Thread 106546577

The main problem with desktop Linux is that it simply has nothing to offer to customers over its competitors.
There is no added value in it, just more trouble for no real benefit.

>>106546577 (OP)
Nerds don't understand the power of good exclusivity.

>>106546577 (OP)
You seem to mistake GNU/Linux as a commercial product that is subject to customers or competition. That is not why it was made or why people like using it, but your deep-fried capitalist mind won't let you understand that.

>>106546683
Life is a competition.
Competition is not a capitalist concept.

The people that keep complaining that Desktop Linux breaks all the time... I dont buy it. 99% of you only use it for browsing. No chance that you would do anything that could break it

>>106546577 (OP)
Shit's exploding on xitter rn
So basically linus tried to use linux
And like when he installed steam shit just stopped working and the computer became unusable lol
Imagine using this half assed shit man

>>106546742
OP clearly used the words "customers" and "competition" in the same sentence, setting an unmistakable context. Pulling one word out and setting it in a different context is manipulation. Either you did that on purpose or you didn't understand the context; both of these conclusions don't look particularly good on you.

>>106546784
Replace "customers" with "users" and OP point still stands.

>>106546766
Automatic update or even just restarting your computer can destroy your desktop Linux installation - it's that unreliable of an OS.

>>106546577 (OP)
try Winux

The benefit is freedom you dumb wageslave goy

>>106547557
What freedom?

the problem with linux is that its defaults are almost always retarded garbage. and turning them not garbage takes stupid amounts of effort for something that should be on by default. ironically linux has good things but they are buried deep.
look at fonts - invariably every distro has DOGSHIT font rendering for some awful reason. But when you dig around with xconfig and xfont server and all that retard garbage you can make them look incredible, it's just blurry mess by default FOR NO REASON.
stuff like that goes a long way for a fresh consumer. same for bootloaders - people DONT WANT TO PICK A BOOTLOADER they dont even know what it is. just make give them on that works and they can pick something they like better later (or never)

>>106546766
>No chance that you would do anything that could break it
You don't need to do anything to break a Linux system except wait.
The average computer is barely updated, and just about the only thing that does receive consistent updates is the web browsers. This simply does not work on Linux, where the expectation is that the average user is only reasonably behind on their updates, and will want to and be capable of updating everything often and at once.
A launch-day Windows 10 system will still run the latest Firefox quite happily. What do you think the experience would be like on an Ubuntu 15.04 system that hasn't seen a single update since it was installed? What sort of a clusterfuck would it result in if the user then finally ran "sudo apt-get upgrade" on it a decade behind schedule?

>>106546742
did you know ant colonies respect each others borders and will even provide auxillary support for defense?

>>106546577 (OP)
>Costumers
Y'all got brainfucked by years of living under a pretend economy where marketing buzzwords replace reality. Personally for me the "added value" is that it just works and isn't trying to fuck me over. Using windows means having to fight window's continuous bullshit. And using mac means you are a toddler and isn't worth discussing.

>>106547845
>>106547106
I don't even think before updating on arch, only do it when i want to install a new program, never once broke on me. Skill issue. Starting to think that all the complaints people commonly have about linux come from disabled retards that don't know how to tie their shoes

>>106546577 (OP)
I don't blame Linux desktop for being shit, I understand it's out of their control and they can't compete with status quo huge companies like Microsoft/Apple/Google dominating the space. I just use Windows for convenience of playing vidya and compatibility with my software and hardware, but am happy to see Linux try to grow and fight back even if I think it's futile. I think some shill linux a bit too hard, while LTT is on the opposite end of being really pessimistic about it, which is lame as fuck.

>>106547096
Nah, it's just brainrot bullshit that is being parroted here 24/7. People just can't free their mind from repeating propaganda for their corporate overlords because thinking for yourself is hard.
The idea of proprietary software is "give us control over everything you do", while free software is "no, I won't let you, at the cost of having to compromise".

Have an example: all kinds of proprietary services constantly ramp up their prices, their software keeps pushing you into subscriptions and shady online-only services and people keep getting fucked left and right every single day. Microsoft is one of the worst offenders but Apple's not far off. Look at Spotify, Netflix etc. If you can't control something, they WILL make it worse and more expensive at the same time.
Pirating Windows and software is a good first step, but on Linux you won't suddenly have all your files disappear to OneDrive because of an "update" or your PC requiring TPM2 for the next OS version.

Proprietary vs. Free software is about being kept on a chain or in a cage, vs. being, well, free to do anything you want. And the most beautiful thing: nobody forces you to use it, so I don't really get why people hate on Linux. You literally *don't have to use it*.

>>106546577 (OP)
This. Every successful platform had a "killer app":
>cp/m: visicalc/wordstar
>dos: lotus 1-2-3 and wordperfect
>mac: photoshop
>windows: ms office
>linux: ...

>>106546577 (OP)
>for no real benefit
if you fail to see full control over your hardware and data as a real benefit, that's your personal problem. Just don't use Linux then?

>>106548463
Hypothetical full control you don't really use for anything in particular except mental masturbation.

>>106546577 (OP)
The value is less trouble, actually. But I guess it depends on which distro we're talking about.

>>106548516
That's some nice projection there, keep going

>>106548372
>mac: photoshop
oh no, it's retarded

>>106548646
One could make a very strong case for Pagemaker too. But I went with the more recognisable name.

>>106547738
you are so captured you don't even know what awaits you on the other side. you are unable to imagine a world where you can make your desktop, keybinds, programs, your fucking computer, do what YOU want your computer to do. all you are capable of understanding is what microshaft wants your computer to do.

>>106546577 (OP)
REDHAT. SYSTEMD, WAYLAND, FREEDESKTOP, DBUS. SRSLY HOW A RANDOM GUY DEVELOPS A GOOD DESKTOP FOR THIS FRAMEWORK STACK? ITS TOO COMPLEX FOR A SIGNLE GUY. THE ABSOLUTE FUCKING STATE

>>106546577 (OP)
linux has no customers :)

Linux has it's problems, but Microsoft reserves the right to take any file from "your" Windows system any time it likes, and Apple scans "your" systems for files it doesn't like. Sure Apple says that's just looking for cheese pizza, but I sure as hell don't trust 'em.
Could something similar be in some Linux distros? Yes, but it's less likely because some autistic s.o.b. is probably actually going to look at the code at some point and spill the beans if something hinky is going on.
Do I have files full of bad-thought things on my system? No, not today -- but this is a timeline where people have been fired for things they put on the internet 20 years prior, so who knows which things that are okay now will get you killed next week?
So yeah, I use Linux, because it's the least worst of a bunch of really bad alternatives. Yeah, a driver gets fucked up sometimes, but there's enough smart people out there using Linux (not that I'm one of them) that someone will figure it out.

>>106546577 (OP)
there's plenty of added value
>no integrated AI spyware
>no integrated telemetry spyware
>not associated with fag or shitskin CEOs
>updates only break shit 10% of the time

>>106548930
>maybe if i say the exact same thing for the quadrillionth time it might work!
TL;DR.

>>106547845
> What sort of a clusterfuck would it result in if the user then finally ran "sudo apt-get upgrade" on it a decade behind schedule?
use case of running updates? worked fine for the preceding decade and now suddenly it's "required"?

>>106548967
you dont understand anon, that local vulnerability that requires direct hardware access is going to result in all your files being uploaded to the russia china darknet.

jay thread

why are there so many of these threads? microsoft panicking as windows 10 eol approaches?

>>106548342
>Linux hate
It's ironically a good thing. After the abuse, it leads people to end user control, like the Copilot fiasco. In other words, it's free real estate.
Granted, if you deal with it all the time it has the annoyance of gnat-like behavior, but it's acceptable.

>>106546577 (OP)
No, the main problem are the delusional Linuxfags who only understand computers on a superficial level, but act smug and annoying towards everyone else.
They don't understand that Windows, as bad as it is these days, is still a better desktop OS than Linux for many reasons.
They don't understand how the adult world of money works.

And then there's the whole industry of grifters (pic related) that feed into those delusions and turn Linux usage into an identity/cult like LGBT.

It's tiresome, but the best you can do is to just ignore them. 90% of Linuxfags grow out of that phase within a year.

>>106548930
I'll be honest with you, you have a very naive view of the linux world. Most of linux ecosystem is developed for corporations. Linux kernel is made by a large US corporation, it's sponsored and contributed to by big-tech like Google, Microsoft who are using it for their services and offerings. And the primary people who are developing and investing into linux like Pipewire, Wayland, GNOME, btrfs, SELinux etc. are from large companies like IBM owned RedHat, SUSE, and to a degree Canonical and smaller companies. The mythical linux chad in his basement who sips on mountain dew and contributes to linux and makes sure it's all community ran doesn't exist, or rather they do but their contributions are making alternative versions of neofetch and putting up dot files of hyprland and niri rices they like. Linux is fully political and managed by corporations in the United States, and if the US decides to start spying on everyone and forcing everyone to be transparent with what they have on their PCs then so will Linux kernel get the same functionality into it, and everyone hosting libre without spyware kernel forks on shit like github (owned by microsoft) or any other place will be terminated in the US. A more sane approach is using what software works for you and voting for politicians that are least likely to add draconian spying measures.

>>106546577 (OP)
freedom from advertising, vendor lock-in, walled gardens, telemetry, globalist propganda, full control over hardware

>>106548342
Cute speech you typed up, but you didn't actually manage to say anything.
Linux has nothing to offer the average user over other available options.

>>106550007
If you're just not going to consider what anyone has to say noone will consider what you have to say. I already stated my reasons here >>106549868, and I'm an average user. This isn't a difficult question to answer and anyone already using it or considering switching isn't going to find what you say compelling. Good day, sir.

>>106549868
If you care about those things you should first and foremost be waging war against smartphones, which are much more locked down and also much more pervasive.
Not to mention the internet as a whole.
Desktop OSs matter too, but they're relatively small fish in the grand scheme of things.

>>106550168
smartphones offer nothing in terms of computing why would i give a fuck about the normie looking glass

>>106550251
Because soon you'll be forced to use an "approved" smartphone just to function normally in the world.
And other people's smartphones are also spying on you.

>>106546577 (OP)
Does linus hang out here?

>>106550124
>>106549868
>freedom from advertising
Nah, I remember Ubuntu sneaking in Amazon ads.
Yet Windows hasn't served me a single ad, since I'm not retarded.
>[freedom from] vendor lock-in
I can install Windows on any modern x86 system regardless if who made it. What are you on?
>[freedom from] walled gardens
???
Unsigned software has never been restricted on Windows.
>[freedom from] telemetry
Once again, not something I need to worry about since I'm not a retard.
>[freedom from] globalist propganda
Same as above.
Unless you mean to imply corporate posturing somehow impacts my experience. In which case I'd point you to some of the more vocal Debian maintainers, as well as the colorful folx pushing for the Linux-wide shift from X to Wayland.
>[freedom from] full control over hardware
Smooth move.

>>106549639
special forces propagandists

Windows is for corporations, Mac is for A/V work. It's incidental that either appeal to average people (the former through legacy market share, the latter through marketing and luxury spending). It's more the fact that there is proprietary software that doesn't support Linux that keeps people on the other operating systems. The other OS environments are actually worse for normal people who want to do normal things on their computer. Well, Apple is okay as long as you exclusively buy their accessories and use their software.

>>106550269
>function normally in the world
i'm good thanks, you can keep doing the suit and tie monkey dance but i checked out half a decade ago.

>>106550283
>Yet Windows hasn't served me a single ad, since I'm not retarded.
these retards dont understand that co-pilot is an ad, the screensaver showing "destination hotspots" is an ad, the search bar connecting to the internet is an ad, the little icon in the search bar by default is an ad, the weather app is an ad, this idiot is so glossed over in the brain that being advertised to is just normal for them.

>>106550340
>unemployed
makes sense, using linux is a full time job in itself

>>106550326
Sit Granny down in front of Mint or Ubuntu vs Windows. There's no way anyone could argue the .exe and driver hell of Windows is going to be easier for Granny to understand. It's only because people are used to it that they believe it's easier. It's objectively more difficult and convoluted.

>No, Granny, you have to right click the icon, and then go down to "Show more options," and THEN...
>Okay Granny, just go to Google and search for "Google Chrome." Yes, you have to use Edge, but that's not what you're going to keep using. No, that's a fake Pakistani sponsored link, you have to keep scrolling down. Okay, once that .exe file is downloaded, now click on it. Okay, now click Next...

>>106550358
>co-pilot
Dont have it.
>screensaver showing "destination hotspots"
Not on my machine.
>search bar connecting to the internet
Mine doesn't, sorry.
>icon in the search bar
Nope.
>weather app
Never got installed.

Sounds like you failed at installing Windows and have been living with a chip on your shoulder ever since.

>>106550376
being employed is not a virtue in the modern day. please tell me how your corporate spreadsheets improve my life whatsoever.

>>106550358
All that shit can be disabled though.

>it shouldn't be there in the first place
Sure, but assuming that companies won't try to make money is just naive.
Communism doesn't work well, actually. People want money to work.

>>106550405
>has to jump through hoops and side step his way past all the default advertising
>this is winning somehow

>>106550408
oh my god it's actually doubling down on being an unemployed social outcast

>>106550420
>windows does all this!
>>No it doesn't. You just did it wrong.
>T-T-THAT'S NOT THE DEFAULT! THAT'S TOO MUCH EFFORT!
So you use all of your OS's default options? That sounds really limiting, and like you maybe don't realize you can change them.
I'm gonna go update my graphics driver, just because I can.

>>106550418
>>106550465
and yet you faggots make the argument that linux takes too much to set up for it to be worthwhile, and that you need to be unemployed to do so. you are all stinky indians working for microshit, it would seem.

>>106550392
A clueless granny shouldn't be installing software and drivers, retard. Using a desktop OS requires a certain level of competence, because it gives you the freedom to run anything. That's by design and it's a good thing. If you don't want that, get a Chromebook or an iPad.

And Windows can be locked down with parental controls or corporate tools, so that your granny can't fuck it up. You'd know this if you weren't a clueless tinkerer.

>>106550524
>you make the argument that linux takes too much to set up for it to be worthwhile
I never said that. I said it doesn't offer the average user anything over the other available options, and I'm right.
Keep trying though.

>>106546577 (OP)
Not needing to tinker to make it usable?
The start menu isn't written in react. It doesn't take several seconds to open the right click menu. It doesn't brick your SSD drives. No AI slop by default. There are no ads, it's free (as in beer). You can fit it to any usecase. Software is installed through a package manager similar to a mobile store.
Microsoft is only successful because it's the only thing normies know. Even that is dwindling as Linux is at the highest desktop market share in it's history.

>>106550696
>Software is installed through a package manager similar to a mobile store.
You say that like it's a good thing.

>>106550731
You can't say "Linux is hard to use" if installing software is as simple as clicking "install"

>>106550754
I never said that and I don't care about pandering to 80IQ normgroids. Clicking an .exe file is easy enough anyway.
App stores are just evil. Software should be acquired directly from the developer. You should not be forced to get it from a middleman.

>>106550800
Then developers should package their software as an appimage. They just don't want to do that for some reason.

>>106550826
>They just don't want to do that for some reason.
I heard that it's just too much work, when you consider compatibility with different distros, updates and so on.

>>106546577 (OP)
>No real benefit
>Controlling your own system is not a benefit
I choose to cut the cord from corporate bullshit as much as possible. If you wish to stay a cuck that's your choice.

>>106550847
As if writing your own installer is easy. Developers are just lazy.

>>106550661
except the ability to configure your desktop how you want, choose your window manager, terminal, shell, de, change themes and icons, view every process and every file on your computer and its source, and basically anything a not-npc would want out of their computer.

>>106546742
>capitalist
Capitalism isn't even an ideology per say. A desire to have capital (money an goods for rainly days) is just common sense. Both the Dutch and Germanic Prussians were 'capitalists' way back when the crusades were still a thing. Even LoLberts dont' 100% agree with one another on fiscal policy all the time despite the schizo tier Ancap meme's that don't usually reflect reality, most of us are just Minarchists actually. Hell even Broz Tito slowly became more 'capitalistic' once he realized going full red was fucking retarded after watching the Romanians and Albanians ruin their homeland in the name of their dogma. Also the idea that America is 'capitalistic' is nonsense, has been in a long time. We're overly protectionist and highly regulatory to the point of giving several large corpo's basically regulatory monopolies since small fry can't compete unless they muster a army of layers, ironically enough actual communist shitholes like Mainland China and Vietnam have become more 'capitalistic' because the red tape that exists in the west to start a businesses doesn't exist there to that extreme of a degree and basically having to kiss the governments ass while degrading has a LOT less friction compared to America were one wrong stroke of a pen when dotting your i's or crossing your t's can basically get you shut down for good and the EPA, USDA, and IRS love nothing more than curb stomping the little guy.

All of this could have been avoided had Boomers and Millennial faggots just voted for Ron Paul way back in 2012.

>>106546577 (OP)
>it simply has nothing to offer to customers over its competitors.
Well I got into Loonix back when Win8 was a thing and that dog shit OS basically made me rage quit Windows entirely. Had Microsoft simply continued giving Win7 security updates rather than forcing it's users to migrate I'd probably still be using Win7 but that's not the case and since I'm already well acquainted to Troonix why bother ever going back?

>>106548372
The actual answer is that there's a bunch of applications all working in orchestra that actually change the game for using a computer, but you can't explain this to chattel slaves with no imagination. The people who get really stuck into a workflow involving i3 or dwm get it because they're living it. Proprietard jayposters are gonna keep calling GNU heckin le bad because you can't point to i3 AND st AND vim AND like sixteen other applications that enrich my life and call that a killer app. And you know what? Good. Your loss, my gain.

>>106550525
>Grandmother maam, please submit the Jira ticket, helpdesk associate will install the softwares for you. No, you do not have permissions to do the installing!

Sounds like a Microsoft mindset to me

>>106550902
>average user
Read, Rajesh.
And don't pretend the most popular visual tweaks aren't just making it look like Windows/Mac.

>>106551125
>please don't lock down your gramma's computer saaar, we need to install teamviewer saaar
You sound like a scammer to me.

>>106548342
Services are so easy to set up these days. There’s no reason for prices to continue to climb for online services. Video streaming, music streaming, books, are all available everywhere from my homelab. It’s not even that difficult anymore using k8s and docker, you could do it in an afternoon.

>/g/ - Technology
>look inside
>it's youtuber gossip

>>106546577 (OP)
Hosting a server without paying for the OS, xir