>capitalism is a race to the bottom that will sacrifice all human values and meaning for the increase of quarterly profits
>any mitigating dynamics are systematically attenuated and violently destroyed
>advances in technology increasingly centralize power into an ever shrinking oligarchy
>the threat of artificial intelligence to human life is immense. infinitely scalable agents and datasets mean that whole civilization simulation, and personalized advertising "demiurge" style agenticity is only an inevitability
>integration of cybernetics and Brain Computer Interface threaten to conceptually abolish humanity
>not to mention all the other ancillary issues like climate instability, geopolitical instability, mass migration, loss of literacy, loss of consensus reality, IQ shredders, whatever other nasty side effects you can think of etc etc etc etc

What is to be done? Capitalism is literally destroying humanity

>>24571316 (OP)
this guy really killed himself over this nonsense

>>24571316 (OP)
I could see the brain-computer technology becoming advanced enough that the people with it become something like working class ubermensch, perfect cogs in the machine of capital. And once employers start only selecting those people, the competitive job market will make it so everyone has to get it to remain employed.

>lists strawmen
>blames capitalism
>demands something must be done
Histrionic catastrophising is not an argument. It's just the typical appeal to emotion that characterises a weak premise.

>>24571316 (OP)
Mark Fisher's lectures on YouTube are quite comfy in a weird way.

Realize that the existential horror that grips you reading and writing this will dawn on others. People are going to chimp out. No matter how abstract and complex the system becomes, the primordial truth is eternal.

If the chimping fails or is contained, humanity deserves its fate.

You should give Spinal Catastrophism by Thomas Moynihan a whirl. Similar brain feel.

>>24571316 (OP)
He is right

>>24571342
everything is a race to the bottom and moloch trap under capitalism

>>24571387
I truly hope so anon

>>24571316 (OP)
Everything flows, we must get to the crisis in order to care to solve anything. Live your life. It's interesting stuff but there's nothing to be done really.

>>24571328
I've come to understand why Zweig did it in the last 5 years

>>24571316 (OP)
>What is to be done?
This has been extensively written about over a hundred years ago and one day it will be an inevitability, contradictions of capitalism intensifying will result either in socialism or barbarism

>>24571316 (OP)
Your worldview and reality is a lie. The people in power don’t determine reality. People don’t determine reality. People aren’t god and cannot be god. People are not equal. People are not blank slates, people are not interment good noble savages, people are not perfectible, people are not rational and rationally disconnected from their environment. There is no realm of higher purely rational thought disconnected from emotions and impulses. People and society cannot be improved through social engineering by leftist collage educated experts, managerial bureaucrats, or the state.
Progress is not inherent to reality. Reality is not entirely and fundamentally material. reality is not fundamentally dead but alive and consciousness and responsive and evolving. The divine and spiritual is real. the meak are not more moral than the great. Weakness and tolerance are not virtuous. Everything just is what it is. Reality is inherently mysterious. Self loathing is just as evil as hubris. Your entire worldview is just a rationalization for the ruling class to gain ever increasing amounts of power and turn people into cogs. Your entire worldview is just lying and stealing and parasitism. Your entire worldview is just a way to deny reality and evade responsibility and remain immature and evil and not grow up and be virtuous.

>>24571638
If people are majorly and irrevocably influenced by their environment, why can't the state influence them by changing the environment?

>>24571316 (OP)
Ok, and what are you presently doing about it?

>>24571391
I think he's a nonce personally and I've written several articles as to why

>>24571582
>socialism or barbarism

Which one, historically, has produced the most saints? That is the one that will win. Because in the end the Church always wins.

>>24571643
They're not though, its dialectical. I think Georg Luckacs thought so too.

>>24571652
Amen.

>capitalism is bad even though it reduced poverty to the lowest levels in human history
>the solution is this idiotic idea a couple of pseud philosophers concocted 100 years ago based on flawed assumptions
>i know every time it has been tried it devolved into tyranny, mass starvation and poverty but this time it will work

>>24571655
The thing about capitalism is that it feels like a natural evolution of the way the exchange of goods and services has always worked. It's got buyers and sellers, it's got currency, it's got merchants. Even things like speculative investment wouldn't have been too far-fetched to somebody from ages past. If you took somebody from the Ancient world or the Medieval world, and brought them into the present, the way the economy works wouldn't seem alien to them.

Communism, on the other hand, DOES seem alien, radically so, compared to what most of human history has known. That's honestly the real reason I think it's always destined to lose. It relies on people becoming different than they've always been, but as centuries pass, people don't change. Humans will always be humans.

>>24571316 (OP)
my completely biased and unsourced opinion as a tech worker

>>capitalism is a race to the bottom that will sacrifice all human values and meaning for the increase of quarterly profits
it's not "will". it's already happening, and has been happening for... decades.

>>any mitigating dynamics are systematically attenuated and violently destroyed
same as above

>>advances in technology increasingly centralize power into an ever shrinking oligarchy
well, there are many factions and dynamics of power in capitalism. things could change overnight.

>>the threat of artificial intelligence to human life is immense. infinitely scalable agents and datasets mean
ehh, LLMs are glorified assistants, and are expensive in terms of energy, money and resources. while they are useful, they are also unreliable af. if you trust them, you might get burned, and people ARE getting burned. don't buy the narrative being pushed by tech companies. this shit has happened before and ended up in an economic crisis.
on the other hand, AI has been used for decades. LLMs will survive as shitty glorified chatbots.

>>whole civilization simulation and personalized advertising "demiurge" style agenticity is only an inevitability
I guess this could happen. it's already happening to a degree, but it could get much worse.

>>integration of cybernetics and Brain Computer Interface threaten to conceptually abolish humanity
I'd say this is already happening and capitalists don't even need "cybernetics and Brain Computer Interface". smartphones ARE this. also, as far as I understand, brain implants are fucking hard.

the question here becomes, who controls the contents of what most of us read on the internet, or gives data to companies to push for that content? this has already been answered: a few american and chinese big corpos. one could imagine they were pushed by american glowies.

>Capitalism is literally destroying humanity
here's an idea: those big corpos are directed by a few people. ukrainian war-style drones are very good at what they do...
but then, capitalism won't stop existing. american hegemony will be replaced by china-driven capitalism, and things will be the same in a different way.

>>24571648
link?

>>24571316 (OP)
>Capitalism is literally destroying humanity
Nice, can we extend it to all of life on earth? Would be even better

>>24571820
>Nice, can we extend it to all of life on earth?
Why not just kill yourself? There are some creatures that want to live.

You're a coward I know, I know...

>>24571328
He made the right choice

>>24571638
>All these things arent real
>B-but spirits are real
What?

>>24571316 (OP)
Why doesn't he address the real issues caused by capitalism?
>Feminism
>Mass immigration
>Jewry
>Alienation
>Media
>Schizophrenia
>Nihilism

>>24571652
>>24571654
But the church lost bozo your moralfagging evolved into critical leftism that worships niggers out of pity

>>24572171
that's just one issue ;)

>>24571316 (OP)
Nothing. Capitalism doesn't exist. It will perpetuate through any medium of existence established in an industrial society, and even many pre-industrial ones. The gods will flood the earth should they be merciful.

>>24572184
human history asserts god's mercy doesn't exist either.

>>24572211
Maybe not God's mercy, but divine mercy from the deeper, primal forces sure does. It's just not what you would call merciful in the Christian sense. It's not relief and salvation, but the ever-increasing pressure that busts falsehoods and allows us to fix the mess ourselves.

>>24572241
do you have any examples of that happening or is it that you're waiting for sun to explode? because we might become an intergalactic species before that happens.

>>24572245
Fall of the Roman Empire as the most obvious example, also one that brings up some relevant particulars. We are still extremely sensitive to changes in climate, and we are much more sensitive to trade disruptions as we have to supply and feed massive cities crucial to the existence of the current system. Some political upheavals in one place, combined with a cold spell in another, all leading to more disruptions that snowball very slowly. An economic crisis here or there. Global trade getting threatened. It accumulates, then when everything crumbles it seems sudden, but it is not.
>or is it that you're waiting for sun to explode
What else is there to do? You can't really affect these things on any scale that matters without perpetuating their game. The bottom line is you're competing for resources and it doesn't matter what the resource is because you're forced to endlessly optimize, reducing the human condition to a set of variables and procedures aimed at working those variables. Now, in a more isolated and less populated world it would be possible to ignore this process, at least temporarily, but for it to truly stick you would require a world that is more conscientious and aware of its own motivations, so people don't act like a resource, which cannot happen without a global override. We have seen major local overrides, and we have also seen minor global overrides like at the beginning of the 20th century. However, the world wasn't as global back then.

>>24571316 (OP)
national socialism is the answer. it is why natsoc is conflated with nazism, so that it is discredited.

>>24572305
humanity is opposite of fragile. ice age couldn't kill them and all the technology they had was rocks and sticks. worst a supply chain 'crisis' will cause is your cheap chinese keyboard delivery getting delayed by 2 weeks. you can double down on this and argue nukes will fly out and humanity's fate is hanging by a thread but aside from being wrong that idea goes nowhere.

fall of rome didn't fix anything as far as I'm aware, as humanity continued in a chain of shittier civilizations with more problems and we are in one of them right now. implosions of civilizations in general didn't solve anything.

I personally don't see an existential crisis putting humanities problems to sleep for eternity and I don't believe in political theories. I make a distinction in humans. there are civilizational and moral humans and there are opposites. until the later category is wiped off we shall now no peace. marx or rand leads to nowhere.

>>24572377
Natsoc is repackaged communism. It's exploiting the idea of your inherent social values and bleeding heart experience to let some control freak Mugwump-born egregore ("the State", "the Party") control your every action as its collective schizophrenia grows with its complexity and self-referentiality and eventually collapses under its own hubris in one last act of massive wealth transfer to newborn parasitic oligarchs in a new stage of the dialectics of control and exploitation. In essence, a con. The valuable transmutation of decades of alien suffering for its value to be fed back to the capitalist machine. This is the game God plays.
>>24572305
You do forget there is optimization in resource exploitation but irrationality in the distribution of these resources. The dick controls it all and it is massively stupid.

>>24571655
>reduced poverty
how do these shills still exist? poverty has been on the same level for 50+ years, meanwhile, the gluttony of capitalism has eaten up everything meaningful and turned it into commodity. capitalism preys on our desires and wants us all to be hedonistic addicts. and it's true i think that communism is not a solution, the solution is for all of us to recognize that capitalism is the sin itself, and to become Christ.

>>24572451
it's easy to fix, don't buy shit you don't need retard.

>>24571316 (OP)
Capitalism is but one mechanism of conflict/struggle with generates change. It CAN be slowed down by supressing competition (that is, by supressing the struggle itself).
But I sense that what OP is truly against isn't even capitalism itself, but the degeneration of man, capitalism would be fine if it didn't bring with it the obsolescence of mankind.
There was an ideal that man could retain both its civilized and primordial nature. That capital and technology could exist alongside man without causing its degeneation, without erasing its predatorial strength and vitality. This idea, however, died in 1945.
Rather than clinging to utopian delusions, linear views, the idea of the 'end of history,' or visions of societies without conflict or scarcity, I'd say we should accept the fact that life is eternal struggle and societies with limited resources and natural human inequality are bound to create hierarchies (the natural basis for civilization). That instead of running away from conflict, the mechanism by which all things are born, one should embrace it in all dimensions of life (economic, political, cultural, racial, etc.). To not fight against change, but instead to fight against degeneration itself, to fight for the propagation of higher, superior forms. The quintessential logic of eugenics, but applied to other spheres of human life, until the extirpation of all that is low. That's "what is to be done".

>>24572174
>But the church lost bozo your moralfagging evolved into critical leftism that worships niggers out of pity
That only happened after Gramscians infiltrated the protestant churches. They nearly got into the Catholic ones and the Orthodox were left alone outside physical beatings by the atheist commies.

So in face of the most repulsive, radical evil that humanity has ever faced, one should:

>>24571638
acquiesce, and get lost in idealism and ideology

>>24571655
>the solution is this idiotic idea a couple of pseud philosophers concocted 100 years ago based on flawed assumptions
>i know every time it has been tried it devolved into tyranny, mass starvation and poverty but this time it will work
are you talking about Rand or Hayek here?

>>24571668
the joint stock corporation is completely alien to the human experience, and the need for constant quarterly profits drive for extremely rational and short term thinking. even the Chinese do capitalism better at this point, and that's solely due to them thinking in five year plans rather than quarterly returns

>>24572184
acquiesce with more idealism, only this time in a more nihilistic way

>>24572377
adopt a failed ideology that totally ruined the political and economic stability of the country that adopted it in 12 years

>>24572451
adopt more idealism

>>24572456
destroy all values and become a human insect

none of these are real solutions, and you you all know this

>>24572617
>destroy all values and become a human insect
Did not read what I wrote award

>>24572456
>This idea, however, died in 1945.
Nazis were feeding on the same illness which caused the modern condition. You do not combat the degeneracy of modern civilization by building a modern industrial state and dressing it up in pretty colors.

>>24571316 (OP)
>What is to be done? Capitalism is literally destroying humanity

>>24571652
The only future for the church is dwindling numbers and eventually being regulated to the dustbin of history.

>>24572771
>You do not combat the degeneracy of modern civilization by building a modern industrial state
Neither will you by building a traditional communal society or whatever. So now what?

>>24573025
The church will actually increase in numbers, but it will be composed almost entirely by africans, because that's the sort or people most attracted to the gospel, our most humble, sick, poor, and meek creatures. Hallelujah

>>24572935
>humanity is not getting BTFO'd because abstract number goes up
how does this type of guy still exist?

>>24572935
>number go up means life equals more gooder
>t. sub-80 IQ

>>24572456
>>24572736
>hierarchy is Le Natural
>scarcity is Le Inevitable and not manufactured
>eugenics is Le Logical
half of what you wrote is objectively wrong, the other half is plainly retarded.
eugenics always sounds like a great idea when you're stupid enough to think you'd be spared.

>>24572174
Absolutely deranged post

>>24573025
You keep saying that, commie. It doesn't make it anymore true

>>24573214
>being against the church is commie shit
>t. has not studied the textual, canonical teachings of Christ Jesus

>>24573204
Hierarchy is literally the result of scarcity and arose thousands of years ago. Do you think the sumerians were "manufacturing scarcity"?
If there was no scarcity (that is, if resources were infinite), then human natural differences wouldn't matter, everyone could get the same shit regardless if they were geniuses or retards, resources are infinite, after all.
If people were naturally equal, then equality would be possible with scarce resources, since everyone is equal, you could just give everyone an equal share of the limited resources available.
Since literally neither of these conditions are true. Hierarchy becomes necessary and naturally arose with civilization. You utter retard.
I also don't give a fuck about being spared by eugenics or not. In a thousand generations of eugenics everyone of us would be considered dysgenic.

>>24571316 (OP)
>Capitalism is literally destroying humanity
capitalism or Judaism

>>24573258
what we understand as "Modern Humans" go back approximately 100k years. we didn't develop writing until 6k years ago or so, and the earliest pieces of writing we have are records of transactions. commerce is born of scarcity, but that doesn't mean the scarcity wasn't manmade.
the only reason you would sell a resource to someone else is if you have a surplus above what you yourself need. it logically follows that scarcity is downstream of hoarding surplus resources.

it's not that resources are ininite, it's that we have Enough but have to keep pretending we don't by allowing a select few to hoard more than they need by several orders of magnitude, with the sole purpose of withholding those resources from people that need them for exploitative purposes.

>>24571316 (OP)
>>24571328
"The pandemic of mental anguish that afflicts our time cannot be properly understood, or healed, if viewed as a private problem suffered by damaged individuals."

>>24573258
>if there was no scarcity, ...
>if A then B
>if people were naturally equal, ...
>if C then D
>since not A and not C, therefore not B and not D
this is logically invalid by the way. it's called Denying the Antecedent.
Congratulations you're retarded.

>>24572935
How the fuck do you accurately calculate GDP and purchasing power for the year 1 AD? And then convert it into 1990 USD?

>>24571316 (OP)
>Capitalism is literally destroying humanity
The other alternatives you bring to the table isnt exactly much better i would say even worse you subhuman monkey.

>>24573349
>gommunism killed a hundred gorillion
on the low end capitalism directly leads to almost 20 million deaths per year, by starvation, lack of access to clean water, and curable illness.
we have the resources, it's just not Profitable to deliver them to those that need them.

>>24573373
>capitalism directly leads to almost 20 million deaths per year
Yeah im sure buddy. BTW cigarettes are legal in commie shitholes aswell.

>>24573238
Christianity is against both capitalism and communism. Not the "gotcha" you think it is.

>>24573414
descriptions of God's Kingdom are suspiciously similar to the utopia described in communist theory. but sure man, anything is possible when you just make shit up.

>>24573414
Then why does it always lose to both? Not much of against anything if that never turns out in practice.

>>24573349
>look, democracy is evil and doomed to fail! just look at the results of the french revolution! yeah, feudalism has a few flaws but it's the best system we've got

democracy needs to be shot in the back of the head by a new caesar and his regiment and every last plutocrat and unethical scientist shot with it to stop the unrelenting anti-human advance of technology and trans/post-humanism.

>>24573439
>France today is currently ruled by a manlet banker dictator.
You sure showed me schlomo.

>>24573723
humanity will be dragged into the future void and experimentation will be our god. The only party that is anti democracy is pro AI and tech bro too, so you’re double fucked.

>>24571316 (OP)
>What is to be done
Fortunately there's another book for that

>>24573745
Based anti-capitalist readtionary

>>24571582
It must be true then.
This time next year, comrades ...

>>24572451
Retard. In the past few decades alone, capitalism has lifted a billion Chinese out of agrarian poverty.

>>24574007
>capitalism has lifted a billion Chinese
They would tell you its socialism.

>>24574007
why do you care about poverty in China? are you a globalist shill or a chink?

>>24574029
What a weird thing to say

>>24573145
We were thinking the same about you.

>>24573373
>capitalism directly leads to almost 20 million deaths per year
Source: your ass.

>>24574024
Chinese growth has been driven by manufacturing and tech companies. They are not state-owned.

>>24574029
No need to get mad. I was merely refuting a dumb assertion by a retard.

>>24573349
sending social democrats to mental health institutes is kind of funny though

>>24571316 (OP)
is this book actually worth reading or is it a meme

>>24574052
Every single company in China is in partnership with the government. The state and government are fused economically.

>>24574187
it's 80 pages long you fucking pussy

>>24571316 (OP)
this is linear projection in a non-linear world.
like when they'd make movies about the future in the past where the Soviet Union was still around.
it's a bunch of causal fields of partial differential equations interacting with each other (absurd to a limited retard, but decipherable to a sufficient wisdom).

>>24574007
>A billion Chinese out of agrarian poverty
Two issues with this. The first is that most of China is still in agrarian poverty, the second is that this is not good for the actual people on the planet. You're talking about how we're going backwards and espousing that to be a good thing. Call us when someone has figured out how to wipe China off the face of the Earth and we'll all cheer properly.

>>24574244
>most of China is still in agrarian poverty
No it isn't.
>second is that this is not good for the actual people on the planet
Yes it is.

Wrong on both counts.

>>24574052
Chinese company law allows the establishment of party organizations in any company. They're really not independent of the government. That's why Ma Yun got owned so hard.

>>24574195
Yeah modern china is basically fascist

>>24574320
Fascists were trying to be socialist, so...

>>24574327
Not really, at least if you mean "socialism" in the leninist sense

The extent to which GDP is actually important and is our best measurement of "a civilizations power over its environment". Should not be discounted. And an extension of this is that GDP growth rate is an important metric which should be optimized whenver possible. Because when you compound a high GDP growth rate over time it means the civilization is becoming more and more robust.

Retarded faggots like Mark Fisher lack this very basic understanding of our position within a hostile universe.

>>24574358
Economists literally believe this btw

>>24574363
Only the smart ones

>>24574367
The influential* ones, which explains the current state of the world

>>24574320
>socialism with chinese characteristics
>socialism with national characteristics
>national socialism

lol they heavily imply they are fascist themselves. Its really sad how most people don't understand that fascism is the meta and the greatest way to organize society yet discovered.

>>24574358
Mississippi has a significantly higher GDP per capita than Japan.

Which would you rather live in?

>>24571316 (OP)
>capitalism is a race
I'm le capitalist race

>>24574391
Mississippi, because I don't know japanese idiot

>>24574344
Obviously not. Socialism is too broad and older than Lenin. Why would you say something so stupid?

>>24574409
>Socialism is too broad and older
Name one industrialized socialist country that lasted 50+ years that wasn't marxist-leninist.
>Why would you say something so stupid?
Because I'm interested in actually existing socialist countries, not your daydreams of an anarchist utopia

>>24571316 (OP)
Pic related perfectly foreshadowed late modernity. The Holy Orthodoxy pill could have saved Mark. Suffering cannot be avoided; it must be transfigured in Christ. It's like Solovyov says, history is the proving ground where dross is burned away by the refiner's fire and truth is purified in suffering. The race of man is to become like the Blessed Virgin, giving birth to the immanent, mystical body of Christ, the Church Militant, in thought, word, and deed.

>>24574391
I literally said "a civilizations power over its environment". The universe does not care about your happiness.

>>24574436
How does oil prices increasing by 5% affect your "power over the environment"?

>>24574358
Absolutely degenerate.

>>24571316 (OP)
I hope Jesus comes back. Call me a coward but I don’t want to be a part of the post human future we are headed towards. Maybe it’s foolish to think we could have gone a different way, but what is so wrong with human beings that we want to abolish our selves.

>>24574438
A lot actually. Higher oil price means there is less supply of oil which is like actually super fucking directly tied to the amount of energy the civilization has in order to affect change. Jesus christ do leftoids not ever spend like a couple hours contemplating how the world works in their entire lives

>>24572451
You are just spewing an opinion that is proved wrong by almost, if not all, measurable metric.
You don't even know what a commodity is.
>>24574007
Even if you take china out you still see the same trend on poverty reduction.
>>24574279
They are ran independently of the government as long as they don't do anything against the party. Commies like to think the Chinese way works because of government control but it only works because the government is not involved in the day to day. Put Xi's portrait up your office and the ccp will let you get away with slavery.

>>24574522
Awesome, then OPEC limiting oil production gives places like saudi arabia more "power to affect the environment". I honestly respect your schtick, I'm going to start manipulating the economy to improve gdp, and by extension, civilization

>>24574669
yes you absolute mouth breathing retard. A country like saudi arabia gains more power when oil price is higher.

>>24574740
Okay, then do you understand why increasing the gdp for an individual country as much as possible can be detrimental? Especially when considering "negative externalities"?

>>24573325
>How the fuck do you accurately calculate GDP and purchasing power for the year 1 AD?
>Purchasing power
Holy shit
Human economic activity before the end of the 18th century was tied to what a person could do in a year with their hands, its actually very easy to calculate
For all of human history before industry and machines global GDP per capita was somewhere between $150 and $200 in todays dollars
Global human wealth in 1 AD compared to today was essentially $0

>>24574795
These is an S curve regarding inequality, where at a certain point, more inequality actually decreases economic output. Countries like the USA are way past that point. When you compare them with somewhere like Norway, Norway wins on GDP per capita.

>>24571316 (OP)
It truly is over, there is no viable alternative, except for a nuclear war perhaps

>>24571316 (OP)
Communists have an apocalyptic view of history. They insist the world will and is getting worse year after year. The world will reach rock bottom and only then will things get better. Communists have an apocalyptic view of history just like rabbinic jews and Christians do. Thats because all three were discovered by jews. The only difference is communists insist things will get better by the will of man alone. This is wrong! This is the doctrine of antichrist and will lead to ruin in the end.

The only thing that can be done for this hopeless doctrine is to convert to Christianity or convert to judaism and discover they are much like the communists themselves, they dont dont believe God is going to do the work through his Son.

>>24574842
>where at a certain point, more inequality actually decreases economic output.
This is nonsense
You have no idea what you are talking about
College freshmen are taught that correlation does not equal causation

Capitalism isn't inherently or definitionally Godless. Marxism is though. How do we know the Marxist intelectual class isn't driving this centralization of capital and all the commodity fetishism through their propagandistic media? Can the author of this book or a fag like OP develop a pure analysis of capital in a post-Marcuse in the CIA world? Invariably, if I were to try and example positive world events that were derived from what was ultimately capital interest, the obese skin tag neck beard Marxist on the other side of the iPhone will just claim all those good things are actually bad things, because to a Kabbalist-I mean, Marxist, only Marxism is good, and Marxism is good, because in the nihilation of their individuality through transition to communist consciousness, the Marxist can finally, at long last, escape all acountability, and lose their phobia of mirrors or non-angle shot photos.

Tl;dr oh boy, another Marx thread.

>>24574962
>Tl;dr oh boy, another Marx thread.
u mad bro?

>>24574967

I'm fairly confident that what determines the side a given anon picks in this debate has a lot more to do with social/financial status than reasoned thought. Take me for example, rich property owner currently getting head from your mom while your kid sister tongues my anus and the OP watches from the closet. I think Marx is stupid. Is it because I'm bourgeoisie conscious? You'll say so, but I'll say you say because you're jealous. Which is fucking weird anon, this is your mom and kid sister here.

>>24574962
Based
>>24574967
>u mad bro?

>>24574391
I don't like japs

>Capitalism is whatever the writer needs it to be,

why the fuck are there so many annoying Christian commenters on /lit/? I haven't been on this board for a bit, its noticeably degraded since

>>24574962
Total B.S. There is no connection between Marxism and Kabbalah or Hermeticism.

>>24575053
Religion is some powerful shit. Imagine if they were as critical of the Bible as they are of Marxism. I guess Jesus telling them to get rid of their possessions and to follow him wasn’t enough. I think though the skichtzo types who land here must be kicked out of other spaces and so they land here.

>>24575074
>get rid of their possessions and to follow him
What if following Jesus also means getting a job?

>>24575053
Tradcath and christian larpers; /pol/ infested all of 4chan since a while ago.

>>24575074
The difference is that no one is seriously proposing that we use the Bible as a blueprint for replacing our current economic system, which has been working perfectly fine for the past couple of centuries and has raised untold millions of people around the world out of poverty. To want to replace capitalism with communism is to deny reality on a level that far exceeds any religious person's illusions or delusions because theirs are based in faith, you on the other hand have historical, scientific evidence that communism doesn't work.

>>24575075
Didn’t he say he was coming back soon?

>>24575074
It also was the foundation of culture for many years. Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater. You won't like what comes out.

>>24575086
Most criticism of capitalism doesn’t suggest a complete replacement with some version of communism. Most critique is about a better balance between public needs and those of the corporate overlords.

Also if your measure of success is lifting people out of poverty then you would judge Lenin and Stalin and modern China as success cases as well neither of which succeeded because of capitalism.

>>24575090
Which verse you mean?
Also, John 21:22.

>>24575105
It’s written multiple times in the Book of Revelation.

>>24575099
What are you talking about? China was able to create a big middle class exactly BECAUSE they started adopting capitalist free market principles and moved away from communism when it comes to how they approach their economy.

>>24575111
God’s sovereignty encompasses past, present, and future, so it is not a contradiction when centuries pass; it is the believer’s reminder to remain steadfast and prayerful. Consider also the context of Revelation. Terrible things are happening to believers in it BUT they happen briefly and Jesus returns imminently within that timeframe.

give me literally one fucking metric you could use to show any logical merit to the claim "capitalism is destroying humanity"

since capitalism has been implemented globally, the human population has done nothing but grow, our wellbeing has done nothing but increase, and our technology has done nothing but advance

what fucking counterfactual can you provide here where we would be better off?

something else that's hilariously ironic is that these types who espouse these staunchly anti-capitalist views tend to also be anti-natalists

>capitalism is destroying humanity

why do you care? you want us all to die out anyway

>>24575126

>>24575146
>capitalism is bad because it creates such abundance that people with no impulse control can get fat

That's kind of a compliment for capitalism if you ask me.

>>24575146
microplastics are destroying humanity

there will be none of us left in 10 years because of microplastics

lord help us

>>24575152
>Entire teams of food scientists work to make food as addictive as humanly possible to improve quarterly earnings
That's kind of a negative of capitalism if you ask me. You also ignored the microplastics bit

>>24575157
Sure, but having to exert the tiniest bit of self control to exercise and not get addicted to processed foods stil easily beats bread lines and dying of starvation. In my opinion of course. The micro plastics thing has nothing really to do with capitalism and is just a problem of industrialization as a whole. Isn't one of the biggest worldwide exporters of plastic products China?

>>24575164
>beats bread lines and dying of starvation
Is that the only alternative? Additionally, do you think capitalism didn't cause those things when it was in the earliest stages of industrialization?
>a problem of industrialization as a whole
The issue is that capitalism directly incentivizes increasing consumption and externalizing costs. The soviet's also polluted heavily as well though so I guess it depends on whether there's political will to stop poisoning people
>Isn't one of the biggest worldwide exporters of plastic products China
Yes, which has been capitalist since deng took power

>>24574902
It's actually a well documented phenomenon. The reason is that when there is a more equitable distribution of incomes, the lower end spend their increased incomes locally, fueling the economy. Wealthy people, when given additional wealth, are much more likely to invest it globally, meaning that wealth leaves the community or country. Try actually thinking about a subject before having a knee jerk defensive conniption next time.

>>24573349

Humanity deserves the evil that is capitalism because humanity itself is evil.

>>24575222
Lmao

told you >>24575131

communists try not to be anti-human, death worshipping freaks for 5 minutes challenge (impossible)

>>24575233
Of course choosing to be an idiot regarding this is in itself a form of evil. Just a lower level kind of evil. Kind of like a mangled grotesque 4 ft hunched goblin slave, tortured daily in an eternal masochistic relationship with satan

>>24575242
You talk like a world of warcraft character.

>>24574542
my point was that it's dumb to hide behind poverty metrics to avoid critiquing capitalism's effect on human desires

>>24575237
>death worshipping
My brother in Christ (you) deliberately made perpetual low-intensity warfare a permanent fixture of civilization.

>>24575523
yes I personally did that

it was all me

my bad guys

>>24575126
every one of us is fucking addicted and can't stop using social media because we want to always discover the unknown, that is how our mind works. the logic of capitalism is to satisfy our desires, but it has got to the point where it works against our long term future. and we know that we're addicted (well sadly, most of us don't), but can't stop.
and again, i'm not a commie.
Jesus Christ was right

>>24575529
>every one of us is fucking addicted and can't stop using social media because we want to always discover the unknown

and precisely how is this destroying humanity?

how many deaths does social media addiction cause every year?

>>24575126
>our wellbeing has done nothing but increase
Top goy

>>24575534
never thought I'd see the day where someone is insulted on 4chan for NOT being jewish

>>24575131
birth rates are falling in capitalist countries around the world, if you haven't noticed. why reproduce when you can read smut YA or goon to Sabrina Carpenter?
i'm not even against capitalism, because there haven't been a better economic system around, but we'll destroy ourselves if we don't adopt restraint, like how Jesus Christ taught us

>>24575126
>the human population has done nothing but grow
Overpopulation is how a ton of species drive themselves into extinction.

>our wellbeing has done nothing but increase
Excessive consumption never was, is not, and will never be a measure of well-being, regardless of the context.
Also
>our
There are more people starving right now than at any point in prior human history. You sample 9 deformed niggers and one guy who weights a about a ton to proclaim "on average this group has healthy weight". That's fraud, simple as.

>our technology has done nothing but advance
Cause and effect. Capitalism is the outcome of rapid technological advancement, not the cause, and it will never be - the only things that private capital has ever willingly invented are advertisement and various forms of wagie cage.

We can also throw two world wars, permanent low-intensity conflicts, permanent threat of nuclear warfare, dwindling natural resources, and fucked up ecology into the mix.

>>24575531
we're not reproducing in western countries, for instance

>midwits regurgitating talking points pretending to be involved in intellectual discussion
Capitalism is not a thing. It’s an arbitrary label for the current system of power relations in society. Power is who controls wealth. Everything anyone does at a societal level is for the sake of wealth, therefore, those who control wealth have power, and the more wealth the more power. “Capitalism” was invented by middle management to label the top management as an enemy to focus the peasant masses on in their effort to seize power for themselves. To match the Capitalist villains, the Communist (or derivative ie worker) label was applied to the peasants as the counter-acting protagonists. The middle-management who organize the peasants in this effort are the “vanguard” “people’s party” etc. It has to be middle-management because the peasants themselves don’t have the wealth (or IQ) to organize themselves. This is the same system that has been behind revolutions since the beginning of large-scale human civilization. What do you think the Industrial Revolution was, for example? It’s only been a handful of decades since the fall of the USSR so we’re still being effected by the Communist style but this will change as time goes on and middle-management figure out new propaganda paradigms to organize the peasants in their bid to take power. Or maybe there’s so much wealth today that power has become so enormously diffuse that it’s no longer possible for middle-management to take everything.

Anyway, this has been my high-IQ explanation. I realize it was a waste of time because it wont enlighten anyone here but it made me feel good typing it out so here it is anyway.

>>24575550
>Overpopulation is how a ton of species drive themselves into extinction

good thing we aren't overpopulated

>There are more people starving right now than at any point in prior human history

What the fuck are you on about retard? That is objectively false. There are more people undernourished globally than ever before, because the human population is very large and not everyone can meet a perfect nutritional standard. But starving? You're either lying or dangerously stupid.

I'm not gonna address the last two points you made because they are entirely moot. You're saying in one breath we can't attribute technological advancements to capitalism, but then immediately after you imply both world wars, dwindling resources, and nuclear threats are all due to capitalism.

You should think before you speak (or type), it's a good habit.

>>24571316 (OP)
I don't get why people worship this guy like he's the second coming of Christ.

>>24575579
>You're saying in one breath we can't attribute technological advancements to capitalism, but then immediately after you imply both world wars, dwindling resources, and nuclear threats are all due to capitalism.
Technological advancement only provides machine guns and nukes. Capitalism provides reasons for using them.

still works better than the alternative

>>24575573
Anon that's just Marxist analysis but more gay.

>>24575599
>today I learned that communist governments never used machine guns

>>24575611
Commieislamostan dicturdership shitholes are a pure reaction to Capitalism. That's why they keep spawning no matter how many times US levels them. There will only be more and more of them, and they will have easier and easier time obtaining nukes, because you are producing them like a coal power plant produces smog.

>>24575599
Both Russia and Germany were socialist nations during WW2.

>>24575616

>>24575625
How were the goalposts moved?

>>24575054

Marxism is Kabbalism with all the religious language swapped out for "technical" terms. Marx himself was the offspring of a 100 year lineague of Rabbis. It wouldn't surprise me if he was purposively "summoned" within the frame of their institution. Communist consciousness and returning humanity to Ein Sof are the same goal.

>>24571316 (OP)
>What is to be done? Capitalism is literally destroying humanity
Regulate capitalism through state-intervention. Unironically the chinese model but without the retarded elements.

>>24571655
>>24571668
>>24572179
>>24575573
It's genuinely amazing that people don't understand that capitalism isn't simply trade between private individuals.

>capitalism is a system where the economy is oriented towards the benefit of private individuals.
You can have market characteristics like supply and demand with a control of the state and general directions (socialism, you can have market characteristics with a upper aristocratic class who's role is to defend their territories (feudalism), you can have market characteristics with a religious model which bans certain goods (theocracy), you can have market characteristics but with limits as to how much capital can have and their respective share of the means of production (distributivism) etc

I'd even go at length and say that to define a system, rather than searching for its core, we should instead observe its instantiation in the real world. Capitalism in that sense deploys itself as an ethical system valuing the merit of the individual, interpreting reality through the eyes of a rational and educated individual, letting individuals benefit from the economy who's domain should be reserved entirely to them. This idea of course has problems because the interests of individuals often comes in conflict with the state, the nation, religion etc. And the very obvious answer is to realize that we are not doomed to be subject to the economic whims of certain individuals but that we instead have tools to control the economy.

>>24575694
>Marxism is Kabbalism
But anon how would you know? You never read any Marxist works whatsoever.

>>24575596
Most people don't read a lot of "theory" (as normal people do) and don't have this mental apparatus with which they can operate concepts and ideas concerning ideology, because the apparatus is built through seeing a lot of things, and "theory" introduces a lot of fundamental things in that apparatus like alienation, myth or the other or some other shit. Fisher is both a really nice introduction to actual leftist thought and a good cultural researcher that stood on his own legs. Capitalist Realism became a popular thing among Disco Elysium fans for a reason, sorta. It's short enough to be digested in one sitting, introduces a lot of pop media things as examples so you don't have to interact with the people Fisher was inspired by like Lacan or Jameson, and is just written well: he gets the point across concisely and easily. For most people, it's enough to understand the things they are haunted by, so they may just stop at Fisher.
However, you DO NOT stop at Fisher if you want some actual leftist treatise. He is first and foremost a culture researcher who happens to come to the leftist perspective on things. His works on hauntology among with The Weird and the Eerie are legitimately great and interesting to consider. I've been reading a 380 page long series of lectures on the "hauntological perspective" in modern art by a member of the Russian Academy of Arts (really interesting stuff on how people process lost futures) and I could say that he had already left a mark on academia, at least. It's just that it's "cultural researchers Fisher and Reynolds" and not "leftist thinkers Fisher and, IDK, another Gen X British leftist who's not a YouTuber".

>>24573288
good catch anon

>>24573258
>If people were naturally equal, then equality would be possible with scarce resources, since everyone is equal, you could just give everyone an equal share of the limited resources available.
Anon Marxism doesn't even care about enforcing le equality. Marx was racist af, and never saw any issue with geniuses dunking on retards. The problem is with economic inequality and economic hierarchy. And even that problem is not that they are le bad, or allow dysgenic retards to dominate society of better through hoarded wealth, define merit as luck and skill in con-artistry, or force the vast majority of human population into an artificial equality of poverty where vastly different people are given the equivalent wageslave status.

The problem is that this hierarchy persists by repeatedly shooting itself in the dick. That's the big issue - we are incapable of figuring out a (desirable) way out of Capitalism, and we are incapable of figuring out (any) way of sustainably prolonging Capitalism. The last part is the crux of Marx's critique of political economy - not "Capitalism le bad", but "Capitalism le cannot function without fucking itself up". Notice how all the Capitalist cope always comes down to "it's the only thing that works the alternatives are worse", but perpetually ignores every issue of maintaining Capitalism indefinitely - that's becaue every possible measure is inherently anti-Capitalist, it cannot be divorced from it's self-sabotaging nature, and the only remaining cope is "too big to fail".

The only remaining outcome is that Capitalism will inevitably fuck itself to death in a way that is extremely unpleasant and undesirable for everyone, like a nuclear war or Islamic sandnigger revolution or fossil fuel crisis collapse. That's what Capitalist Realism is - the trolley is coming, the lever doesn't work, and we are standing on the rails.

>>24573107
>The church will actually increase in numbers, but it will be composed almost entirely by africans
Correct, but this Church will also be unrecognizable as Christian to any modern Christian.

>>24571812
>it's not "will". it's already happening
ESL.

>>24575920
>Capitalism will inevitably fuck itself to death in a way that is extremely unpleasant and undesirable for everyone, like a nuclear war or Islamic sandnigger revolution or fossil fuel crisis collapse
The best part is that the standards of living will inevitably drop like holy fuck, and some niggers will inevitably nostalgiawank to the halcyon days of bygone Amazon Era.

They will be the monarchyboos of tomorrow, and Warren Buffett and Jim Walton will be their enlightened kings, who would bring about the perpetual Golden Age of civilization if not for all the evil and stupid motherfuckers who fucked up everything for everyone. Oh the humanity.

>>24575209
Again, you have no idea what you are talking about
You just told on yourself by, I think, posting a picture of the cover of a Thomas Piketty book as evidence of you being right
Piketty's conclusion are highly debatable and in my opinion, as someone with an actual professional background in economics, highly doubtful
His conclusions about inequality are based on a theory of the rate of return on capital which are highly debatable to say the last, back to your original reply to me
>These is an S curve regarding inequality, where at a certain point, more inequality actually decreases economic output.
This is unproven nonsense, try again
>Norway wins on GDP per capita.
>B-B-But Norway Wins!!!
This isn't how economics works at all
The United States is obscenely more rich than Norway, has most of the most prestigious universities on Earth, produces the most millionaires and billionaires, medical innovation, I could go on
Youre a socialist, so the whole game is just goalpost moving, when people point out that the United States economy, a country of 330 million, mind you, dwarfs the economies of nation states with pops of 1.4 billion, or a group of countries like the EU with a population more than double ours, you change the metric to GDP per capita while ignoring GDP and other measures of national wealth like GNP, where the United States is clearly out in front, or, you claim that GDP is misleading and you have to measure GDP per head to, as you said, "win", or you use another metric that you do not understand, like PPP, to equate a way to measure the buying power of countries while controlling for exchange rates, with the overall size of their economies, which are two different fucking things, XD
Again, I understand that this is something you believe
>more inequality actually decreases economic output.
This is unproven nonsense
Look at the list
Do you see Norway?
Get better at the game
>B-B-B-But one economist said
Uh-huh, do you think that makes it true?

>>24575209
Also,
>The S curve!!
I think you are referring to the Kuznets curve, which is theoretical and does not hold true in reality based on historical evidence
Probably a troubling spot for a socialist, I understand, but still, tough shit

>>24575978
woah, your very smart

>>24575731

You're such a gay nigger. You're such a clown faggot incel. How tf would YOU know? You've never read anything at all. The totality of your education now is google AI and other losers like you on reddit. You wouldn't know Grundrisse from Sur Judenfrage, out here running your suck. Everytime your mother gives me head, I fart right into her face, as punishment for allowing a nerd like you to have access to the internet. I just want you to know, no matter how passionately you worship him, Marx will never keep you from being a loser. There is no outcome ever in your miserable, material life, where you get to see the advent of your communist state, and the reason why is because everyone that thinks (and looks, you 40+ BMI mold-in-his-rolls bitch) like you, is a weakling. Weak in every sense. Now if there's only material, and there's no way your revolution will occur in your lifetime... why fight for it? That's why you won't, that's why you don't, that's why Marxism is only ever, has only ever been, a religion.

this must be the most intellectual thread I've seen in a while. really, the best arguments I've ever read.

>>24575991
Big line go up

>>24576051
>How tf would YOU know?
You Just Know.

So about the Kabbalism thing...

>>24575991
Piketty's "Capital" is a rigorously researched, data-driven analysis backed by years of empirical work across dozens of countries. I reference it as presenting a legitimate case for my claim which you merely dismissed as "nonsense", even though you clearly don't even understand the mechanics at play, let alone are able to make an argument as to why these shifting drivers of the economy either aren't shifting or won't have the effect I outline.

The claim that higher inequality can lead to lower economic output isn’t unique to Piketty. It’s supported by studies from institutions like the IMF and OECD, which have found that extreme inequality can reduce social mobility, undermine demand, erode trust in institutions, and distort investment decisions. In other words, when wealth is concentrated in fewer hands, aggregate demand suffers because the rich tend to save more and consume less relative to their income. You seem unable to actually address this issue, you just bluster and obfuscate. Sad.

Also, as the USA has become more unequal in wealth distribution, their wealth advantage has been slowly slipping away. The major economic advantage that helped establish the USA as a global economic powerhouse was a healthy middle class! Without that, the prestige of the USA has been declining, as has their position as dominant global economic power. Of course, you've demonstrated a total inability to comprehend these issues though, so you will just regurgitate some vacuous line you've learned to parrot without actually understanding any of the forces driving these economic changes.

As I said, I'll expect another knee jerk defensive hysterical outburst from you.

>>24576051
For whatever reason I also have a tough time believing you've read marx or jewish mystical literature
0JANA

>>24576336
>It’s supported by studies from institutions like the IMF and OECD
Which obviously makes them Bolshevik Communists.

>>24571316 (OP)
nigga, i don't give a fuck about this pansy shit. im grilling rn.

>>24576465
Horseshoe theory

>>24571316 (OP)
we haven't even gotten true AI but effectively the paperclip maximizer scenario is here, it just runs on a combination of human minds and computers

>>24576522
how else would it run

>>24571316 (OP)
"capitalism" is a huge all encompassing word that can mean whatever you want it to mean. it's always existed and always will, you can attribute this or that negative aspect to it and be correct but capitalism is the reason you exist on this planet as well, this rhetoric is tired and infantile

>>24575920
>Anon Marxism doesn't even care about enforcing le equality
>"From each according to his ability, to each according to his need"
You're a fucking retard.

>>24576636
I want you to point out the exact part of this slogan which implies any sort of equality.

>>24576619
>it's always existed and always will

Untrue
>capitalism is the reason you exist on this planet as well,
Anon.....

>>24576619
This is what Americans actually believe, btw.

>>24576437

I'm sure the reasons you provided would have much more to do with an infatuation (as a non-member) with the intellectual class, as described by Gouldner, ironically not accounting for the possibility that you see things the way you do, because of your class membership. I really don't know how Marxists can qualify Marx as something material and non-mystical, within the frame Marx provides. So he alone was able to see beyond his class consciousness? Why? Because he was a fat smelly kike? Here's the real deal anon, you're some member of genus homo. Maybe not necessarily sapiens, maybe erectus, but the genus none the less. That species of animal evolved for endurance running. Just like a dog owner that lets his fido become obese is doing something unnatural and cruel, something that prevents the animal from exhibiting its nature, a fat weakling like you or Marx, also doesn't qualify for being fully human. Go outside and do me some laps around the block. Once you're no longer a disgusting fat body, then you can talk to me about how humans are supposed to behave. Not before. You belong to the class consciousness of obesity rn. There's no more false a consciousness for our speciex than that one.

Tl;dr only humand with a healthy body fat% are capable of making valid points on anything.

>>24575991
>as someone with an actual professional background in economics
Reading ludwig von mises and Hayek isn't a "background" in economics.

>This is unproven nonsense, try again
It's common logic. Imagine 2 types of monkeys, the first type don't have much bananas, and the second ones have many bananas. What do you think happen if you give money to the first type to buy bananas ?

>The United States is obscenely more rich than Norway [...]
I've never seen someone showcase a clear lack of understanding of common economic notions this well.

>Youre a socialist [...]
You're a retard

>>24576650
Richer people have the ability to supply the needs of poorer people.
If you like, I can spell it out in fridge magnets and upload the pic.

>>24576687
>Tl;dr only humand with a healthy body fat%
So Lenin and Stalin are kosher?

>>24571316 (OP)
The only two forces that can't be consumed are ethnic nationalism and religious fundamentalism.

>>24576715
Yeah but where is the equality thing?

The slogan states that every individual should provide as much as he can (never implied to be a figure equal to what others provide, rather the opposite), and every individual should receive as much as he requires (never implied to be a figure equal to what others receive, rather the opposite).

Is this some sort of American thing where taxes are considered communist or something?

>>24576336
>Piketty's "Capital" is a rigorously researched, data-driven analysis backed by years of empirical work across dozens of countries.
xD
>Piketty's "Capital" is a rigorously researched, data-driven analysis backed by years of empirical work across dozens of countries.
>We echo many of the concerns first raised in Giles’ Financial Times critique, including the problem of opaque citations throughout Piketty’s empirical work. We find that insufficient citation of his sources and inadequate explanations of his methodologies are not only present – as Giles also indicated – but pervasive throughout the book. We diverge from Giles though in one key way though. The bulk of Giles’ investigation focused upon methodological differences in the calculation of wealth inequality, particularly in the UK but also several other countries that Piketty investigated. This is an admittedly imprecise area of research, though – importantly – it is also one that is still very actively being pursued. While we echo many of Giles’ concerns here as well, we note that they may be the least of Piketty’s data worries. Far more troubling, we believe, are a number of core factual misstatements in Piketty’s historical narrative, clear evidence of cherry-picking within his data presentation, and at least one case of possible mischief in his construction of an important data chart on which he bases one of his main theoretical claims, the famous “r > g” formula.
>We chose to focus mainly on Piketty’s historical treatment of the United States, as this is both the closest area of overlap between Piketty’s work and our own as well as being the focal point of the public discussion around the book for the past several months. We believe that Piketty’s U.S. data problems are symptomatic of similar issues in the other countries that he examines, and acknowledge instances of such as found by other scholars abroad. In examining Piketty’s U.S. data though, it becomes abundantly apparent that he struggles with U.S. political and economic history, including misstatements of basic factual events, dates, and data points. This particular problem extends deeply into his historical narrative of the 20th century United States, and stains his main attempt to construct and interpret a historical time series of U.S. wealth inequality.

>>24576717

Stalin I think is fairly predictable. Destiny and Hasan are sort of the modern equivalent of Trotsky and Stalin. Hopefully with a similar outcome. If you think Lenin or Stalin had any interest in "Marxism", and weren't just vying for power...

>>24576336
>One of the heaviest points of criticism focuses upon Piketty’s attempt to measure wealth inequality in the United States, purporting to show a dramatic upswing in the past three decades. When first faced with this criticism back in June, Piketty largely sidestepped the issue by appealing to a new “study” by Emmanuel Saez and Gabriel Zucman that appeared to support his own claims. At the time this study existed as no more than a PowerPoint slideshow and had not been subjected to any meaningful peer review. It was nonetheless quickly embraced by Piketty and his supporters as a point of vindication for his own problem-plagued measures. The Saez-Zucman draft has since been released as a NBER working paper. While it is not our aim to dissect this paper as well, we do address its meaning for the larger debate around Piketty and raise a number of questions that do not seem to be adequately addressed in either work.
>As noted above, we do suggest an instance of likely mischief in one of Piketty’s empirical charts, used to test his famous “r>g” prediction for the global capital stock. Specifically, and as readers of this blog have seen before, Piketty quietly inserted a succession of highly questionable data assumptions from the Soviet Union and other communist countries in one of his main empirical graphs about the purported characteristics of global capitalism. This was done without any annotation, and only appears hard-coded into his source material some three spreadsheets deep. The resulting effect of this insertion created a severe distortion in the cumulative “global” index that Piketty constructs, operating in a way that directly accentuates his “r>g” thesis. Although this is not a lightly offered criticism, it is also difficult to explain or justify Piketty’s decisions on this chart through any of his annotation or descriptive notes, giving rise to the likelihood of an intentional manipulation on his part.

>>24576336
>In conducting this analysis, it merits acknowledgement that Piketty has made his data publicly available for outside scrutiny. Although this is an increasingly common convention of economics, we fully credit him for this exercise in transparency. It should also be noted, however, that the posting of one’s data files online is not a license to impute validity to their contents and subsequent interpretation. Many of Piketty’s key charts are derived from complex and interlinked spreadsheets that require hours of patient analysis to fully dissect and understand. Even as the files are accessible, this task requires a level of scrutiny that extends well beyond the casual reader of Piketty’s book in which the same charts are presented as accurate factual representations. In reality, they are often products of highly normative methodological choices, source selectivity, and other biasing factors. We have accordingly endeavored to shed some light on a number of Piketty’s more widely touted charts including where they go astray.

Just to be clear, in the 'Thomas Piketty is a huge bullshit artist oeuvre' that's just the tip of the iceberg
Better luck next time little brother

>>24576636
Do you think that all people have equal abilities and needs? If so, maybe you're the retard, not marx

>>24576041
They don't even realize that ESL is actually indicative of you speaking 1 language more than them AKA they're retarded and proud of it.

>>24576719
>>24576749
People with abilities tend to be rich, and can satisfy their own needs.
People without abilities tend to be poor, and require their needs to be satisfied by others.
Fridge magnet pic incoming.

>>24576749
And I didn't call Marx a retard. I called the Marxist who didn't even know that quote a retard.

>>24576762
Don't you think that all people should have their needs fullfilled, even if they aren't skilled enough?
>>24576766
>Marxist who didn't even know that quote a retard.
But that quote directly contradicts your claim that "marx advocated for equality". Why bring up a quote that contradicts you?

>>24576762
Anon, I need you to focus. "Equality".

>>24576775
>Don't you think that all people should have their needs fullfilled, even if they aren't skilled enough
No, Marx does.
>But that quote directly contradicts your claim that "marx advocated for equality".
Are you an ESL, ETL or EFL?

>>24576336
https://steadystate.org/wp-content/uploads/Stern_KuznetsCurve.pdf

>This paper presents a critical history of the environmental Kuznets curve (EKC). The EKC proposes that indicators of environmental degradation first rise, and then fall with increasing income per capita. Recent evidence shows however, that developing countries are addressing environmental issues, sometimes adopting developed country standards with a short time lag and sometimes performing better than some wealthy countries, and that the EKC results have a very flimsy statistical foundation. A new generation of decomposition and efficient frontier models can help disentangle the true relations between development and the environment and may lead to the demise of the classic EKC.

Your conjecture that "inequality is bad in poor countries!!!1" is just that, conjecture
When I said earlier that you don't know what you are talking about and that I know way, way more about economics than you do, this is what I meant
Again, I understand that you believe that inequality is bad, that doesn't make it true, take the note, move on, it's not the end of the world

Another high-IQ observation which no one will care about because it doesn’t make them feel good:
Power, in the realm of economics, is considered to be an “externality”, a distortionary force in economic activity. That is FALSE. Economics IS power relations. Supply and demand are interactions of POWER relations.

>>24576785
My first language is english, maybe that's why this is so difficult for you to understand, I recommend reading translations of marx in your native language.

Marx did not advocate for equality. The quote you brought up demonstrated that.

>>24576791
>talks about inequality
>link a paper on the EKC (?)
nta but what ?

>>24576733
>24576336 talks about inequality yielding diminishing returns
>anon comes in and disproves ... r > g using a blog (?)

There seems to be some pattern of not adressing the core issue

>>24576816
I legitimately have no theories other than this being some form of mental illness in which rich people paying for anything ever = equality.

>>24576733
>>24576741
>>24576748
>>24576791

>"In most OECD countries, the gap between rich and poor is at its highest level since 30 years. Today, the richest 10 per cent of the population in the OECD area earn 9.5 times the income of the poorest 10 per cent; in the 1980s this ratio stood at 7:1 and has been rising continuously ever since. However, the rise in overall income inequality is not (only) about surging top income shares: often, incomes at the bottom grew much slower during the prosperous years and fell during downturns, putting relative (and in some countries, absolute) income poverty on the radar of policy concerns. This paper explores whether such developments may have an impact on economic performance."
>"Drawing on harmonised data covering the OECD countries over the past 30 years, the econometric analysis suggests that income inequality has a negative and statistically significant impact on subsequent growth. In particular, what matters most is the gap between low income households and the rest of the population. In contrast, no evidence is found that those with high incomes pulling away from the rest of the population harms growth. The paper also evaluates the “human capital accumulation theory” finding evidence for human capital as a channel through which inequality may affect growth. Analysis based on micro data from the Adult Skills Survey (PIAAC) shows that increased income disparities depress skills development among individuals with poorer parental education background, both in terms of the quantity of education attained (e.g. years of schooling), and in terms of its quality (i.e. skill proficiency). Educational outcomes of individuals from richer backgrounds, however, are not affected by inequality."
>"It follows that policies to reduce income inequalities should not only be pursued to improve social outcomes but also to sustain long-term growth. Redistribution policies via taxes and transfers are a key tool to ensure the benefits of growth are more broadly distributed and the results suggest they need not be expected to undermine growth. But it is also important to promote equality of opportunity in access to and quality of education. This implies a focus on families with children and youths – as this is when decisions about human capital accumulation are made -- promoting employment for disadvantaged groups through active labour market policies, childcare supports and in-work benefits"

oecd study, he's right yk

>>24576814

I don't think the average capitalism apologist even understands the linkage between power relations and Capital. To them all people are free moving freely thinking isolated agents interacting through the money they possess, which somehow has intrinsic value.

Which is precisely why the underhanded corruption, violence and deceit that goes into actually becoming a capitalist is invisible to them

>>24576762
>People with abilities tend to be rich, and can satisfy their own needs.
>People without abilities tend to be poor, and require their needs to be satisfied by others.
Only true if you limit "abilities" to mean "things useful to capital". There are lots of talented people who aren't rich because their abilities aren't related to tech, real estate, or financial capital.

>>24576816
>Marx did not advocate for equality. The quote you brought up demonstrated that.
Marx didn't believe in abstract equality because people have different needs. This is basically the difference between formal quality (everyone treated the same under law, at least theoretically in liberal systems) and substantive equality (the actual distribution of goods and resources accounting for people's varying needs).

>>24571387
>If the chimping fails or is contained, humanity deserves its fate.
"if I rape your ass and you fail to stop me, you deserved it"
kill yourself please for saying this

>>24576982
>"if I rape your ass and you fail to stop me, you deserved it"
I say this because it is correct. Only women and gays think otherwise.

>>24575126
>give me literally one fucking metric

No.

>>24576814
"economics" as a field of study is better understood by its name before the modernist rebrand: Political Arithmetic

>>24576791
>Confuses two different issues and doesn't address my point
>Claims I don't know what I'm talking about
Like pottery lol

>>24576844
Thanks anon, an important thing to note is that this isn't a demonization of people who do extremely well, it's the fact that as people stack up at the bottom, they drop out of the system: they can no longer afford education, they no longer reach their potential to add to the economy and reap its rewards. In other words, the very structure of the market is, by its nature, drawn towards the needs of those with money and means, thus, the more people who find themselves lacking these things, the more the market itself completely ignores them as agents altogether. This creates a downward spiral, the economy is slowed and more and more people are left out of the opportunity to enjoy prosperity.

>>24577006
go read book 1 of the republic

>>24571638
Based.

What is there to be done then ?