835695
>gamergate leaves this site
>immediately sanitized by zionist assets like Christina Hoff Sommers and Milo Yiannopolous
This is what I don't get about you progressive retards. You don't like Israel, (because you think jews are white) you're anti-zionist, but it's always Russia for some reason. Trump? Russia, ignore the giant zionist money network that owns him. Gamergate? Russia again, ignore the ziocons that subverted it. Get a clue nigger

>>105836077
Closed BNet was an attempt to provide a level playground without cheaters but it just gave monetary incentives to them. Diablo 3 was created so the money would go to Blizzard instead of Itemshop.

>>105835400
Video games are like this guy's mom: no one owns her, but everyone can have a go at her in the right circumstances.

>>105835343
the truth is this isn't even really a video games issue, this is a consumer rights digital age products issue

>>105835361
If you're not planning on running your servers anymore what's the problem in releasing the server code?

>>105835398
I'll play the devil's advocate here: what would prevent companies from releasing an "update" one day before they end support for a game, that would essentially turn the game into some trivial Pong, Snake or whatever clone that can be played offline? You can play it forever, so it would technically comply with the requirement, right?

>>105835361
If he as a developer can't make/refactor a sensible API for a server so it's trivial to implement minimal self-hostable server binary then he deserves to be out of a job by being shit at coding. I bet people like them use bullshit like GCP, AWS and other cloud bullshit. Even if the SKG was retroactive having 6 months or a year is enough for doing that.

They don't even need to open source the server. Just open source the minimal server or even just the headers for the server API. And make a patch for game client so the user can override the server configuration.

>>105836196
>buy a car
>get a toy car
what's the problem? it's technically a car.

>>105836196
What would prevent your dentist from drilling holes into the rest of your teeth so that you have to get them fixed? Just because there's no law explicitly addressing it doesn't mean a court won't nuke you to oblivion for what is clearly a malicious act meant to abuse your customers

>>105835326 (OP)
This initiative will make it harder for indies to create revolutionary new online experiences utilizing blockchain technology, AI and NFTs.
It ultimately hurts Indies including those from marginalized racial groups, LGBTQ+ communities, and underrepresented backgrounds.

>>105836017
no it doesn't you retarded monkey

>>105836204
>just document your server so everyone had a better chance at hacking it bruh

>>105836247
It's not your server anymore, you shut it down. Why do you care?
And as far as I understand it nobody is asking for documented code either, just the binaries would be sufficient

>>105835326 (OP)
Oh boy another controversy. Add it to the pile. I'm tired.

Donald Trump will kill this movement dead.
The EU shouldn't be messing with American companies if they don't want tariffs to increase.

>>105836265
My other services still run on the same or very similar code.
And I don't even have the rights to distribute binaries.

>>105836017
>try to refuse any of my points you commie brainlet
OK:

>force game providers to keep their servers running indefinitely for free
>no one is or should be obligated to provide support to you for free
>you can't force an entity to provide support for something
You're deliberately misunderstanding the initiative. The point is that AFTER support ends, the publisher should make sure that the game remains somewhat playable without any further input from the original publisher or developers.
You're arguing "You can't force a publisher to do A" when the initiative is all about "Once a publisher STOPS doing A, they shouldn't brick the product they sold"
>it's their servers, they can do whatever they want with them
Everyone agrees.
>if you don't like the product or how they treat you, you're free to not buy it
See literally every reply to the anon who says "vote with your wallet"
>no one is or should be obligated to provide resources to you for free
It's not free if I paid for the product.

>>105836279
American companies shouldn't destroy people's property if they don't want to be messed with.

>>105836286
>And I don't even have the rights to distribute binaries.
The fuck does that mean? If you're using iron source code then you were obliged to distribute your modifications in the first place. If you're using third party propertiary code then the law supplants your contract

>>105836296
>iron source code
you what

>>105836306
open*
Don't know how that happened

>>105835985
Freedom for game provider to steal back the product they sold? You sell a game then it should be playable. You sold in-game content it shouldn't be taken away either. If you sold furniture you can't just go to someone's home and break it after you removed it from your catalog.

Games used to have server binaries with the game. The only reason developers don't do that anymore is just to fuck users over. Making older games unavailable so they either aren't a competition with their current day slop, because the people that actually developed their games are no longer at the companies and they are shit at developing games and/or they just do everything to satisfy the shareholders greed. As for purely single player games they server DRM allows them to release the same game over and over with changed content to satisfy the modern woke bullshit agenda and sell them at full price. This is just incompetence (not being able to compete with their past selves) and greed so they can sell the same thing multiple times.

I bet you are tranny activist corporate dick sucking scum.

>>105836295
>>105836316
>responding to bait

>>105835326 (OP)
We need to kill DEI in games not whatever this wants to do, not signing shit.

>>105836295
>the publisher should make sure that the game remains somewhat playable
this is requesting free labor via government authority (who's really the bootlicker here ? >>105836316 )
the publisher isn't required to do anything for you
>It's not free if I paid for the product
you paid for what you agreed to. the publisher didn't include "make the game playable after EOL" in the product you purchased

>>105836434
>this is requesting free labor via government authority
It's not free labor if they're getting paid.
>the publisher didn't include "make the game playable after EOL" in the product you purchased
That's exactly what needs to change.

>>105835343
>vote with your wallet
Why not vote with my vote and sign the initiative instead? Actually no need to respond, did it already.

>>105836448
>It's not free labor if they're getting paid.
what kind of an argument is this? you paid for something else. that's like saying you get paid a salary to develop software so it's not free labor if i make you work the mines too
>That's exactly what needs to change.
yeah, by the company's decision, via you not supporting their current way of doing business with your wallet

>>105836296
>>105836310
You're clinically retarded and just spewing random freerard propaganda material.
I don't have the right to distribute GPL2 and GPL3 and Apache2 and proprietary licensed modules, and even if I did, I would never do it under GPL and I'd never release the source code, and nobody should be forced to do it either for their backend.

>>105836590
I don't understand which part of
>if this law passes, then your server software vender will have to adjust the contract to a more permissive one, because you literally cannot use their libraries/modules/extensions legally otherwise
Is hard to understand for you. If the law requires that you release your server binaries then you cannot use code under a license that prohibits you from releasing binaries

Piratesoftware huh, a gay libertarian furry with a bad take?? wow shocking!

>>105836434
Nobody reads your TOS, it has no legal power. I can print it and use it as a toilet paper, but I will never read it.
>>105836471
They paid for a game. If the game doesn't work you stole the game from them by remotely bricking it. That is what a user sees. Don't talk about licenses or services. It's bullshit to exploit area of commerce that wasn't regulated yet. You sell a product which is a game. Making a game unplayable is akin to burning a book of someone's bookshelf at home. It's nonsense and shouldn't be a thing, that's why it needs regulation. If companies don't want to play fair you need to enforce them to play fair by law otherwise they are doing what they please i.e. being fucking anti-consumer cunts. Nobody cares about your bullshit licenses. If you don't have the rights to some music or something like that just remove that copyrighted music from the game. If you use proprietary technology do as Id software did and replace it. If you depend on too much shit like that then RIP BOZO.

>>105836604
there may be 100's of different server versions. which one do you want to be released?
you really need to realize that a live service game isn't just some blob you can release.

>>105836616
If it's up to me, all of them as well as all client versions too Fuck retarded ass devs that change the entire game every week on a whim to appease ADHD zoomers
But the boomers legislating this would probably just force you to release the latest version

>>105836616
what's stop me, as a developer, to release a "final" patch that turns the game into a screensaver, and claim that game isn't killed anymore, huh?

they're free to drop the game and you're free to not buy it
why are you faggots so anti-freedom

>>105836616
This is such a dumb take. Release the last working version. If the service was up you wouldn't use any other version. If you can't open source then releasing such binary would be the same as if someone bought a game on CD with that particular version.

>>105835388
>>105835379
>>105835372
>>105835361
>>105835359
>>105835352
Notice this redditor pressing enter after every word is a "gamer" and screams in pain if you say you don't want to be a slave to corporations.

>>105836626
The people have rights to sue you then. How hard is it to not be a fucking dickhead?

Reminder that eurocucks could have been asking for rights
>to reverse engineer and interact with games' interfaces
>to create and distribute emulators
>to legally patch DRM out of games they purchased
but instead they went for
>REEEEEEEE big daddy gubbermint pwease micromanage software development practices because Im seething about a single niche racing game I shouldn't have purchased anyway I just want to consoom without responsibilities I was told we have gommunism here so I can haz this please
They don't want rights because they fear the responsibilities that come with them.
A finger on the monkey's paw curls.

>>105835361
http://games.sos.gd/
this guy made flash-like meme "games", why he out of all people speaks against it? His shit would require no additional work to be playable offline and it's not like he put any effort into planning ahead to make his games this way

>>105836017
hi mald

>>105835361
Do his shitty single player games require a central server to play? What crack is this guy smoking?

>>105836674
Your expectations for gamers are way too high. Most of them can't even find their save files on the filesystem and you expect them to fuck with the source code?
The people who care about that kind of thing already do it illegally

>>105836674
reverse engineering and emulating is already legal

>>105836674
>REEEEEEEE big daddy gubbermint pwease micromanage software development practices because Im seething about a single niche racing game I shouldn't have purchased anyway I just want to consoom without responsibilities I was told we have gommunism here so I can haz this please
This but unironically

>>105836471
>by the company's decision
The sooner you understand that unregulated commerce is objectively bad and will always be bad for an average citizen, the better.

>>105835379
Only in "headcanon" of companies. If the person buys something they own it. Nobody cares about some bullshit licenses. That's just made up nonsense. If you want to make it clear that the customer doesn't indeed buy the product, but rent it then say it clearly. I expect that if it was clearly said rent it for 2 years or something like that there would be MUCH less people willing to "buy" the game. Companies don't state you rent it, because it's convenient for them to not disclose it. They are basically scamming people by doing that.

>>105836728
I wonder how many people would buy the new Call of FIFA: Battlefield Creed every time if corporations were forced to declare in advance in big bold letters on the game's store page fow how long they intend to keep the servers running

>>105836699
Why isn't it super simple to host and work on either of the Switch emulators in the EU without it getting taken down and without the fear of you getting fucked? Guaranteeing this right should be gamers' number 1 priority if they want to help preservation.

>>105835985
>i'm a free software advocate
so you agree they should provide source code right?

>>105836757
Probably tons. They're the marvel/disney movies of vidya. People will always buy them.

>>105836759
Probably because the retards working on reversing/emulating Nintendo stuff are doing something illegal. Like distributing ROMs.

>>105835484
Being trans or brown means you'll get discriminated a lot, specifically during job seeking

>>105836768
Nobody distributed ROMs with Ryujinx, and nobody distributed ROMs with Yuzu either. Also you should have the right to have a ROM image if you purchased the game (regardless of the way you acquired the file).

>>105835326 (OP)
I don't really care about the movement but seeing how afraid corpocucks are I want it to pass just to fuck them over

>>105836674
>to reverse engineer and interact with games' interfaces
>to create and distribute emulators
>to legally patch DRM out of games they purchased
All of these are legal, why would we need a new proposal for that? Your great america is not so great if it's illegal there. RIP americucks. Actually a third world country.

As usual, the problem is that games and servers are closed source. It could be solved overnight by making it illegal to sell closed source software.
If I pay for it I get to see the source code.

>>105836793
>Yuzu
Notice how the lawsuit says "United States"

burger corpo shills are on a rampage

>>105836809
This

>le vote with your walled :DDD
Retarded braindead parrot slogan monkey. There are MILLIONS of copies of remotely killable slop being successfully sold, with an ever-increasing demand. Me or (You) or your mother not buying any of them makes *zero fucking difference* to that fact. Wake the fuck up, delusional faggots.

"Dying games" wouldn't be a problem if games/servers were open source. It would be solved overnight by making it illegal to sell closed source software. If I pay for a game I should get to see its source code. If you fuck me in the ass by pulling the plug on your servers 2 years down the line, I can run the servers myself.

>>105836808
DRM circumvention is forbidden by the EU and the DMCA too. If you published a patch for Denuvo, you would go to jail.

>>105835404
only sane cunt in the thread

>>105836861
>"Dying games" wouldn't be a problem if games/servers were open source
if my mother had wheels, she'd be a bike

>>105836881
No idea what you meant. This isn't a cooking show, retard.

>>105835326 (OP)
>You know shits about to real when Louis Rossmann is getting involved.

>>105836881
Your mother doesn't need wheels to be the town bicycle

>>105836861
There's zero need to open source anything. Just don't build your game on top of a remote killswitch. You know, like pretty much every game until 2010s managed to do just fine.

>>105836869
>DRM circumvention is forbidden by the EU
wrong, it's complicated
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?uri=celex:62012CJ0355

>>105836913
>>105836913
>don't build your game on top of a remote killswitch.
Consumers can verify this only by looking at the source code.

>>105836858
If the invisible hand of the market demands games that can be killed, then it should be given simple as
Regulations serve for nothing good and only stiffle the free hand of the market

>>105836861
>>105836901
You're essentially saying that things would be better, if they weren't how they are now. What point are you even trying to make? Oh wait, let me guess, you live in Stallman's delusional fantasy world where all code is le free... alright, cool, I know how this goes, no need to reply to me any further.
>>105836925
Confirmed for being a delusional freetard monkey

>>105836931
>the invisible hand of the market
a.k.a. the quadruple-A goyslop publisher conglomerate?
>only stiffle the free hand of the market
you mean harm slop publisher profits? you don't say...

>>105836919
If it's so complicated nobody can tell, that means it's not legal in practice.

>>105835392
HIT
HIT
DAMAGE CONTROL
SHUT IT DOWN
OY VEY

>>105836697
Yeah. These people would die of dehydration right next to a drinking fountain and blame the lack of a store selling Nintendo-licensed bottled water for it.

>>105835392
>reddit is about to lose their own gamer gate
Basedboys are hitting the fork in the road

>>105836869
Suck my cock desu. Just don't release your patch or release anonymously.

>>105837036
>anonymously
>on the internet
Oh yeah, you guys are begging to the same people who are doing their best to make that impossible, lmao.

>>105835343
IVE BEEN VOTING WITH MYE WALLET FOR 20 FUCKING YEARS YOU FUCKING NGIGER AND THINS ONLY GET WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE AND WORSE

IM GONNA VOOOOOOOOTE

>>105837099
It took you 20 years to realize that democracy sucks?

>>105836971
Dude, it's only allowing you to bypass DRM if it's for some weird accessibility use-case or if you've not been informed that there is DRM in whatever product you've bought. Or for research purposes I guess.

It doesn't allow you to bypass DRM for your own personal use or convenience. Even if a DRM check fails because the online DRM service is abandoned/offline, you're technically not allowed to bypass that DRM and your software would just be dead. Yes, you'd likely be allowed to do so if you were ever brought to court since it's something that's easy to defend, but nobody is going to sue you for it. Not only because it's clearly an abandonware product in that case, but because it could open a can of legal worms and weaken DRM overall. No company wants DRM to be weak.
However, just because nobody is taking a legal action against you doesn't mean you're doing something legal.

>>105835343
>voote with your wallet in a globalized economy where a company can just take its product to another market if one market doesnt like it
>im VOOOOOOOOOOTING

kill yourself you worthless baby boomer retard.

>>105835343
shutup faggot

>>105837275
Sounds like there is a market for that product regardless of your personal feelings on it?

>>105837286
sounds like you want to swing from a lamp post.

>>105837294
Sounds like you're a manbaby who can only respond to anyone who doesn't echo your worldview with death threats

>>105837286

>>105837251
no

>>105835343
>>105836674
>daddy government
How retarded do you have to be to be tricked into thinking this way? Daddy government is the reason "intellectual" "property" laws (which are not natural) exist in the first place. If a game developer takes the server code for a dead live service game home with him on a flash drive, it's daddy government who arrests him for breaking intellectual property laws. By using this stupid self-sabotaging rhetoric, you're advocating for yourself, as a consumer, to get fucked harder by the government than if SKG passes.

>>105837328
I'm not advocating for anything except piracy. I don't expect the government to save me and I don't care if the government seems what I do illegal
>Daddy government is the reason "intellectual" "property" laws (which are not natural) exist in the first place
IP laws are irrelevant on the issue of dead servers. The problem isn't that obtaining the server binaries is illegal, the problem is that obtaining the server binaries is impossible

>>105837342
Why would that be impossible?

>>105837354
I guess technically you can hack the corpo servers and steal them, of get them leaked by an insider
Realistically that's not happening though

>>105837364
Why isn't it "realistic" that it would get leaked by an insider? It sounds incredibly realistic to me. Devs are often fans of their own games, or at least they don't want years of their life's work lost to history. If there was no chance of punishment (enforced by "daddy government") I think it would be guaranteed that at least one guy from a team of 200+ devs would take the server code for a live service game home with him for posterity sake.

>>105837342
>IP laws are irrelevant on the issue of dead servers

They absolutely are relevant for gamespy games that had/have server binaries readily available but the publishers refuse to patch them, and distribute the games, and for those who do patch them, and make them accessible enough that many people will actually play, such as in the case of the Battlefield Revive project, the corporations wage lawfare against because they are terrified of losing their intellectual property due to archaic laws and their own greedy negligence.

As a result, the only way to get and play the games is through piracy. The retards running gamespy emulator instances are so fucking buckbroken and terrified of getting sued they refuse to publicly distribute or tell people how to get games at all, and if you ask then they tell you to figure it out, and you have to pray for someone to dm you the link or some shit. It's a joke.

>>105837422
>The retards running gamespy emulator instances are so fucking buckbroken and terrified of getting sued they refuse to publicly distribute or tell people how to get games at all, and if you ask then they tell you to figure it out, and you have to pray for someone to dm you the link or some shit.
wrong

>>105837411
I've never seen it happen, at least. I don't doubt that it has happened a few times in history but it certainly isn't the norm

>>105837422
So the games are fully playable despite being abandonware, and you're seething that they're not popular? Legal private servers won't really change much there, a dead game will never have anywhere near as much popularity as it had even during the last weeks of its life. If you can gather up your friends, start up a server and play a few matches that's pretty much the best you could hope for

>>105837448
They were popular enough to get legal notices.

As soon as they got legal notices and ran away the servers were pumping. Now it's a ghost town because it's not accessible for the average retard. You don't know what the fuck you're talking about

>>105837456
the servers were pumping before they got legal notices and shut it down and ran away*

>>105837422
>5 seconds in google
https://www.reddit.com/r/Battlefield2/comments/80d6ll/bf2_revive_was_not_shut_down_by_ea/
>Now, I looked at the EA's letter at their webpage, and there is literally nothing indicating a demand to discontinue the project. The letter clearly says they only want the artwork that associates the project with EA and Dice removed from their website. Yet, however, the Revive team openly state how they are shutting down due to non existant legal threats.

>>105837466
They demanded they stop giving people links to download the game also.

>>105837476
This is despite them refusing to sell it themselves btw

>>105837476
well, yeah. distributing the game illegally is illegal.

>>105837448
>I've never seen it happen
Because it's illegal you retard. I'm saying if it wasn't illegal, it would happen.
(Also I have seen it happen. I'm part of the modding community for a 2000s-era console game and we've had confirmed devs leak us source code in private chat because they still love the game and the modders.)

>>105837482
So we are in agreeance, the law is absolutely relevant on the issue of dead servers. Especially for games that publishers refuse to sell or distribute themselves, it's fucking absurd.

>>105837422
>So we are in agreeance
no, there was no "lawfare" against the battlefield revive project.
https://archive.is/20171027174341/https://reviveheroes.com/notice.txt

>>105837422
>be Anon
>be going into SKG threads trying to turn the discussion over to IP laws for several threads in a row
>make up some bullshit about publishers "losing their intellectual property due to archaic laws"
>keep making up bullshit that piracy somehow solves games being remotely shutdown
kys shitstain

>>105837512
Still, it is clear we now agree that the law is relevant on the issue of dead servers. Also, whether or not there was any actual notice served by lawyers, or suing done, anything to send someone running who can't afford a retainer I would consider an act of legalist aggression and undue protectionism

>>105835326 (OP)
>when its muh ebin gaymes
>"nooo I NEED to play goyslop no. 19392383 forever"
>when its the globohomo spying on you
>"I have nothing to hide anyway"

>>105837541
>Still, it is clear we now agree that the law is relevant on the issue of dead servers.
Not at all.
>anything to send someone running who can't afford a retainer I would consider an act of legalist aggression and undue protectionism
There was nothing like this.
https://archive.is/20171027174341/https://reviveheroes.com/notice.txt
>We need a favor though: we must ask that you stop throwing down Ammo Crates. In other, more legal-styled terms, please stop distributing copies of our game clients and using our trademarks, logos, and artwork on your sites. Thing is, your websites may easily mislead visitors to believe that you are associated or affiliated with EA — we’re the only ones that get to wear the “Official EA†dog tag. Since you’re Battlefield community members, we know that you are smart and helpful, and will respect that we must protect our intellectual property rights in the franchise.

>>105837536
iirc if someone takes over distribution of a working product that a publisher refuses to after enough time they may have grounds to become custodians, so the publishers have to snuff it out

i could be wrong though

>>105837562
>Just make it inaccessible enough so that no one will play it and we will leave you alone, or else we're going to come after you with a team of lawyers and put you in debt for the rest of your life :)
Definitely not a threat!

>>105837571
dumb retard
>please stop distributing copies of our game clients and using our trademarks, logos, and artwork on your sites

We need to get older people involved with stop killing games. They have problems getting replacements for their consoles from the era they grew up with. My mum misses playing Bubble Bobble and Mean Bean Machine and PuyoPuyoTetris isn't as good for her. I don't think she could deal with setting up emulators.

>>105837575
? That's exactly what I posted

>>105837605
no

>>105837607
I guess the art stuff isn't relevant. You're right. I concede the law has nothing to do with it and driving game accessibility underground while refusing to distribute it yourself and going after those who do so publicly has NOTHING to do with the state legality whatsoever! How could I have been so stupid?

The law should just require the release of the server source code. Let the community figure out how to make it work on their own (which they will do easily)

That way, it costs almost $0 to do.

Or better yet, make games work without online servers in the first place.

>>105837542
Remember the massive protest when New Coke came out? Oh wait you're too young to remember.

>>105837651
>The law should just require the release of the server source code
that's retarded

>>105835379
funny how when i buy a cd or bluray i don't have this ownership problem and do not need permission to enjoy them.

>>105837657
Why? I meant to say that when the official servers are shutdown that they should release the source code
What's the problem with that? It will be 10 years after the game was released anyways and by then anything proprietary will be old and valueless

>>105837660
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_region_code

>>105837670
You think 10 year old code is old and valueless? lol

>>105837657
so what if it's retarded. that's what Anonymous happens to want and will keep posting about it until he's blue in the face.

stop engaging with freetards. they live entirely in their own heads and have no concept of reality outside of them.

>>105837670
>What's the problem with that?
because almost every single piece of SaaS and GaaS re-uses a ton of code between projects. You'd just make it infinitely easier to find vulnerabilities in your existing servers/services.

>>105837651
SIMPLY just don't give publishers grounds to sue people who distribute and support games they refuse to distribute and support themselves. How fucking hard is it? THATS ALL YOU NEED TO FUCKING DO

>>105837687
If you want to keep it secret then keep supporting the game
>But muh coooost
One server in each region for the 10k or so nerds who won't move on to your N+1 iteration of the same game isn't going to break the bank

>>105837704
why are you speaking like you have any sort of authority

>>105837706
Why are you speaking to me?

>>105837564
we're not talking about taking over distribution. you could have stopped distribution 50 years ago, but as long as you have an original copy and suitable hardware, it should still be playable, is the point.

>>105835473
Developers/publishers can change the EULA at any time and you're forced to agree to it to keep playing the game. You might buy one that's perfectly fine only to have your rights taken away in a patch.

>>105837270
Yep, that's exactly the way I remembered it.
If they allowed DRM cracking for this purpose, that would already be a huge step forwards.
Actually while we are at it, it shouldn't even apply to just muh games, it should apply to all software. This would be a huge step forward and it would give people actual rights instead of expecting others to do work for them and region locking europeans out of games.

>>105837730
illegal in the EU

>>105837328
I want rights for the people. I don't want people to have fewer rights for developing software, I want to give people MORE rights to DO shit with the software they paid for.

>>105835547
>live service
Normal games and even singleplayer games now have online only components. You can even lose access to expansions you buy because the servers go down years later.

>>105835343
the problem is people are too retarded for free market to work

>>105837758
>I want to give people MORE rights
except game developers who have less rights

Why does every single thread about this subject get multiple spam posts that you can find posted in the archives 40+times? Every single one of them is against the movement.

>>105837787
Paid shills? In MY 4chan?

>>105837775
I don't want to do that, that's why I'm against SKK. I think people should be able to crack the games they bought (for including but not limited to keeping them playable). I'm also for emulation and piracy.

>>105836940
>you live in Stallman's delusional fantasy world where all code is le free... alright, cool, I know how this goes, no need to reply to me any further.
Maybe Stallman is right. Free Software should be enforced by law.
>LALALALALALALALALA I DON'T WANT TO HEAR THE SOLUTION TO MY PROBLEM IF THE MAN WHO TELLS IT IS FAT

>>105837775
game developers dont even have rights or even really care about games

they will sell out the code and assets they write for job security and a steady mortgage payment any day of the week

>>105835774
>and take the product away from us.
steam in a nutshell

>>105837767
The market doesn't intervene when the publisher pulls the plug 5 years after you bought the game.

>>105837767
Videogames are marketed towards children. How the fuck is little Tommy going to know a game will shut down 3 months after he buys it?

>>105835486
>Not buying something is not the equivalent of voting against it.
It's the only metric that cares for companies.

>>105837799
yep game developers dont care about games thats why they endure shitty work conditions to make them

>>105837767
its funny cause if people were smart enough for the free market to work then communism and socialism would probably work also

hell even democracy would work

>>105837839
>little Tommy
how would anyone ?

>>105837758
>>105837775
It's not taking away the developers' rights. It's making the developers' ability to take away your rights conditional, which is not the same thing. If they weren't protected by IP law there would be no problem. They'd just release the game server as open source and be done with it. The only reason it's difficult for them to comply with the SKG proposals is because they want IP protections (which take away YOUR rights,) so it's perfectly fine to give them extra requirements.

>>105837855
Yeah I'm sure the chinks who endured the sweatshop to make the clothes you're wearing are really passionate about fashion too

>>105837797
>right
>should
>maybe
Keep dreaming, bubby :3

>>105837860
yes, so youre fucked unless you get lucky and have a competent monarch like singapore

>>105837839
Games have been for adults since Leisure Suit Larry.

>>105837878
>The only reason it's difficult for them to comply with the SKG proposals
It's not difficult to comply with SKG proposals though

>>105835326 (OP)

Only because I’m terminally online have I even heard about it. Ooooh Louis Rossman and his big lazyboy chair oooooh so spooky. Watch this petition be Reddit protest tier.

>>105837747
>EU are fags
Its legal in the US and EULAs are legally enforceable too

The Game journalists are getting extremely desperate now. They are making this all about Gamergate again, defending PirateSoftware.

>>105837917
>US
this is an EU thread

I hope this thing works.

>>105835343
How the fuck am I supposed to vote with my wallet if the product I want doesn't exist? Like, for example I want to purchase Helldivers 2 with the guarantee that can play it when they shut down the central servers. How do I purchase that? I can't. That product doesnt exist. And don't just say "oh vote with your wallet and play Earth Defense force or Warhammer!" No those games are not Helldivers 2, they are not the product I want to vote for. The only way I can vote with my wallet the way I want is through government intervention.

>>105837880
This is a totally valid comparison. I'm a poor citizen of the country Videogameistan, and I was forced into the video game factories at age 6 to provide for my ailing mother. I truly hate video games and have no passion for them at all but I'm forced to do 18 hours a day of backbreaking labor in the Unity Editor because my country has no other industry.

>>105837747
Cool, now enforce it.

>>105837962
You vote with your wallet by not buying it dumbass

>>105835361
>it will harm SOME game developers
so the law works then, comply or perish, tranny

>>105837890
Fine. Nintendo games*

>>105837964
>Unityslop
i rest my case

>>105837972
I want the game dumbass

>>105837937
They also say the EU doesn't have software patents either, but they still do in practice. You can shove your "rights" right up your ass.

>>105837984
Then buy it

>>105837967
step 1: ask for a refund citing https://eur-lex.europa.eu/eli/dir/2019/770/oj/eng
step 2: make a claim in the eu small claims court

>>105837989
>but they still do in practice
how?

>>105837995
In addition, I signed the petition so I can get what I want.

>>105837989
>They also say the EU doesn't have software patents either
only retards say that since it is completely wrong

>>105838003
you wont get anything by signing the petition
Even if it goes through to become law (not likely at all) it doesn't actually shut down live service games

>>105838016
Good that's not what I want. Demented ass should read the SKG FAQ.

>>105838027
SKG does not guarantee that you can play Helldivers after they shut down the central servers

>>105838033
Not the current Helldivers 2 no, but if there's a Helldivers 3 after it passes then yes.

>>105835326 (OP)
>balding rat grifter cancels an indie dev to get more signatures
>repair ghoul smells blood and joins in
It's the ultimate youtube grifter canceltranny crossover episode! nu-/g/ must be running out of drawers to cum into. You are still not getting my server binaries and I will enforce my copyright with drone strikes if it comes to that.
Strategies for you not getting my server binaries include:
>not giving you the server binary
>operating out of a non EU jurisdiction
>sorry chump, you're not getting the server binary
>refusing to give you the server binary
>using a shell company designed to go bankrupt without giving you a server binary
>not complying with the mandate to give you the server binary
>lawyering up to sidestep the mandate to give you the server binary
>umm yeah i don't think you're getting it, pal =]
>making you wait two more weeks for the server binary
>writing server binary in ppcle64 assembly so you can't afford to run it
>running the game off a highly sharded cloud and CDN infrastructure you can't replicate
>fighting this horse shit in court and winning
>overthrowing the EU
>what if.. i just don't give you the server binary? ;]
And, after all this, if you somehow impose The People's Will to force me to release the server binary on a game that either stopped pulling in money or never fucking did, because you had an incentive to not pay me: Would you really trust a server binary from me in that state? You have to run it on an internet-facing computer with a forwarded port, accepting socket connections over a protocol I designed, only I have the full documentation of, and which for all you know, could "accidentally" have a few very interesting bugs. So let me ask you once again. Do you reaaaally want my server binary?

>>105838045
Nah, they can just decide it's a live service subscription based game and then shut it down

>>105838050
I stop reading posts after about 5 or 6 buzzwords so I stopped reading yours. I'm happy for you though, or sorry that happened.

>>105838053
They would still need an end of life plan for those though.

>>105838069
You are a black man.

>>105838078
Oh well then this is definitely not going to go through, that's very unreasonable

>>105838079
This vexes me

>>105838053
like a pay monthly kinda thing? they could, but ross thinks this ain't happening since the market is only so big for people willing to pay monthly, already been tried after WoW got popular and failed

>>105838078
no

>>105837974
>nu/g/ and nu/v/ suck AAA cock
shocking truth!

>>105838003
Voting with your vote/signature wont do anything good
Vote with your wallet only, stop giving lawmakers more power to control the free market
This is like petitioning to make pizzas illegal because other people keep buying them but you dont want to

>>105835361
>Many marginalized developers
Where in your screenshot does it say that? Did you just include this to rile the chuds up in support of the initiative, Ross?

>>105838104
>>105838095
We'll see how it plays out in the European Parliament, but you dick sucking homos need to remember the the EU isn't the United States. Lawmakers here can actually make laws to help people instead of just always giving tax breaks and government contracts to the rich.

>>105836172
Trade secrets and the fact that you now have an incentive to boycott a game so that you can get your legal private servers faster.

>>105838050
cute pic but that's all, your post is empty

>>105836043
>trusting the government
The government will do anything to fuck over the middle class regardless of what it's asked to do.

>>105838112
Fuck the free market. A market without strong government control creates a power vacuum that unaccountable corporations are more than happy to assume power in.

>>105838003
You're not getting shit except more DRM and microtransactions to offset the costs of dealing with you, and an industry that hates (you), the consumer even more than it already does.

>>105838148
The EU is made all the big tech companies their bitch with the DMA. They can wrangle in big game companies too.

>>105837997
My point is that they shouldn't be allowed to use those EULA conditions at all. The whole reason they have it there if to TRICK people into thinking they have no legal recourse even when they do.

>>105838134
Your and Ross's wide eyed teenager tier understanding of how the world works is not my problem. You probably make edgy posts about how you're pirating literally everything because you just can, so why can't I just... not give you the server binary? If a law is too horseshit people won't comply with it. In the country Ross lives in, it's illegal to operate a shop on Sundays. I wish someone would remind him of that next time he visits a Żabka on a fine Sunday morning.

>>105835392
The funny thing is that they could write "rental" on the steam page and keep doing what they want

>>105838129
>Lawmakers here can actually make laws to help people
Yeah, like Chat Control LMAO

>>105838212
Von Der Lyin' keeps tryin' to get it passed but it never does.

>>105838112
>This is like petitioning to make pizzas illegal because other people keep buying them but you dont want to
This is already a bad analogy, because you don't get to buy a pizza once to keep enjoying it indefinitely.
It's more like, petitioning so that the company who sold you a pizza recipe book can't forcibly take it away from you months or years down the line, claiming that people making their own pizzas is hurting the pizza restaurant industry.

>>105838187
I'm your employee. Why can't I just... leak the server binary?

>>105835326 (OP)
The first guy Rossmann reviewed was a moron.
>Wow, nobody could ever set up a Linux server or get a personal AWS account. Totally beyond the skill set of anyone that plays games.

Game companies don't want to tell you how all the shit works on the backend because they copy/paste the infrastructure for all of their titles and they'll have to admit how ridiculous and insecure it is.

>>105838187
Don't Sunday trading laws only apply to stores over a certain size? Żabkas are all small from what I've seen. We have this shit in the UK too, large stores can only be open for a certain number of hours on Sundays, small corner/bossman shops are exempt form this.

>>105838182
Put yourself in the shoes of the developer for once. I know you're one of those "you or me will never be a millionaire" people who vote blue but just TRY for a fucking second. Running the server indefinitely is an undue burden, so is having to design everything with EOL release from the start. Is there any other industry with this kind of unknown future cost imposed upon the seller? You cannot have any trade secrets, or even a good anticheat system under such laws.
This entire initiative has been concocted and supported by manchildren who have never done anything more ambitious than stack shelves in their lives and don't understand how anything works. It's just as fucktarded as any other communist revolution.
>what if we just um.... take waht we want by force?
>oh no, nobody is making anything anymore!
Why I have to argue this on a site that's supposedly right wing is beyond me, I think most of you are just comrade sonic stalin tier fatasses who learned to say "nigger" on twitter and think they're redpilled now.

>>105838235
I just learned she will be in her position for 20 fucking 30 or something. I doubt her successor would give up on a juicy opportunity of mass surveillance.
They are already working on internet ID systems and shit.

>>105838242
No, this is like mandating that a restaurant has to give you the recipe even after you deliberately trash it so that it closes down faster. In real life you would be beaten, arrested and then beaten again. Here you want the equivalent of making the chefs stand outside the ruins of the diner you trashed pouring you a government-mandated serving of soup they were forced to make with what was left in the fridge.

>>105837652
>Remember the massive protest when New Coke came out? Oh wait you're too young to remember.
>massive
And what did that achieve. It was only perfunctory if anything. The problem is big enough to warrant a "protest" not fizzling out after a few weeks.

>>105838278
>stores over a certain size
No, Żabka is mousing around it by registering as a post office. This is the kind of "compliance" you should expect from developers, including myself, if this horse shit actually somehow passes.

>>105838319
Yes, restaurants have to disclose what they put in their food.

classic dog piling. and im on ross scott’s side in all respects. but seeing the amount of opportunistic drama hunters just absolutely dragging thor through the mud is ridiculous to me.

>>105838336
You are employing pilpul right now and you should hang yourself.

>>105838129
Making a law that says you can't do games as a service and you have to provide the full game when the service ends is fucking moronic and will never go through

>>105836674
>to reverse engineer
Already have that
>to create and distribute emulators
Already have that
>to legally patch DRM out of games they purchased
Don't have that but that's a hard sell

>>105838303
>>oh no, nobody is making anything anymore!
Do you really believe this? That the owner class is just going to put their head in their hands and "not make anything anymore" if they're not allowed to exploit their IP in a particular way. You are a useful idiot.

>>105838106
>NOOOOOO, I HAVE TO ARCHITECT MY CODE INTO MALEVOLENT CANCER AS AN INDIE!
kys

>>105838379
If you engage in class warfare where does it end? Are you just going to stop at "no live service" games? Because that's not going to be the end of corporate greed, it won't even make a dent

>>105838319
>mandating that a restaurant has to give you the recipe
Once again, we're talking about retaining something you already paid for. Typically, one goes to restaurants for one-off meals that are consumed immediately. You don't get to keep eating the same pizza you bought 30 years ago. If a pizza restaurant chain sold pizza recipe books, it cannot have them destroyed, either by breaking into your house and burning it, or by remotely detonating them. That is the argument, not whatever fucking retarded shit you're coming up with, trashing diners and chefs standing outside, you dishonest fuck

>>105838326
>>105837652
>New Coke
The mutt was talking about fucking coke and I thought he was going on about the snowden protests without reading the entire thing

>>105838401
It's more like going to see a movie at the theater and demanding you get it on DVD to keep forever just because you paid to see it once

>>105838413
You don't pay for access, you pay for functionality

>>105838423
Who says you can't pay for access?

>>105838387
>are you just going to stop at one good thing?
>because that's not going to the the end of every bad thing
Yes, I do believe in small wins, even if the overall problem seems overwhelming. (SKG won't be the end of live service games btw.)

>>105838244
Drone strikes tend to have a chilling effect and binaries can be steganographically fingerprinted to trace who did it. My threat model already assumes possible exfiltration from a running server, so there is no binary in storage, just what's in RAM at the time. It's possible to set it up that the master binary doesn't exist outside of a device in my pocket that requires manual authorization from me. My recruitment process already screens out gamers and gamer sympathizers for unrelated reasons. And local AI is getting pretty good at writing against my APIs, so who knows if I'll need anyone.

Game on, NYPD. It's kill or be slaughtered. I've leveled up since we last met, have (You)?

>>105838413
That is already a thing. Films eventually fall in public domain. Games servers don't

>>105838434
What you're doing isn't good
The real problem is corporate greed, and this is just punitive, which will make the problem worse instead of better

>>105838450
Movie sets, props and outtakes don't either.

>>105838450
You never paid for a game server

>>105838435
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I'll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I've been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I'm the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth.

>>105835361
I completely agree with the guy in the pic. European culture and legislation are against experimentation.
>you VILL not experiment
>you VILL not have fun
>you VILL not innovate
>you VILL go to work
>you VILL go home
>you VILL shut the fuck up
>you VILL eat ze bugs
>you VILL be happy
>you VILL leave everything else to bureaucrats
Like, imagine wanting to release an innovative game that relies on your server and them remembering
>uhm, sweaty, ackshually, ZAT IST ILLEGAL IN ZE EU
It baffles me how /g/ is so vehemently against rights for being a develope--ok lol I mean it's a literal Apple fan board, my mistake, I'm not surprised at all.

>>105838454
>will make the problem worse
How lmao

>>105838427
Nobody, not even me

>>105838474
Because you're fueling a division between people who produce games and people who consume them

>>105838434
>SKG won't be the end of live service games btw
No, the big guys will just write this into their costs and carry on. Ubisoft already did. You will have your EA slop, but everything else will go extinct, all because Ross couldn't live without his EA slop, or at least, because his youtube character couldn't.

You did it, you did it Reddit. You saved gaming once again.

>>105838467
Nice, I can tell it's typed from memory. If your memory is this good, why are you too stupid to have a correct opinion on Ross and his retard crusade? You could save yourself some embarrassment.

The best part is that ever since the initiative passed the amount of pro-corpo shilling went through the roof. (((They))) are going all in alongside their lobbying group.
>NOOOOO LEAVE THE MULTI BILLION DOLLAR CORPORATIONS ALONE, IT IS THEIR RIGHT TO DESTROY THE GAME YOU BOUGHT SO YOU HAVE TO BUY THE NEXT ONE

>>105838512
I thought it was just 4chin contrarians

>>105838491
Oh no

>>105838523
When the initiative was small it was rare to see any opposition aside from the obvious contrarian troll doing it for the lolz. After it got momentum and lobbying groups got involved you started seeing anti initiative threads everywhere. You can tell because the one thing they have in common is completely missing the point and trying to misrepresent it.

>>105838491
Don't expect a /v/ermin to understand. In any case I'll adapt, there's thousands of ways to get around this commie farce, but the bridge has been burnt. I'm no fan of EA but I hope they kick Ross's balls in, that is if they don't realize it's an insane ladder pull he's gifting them.

>>105838512
>people disagreeing means le jews are against me
>le you will own nothing face
Your worldview is as nuanced as my aunt's twitter posts. But sure, your position is so undefendable I'll side with (((Them))) on it any day if it comes to that.

>>105838548
Yes, oh no
If you like games you shouldn't be waging war against people who make them
If you don't like games well you have no reason to give a shit about this

>>105838554
This proposal will not become a law

>>105838574
Great argument for having your games stolen!

>>105838549
>You can tell because the one thing they have in common is completely missing the point and trying to misrepresent it.
I mean I still feel like it's just a few people who care too much about (You)s but you could definitely be right. Either way, it's pathetic and I hope nobody wastes precious time on them

>>105838577
If I like games, I should have high standards for them, and self-respect for how I'm treated by the industry who makes the games I like

>>105838581
Sadly it is good to waster time on them every now and then, so I'd urge people to make a simple copy pasta for it.
The goal isn't to convince them, no, that is impossible. What you want is to show impressionable lurkers who don't know better how full of shit the trolls are.

>>105838603
>self-respect for how I'm treated by the industry
The industry is not your parent you servile fuck
You CHOOSE what games to buy
If you don't like a game, don't fucking buy it, don't throw a fucking tantrum like mommy didn't microwave your chicken nuggets long enough

>>105838413
>It's more like going to see a movie at the theater and demanding you get it on DVD to keep forever just because you paid to see it once
Lmao, fucking no. I paid for the DVD. I didn't pay for no movie ticket. I want to retain the rights to keep watching my DVD and not have it remotely destroyed and the movie being literally made impossible to be viewed, by anyone, ever again.

>>105838610
You CHOOSE in what jurisdictions to sell your games
If you don't like a jurisdiction, don't fucking sell it there, don't throw a fucking tantrum like mommy didn't microwave your chicken nuggets long enough

>>105838619
When you go to a movie theater you do actually pay for a movie ticket, I thought they had these in every country

>>105838549
>When the initiative was small it was rare to see any opposition
So basically it took people with actual jobs or finances noticing it for anyone to voice any dissent, because it had a 100% approval rating among tendie munchers. Shocking.
>nooo you're missing the point!
Ross's entire thing is "game preservation". He made this as broad as possible on purpose. His cult wants free shit, just wants shit in general, that's the people he's pandering to. He appeals to the same base instincts as communists did, he's offering you a revolution against the kulaks who don't let you archive everything as soon as it leaves their pen.
Ross's channel is full of unfinished games and abandonware, sometimes things he received from the developers directly. He's obsessed with that kind of stuff, and he would absolutely raid your company's servers to get his fix. This is just him trying to abuse the law to get it, and he's found fertile ground with the scum of the internet. He already has one cancel on his conscience and he doesn't give a shit. Dude's just filthy.

>>105838629
kill yourself.

>>105838623
did this post make sense in your head?

>>105838634
yes, the EU has consumer protection laws unlike shitholes like the USA

>>105838633
>can't come up with a logical argument
>falls back on violent threats
That's this movement in a nutshell

>>105838631
Who gives a fuck?
The proposal is sane and reasonable, I don't care who proposed it

>>105838643
You don't need to be protected from live service games, if you don't like them don't buy them, nobody is forcing you to

>>105838655
>You don't need to be protected from unfair contract terms, if you don't like them don't sign the contract, nobody is forcing you to
https://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/consumers/unfair-treatment/unfair-contract-terms/index_en.htm

>>105838631
>Attack the person, not the idea
You're just desperate, lol

>>105838647
>i will repeatedly twist the argument by coming up with analogies that support *my* point of view
>wait, why aren't you engaging my bullshit?? :o
fuck you, that's why.

>>105838682
explain to me how buying a live service game is any different to buying a movie ticket

>>105838678
whats unfair about it?

>>105838692
A movie ticket clearly states that it is for one showing.

>>105838692
For starters, you don't expect to keep reusing the ticket for months or years. You go there for one viewing, and it's done.

>>105838579
I haven't had anything stolen because I don't buy trash you inbred fucking mongoloid. I'm probably the only one who doesn't have Steam installed in this entire nigger thread.
Instead of supporting developers that are sympathetic to your cause, you decide to change the rules for everyone because you have zero self control. You are well on your way to becoming the world's #1 most hated consumer base by industry. Not even the indies like you anymore, not like they had any reason to, given you actively look for excuses to cancel and not pay them. There's basically nobody left on your side besides a few boomer grifters and clueless /agdg/ victims who can't code and model their way out of a paper bag.

>>105838698
https://www.ubisoft.com/legal/documents/eula/en-US
>8. TERMINATION.
>The EULA is effective from the earlier of the date You purchase, download or use the Product, until terminated according to its terms. You and UBISOFT (or its licensors) may terminate this EULA, at any time, for any reason. Termination by UBISOFT will be effective upon (a) notice to You or (b) termination of Your UBISOFT Account (if any) or (c) at the time of UBISOFT’s decision to discontinue offering and/or supporting the Product. This EULA will terminate automatically if You fail to comply with any of the terms and conditions of this EULA. Upon termination for any reason, You must immediately uninstall the Product and destroy all copies of the Product in Your possession.

>>105838654
There is nothing sane and reasonable about making AGPL mandatory unless you have socialist brain worms.

>>105838692
You don't erase all the records of the movie from history when the producer dies

>>105838701
So what's wrong with a game clearly stating it lasts for X amount of time>

>>105838718
>you don't expect
this is not an argument unless you're being misled

>>105838692
A movie has a set length, and a movie ticket grants you physical unrestricted access to a theater seat for that length. You are promised the full viewing of the movie
A live service game has an unstated lifetime, no guarantee as to what content will be available to you, and can at any time lock content that was previously available behind a new payment or even delete it entirely. You get no guarantees whatsoever as to what you're paying for
If game publishes would make a clear statement as to the lifetime they intend for the game servers and the content they will be delivering, and be legally liable to it, the comparison would be a lot more fair

>>105838757
>So what's wrong with a game clearly stating it lasts for X amount of time>
name one game that does this and isn't subscription based

>>105838724
that doesn't fall under any of the unfair terms in your previous link

>>105838680
>what is context
The more I argued with them, the more I got to know their dialectics. First they counted on the ignorance of their adversary; then, when there was no way out, they themselves pretended stupidity. If all this was of no avail, they refused to understand or they changed the subject when driven into a corner; they brought up truisms, but they immediately transferred their acceptance to quite different subjects, and, if attacked again, they gave way and pretended to know nothing exactly. Wherever one attacked one of these prophets, one's hands seized slimy jelly; it slipped through one's fingers only to collect again in the next moment.
Often I was stunned. One did not know what to admire more: their glibness of
tongue or their skill in lying.
I gradually began to hate them.

>>105838733
>virtually all closed source games until 2010s can be played today
and you somehow think we need AGPL to solve this? perhaps you need to check your own brain for those socialist worms

>>105835361
no one is asking for code

just stop suing people who fucking try to revive the games you kill holy shit

>>105838692
If I like he movie I can buy the DVD and watch it again whenever I want

>>105838761
Yeah you're right, except this movement isn't asking game developers to tell you what you're getting, it's just about making it illegal full stop

>>105838736
Nobody erased all the records of your shovelware MMO racing game from history either, Ross.

>>105838769
3. Get-out clause in favour of the trader

>>105838733
>There is nothing sane and reasonable about making AGPL mandatory unless you have socialist brain worms.
Is this bait?

>>105838757
>So what's wrong with a game clearly stating it lasts for X amount of time>
That they don't.

>this is not an argument unless you're being misled
????

>>105838785
So if DVDs weren't available then movie theatres should shut down?

>>105838723
Tell me, how does this affects the poor indie devs? Which 1 dev indie team is making always online servers?
It doesn't matter if you buy or not your egotistical maniac, it is a problem that affects a lot of people and you're just being completely retarded by letting corpos get away with it. Care for the next and they might just care for you once in your pathetic life.

>>105838807
Did anyone ask for game studios to be shut down? You're jumping like 4-5 logical steps here

>>105838769
6. One-sided cancellation
7. Cancellation at short notice
9. Hidden terms
10. One-sided changes to the contract
11. One-sided changes to the product or service
17. Limited rights to legal action

>>105838795
It doesn't bind the consumer

>>105838822
What does that matter? Nobody can play The Crew anymore.

>105838775
>virtually all closed source games until 2010s can be played today
yeah maybe with bots

the vas majority of the multiplayer ones are dead because publishers refuse to sell them or they ran on gamespy and your average retard doesnt know how to pirate them and patch the executables for openspy

>>105838835
>What does that matter?
Because that's the clause you idiot

>>105838821
6. One-sided cancellation
N/A
7. Cancellation at short notice
maybe
9. Hidden terms
no
10. One-sided changes to the contract
no
11. One-sided changes to the product or service
maybe
17. Limited rights to legal action
no

>>105838631
>wants free shit
You have brain damage. How is wanting to retain something you BOUGHT equivalent to wanting free shit?
>dude's just filthy
argumentum ad personam

we know you'all are fucking corpo dick suckers and shills. The companies themselves are abusing - exploiting the hole in the law. The common sense is that the transaction is an exchange. If you buy something and it's taken away from you that is basically stealing from the customer. Buying a game is not equivalent to buying a ticket to cinema/concert. It's an equivalent to buying a book, a painting etc. It doesn't matter that medium is digital. It's a product.

>>105838701
Do you consciously look for that wording on your ticket every time you go to the movies, or do you just KNOW the ticket is for one showing, because of cultural common sense knowledge you aqcuired in your early childhood that a ticket is for one showing?
Now what does our cultural common sense knowledge say about online games? That they WILL die one day. Refusing to accept this is on the level of a tantrum that the ticket can't be used twice, or that the live TV show you liked stopped running.

Live service games are more like live TV shows or hosted events you attend in person. The circus does not owe you the elephants. The amusement park does not owe you the fucking rides. And your EA slop shutting down is not the end of the world, if you feel scammed, don't buy EA. And if you really want server binaries, groom some young naive developer into your cult so that he releases them. Protip, you won't, you'll throw him to the dogs and he'll go work at the big companies or make one himself.
Carmack open sourced his games because he was happy with where he was at. If he was forced to make Doom and Quake today, forcibly exposed to the modern internet, he'd tell you to take a hike.

>>105838882
6. One-sided cancellation
>Upon termination for any reason, You must immediately uninstall the Product and destroy all copies of the Product in Your possession.

7. Cancellation at short notice
>Termination by UBISOFT will be effective upon (a) notice to You or (b) termination of Your UBISOFT Account (if any) or (c) at the time of UBISOFT’s decision to discontinue offering and/or supporting the Product.

9. Hidden terms
The EULA is not shown to you before you buy, but afterwards inside of the game.

10. One-sided changes to the contract
>UBISOFT reserves the right, in its sole and absolute discretion, to revise, update, change, modify, add to, supplement, or delete certain terms of this EULA

11. One-sided changes to the product or service
>UBISOFT may modify the Product for any reason or without any specific reason, at any time and at its entire discretion

17. Limited rights to legal action
>Thus, for any claim related to this EULA where the total amount sought (i) is equal to or more than $10,000 USD, you may, or (ii) is less than $10,000 USD, you must, initiate dispute proceedings by completing the Notice of Dispute Form accessible at https://legal.ubi.com/NoticeOfDispute/en-US . UBISOFT may offer to settle the claim, provided however that if the dispute is not resolved within 30 days from the date of UBISOFT's offer to settle or UBISOFT's receipt of the Notice of Dispute Form (whichever is later), you may invoke binding arbitration by filing a separate Demand for Arbitration accessible at https://legal.ubi.com/DemandForArbitration/en-US . A party electing arbitration shall initiate it through an established alternative dispute resolution ("ADR") provider mutually agreed upon by the parties.

>>105838796
Well, you have socialist brain worms or you're too stupid to realize this is 99% AGPL in practice. Glad we cleared that up.

>>105838911
>Do you consciously look for that wording on your ticket every time you go to the movies, or do you just KNOW the ticket is for one showing, because of cultural common sense knowledge you aqcuired in your early childhood that a ticket is for one showing?
It typically states the date, time, and place on the ticket. Didn't read the rest of your post.

>>105838303
>this guy believes in the "free market"
Son, the "free market" is a scam run by jews - a planned economy that is not planned for you.

>>105838923
You're doing a one-sided interpretation of all of these clauses. You'll notice they say things like "without valid reason" or "unless neccessary", but you're just automatically assuming they're in the wrong, which is obviously not how a court case would work
one-sided cancellation and hidden terms only apply if you can't get a refund for your product
the paragraph about legal action literally says the opposite of what you're trying to say, they're telling you that you can make legal claims

>>105838845
>virtually all closed source games until 2010s can be played today
>yeah but not in the same way as when they were supported
>yeah but the average retard doesn't know how to make the patches work
yeah but the fucking game is fucking playable by those who own a copy and still want to fucking play it, you fucking mong

>>105838890
>BOUGHT
You didn't buy indefinite support. No software is supported indefinitely. No software is "bought" in the first place.

You are a manchild who gets hung up on precise literal definitions of things with zero awareness of common sense, social contracts and context. Not even lawyers operate like this, quite the opposite, lawyers will destroy this in court the moment someone demonstrates undue burden.
In EXTREMELY blunt terms:
>You do not get to unilaterally fuck people over using law or poorly worded contracts.
>There is a concept of "reasonability" that applies to anything; if you got several years of service out of a game, that's a perfectly reasonable return on your purchase. Appliances have 2 years mandated warranty for fuck's sake.
>Shit happens. Companies can go under and they should not be obligated to spend the last $500k in their war chest preparing you an EOL binary emulating various cloud services because that money should go to the company employees' last paycheck.
>If you force people to do things, they will actively despise you and any compliance you get will be extremely malicious.

>>105838187
>stores closed on Sunday are a bad thing
If It were up to me, there would be no work at all on Staturdays or Sundays. Capitalism fucked your brains over to believe that people should provide services 24/7/365

>>105838882
>What does that matter?
>Because that's the clause you idiot
So if my game got shut down, I should be thankful because the clause that says they're allowed to do it is... non-binding? Gee, thanks

>>105838983
a server with 1 person in it for a game that was designed for over 50 is not playable, you fucking mong

>>105838972
>You'll notice they say things like "without valid reason" or "unless neccessary"
wrong, quote the EULA or kys
>the paragraph about legal action literally says the opposite of what you're trying to say, they're telling you that you can make legal claims
wrong

>>105839002
It means you get a refund

>>105839011
so everyone who ever bought the crew (in the EU, for the sake of argument), gets a refund? well, where are these refunds then?

>>105839010
Terms which allow the trader to alter a contract unilaterally, *unless the contract states a valid reason for doing so.*
Terms which allow a trader to make changes to the product or service to be provided unilaterally and *without a valid reason.*
Terms which authorise a trader to terminate a contract with no fixed end-date at short notice, *except where absolutely justified.*
They are literally providing you with a way to take legal action, they're making it easy for you

>>105839022
>so everyone who ever bought the crew (in the EU, for the sake of argument), gets a refund?
maybe

>>105839009
what even is your argument anymore? that nobody plays the game anymore therefore we should make it unplayable for everyone forever? that i can't possibly get 50 people to play an old game one evening? what?

>>105839052
nobody plays them because they're inaccessible for the average retard because the only way to get them is with piracy + community patches that look like viruses you fucking retard

>>105839033
>*unless the contract states a valid reason for doing so.*
>*unless the contract states a valid reason for doing so.*
>*except where absolutely justified.*
Where in the EULA are those valid reasons specified?

>They are literally providing you with a way to take legal action, they're making it easy for you
Ok, another quote from the same section:
>You hereby agree that for any dispute or claim that is less than $10,000 USD, you waive any right to a trial (by judge or jury), you waive any right to participate as a member of a class in a class action or similar proceeding, and you will abide by the dispute resolution mechanism in this Section.

>>105838951
I helped ship an online game this year you crayon eater. We're so far out of reach of your commie nonsense that we're not even incorporated in an OECD country. I guess that makes me the (((them)))? That's fine by me, I was on your side like 10 years ago though, before I got fucked over. I was part of this cult hook line and sinker, and almost died thanks to it.

You apply (((echoes))) to developers but the (((consumers))) in this retard industry are the greediest, most morally bankrupt and rotten people I've ever met, a perfect mix of evil and gullible. You will abuse any good will thrown at you, give you a finger and you'll chew the whole arm off. You will cancel your own allies at the drop of a hat and fall for the most elementary psyops. Why should I feel one bit bad for you or cheer for you? You literally cannot be interacted with in any way and you do not respond to anything other than greed. If someone offers you the tiniest bit of goodwill, you will, in Russian assrape military trad fashion, see this as a weakness and eat the person in question alive. The average gamer has an indian morality combined with russian closet homoeroticism and the impulsivity of the negro. I do not even register you as a sentient being, I have more pity for a mosquito, it's less greedy than you.

>>105839106
>Where in the EULA are those valid reasons specified?
They will be specified when the the thing actually happens obviously, not in the EULA
>you waive any right to participate as a member of a class in a class action or similar proceeding, and you will abide by the dispute resolution mechanism in this Section.
This could potentially be an issue, but only if the resolution mechanism didn't offer you adequate options

>>105839134
>They will be specified when the the thing actually happens obviously, not in the EULA
So there are no valid reasons specified in the EULA which makes it unfair.
>This could potentially be an issue, but only if the resolution mechanism didn't offer you adequate options
It literally tries to forbid you to a trial (by judge or jury)

only kikes and retards are against the movement

>>105838997
How's that compliance working out for you? Where are the right wing death squads to shoot me for heresy? Why isn't the żabka girl slipping me a "HELP" note or blinking "torture" in morse code?

>>105839149
>So there are no valid reasons specified in the EULA which makes it unfair.
Are you asking the EULA to predict the future?
>It literally tries to forbid you to a trial
Only if it's less than 10,000 USD which isn't very restrictive if their resolution system actually does what it's supposed to

>>105838997
That map is complete bullshit, the vast majority of stores are closed on Sundays, and the ones which are open on Saturdays are only open in the morning too. It is absolutely fucking retarded, and I hate the EU for this. We used to have 24/7 stores, but we no longer have those either. Then they introduced mandatory store closures on Sundays because of the christcucked government but people hated it so much they eventually backed down (doesn't happen very often) but it still took like a year or two.

>>105839169
The contract must state the valid reason for the one sided change to the contract/product.
>Only if it's less than 10,000 USD
Which Ubisoft game costs 10000 USD or more?

>>105839185
>The contract must state the valid reason for the one sided change to the contract/product.
No it musn't, it just needs to be stated somewhere
Why the fuck would an Ubisoft game cost 10,000 dollars? That's the how much you're suing for not the price of the game lmao

>>105838940
Do you READ it though? Every time? Just to make sure they didn't get it wrong, or to see if you got an extra showing?
Yeah, that totally happened. No you fucking mong, you ask for a ticket for the showing at 6PM, you read the room number on it at most, if you didn't see it on the screen, and you just go. You don't check autistically whether the ticket is for one showing because even a fucking toddler knows it's for one showing.
If you're gonna be a dishonest nigger, don't cry when people say your movement is spearheaded and promoted by dishonest niggers.

>>105839212
>No it musn't
unless the contract states a valid reason
>Why the fuck would an Ubisoft game cost 10,000 dollars?
So why would you sue for 10000 USD?

>>105839219
>Do you READ it though?
Yes, I inspect the product I bought and if it is faulty, I return it and either get a replacement or my money back. I didn't read the rest of your post.

>>105839223
The valid reason just needs to exist, it doesn't need to be in the contract
Who knows why you would sue for 10,000 USD

>>105839240
Yeah, you sure do. Or rather, your mom does whenever she takes you out of your basement for good behavior.

>>105839273
you lost

>>105839296
lost what?

>>105839301
the plot, you yourself wrote here >>105839033
>*unless the contract states a valid reason for doing so.*

>>105839313
The Ubisoft contract does state the valid reasons for doing so

>>105839319
quote them

>>105838078
Oh you mean just like the opponents are saying, which Ross and the rest of the cult are calling a "misrepresentation"? Rossfags are lying cunts after all? Shocking.

>>105839326
security, legal, best practice or regulatory reasons.

>>105839340
those aren't specific enough

>>105839330
>anime fag
opinion disregarded

>>105839348
How do you know? The specifics can't be known ahead of time
What's the point in this roleplay session where you pretend to be the worst lawyer ever?

>>105838129
>The developers vill release ze binaries!
<they will just switch to a subscription model
>Oh that doesn't change anything! Subscription games are affected too!
<bruh that's unreasonable
>We'll see how it plays out in EU parliament, nyeh heh heh!
Oy vey it's a (((misrepresentation)))!

>>105839360
>What's the point in this roleplay session
To keep bumping the thread. I'm not actually trying to convince anyone. I don't care because I don't buy games with DRM.

>>105839378
>bump limit reached
oh shit, I didn't realize

>>105839378
Clearly you do care because you're trying to prove that there's something wrong here
All of the things that could be considered unfair can be solved by just giving out a refund

>>105839378
I don't give a shit if a game has DRM or not. If I have the same system 20 years later, I want to still be able to play the games I bought, like it was when videogames started being made.

>>105839352
>>105838940
>>105839240
>>105838069
>le didn't read!
>noooo why is nobody DISCUSSING with us! oy vey we're being misrepresented!

>>105839409
>20 years later, I want to still be able to play the games I bought, like it was when videogames started being made.
I can't play my games from 20 years ago, the discs don't work at they don't work on modern OSes

>>105839414
>why is nobody DISCUSSING with us
because we will discuss it with the EU Comission

>>105839330
>Ross and the rest of the cult are calling a "misrepresentation"?
Every SKK cultist tells people they don't understand what SKK is about, then you go check what it's about, and then they'll eventually admit it's about what you said in the first place.

>>105839419
You could convince the EU to legally mandate that I owe brown people my hemorrhoid ridden rectum for all I care, doesn't mean they'll be getting it, just like you are not getting the server files without resorting to illegal means subject to equally illegal retaliation.

My ancestors survived communism once by, wait for it - Not. Fucking. Complying. A yankee immigrant manchild and his ugly passport hunter wife trying to change MY law to make me give him free shit are going to get fuck all and a little less from me, but it does put them on the list of people to fuck with if I'm bored enough.

>>105839488
>you are not getting the server files
Then you will be sued and forced to comply.

>>105839513
The service is only available in Japan, the US, China, Korea, Taiwan, and literally every country other than the EU, sowwy :^) While the rest of the world is busy having fun with games, you commies can have fun with another petition to the EU lol
No, we are blocking your VPNs too, and they are getting banned by the EU anyway.

>>105835361
>extra burden it will place on the indie developer community.
no, they can just say there is no end of life support.

you dont need to make cigarettes healthy, you just have to declare that they're deadly on the packaging

>>105839513
see the end of >>105838050
I look forward to prolonged legal and media kino involving several rounds of evasion and malicious compliance, all while I become a martyr and icon for the opposition against you, with the full drumming support of the industry. We can even call it "Gamergate 2" for maximum irony. I promise you that the californian cokeheads and trannies are nothing compared to me, because I am a monster you've created.
I probably won't even live in the EU by then though. I might not even legally incorporate. I already live in a world without law thanks to the earlier actions of your cult and the already zero-trust environment we have to meet in, which pushed me to consider online-only games in the first place.
You will pay for access to my servers in Monero and you will get a visit from sad dark men if you violate my license and the natural divine laws and basic human social contract, simple as.

>>105839588
Hey, think about the cross-promo deals you can make with VPN companies here.
We can build a big beautiful wall, and rossniggers are going to pay for it.

>the faggot pushing this is an American
Why isn't he pushing this America? He does he come to Europe and get European people to agree to losing their rights? Right, because America, screwed as it may be, still gives more of a fuck about people's rights than the shithole that is the EU. This would not fly in America.

>>105839733
>"people to agree to losing their rights"
>corporations have the right to steal money at any time!
perfect fluoridated max vaxed cattle

>>105839108
The devs aren't the problem, or aren't the biggest manifestation of it. It's the game company management/execs and shareholders. Those cretins absolutely deserve (((echoes))). They're the ones making these decisions, not you.

>>105838303
You're telling people to literally destroy their copy of the software they purchased if the EULA changes and they don't agree with those changes. You're a corpo plant sent to spread misinformation.

>>105839839
Nobody stole anything from you. You were stupid enough to buy a "license" to an online game from FUCKING UBISOFT of all things. You knew what you were buying.

>>105839982
Actually the terms you agree to can change at any time. You might buy a game with no DRM only for it to be added in a patch later with no way to avoid it.

>>105838757
>So what's wrong with a game clearly stating it lasts for X amount of time
Nothing. But none of the games state that except subscription based games like WoW.

>>105838997
>there would be no work at all on Staturdays or Sundays
This is retarded. You should demand lower weekly hours instead of arbitrarily deciding to make 2 days of the week completely useless and unproductive. Imagine not being able to go to a fucking store, pharmacy or a doctor over the weekend. Disgusting.

>>105839991
If this happens you're allowed to not agree to new terms and demand a refund (if it's a live service game). You'd easily win in court, at least in EU. This is why most games don't actually do this.

>>105839961
>You're telling people to literally destroy their copy of the software they purchased if the EULA changes and they don't agree with those changes
I never said that, but yes, why not. Furthermore, I reserve the right to ban you and terminate your access to my Services at any time for any reason I deem fit. This Agreement is governed by the laws of the jurisdiction of my choice, and by using my Services, you agree to indemnify me from any third party legal action and agree to settle disputes via arbitrage rather than in a civil court.
These provisions are absolutely necessary for me to conduct business with you because you are a nigger.

>>105839991
Then don't install the fucking patch.

>>105839900
You CANNOT make a game without the execs and shareholders because you will get buttfucked by the same people who are spearheading this initiative, and by your competitors who have execs, shareholders, and marketing black budgets to cancel your poorfag ass.

>>105839900
At great risk to myself I will be even more blunt. I tried doing it your way. I worked on a single player DRM-free 120+ FPS 3D game with modern graphics, for (You). Believed every /v/ermin meme and lived it. I got assraped dry by your faggot cult the moment I needed the bare minimum of community support. You get what you deserve, and you deserve to get fucked. My subsequent projects will all be online and I will sooner host them out of a boat on the mare nostrum via starlink than give up the last bargaining chip that physically forces your niggardly ass to pay up.
And Ross better get into habit of looking over his shoulder if he gets his way because he's fucking with people's daily bread to satisfy his desire for fame.

>>105840589
>>105839900
Forgot to mention, it was gonna be an open source release after a set time just like id Software used to. You were going to have a level editor and other modding tools. The reason I'm telling you this is to make you understand who is against this movement and why we despise you. The reason you only see 2D pixelshitters speak out openly on named accounts is a skill issue on their part, the rest of us know better. And AAA isn't against you or even mounting any serious resistance, pic related. They're fucking loving this ladder pull.

>>105839733
Watch his videos, he's calculating this like a true psychopath. And also because he's a poor nigger stuck in a dead end youtube "career" who has to live in a moldy rathole in Poland to make ends meet. Don't get fooled, this initiative is making him real money in the exposure alone, and he's perfectly willing to throw people into the wood chipper for it, hiding behind
>he's not responsible for his fans actions, tee hee!
He's an evil, slimy fuck.