Thread 106370516

>>106370516 (OP)
Good for you, bro. I hope you're having fun. It's useful skill to have and it can be very rewarding as well. Have a good time with it, yeah?

>>106370516 (OP)
Better late than never.
Don't let the vibe coders discourage you, when the IA bubble bursts, you'll be on top.

It's only too late to learn coding after you take your last breath.

link from that website?

>>106371037
https://gdquest.github.io/learn-gdscript/

>>106370516 (OP)
>dick variables
proof that oop is gay

>>106370516 (OP)
with AI you can will be able to avoid stackoverflow completly, consider yourself lucky. just dont let it become a crutch for critical thinking and debugging.

>>106370516 (OP)
if you want to actually learn, use chatgpt as a search engine and a debugging assistant. dont let it write the code on your behalf.

>>106371059
>gdscript
My brother in christ…….

>>106371107
what's wrong with it? I just want to make games

>>106371132
not useful in any other context

>>106370516 (OP)
that's very based anon-kun! i'm 25 and i've been meaning to learn how to code since my late teens, but so far i only managed to learn html and css like a fucking homosexualised cumbucket. this post inspired me to try harder!

>>106371132
GDScript is fine. Ideally you learn a number of programming languages so you can understand what tradeoffs are made for each language. A good design in one language may not be a good design in another. Some languages have made poor decisions in terms of their own implementation and syntax that can create annoying problems to work around. You only really get a good feel for all that when you experiment with some number of languages. The best language to pick when you're starting out is the one that keeps you interested and engaged so you can complete a project. If you're productive with GDScript then use GDScript.

>>106371163
so should i do any of these languages?
honest question, i just want to make games and i heard godot is an easy bar to break through, i probably can't get a decent job coding since i probably cant compete against the other kids who started in their early / late teens and are constantly joining the work force

>>106370516 (OP)
i started coding in my 20s, and i'm in my 40s now and haven't really made much progress
i did write a Python program to download podcasts that have an RSS feed, and that was pretty useful
i wrote an implementation of Conway's game of life in Ruby with SDL
and i wrote a login system in PHP that stored hashed passwords in PostgreSQL with argon2, but i never did anything with it
oh, and i implemented most of an HTTP 1.1 server in C before i got filtered by epoll/kqueue
i don't even know where most of the code is, probably on an old external HDD somewhere
i'll probably never develop anything worthwhile
but it distracts me for a while, i guess

>>106371212
C/C++ is the language you should learn if you want to get into games (you'll also improve quicker using these 'hard' languages than you would using shit like Java). Also that's bullshit. A fucking Indian can land a 80k a year job off a H1B after a 6 week boot camp, you can do it to.

>>106370516 (OP)
Good for you man !

>>106371237
i kind of understand where you might be coming from, i also thought about why i'd want to code other than just for fun and i realized that if i had games in mind they could be an anchor i.e. you keep moving forward until your game is finished and have a goal you know you're working towards to otherwise yeah getting into programming was hard because i had no clue what i want to do by "learning" C, Java, C#, Rust, Python, etc.

>>106371256
Indians get their jobs via a combination of nepotism and having no dignity. If you aren't Indian the bar is a lot higher.

>>106370516 (OP)
Programming is useful in its own right, but also good for the intellect in general.

NEVER vibe code.

>>106370516 (OP)
I went down a similar path as you. Started in my late 30's to relearn how to code. Tried C# w/godot for a while but got frustrated with the lack of support on godot's end. (Not being able to easily profile my code for example). Moved on to gdscript and it's... meh. I like the helpful tools visual studio code provides for c#, writing code in godot editor is shit.

>>106371256
>boot camp

lol it's not 2016 anymore also

>H1B

>>106371212
GDScript is fine for a first language
you can use it until you start hitting performance issues
then you can switch to C# if you only care about Windows, or C++ if you want cross-platform or really need to juice performance
there's no point in using C for games, because you're either going to have to use a bunch of libraries for basic shit, or reimplement stuff yourself, and your implementation will probably be buggier and less efficient than a library that has been in development and real-world use for a while
if you use C++, you might end up having to rely on C for some low-level shit like networking or kernel interface on *nix, but you can use it judiciously and mix it in with your C++

>>106371212
If you're passionate about games that would already make you a better fit for the company than someone who just learned to code.

>>106371302
great, so gdscript / godot until i'm ready to move on? do you suggest i look up guides on how to learn c / c++ for games or just generally learn c / c++?

>>106371331
If you want to learn c/c++ for game making you can mess around with raylib.

>>106371059
drop this garbage and learn lua and love2d, I say this from experience, godot is a buggy engine designed and maintained by retards. literally anything else is a better option.

>>106371256
shut the fuck up nocoder
>>106371212
no, continue using GDScript, and build games. if you ever need to build something that is not a game, it should be fairly fucking obvious how to do so with another language
and stop browing this board for advice on programming, IMMEDIATELY! I've been doing this shit over a decade, have like 40 different projects in various states of progress, have worked as a professional in the medical device industry, etc. and the amount of retardation you find oon this board is uncountable. your noob ass will not be able to tell genuinely good recommendations from retards that have written maybe 100 LOC over the entirety of their lives (but have read many blog post! lmao)

>>106370516 (OP)
i'm 37 and couldn't care at all about coding, wtf is even the point if I can't print money with it? Everything people would want is already made so who cares at this point?

>>106371059
don't get stuck in tutorial hell think of a little game you can implement quickly and you learn much faster.

>>106371390
yeah i already have five games in mind that i want to make of varying complexity, the first one is a simple side scroller similar to the early star war SNES games, since I have this anchor/goal I can put in the effort to see it through and probably get decent knowledge on it

>>106371369
Seething, lying Indian detected. No one with even 6 months of coding experience would, in good faith, hand out the advice you are, which is some of the worst shit I've seen in my life. Why the fuck are you recommending a shitty scripting language that's tied to a shitty game engine for any usecase? It's a complete waste of his time, you are essentially vendor locking him into ecosystem he may or may not want to use when he has some experience. Instead he could spend that time learning C++ then jump right into any game engine/library such as SDL/Raylib when ever he wants. You are a massive cunt for trying to get a newbie to do what you are recommending.

>>106371422
post code faggot, this is a hash table that I have outperforming Swiss Table

>>106371331
>Whenever the C++ language designers had two competing ideas as to how they should solve some problem, they said, “OK, we’ll do them both”. So the language is too baroque for my taste. – Donald E Knuth
>I may be biased, but I tend to find a much lower tendency among female programmers to be dishonest about their skills, and thus do not say they know C++ when they are smart enough to realize that that would be a lie for all but perhaps 5 people on this planet. – Erik Naggum
nobody really learns C++, they learn the parts of it they need that work
many large C++ projects have, along with the usual style guide (use tabs, make your lines this long, make your functions no longer than this, etc.) guidance on which C++ features are allowed and which are prohibited so everyone can be on the same page about what the code is doing
if games are your primary interest, i'd suggest looking at some C++ game code and going from there
IIRC, Irrlicht3D is written in C++

>>106371331
C and especially C++ aren't that easy to learn on the side, personally I would stick to an easier language at first, some of the concepts will still carry over.
But if you have a lot of time and motivation it could be possible.

>>106371212
>>106371302
Do not listen to this retard, it's obvious he has no idea what he's talking about, but unfortunately the internet is filled with idiots like him giving advice on shit they are a beginner or garbage at. He's repeating surface level shit he heard other idiots say but has no idea of anything.
99% of anyone who is good at anything won't spend time on forums/discord/etc, it's just dimwits who procrastinate who are here, and who's experience amounts to trying something for a few hours and then watching youtubers talk about it.

The only options you have are:
1. trial and error, this takes a very long time.
2. to take direct advice (not meme youtube videos), meaning a conversation with someone that you can confirm that he has experience in the domain, like someone that works in the industry, not some meme youtuber who submits trash he worked on for a day to game jams and has no idea how to complete or scale up a game.

>>106371438
LOL THE LISP FAG IS STILL STUCK ON HIS HASH TABLE AFTER 6 MONTHS HAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAH
You fucking suck lol, that should have taken you 20 mins to do what you're trying to do. Funny that you keep switching languages and everytime you still fail. Fucking Lisp > Rust > Lisp HAHAHAHAH. I rest my case, you are retarded.

>>106371456
There is also the issue of whether C++ is really the best choice for making games specifically, even if most game engines are using C or C++.
For instance if you want to use Unity at some point, you just script it with C#.

>>106371438
not him, but you exposed yourself, did you ever program anything usable or just worked on college algorithms?

>>106371464
go ahead and write a hash table in 20 mins that outperforms Swiss Table
I'll wait
btw, @op, these are the retards I'm talking about. notice how he will not post any code.

>>106371493
>>106371484

>>106371525
you get no more responses from me. you are worthless.

>>106371456
>>106371480
If I really take off and don't quit, I'd like to make my games really performant which I heard is difficult to do with Godot so yeah maybe at some point I'll consider C / C++ / C#

>>106371237
maybe the universe is trying to tell you something

>>106371806
perhaps so, but i'm notoriously bad at listening to the universe

bump

>>106371212
I found that I disliked working in VS code languages as a game dev.
I bounced off of C and C++ and instead sorta transitioned to something I found easier for me to handle which was python.
It's worked fine for me for the past 6-7 years. I make games in pygame and renpy and make an ok amount of money off of it. I'm finally good enough that I can see where the limitations of the language are and get past them and start doing stuff that isn't just copying other peoples work.
If you're a first time, try out python
It's the easiest to get into I feel

>>106370673
>when the IA bubble bursts, you'll be on top.
Iowa will never fall.

>>106370516 (OP)
My grandmother tried to learn to read when she was 22 years old. Her boss was a teacher and put her on a special course for adults. Even so, my grandmother died without knowing how to draw her own name. She was born illiterate and died illiterate.
And all because her learning window had already closed.
Based on this empirical experience, I affirm that nothing complex is learned after the age of 18. Music, singing, drawing, painting, programming, other languages and so on.

>>106372970
bot post, if not, your grandma had a skill issue and so do you if you're basing everyone on planet earth off of your grandma's skill issue

>>106372935
true, she's still a floating museum in california

>>106373035
Murica.

>>106372970
>>"nothing complex is learned after the age of 18"
uhhhhhhhhhh i've got some bad news for you little buddy

>>106373179
fuck yeah

>>106370516 (OP)
i'm vibe coding in my late 30. kek

i know how to do small coding and medium, just can't retain any shit.

>>106371212
>so should i do any of these languages?
It depends
>python
not really useful for games
>java
can make a game (see Minecraft) but you won't be happy (they eventually ported Minecraft to C++)
>C++
The most common choice for games doing anything reasonably computationally difficult (RTS, deep simulation, high fidelity graphics). Relatively low bar of entry to learn, but immensely high bar to reach to mastery. Not often a first programming language.
>Shell
Irrelevant to gaming, extremely useful if you plan to work on any software projects outside of gaming.
>Assembly
Irrelevant to 99% of software. Very few people are writing this close to the hardware. OS developers, embedded developers, maybe graphics shaders?
>C
Irrelevant to games. Extremely useful if you want to learn how the computer functions and want to become a REAL programmer.
>Latex
Not a programming language
>HTML
Not a programming language. Kind of useful though?

>>106373401
>C
>Extremely useful if you want to learn how the computer functions and want to become a REAL programmer
if the computer in question is a PDP-11

>>106373475
are you retarded?

>>106373503
https://queue.acm.org/detail.cfm?id=3212479

>>106373523
>literal who boomer spouting boomer nonsense
what is your point, sir?

>>106370516 (OP)
Also be mighty sure to dust off that algebra in the back of your brain. That alone will massively increase your problem solving skills. The better the math, the better the app.

>>106373571
Can't this work in reverse as well? The better you discipline your brain through programming the better you'll be at math

>>106373571
>The better the math, the better the app.
it's true, when i mastered partial differential equations, my "Hello, World!" program got 32% faster

>>106373644
I didn't say everything will be faster (though many things will), I said it improves problem solving skills.

>>106373610
I did a lot of programming berore I bothered to pick up a math book and I'm telling you my math was in the frggin gutter.

>>106373661
>I said it improves problem solving skills.
mhm, you did say that
but i didn't quote that, because that's not what i was responding to
you said something else, too
i did quote that, because it was what i was responding to
welcome to 4chan
mhm

>>106373661
he's being a dickhead. continuous mathematics wouldn't help much. discrete mathematics absolutely does.

>>106373688
>he's being a dickhead
i didn't know /g/ was full of such humorless pricks
relax, guy, it's not that serious

>>106373704
warhammer is serious business

>>106371422
>Instead he could spend that time learning C++ then jump right into any game engine/library such as SDL/Raylib when ever he wants. You are a massive cunt for trying to get a newbie to do what you are recommending.
nta but this is incredibly bad faith advice too
setting up c++/sdl/the whole environment will take him more time than creating a whole game in an existing environment
i get your sentiment but jumping into C++ and SDL is the most retarded thing one could do if they actually wanted to make a game. whats next, are you going to tell him to use glwf with opengl from scratch?

>late 30's
fuck off zoomer

>>106373475
>if the computer in question is a PDP-11
You know what I meant. You know that I meant it would teach concepts like virtual memory, stack memory, heap memory, struct packing, pointers, shells, environments, compilers, linkers, etc. Fundamental computing concepts that will put you ahead 99% of people who have ever written a line of python if you even scratch the surface.

I was not saying they will learn every idiosyncrasy of their hardware architecture. You know this, and yet you chose to be a cunt. This is why you suck.

>>106371212
Heres my take
>Assembly
Rare jobs paying insane salaries. Not necessarily good paying. You end up learning too much for nothing
>JavaScript
Will give you job as webdev. Mostly hostile and low paying job which js ALWAYS available since devs are disposable
>Java/C#
Easy jobs for both medium stability and wages
If C# and Unity you get gamedev jobs
>C++
Same as before but way more salaries for old systems. Just like JavaScript these jobs are always available
>Python
As versatile as disposable its devs are. The savings on dev hours will be compensate its terrible performance but thats an users problem

>>106374207
you think it puts you ahead, but it doesn't.
working with complicated problem domains (logistics, cryptographic systems, fault tolerant networks, concurrent system design, database query planning, etc.) is what puts you ahead.
there are plenty of devs that write Python mainly (or some other high level language) that have a far better understanding of low-level mechanisms than you do. they are also better at algorithms than you, thus produce software that is faster than whatever you make in C.

>>106373890
what stopped thousands of other people from building games with c++ then, you dumbass

I like how the topic of learning to code is riddled with so many inferiority complexes within the racist community who never managed to break through or go hung up on which programming language was the best.

>>106374273
still going with the dickhead thing, i see

>>106374273
>you think it puts you ahead, but it doesn't
Yes actually understanding fundamentals does put you ahead of around 90% of professionally employed programmers and around 99% of people who have ever touched python.

i learned how to code in college but i always feel like i have to brush up due to how much shit is changing. mainly SPIR-V for writing low level gpu instructions that run on amd and nvidia equally, although now i'm also dealing with some limitations like mesh shaders. they're so powerful but only the newest hardware supports it and i don't want to alienate people from using my programs, but it would basically be like nanite virtualized geometry with lod clustering, only several orders of magnitude faster. shit sucks.

>>106370516 (OP)
>im learning to code in my late 30s
For what?

>>106374880
making games
keeping my brain healthy, hopefully

>>106374927
Video games make you a dumbass, specially programming them.

>>106370516 (OP)
How do people not know what a variable is? Isn't algebra known by literally every human alive?

>>106375003
>Isn't algebra known by literally every human alive?
there are 1,260,000,000 people in sub-Saharan Africa

>>106375019
*people*

how do i escape my code hole? If you give me code I can understand and follow it. I know all the basic of programming but I can't code anything or call myself a programmer. for example, when I see a fizzbuzz code i know I would never be able to write that but it makes sense

i've been hard stuck like this for a long time not sure what to do.

>>106375003
I honestly never learned Algebra from school. I learned pretty much all math from algebra and beyond on my own time using khan academy. But I'm from a 3rd world shithole (united states).

>>106370516 (OP)
I mean, you only need to know the basic structure of the code. Variables, types, arrays, objects, functions, class, and uhh syntax(thats just language dependent). I think thats about it for basics. Once you get the basics down, you're set to dive into any language

>>106374270
Just stop posting, youve never had a job

Learn to code to make real things not videogames. You have a better shot of becoming rich doing small scale manufacturing with an arduino than the slopa. Godot no less really doing thd special snowflake thing.

>>106375275
friend,
if what you're saying is genuine I'd like to hear it
Manufacturing usually comes with a bunch of nasty requirements for permits and I have no clue how I would even begin to break through the manufacturing industry of whatever I wish to manufacturer not to mention id have to compete with well positioned competition, and work with CAD for designs, hire people maybe, environmental, machining, raw materials, finding customers etc
But if you're giving genuine advice id like to hear more, arduino works with C right?

>>106375307
Arduino works in c++
Behold. A paper clip.
>nasty requirements
Forget about it just make the paper clips.
>hire people
Why

>>106375156
that's a very unusual experience
typically, people can write code much more easily than they can read and understand others' code, or even their own code they haven't worked with for a while
are you neuroatypical in some way? dyslexia? dyscalculia? ADHD?

i'm in my late 30s, too. i used to make simple aol progs in vb6 when i was a kid, albeit i had bas files to help.. i don't remember ANY of it now.

should I teach myself BASIC instead of jumping on the python or javascript lrn2code shit?

>>106375437
>should I teach myself BASIC instead of jumping on the python or javascript lrn2code shit?
what do you mean by BASIC?
VB.NET?
Freebasic?
Gambas?
or actual old-school runs-on-a-homebuilt-8086 BASIC?

>>106375475
nigga did you read my fucking post. i dont fucking know, obviously. i recall some hn post about some dude suggesting that basic was really suited for beginners and makes more sense, despite it being dated. i dont know if thye were talking freebasic, qbasic or what i have no idea i can't code nigga damn

>>106375437
>should I teach myself BASIC instead of jumping on the python or javascript lrn2code shit?
Don't go into any of that before you have your bits and bytes down.

>>106375528
not that dude but just learn python honestly. i've used a lot of languages including basic and cobol, and python is the best if you're trying to learn cuz it lets you solve problems with dynamic typing so the syntax isn't in the way. you can just focus on passing down results. every language has some quirks, and pythons are the least invasive for just solving simple puzzles to learn the principles of the language and also get your brain wired for programming, aka solving problems.

for learning i'd suggest solving the problems in projecteuler and advent of code. from there you can do w/e. use thonny as your ide as well since it has its own python interpreter within, so you don't have to set shit up.

>>106370516 (OP)
remember to round out your academic knowledge as you go too. the difference between a programmer and a guy who actually understands computers is immeasureable. here's a good resource.

https://github.com/ossu/computer-science

>>106375604
As retarded as I come across, I'm actually fairly comfortable with bash scripting and working in the terminal, I still have a virtual machine saved somewhere where I set up vim to be a minimalist python IDE. I should look for it and fire it up.

>>106370516 (OP)
good for you i'm in my 30s i can code but idk how to weld

>>106375652
>weld
Overrated skill. Programming is where it's at.

>>106375667
Welding is bad ass, though.

>>106375640
you should be fine then. just practice solving problems. don't think about the language that much. i started off learning with java and while i didn't like it that much, i got my head around OOP really well because of all the projects i did. I then got exposed to a ton of C because of embedded systems and realtime operating systems, and C++ for graphics programming. i also had to utilize C# and .NET for various projects involving virtual machines, cloud computing and distributed storage. it really boils down to what you plan to do at some point, but if you don't know, i'd say just fuck around with puzzles until something clicks.

>>106370516 (OP)
I learned when I was 30 and got into team red, go for it

>>106375690
How much math do you typically use while coding?

>>106375528
i did read your post
no need to be an asshole
VB.NET is still viable on Windows, but Microsoft has ceased developing the language and is only providing bugfixes at this point; it seems likely they will drop support for it entirely at some point
VB6 is functionally dead
Gambas, ironically, doesn't have great Windows support; fine if you're permanently on Linux, not so great if you're on Windows or want cross-platform utility
Freebasic is pretty cool, but kinda niche and uses an older BASIC dialect
i'm assuming you're not interested in BASIC retrocomputing, not because you said so, but basically because you decided to be an asshole instead of answering my questions (great work, anon)
if you want to develop something that will work for the next ~10 years and you're on Windows, VB.NET should be fine
otherwise, anon's suggestion to consider an alternative like Python is probably a good one
Python's not going away anytime soon

>>106375713
>got into team red
not impressive, every female age 14-45 does that every 28 days

>>106375156
If you can't even rewrite it, then you don't understand shit

>>106375760
I'm sorry, my tender sweet darling. Forgive me.

>>106375735
while coding? almost none. while designing complicated data science algorithms or shit like that? constantly.