Thread 18100899

Rai keeps saying the data will be released next year, but he never follows through. Never. In 2020, he said it would be in 2021. With each passing year, suspicion grows that he's stalling or hiding the DNA data. It's no longer a matter of "conspiracy."

These leaks only increase suspicion. They've literally been sitting on this for five years. Rai said in 2020 that the data would be published in 2021. He's just stalling to please the nationalist Indian government, so you change your mind all the time, saying the steppe entered India in 1700 BC or after 1000 BC.

Sorry, but the whole world thinks India is compromised, and this is highly damaging to history in general, as we will apparently never have truly impartial results, and this is not restricted to archaeogenetics, but also to archaeology; excavations are always without any depth and are in communion with Indian narratives.

Its a poopjeet cope

There are a bunch of retard Indians who believe the genetic signature and linguistic family started in North India and spread north. It's on the level of Chinese anthropologists saying China had the first modern humans. High ingroup loyalty in a culture makes their humanities biased to the point of their universities being a circus.

>>18100939
This

>>18100899 (OP)
We really need new samples

>>18100899 (OP)
It appears there has been confirmation about the leaked highly admixed Andronovo sample

>>18101154
Which?

>>18100899 (OP)
There is a clear political bias, and we know what happens when nostalgia and bias are applied to the analysis of any subject that should be abstract and impartial. Pathetic

>>18100899 (OP)
Pakistani archaeologists are just lazy people who don't do their job.

>>18100899 (OP)
Based on actual DNA testing, the wealthy, upper-class post-Harrapan Indians possessed the "pre-invasion" yDNA haplogroups along with the "Aryan" mtDNA haplogroups. Note how the only R1a sample appears to be from a poor peasant or slave, based on his grave kek Therefore, it appears that the Harrapans dominated the Steppeboos
even after the decline of their civilization.
In short, J(2)ocks and E1bulls created the H women and enslaved the poor R1bois.

>>18101342
Hello niraj rai

>>18100899 (OP)
I see this situation with extreme sadness, not only because of the arrogance and hubris of the Indian "researchers," but above all because all this proves how limited we are to one of the most deceitful populations of all... Keeping in mind that they've already tested several samples from the Bronze Age, between the post-Favela Valley periods, and HIDE the results makes me depressed. They could simply destroy this evidence or even the few skeletons we might have. They could even contaminate the samples. Why the hell doesn't the West research this? These are the people handling India's genetic history.
Related photo
I bet we already have or HAD old samples of 1500, but they were never released

>>18101376
That's why someone had to leak a sample from this supposed "study." I followed the story, and one of the guys who was related to one of the people who leaked the sample had to retract and delete the posts about police threats.

The guy could talk to his contacts and leak all these samples anonymously. It's quite easy to do that on Xiiter... but yes, the Indians can contaminate the samples to make the results more appreciable for their narrative. But at this point, we can do contamination tests. And this raises doubts as to whether that leaked sample wasn't actually contaminated. But there's no point in revealing photos; IDs would be more useful.

>>18101212
This sample

>>18101403
Eurocope
Female sample lmao Should be H1 of some sort (mt hap). we know from swat that indian took steppe and bmac women. This is nothing surprising we already knew from narasimhan 2019 paper see>>18101342

>>18101403
Wow 81% Sintashta? There is a lot of steppe ancestry here. I don't think anyone expected that. And I find it interesting that they use sapalli as a proxy, because from an archaeological point of view, the region did in fact suffer from Andronovo influx, at least culturally. And there are those in the region with steppe

>>18101419
Those _o*

>>18101419
Yes, and there are some samples that are incredibly steppe-displaced, such as Gonur and Hajji Firuz BA. Although they cannot be evidence of mass migrants, there was a movement of steppe peoples, perhaps from Yamnaya itself, into what is now northwestern Iran during the Bronze Age. I am aware that Sappali is already known to have been an area with steppe influence.

>>18101438
what are you talking about, weirdo? sappali is 100% not steppe stop lying, what did a female sample do to your brains?

>>18101405
>Female sample lmao
We're all getting the benefit of the doubt, but there's no confirmation whatsoever that it's a female sample, other than conflicting accounts from Indians. Please elaborate.
>we know from swat that indian took steppe and bmac women.
I've already explained in another thread why Swat** should not be used as a steppe metric for India, but to refresh some minds, most Iron Age peoples of the Swat Valley cannot be simply modeled as a mixture of Indus_Periphery and Steppe_MLBA. They appear to have a similar ancestry to Shahr_I_Sokhta_BA1.
Furthermore, qpAdm suggests this. Steppe ancestry was mediated by men. You're misinterpreting the data. Does any peer-reviewed article say it's not patrilineal? No article I've found using the genome project says it's patrilineal.
>This is nothing surprising we already knew from narasimhan 2019 paper see
See above. Swat valley It is not the steppe vector and much less Indo-Aryan,
It is not the steppe vector, much less Indo-Aryan. Elena Kuz'mina's, who has been well cited in several articles, unlike accounts or blogs like Hail Shieva, says that the region underwent an amalgamation of cultures and cannot be reduced to culture A, B, or C based on their funeral rites, but dismissed it abeing Indo-Aryan.
>sappali is 100% not steppe stop lying
bizarre reading level, did you at least correctly interpret what I told you...? It was not mentioned anywhere that these cultures were entirely Indo-European, but you must accept sooner or later Sapalli culture does indeed have steppe influence, there is _o with steppe and as recently they’ve discovered steppe pottery at their burials. but this last one is too much for a "history" forum where people treat everything as some kind of anime battle.

>>18101447
>>18101405
>>18101342
Your replies aren’t getting downvoted on the r/indianhistory thread.

>>18101395
Correct

>>18101403
>12% Uzbekistan
Yes, she wasn't white, but tajik at best. Eurosistere?

>>18101342
>bmac
What actually happened

>>18101477
No. Sappali Culture isn't steppe. It's a Proto-BMAC site, and they are indeed considered the earliest Vedic culture by Russian scholar Nona Avesnova. They were neither pastoralist nor very rural, more like Intermediate, which fits early RV hymns. Furthermore, the word arya is only found in historical Iran and India. And it didn't mean "race" at all, and swat was Indo-Aryan

>>18101805
So you're the same anon who made that shameful thread last week? Great, good to know the kind of problem we're dealing with. Let's try again... I DIDN'T SAY that Sappali was Indo-European. I said that they suffered non-marginal Indo-European influence, and it's proven by _o with steppe. Simple as that. Furthermore, this author you cited is pure garbage, because the hypothesis that Bmac spoke Iranian, or as you postulated in those threads where it would be PIIr, is beautiful, with no archaeological or linguistic support. Bmac was not "proto-vedic." The RV clearly shows pastoralist and nomadic and non-settled elements, which verses are you talking about exactly or is it just something in your head?
>aryan
Can you show me who in this thread even mentioned this word? What reason are you putting words in my mouth for? Intellectual dishonesty or persecution mania?

>>18101806
>beautiful
BS*

>>18101806
The culture isn’t steppe at all. Also the genetic studies don’t find steppe component in Sappali culture. You can't give a damn who you trust or not.
And it doesn't correlate with the Indo-Aryan language if the interaction occurred post-1700 BCE in the Late Bronze Age. And you still deny it. Steppe ancestry in most modern South Asians is male-mediated, unlike the Iron Age samples from the Swat Valley (Vedic era), which was primarily mediated by Aryan women (circa 1200 BCE).

These women had less steppe ancestry on the Y chromosome (~5%) compared to the autosomes, implying that steppe ancestry entered primarily through the maternal route. This is observed in ancient Gandharans and in some modern Dardic/Pahadi groups, such as the Kalash and Chitrali, who descend from them.

>>18101812
It's no longer a question of belief or disbelief. My personal opinions or analyses aren't being taken lightly. You can read it here:http://uzscite.uz/wp-content/uploads/2022/06/67-74.pdf
The article literally says that the influence of the steppes began at the turn of the 3rd to 2nd centuries. Where do you get 1500 BC as the beginning of the influence? What does that have to do with it? And again, we have _o with the steppe. I'm using my cell phone, and I can't use G25 or qpAdm to make a model now....
>swat
Is this the same argument again? I've already answered it over and over again: they're not even Indo-Aryans, and their ancestry was mediated by men. I don't want to talk about it again. Narsimhan's says it’s male mediated for the Indian subcontinent. Gandhara isn’t the main pop for the subcontinent

>>18101825
lol what a liar this sample probably doesn't even exist and you're just pulling your leg, right? You've been refuted, everyone saw it here, this little article proves what I'm saying, bmac was a powerful matrix in all this and you refuse to show this sappali with steppe... because it's a lie, right? And yes, and it seems that none of you have the ability to do this, and that's why you hesitate. R1A? No clade in the Sintashta samples mediated by WOMEN from the steppe with IVC men, was it sex tourism?

>>18101834
>this sample probably doesn't even exist and you're just pulling your leg, right?
ID:17493

>>18101841
>1 outlier
that is irrelevant to any later population....and most likely a misdated sample... LOL you lost, again
The same with this shitty sample>>18101403
Cope and seethe more

>>18100939
Always remind Out of Bharat retards that they have to explain Uralic-Piir contact, they always leave this out and refuse to comment. IF Piir came from India, then so must Uralic. Where in India was Uralic ?

Lol

>>18101842
That's not how things work... you can't simply dismiss these samples out of pure chauvinism.

Obviously, there was an Andronovo incursion, or related incursions, into what is now Bustan sometime in the Middle Bronze Age.

This sample, dated to 1800 BC, is almost 26% Sintashta, according to a model I made some time ago. Try it for yourself. I'll trust them over random trolls on Twitter who disprove the steppe theory of their identity. I'm tired of it... I even posted an article showing archaeological evidence of steppe intrusion in these regions. You CANNOT ignore that.

And this leaked sample makes people like you extremely angry, right?
>>18101845
look at the idiot above, the new argument that is PIIr comes from bmac or some nonsense like that.

>>18101646
Nice try, he would looked like this

>>18101852
First, define who's who... You Kurganoids
have been changing the goals for a long time... like transvestites.
1 in 50 R1a samples from various sites is a suspicious Y3 and again irrelevant to L657 among Indians... Now they're hoping that the Y3-L657 relevant to India will show up in Abashevo, right? Faggot
>>18101854
LOL no would resemble TAJIKS or north indians, not eurozoos

>>18101857
>>18101855
Why do you conveniently reduce the step of the sample which is 80% and add boots which are missing in the photo? How can we take a Punjabi faggot like you seriously if you don't have the ability to be honest for 10 minutes? Damn

>>18101858
Its a simulated, dumb
>>18101852
Next, you must explain without a magical migration how you have so many Dravidian and BMAC loanwords in IE. So those BMAC loanwords are via Steppe females? Swat proves that steppe women were wives of the Iranian Zagronian race, so in IVC

>>18101864
What? Stop changing the goals.
Andronovo moved into bmac and created the Sapalli culture via mixing from around 2000-1500 bce. That's my point. but I'm sure the IVC hasn't been decrypted and whatever the bmac language was it's not reconstructable

Arya/Ariya was an endonym used only by the ancient Indo-Iranians (Persians, Medes, Bactrians). Their descendants today exist mainly in Asia and parts of Russia (Uralians). Europeans have their own rich heritage with distinct endonyms, such as Graikoi/Hellēnes, Goídel, Ænglisc, Slověninŭ, etc

damn, Indians end up with every possible thread and I've seen a lot of these arguments

>>18101894
Fake, again

>>18101957
The cool thing is that this proves the opposite of what was barked by people like the guy above, right? In fact, people with steppe ancestry were having influences within the fevelas bmac mutts this photo represents what happened>>18101753

>>18101403
It’s most likely the central chariot burial at Sinauli, but we’ll have to wait a long time for confirmation. Warlord in late Harappan civilization who was basically fully European this is the last thing the Indian government wants to put out there

>>18102308
Iranians came from Central asia
the steppe people had nothing to do with Europe. So why does it matter. Europe is R1b, India is R1a. We have some continuity with Russia, but none with Europe.

>>18102309
No, they came from Europe.
And how come they have nothing to do with it if they literally formed and migrated from Europe, retard? Half of Europe is R1A. Everything to do with europe, the real aryan land

>>18102315
>aryan
lol no
The R1a found in Eastern Europe diverged from that found among Indo-Iranians around 3800 BC, well before the formation of the CWC. Eastern Europeans descend from the CWC, but not Indo-Iranians.

>>18100899 (OP)
Disgusting people. When the researchers involved summon the courage to publish their findings, we’ll have a clear picture. But this is the level of delusion we’re dealing with so don’t hold your breath

>>18102323
When the discovery comes, all your orgasms will disappear. You are not Aryans. You will find your ancestors in some harem where you were born by consanguinity Keep dreaming of the Aryan orgasm like your ancestors. You, at best, are Malechcha.

>>18102327
>When the discovery comes
We've been waiting for years, first in 2020, then in 2021. When will it come out? It's clearly political and there's confirmation bias, suck it all you want.

>>18102336
Maybe you should know this before you insult others. This juicy paper was submitted for peer review but was rejected due to the sample having too little coverage. Ask your Harvard people, who also contributed to the paper.

>>18102345
No, it's not. The study is garbage because it's political, not scientific. Even if the issue was solely low coverage, the European studies had the same problems. Are the Indians incompetent or something? In fact, the Harvard group literally said they had to change their dynamics and use vague words like "ANI" to please Indian nationalist palates that refuse to use steppe. You can't be so cynical, but when the paper comes out, we'll see. It will be similar to the samples from Bronze Age Uzbekistan. You're no more Aryan than a Mexican is Creole.

>>18102358
What could be lower than something trying to claim credit for something it had nothing to do with. Kek There is zero mention of aryans arriving from anywhere outside in vedas Steppe never created vedas in their own lands. Cope and seeth
I know from good sources that SNP count was way low, less than half of the Rakhigarhi sample.

>>18101825
>>18101825
I'm not Indian and I disagree with pretty much everything the schizophrenic here is spouting, but I think the "IE" concept is saturated by eternal young-minded people, look at this related photo. The guy made a book about how there are actually IE elements in the Hebrew Bible. Like, these days almost everything that comes out about IEs is not academic and is pure garbage.

>>18100899 (OP)
>Aryan invasion myth will be definitively disproven
>The UNNATURAL astroturfing of anti-Indian hate will end
>India will be a superpower
>The West will convert to Hinduism
All coming in two more years.

>>18102545
This is garbage without citation, as you said, it is not academic. So it is irrelevant to the subject, what I posted is archaeological

You just need to know how to filter and research the author's precedents. You certainly wouldn't read a book by someone who appears to be a Twitter user.

>>18102545
the author of this book is that year who spams about cognate Aryans, this is his ilk

>>18102545
the author of this book is that anon who spams about cognate Aryans, this is your guys ilk

>>18102561
>>18102584
Bots broken

>>18102609
Its you

>>18102362
Stop lying around

>>18101805
>Furthermore, the word arya is only found in historical Iran and India.
It will never stop being funny how they continually deny this.

>>18101894
>Arya/Ariya was an endonym used only by the ancient Indo-Iranians
LMAO he can't stop himself. Why can't he just take the L and move on?
Honestly though who cares? So what if your Aryan ancestors had an ethnonym in common with Europeans? It's actually very cool and interesting history. Indo-European migrations are a fascinating story.

>>18102584
Kek, he has you so buck broken all you can do is lie. He won.

>>18102942
He=you?

>>18103021
>paranoia
He won again

>>18103021
You lost